Religions > Atheism > Priest charged in theft opposed parish audit {accused of stealing $8 million from Florida church}
| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"stoney" |
| Date: |
11 Mar 2007 11:38:37 AM |
| Object: |
Priest charged in theft opposed parish audit {accused of stealing $8 million from Florida church} |
As a lad growing up I never heard of clergical theft. I see no reason
to suspect things were different from the way they are now. I wonder
how financial matters were dealt with since $$$$$ is their god.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17540906/
Priest charged in theft opposed parish audit
He and colleague are accused of stealing $8 million from Florida church
Updated: 9:44 p.m. ET March 9, 2007
DELRAY BEACH, Fla. - A priest accused along with another clergyman of
stealing more than $8 million from their church once griped that an
audit of parish funds was "a waste" of money that "should be spent more
wisely," newly released court documents show.
The Revs. Francis Guinan, 64, and John Skehan, 79, were arrested last
fall on charges that they spent money on gambling trips, rare coins, and
in Guinan's case, a girlfriend. Letters and notes related to the case
were released Thursday by Palm Beach County prosecutors.
In one letter, dated three years before the arrests, Guinan wrote to the
Diocese of Palm Beach opposing a planned audit of the church.
"My reasons for this request are as follows: It is demeaning,
embarrassing and humiliating. It accomplishes nothing that could not be
accomplished in a more dignified fashion," Guinan said in the October
2003 letter. "The money spent on an audit is a waste and should be spent
more wisely."
Diocese policy calls for a parish audit whenever there is a change in
pastors. Guinan had just taken over St. Vincent Ferrer Catholic Church
from his close friend, Skehan, who was retiring after 40 years.
The 2003 audit eventually revealed the priests' alleged misdeeds.
Guinan reasoned in the letter that priests "devote their lives to the
church with little thought for personal gain. They are generous,
charitable and compassionate. They have earned and deserve trust, at
least until proven otherwise ... May I be so crude as to ask you to
'call off the dogs.'"
Both men have pleaded not guilty to grand theft and are free on bail.
Their attorneys did not return phone messages seeking comment about the
letter.
A police report said Guinan had an intimate relationship with a former
bookkeeper at another church. Denis Hamel, chief financial officer for
the Diocese of Palm Beach, told police Guinan had paid the woman's
credit card bills and her child's school tuition with church funds that
were not recorded on the church books.
© 2007 The Associated Press.
--
Fundies and trolls are cordially invited to
shove a wooden cross up their arses and rotate
at a high rate of speed. I trust you'll
be 'blessed' with a plethora of splinters.
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| User: "johac" |
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| Title: Re: Priest charged in theft opposed parish audit {accused of stealing $8 million from Florida church} |
12 Mar 2007 12:35:33 AM |
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In article <7qb8v258ntjj886ps12r8lejc9fpt91rp6@4ax.com>,
stoney <stoney@the.net> wrote:
As a lad growing up I never heard of clergical theft. I see no reason
to suspect things were different from the way they are now. I wonder
how financial matters were dealt with since $$$$$ is their god.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17540906/
Priest charged in theft opposed parish audit
He and colleague are accused of stealing $8 million from Florida church
Updated: 9:44 p.m. ET March 9, 2007
DELRAY BEACH, Fla. - A priest accused along with another clergyman of
stealing more than $8 million from their church once griped that an
audit of parish funds was "a waste" of money that "should be spent more
wisely," newly released court documents show.
The Revs. Francis Guinan, 64, and John Skehan, 79, were arrested last
fall on charges that they spent money on gambling trips, rare coins, and
in Guinan's case, a girlfriend. Letters and notes related to the case
were released Thursday by Palm Beach County prosecutors.
In one letter, dated three years before the arrests, Guinan wrote to the
Diocese of Palm Beach opposing a planned audit of the church.
"My reasons for this request are as follows: It is demeaning,
embarrassing and humiliating. It accomplishes nothing that could not be
accomplished in a more dignified fashion," Guinan said in the October
2003 letter. "The money spent on an audit is a waste and should be spent
more wisely."
Yeah right.
Diocese policy calls for a parish audit whenever there is a change in
pastors. Guinan had just taken over St. Vincent Ferrer Catholic Church
from his close friend, Skehan, who was retiring after 40 years.
The 2003 audit eventually revealed the priests' alleged misdeeds.
Guinan reasoned in the letter that priests "devote their lives to the
church with little thought for personal gain. They are generous,
charitable and compassionate. They have earned and deserve trust, at
least until proven otherwise ... May I be so crude as to ask you to
'call off the dogs.'"
Didn't he read in his holy book what Jesus had to say about hypocrites?
Both men have pleaded not guilty to grand theft and are free on bail.
Their attorneys did not return phone messages seeking comment about the
letter.
A police report said Guinan had an intimate relationship with a former
bookkeeper at another church. Denis Hamel, chief financial officer for
the Diocese of Palm Beach, told police Guinan had paid the woman's
credit card bills and her child's school tuition with church funds that
were not recorded on the church books.
I hope they get another book thrown at them.
© 2007 The Associated Press.
--
John #1782
"We should always be disposed to believe that which appears to us to be
white is really black, if the hierarchy of the church so decides."
- Saint Ignatius Loyola (1491-1556) Founder of the Jesuit Order.
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| User: "j.m. #1491" |
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| Title: Re: Priest charged in theft opposed parish audit {accused of stealing$8 million from Florida church} |
11 Mar 2007 07:23:34 PM |
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stoney wrote:
As a lad growing up I never heard of clergical theft. I see no reason
to suspect things were different from the way they are now. I wonder
how financial matters were dealt with since $$$$$ is their god.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17540906/
Priest charged in theft opposed parish audit
He and colleague are accused of stealing $8 million from Florida
church
Think about this: 8 Million dollars.
How much does a nurse or teacher make? 30-40k/year? That's more than 200
years of social work that could have been paid.
A few weeks ago an anonymous donation of 5 million Canadian dollars was
given to the 'Sick Kids' society here in TO. For stem cell research. I
heard interviews with the scientists allowed to use the money. They
think it will make a difference. 8 Million US is about twice as much.
Read this:
http://www.spiegel.de/international/spiegel/0,1518,454694,00.html
It took 4.7 Million initial funding (by a (very, very rich) atheist!) to
start a project to find a cure against a disease killing 60000 people
per year in poor nations.
And here we have an organization that is collecting money, allegedly for
social work, and 8 million dollars can just leak away, without being
noticed for years. Amazing!
Oh, in case you want to know their total budget:
http://www.diocesepb.org/development/dsa.htm
http://www.diocesepb.org/development/2007/acrobat%20files/PalmBeachBrochure.pdf
About 11.7 million dollars available per year.
0% for taxes.
Religious staff (i.e. people who swore to live poor):
11% for "Diocesan Clergy and Leadership"
8% for "Seminarians, Deacons, and Women Religious"
22% for retired clergy.
Other staff and infrastructure:
13% for administration.
5% for Plant and Facilities
God:
11% for "Outreach & Mission Support"
10% for Religious Education (it's nice that the website just states
"Education", and the pdf clarifies that this is "Religious Education",
"Serving God's Children" (cough!), "School Superintendent" and "Campus
Ministry".)
This leaves:
19% for "Social Services"
And I'm very nice here. They list "Communications", "Liturgy" and
"Florida Catholic Newspaper" under this item, together with "Family
planing" (cough!) and "Substance Abuse". More likely it's something like
10% for actual Social Services. But "Outreach" includes "Catholic
charities", so perhaps 15% for activities that actually help others?
Your article doesn't say how long this thefts were going on, but let's
be nice and say 20 years. 400,000 per year. Hard to see how two single
family homes or 10 staff positions can disappear every year without
being noticed, but, as I said, let's be nice.
Add that to their budget:
3.5% lost or stolen
(Or is this the 1% for "Change in Net Assets" they list?)
I'd say, 80-90% wasted. Efficient, eh? Makes you want to donate!
Or look at it from an investment point of view:
Return: This 41% the religious staff gets: about 4.8 Million/year
Investment: 0 (everything is given to them! Or income generated from
assets given to them or stolen centuries ago.)
Risk: 0
*****. I choose the wrong career.
j.m.
#1491
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| User: "Uncle Clover" |
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| Title: Re: Priest charged in theft opposed parish audit {accused of stealing $8 million from Florida church} |
11 Mar 2007 11:50:32 PM |
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And so the question becomes:
Was he opposed to the audit because he knew they'd find him to be
thief? Or did they find him to be a thielf simply because he was
opposed to the audit?
Hmmmnn....
(honestly, I think he's guilty, but it is kind of a cute little
quandry) :-)
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Priest charged in theft opposed parish audit {accused of stealing $8 million from Florida church} |
12 Mar 2007 01:01:34 AM |
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On Mar 11, 8:23 pm, "j.m. #1491" <j.m.1...@gmx.net> wrote:
Or look at it from an investment point of view:
Return: This 41% the religious staff gets: about 4.8 Million/year
Investment: 0 (everything is given to them! Or income generated from
assets given to them or stolen centuries ago.)
Risk: 0
*****. I choose the wrong career.
I think it was Heinlein who said that witch doctor
was the best career available, if you had the
stomach for it.
--
Walt Smith
Firelock on DALNet
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