| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"" |
| Date: |
26 Oct 2005 04:46:58 PM |
| Object: |
Re: about sinning |
Bock wrote:
I am new to attending church service.
Why does religion suggest that everyone is sinning?
The reason I ask that question is that I don't believe
the average person sins very much if at all. What would be the
sins that the average person does?
Why does the pastor suggest for many life is less than ideal or happy?
Why is there such stress on trying to get to heaven? Doesn't one live
the best life they can and accept the consequences? Perhaps heaven is
full or in spite of living a good life, compared to the numbers who want
to get to heaven, have more money, more priests and friends praying for
them as a reference - some get to heaven and others don't.
Why is there stress on collecting or sending money to foreign places
when the North American city I live in has lots of homeless, drug
addicts, mentally ill people on the street in need of help?
Why do pastors read what Paul, Jesus and a host of other people did a
long, long time ago when it is important to work and think in the
present with issues such as pollution, homelessness, high divorce rate,
over population.
I ask these questions not out of criticism but out of being new to
attending service.
When you were born, it was with original sin. Baptism, Holy Communion
and Confirmation washes that sin away, but you are still a victim of
the fall of mankind. This is why you will sweat at your brow for your
daily bread, and why a woman must endure labor pains in childbirth.
You must give with a joyful heart, for it is in giving that we receive.
And we all must die, for it is in dying that we are born into eternal
life, be it in Heaven or hell.
"Those whom he foreknew he also predestined." -- Romans 8:29.
What did St. Paul mean by 'predestined'? Doesn't salvation depend on
our free will? Or does God know in advance -- and even mark out in
advance -- which path we will choose? Worrying about this issue is
kind of like a fish in the ocean trying to calculate how high the sky
is. Simply reflecting on God's omnipotence leads us to realize that
this question is not even in our neighborhood. Along with King David,
we can say, "I do not occupy myself with things too great and too
marvelous for me." -- Psalm 131:1.
We know one thing: "God desires everyone to be saved and to come to
the knowledge of truth." -- 1 Timothy 2:4. Without a doubt,
salvation is the most important item on his agenda. It's so important
that God designed all of history around it, from the creation of the
world to the death and resurrection of his Son. Imagine: He planned
everything just so that we could be part of his family for all eternity!
.
|
|
| User: "Ike" |
|
| Title: Re: about sinning |
26 Oct 2005 11:27:55 PM |
|
|
<vivapadrepio@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1130363217.988778.37650@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
Bock wrote:
I am new to attending church service.
Why does religion suggest that everyone is sinning?
The reason I ask that question is that I don't believe
the average person sins very much if at all. What would be the
sins that the average person does?
Why does the pastor suggest for many life is less than ideal or happy?
Why is there such stress on trying to get to heaven? Doesn't one live
the best life they can and accept the consequences? Perhaps heaven is
full or in spite of living a good life, compared to the numbers who want
to get to heaven, have more money, more priests and friends praying for
them as a reference - some get to heaven and others don't.
Why is there stress on collecting or sending money to foreign places
when the North American city I live in has lots of homeless, drug
addicts, mentally ill people on the street in need of help?
Why do pastors read what Paul, Jesus and a host of other people did a
long, long time ago when it is important to work and think in the
present with issues such as pollution, homelessness, high divorce rate,
over population.
I ask these questions not out of criticism but out of being new to
attending service.
When you were born, it was with original sin. Baptism, Holy Communion
and Confirmation washes that sin away, but you are still a victim of
the fall of mankind. This is why you will sweat at your brow for your
daily bread, and why a woman must endure labor pains in childbirth.
I have 6 Trick-or Treat coupons for free bagels for any child under 12 limit
one pre coupon per visit at Einstein Brothers Bagel shop. Is that because
they aren't Christians?
You must give with a joyful heart, for it is in giving that we receive.
I gave at the office.
And we all must die, for it is in dying that we are born into eternal
life, be it in Heaven or hell.
Great, a reason to die. Now I can go ahead with it.
"Those whom he foreknew he also predestined." -- Romans 8:29.
What did St. Paul mean by 'predestined'?
Wait what did he mean by foreknew? Four new what?
Doesn't salvation depend on
our free will? Or does God know in advance -- and even mark out in
advance -- which path we will choose? Worrying about this issue is
kind of like a fish in the ocean trying to calculate how high the sky
is.
I didn't know fish were interested in the sky. I suppose they are though,
now that you mention it.
Simply reflecting on God's omnipotence leads us to realize that
this question is not even in our neighborhood.
What question?
Along with King David,
we can say, "I do not occupy myself with things too great and too
marvelous for me." -- Psalm 131:1.
How can we talk in unison; I thought he was dead?
We know one thing: "God desires everyone to be saved and to come to
the knowledge of truth." -- 1 Timothy 2:4. Without a doubt,
salvation is the most important item on his agenda.
Timothy's agenda? Boy are you getting mysterious.
It's so important
that God designed all of history around it, from the creation of the
world to the death and resurrection of his Son. Imagine: He planned
everything just so that we could be part of his family for all eternity!
I'm trying to imagine it, but don't know where to begin.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Mike W" |
|
| Title: Re: about sinning |
29 Oct 2005 08:29:56 PM |
|
|
"Ike" <accordiondocxyzxyzxyz@mindspring.com> wrote:
<vivapadrepio@aol.com> wrote:
Bock wrote:
I am new to attending church service.
Why does religion suggest that everyone is sinning?
The reason I ask that question is that I don't believe
the average person sins very much if at all. What would be the
sins that the average person does?
A guiltless person is probably defined as a sociopath by those people in the
know.
Why does the pastor suggest for many life is less than ideal or
happy?
'cause this isn't utopia?
Why is there such stress on trying to get to heaven?
Heaven is a good place that shouldn't be well defined. Definitions always
lead to rational deconstruction, which can be a nuisance.
Doesn't one live the best life they can and accept the
consequences? Perhaps heaven is full or in spite of living a
good life, compared to the numbers who want to get to heaven,
have more money, more priests and friends praying for
them as a reference - some get to heaven and others don't.
Why is there stress on collecting or sending money to foreign
places when the North American city I live in has lots of
homeless, drug addicts, mentally ill people on the street in
need of help?
Guilt about not helping your people enough? No? Too much!
Guilt about laying blame where it's not fair to lay it? No? Wow!
Why do pastors read what Paul, Jesus and a host of other people
did a long, long time ago when it is important to work and think
in the present with issues such as pollution, homelessness, high
divorce rate, over population.
The Romans had sewage treatment and then came the Dark Ages. We need to
remember.
I ask these questions not out of criticism but out of being new to
attending service.
<snipped>
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "" |
|
| Title: Re: about sinning |
27 Oct 2005 04:49:15 PM |
|
|
Ike wrote:
<vivapadrepio@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1130363217.988778.37650@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
Bock wrote:
I am new to attending church service.
Why does religion suggest that everyone is sinning?
The reason I ask that question is that I don't believe
the average person sins very much if at all. What would be the
sins that the average person does?
Why does the pastor suggest for many life is less than ideal or happy?
Why is there such stress on trying to get to heaven? Doesn't one live
the best life they can and accept the consequences? Perhaps heaven is
full or in spite of living a good life, compared to the numbers who want
to get to heaven, have more money, more priests and friends praying for
them as a reference - some get to heaven and others don't.
Why is there stress on collecting or sending money to foreign places
when the North American city I live in has lots of homeless, drug
addicts, mentally ill people on the street in need of help?
Why do pastors read what Paul, Jesus and a host of other people did a
long, long time ago when it is important to work and think in the
present with issues such as pollution, homelessness, high divorce rate,
over population.
I ask these questions not out of criticism but out of being new to
attending service.
When you were born, it was with original sin. Baptism, Holy Communion
and Confirmation washes that sin away, but you are still a victim of
the fall of mankind. This is why you will sweat at your brow for your
daily bread, and why a woman must endure labor pains in childbirth.
I have 6 Trick-or Treat coupons for free bagels for any child under 12 limit
one pre coupon per visit at Einstein Brothers Bagel shop. Is that because
they aren't Christians?
You must give with a joyful heart, for it is in giving that we receive.
I gave at the office.
And we all must die, for it is in dying that we are born into eternal
life, be it in Heaven or hell.
Great, a reason to die. Now I can go ahead with it.
"Those whom he foreknew he also predestined." -- Romans 8:29.
What did St. Paul mean by 'predestined'?
Wait what did he mean by foreknew? Four new what?
Doesn't salvation depend on
our free will? Or does God know in advance -- and even mark out in
advance -- which path we will choose? Worrying about this issue is
kind of like a fish in the ocean trying to calculate how high the sky
is.
I didn't know fish were interested in the sky. I suppose they are though,
now that you mention it.
Simply reflecting on God's omnipotence leads us to realize that
this question is not even in our neighborhood.
What question?
Along with King David,
we can say, "I do not occupy myself with things too great and too
marvelous for me." -- Psalm 131:1.
How can we talk in unison; I thought he was dead?
We know one thing: "God desires everyone to be saved and to come to
the knowledge of truth." -- 1 Timothy 2:4. Without a doubt,
salvation is the most important item on his agenda.
Timothy's agenda? Boy are you getting mysterious.
It's so important
that God designed all of history around it, from the creation of the
world to the death and resurrection of his Son. Imagine: He planned
everything just so that we could be part of his family for all eternity!
I'm trying to imagine it, but don't know where to begin.
Typical. How about prayer? Always worked for me! Or do you want to
burn in hell with all of your 'friends'?
.
|
|
|
|
|
| User: "Bill" |
|
| Title: Re: about sinning |
29 Oct 2005 03:48:15 PM |
|
|
<vivapadrepio@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1130363217.988778.37650@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
Bock wrote:
I am new to attending church service.
Why does religion suggest that everyone is sinning?
The reason I ask that question is that I don't believe
the average person sins very much if at all. What would be the
sins that the average person does?
Why does the pastor suggest for many life is less than ideal or happy?
Why is there such stress on trying to get to heaven? Doesn't one live
the best life they can and accept the consequences? Perhaps heaven is
full or in spite of living a good life, compared to the numbers who want
to get to heaven, have more money, more priests and friends praying for
them as a reference - some get to heaven and others don't.
Why is there stress on collecting or sending money to foreign places
when the North American city I live in has lots of homeless, drug
addicts, mentally ill people on the street in need of help?
Why do pastors read what Paul, Jesus and a host of other people did a
long, long time ago when it is important to work and think in the
present with issues such as pollution, homelessness, high divorce rate,
over population.
I ask these questions not out of criticism but out of being new to
attending service.
When you were born, it was with original sin. Baptism, Holy Communion
and Confirmation washes that sin away, but you are still a victim of
the fall of mankind. This is why you will sweat at your brow for your
daily bread, and why a woman must endure labor pains in childbirth.
You must give with a joyful heart, for it is in giving that we receive.
And we all must die, for it is in dying that we are born into eternal
life, be it in Heaven or hell.
I thought your Jesus died to pay for our sins? If not, why was he nailed to
a cross?
"Those whom he foreknew he also predestined." -- Romans 8:29.
What did St. Paul mean by 'predestined'? Doesn't salvation depend on
our free will? Or does God know in advance -- and even mark out in
advance -- which path we will choose? Worrying about this issue is
kind of like a fish in the ocean trying to calculate how high the sky
is. Simply reflecting on God's omnipotence leads us to realize that
this question is not even in our neighborhood. Along with King David,
we can say, "I do not occupy myself with things too great and too
marvelous for me." -- Psalm 131:1.
We know one thing: "God desires everyone to be saved and to come to
the knowledge of truth." -- 1 Timothy 2:4. Without a doubt,
salvation is the most important item on his agenda. It's so important
that God designed all of history around it, from the creation of the
world to the death and resurrection of his Son. Imagine: He planned
everything just so that we could be part of his family for all eternity!
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "" |
|
| Title: Re: about sinning |
26 Oct 2005 05:11:31 PM |
|
|
wrote:
Bock wrote:
I am new to attending church service.
Why does religion suggest that everyone is sinning?
When you were born, it was with original sin.
otherwise known as absolute stupidity...
We know one thing: "God desires everyone to be saved and to come to
the knowledge of truth."
and the truth is... you're a liar!
.
|
|
|
| User: "John Manning" |
|
| Title: Re: about sinning |
26 Oct 2005 05:56:46 PM |
|
|
wrote:
vivapadrepio@aol.com wrote:
Bock wrote:
I am new to attending church service.
Why does religion suggest that everyone is sinning?
When you were born, it was with original sin.
otherwise known as absolute stupidity...
We know one thing: "God desires everyone to be saved and to come to
the knowledge of truth."
and the truth is... you're a liar!
He/she is also a troll.
.
|
|
|
| User: "" |
|
| Title: Re: about sinning |
27 Oct 2005 06:01:50 PM |
|
|
John Manning wrote:
wildbluskies@hotmail.com wrote:
vivapadrepio@aol.com wrote:
Bock wrote:
I am new to attending church service.
Why does religion suggest that everyone is sinning?
When you were born, it was with original sin.
otherwise known as absolute stupidity...
We know one thing: "God desires everyone to be saved and to come to
the knowledge of truth."
and the truth is... you're a liar!
He/she is also a troll.
so does that make YOU, a fish?
.
|
|
|
| User: "John Manning" |
|
| Title: Re: about sinning |
27 Oct 2005 06:00:57 PM |
|
|
wrote:
John Manning wrote:
wrote:
vivapadrepio@aol.com wrote:
Bock wrote:
I am new to attending church service.
Why does religion suggest that everyone is sinning?
When you were born, it was with original sin.
otherwise known as absolute stupidity...
We know one thing: "God desires everyone to be saved and to come to
the knowledge of truth."
and the truth is... you're a liar!
He/she is also a troll.
so does that make YOU, a fish?
Just informing the he/she that fell for it.
.
|
|
|
| User: "" |
|
| Title: Re: about sinning |
27 Oct 2005 06:09:42 PM |
|
|
John Manning wrote:
wildbluskies@hotmail.com wrote:
John Manning wrote:
wildbluskies@hotmail.com wrote:
vivapadrepio@aol.com wrote:
Bock wrote:
I am new to attending church service.
Why does religion suggest that everyone is sinning?
When you were born, it was with original sin.
otherwise known as absolute stupidity...
We know one thing: "God desires everyone to be saved and to come to
the knowledge of truth."
and the truth is... you're a liar!
He/she is also a troll.
so does that make YOU, a fish?
Just informing the he/she that fell for it.
Nice to see you're taking responsibilty for others stupidity, Jesus
must be very proud of you?
.
|
|
|
| User: "John Manning" |
|
| Title: Re: about sinning |
27 Oct 2005 07:14:07 PM |
|
|
wrote:
John Manning wrote:
wrote:
John Manning wrote:
wrote:
vivapadrepio@aol.com wrote:
Bock wrote:
I am new to attending church service.
Why does religion suggest that everyone is sinning?
When you were born, it was with original sin.
otherwise known as absolute stupidity...
We know one thing: "God desires everyone to be saved and to come to
the knowledge of truth."
and the truth is... you're a liar!
He/she is also a troll.
so does that make YOU, a fish?
Just informing the he/she that fell for it.
Nice to see you're taking responsibilty for others stupidity, Jesus
must be very proud of you?
You're the dope, not me.
.
|
|
|
| User: "" |
|
| Title: Re: about sinning |
28 Oct 2005 03:23:59 PM |
|
|
John Manning wrote:
wildbluskies@hotmail.com wrote:
John Manning wrote:
wildbluskies@hotmail.com wrote:
John Manning wrote:
wildbluskies@hotmail.com wrote:
vivapadrepio@aol.com wrote:
Bock wrote:
I am new to attending church service.
Why does religion suggest that everyone is sinning?
When you were born, it was with original sin.
otherwise known as absolute stupidity...
We know one thing: "God desires everyone to be saved and to come to
the knowledge of truth."
and the truth is... you're a liar!
He/she is also a troll.
so does that make YOU, a fish?
Just informing the he/she that fell for it.
Nice to see you're taking responsibilty for others stupidity, Jesus
must be very proud of you?
You're the dope, not me.
said the kettle to the pot...
.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| User: "" |
|
| Title: Re: about trolling |
26 Oct 2005 10:42:51 PM |
|
|
John Manning wrote:
cindys wrote:
<vivapadrepio@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1130363217.988778.37650@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
When you were born, it was with original sin.
There is no such thing as original sin, and please stop posting this crap to
the Jewish newsgroup.
Best regards,
---Cindy S .
Indeed. Isn't is said somewhere that we were
made in the image and likeness of God?
Certainly. But does that make you God? If so, let's see you create a
universe.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Chris H. Fleming" |
|
| Title: Re: about trolling |
26 Oct 2005 11:18:44 PM |
|
|
wrote:
John Manning wrote:
cindys wrote:
< > wrote in message
news:1130363217.988778.37650@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
When you were born, it was with original sin.
There is no such thing as original sin, and please stop posting this crap to
the Jewish newsgroup.
Best regards,
---Cindy S .
Indeed. Isn't is said somewhere that we were
made in the image and likeness of God?
Certainly. But does that make you God? If so, let's see you create a
universe.
Certainly. But first I want to see God create a universe.
.
|
|
|
| User: "thomas p" |
|
| Title: Re: about trolling |
27 Oct 2005 06:24:56 AM |
|
|
On 26 Oct 2005 21:18:44 -0700, "Chris H. Fleming"
<chris_h_fleming@yahoo.com> wrote:
vivapadrepio@aol.com wrote:
John Manning wrote:
cindys wrote:
<vivapadrepio@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1130363217.988778.37650@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
When you were born, it was with original sin.
There is no such thing as original sin, and please stop posting this crap to
the Jewish newsgroup.
Best regards,
---Cindy S .
Indeed. Isn't is said somewhere that we were
made in the image and likeness of God?
Certainly. But does that make you God? If so, let's see you create a
universe.
Certainly. But first I want to see God create a universe.
That was the perfect answer - not that he will understand it.
Thomas P.
"Life must be lived forwards but understood backwards"
(Kierkegaard)
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "" |
|
| Title: Re: about trolling |
27 Oct 2005 06:06:42 PM |
|
|
cindys wrote:
"Chris H. Fleming" <chris_h_fleming@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1130386724.662373.295510@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
vivapadrepio@aol.com wrote:
John Manning wrote:
cindys wrote:
<vivapadrepio@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1130363217.988778.37650@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
When you were born, it was with original sin.
There is no such thing as original sin,
---Cindy S .
Indeed. Isn't is said somewhere that we were
made in the image and likeness of God?
Certainly. But does that make you God? If so, let's see you create a
universe.
Certainly. But first I want to see God create a universe.
------------
First, I want to see Vivapadreckio stop adding his crossposts to the Jewish
newsgroup.
---Cindy S.
frustrating the will of God is a Sin, Gods will is for vivapadreckio to
crosspost... God just created a universe, Praise the LORD!
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "Uncle Vic" |
|
| Title: Re: about trolling |
27 Oct 2005 02:32:59 PM |
|
|
on 26 Oct 2005 in alt.atheism, dear sweet Chris H. Fleming
(chris_h_fleming@yahoo.com) made the light shine upon us with this:
vivapadrepio@aol.com wrote:
John Manning wrote:
cindys wrote:
<vivapadrepio@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1130363217.988778.37650@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
When you were born, it was with original sin.
There is no such thing as original sin, and please stop posting
this crap to the Jewish newsgroup.
Best regards,
---Cindy S .
Indeed. Isn't is said somewhere that we were
made in the image and likeness of God?
Certainly. But does that make you God? If so, let's see you create
a universe.
Certainly. But first I want to see God create a universe.
Certainly. But first I want to see God.
--
Uncle Vic
aa#2011
Supervisor, EAC Department of little adhesive-backed "L" shaped
chrome-plastic doo-dads to add feet to Jesus fish department
----
"The world is only 5-6 thousand years old does not mean the planet
earth is only 5-6 thousand years old. There have been many worlds
created and destroyed on this planet. The creation of the planet is
described in Genesis 1. The creation of the world is described in
Genesis 2. Two different kind of creations." --Eric Brze
.
|
|
|
|
|
| User: "thomas p" |
|
| Title: Re: about trolling |
27 Oct 2005 06:25:03 AM |
|
|
On 26 Oct 2005 20:42:51 -0700, "vivapadrepio@aol.com"
<vivapadrepio@aol.com> wrote:
John Manning wrote:
cindys wrote:
<vivapadrepio@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1130363217.988778.37650@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
When you were born, it was with original sin.
There is no such thing as original sin, and please stop posting this crap to
the Jewish newsgroup.
Best regards,
---Cindy S .
Indeed. Isn't is said somewhere that we were
made in the image and likeness of God?
Certainly. But does that make you God?
It certainly would make me a god, if it were true. Since I am not a
god, it is not true.
If so, let's see you create a
universe.
You just disproved your belief.
Thomas P.
"Life must be lived forwards but understood backwards"
(Kierkegaard)
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "Dubh Ghall" |
|
| Title: Re: about trolling |
27 Oct 2005 06:58:54 PM |
|
|
On 26 Oct 2005 20:42:51 -0700, "vivapadrepio@aol.com" <vivapadrepio@aol.com>
wrote:
John Manning wrote:
cindys wrote:
<vivapadrepio@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1130363217.988778.37650@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
When you were born, it was with original sin.
There is no such thing as original sin, and please stop posting this crap to
the Jewish newsgroup.
Best regards,
---Cindy S .
Indeed. Isn't is said somewhere that we were
made in the image and likeness of God?
Certainly. But does that make you God? If so, let's see you create a
universe.
Show us good solid, empirical, evidence, that any god has already done that, and
we will duplicate the trick.
.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Related Articles |
|
|
