| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"WarDragonDeath" |
| Date: |
30 Dec 2005 05:17:10 PM |
| Object: |
punctuated equilibrium and root cause of mutations |
It also has been said that mutations may be a key to the rapid
change called for by the "punctuated equilibrium" theory. Writing in
Science Digest, John Gliedman stated: "Evolutionary revisionists
believe mutations in key regulatory genes may be just the genetic
jackhammers their quantum-leap theory requires." However, British
zoologist Colin Patterson observed: "Speculation is free. We know
nothing about these regulatory master genes." But aside from such
speculations, it is generally accepted that the mutations supposedly
involved in evolution are small accidental changes that accumulate
over a long period of time.
How do mutations originate? It is thought that most of them occur in
the normal process of cell reproduction. But experiments have shown
that they also can be caused by external agents such as radiation and
chemicals. And how often do they happen? The reproduction of genetic
material in the cell is remarkably consistent. Relatively speaking,
considering the number of cells that divide in a living thing,
mutations do not occur very often. As the Encyclopedia Americana
commented, the reproducing "of the DNA chains composing a gene is
remarkably accurate. Misprints or miscopying are infrequent
accidents."
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| User: "Bob" |
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| Title: Re: punctuated equilibrium and root cause of mutations |
30 Dec 2005 09:12:55 PM |
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On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 18:17:10 -0500, WarDragonDeath
<Use-Author-Address-Header@[127.1]> wrote:
It also has been said that mutations may be a key to the rapid
change called for by the "punctuated equilibrium" theory. Writing in
Science Digest, John Gliedman stated: "Evolutionary revisionists
believe mutations in key regulatory genes may be just the genetic
jackhammers their quantum-leap theory requires."
Yes, that is well documented.
However, British
zoologist Colin Patterson observed: "Speculation is free. We know
nothing about these regulatory master genes."
How long ago did he say that? That is quite outdated. Suggest you read
Sean Carroll's book, which outlines much of what is known about these
master regulatory genes and their key role in evolution.
But aside from such
speculations, it is generally accepted that the mutations supposedly
involved in evolution are small accidental changes that accumulate
over a long period of time.
How do mutations originate? It is thought that most of them occur in
the normal process of cell reproduction. But experiments have shown
that they also can be caused by external agents such as radiation and
chemicals. And how often do they happen? The reproduction of genetic
material in the cell is remarkably consistent. Relatively speaking,
considering the number of cells that divide in a living thing,
mutations do not occur very often. As the Encyclopedia Americana
commented, the reproducing "of the DNA chains composing a gene is
remarkably accurate. Misprints or miscopying are infrequent
accidents."
Depends on what you mean by infrequent, I suppose. With a genome as
large as the human genome they occur thousands of times each
replication (each cell division). The frequency is low, expressed as a
fraction, but many would say that the number is quite large. In other
words, 99.9999% accuracy still leaves thousands of mutations per
replication.
bob
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: punctuated equilibrium and root cause of mutations |
31 Dec 2005 06:09:16 PM |
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Bob wrote:
On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 18:17:10 -0500, WarDragonDeath
<Use-Author-Address-Header@[127.1]> wrote:
It also has been said that mutations may be a key to the rapid
change called for by the "punctuated equilibrium" theory. Writing in
Science Digest, John Gliedman stated: "Evolutionary revisionists
believe mutations in key regulatory genes may be just the genetic
jackhammers their quantum-leap theory requires."
Yes, that is well documented.
However, British
zoologist Colin Patterson observed: "Speculation is free. We know
nothing about these regulatory master genes."
How long ago did he say that?
The book he is quoting is from 1985.
Put the first line of his post in Google. Gives three hits. Look up the
cached sites. One hit references an article called "Mutations—A Basis
for Evolution?". This is a chapter from "Life-How did it get here?",
published in 1985 by the watchtower society.
See http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/jw-book.html
Same procedure works for other posts cross-posted by a nym-shifting
troll to this newsgroups. See
http://groups.google.ca/group/alt.atheism/msg/e81b94f6c2ce0254?dmode=source&hl=en
This individual is not interested in discussions, most likely does not
understand enough of the subject to voice his own opinion. Simple hit
and run troll.
j.m.
#1491
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| User: "Cracklin" |
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| Title: Re: punctuated equilibrium and root cause of CROSSPOSTING! |
01 Jan 2006 02:03:03 AM |
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<j.m.1491@gmx.net> wrote in message news:41okthF1f8vgkU1@individual.net...
Bob wrote:
On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 18:17:10 -0500, WarDragonDeath aka JABRIOL from
alt.religion.jehovahs-witn.
<Use-Author-Address-Header@[127.1]> wrote:
It also has been said that mutations may be a key to the rapid
change called for by the "punctuated equilibrium" theory. Writing in
Science Digest, John Gliedman stated: "Evolutionary revisionists
believe mutations in key regulatory genes may be just the genetic
jackhammers their quantum-leap theory requires."
Yes, that is well documented.
However, British
zoologist Colin Patterson observed: "Speculation is free. We know
nothing about these regulatory master genes."
How long ago did he say that?
The book he is quoting is from 1985.
Put the first line of his post in Google. Gives three hits. Look up the
cached sites. One hit references an article called "Mutations—A Basis for
Evolution?". This is a chapter from "Life-How did it get here?", published
in 1985 by the watchtower society.
See http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/jw-book.html
Same procedure works for other posts cross-posted by a nym-shifting troll
to this newsgroups. See
http://groups.google.ca/group/alt.atheism/msg/e81b94f6c2ce0254?dmode=source&hl=en
This individual is not interested in discussions, most likely does not
understand enough of the subject to voice his own opinion. Simple hit and
run troll.
=======================================
He's not a hit-and-run troll; he's a permanent troll. He's been
cross-posting this crap for 15 years. He's JABRIOL nym-shifting (Google
Jabriol) sometimes several times a day. Before he started nym-shifting
everyone ignored him. He was in their killfiles. So he nym-shifts now to
avoid your killfiles and to harass the people across several NGs with his
copy&paste Watchtower garbage. You are correct in that he isn't interested
in any discussion concerning what he posts. He's trying to see how many NGs
he can destroy with the help of people who refuse to take a few seconds to
remove irrelevant off-topic NGs before they hit that send button. If they
knew it was Jabriol they wouldn't reply at all.
--
CR...........
http://silentlambs.org
www.freeminds.org
http://dbhome.dk/carlo/ secret Elder's Manual
"Properly read, the Bible is the most potent
force for atheism ever conceived."
-= Isaac Asimov =-
~~~~ }<((((o> ~~~~ }<{{{{{̉> ~~~~ }<((({ö> ~~~~
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: punctuated equilibrium and root cause of CROSSPOSTING! |
02 Jan 2006 02:31:43 PM |
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Cracklin' wrote:
He's not a hit-and-run troll; he's a permanent troll. He's been
cross-posting this crap for 15 years. He's JABRIOL nym-shifting (Google
Jabriol) sometimes several times a day. Before he started nym-shifting
everyone ignored him. He was in their killfiles. So he nym-shifts now
to avoid your killfiles and to harass the people across several NGs with
his copy&paste Watchtower garbage. You are correct in that he isn't
interested in any discussion concerning what he posts. He's trying to
see how many NGs he can destroy with the help of people who refuse to
take a few seconds to remove irrelevant off-topic NGs before they hit
that send button. If they knew it was Jabriol they wouldn't reply at all.
Crap. I had him in my killfile. Five times. Different versions of
jabriol, javriol etc. First entry is the third filter I ever created.
All filters set to kill the thread.
j.m.
#1491
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| User: "Christopher A. Lee" |
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| Title: Re: punctuated equilibrium and root cause of mutations |
30 Dec 2005 05:40:35 PM |
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On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 18:17:10 -0500, WarDragonDeath
<Use-Author-Address-Header@[127.1]> wrote:
It also has been said that mutations may be a key to the rapid
change called for by the "punctuated equilibrium" theory. Writing in
Science Digest, John Gliedman stated: "Evolutionary revisionists
believe mutations in key regulatory genes may be just the genetic
jackhammers their quantum-leap theory requires." However, British
zoologist Colin Patterson observed: "Speculation is free. We know
nothing about these regulatory master genes." But aside from such
speculations, it is generally accepted that the mutations supposedly
involved in evolution are small accidental changes that accumulate
over a long period of time.
You have no idea what you are talking about. PE is a consequence of a
small, isolated gene pool.
How do mutations originate? It is thought that most of them occur in
the normal process of cell reproduction. But experiments have shown
that they also can be caused by external agents such as radiation and
chemicals. And how often do they happen? The reproduction of genetic
material in the cell is remarkably consistent. Relatively speaking,
considering the number of cells that divide in a living thing,
mutations do not occur very often. As the Encyclopedia Americana
commented, the reproducing "of the DNA chains composing a gene is
remarkably accurate. Misprints or miscopying are infrequent
accidents."
They happen all the time.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: punctuated equilibrium and root cause of mutations |
30 Dec 2005 06:03:15 PM |
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Christopher A. Lee wrote:
On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 18:17:10 -0500, WarDragonDeath
<Use-Author-Address-Header@[127.1]> wrote:
It also has been said that mutations may be a key to the rapid
change called for by the "punctuated equilibrium" theory. Writing in
Science Digest, John Gliedman stated: "Evolutionary revisionists
believe mutations in key regulatory genes may be just the genetic
jackhammers their quantum-leap theory requires." However, British
zoologist Colin Patterson observed: "Speculation is free. We know
nothing about these regulatory master genes." But aside from such
speculations, it is generally accepted that the mutations supposedly
involved in evolution are small accidental changes that accumulate
over a long period of time.
You have no idea what you are talking about.
Correct. It isn't even him talking. He's posting parts of a JW book.
Life: How did it get here? By evolution or by creation?
Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society of Pennsylvania.
Chapter 8. Mutations - A Basis for Evolution?
Pitiful, isn't it?
j.m.
#1491
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| User: "John Baker" |
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| Title: Re: punctuated equilibrium and root cause of mutations |
04 Jan 2006 02:33:08 PM |
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Please do not feed Jabriol.
Thank you.
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| User: "Dale" |
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| Title: Re: punctuated equilibrium and root cause of mutations |
30 Dec 2005 05:34:03 PM |
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Thanks for the info. I would hope that everyone who went past 9th grade
would know all that, but probably not. What is up with these posts that
don't get the little quote thingies when you respond to them from Outlook
Express? Is it the posting software that's defective, or is it Outlook?
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: punctuated equilibrium and root cause of mutations |
30 Dec 2005 06:35:22 PM |
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http://www.rae.org/critanl.html
[snip]
So why aren't transitional fossils leading up to trilobites, sponges,
jellyfish, pterosaurs, dinosaurs and countless other creatures found in
the fossil record? Most paleontologists would probably cite the
"punctuated equilibrium" model of evolution (Eldredge and Gould, 1972)
which is unique. It must be the only theory put forth in the history of
science which claims to be scientific, but then explains why evidence
for it cannot be found.
I thought a good theory was based on evidence, not a _lack_ of
evidence.
David Buckna
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| User: "maff" |
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| Title: Re: punctuated equilibrium and root cause of mutations |
30 Dec 2005 06:47:22 PM |
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wrote:
http://www.rae.org/critanl.html
[snip]
So why aren't transitional fossils leading up to trilobites, sponges,
jellyfish, pterosaurs, dinosaurs and countless other creatures found in
the fossil record? Most paleontologists would probably cite the
"punctuated equilibrium" model of evolution (Eldredge and Gould, 1972)
which is unique. It must be the only theory put forth in the history of
science which claims to be scientific, but then explains why evidence
for it cannot be found.
I thought a good theory was based on evidence, not a _lack_ of
evidence.
Haven't you heard of DNA evidence, Christian murderer?
David Buckna
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: punctuated equilibrium and root cause of mutations |
02 Jan 2006 03:32:12 PM |
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maff wrote:
dabuckna@direct.ca wrote:
http://www.rae.org/critanl.html
[snip]
So why aren't transitional fossils leading up to trilobites, sponges,
jellyfish, pterosaurs, dinosaurs and countless other creatures found in
the fossil record? Most paleontologists would probably cite the
"punctuated equilibrium" model of evolution (Eldredge and Gould, 1972)
which is unique. It must be the only theory put forth in the history of
science which claims to be scientific, but then explains why evidence
for it cannot be found.
I thought a good theory was based on evidence, not a _lack_ of
evidence.
Haven't you heard of DNA evidence, Christian murderer?
First of all, why did you call me a "Christian murderer"?
As for DNA evidence...I noticed that both Crick and Watson,
co-discoverers of the structure of the DNA molecule are listed at
www.celebatheists.com:
http://www.celebatheists.com/w/index.php?title=Francis_Crick
http://www.celebatheists.com/w/index.php?title=James_Watson
*
Yet the psalmist David wrote thousands of years ago:"For you created my
inmost being; you knit me together in my mother's womb...your eyes saw
my unformed body. All the days ordained for me were written in your
book before one of them came to be." (Psalm 139, verses 13 and 16.)
The phrase "you knit me together" (or "you wove me together") is
interesting in view of the fact that the DNA molecule is a THREAD-LIKE
double-helix---suggesting we are literally "knitted" or "woven"
together at the molecular level. Oh the irony!
This is just one of several scientific allusions found in the Bible.
Others include the earth's water cycle (Ecclesiates 1:7), earth is
spherical (Job 26:10; Isaiah 40:21-22) and suspended in space (Job
26:7), the stars of Pleiades are gravitationally bound while the stars
of Orion are not gravitationally bound (Job 38:31).
http://www.christiananswers.net/q-eden/edn-c015.html
David Buckna
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| User: "maff" |
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| Title: Re: punctuated equilibrium and root cause of mutations |
02 Jan 2006 05:54:33 PM |
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wrote:
maff wrote:
wrote:
http://www.rae.org/critanl.html
[snip]
So why aren't transitional fossils leading up to trilobites, sponges,
jellyfish, pterosaurs, dinosaurs and countless other creatures found in
the fossil record? Most paleontologists would probably cite the
"punctuated equilibrium" model of evolution (Eldredge and Gould, 1972)
which is unique. It must be the only theory put forth in the history of
science which claims to be scientific, but then explains why evidence
for it cannot be found.
I thought a good theory was based on evidence, not a _lack_ of
evidence.
Haven't you heard of DNA evidence, Christian murderer?
First of all, why did you call me a "Christian murderer"?
Christian atrocities
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.atheism/msg/2b62a1f5e94cbbbd
Constitution of the Confederate States of America
http://americancivilwar.com/documents/confederate_constitution.html
March 11,1861
We, the people of the Confederate States, each State acting in its
sovereign and independent character, in order to form a permanent
federal government, establish justice, insure domestic tranquillity,
and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our
posterity~invoking the favor and guidance of Almighty God~do ordain and
establish this Constitution for the Confederate States of America.
As for DNA evidence...I noticed that both Crick and Watson,
co-discoverers of the structure of the DNA molecule are listed at
www.celebatheists.com:
http://www.celebatheists.com/w/index.php?title=Francis_Crick
http://www.celebatheists.com/w/index.php?title=James_Watson
*
Yet the psalmist David wrote thousands of years ago:"For you created my
inmost being; you knit me together in my mother's womb...your eyes saw
my unformed body. All the days ordained for me were written in your
book before one of them came to be." (Psalm 139, verses 13 and 16.)
The phrase "you knit me together" (or "you wove me together") is
interesting in view of the fact that the DNA molecule is a THREAD-LIKE
double-helix---suggesting we are literally "knitted" or "woven"
together at the molecular level. Oh the irony!
This is just one of several scientific allusions found in the Bible.
Others include the earth's water cycle (Ecclesiates 1:7), earth is
spherical (Job 26:10; Isaiah 40:21-22) and suspended in space (Job
26:7), the stars of Pleiades are gravitationally bound while the stars
of Orion are not gravitationally bound (Job 38:31).
http://www.christiananswers.net/q-eden/edn-c015.html
Scientifically illiterate Christian fundamentalist terrorists don't
determine what science is.
David Buckna
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