Religions > Atheism > Pro-life vindication: Experiments may overcome stem-cell qualms
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Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"J Young" |
| Date: |
16 Oct 2005 02:09:42 PM |
| Object: |
Pro-life vindication: Experiments may overcome stem-cell qualms |
Persistance has paid off for those who value life. Scientists have made
efforts and succeeded in conducting medical experiments without
desecrating the dead. Everyone benefits when the respect for life
becomes paramount. Let this serve as encouragement when fighting for
the overturn of Roe v Wade.
http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/living/health/12919124.htm
Experiments may overcome stem-cell qualms
NEW YORK - Two new mouse experiments may show how to obtain human
embryonic stem cells without ethical hurdles, a step that could allow
federal funding for such research, scientists reported Sunday.
Currently, scientists must sacrifice human embryos to harvest such
cells, which can form any tissue type and are seen as valuable for
studying and treating illnesses like diabetes and Parkinson's disease.
Objections to the embryo destruction have led to a ban on federal
funding for such work, which scientists say hampers research.
The new methods, detailed Sunday in the online edition of the journal
Nature, seek to obtain the cells without destroying embryos.
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| User: "LC" |
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| Title: Re: Pro-life vindication: Experiments may overcome stem-cell qualms |
16 Oct 2005 04:29:46 PM |
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Insane troll "J Young" <youngopinions@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1129489782.908720.99690@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
<bulk of J/IBen's troll flushed>
Everyone benefits when the respect for life becomes paramount.
Got irony, IBen?:
"30,000 dead Muslims, 30,000 less potential bombers; somebody please
pass me the tissue box."
From: "J Young" <youngopinions@aol.com>
Newsgroups:
alt.politics.usa,alt.atheism,soc.culture.jewish,alt.abortion,seattle.politics
Subject: 30,000 feared dead as huge earthquake hits Pakistan
Date: 9 Oct 2005 18:28:14 -0700
Message-ID: <1128907694.674301.260100@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 152.163.101.5
LC~ The trolls keep getting lamer...
"Ordinarily he was insane, but he had lucid moments when he was merely
stupid."~Heinrich Heine
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| User: "Ray Fischer" |
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| Title: Re: Pro-life vindication: Experiments may overcome stem-cell qualms |
16 Oct 2005 02:16:13 PM |
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J Young <youngopinions@aol.com> wrote:
Persistance has paid off for those who value life.
People like you who cheer the deaths of 30,000 Muslims?
Scientists have made
efforts and succeeded in conducting medical experiments without
desecrating the dead.
Welcome to the 14th century.
Everyone benefits when the respect for life
becomes paramount.
And respect for people vanishes.
--
Ray Fischer
rfischer@sonic.net
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| User: "Parsifal" |
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| Title: Re: Pro-life vindication: Experiments may overcome stem-cell qualms |
16 Oct 2005 04:59:27 PM |
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The irony, which obviously escapes J Young, is that his mere existence
justifies abortion and the necessity of keeping it legal and
accessible. Knowing that my wife would give birth to a nazi turd like
him would certainly makes me seriously wonder about the necessity of
bringing another one of these on earth...
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| User: "J Young" |
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| Title: Re: Pro-life vindication: Experiments may overcome stem-cell qualms |
16 Oct 2005 05:12:07 PM |
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Parsifal wrote:
The irony, which obviously escapes J Young, is that his mere existence
justifies abortion and the necessity of keeping it legal and
accessible. Knowing that my wife would give birth to a nazi turd like
him would certainly makes me seriously wonder about the necessity of
bringing another one of these on earth...
That is why abortion decisions should be taken away from the
individual. Jackasses such as yourself would murder a pre-born child
for no other reason than the kid *might* become more civilized and
intelligent than the father, thereby causing embarrassment to you.
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| User: "Joseph Welch" |
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| Title: Re: Pro-life vindication: Experiments may overcome stem-cell qualms |
16 Oct 2005 05:37:24 PM |
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"J Young" <youngopinions@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1129500727.639793.87670@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
That is why abortion decisions should be taken away from the
individual.
Yet another freedom-hating right-wing jackass who believes that government
is more qualified to make personal decisions for people than the individuals
themselves.
You really should move to Cuba or some other communist country. You'd like
it better there.
--
JW
***************
"You've done enough. Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last? Have
you left no sense of decency?"
http://www.americanrhetoric.com/speeches/welch-mccarthy.html
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| User: "Parsifal" |
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| Title: Re: Pro-life vindication: Experiments may overcome stem-cell qualms |
17 Oct 2005 12:56:55 AM |
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*a pre-born child
WTF are you talking about? There's no such thing... Are you a "pre-dead
person"?
Actually, since you consider yourself a Christian, I'd start to worry,
because you're obviously a "pre-damned soul"...
*the kid *might* become more civilized and intelligent than the father,
Since when are nazi turds "more civilized"? Your country killed
thousands of them in the 40s... Obviously, you're a traitor to the USA.
OK, let me check: bigot, homophobe, racist, fascist, liar and
traitor... Way to go!
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| User: "Ray Fischer" |
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| Title: Re: Pro-life vindication: Experiments may overcome stem-cell qualms |
16 Oct 2005 08:55:43 PM |
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J Young <youngopinions@aol.com> wrote:
That is why abortion decisions should be taken away from the
individual. Jackasses such as yourself would murder a pre-born child
for no other reason than the kid *might* become more civilized and
intelligent than the father, thereby causing embarrassment to you.
Instead it should be left to people like you who would happily commit
genocide and murder tens of thousands to millions of muslims.
--
Ray Fischer
rfischer@sonic.net
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| User: "J Young" |
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| Title: Re: Pro-life vindication: Experiments may overcome stem-cell qualms |
17 Oct 2005 09:58:29 PM |
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"Ray Fischer" <rfischer@bolt.sonic.net> wrote in message
news:div0av$kfs$1@bolt.sonic.net...
J Young <youngopinions@aol.com> wrote:
That is why abortion decisions should be taken away from the
individual. Jackasses such as yourself would murder a pre-born child
for no other reason than the kid *might* become more civilized and
intelligent than the father, thereby causing embarrassment to you.
Instead it should be left to people like you who would happily commit
genocide and murder tens of thousands to millions of muslims.
--
Ray Fischer
rfischer@sonic.net
I do not endorse murder of any kind; I just don't believe in some b.s.
sympathy for self proclaimed enemies of America when a natural disaster
comes their way.
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| User: "Mimi Cohen" |
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| Title: Re: Pro-life vindication: Experiments may overcome stem-cell qualms |
17 Oct 2005 12:12:31 AM |
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Ray Fischer wrote:
J Young <youngopinions@aol.com> wrote:
That is why abortion decisions should be taken away from the
individual. Jackasses such as yourself would murder a pre-born child
for no other reason than the kid *might* become more civilized and
intelligent than the father, thereby causing embarrassment to you.
Instead it should be left to people like you who would happily commit
genocide and murder tens of thousands to millions of muslims.
Want to see "j young go ape *****? Watch this:
Stem Cell Test Tried on Mice Saves Embryo
By NICHOLAS WADE
Scientists have devised two new techniques to derive embryonic stem
cells in mice, one of which avoids the destruction of the embryo, a
development that could have the potential to shift the grounds of the
longstanding political debate about human stem cell research.
The destruction of embryos is a principal objection of anti-abortion
advocates who have strenuously opposed federal financing of the
research. The second new technique manipulates embryos so they are
inherently incapable of implanting in the uterus, what some see as a
possible ethical advantage in the proposed therapy, which converts a
patient's skin cell into embryonic cells and then new tissues to repair
the body. Both methods are described in today's online edition of Nature.
The technique for making embryonic stem cells without compromising the
embryo has yet to be adapted to people, but the two species are very
similar at this level of embryonic development. "I can't think of a
reason why the technique would not theoretically work in humans," said
Brigid L. M. Hogan, an embryologist at Duke University.
If it does work in people, which could take many months to find out, the
technique might divide the anti-abortion movement into those who accept
or reject in vitro fertilization, because the objection to deriving
human embryonic stem cells would come to rest on creating the embryos in
the first place, not on their destruction.
"This gets around all of the ethical arguments, except for that small
minority of the pro-life community that doesn't even support in vitro
fertilization," said Representative Roscoe G. Bartlett, Republican of
Maryland, whose Web site describes him as "a pro-life legislator."
Until now the only way of deriving human embryonic stem cells has been
to break open the embryo before it implants in the uterus, a stage at
which it is called a blastocyst, and take out the inner cell mass, whose
cells form all the tissues in a human body.
Although the blastocysts used in the procedure are ones that fertility
clinics have rejected for implantation, many opponents of abortion say
the destruction of any embryo is wrong. Congress has forbidden the use
of federal money for any such research, and federally supported
scientists can work with only a small number of existing lines of
embryonic stem cells that have been exempted by President Bush.
Robert Lanza and colleagues at Advanced Cell Technology, a biotechnology
company in Worcester, Mass., have developed an alternative way of
generating embryonic stem cells that leaves the embryo viable.
They let a fertilized mouse egg divide three times until it contained
eight cells, a stage just before the embryo becomes a blastocyst.
Removing one of these cells, they then coaxed it into growing in
glassware and forming cells that have all the same essential properties
as embryonic stem cells derived from the inner cell mass, Dr. Lanza's
team reports.
The seven-cell embryo was implanted in the mouse uterus and grew
successfully to term. This part of the procedure is known to work with
humans too, because it is the basis of a well-established test known as
preimplantation genetic diagnosis. In the test, one cell is removed from
each of a set of embryos and tested for any of 150 genetic defects,
giving the parents the choice of implanting an embryo that is disease free.
Dr. Lanza's technique is likely to be welcomed by many in the middle of
the debate, although it has not won over the United States Conference of
Catholic Bishops. Richard M. Doerflinger, its deputy director for
pro-life activities, dismissed the technique, saying that
preimplantation genetic diagnosis itself is unethical.
The technique "is done chiefly to select out genetically imperfect
embryos for discarding, and poses unknown risks of future harm even to
the child allowed to be born," Mr. Doerflinger said in an e-mail message.
Only a procedure that generated embryonic stem cells without creating or
destroying embryos "would address the Catholic Church's most fundamental
moral objection to embryonic stem cell research as now pursued," Mr.
Doerflinger said in testimony last December to the President's Council
on Bioethics.
Senator Sam Brownback, a Kansas Republican and a leading pro-life
advocate did not return a call to his office. Edmund D. Pellegrino, the
new chairman of the President's Council on Bioethics, said through a
spokeswoman that he had no comment.
But Markus Grompe, a leading stem cell scientist and a Roman Catholic
who supports the church's teaching on the unacceptability of destroying
embryos, praised the Lanza approach, provided that the extracted cell
could not develop into an embryo by itself. "I find it clearly less
objectionable than the outright destruction of the embryo," said Dr.
Grompe, who studies liver stem cells at the Oregon Health and Science
University.
In response to Dr. Grompe's reservation, Dr. Lanza said individual human
blastomeres, as the cells are known at this stage, had never been shown
to create viable embryos.
If Dr. Lanza's technique proves to work in humans, it could do more than
just provide researchers with a new source of cells. It might allow
every child born through preimplantation genetic testing to have its own
line of embryonic cells stored for the future. The blastomere removed at
the eight-cell stage could be allowed to divide, with one cell being
used for genetic testing and the other for growing a culture of
perfectly matching embryonic stem cells.
The cells would be available throughout the child's life for the kind of
tissue and organ repair that it is hoped stem cells will one day
provide. In many of the degenerative diseases of old age, from heart
attacks to Parkinson's, the body loses vital cells and fails to replace
them, an omission that could perhaps be overcome if embryonic cells like
those present at the beginning of life were available to generate
replacement cells artificially.
With the parents' consent these cells could also be used for research,
providing many new embryonic stem cell lines for laboratories. The
procedure might be even be offered for all embryos generated in
fertility clinics when its theoretical risk has been better assessed.
"I can see a day when every fertility clinic embryo has a cell removed
and banked for future tissue use or organ replacement," said Ronald M.
Green, an ethicist at Dartmouth.
Children born after the preimplantation diagnosis procedure have the
same incidence of birth defects as those who did not undergo the
procedure. So far, after some 10 years of experience, there is no
indication that it causes health problems in humans, said Andrew R. La
Barbera, scientific director of the American Society for Reproductive
Medicine.
If Dr. Lanza's technique succeeds in generating human embryonic stem
cell lines, Dr. La Barbera said, "I suspect that indeed it will become
routine to generate stem cells for everyone who undergoes
preimplantation genetic diagnosis."
But Kathy Hudson, director of the Genetics and Public Policy Center at
Johns Hopkins University, said there was "little data that documents the
safety and efficacy" of the preimplantation diagnosis procedure, even
after 2,000 births. She urged the American Society for Reproductive
Medicine to create a national database to address the safety issue.
The other alternative method reported in Nature today addresses an
ethical objection to therapeutic cloning, the idea of treating patients
with new tissues generated from their own cells.
The cells would be obtained by taking the nucleus from a patient's skin
cell and injecting it into a human egg whose nucleus had been removed.
The egg develops into a blastocyst from which embryonic stem cells can
be derived in the usual way. Critics say this nuclear transfer technique
creates embryos only to destroy them.
To counter this objection, Alexander Meissner and Rudolf Jaenisch of the
Whitehead Institute in Cambridge, Mass., have created mouse nuclear
transfer embryos that are inherently incapable of implanting in the
uterus. They did so by switching off a gene in the donor nucleus that is
needed for the implantation process. The gene was switched back on later
because it is needed to form the intestinal tissues.
William Hurlbut, a member of the President's Council on Bioethics, has
suggested that such unimplantable embryos may satisfy those who say a
potential life is being destroyed in the nuclear transfer process. But
Mr. Doerflinger, of the bishops conference, told the council last
December that this approach did not fulfill his criterion that an embryo
should not be created. This is still his position, he says.
Scientists hope that alternative approaches to embryonic stem cell
research may ease the political obstacles in their path, but they also
wish to avoid being compelled to abandon existing approaches before new
ones have been shown to work.
Irving Weissman, a stem cell biologist at Stanford, notes in a
commentary in Nature that there have been calls in Congress for a
moratorium on generating new stem cell lines until the two new
techniques have been adapted to people, a prospect that he describes as
"highly speculative."
Representative Bartlett said the Lanza method "has come at a very
propitious time" because the Senate is considering various stem cell
bills, including a counterpart to legislation he proposed in the House
advocating research into alternative ways of deriving embryonic stem cells.
It is not yet clear if human embryonic stem cells generated from
blastomeres would be eligible for federal financial support, because
they might still fall foul of the Dickey-Wicker amendment, which
prohibits federal research where human embryos are destroyed, discarded
or subjected to substantial risk.
Dr. Lanza's company, Advanced Cell Technology, is well known in the
cloning field, having accomplished solid achievements as well as some
that veered toward the merely attention getting, like letting a human
nucleus develop to very early stages in a cow's egg. The company is
headed by Michael West, who as founder of Geron initiated support for
the research that led to the first derivation of human embryonic cells.
It will take a lot more research and maybe several years before Advanced
Cell Technology and others can tell if the new method works in humans
and how applicable it may be.
In preimplantation genetic diagnosis, there is very little time before
the disease-free embryo must be implanted in the uterus, perhaps too
little to allow an embryonic stem cell line to be generated, as Dr.
Lanza hopes, some experts said.
The procedure is in any case highly inefficient at present, and may
never become practical for babies born through in vitro fertilization.
"I think it is wildly speculative to say that in the future every IVF
child will have embryonic stem cell lines made, especially if the
efficiency is so low already," said Dr. Hogan, of Duke.
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/10/17/health/17stem.html
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| User: "Paul Duca" |
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| Title: Re: Pro-life vindication: Experiments may overcome stem-cellqualms |
16 Oct 2005 08:24:26 PM |
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in article 1129500727.639793.87670@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com, J Young at
youngopinions@aol.com wrote on 10/16/05 6:12 PM:
Parsifal wrote:
The irony, which obviously escapes J Young, is that his mere existence
justifies abortion and the necessity of keeping it legal and
accessible. Knowing that my wife would give birth to a nazi turd like
him would certainly makes me seriously wonder about the necessity of
bringing another one of these on earth...
That is why abortion decisions should be taken away from the
individual. Jackasses such as yourself would murder a pre-born child
for no other reason than the kid *might* become more civilized and
intelligent than the father, thereby causing embarrassment to you.
--
Tell us more about the rewards God has bestowed upon a "civilized
and intelligent" soul like yourself...I mean, BESIDES the empty feelings of
cheap feel-good you get from your dreary church.
Paul
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| User: "Douglas Berry" |
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| Title: Re: Pro-life vindication: Experiments may overcome stem-cell qualms |
16 Oct 2005 06:52:09 PM |
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What's so funny about peace, love and "J Young"
<youngopinions@aol.com> posting the following on 16 Oct 2005 12:09:42
-0700 iin alt.atheism?
Persistance has paid off for those who value life. Scientists have made
efforts and succeeded in conducting medical experiments without
desecrating the dead.
Are yopu opposed to organ donation? How about using real cadavers to
train doctors?
Everyone benefits when the respect for life
becomes paramount. Let this serve as encouragement when fighting for
the overturn of Roe v Wade.
If your respect for life is paramount, may I infer that you are
working tirelessly to ban all privately held firearms? Are you a
strict Vegan?
--
Douglas E. Berry Do the OBVIOUS thing to send e-mail
Atheist #2147, Atheist Vet #5
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as
when they do it from religious conviction."
Blaise Pascal (1623-1662), Pense'es, #894.
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| User: "Paul Duca" |
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| Title: Re: Pro-life vindication: Experiments may overcome stem-cellqualms |
16 Oct 2005 08:18:37 PM |
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in article 1129489782.908720.99690@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com, J Young at
youngopinions@aol.com wrote on 10/16/05 3:09 PM:
Persistance has paid off for those who value life. Scientists have made
efforts and succeeded in conducting medical experiments without
desecrating the dead. Everyone benefits when the respect for life
becomes paramount.
God won't benefit...it could mean people will be CURED of diseases
and conditions, instead of being noble cripples comforted by the promises of
the Lord in the next life.
Paul
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