| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"Bill" |
| Date: |
12 Jan 2005 12:44:16 PM |
| Object: |
Questions about the Trinity of God? |
Some questions for experts on Christian religion;
God is supposedly made up of God the Father, God the Son and the Holy Ghost.
Who was God the fathers wife? Who was Jesus's mother before he was born of
the virgin Mary?
If God the Father did not have a wife, how did he father a son?
Who is the Holy Ghost? Is he an uncle? What is his function?
If this trinity is all powerful and created the Universe and everything in
it, why did it create such
fallible, errant and grossly imperfect men and earthly catastrophes and
diseases of every
imaginable kind? Why did this supposedly infallible God make these many
serious
mistakes in his creation?
If God created everything, why did he create sin and punishment for the sins
he created?
What is his purpose of putting man on earth to suffer from hunger, diseases
and catastrophes and then
usually experience a painful old age and death before being delivered to an
infinitely pleasant and
perpetual heaven?
Does God enjoy toying with and torturing his creations?
Bill
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| User: "Ike" |
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| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
12 Jan 2005 09:40:18 PM |
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"Bill" <wmech@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:4eeFd.8034$7N1.5538@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
Some questions for experts on Christian religion;
God is supposedly made up of God the Father, God the Son and the Holy
Ghost.
Who was God the fathers wife? Who was Jesus's mother before he was born of
the virgin Mary?
God the Father's wife was the virgin Mary. Now, just think about that. How
should a girl feel if she is a virgin, and all of a sudden finds herself
selected to become pregnant by God? How is she supposed to explain that to
her family? Then the child that she has is doomed to be tortured to death.
But all the while she is supposed to keep a stiff upper lip because it's
saving the world form "sin".
--
The argument that everything had a Creator because it's too complicated, is
about as reasonable as saying that it couldn't have been created since it's
too complicated.
It's about like saying that a super flea created a dog. Then
the good fleas go to a great dog in the sky, while the bad unbelieving fleas
are scratched off into a super rug to be forever hungry. If you think dogs
weren't created by a Great Flea then you are an afleaist.
.
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| User: "Al Klein" |
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| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
13 Jan 2005 09:26:36 PM |
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On Thu, 13 Jan 2005 03:40:18 GMT, "Ike" <accordiondoc@mindspring.com>
said in alt.atheism:
"Bill" <wmech@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:4eeFd.8034$7N1.5538@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
Some questions for experts on Christian religion;
God is supposedly made up of God the Father, God the Son and the Holy
Ghost.
Who was God the fathers wife? Who was Jesus's mother before he was born of
the virgin Mary?
God the Father's wife was the virgin Mary. Now, just think about that. How
should a girl feel if she is a virgin, and all of a sudden finds herself
selected to become pregnant by God? How is she supposed to explain that to
her family? Then the child that she has is doomed to be tortured to death.
But all the while she is supposed to keep a stiff upper lip because it's
saving the world form "sin".
Of course all that crap is TOTALLY contradicted in the Book of Mary.
Which is why Nicea wouldn't even consider including it in the bible.
Even if what's in the BofM makes more sense and is closer to the
customs of the time than the 'official' story. (The whole virginity
nonsense didn't even exist until the 4th century.)
--
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious
conviction."
- Blaise Pascal (1623-1662)
(random sig, produced by SigChanger)
rukbat at verizon dot net
.
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| User: "CDumont" |
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| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
13 Jan 2005 10:11:44 AM |
|
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"Bill" <wmech@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:4eeFd.8034$7N1.5538@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
Some questions for experts on Christian religion;
God is supposedly made up of God the Father, God the Son and the Holy
Ghost.
Who was God the fathers wife? Who was Jesus's mother before he was born of
the virgin Mary?
If God the Father did not have a wife, how did he father a son?
Who is the Holy Ghost? Is he an uncle? What is his function?
If this trinity is all powerful and created the Universe and everything in
it, why did it create such
fallible, errant and grossly imperfect men and earthly catastrophes and
diseases of every
imaginable kind? Why did this supposedly infallible God make these many
serious
mistakes in his creation?
If God created everything, why did he create sin and punishment for the
sins
he created?
What is his purpose of putting man on earth to suffer from hunger,
diseases
and catastrophes and then
usually experience a painful old age and death before being delivered to
an
infinitely pleasant and
perpetual heaven?
Does God enjoy toying with and torturing his creations?
Bill
Perhaps if you studied real hard and prayed for wisdom you would'nt
need to keep asking the same questions over and over again after you got the
answers. God created you and look at you, you do satans work, for satans
work you get satans reward.
Since you know so much tell us how all life on earth began, tell me if
i got it right, some slime formed in the sea somehow, and turned into a
fish, or mutated, whatever, and turned into thousands of other species of
fish or mutated, whatever, then one grew legs and walked to a fresh water
lake and did the same thing there, then it turned into, or mutated into the
thousands of different seeds for grass and trees and herbs and veg.etc. and
then turned into or mutated in the thousands of different animals, insects,
reptiles, etc.
Now Bill, could you explain to me how all this happened and don't forget
the objective evidence, this should be interesting, i'm due for a good
laugh. God bless
.
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| User: "Al Klein" |
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| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
13 Jan 2005 09:31:30 PM |
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On Thu, 13 Jan 2005 16:11:44 GMT, "CDumont" <cdumont@telusplanet.net>
said in alt.atheism:
Perhaps if you studied real hard and prayed for wisdom
Praying is self-contradictory in the Christian context.
God created you and look at you, you do satans work
Then that's how (and why) your god created him. Who are you to
question your god's work?
Since you know so much tell us how all life on earth began, tell me if
i got it right, some slime formed in the sea somehow, and turned into a
fish, or mutated, whatever, and turned into thousands of other species of
fish or mutated, whatever, then one grew legs and walked to a fresh water
lake and did the same thing there, then it turned into, or mutated into the
thousands of different seeds for grass and trees and herbs and veg.etc. and
then turned into or mutated in the thousands of different animals, insects,
reptiles, etc.
No, you got it wrong. Change that - you didn't even get it wrong.
--
"Damn. Looks like all of usenet agrees that you don't have the logical
faculties to prove the statement 'dogshit is not peanut butter' if we
gave you a jar of each and a box of crackers" - John Hattan to Tichy
(random sig, produced by SigChanger)
rukbat at verizon dot net
.
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| User: "CDumont" |
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| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
14 Jan 2005 12:05:02 AM |
|
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"Al Klein" <rukbat@pern.invalid> wrote in message
news:j5feu0tfc3fgm0hvuij92fk2k1j17qgc7n@4ax.com...
On Thu, 13 Jan 2005 16:11:44 GMT, "CDumont" <cdumont@telusplanet.net>
said in alt.atheism:
Perhaps if you studied real hard and prayed for wisdom
Praying is self-contradictory in the Christian context.
God created you and look at you, you do satans work
Then that's how (and why) your god created him. Who are you to
question your god's work?
Since you know so much tell us how all life on earth began, tell me if
i got it right, some slime formed in the sea somehow, and turned into a
fish, or mutated, whatever, and turned into thousands of other species of
fish or mutated, whatever, then one grew legs and walked to a fresh water
lake and did the same thing there, then it turned into, or mutated into
the
thousands of different seeds for grass and trees and herbs and veg.etc.
and
then turned into or mutated in the thousands of different animals,
insects,
reptiles, etc.
No, you got it wrong. Change that - you didn't even get it wrong.
--
"Damn. Looks like all of usenet agrees that you don't have the logical
faculties to prove the statement 'dogshit is not peanut butter' if we
gave you a jar of each and a box of crackers" - John Hattan to Tichy
(random sig, produced by SigChanger)
rukbat at verizon dot net
I know i got it wrong, since Bill can't or won't inlighten me, why don't
you? God bless
.
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| User: "Al Klein" |
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| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
14 Jan 2005 01:36:30 PM |
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On Fri, 14 Jan 2005 06:05:02 GMT, "CDumont" <cdumont@telusplanet.net>
said in alt.atheism:
"Al Klein" <rukbat@pern.invalid> wrote in message
news:j5feu0tfc3fgm0hvuij92fk2k1j17qgc7n@4ax.com...
On Thu, 13 Jan 2005 16:11:44 GMT, "CDumont" <cdumont@telusplanet.net>
said in alt.atheism:
Perhaps if you studied real hard and prayed for wisdom
Praying is self-contradictory in the Christian context.
Since the Christian god is all-knowing and all-good, praying for him
to change anything would be asking him to be not all-good and telling
him that he was wrong. Even praying for acceptance would be the same
thing. If he didn't already give you that acceptance, he would,
according to Christianity, have his reasons for not wanting you to
accept.
Since you know so much tell us how all life on earth began, tell me if
i got it right, some slime formed in the sea somehow, and turned into a
fish, or mutated, whatever, and turned into thousands of other species of
fish or mutated, whatever, then one grew legs and walked to a fresh water
lake and did the same thing there, then it turned into, or mutated into the
thousands of different seeds for grass and trees and herbs and veg.etc. and
then turned into or mutated in the thousands of different animals, insects,
reptiles, etc.
No, you got it wrong. Change that - you didn't even get it wrong.
I know i got it wrong, since Bill can't or won't inlighten me, why don't
you?
(The following is way oversimplified in spots. I know that, so I
don't need flames telling me that.)
We have no idea how life began on Earth - science doesn't work like
that. If you want exact answers you turn to fairy tales - like
religion. Science posits what is considered the best explanation for
an observation, called a theory. If further observations contradict
the theory, and the observations prove to be accurate, the theory is
changed to accommodate them. If the predictions made possible by the
theory prove to be false, the theory is also modified.
But science never says "this is exactly what happened on a Thursday, 4
billion years ago". Even if some slime mold back then learned English
and left a record etched into a rock.
What we DO know is that it's possible that some of the organic
molecules that we DO know exist in space, on carbonaceous chondrites
(how they got there is another matter, but there's absolutely no
evidence of anything supernatural being involved - natural chemistry
can account for it), landed on Earth (meteorites strike the surface
all the time, and we find these molecules on them), and the molecules,
finding a hospitable environment, did what they do by normal chemistry
- they "reproduced". (Crystals "reproduce", but we don't call rock
candy "alive".)
Eventually they reached the point that we call "life" - which is a
totally arbitrary human concept. Are viruses "alive"? Who knows?
There's no absolute life/no life delineation in nature. Whether any
particular thing is alive depends on the definition of "alive" - and
it's a totally arbitrary definition. ("We know what 'life' is" is
meaningless as far as science is concerned.)
Now, as far as that initial "life" changing, we KNOW that, through
various observed mechanisms, a species can reproduce in such manner
that the offspring is another species. ("Species" is another
arbitrary human concept. Are lions and tigers the same species?
Horses and zebras? Man and Bonobo?) There are thousands of observed
speciation events. Among bacteria alone speciation occurs millions of
times a day. (Forget the "but they're still bacteria" nonsense. If a
cat gives birth to a human baby, "they're still animals". "Bacterium"
is a kingdom - the same as "animal".)
As far as "other species of fish or mutated, whatever, then one grew
legs and walked to a fresh water lake", they're known variously as
"walking catfish", "lungfish", "anabantidae", etc. There are, and/or
have been, quite a few species of fish that can walk on land and/or
breathe air. (Almost all of the extant ones live in areas in which
either the "water" is really more like thin mud, so they have to
supplement their gills with the ability to breathe air, or the water
periodically dries up and the only way to survive is to breathe air
while "walking" to another pond that hasn't dried up.) Keeping the
skin moist is the only thing left to convert one of these into an
amphibian (again, an arbitrary human construct).
You went on to say, "then it turned into, or mutated into the
thousands of different seeds for grass and trees and herbs and
veg.etc. and then turned into or mutated in the thousands of different
animals, insects, reptiles, etc."
No. Plants and animals split from each other LONG before fish crawled
up on land. In fact, the split occurred long before the Cambrian,
which is about the earliest time we have real records for. (Before
that life was probably soft-bodied, and even bones don't usually
fossilize, so we can't expect many soft tissue fossils.) By the
Cambrian there were a myriad of kingdoms, phyla, classes, orders,
families, genera and species. Exactly what the line of descent was
before that we can only guess in most cases. Educated guesses, but no
"on the third day X turned into Y" certainty.
If you want more, and more detailed, information about this, look up
"Burgess Shale". Google returns about 48,000 hits.
(http://www.scienceweb.org/burgess.html is pretty introductory.)
Gould's book on the place, _Wonderful Life: The Burgess Shale and the
Nature of History_, is pretty good for a non-scientist, and most large
libraries have many of his books.
_The Crucible of Creation: The Burgess Shale and the Rise of Animals_
by Simon Conway Morris, takes a different view. If you read both of
them you'll begin to get an idea of what science means when it says
that there's a controversy about evolution. Not that any biologist
doubts that evolution occurs - it's been observed, so it occurs - but
different experts analyze the data differently and come to different
conclusions about it.
I hope this helped at least a little.
--
"Creationists are the best evidence we have that there is no intelligent design."
-Josef Balluch
(random sig, produced by SigChanger)
rukbat at verizon dot net
.
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| User: "CDumont" |
|
| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
15 Jan 2005 01:24:30 AM |
|
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"Al Klein" <rukbat@pern.invalid> wrote in message
news:b75gu01ft6oginvk7lf8ml7s49dh4m3krc@4ax.com...
On Fri, 14 Jan 2005 06:05:02 GMT, "CDumont" <cdumont@telusplanet.net>
said in alt.atheism:
"Al Klein" <rukbat@pern.invalid> wrote in message
news:j5feu0tfc3fgm0hvuij92fk2k1j17qgc7n@4ax.com...
On Thu, 13 Jan 2005 16:11:44 GMT, "CDumont" <cdumont@telusplanet.net>
said in alt.atheism:
Perhaps if you studied real hard and prayed for wisdom
Praying is self-contradictory in the Christian context.
Since the Christian god is all-knowing and all-good, praying for him
to change anything would be asking him to be not all-good and telling
him that he was wrong. Even praying for acceptance would be the same
thing. If he didn't already give you that acceptance, he would,
according to Christianity, have his reasons for not wanting you to
accept.
Since you know so much tell us how all life on earth began, tell me if
i got it right, some slime formed in the sea somehow, and turned into a
fish, or mutated, whatever, and turned into thousands of other species
of
fish or mutated, whatever, then one grew legs and walked to a fresh
water
lake and did the same thing there, then it turned into, or mutated into
the
thousands of different seeds for grass and trees and herbs and veg.etc.
and
then turned into or mutated in the thousands of different animals,
insects,
reptiles, etc.
No, you got it wrong. Change that - you didn't even get it wrong.
I know i got it wrong, since Bill can't or won't inlighten me, why don't
you?
(The following is way oversimplified in spots. I know that, so I
don't need flames telling me that.)
We have no idea how life began on Earth - science doesn't work like
that. If you want exact answers you turn to fairy tales - like
religion. Science posits what is considered the best explanation for
an observation, called a theory. If further observations contradict
the theory, and the observations prove to be accurate, the theory is
changed to accommodate them. If the predictions made possible by the
theory prove to be false, the theory is also modified.
But science never says "this is exactly what happened on a Thursday, 4
billion years ago". Even if some slime mold back then learned English
and left a record etched into a rock.
What we DO know is that it's possible that some of the organic
molecules that we DO know exist in space, on carbonaceous chondrites
(how they got there is another matter, but there's absolutely no
evidence of anything supernatural being involved - natural chemistry
can account for it), landed on Earth (meteorites strike the surface
all the time, and we find these molecules on them), and the molecules,
finding a hospitable environment, did what they do by normal chemistry
- they "reproduced". (Crystals "reproduce", but we don't call rock
candy "alive".)
Eventually they reached the point that we call "life" - which is a
totally arbitrary human concept. Are viruses "alive"? Who knows?
There's no absolute life/no life delineation in nature. Whether any
particular thing is alive depends on the definition of "alive" - and
it's a totally arbitrary definition. ("We know what 'life' is" is
meaningless as far as science is concerned.)
Now, as far as that initial "life" changing, we KNOW that, through
various observed mechanisms, a species can reproduce in such manner
that the offspring is another species. ("Species" is another
arbitrary human concept. Are lions and tigers the same species?
Horses and zebras? Man and Bonobo?) There are thousands of observed
speciation events. Among bacteria alone speciation occurs millions of
times a day. (Forget the "but they're still bacteria" nonsense. If a
cat gives birth to a human baby, "they're still animals". "Bacterium"
is a kingdom - the same as "animal".)
As far as "other species of fish or mutated, whatever, then one grew
legs and walked to a fresh water lake", they're known variously as
"walking catfish", "lungfish", "anabantidae", etc. There are, and/or
have been, quite a few species of fish that can walk on land and/or
breathe air. (Almost all of the extant ones live in areas in which
either the "water" is really more like thin mud, so they have to
supplement their gills with the ability to breathe air, or the water
periodically dries up and the only way to survive is to breathe air
while "walking" to another pond that hasn't dried up.) Keeping the
skin moist is the only thing left to convert one of these into an
amphibian (again, an arbitrary human construct).
You went on to say, "then it turned into, or mutated into the
thousands of different seeds for grass and trees and herbs and
veg.etc. and then turned into or mutated in the thousands of different
animals, insects, reptiles, etc."
No. Plants and animals split from each other LONG before fish crawled
up on land. In fact, the split occurred long before the Cambrian,
which is about the earliest time we have real records for. (Before
that life was probably soft-bodied, and even bones don't usually
fossilize, so we can't expect many soft tissue fossils.) By the
Cambrian there were a myriad of kingdoms, phyla, classes, orders,
families, genera and species. Exactly what the line of descent was
before that we can only guess in most cases. Educated guesses, but no
"on the third day X turned into Y" certainty.
If you want more, and more detailed, information about this, look up
"Burgess Shale". Google returns about 48,000 hits.
(http://www.scienceweb.org/burgess.html is pretty introductory.)
Gould's book on the place, _Wonderful Life: The Burgess Shale and the
Nature of History_, is pretty good for a non-scientist, and most large
libraries have many of his books.
_The Crucible of Creation: The Burgess Shale and the Rise of Animals_
by Simon Conway Morris, takes a different view. If you read both of
them you'll begin to get an idea of what science means when it says
that there's a controversy about evolution. Not that any biologist
doubts that evolution occurs - it's been observed, so it occurs - but
different experts analyze the data differently and come to different
conclusions about it.
I hope this helped at least a little.
--
"Creationists are the best evidence we have that there is no intelligent
design."
-Josef Balluch
(random sig, produced by SigChanger)
rukbat at verizon dot net
I do thank you for answering my post, and i do respect your beliefs, and i
will not insult you like some people do.
When it became obvious to me that religion was mostly a racket, i turned
to the scriptures instead of science because of a couple of unexplainable
experience, and quickly learned that what was being said was not what was
written. God bless
.
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| User: "Al Klein" |
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| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
16 Jan 2005 04:26:45 PM |
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On Sat, 15 Jan 2005 07:24:30 GMT, "CDumont" <cdumont@telusplanet.net>
said in alt.atheism:
When it became obvious to me that religion was mostly a racket, i turned
to the scriptures
Which were written by religious racketeers. Not much of a change.
instead of science because of a couple of unexplainable
experience
Which is all religion is - an attempt to explain something we
currently have no answer for. It's called "god of the gaps", and the
gaps keep getting smaller and smaller.
--
"Christians, it is needless to say, utterly detest each other. They slander each
other constantly with the vilest forms of abuse and cannot come to any sort of
agreement in their teachings. Each sect brands its own, fills the head of its own
with deceitful nonsense, and makes perfect little pigs of those it wins over to its
side."
- Celsus On the True Doctrine, translated by R. Joseph Hoffman, Oxford University Press, 1987
(random sig, produced by SigChanger)
rukbat at verizon dot net
.
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| User: "dgillesp" |
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| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
16 Jan 2005 07:56:36 PM |
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Al Klein wrote:
On Sat, 15 Jan 2005 07:24:30 GMT, "CDumont" <cdumont@telusplanet.net>
said in alt.atheism:
When it became obvious to me that religion was mostly a racket, i turned
to the scriptures
Which were written by religious racketeers. Not much of a change.
instead of science because of a couple of unexplainable
experience
Which is all religion is - an attempt to explain something we
currently have no answer for. It's called "god of the gaps", and the
gaps keep getting smaller and smaller.
Unless, of course, we learn that the questions, answers, bridges and gaps--in fact, all things
are derived from and exist within a greater reality, their ultimate Source and Sustainer.
"Christians, it is needless to say, utterly detest each other. They slander each
other constantly with the vilest forms of abuse and cannot come to any sort of
agreement in their teachings. Each sect brands its own, fills the head of its own
with deceitful nonsense, and makes perfect little pigs of those it wins over to its
side."
Sounds like a classic description of Democrats and Republicans, liberals and conservatives,
Bushites and the terrorists, atheists and fundamentalists, as well as many divorcees and their
exes I have known, etc., etc., etc. and the beat goes on. Call it what you will, it's a given
for the human condition which requires more than a good education even to begin to overcome.
Denny
- Celsus On the True Doctrine, translated by R. Joseph Hoffman, Oxford University Press, 1987
(random sig, produced by SigChanger)
rukbat at verizon dot net
.
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| User: "Al Klein" |
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| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
17 Jan 2005 02:52:01 PM |
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On Sun, 16 Jan 2005 20:56:36 -0500, dgillesp <dgillesp@nospam.net>
said in alt.atheism:
Al Klein wrote:
On Sat, 15 Jan 2005 07:24:30 GMT, "CDumont" <cdumont@telusplanet.net>
said in alt.atheism:
When it became obvious to me that religion was mostly a racket, i turned
to the scriptures
Which were written by religious racketeers. Not much of a change.
instead of science because of a couple of unexplainable
experience
Which is all religion is - an attempt to explain something we
currently have no answer for. It's called "god of the gaps", and the
gaps keep getting smaller and smaller.
Unless, of course, we learn that the questions, answers, bridges and gaps--in fact, all things
are derived from and exist within a greater reality, their ultimate Source and Sustainer.
Get back to me when we do. Until such time, it's just another
religious fairy tale, not to be taken any more seriously than the
Greek, Roman, Norse, etc., stories. Maybe some day we'll find out
that Odin's been laughing at Christians all these centuries.
--
"A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything."
- Friedrich Nietzsche
(random sig, produced by SigChanger)
rukbat at verizon dot net
.
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| User: "dgillesp" |
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| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
17 Jan 2005 06:01:58 PM |
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Al Klein wrote:
On Sun, 16 Jan 2005 20:56:36 -0500, dgillesp <dgillesp@nospam.net>
said in alt.atheism:
Al Klein wrote:
On Sat, 15 Jan 2005 07:24:30 GMT, "CDumont" <cdumont@telusplanet.net>
said in alt.atheism:
When it became obvious to me that religion was mostly a racket, i turned
to the scriptures
Which were written by religious racketeers. Not much of a change.
instead of science because of a couple of unexplainable
experience
Which is all religion is - an attempt to explain something we
currently have no answer for. It's called "god of the gaps", and the
gaps keep getting smaller and smaller.
Unless, of course, we learn that the questions, answers, bridges and gaps--in fact, all things
are derived from and exist within a greater reality, their ultimate Source and Sustainer.
Get back to me when we do. Until such time, it's just another
religious fairy tale, not to be taken any more seriously than the
Greek, Roman, Norse, etc., stories. Maybe some day we'll find out
that Odin's been laughing at Christians all these centuries.
--
"A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything."
- Friedrich Nietzsche
Neither does unbelief since Nietzsche himself died a lunatic.
(random sig, produced by SigChanger)
rukbat at verizon dot net
.
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| User: "Josef Balluch" |
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| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
18 Jan 2005 09:38:48 PM |
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In a message sent 'round the world, dgillesp poured fuel on the fire
with the following:
....
"A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything."
- Friedrich Nietzsche
Neither does unbelief since Nietzsche himself died a lunatic.
And here we have Denny, trying to make something out of nothing. I
suggest you leave this to your deity, who apparently has much more
experience with that sort of thing.
Neitzsche's insanity lasted about ten years, and his creative years
preceded this condition. There is no demonstrated connection between the
two. Also, Neitzsche considered his condition to be a religious
experience.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friedrich_Nietzsche
Regards,
Josef
Facts, or what a man believes to be facts, are delightful... Get your
facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please.
-- Mark Twain
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| User: "dgillesp" |
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| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
19 Jan 2005 09:00:20 AM |
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Josef Balluch wrote:
In a message sent 'round the world, dgillesp poured fuel on the fire
with the following:
...
"A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything."
- Friedrich Nietzsche
Neither does unbelief since Nietzsche himself died a lunatic.
And here we have Denny, trying to make something out of nothing. I
suggest you leave this to your deity, who apparently has much more
experience with that sort of thing.
And here we have Josef, trying to make nothing out of something, understandably. Now you see
it; now you don't. You say seeing is believing. I say some things have to be believed in
order to be seen.
Neitzsche's insanity lasted about ten years, and his creative years
preceded this condition. There is no demonstrated connection between the
two. Also, Neitzsche considered his condition to be a religious
experience.
But, of course, it was syphlitic insanity and his accompanying religious experience was most
likely delusional, but who knows for sure? The insane often see certain things much more
clearly than those whose view of reality is strictly confined to the obvious. If you get my
drift.
Denny
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friedrich_Nietzsche
Regards,
Josef
Facts, or what a man believes to be facts, are delightful... Get your
facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please.
-- Mark Twain
.
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| User: "Josef Balluch" |
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| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
19 Jan 2005 07:52:57 PM |
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In a message sent 'round the world, dgillesp poured fuel on the fire
with the following:
Josef Balluch wrote:
In a message sent 'round the world, dgillesp poured fuel on the fire
with the following:
...
"A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything."
- Friedrich Nietzsche
Neither does unbelief since Nietzsche himself died a lunatic.
And here we have Denny, trying to make something out of nothing. I
suggest you leave this to your deity, who apparently has much more
experience with that sort of thing.
And here we have Josef, trying to make nothing out of something, understandably.
Silly twaddle.
Now you see
it; now you don't. You say seeing is believing. I say some things have to be believed in
order to be seen.
Irrelevant twittering. The facts speak for themselves. As I stated,
there is no demonstrated connection between Neitzsche's condition near
the end of his life and the beliefs he held earlier in life. If you can
demonstrate that future events influence the past then please do so now.
Failing that, then stop insulting everyone's intelligence.
Neitzsche's insanity lasted about ten years, and his creative years
preceded this condition. There is no demonstrated connection between the
two. Also, Neitzsche considered his condition to be a religious
experience.
But, of course, it was syphlitic insanity and his accompanying religious experience was most
likely delusional, but who knows for sure?
You certainly don't. Had you bothered to read the link I supplied, you
would have found that Neitzsche's condition was not consistent with the
symptoms of syphilis.
The insane often see certain things much more
clearly than those whose view of reality is strictly confined to the obvious. If you get my
drift.
Yes, I do. You are clearly referring to yourself.
Regards,
Josef
Belief in the supernatural is the shame of civilization.
-- Joseph Ernest Renan
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| User: "Dore" |
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| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
12 Jan 2005 07:55:47 PM |
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"Bill" <wmech@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:4eeFd.8034$7N1.5538@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
Some questions for experts on Christian religion;
God is supposedly made up of God the Father, God the Son and the Holy
Ghost.
Actually the Godhead is made up of ALL of the hosts of heaven, the Father,
the Son, who became flesh on earth, as well as all of the hosts (angels) of
heaven, who are ALL ONE with the Holy Spirit of God, which is the power,
authority, all knowledge, wisdom, light, truth and righteousness etc.
cont
Who was God the fathers wife?
The Father has NO wife, for He is SPIRIT and ONLY the physical flesh on
earth procreate with the means of man and woman.
cont
Who was Jesus's mother before he was born of
the virgin Mary?
He had no mother in heaven, for the Father brought forth from Himself, ALL
of the angels, including Michael, the archangel, who is Jesus Christ.
cont
If God the Father did not have a wife, how did he father a son?
See above
cont
Who is the Holy Ghost? Is he an uncle? What is his function?
See above
cont
If this trinity is all powerful and created the Universe and everything in
it, why did it create such
fallible, errant and grossly imperfect men and earthly catastrophes and
diseases of every
imaginable kind? Why did this supposedly infallible God make these many
serious
mistakes in his creation?
When God created all things, it was perfect. When He created beings, angels,
souls, etc, He gave them FREE WILL and CHOICE, thus choosing between good
and evil, light and darkness, truth and lies, right and wrong. When God
placed man on the earth, his loyalty was tested, and he fell, giving into
temptation and disobedience, therefore giving the earth over the Satan to
reign, causing all humans to be tempted in their choices of good and evil,
etc. Because MAN CHOOSES sin and evil, affliction, diseases, disasters,
catastrophes are the result of reaping the consequences of sin and evil. God
made NO mistakes. MAN makes the mistakes by CHOOSING evil and sin. If ALL
men did NOT choose sin, there would be NO suffering, temptations, griefs,
horrors, catastrophes, infirmities etc. on the earth. Satan is the one who
brings all evil upon the earth, therefore CHOOSING sin and EVIL, empowers
him to cause the magnitude of atrocities that the earth endures.
cont
If God created everything, why did he create sin and punishment for the
sins
he created?
Because of His great love for His creation. God didn't want robots who had
NO choices, but wanted His children to serve, love and abide in Him by their
own choices. He gave them the opportunity of choosing evil, with the
warnings of the consequences of choosing that evil would bring. Punishment
is the result and consequences for CHOOSING evil and sin and rightly so. It
is called JUSTICE.
cont
What is his purpose of putting man on earth to suffer from hunger,
diseases
and catastrophes and then
usually experience a painful old age and death before being delivered to
an
infinitely pleasant and
perpetual heaven?
God placed man on the earth because of the fall of Lucifer, discovering that
His created being CHOSE iniquity, thus instead of having another war in
heaven, for the choices of evil, disobedience, iniquity and sin, God created
the earth, to separate man from heaven and Himself, to make his choices as
to whether CHOOSING sin and evil is worth the great loss of heaven and
standing in the presence of God. Having discovered that sin and evil cause
such horror, pain, suffering and grief, man would choose obedience,
goodness, righteousness, truth, and servitude to the Father, to be with Him
and return to heaven, and that man would NO longer CHOOSE evil and sin,
however, YOU tell me, after knowing this, why you still do?
cont
Does God enjoy toying with and torturing his creations?
NO, suffering any evil is never good, and even witnessing the torture of the
sinners is painful, however, choosing evil, REQUIRES JUSTICE. So what have
YOU done to stop all of the evil and sins in your life to make the world a
better place?
--
Dore
www.dorewilliamson.com
"Bill" <wmech@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:4eeFd.8034$7N1.5538@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
Some questions for experts on Christian religion;
God is supposedly made up of God the Father, God the Son and the Holy
Ghost.
Who was God the fathers wife? Who was Jesus's mother before he was born of
the virgin Mary?
If God the Father did not have a wife, how did he father a son?
Who is the Holy Ghost? Is he an uncle? What is his function?
If this trinity is all powerful and created the Universe and everything in
it, why did it create such
fallible, errant and grossly imperfect men and earthly catastrophes and
diseases of every
imaginable kind? Why did this supposedly infallible God make these many
serious
mistakes in his creation?
If God created everything, why did he create sin and punishment for the
sins
he created?
What is his purpose of putting man on earth to suffer from hunger,
diseases
and catastrophes and then
usually experience a painful old age and death before being delivered to
an
infinitely pleasant and
perpetual heaven?
Does God enjoy toying with and torturing his creations?
Bill
.
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| User: "jwk" |
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| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
13 Jan 2005 05:15:34 PM |
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Dore wrote:
"Bill" <wmech@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:4eeFd.8034$7N1.5538@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
Some questions for experts on Christian religion;
God is supposedly made up of God the Father, God the Son and the
Holy
Ghost.
Actually the Godhead is made up of
Godhead? Is that like the absolute best ***** ever? Does it have to
be by the male Christian God? I'm not into males, even if the head is
godhead.
jwk
.
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| User: "Jason Gastrich" |
|
| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
13 Jan 2005 01:13:37 AM |
|
|
Dore wrote:
"Bill" <wmech@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:4eeFd.8034$7N1.5538@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
Some questions for experts on Christian religion;
God is supposedly made up of God the Father, God the Son and the Holy
Ghost.
Actually the Godhead is made up of ALL of the hosts of heaven, the
Father, the Son, who became flesh on earth, as well as all of the
hosts (angels) of heaven, who are ALL ONE with the Holy Spirit of
God, which is the power, authority, all knowledge, wisdom, light,
truth and righteousness etc.
Is there a scripture in the Bible that says this?
Regards,
Jason
cont
Who was God the fathers wife?
The Father has NO wife, for He is SPIRIT and ONLY the physical flesh
on earth procreate with the means of man and woman.
cont
Who was Jesus's mother before he was born of
the virgin Mary?
He had no mother in heaven, for the Father brought forth from
Himself, ALL of the angels, including Michael, the archangel, who is
Jesus Christ.
cont
If God the Father did not have a wife, how did he father a son?
See above
cont
Who is the Holy Ghost? Is he an uncle? What is his function?
See above
cont
If this trinity is all powerful and created the Universe and
everything in it, why did it create such
fallible, errant and grossly imperfect men and earthly catastrophes
and diseases of every
imaginable kind? Why did this supposedly infallible God make these
many serious
mistakes in his creation?
When God created all things, it was perfect. When He created beings,
angels, souls, etc, He gave them FREE WILL and CHOICE, thus choosing
between good and evil, light and darkness, truth and lies, right and
wrong. When God placed man on the earth, his loyalty was tested, and
he fell, giving into temptation and disobedience, therefore giving
the earth over the Satan to reign, causing all humans to be tempted
in their choices of good and evil, etc. Because MAN CHOOSES sin and
evil, affliction, diseases, disasters, catastrophes are the result of
reaping the consequences of sin and evil. God made NO mistakes. MAN
makes the mistakes by CHOOSING evil and sin. If ALL men did NOT
choose sin, there would be NO suffering, temptations, griefs,
horrors, catastrophes, infirmities etc. on the earth. Satan is the
one who brings all evil upon the earth, therefore CHOOSING sin and
EVIL, empowers him to cause the magnitude of atrocities that the
earth endures.
cont
If God created everything, why did he create sin and punishment for
the sins
he created?
Because of His great love for His creation. God didn't want robots
who had NO choices, but wanted His children to serve, love and abide
in Him by their own choices. He gave them the opportunity of choosing
evil, with the warnings of the consequences of choosing that evil
would bring. Punishment is the result and consequences for CHOOSING
evil and sin and rightly so. It is called JUSTICE.
cont
What is his purpose of putting man on earth to suffer from hunger,
diseases
and catastrophes and then
usually experience a painful old age and death before being
delivered to an
infinitely pleasant and
perpetual heaven?
God placed man on the earth because of the fall of Lucifer,
discovering that His created being CHOSE iniquity, thus instead of
having another war in heaven, for the choices of evil, disobedience,
iniquity and sin, God created the earth, to separate man from heaven
and Himself, to make his choices as to whether CHOOSING sin and evil
is worth the great loss of heaven and standing in the presence of
God. Having discovered that sin and evil cause such horror, pain,
suffering and grief, man would choose obedience, goodness,
righteousness, truth, and servitude to the Father, to be with Him and
return to heaven, and that man would NO longer CHOOSE evil and sin,
however, YOU tell me, after knowing this, why you still do?
cont
Does God enjoy toying with and torturing his creations?
NO, suffering any evil is never good, and even witnessing the torture
of the sinners is painful, however, choosing evil, REQUIRES JUSTICE.
So what have YOU done to stop all of the evil and sins in your life
to make the world a better place?
"Bill" <wmech@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:4eeFd.8034$7N1.5538@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
Some questions for experts on Christian religion;
God is supposedly made up of God the Father, God the Son and the Holy
Ghost.
Who was God the fathers wife? Who was Jesus's mother before he was
born of the virgin Mary?
If God the Father did not have a wife, how did he father a son?
Who is the Holy Ghost? Is he an uncle? What is his function?
If this trinity is all powerful and created the Universe and
everything in it, why did it create such
fallible, errant and grossly imperfect men and earthly catastrophes
and diseases of every
imaginable kind? Why did this supposedly infallible God make these
many serious
mistakes in his creation?
If God created everything, why did he create sin and punishment for
the sins
he created?
What is his purpose of putting man on earth to suffer from hunger,
diseases
and catastrophes and then
usually experience a painful old age and death before being
delivered to an
infinitely pleasant and
perpetual heaven?
Does God enjoy toying with and torturing his creations?
Bill
--
--------
Jesus Christ Saves Ministries
http://www.jcsm.org
Over 60,000 web pages!
John 8:36 reads, "Therefore if the Son makes you free, you shall be
free indeed."
Galatians 5:1 reads, "Stand fast therefore in the liberty by which
Christ has made us free, and do not be entangled again with a yoke of
bondage."
ICQ#: 20731140
AIM: MrJasonGastrich
YIM: Jesus_Saved_Jason
.
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| User: "Uncle Davey" |
|
| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
13 Jan 2005 01:53:07 PM |
|
|
"Jason Gastrich" <usenetspam1@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:BcpFd.53005$Ew6.43986@twister.socal.rr.com...
Dore wrote:
"Bill" <wmech@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:4eeFd.8034$7N1.5538@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
Some questions for experts on Christian religion;
God is supposedly made up of God the Father, God the Son and the Holy
Ghost.
Actually the Godhead is made up of ALL of the hosts of heaven, the
Father, the Son, who became flesh on earth, as well as all of the
hosts (angels) of heaven, who are ALL ONE with the Holy Spirit of
God, which is the power, authority, all knowledge, wisdom, light,
truth and righteousness etc.
Is there a scripture in the Bible that says this?
Regards,
Jason
No. It is anti-scriptural delirium. In Revelation we see the angel say to
John 'see thou do it not, for I am thy fellowservant, worship God'.
Uncle Davey
www.usenetposts.com
.
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| User: "Al Klein" |
|
| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
13 Jan 2005 09:23:08 PM |
|
|
On Thu, 13 Jan 2005 07:13:37 GMT, "Jason Gastrich"
<usenetspam1@yahoo.com> said in alt.atheism:
Dore wrote:
"Bill" <wmech@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:4eeFd.8034$7N1.5538@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
Some questions for experts on Christian religion;
God is supposedly made up of God the Father, God the Son and the Holy
Ghost.
Actually the Godhead is made up of ALL of the hosts of heaven, the
Father, the Son, who became flesh on earth, as well as all of the
hosts (angels) of heaven, who are ALL ONE with the Holy Spirit of
God, which is the power, authority, all knowledge, wisdom, light,
truth and righteousness etc.
Is there a scripture in the Bible that says this?
You dare question your god?
(You DO know that Dore is both Jesus and the Christian god, right?)
--
"If we really know Truth, we do not fear hearing falsehoods or half-truths; if we are not sure of the truth - we shudder and try to shout down every utterance." - A. J. Mims
(random sig, produced by SigChanger)
rukbat at verizon dot net
.
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| User: "Uncle Davey" |
|
| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
14 Jan 2005 03:26:14 AM |
|
|
Uzytkownik "Al Klein" <rukbat@pern.invalid> napisal w wiadomosci
news:rneeu051kaav9aukfttfft7tmcaue90jh7@4ax.com...
On Thu, 13 Jan 2005 07:13:37 GMT, "Jason Gastrich"
<usenetspam1@yahoo.com> said in alt.atheism:
Dore wrote:
"Bill" <wmech@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:4eeFd.8034$7N1.5538@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
Some questions for experts on Christian religion;
God is supposedly made up of God the Father, God the Son and the Holy
Ghost.
Actually the Godhead is made up of ALL of the hosts of heaven, the
Father, the Son, who became flesh on earth, as well as all of the
hosts (angels) of heaven, who are ALL ONE with the Holy Spirit of
God, which is the power, authority, all knowledge, wisdom, light,
truth and righteousness etc.
Is there a scripture in the Bible that says this?
You dare question your god?
(You DO know that Dore is both Jesus and the Christian god, right?)
I saw no lightning strike from east to west.
I didn't see that the mount of Olives was cleft in twain.
I didn't note anybody meeting him in the air.
Uncle Davey
.
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| User: "bob young" |
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| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
12 Jan 2005 09:43:56 PM |
|
|
Dore wrote:
"Bill" <wmech@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:4eeFd.8034$7N1.5538@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
Some questions for experts on Christian religion;
God is supposedly made up of God the Father, God the Son and the Holy
Ghost.
Actually the Godhead is made up of ALL of the hosts of heaven, the Father,
the Son, who became flesh on earth, as well as all of the hosts (angels) of
heaven, who are ALL ONE with the Holy Spirit of God, which is the power,
authority, all knowledge, wisdom, light, truth and righteousness etc.
One long paragraph that adds up to 'zero'
cont
Who was God the fathers wife?
The Father has NO wife, for He is SPIRIT and ONLY the physical flesh on
earth procreate with the means of man and woman.
Groan
cont
Who was Jesus's mother before he was born of
the virgin Mary?
He had no mother in heaven, for the Father brought forth from Himself, ALL
of the angels, including Michael, the archangel, who is Jesus Christ.
Wail, groan, dear oh dear. the depths that human imagination can go to are
distressing indeed
cont
If God the Father did not have a wife, how did he father a son?
See above
cont
Who is the Holy Ghost? Is he an uncle? What is his function?
See above
cont
If this trinity is all powerful and created the Universe and everything in
it, why did it create such
fallible, errant and grossly imperfect men and earthly catastrophes and
diseases of every
imaginable kind? Why did this supposedly infallible God make these many
serious
mistakes in his creation?
When God created all things, it was perfect. When He created beings, angels,
souls, etc, He gave them FREE WILL and CHOICE, thus choosing between good
and evil, light and darkness, truth and lies, right and wrong. When God
placed man on the earth, his loyalty was tested, and he fell, giving into
temptation and disobedience, therefore giving the earth over the Satan to
reign, causing all humans to be tempted in their choices of good and evil,
etc. Because MAN CHOOSES sin and evil, affliction, diseases, disasters,
catastrophes are the result of reaping the consequences of sin and evil. God
made NO mistakes. MAN makes the mistakes by CHOOSING evil and sin. If ALL
men did NOT choose sin, there would be NO suffering, temptations, griefs,
horrors, catastrophes, infirmities etc. on the earth. Satan is the one who
brings all evil upon the earth, therefore CHOOSING sin and EVIL, empowers
him to cause the magnitude of atrocities that the earth endures.
so sayeth one who has been brainwashed from birth
What about the Hindus then? they tell a completely different story. All liars
are they or mistaken idiots lke you
cont
If God created everything, why did he create sin and punishment for the
sins
he created?
Because of His great love for His creation. God didn't want robots who had
NO choices, but wanted His children to serve, love and abide in Him by their
own choices. He gave them the opportunity of choosing evil, with the
warnings of the consequences of choosing that evil would bring. Punishment
is the result and consequences for CHOOSING evil and sin and rightly so. It
is called JUSTICE.
Your god has all this influence, all this knowledge all this power, but never
shows?
WHY?
cont
What is his purpose of putting man on earth to suffer from hunger,
diseases
and catastrophes and then
usually experience a painful old age and death before being delivered to
an
infinitely pleasant and
perpetual heaven?
God placed man on the earth because of the fall of Lucifer, discovering that
His created being CHOSE iniquity, thus instead of having another war in
heaven, for the choices of evil, disobedience, iniquity and sin, God created
the earth, to separate man from heaven and Himself, to make his choices as
to whether CHOOSING sin and evil is worth the great loss of heaven and
standing in the presence of God.
Impossibe claptrap, where is the 'presence' of this imaginary god????!!!!
Having discovered that sin and evil cause
such horror, pain, suffering and grief, man would choose obedience,
goodness, righteousness, truth, and servitude to the Father, to be with Him
and return to heaven, and that man would NO longer CHOOSE evil and sin,
however, YOU tell me, after knowing this, why you still do?
cont
Does God enjoy toying with and torturing his creations?
NO, suffering any evil is never good, and even witnessing the torture of the
sinners is painful, however, choosing evil,
talking again on behals of your imaginar od are we? Did He give your His
persoal permission to do that?
REQUIRES JUSTICE. So what have
YOU done to stop all of the evil and sins in your life to make the world a
better place?
I'll guarantee he has done more than your imaginary god has done
--
Dore
www.dorewilliamson.com
"Bill" <wmech@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:4eeFd.8034$7N1.5538@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
Some questions for experts on Christian religion;
God is supposedly made up of God the Father, God the Son and the Holy
Ghost.
Who was God the fathers wife? Who was Jesus's mother before he was born of
the virgin Mary?
If God the Father did not have a wife, how did he father a son?
Who is the Holy Ghost? Is he an uncle? What is his function?
If this trinity is all powerful and created the Universe and everything in
it, why did it create such
fallible, errant and grossly imperfect men and earthly catastrophes and
diseases of every
imaginable kind? Why did this supposedly infallible God make these many
serious
mistakes in his creation?
If God created everything, why did he create sin and punishment for the
sins
he created?
What is his purpose of putting man on earth to suffer from hunger,
diseases
and catastrophes and then
usually experience a painful old age and death before being delivered to
an
infinitely pleasant and
perpetual heaven?
Does God enjoy toying with and torturing his creations?
Bill
.
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| User: "Olrik" |
|
| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
13 Jan 2005 01:16:22 AM |
|
|
bob young wrote:
Dore wrote:
<snip>
Dore is an atheist troll. Don't mind him.
--
Olrik
aa #1981
Qualified SMASH member
EAC Chief Food Inspector, Bacon Division
.
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| User: "Robibnikoff" |
|
| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
13 Jan 2005 04:49:18 AM |
|
|
"Olrik" <olrik666@yahoo_BACON!_.com> wrote in message
news:hdpFd.5919$2Y4.550692@wagner.videotron.net...
bob young wrote:
Dore wrote:
<snip>
Dore is an atheist troll. Don't mind him.
Um, no SHE'S not.
--
---------
Robyn
Resident Witchypoo
#1557
.
|
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| User: "Al Klein" |
|
| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
13 Jan 2005 09:24:14 PM |
|
|
On Thu, 13 Jan 2005 05:49:18 -0500, "Robibnikoff"
<witchypoo@broomstick.com> said in alt.atheism:
"Olrik" <olrik666@yahoo_BACON!_.com> wrote in message
news:hdpFd.5919$2Y4.550692@wagner.videotron.net...
bob young wrote:
Dore wrote:
<snip>
Dore is an atheist troll. Don't mind him.
Um, no SHE'S not.
She's neither a 'he' nor an atheist. She IS, however, a troll. :)
And, if you believe her, god and Jesus.
--
"The United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian Religion"
- Treaty of Tripoli, 1797, ratified by Congress
(random sig, produced by SigChanger)
rukbat at verizon dot net
.
|
|
|
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| User: "Olrik" |
|
| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
14 Jan 2005 10:16:38 AM |
|
|
Robibnikoff wrote:
"Olrik" <olrik666@yahoo_BACON!_.com> wrote in message
news:hdpFd.5919$2Y4.550692@wagner.videotron.net...
bob young wrote:
Dore wrote:
<snip>
Dore is an atheist troll. Don't mind him.
Um, no SHE'S not.
Oh!
But somebody once posted a page from her site, and it was clear to me
that is was a parody. But it's becoming harder these days to distinguish
between parodists and fundie trolls...
--
Olrik
aa #1981
Qualified SMASH member
EAC Chief Food Inspector, Bacon Division
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| User: "Robibnikoff" |
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| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
14 Jan 2005 10:21:40 AM |
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"Olrik" <olrik666@yahoo_BACON!_.com> wrote in message
news:MfSFd.39426$8m.752896@weber.videotron.net...
Robibnikoff wrote:
"Olrik" <olrik666@yahoo_BACON!_.com> wrote in message
news:hdpFd.5919$2Y4.550692@wagner.videotron.net...
bob young wrote:
Dore wrote:
<snip>
Dore is an atheist troll. Don't mind him.
Um, no SHE'S not.
Oh!
But somebody once posted a page from her site, and it was clear to me that
is was a parody.
Sadly, it's not. Dore thinks she's the 2nd coming of Jesus.
But it's becoming harder these days to distinguish
between parodists and fundie trolls...
Scary, isn't it? :P
--
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Robyn
Resident Witchypoo
#1557
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| User: "Olrik" |
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| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
14 Jan 2005 11:26:51 PM |
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Robibnikoff wrote:
"Olrik" <olrik666@yahoo_BACON!_.com> wrote in message
news:MfSFd.39426$8m.752896@weber.videotron.net...
Robibnikoff wrote:
"Olrik" <olrik666@yahoo_BACON!_.com> wrote in message
news:hdpFd.5919$2Y4.550692@wagner.videotron.net...
bob young wrote:
Dore wrote:
<snip>
Dore is an atheist troll. Don't mind him.
Um, no SHE'S not.
Oh!
But somebody once posted a page from her site, and it was clear to me that
is was a parody.
Sadly, it's not. Dore thinks she's the 2nd coming of Jesus.
Wait 'til she hears there was no First Coming!
But it's becoming harder these days to distinguish
between parodists and fundie trolls...
Scary, isn't it? :P
Indeed! It makes it hard for us to respond to posts! Insult, cajole,
laugh, what?
;-)
--
Olrik
aa #1981
Qualified SMASH member
EAC Chief Food Inspector, Bacon Division
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| User: "Mark K. Bilbo" |
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| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
15 Jan 2005 08:53:35 AM |
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In our last episode <MfSFd.39426$8m.752896@weber.videotron.net>, Olrik
lept out of the bushes shouting:
Robibnikoff wrote:
"Olrik" <olrik666@yahoo_BACON!_.com> wrote in message
news:hdpFd.5919$2Y4.550692@wagner.videotron.net...
bob young wrote:
Dore wrote:
<snip>
Dore is an atheist troll. Don't mind him.
Um, no SHE'S not.
Oh!
But somebody once posted a page from her site, and it was clear to me that
is was a parody. But it's becoming harder these days to distinguish
between parodists and fundie trolls...
Oh no, it's not a parody. That's the *scary part.
She's been around for *years. Tells a story that includes
apparently wandering off from her life and living on the streets for some
time. Near as anyone has been able to tell, she was at some point, for
real, one of those people who you sometimes see that pushing a grocery
cart along the sidewalk, having arguments with lamp posts.
I try to keep her in my killfile and resist the urge to toy with the crazy
lady as she's not just Usenet kook but the real thing. One hopes she's
getting some kind of treatment and decent care.
--
Mark K. Bilbo - a.a. #1423
EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion
Alt-atheism website at: http://www.alt-atheism.org
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"Religion is regarded by the common people as true,
by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful."
-- Seneca the Younger
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| User: "Olrik" |
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| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
15 Jan 2005 02:37:13 PM |
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Mark K. Bilbo wrote:
In our last episode <MfSFd.39426$8m.752896@weber.videotron.net>, Olrik
lept out of the bushes shouting:
Robibnikoff wrote:
"Olrik" <olrik666@yahoo_BACON!_.com> wrote in message
news:hdpFd.5919$2Y4.550692@wagner.videotron.net...
bob young wrote:
Dore wrote:
<snip>
Dore is an atheist troll. Don't mind him.
Um, no SHE'S not.
Oh!
But somebody once posted a page from her site, and it was clear to me that
is was a parody. But it's becoming harder these days to distinguish
between parodists and fundie trolls...
Oh no, it's not a parody. That's the *scary part.
She's been around for *years. Tells a story that includes
apparently wandering off from her life and living on the streets for some
time. Near as anyone has been able to tell, she was at some point, for
real, one of those people who you sometimes see that pushing a grocery
cart along the sidewalk, having arguments with lamp posts.
I try to keep her in my killfile and resist the urge to toy with the crazy
lady as she's not just Usenet kook but the real thing. One hopes she's
getting some kind of treatment and decent care.
Thanks for the info. I've always ignored her. Now I know why!
--
Olrik
aa #1981
Qualified SMASH member
EAC Chief Food Inspector, Bacon Division
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| User: "Vic Sagerquist" |
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| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
12 Jan 2005 11:02:28 PM |
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On 12 Jan 2005, Dore dropped trou, farted, whirled, then shouted:
"Bill" <wmech@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:4eeFd.8034$7N1.5538@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
Some questions for experts on Christian religion;
God is supposedly made up of God the Father, God the Son and the Holy
Ghost.
Actually the Godhead is made up of ALL of the hosts of heaven, the
Father, the Son, who became flesh on earth, as well as all of the
hosts (angels) of heaven, who are ALL ONE with the Holy Spirit of God,
which is the power, authority, all knowledge, wisdom, light, truth and
righteousness etc.
I'll bet parties are pretty boring up there.
[snip]
If this trinity is all powerful and created the Universe and
everything in it, why did it create such
fallible, errant and grossly imperfect men and earthly catastrophes
and diseases of every
imaginable kind? Why did this supposedly infallible God make these
many serious
mistakes in his creation?
When God created all things, it was perfect. When He created beings,
angels, souls, etc, He gave them FREE WILL and CHOICE, thus choosing
between good and evil, light and darkness, truth and lies, right and
wrong. When God placed man on the earth, his loyalty was tested, and
he fell, giving into temptation and disobedience, therefore giving the
earth over the Satan to reign, causing all humans to be tempted in
their choices of good and evil, etc. Because MAN CHOOSES sin and evil,
affliction, diseases, disasters, catastrophes are the result of
reaping the consequences of sin and evil. God made NO mistakes. MAN
makes the mistakes by CHOOSING evil and sin. If ALL men did NOT choose
sin, there would be NO suffering, temptations, griefs, horrors,
catastrophes, infirmities etc. on the earth. Satan is the one who
brings all evil upon the earth, therefore CHOOSING sin and EVIL,
empowers him to cause the magnitude of atrocities that the earth
endures.
If the godhead dudes have freewill, and can choose between good and evil,
then you have just contradicted yourself by saying Satan brings all evil
upon the earth.
It must suck to be so consistently inconsistent.
cont
If God created everything, why did he create sin and punishment for
the sins
he created?
Because of His great love for His creation. God didn't want robots who
had NO choices, but wanted His children to serve, love and abide in
Him by their own choices. He gave them the opportunity of choosing
evil, with the warnings of the consequences of choosing that evil
would bring. Punishment is the result and consequences for CHOOSING
evil and sin and rightly so. It is called JUSTICE.
Justice makes room for reform in modern society. A criminal is given the
chance to reform himself while serving his debt to society. If, when
released on parole, he proves himself worthy, he is exonerated.
Your stupid religion provides for ETERNAL punishment of those who have
wronged your god. What kind of reform can become of eternal punishment?
I'll help you here. NONE. By definition then, eternal punishment is not
justice. And it's FAR from love. It is barbarianism. And it is wrong.
Your god has the morality of a 2-year-old kicking the walls when he
doesn't get his own way.
cont
What is his purpose of putting man on earth to suffer from hunger,
diseases
and catastrophes and then
usually experience a painful old age and death before being delivered
to an
infinitely pleasant and
perpetual heaven?
God placed man on the earth because of the fall of Lucifer,
discovering that His created being CHOSE iniquity, thus instead of
having another war in heaven, for the choices of evil, disobedience,
iniquity and sin, God created the earth, to separate man from heaven
and Himself, to make his choices as to whether CHOOSING sin and evil
is worth the great loss of heaven and standing in the presence of God.
Having discovered that sin and evil cause such horror, pain, suffering
and grief, man would choose obedience, goodness, righteousness, truth,
and servitude to the Father, to be with Him and return to heaven, and
that man would NO longer CHOOSE evil and sin, however, YOU tell me,
after knowing this, why you still do?
This is utter ***** only a brainwashed christian would believe. Do
you really believe this ***** is truth? Why?
cont
Does God enjoy toying with and torturing his creations?
NO, suffering any evil is never good, and even witnessing the torture
of the sinners is painful, however, choosing evil, REQUIRES JUSTICE.
So what have YOU done to stop all of the evil and sins in your life to
make the world a better place?
Your god supposedly teaches forgiveness, yet your version of justice is
the furthest thing from forgiveness there is. Your "forgiveness" is like
giving a traffic offender a life sentence for speeding. This world won't
be a better place until it is rid of Christianity.
--
Vic Sagerquist
aa#2011
Supervisor, EAC Department of little adhesive-backed "L" shaped
chrome-plastic doo-dads to add feet to Jesus fish department
--------
Why is it that most of the people who are against abortion are people you
wouldn't want to ***** in the first place?
--George Carlin
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| User: "footybet" |
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| Title: Re: Questions about the Trinity of God? |
12 Jan 2005 12:54:51 PM |
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Does God enjoy toying with and torturing his creations?
only His atheistic creations !!!
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