| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"" |
| Date: |
08 Jan 2005 05:43:02 AM |
| Object: |
Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
On Fri, 07 Jan 2005 09:32:10 -0600, Gactimus <gactimus@xrs.net> wrote:
We all know that some of the greatest crimes of the 20th century have
been committed by atheists. From Stalin's many murders, to Leopold
and Loeb's thrill kills, down to Madalyn Murray O'Hair's larceny.
So then, should atheism be blamed for all crimes that atheists commit
in the same way that atheists blame religion for the crimes of the
religious?
No, say the atheists. Atheism is not an organization or a belief,
and so can't be the cause of any behavior. (What then, caused the
formation of American Atheists?)
Even if, for the sake of argument, we grant the premise, it raises
another question: what then, is atheism? Atheists are more than
willing to explain what it is *not*, but are very evasive as to
what it *is*. At best, they may define it as a lack of belief.
But why have a whole newsgroup to discuss a lack of something?
Why an embarrassingly vocal organization called (in effect) American
Lack-ofsomethings? It just doesn't wash.
Why is this? Could it really be that atheists don't know what
atheism is? Not likely. They can be quite silly, but not *that*
silly. They act more as if they know what it is, but don't want to
discuss that.
One explanation fits the facts: ATHEISM IS A MORAL COPOUT. It is a
means of abdicating responsibility. And this harsh criticism of
religion is just a smoke screen.
Nihilism the ultimate moral copout. It says morality doesn't mean
anything. Atheism is a close second.
Hitler was a Roman Catholic. The Pope called him "The Defender of the
Faith." FOAD.
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| User: "Larry Heath" |
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| Title: Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
09 Jan 2005 12:55:58 AM |
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<conan@god.con> wrote in message news:L_-dnVoO1_5770LcRVn-uA@giganews.com...
On Fri, 07 Jan 2005 09:32:10 -0600, Gactimus <gactimus@xrs.net> wrote:
One explanation fits the facts: ATHEISM IS A MORAL COPOUT. It is a
means of abdicating responsibility.
Here we have in one sentence the ultimate load!
Atheism is not an abdication of responsibility, by its very nature in my
opinion, it is taking on ALL responsibility for one's self in all things!
Later Larry
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| User: "T" |
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| Title: Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
08 Jan 2005 08:02:52 AM |
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(Well, this thread just showed up in alt.tv.star-trek.enterprise, and is
cross posted to Hell and back, isn't it?)
Taking a neutral position I'd ask a seemingly rhetorical question:
- Is it possible be Morally Responsible without being a practitioner of
any Religion?
TBerk
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| User: "Therion Ware" |
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| Title: Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
08 Jan 2005 08:17:07 AM |
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On Sat, 08 Jan 2005 08:02:52 GMT in alt.atheism, T (T
<tberk@sbcglobal.net>) said, directing the reply to alt.atheism
(Well, this thread just showed up in alt.tv.star-trek.enterprise, and is
cross posted to Hell and back, isn't it?)
Taking a neutral position I'd ask a seemingly rhetorical question:
- Is it possible be Morally Responsible without being a practitioner of
any Religion?
It's the only morally responsible position. After all the believer
abdicates moral responsibility to their God, at least in theory
obeying the commands of their God, whether they understand them or not
and such moral decisions that are made by the individual are based on
the commandments of the deity in question and the a priori assumption
that those commands are in and of themselves moral. And that amounts
to the abdication of moral responsibility.
<breathe in>
--
"Do Unto Others As You Would Have Them Do Unto You."
- Attrib: Pauline Reage.
Inexpensive VHS & other video to CD/DVD conversion?
See: www.Video2CD.com. 35.00 gets your video on DVD.
Market Your DVD to The World For Almost Nothing: www.instantdvd.tv
** atheist poster child #1 ** #442.
.
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| User: "Pastor Frank" |
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| Title: Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
13 Jan 2005 10:38:45 PM |
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"Therion Ware" <autodelete@city-of-dis.com> wrote in message
news:k85vt0tiogi26a8if431pkf4b3rit823hp@4ax.com...
It's the only morally responsible position. After all the believer
abdicates moral responsibility to their God, at least in theory
obeying the commands of their God, whether they understand them or not
and such moral decisions that are made by the individual are based on
the commandments of the deity in question and the a priori assumption
that those commands are in and of themselves moral. And that amounts
to the abdication of moral responsibility.
Is that what you told the judge why you didn't believe in the laws of
the country, but only in what you consider your "moral responsibility" and
why you are posting this from jail now?
Our Christian "God is love" (1 John 4,16) and morality is only the
consequence of believing in our God, for to cause people to love and care is
the penultimate aim of our religions, if not the aim of most other religions
also. See below
Pastor Frank
Jesus in Jn:13:34: A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one
another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.
Jesus in Jn:13:35: By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples,
if ye have love one to another.
Jesus in Jn:15:12-13: This is my commandment: That ye love one another,
as I have loved you. Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down
his life for his friends.
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| User: "Therion Ware" |
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| Title: Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
17 Jan 2005 10:03:33 AM |
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On Fri, 14 Jan 2005 06:38:45 +0800 in alt.atheism, Pastor Frank
("Pastor Frank" <PF@christfirst.com>) said, directing the reply to
alt.atheism
"Therion Ware" <autodelete@city-of-dis.com> wrote in message
news:k85vt0tiogi26a8if431pkf4b3rit823hp@4ax.com...
It's the only morally responsible position. After all the believer
abdicates moral responsibility to their God, at least in theory
obeying the commands of their God, whether they understand them or not
and such moral decisions that are made by the individual are based on
the commandments of the deity in question and the a priori assumption
that those commands are in and of themselves moral. And that amounts
to the abdication of moral responsibility.
Is that what you told the judge why you didn't believe in the laws of
the country, but only in what you consider your "moral responsibility" and
why you are posting this from jail now?
Good point, though I think you should put the point to Gandhi rather
than me. This is to say that sometimes it is moral to break the law
rather than to obey it, and I presume that in certain circumstances,
you'd agree. If - even under a restricted set of circumstances you do
agree - how do you decide whether that's the case?
Our Christian "God is love" (1 John 4,16) and morality is only the
consequence of believing in our God, for to cause people to love and care is
the penultimate aim of our religions, if not the aim of most other religions
also. See below
If "morality is only the consequence of believing in out God," how do
you explain the widely varying takes on morality expressed by
Christians over the centuries?
--
"Do Unto Others As You Would Have Them Do Unto You."
- Attrib: Pauline Reage.
Inexpensive VHS & other video to CD/DVD conversion?
See: www.Video2CD.com. 35.00 gets your video on DVD.
Market Your DVD to The World For Almost Nothing: www.instantdvd.tv
** atheist poster child #1 ** #442.
.
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| User: "ZenIsWhen" |
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| Title: Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
20 Jan 2005 06:34:59 AM |
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"Pastor Frank" <PF@christfirst.com> wrote in message
news:1106168777.aad0e16a1788896ab8c784b39d4a1abf@teranews...
"Therion Ware" <autodelete@city-of-dis.com> wrote in message
news:eubfu0ln9fctgosaq9sohhnhfvatbhau8d@4ax.com...
On Fri, 14 Jan 2005 06:38:45 +0800 in alt.atheism, Pastor Frank
("Pastor Frank" <PF@christfirst.com>) said, directing the reply to
alt.atheism
"Therion Ware" <autodelete@city-of-dis.com> wrote in message
news:k85vt0tiogi26a8if431pkf4b3rit823hp@4ax.com...
It's the only morally responsible position. After all the believer
abdicates moral responsibility to their God, at least in theory
obeying the commands of their God, whether they understand them or
not
and such moral decisions that are made by the individual are based on
the commandments of the deity in question and the a priori assumption
that those commands are in and of themselves moral. And that amounts
to the abdication of moral responsibility.
Is that what you told the judge why you didn't believe in the laws
of
the country, but only in what you consider your "moral responsibility"
and
why you are posting this from jail now?
Good point, though I think you should put the point to Gandhi rather
than me. This is to say that sometimes it is moral to break the law
rather than to obey it, and I presume that in certain circumstances,
you'd agree. If - even under a restricted set of circumstances you do
agree - how do you decide whether that's the case?
Our Christian "God is love" (1 John 4,16) and morality is only the
consequence of believing in our God, for to cause people to love and
care
is
the penultimate aim of our religions, if not the aim of most other
religions
also. See below
If "morality is only the consequence of believing in out God," how do
you explain the widely varying takes on morality expressed by
Christians over the centuries?
It's because atheists only look for imperfections and when they meet
perfection they don't recognise it.
Bwahahaaaa...... Atheist find insanity/imperfections - because they find
them?
What perfection, asswipe?
You? Your religion? Your "church", other christians? Your unproven god? You
MUST be kidding!!!
Since the church is a hospital for
sinners, not a museum for saints, it should be obvious even to atheists,
that the church is inundated by the imperfect, all hoping and praying for
perfection in Christ Jesus.
Since you now admit THAT fact - then it follows YOU have NO right judging,
or trying to "lead" others - since YOU are a (totally) imperfect
sinner!!!!!!
But the church is also home to Satan's minions seeking whom they may
ensnare. Satan's minions being those who profess Christ, yet do and
justify
doing the opposite from what Christ would do.
Such as you!
Only perceptually and
philosophically challenged atheists can't tell the difference.
They CAN, ***** for brains.
By YOUR actions, you have shown YOURSELF to be one of thiose evil ones. It
is only under your egomaniacal arrogance, and ignorance, that you claim
anything else.
Pastor Frank
ATHEIST LITERALISM
Atheists usually display major problems with interpretation of symbols
and metaphor, and not just religious ones. Most seem to have failed their
literary comprehension courses. It's common for such students to hand
in assignments to critically evaluate a love poem, containing the
following sentiments:
"The comparison of the beloved's features to astronomical bodies is
specious if not spurious to say the least. For apart from the chemical
composition of said features, the face of the beloved has no connection
with, nor similitude to astronomical objects, such as the sun, moon and
stars, alluded to in the poem."
--Anon--
An anonomous, misguided, anti-atheist quote means absolutely nothing.
The mere fact that you dare post it here - as though it has any real
meaning, shows your anti-atheist bellowing means absolutely nothing.
The FACT that you post it here gives ANY and every atheist just as much
right to post in this (insanely described "pristine") news group as you or
anyone else.
.
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| User: "xeno" |
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| Title: Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
20 Jan 2005 07:55:20 AM |
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On Thu, 20 Jan 2005, ZenIsWhen wrote:
[Pastor Frank]
Since the church is a hospital for
sinners, not a museum for saints, it should be obvious even to atheists,
that the church is inundated by the imperfect, all hoping and praying for
perfection in Christ Jesus.
Since you now admit THAT fact - then it follows YOU have NO right judging,
or trying to "lead" others - since YOU are a (totally) imperfect
sinner!!!!!!
Nobody's perfect. But a hospital ran by quacks isn't going to cure
anybody. You are arguing with a patient in an asylum who believes he runs
it. Do not fret.
Only perceptually and
philosophically challenged atheists can't tell the difference.
They CAN, ***** for brains.
You don't expect to have any of his delusions, do you? Is it such a
terrible thing to be afflicted with sanity? Only a madman would think so,
& chastise you for it.
By YOUR actions, you have shown YOURSELF to be one of thiose evil ones. It
is only under your egomaniacal arrogance, and ignorance, that you claim
anything else.
You can't out-Frank Frank, Zen. That fool is a complete loon, & misery
loves company.
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| User: "Pastor Frank" |
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| Title: Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
20 Jan 2005 11:34:43 PM |
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"Therion Ware" <autodelete@city-of-dis.com> wrote in message
news:eubfu0ln9fctgosaq9sohhnhfvatbhau8d@4ax.com...
On Fri, 14 Jan 2005 06:38:45 +0800 in alt.atheism, Pastor Frank
("Pastor Frank" <PF@christfirst.com>) said, directing the reply to
alt.atheism
"Therion Ware" <autodelete@city-of-dis.com> wrote in message
news:k85vt0tiogi26a8if431pkf4b3rit823hp@4ax.com...
It's the only morally responsible position. After all the believer
abdicates moral responsibility to their God, at least in theory
obeying the commands of their God, whether they understand them or not
and such moral decisions that are made by the individual are based on
the commandments of the deity in question and the a priori assumption
that those commands are in and of themselves moral. And that amounts
to the abdication of moral responsibility.
Is that what you told the judge why you didn't believe in the laws of
the country, but only in what you consider your "moral responsibility"
and
why you are posting this from jail now?
Good point, though I think you should put the point to Gandhi rather
than me. This is to say that sometimes it is moral to break the law
rather than to obey it, and I presume that in certain circumstances,
you'd agree. If - even under a restricted set of circumstances you do
agree - how do you decide whether that's the case?
Our Christian "God is love" (1 John 4,16) and morality is only the
consequence of believing in our God, for to cause people to love and care
is
the penultimate aim of our religions, if not the aim of most other
religions
also. See below
If "morality is only the consequence of believing in out God," how do
you explain the widely varying takes on morality expressed by
Christians over the centuries?
The Christian church is supposed to be a hospital for sinners, meaning
that it is filled with sinners seeking healing for their compulsions,
addictions, aggressions and fears.
Are you an atheist, believing that the church feeds their patients some
kind of magic pill called Christianity, which will transform everyone into
uniform Christians, all the spitting image of Christ, something like a
plastic Jesus factory? LOL
Give us a break already, willya???
Pastor Frank
2Tm:3:16: All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is
profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction
in righteousness
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| User: "bob young" |
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| Title: Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
22 Jan 2005 03:06:06 AM |
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Pastor Frank wrote:
"Therion Ware" <autodelete@city-of-dis.com> wrote in message
news:eubfu0ln9fctgosaq9sohhnhfvatbhau8d@4ax.com...
On Fri, 14 Jan 2005 06:38:45 +0800 in alt.atheism, Pastor Frank
("Pastor Frank" <PF@christfirst.com>) said, directing the reply to
alt.atheism
"Therion Ware" <autodelete@city-of-dis.com> wrote in message
news:k85vt0tiogi26a8if431pkf4b3rit823hp@4ax.com...
It's the only morally responsible position. After all the believer
abdicates moral responsibility to their God, at least in theory
obeying the commands of their God, whether they understand them or not
and such moral decisions that are made by the individual are based on
the commandments of the deity in question and the a priori assumption
that those commands are in and of themselves moral. And that amounts
to the abdication of moral responsibility.
Is that what you told the judge why you didn't believe in the laws of
the country, but only in what you consider your "moral responsibility"
and
why you are posting this from jail now?
Good point, though I think you should put the point to Gandhi rather
than me. This is to say that sometimes it is moral to break the law
rather than to obey it, and I presume that in certain circumstances,
you'd agree. If - even under a restricted set of circumstances you do
agree - how do you decide whether that's the case?
Our Christian "God is love" (1 John 4,16) and morality is only the
consequence of believing in our God, for to cause people to love and care
is
the penultimate aim of our religions, if not the aim of most other
religions
also. See below
If "morality is only the consequence of believing in out God," how do
you explain the widely varying takes on morality expressed by
Christians over the centuries?
The Christian church is supposed to be a hospital for sinners, meaning
that it is filled with sinners seeking healing for their compulsions,
addictions, aggressions and fears.
The Church hijacks 'sin' as a tool. How many sinners out there do you imagine
volunteer to go to our church to be 'cured'? Sinners will always be bad. [I
much prefer Bad Individuals to the old fashioned use of 'sin']
By the same token do you believe that good people are good because of your
faith? Humans are basically good, a proprtion are bad therefore humanity has,
from it's earliest times, had to cope with the bad elements, hence gods were
made up to do the job in stone age times. Stone age man also has to contend
with Evil Spirits that were blamed for all their ills of the time.
Today we have law enforcement, Courts of Law and volunteer groups that councel
those bad elements that are prepared to listen.
Gods don't figure, they can't, they are imaginary things, powerless, [I was
going to add 'finished' but of course as long as there is superstion around
there are always going to be 'Gods']
Bob
Humanist Brit
Hong Kong
Are you an atheist, believing that the church feeds their patients some
kind of magic pill called Christianity, which will transform everyone into
uniform Christians, all the spitting image of Christ, something like a
plastic Jesus factory? LOL
Give us a break already, willya???
Pastor Frank
2Tm:3:16: All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is
profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction
in righteousness
.
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| User: "Mark K. Bilbo" |
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| Title: Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
19 Jan 2005 10:30:38 PM |
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In our last episode
<1106168777.aad0e16a1788896ab8c784b39d4a1abf@teranews>, Pastor Frank lept
out of the bushes shouting:
It's because atheists only look for imperfections and when they meet
perfection they don't recognise it. Since the church is a hospital for
sinners, not a museum for saints, it should be obvious even to atheists,
that the church is inundated by the imperfect, all hoping and praying for
perfection in Christ Jesus.
But the church is also home to Satan's minions seeking whom they may
ensnare. Satan's minions being those who profess Christ, yet do and
justify doing the opposite from what Christ would do. Only perceptually
and philosophically challenged atheists can't tell the difference.
Pastor Frank
Oh look who's trolling by...
--
Mark K. Bilbo - a.a. #1423
EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion
Alt-atheism website at: http://www.alt-atheism.org
-----------------------------------------------------------
"Religion is regarded by the common people as true,
by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful."
-- Seneca the Younger
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| User: "RainLover" |
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| Title: Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
20 Jan 2005 05:06:01 PM |
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On Wed, 19 Jan 2005 20:00:52 +0800, "Pastor Frank"
<PF@christfirst.com> wrote:
"Therion Ware" <autodelete@city-of-dis.com> wrote in message
news:eubfu0ln9fctgosaq9sohhnhfvatbhau8d@4ax.com...
On Fri, 14 Jan 2005 06:38:45 +0800 in alt.atheism, Pastor Frank
("Pastor Frank" <PF@christfirst.com>) said, directing the reply to
alt.atheism
"Therion Ware" <autodelete@city-of-dis.com> wrote in message
news:k85vt0tiogi26a8if431pkf4b3rit823hp@4ax.com...
It's the only morally responsible position. After all the believer
abdicates moral responsibility to their God, at least in theory
obeying the commands of their God, whether they understand them or not
and such moral decisions that are made by the individual are based on
the commandments of the deity in question and the a priori assumption
that those commands are in and of themselves moral. And that amounts
to the abdication of moral responsibility.
Is that what you told the judge why you didn't believe in the laws of
the country, but only in what you consider your "moral responsibility"
and
why you are posting this from jail now?
Good point, though I think you should put the point to Gandhi rather
than me. This is to say that sometimes it is moral to break the law
rather than to obey it, and I presume that in certain circumstances,
you'd agree. If - even under a restricted set of circumstances you do
agree - how do you decide whether that's the case?
Our Christian "God is love" (1 John 4,16) and morality is only the
consequence of believing in our God, for to cause people to love and care
is
the penultimate aim of our religions, if not the aim of most other
religions
also. See below
If "morality is only the consequence of believing in out God," how do
you explain the widely varying takes on morality expressed by
Christians over the centuries?
It's because atheists only look for imperfections and when they meet
perfection they don't recognise it. Since the church is a hospital for
sinners, not a museum for saints,
Geeze.. that bumpersticker excuse is as lame as "christians aren't
perfect, just forgiven"
it should be obvious even to atheists,
that the church is inundated by the imperfect, all hoping and praying for
perfection in Christ Jesus.
It should be obvious, even to YOU, that every example of bad
christians throughout history thought of themselves just like YOU
DO... not perfect, but doing "gods work" and better than most of the
people around them.
The problem isn't that there are 'imperfect' people in the church, the
problem really comes from the fact that the WORSE these 'christians'
do and say, the BETTER they THINK they are.
But the church is also home to Satan's minions seeking whom they may
ensnare. Satan's minions being those who profess Christ, yet do and justify
doing the opposite from what Christ would do. Only perceptually and
philosophically challenged atheists can't tell the difference.
And do you think these Minions who profess Christ KNOW they are
working for Satan?
Of course they don't! You can ask ANY of them and they'll ALL tell
you that they are doing The Lord's Work.
Are *YOU* one of Satan's Minions, Frank?
Don't tell us... you're doing The Lord's Work, right?
James, Seattle
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| User: "Pastor Frank" |
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| Title: Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
28 Jan 2005 08:01:07 AM |
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"RainLover" <SP-AMB-LOCKrainlover@raincity.com> wrote in message
news:7rovu05ii8l2f1cql9p8dot1j88gp4bnug@4ax.com...
On Wed, 19 Jan 2005 20:00:52 +0800, "Pastor Frank"
<PF@christfirst.com> wrote:
"Therion Ware" <autodelete@city-of-dis.com> wrote in message
news:eubfu0ln9fctgosaq9sohhnhfvatbhau8d@4ax.com...
On Fri, 14 Jan 2005 06:38:45 +0800 in alt.atheism, Pastor Frank
("Pastor Frank" <PF@christfirst.com>) said, directing the reply to
alt.atheism
"Therion Ware" <autodelete@city-of-dis.com> wrote in message
news:k85vt0tiogi26a8if431pkf4b3rit823hp@4ax.com...
It's the only morally responsible position. After all the believer
abdicates moral responsibility to their God, at least in theory
obeying the commands of their God, whether they understand them or
not
and such moral decisions that are made by the individual are based
on
the commandments of the deity in question and the a priori
assumption
that those commands are in and of themselves moral. And that amounts
to the abdication of moral responsibility.
Is that what you told the judge why you didn't believe in the laws
of
the country, but only in what you consider your "moral responsibility"
and
why you are posting this from jail now?
Good point, though I think you should put the point to Gandhi rather
than me. This is to say that sometimes it is moral to break the law
rather than to obey it, and I presume that in certain circumstances,
you'd agree. If - even under a restricted set of circumstances you do
agree - how do you decide whether that's the case?
Our Christian "God is love" (1 John 4,16) and morality is only the
consequence of believing in our God, for to cause people to love and
care
is
the penultimate aim of our religions, if not the aim of most other
religions
also. See below
If "morality is only the consequence of believing in out God," how do
you explain the widely varying takes on morality expressed by
Christians over the centuries?
It's because atheists only look for imperfections and when they meet
perfection they don't recognise it. Since the church is a hospital for
sinners, not a museum for saints,
Geeze.. that bumpersticker excuse is as lame as "christians aren't
perfect, just forgiven"
it should be obvious even to atheists,
that the church is inundated by the imperfect, all hoping and praying for
perfection in Christ Jesus.
It should be obvious, even to YOU, that every example of bad
christians throughout history thought of themselves just like YOU
DO... not perfect, but doing "gods work" and better than most of the
people around them.
The problem isn't that there are 'imperfect' people in the church, the
problem really comes from the fact that the WORSE these 'christians'
do and say, the BETTER they THINK they are.
That's just your paranoia talking.
But the church is also home to Satan's minions seeking whom they may
ensnare. Satan's minions being those who profess Christ, yet do and
justify
doing the opposite from what Christ would do. Only perceptually and
philosophically challenged atheists can't tell the difference.
And do you think these Minions who profess Christ KNOW they are
working for Satan?
Of course they don't! You can ask ANY of them and they'll ALL tell
you that they are doing The Lord's Work.
That they do, no doubt and that's why they are Satan's minions. But you
can easily check them out yourself. First get to know Jesus. A red letter
Bible edition has all his words printed in red to help you. Then ask: What
Would Jesus Do? If the person does something Jesus would not do and
justifies such action, then you know you are dealing with one of Satan's
minions.
Are *YOU* one of Satan's Minions, Frank?
Don't tell us... you're doing The Lord's Work, right?
Just apply the same rule to me as to others calling themselves
Christians. If you see me doing something Christ would not do, tell me about
it. If I don't repent of, but rather justify that action, then you have
every right to believe me to be one of Satan's minions. In the mean time you
can stay out of hell by believing every person innocent till proved guilty,
rather than the reverse nightmare.
Pastor Frank
**Jesus in Jn:12:47: And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge
him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
.
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| User: "RainLover" |
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| Title: Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
28 Jan 2005 01:38:21 PM |
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On Fri, 28 Jan 2005 16:01:07 +0800, "Pastor Frank"
<PF@christfirst.com> wrote:
"RainLover" <SP-AMB-LOCKrainlover@raincity.com> wrote in message
news:7rovu05ii8l2f1cql9p8dot1j88gp4bnug@4ax.com...
On Wed, 19 Jan 2005 20:00:52 +0800, "Pastor Frank"
<PF@christfirst.com> wrote:
"Therion Ware" <autodelete@city-of-dis.com> wrote in message
doing the opposite from what Christ would do. Only perceptually and
philosophically challenged atheists can't tell the difference.
And do you think these Minions who profess Christ KNOW they are
working for Satan?
Of course they don't! You can ask ANY of them and they'll ALL tell
you that they are doing The Lord's Work.
That they do, no doubt and that's why they are Satan's minions. But you
can easily check them out yourself. First get to know Jesus. A red letter
Bible edition has all his words printed in red to help you. Then ask: What
Would Jesus Do? If the person does something Jesus would not do and
justifies such action, then you know you are dealing with one of Satan's
minions.
Jesus says that Christians should not suffer a witch to live... That
is, Christians should kill witches.
Are *YOU* one of Satan's Minions, Frank?
Don't tell us... you're doing The Lord's Work, right?
Just apply the same rule to me as to others calling themselves
Christians. If you see me doing something Christ would not do, tell me about
it.
Kill any witches lately? Then I will call you One of Satan's Minions,
and by your own standard you just gave us, you agree.
If I don't repent of, but rather justify that action, then you have
every right to believe me to be one of Satan's minions.
You have NO intention of repenting and beginning to kill witches,
hense, you ARE one of Satan's Minions and not a real christain or
"Pastor".
In the mean time you
can stay out of hell by believing every person innocent till proved guilty,
rather than the reverse nightmare.
But since you are guilty, then you have no right to tell others
anything, Minion Frank.
James, Seattle
.
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| User: "Pastor Frank" |
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| Title: Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
29 Jan 2005 08:59:54 AM |
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"RainLover" <SP-AMB-LOCKrainlover@raincity.com> wrote in message
news:6rfkv05ol7v6pj52s6u62f09q16825brtt@4ax.com...
On Fri, 28 Jan 2005 16:01:07 +0800, "Pastor Frank"
<PF@christfirst.com> wrote:
"RainLover" <SP-AMB-LOCKrainlover@raincity.com> wrote in message
news:7rovu05ii8l2f1cql9p8dot1j88gp4bnug@4ax.com...
On Wed, 19 Jan 2005 20:00:52 +0800, "Pastor Frank"
<PF@christfirst.com> wrote:
"Therion Ware" <autodelete@city-of-dis.com> wrote in message
doing the opposite from what Christ would do. Only perceptually and
philosophically challenged atheists can't tell the difference.
And do you think these Minions who profess Christ KNOW they are
working for Satan?
Of course they don't! You can ask ANY of them and they'll ALL tell
you that they are doing The Lord's Work.
That they do, no doubt and that's why they are Satan's minions. But
you
can easily check them out yourself. First get to know Jesus. A red letter
Bible edition has all his words printed in red to help you. Then ask:
What
Would Jesus Do? If the person does something Jesus would not do and
justifies such action, then you know you are dealing with one of Satan's
minions.
Jesus says that Christians should not suffer a witch to live... That
is, Christians should kill witches.
Where does Jesus say that? I think you are just making things up as you
go expressing your hate for Christ and His Christians. You should post to
atheist and flame groups. I will post you over to a selection which might be
to your liking.
.
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| User: "Wortenheimer" |
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| Title: Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
29 Jan 2005 08:14:14 PM |
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"Pastor Frank" <PF@christfirst.com> wrote in message
news:1107000100.2ad8146c80f5c59a6e998631b93aa4b4@teranews...
"RainLover" <SP-AMB-LOCKrainlover@raincity.com> wrote in message
news:6rfkv05ol7v6pj52s6u62f09q16825brtt@4ax.com...
Jesus says that Christians should not suffer a witch to live... That
is, Christians should kill witches.
Where does Jesus say that? I think you are just making things up as you
go expressing your hate for Christ and His Christians.
i know all about the mental contortions that christians put themselves
through with the trinity concept and other assorted *****, so i want to
make this very simple for you.
1) is jesus god?
2) if you answer yes to 1), is jesus the same god as that of the old
testament?
if you answer the last question in the affirmative then jesus wants you to
kill witches and a wide assortment of others, including women and children.
"Behold, I will corrupt your seed, and spread dung upon your faces."
-- Malachi 2:3
what a god jesus is!
You should post to
atheist and flame groups. I will post you over to a selection which might
be
to your liking.
.
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| User: "Al Klein" |
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| Title: Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
29 Jan 2005 10:41:32 PM |
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On Sat, 29 Jan 2005 15:14:14 -0500, "Wortenheimer" <worten@heimer.com>
said in alt.atheism:
"Pastor Frank" <PF@christfirst.com> wrote in message
news:1107000100.2ad8146c80f5c59a6e998631b93aa4b4@teranews...
"RainLover" <SP-AMB-LOCKrainlover@raincity.com> wrote in message
news:6rfkv05ol7v6pj52s6u62f09q16825brtt@4ax.com...
Jesus says that Christians should not suffer a witch to live... That
is, Christians should kill witches.
Where does Jesus say that? I think you are just making things up as you
go expressing your hate for Christ and His Christians.
i know all about the mental contortions that christians put themselves
through with the trinity concept and other assorted *****, so i want to
make this very simple for you.
1) is jesus god?
2) if you answer yes to 1), is jesus the same god as that of the old
testament?
if you answer the last question in the affirmative then jesus wants you to
kill witches and a wide assortment of others, including women and children.
If you answer no to either question, Jesus was Jewish, so he accepted
the OT, so he was in favor of killing witches. Either way, god or
man, if he existed the result is the same.
--
"To assert that the earth revolves around the sun is as erroneous as to claim that Jesus
was not born of a virgin."
Cardinal Bellarmine,[1615, during the trial of Galileo]
(random sig, produced by SigChanger)
rukbat at verizon dot net
.
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| User: "Mark K. Bilbo" |
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| Title: Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
30 Jan 2005 01:25:04 PM |
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In our last episode
<1107000100.2ad8146c80f5c59a6e998631b93aa4b4@teranews>, Pastor Frank
lumbered into the room and mumbled:
Where does Jesus say that? I think you are just making things up as
you
go expressing your hate for Christ and His Christians. You should post to
atheist and flame groups. I will post you over to a selection which might
be to your liking.
You mean you'll do massive, inappropriate cross posting in an attempt to
start yet another flame war...
--
Mark K. Bilbo - a.a. #1423
EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion
Alt-atheism website at: http://www.alt-atheism.org
-----------------------------------------------------------
"Religion is regarded by the common people as true,
by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful."
-- Seneca the Younger
.
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| User: "Harry Lime harrylime at harrylime dot teevee" |
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| Title: Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
30 Jan 2005 04:53:58 PM |
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Dear Mark (et al):
Please see inside text:
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote in message
news:Y-adnS1p3fJEQ2HcRVn-tw@megapath.net...
In our last episode
<1107000100.2ad8146c80f5c59a6e998631b93aa4b4@teranews>, Pastor Frank
lumbered into the room and mumbled:
Where does Jesus say that? I think you are just making things up as
you
go expressing your hate for Christ and His Christians. You should post to
atheist and flame groups. I will post you over to a selection which might
be to your liking.
You mean you'll do massive, inappropriate cross posting in an attempt to
start yet another flame war...
That's how it reads to me. While some Satanists believe in a deity or force
(or "farce" as I like to call it), many do not or they "worship" themselves
as an ersatz god (still reads as Atheism in my book).
While we have debated the point from time-to-time (sometimes vigorously) in
alt.satanism, most of the time the threads aren't crossposted to other
uninterested newsgroups -- except by nutters that have an inordinate need
for attention. Likewise, I don't think most of the regular posters care much
about the theological leanings of one self-described Satanist or another
unless they're trying to sell something.
You'd think that Pastor Frank would just spend his time in hotel rooms
"ministering" to hookers like Rev. Swaggart and not wasting his time in
alt.satanism. In fact, if he does I'll gladly send him a six pack of
Thunderbird, a couple of joints, some Lube, and a copy of Song of Solomon
signed by Jehovah in the blood of Jesus.
Regards,
Harry Lime
www.harrylime.biz
--
Mark K. Bilbo - a.a. #1423
EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion
Alt-atheism website at: http://www.alt-atheism.org
-----------------------------------------------------------
"Religion is regarded by the common people as true,
by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful."
-- Seneca the Younger
.
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| User: "Mark K. Bilbo" |
|
| Title: Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
30 Jan 2005 05:59:32 PM |
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In our last episode <qNGdndFKXK-6jGDcRVn-rg@comcast.com>, Harry Lime
lumbered into the room and mumbled:
Dear Mark (et al):
Please see inside text:
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote in message
news:Y-adnS1p3fJEQ2HcRVn-tw@megapath.net...
In our last episode
<1107000100.2ad8146c80f5c59a6e998631b93aa4b4@teranews>, Pastor Frank
lumbered into the room and mumbled:
Where does Jesus say that? I think you are just making things up as
you
go expressing your hate for Christ and His Christians. You should post
to atheist and flame groups. I will post you over to a selection which
might be to your liking.
You mean you'll do massive, inappropriate cross posting in an attempt to
start yet another flame war...
That's how it reads to me.
Only because it is. <g>
"Pastor" Frank is a troll with a history that spans several years. I
believe he was trolling alt.atheism before I arrived and I've been around
the ng almost seven years now. He's been doing this kind of thing for ages
now. His latest tactics of the quite nutty "I'll post you over" (whatever
the hell that's supposed to mean) seem to have arisen because he blames
"atheists" for his interesting need to frequently switch Usenet providers.
While some Satanists believe in a deity or
force (or "farce" as I like to call it), many do not or they "worship"
themselves as an ersatz god (still reads as Atheism in my book).
Well, you have to keep in mind that Frank has his own "dictionary." In his
curious little mind, "atheist" means "anybody who disagrees with Frank."
I'm sure "Satanist" has just as personal (and incoherent) definition for
him. Probably "people who disagree with Frank." <g>
His use of "worship" seems to indicate something so broad and watered
down, stamp collecting probably qualifies. So if you spend more than five
minutes thinking about something, well, there you go!
While we have debated the point from time-to-time (sometimes vigorously)
in alt.satanism, most of the time the threads aren't crossposted to other
uninterested newsgroups --
I can say in my own experience, we just don't get evangelizing Satanists
showing up in alt.atheism.
except by nutters that have an inordinate need
for attention. Likewise, I don't think most of the regular posters care
much about the theological leanings of one self-described Satanist or
another unless they're trying to sell something.
You'd think that Pastor Frank would just spend his time in hotel rooms
"ministering" to hookers like Rev. Swaggart and not wasting his time in
alt.satanism. In fact, if he does I'll gladly send him a six pack of
Thunderbird, a couple of joints, some Lube, and a copy of Song of Solomon
signed by Jehovah in the blood of Jesus.
Actually, he'd probably be a much happier person if he just went back to
gardening.
Years ago I went Googling around to see what I could find. Frank is
apparently some old, retired coot who used to post to gardening ngs.
Started showing up in "philosophy" ngs and eventually religious ones.
Appointed himself a "missionary" to atheists. As time wore on, he ordained
himself and became increasing... different.
It's a, well, an indicative progression in someone of "advanced years" I'm
sad to say...
--
Mark K. Bilbo - a.a. #1423
EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion
Alt-atheism website at: http://www.alt-atheism.org
-----------------------------------------------------------
"Religion is regarded by the common people as true,
by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful."
-- Seneca the Younger
.
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| User: "Harry Lime harrylime at harrylime dot teevee" |
|
| Title: Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
30 Jan 2005 06:19:43 PM |
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Dear Mark:
Please see inside text:
--
I do not find in our particular superstition of Christianity one redeeming
feature.....Millions of innocent men, women and children, since the
introduction of Christianity, have been burned, tortured, fined and
imprisoned. What has been the effect of this coercion? To make half the
world fools and half hypocrites; to support roguery and error all over the
world. Thomas Jefferson
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote in message
news:V_adnai4_uGwgmDcRVn-og@megapath.net...
In our last episode <qNGdndFKXK-6jGDcRVn-rg@comcast.com>, Harry Lime
lumbered into the room and mumbled:
Dear Mark (et al):
Please see inside text:
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote in message
news:Y-adnS1p3fJEQ2HcRVn-tw@megapath.net...
In our last episode
<1107000100.2ad8146c80f5c59a6e998631b93aa4b4@teranews>, Pastor Frank
lumbered into the room and mumbled:
Where does Jesus say that? I think you are just making things up as
you
go expressing your hate for Christ and His Christians. You should post
to atheist and flame groups. I will post you over to a selection which
might be to your liking.
You mean you'll do massive, inappropriate cross posting in an attempt to
start yet another flame war...
That's how it reads to me.
Only because it is. <g>
"Pastor" Frank is a troll with a history that spans several years. I
believe he was trolling alt.atheism before I arrived and I've been around
the ng almost seven years now. He's been doing this kind of thing for ages
now. His latest tactics of the quite nutty "I'll post you over" (whatever
the hell that's supposed to mean) seem to have arisen because he blames
"atheists" for his interesting need to frequently switch Usenet providers.
Well maybe some Atheists have complained about his bad behavior and gotten
his account yanked. This is understandable as there have been several fundy
Christers who used to disgrace alt.satanism with their special blend of
"Jesus loves you, but he's sending you to hell" crapola. We used to get a
lot of racist asswipes as well. Believe me, we have enough kooks there to
keep use entertained and don't need the additional input from the Christian
crowd.
While some Satanists believe in a deity or
force (or "farce" as I like to call it), many do not or they "worship"
themselves as an ersatz god (still reads as Atheism in my book).
Well, you have to keep in mind that Frank has his own "dictionary." In his
curious little mind, "atheist" means "anybody who disagrees with Frank."
I'm sure "Satanist" has just as personal (and incoherent) definition for
him. Probably "people who disagree with Frank." <g>
Since I've plonked him I guess I'll never know. LOL.
His use of "worship" seems to indicate something so broad and watered
down, stamp collecting probably qualifies. So if you spend more than five
minutes thinking about something, well, there you go!
Since I do my best thinking on the john, I'll make sure and worship under
the tutelage of Pastor Frank next time I take a healthy dump.
While we have debated the point from time-to-time (sometimes vigorously)
in alt.satanism, most of the time the threads aren't crossposted to other
uninterested newsgroups --
I can say in my own experience, we just don't get evangelizing Satanists
showing up in alt.atheism.
Oh we do have a couple. Hope that the crosspost didn't open up a virtual
Pandora's Box. These charlatan's are pretty easily spotted by those who
have more than a high school education.
except by nutters that have an inordinate need
for attention. Likewise, I don't think most of the regular posters care
much about the theological leanings of one self-described Satanist or
another unless they're trying to sell something.
You'd think that Pastor Frank would just spend his time in hotel rooms
"ministering" to hookers like Rev. Swaggart and not wasting his time in
alt.satanism. In fact, if he does I'll gladly send him a six pack of
Thunderbird, a couple of joints, some Lube, and a copy of Song of Solomon
signed by Jehovah in the blood of Jesus.
Actually, he'd probably be a much happier person if he just went back to
gardening.
Too bad he doesn't want to discuss gardening sans the religious dogma. I'm a
bit of a hobbyist myself.
Years ago I went Googling around to see what I could find. Frank is
apparently some old, retired coot who used to post to gardening ngs.
Started showing up in "philosophy" ngs and eventually religious ones.
Appointed himself a "missionary" to atheists. As time wore on, he ordained
himself and became increasing... different.
It's a, well, an indicative progression in someone of "advanced years" I'm
sad to say...
Or the need for an ongoing regimen of Aricept.
Regards,
Harry Lime
www.harrylime.biz
--
Mark K. Bilbo - a.a. #1423
EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion
Alt-atheism website at: http://www.alt-atheism.org
-----------------------------------------------------------
"Religion is regarded by the common people as true,
by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful."
-- Seneca the Younger
.
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| User: "Mark K. Bilbo" |
|
| Title: Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
01 Feb 2005 01:57:44 PM |
|
|
In our last episode <-uSdnQ8L9YiiuGDcRVn-vQ@comcast.com>, Harry Lime
lumbered into the room and mumbled:
<snipping for space>
Well maybe some Atheists have complained about his bad behavior and gotten
his account yanked. This is understandable as there have been several fundy
Christers who used to disgrace alt.satanism with their special blend of
"Jesus loves you, but he's sending you to hell" crapola. We used to get a
lot of racist asswipes as well. Believe me, we have enough kooks there to
keep use entertained and don't need the additional input from the Christian
crowd.
I'm sure others have complained about him. I know several of us did. But I
don't think we can account for all the switching he's had to do. What can
be (okay, mildly <g>) amusing is when you watch a Christian tumble to the
fact that Frank believes that the idea of "god" as an actual *being is an
"atheist" fantasy.
It can be quite loopy to watch Frank attacking people who *believe in
"god" as being "atheists in sheep's clothing" while the actual *believers
are after him for being an atheist trying to corrupt their faith. And he
can go from "god is love" to vicious attacks in about a post and a half.
Frank gets *mean when people don't agree with him.
But at least Frankie can't damn you to "hell." He doesn't believe in that
either.
Well, you have to keep in mind that Frank has his own "dictionary." In his
curious little mind, "atheist" means "anybody who disagrees with Frank."
I'm sure "Satanist" has just as personal (and incoherent) definition for
him. Probably "people who disagree with Frank." <g>
Since I've plonked him I guess I'll never know. LOL.
Probably the best approach. He's not as entertaining as he used to be.
Older he gets, the more repetitious and incoherent he becomes. Looks like
his best trolling days are behind him. <g>
His use of "worship" seems to indicate something so broad and watered
down, stamp collecting probably qualifies. So if you spend more than five
minutes thinking about something, well, there you go!
Since I do my best thinking on the john, I'll make sure and worship under
the tutelage of Pastor Frank next time I take a healthy dump.
Given how Frankie defines things, that would probably qualify...
(All hail Lord Crapper? <G>)
--
Mark K. Bilbo - a.a. #1423
EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion
Alt-atheism website at: http://www.alt-atheism.org
-----------------------------------------------------------
"Religion is regarded by the common people as true,
by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful."
-- Seneca the Younger
.
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| User: "RainLover" |
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| Title: Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
31 Jan 2005 01:50:10 PM |
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On Sat, 29 Jan 2005 16:59:54 +0800, "Pastor Frank"
<PF@christfirst.com> wrote:
"RainLover" <SP-AMB-LOCKrainlover@raincity.com> wrote in message
news:6rfkv05ol7v6pj52s6u62f09q16825brtt@4ax.com...
On Fri, 28 Jan 2005 16:01:07 +0800, "Pastor Frank"
<PF@christfirst.com> wrote:
"RainLover" <SP-AMB-LOCKrainlover@raincity.com> wrote in message
news:7rovu05ii8l2f1cql9p8dot1j88gp4bnug@4ax.com...
On Wed, 19 Jan 2005 20:00:52 +0800, "Pastor Frank"
<PF@christfirst.com> wrote:
"Therion Ware" <autodelete@city-of-dis.com> wrote in message
doing the opposite from what Christ would do. Only perceptually and
philosophically challenged atheists can't tell the difference.
And do you think these Minions who profess Christ KNOW they are
working for Satan?
Of course they don't! You can ask ANY of them and they'll ALL tell
you that they are doing The Lord's Work.
That they do, no doubt and that's why they are Satan's minions. But
you
can easily check them out yourself. First get to know Jesus. A red letter
Bible edition has all his words printed in red to help you. Then ask:
What
Would Jesus Do? If the person does something Jesus would not do and
justifies such action, then you know you are dealing with one of Satan's
minions.
Jesus says that Christians should not suffer a witch to live... That
is, Christians should kill witches.
Where does Jesus say that?
Exodus 22:18
Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live' - GOD
I think you are just making things up as you
go expressing your hate for Christ and His Christians.
And I think you just cover your ears and yell "na! na! na! na!" when
the bible says something you don't want it to.
I have no hate for your god.... I don't believe in your god, so why
would I hate it? As for Christians... I don't have an problem with
most of them, but it's the few (you for example) who make ALL
Christians look bad and turn people away from Christianity.
Which I find to be the height of Irony and downright laughable.
You should post to
atheist and flame groups. I will post you over to a selection which might be
to your liking.
I post from alt.atheism. I rarely look to the crossposts of a post I
find interesting. (unless my ISP doesn't allow posting to some of the
groups, such as some in THIS message)
James, Seattle
.
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| User: "Arthur Mullard" |
|
| Title: Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
05 Feb 2005 11:42:55 AM |
|
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Pastor Frank wrote:
"RainLover" <SP-AMB-LOCKrainlover@raincity.com> wrote in message
news:6rfkv05ol7v6pj52s6u62f09q16825brtt@4ax.com...
On Fri, 28 Jan 2005 16:01:07 +0800, "Pastor Frank"
<PF@christfirst.com> wrote:
"RainLover" <SP-AMB-LOCKrainlover@raincity.com> wrote in message
news:7rovu05ii8l2f1cql9p8dot1j88gp4bnug@4ax.com...
On Wed, 19 Jan 2005 20:00:52 +0800, "Pastor Frank"
<PF@christfirst.com> wrote:
"Therion Ware" <autodelete@city-of-dis.com> wrote in message
doing the opposite from what Christ would do. Only perceptually and
philosophically challenged atheists can't tell the difference.
And do you think these Minions who profess Christ KNOW they are
working for Satan?
Of course they don't! You can ask ANY of them and they'll ALL tell
you that they are doing The Lord's Work.
That they do, no doubt and that's why they are Satan's minions. But
you
can easily check them out yourself. First get to know Jesus. A red letter
Bible edition has all his words printed in red to help you. Then ask:
What
Would Jesus Do? If the person does something Jesus would not do and
justifies such action, then you know you are dealing with one of Satan's
minions.
Jesus says that Christians should not suffer a witch to live... That
is, Christians should kill witches.
Where does Jesus say that? I think you are just making things up as you
go expressing your hate for Christ and His Christians. You should post to
atheist and flame groups. I will post you over to a selection which might be
to your liking.
It was from Exodus. All religious intolerance leads to conflict. Go figure.
.
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| User: "Kasper" |
|
| Title: Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
04 Feb 2005 12:18:21 PM |
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Poland is a stupid country becouse poland is weak in football match.
Użytkownik "Pastor Frank" <PF@christfirst.com> napisał w wiadomości
news:1107000100.2ad8146c80f5c59a6e998631b93aa4b4@teranews...
"RainLover" <SP-AMB-LOCKrainlover@raincity.com> wrote in message
news:6rfkv05ol7v6pj52s6u62f09q16825brtt@4ax.com...
On Fri, 28 Jan 2005 16:01:07 +0800, "Pastor Frank"
<PF@christfirst.com> wrote:
"RainLover" <SP-AMB-LOCKrainlover@raincity.com> wrote in message
news:7rovu05ii8l2f1cql9p8dot1j88gp4bnug@4ax.com...
On Wed, 19 Jan 2005 20:00:52 +0800, "Pastor Frank"
<PF@christfirst.com> wrote:
"Therion Ware" <autodelete@city-of-dis.com> wrote in message
doing the opposite from what Christ would do. Only perceptually and
philosophically challenged atheists can't tell the difference.
And do you think these Minions who profess Christ KNOW they are
working for Satan?
Of course they don't! You can ask ANY of them and they'll ALL tell
you that they are doing The Lord's Work.
That they do, no doubt and that's why they are Satan's minions. But
you
can easily check them out yourself. First get to know Jesus. A red
letter
Bible edition has all his words printed in red to help you. Then ask:
What
Would Jesus Do? If the person does something Jesus would not do and
justifies such action, then you know you are dealing with one of
Satan's
minions.
Jesus says that Christians should not suffer a witch to live... That
is, Christians should kill witches.
Where does Jesus say that? I think you are just making things up as
you
go expressing your hate for Christ and His Christians. You should post to
atheist and flame groups. I will post you over to a selection which might
be
to your liking.
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| User: "bob young" |
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| Title: Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
20 Jan 2005 06:08:05 AM |
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Pastor Frank wrote:
"Therion Ware" <autodelete@city-of-dis.com> wrote in message
news:eubfu0ln9fctgosaq9sohhnhfvatbhau8d@4ax.com...
On Fri, 14 Jan 2005 06:38:45 +0800 in alt.atheism, Pastor Frank
("Pastor Frank" <PF@christfirst.com>) said, directing the reply to
alt.atheism
"Therion Ware" <autodelete@city-of-dis.com> wrote in message
news:k85vt0tiogi26a8if431pkf4b3rit823hp@4ax.com...
It's the only morally responsible position. After all the believer
abdicates moral responsibility to their God, at least in theory
obeying the commands of their God, whether they understand them or not
and such moral decisions that are made by the individual are based on
the commandments of the deity in question and the a priori assumption
that those commands are in and of themselves moral. And that amounts
to the abdication of moral responsibility.
Is that what you told the judge why you didn't believe in the laws of
the country, but only in what you consider your "moral responsibility"
and
why you are posting this from jail now?
Good point, though I think you should put the point to Gandhi rather
than me. This is to say that sometimes it is moral to break the law
rather than to obey it, and I presume that in certain circumstances,
you'd agree. If - even under a restricted set of circumstances you do
agree - how do you decide whether that's the case?
Our Christian "God is love" (1 John 4,16) and morality is only the
consequence of believing in our God, for to cause people to love and care
is
the penultimate aim of our religions, if not the aim of most other
religions
also. See below
If "morality is only the consequence of believing in out God," how do
you explain the widely varying takes on morality expressed by
Christians over the centuries?
It's because atheists only look for imperfections and when they meet
perfection they don't recognise it.
Why keep asking this question of Frank? Frank epitomises perfection as can be
clearly seen by reading his laboriously boring repetitive posts.
Religion panders to the 'better than thou' syndrome, puts them above others and
hands out little portions of power to each and everyone. It's a mind game.
Watch any pastor preaching and almost for sure he will have that book in his
hand open at some page or other. Where would they be without this book of
mythology, this 'comforter'?
Bob
Humanist Brit.
Hong kong
"The most ridiculous concept ever perpetrated by Homo Sapiens is that the Lord
God of Creation, Shaper and Ruler of the Universes, wants the saccharine
adoration of his creations, that he can be persuaded by their prayers, and
becomes petulant if he does not receive this flattery. Yet this ridiculous
notion, without one real shred of evidence to bolster it, has gone on to found
one of the oldest, largest and least productive industries in history."
[Robert Heinlein]
Since the church is a hospital for
sinners, not a museum for saints, it should be obvious even to atheists,
that the church is inundated by the imperfect, all hoping and praying for
perfection in Christ Jesus.
But the church is also home to Satan's minions seeking whom they may
ensnare. Satan's minions being those who profess Christ, yet do and justify
doing the opposite from what Christ would do. Only perceptually and
philosophically challenged atheists can't tell the difference.
Pastor Frank
ATHEIST LITERALISM
Atheists usually display major problems with interpretation of symbols
and metaphor, and not just religious ones. Most seem to have failed their
literary comprehension courses. It's common for such students to hand
in assignments to critically evaluate a love poem, containing the
following sentiments:
"The comparison of the beloved's features to astronomical bodies is
specious if not spurious to say the least. For apart from the chemical
composition of said features, the face of the beloved has no connection
with, nor similitude to astronomical objects, such as the sun, moon and
stars, alluded to in the poem."
--Anon--
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| User: "Pastor Frank" |
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| Title: Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
21 Jan 2005 01:28:22 AM |
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"bob young" <alaspectrum@netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:41EF4AC4.2B434E0D@netvigator.com...
Pastor Frank wrote:
It's because atheists only look for imperfections and when they meet
perfection they don't recognise it.
Why keep asking this question of Frank? Frank epitomises perfection as
can be
clearly seen by reading his laboriously boring repetitive posts.
Religion panders to the 'better than thou' syndrome,
You are sure dense Bob and forgetful. By now you should know THERE ARE
NO perfect people in heaven, only forgiven sinners. Therefore "better than
thou" doesn't cut it, and only gets you to hell.
Talk about repetitive posts ...sheeeeh!!! If you just want to spout
atheist nonsense, why do you keep posting here to our pristine Christian
NGs? I will post you over where your like-minded pals are.
Pastor Frank
2Tm:3:16: All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is
profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction
in righteousness
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| User: "Cary Kittrell" |
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| Title: Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
21 Jan 2005 07:16:31 PM |
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In article <1106313378.7a97897bbe399a3b90cf37b9857e1582@teranews> "Pastor Frank" <PF@christfirst.com> writes:
"bob young" <alaspectrum@netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:41EF4AC4.2B434E0D@netvigator.com...
Pastor Frank wrote:
It's because atheists only look for imperfections and when they meet
perfection they don't recognise it.
Why keep asking this question of Frank? Frank epitomises perfection as
can be
clearly seen by reading his laboriously boring repetitive posts.
Religion panders to the 'better than thou' syndrome,
You are sure dense Bob and forgetful. By now you should know THERE ARE
NO perfect people in heaven, only forgiven sinners. Therefore "better than
thou" doesn't cut it, and only gets you to hell.
Well now, there's an interesting concept, intellectually speaking.
So, anyone in heaven may yet at some point commit sin? If so,
what happens to them?
Or does God take away your free will at time of entry, and
you are no longer capable of chosing to sin?
-- cary
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| User: "bob young" |
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| Title: Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
22 Jan 2005 04:52:58 AM |
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Cary Kittrell wrote:
In article <1106313378.7a97897bbe399a3b90cf37b9857e1582@teranews> "Pastor Frank" <PF@christfirst.com> writes:
"bob young" <alaspectrum@netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:41EF4AC4.2B434E0D@netvigator.com...
Pastor Frank wrote:
It's because atheists only look for imperfections and when they meet
perfection they don't recognise it.
Why keep asking this question of Frank? Frank epitomises perfection as
can be
clearly seen by reading his laboriously boring repetitive posts.
Religion panders to the 'better than thou' syndrome,
You are sure dense Bob and forgetful. By now you should know THERE ARE
NO perfect people in heaven, only forgiven sinners. Therefore "better than
thou" doesn't cut it, and only gets you to hell.
Well now, there's an interesting concept, intellectually speaking.
So, anyone in heaven may yet at some point commit sin? If so,
what happens to them?
Or does God take away your free will at time of entry, and
you are no longer capable of chosing to sin?
Well once anyone starts off down the road of superstition and mythology the lunacy sets in and progressively
becomes worse.
It's a bit like my dad used to tell me:
"Never lie as you will usually be found out"
Bob
-- cary
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| User: "John Blake" |
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| Title: Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
24 Jan 2005 03:15:06 PM |
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On Fri, 21 Jan 2005 19:16:31 +0000 (UTC),
(Cary Kittrell) wrote:
In article <1106313378.7a97897bbe399a3b90cf37b9857e1582@teranews> "Pastor Frank" <PF@christfirst.com> writes:
"bob young" <alaspectrum@netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:41EF4AC4.2B434E0D@netvigator.com...
Pastor Frank wrote:
It's because atheists only look for imperfections and when they meet
perfection they don't recognise it.
Why keep asking this question of Frank? Frank epitomises perfection as
can be
clearly seen by reading his laboriously boring repetitive posts.
Religion panders to the 'better than thou' syndrome,
You are sure dense Bob and forgetful. By now you should know THERE ARE
NO perfect people in heaven, only forgiven sinners. Therefore "better than
thou" doesn't cut it, and only gets you to hell.
Well now, there's an interesting concept, intellectually speaking.
So, anyone in heaven may yet at some point commit sin? If so,
what happens to them?
Or does God take away your free will at time of entry, and
you are no longer capable of chosing to sin?
I wonder if you'll get answer to this? Somehow I think not............
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| User: "Pope Rudraigh" |
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| Title: Re: Atheism -- The Ultimate Moral Copout |
21 Jan 2005 07:09:44 PM |
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On Fri, 21 Jan 2005 09:28:22 +0800, "Pastor Frank"
<PF@christfirst.com> wrote:
"bob young" <alaspectrum@netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:41EF4AC4.2B434E0D@netvigator.com...
Pastor Frank wrote:
It's because atheists only look for imperfections and when they meet
perfection they don't recognise it.
Why keep asking this question of Frank? Frank epitomises perfection as
can be
clearly seen by reading his laboriously boring repetitive posts.
Religion panders to the 'better than thou' syndrome,
You are sure dense Bob and forgetful. By now you should know THERE ARE
NO perfect people in heaven, only forgiven sinners. Therefore "better than
thou" doesn't cut it, and only gets you to hell.
Talk about repetitive posts ...sheeeeh!!! If you just want to spout
atheist nonsense, why do you keep posting here to our pristine Christian
NGs? I will post you over where your like-minded pals are.
Pastor Frank
And we'll post them right back at ya, fuckwit.
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