| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"Lawrence Seib" |
| Date: |
07 Apr 2004 09:26:23 AM |
| Object: |
Re: "Atheist" is an "inhumanists" label. |
bob young <alaspectrum@netvigator.com> wrote in message news:<40650E26.D0E13483@netvigator.com>...
Family Man wrote:
"RoyBoy" <armageddon79@email.com> wrote in message
news:F6Q8c.8935$n37.1108948@read2.cgocable.net...
"Family Man" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
"Lawrence Hyde" <revolutionarian@earthlink.net> wrote in message
Question: What is the 12,000 pound bombs referring to?
The pre-planned, pre-meditated illegal holy war against Iraq that has taken
the lives of 575 (latest figure) of our troops and thousands of Iraqi
civilians.
The christians decided to have a "Shock & Awe" party dropping 12,000 pound
bombs across Iraq. I guess this was some kind of tension relief for the
right-wing extremists and corporations that now own America.
Where does it end?
freedom for the people of Iraq?
We can impose freedom on people by wageing
war agianst them, brilliant.
Since Iraq is conmposed of Shite's, Sunni's
and Kurd's, who all hate each other,
it will be nearly impossible for a
democracy to exist there.
Larry
.
|
|
| User: "Fred Stone" |
|
| Title: Re: "Atheist" is an "inhumanists" label. |
07 Apr 2004 10:34:37 AM |
|
|
(Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404070626.51ffb4b6@posting.google.com:
bob young <alaspectrum@netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:<40650E26.D0E13483@netvigator.com>...
Family Man wrote:
"RoyBoy" <armageddon79@email.com> wrote in message
news:F6Q8c.8935$n37.1108948@read2.cgocable.net...
"Family Man" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
"Lawrence Hyde" <revolutionarian@earthlink.net> wrote in
message
Question: What is the 12,000 pound bombs referring to?
The pre-planned, pre-meditated illegal holy war against Iraq that
has taken the lives of 575 (latest figure) of our troops and
thousands of Iraqi civilians.
The christians decided to have a "Shock & Awe" party dropping
12,000 pound bombs across Iraq. I guess this was some kind of
tension relief for the right-wing extremists and corporations that
now own America.
Where does it end?
freedom for the people of Iraq?
We can impose freedom on people by wageing
war agianst them, brilliant.
Nice slogan. Too bad we're not waging war against the ones who will
accept freedom for everyone.
Since Iraq is conmposed of Shite's, Sunni's
and Kurd's, who all hate each other,
it will be nearly impossible for a
democracy to exist there.
Since many of the leaders of each of those groups *have* embraced the
democratic process, there's a good chance that it can be made to work.
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
Cthulhu for President! Why vote for a lesser evil?
.
|
|
|
| User: "Lawrence Seib" |
|
| Title: Re: "Atheist" is an "inhumanists" label. |
09 Apr 2004 09:42:26 AM |
|
|
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message news:<Xns94C475C59C17Cfstone69@207.69.154.203>...
lseib@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu (Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404070626.51ffb4b6@posting.google.com:
bob young <alaspectrum@netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:<40650E26.D0E13483@netvigator.com>...
Family Man wrote:
"RoyBoy" <armageddon79@email.com> wrote in message
news:F6Q8c.8935$n37.1108948@read2.cgocable.net...
"Family Man" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
"Lawrence Hyde" <revolutionarian@earthlink.net> wrote in
message
Question: What is the 12,000 pound bombs referring to?
The pre-planned, pre-meditated illegal holy war against Iraq that
has taken the lives of 575 (latest figure) of our troops and
thousands of Iraqi civilians.
The christians decided to have a "Shock & Awe" party dropping
12,000 pound bombs across Iraq. I guess this was some kind of
tension relief for the right-wing extremists and corporations that
now own America.
Where does it end?
freedom for the people of Iraq?
We can impose freedom on people by waging
war against them, brilliant.
Nice slogan. Too bad we're not waging war
against the ones who will
accept freedom for everyone.
Since Iraq is composed of Shiite's, Sunni's
and Kurd's, who all hate each other,
it will be nearly impossible for a
democracy to exist there.
Since many of the leaders of each of those groups
*have* embraced the democratic process, there's a
good chance that it can be made to work.
What would you say the odds are, 50%, 25%, is that worth
the 500 American lives, plus the 500 billion dollars
that we and are children are going to have to
work to pay off. If a democracy fails to happen,
it will all have been for nothing.
Larry
.
|
|
|
| User: "Fred Stone" |
|
| Title: Re: "Atheist" is an "inhumanists" label. |
09 Apr 2004 10:21:23 AM |
|
|
(Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404090642.1a5048ff@posting.google.com:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message
news:<Xns94C475C59C17Cfstone69@207.69.154.203>...
(Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404070626.51ffb4b6@posting.google.com:
bob young <alaspectrum@netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:<40650E26.D0E13483@netvigator.com>...
Family Man wrote:
"RoyBoy" <armageddon79@email.com> wrote in message
news:F6Q8c.8935$n37.1108948@read2.cgocable.net...
"Family Man" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
"Lawrence Hyde" <revolutionarian@earthlink.net> wrote in
message
Question: What is the 12,000 pound bombs referring to?
The pre-planned, pre-meditated illegal holy war against Iraq
that has taken the lives of 575 (latest figure) of our troops
and thousands of Iraqi civilians.
The christians decided to have a "Shock & Awe" party dropping
12,000 pound bombs across Iraq. I guess this was some kind of
tension relief for the right-wing extremists and corporations
that now own America.
Where does it end?
freedom for the people of Iraq?
We can impose freedom on people by waging
war against them, brilliant.
Nice slogan. Too bad we're not waging war
against the ones who will
accept freedom for everyone.
Since Iraq is composed of Shiite's, Sunni's
and Kurd's, who all hate each other,
it will be nearly impossible for a
democracy to exist there.
Since many of the leaders of each of those groups
*have* embraced the democratic process, there's a
good chance that it can be made to work.
What would you say the odds are, 50%, 25%, is that worth
the 500 American lives, plus the 500 billion dollars
that we and are children are going to have to
work to pay off.
How much is freedom worth to you? Why don't Iraqis deserve the same?
If a democracy fails to happen, it will all have been for nothing.
If we never try, it definitely won't happen.
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
Cthulhu for President! Why vote for a lesser evil?
.
|
|
|
| User: "Lawrence Seib" |
|
| Title: Re: "Atheist" is an "inhumanists" label. |
09 Apr 2004 05:07:01 PM |
|
|
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message news:<Xns94C67387A1FFEfstone69@207.69.154.201>...
lseib@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu (Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404090642.1a5048ff@posting.google.com:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message
news:<Xns94C475C59C17Cfstone69@207.69.154.203>...
lseib@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu (Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404070626.51ffb4b6@posting.google.com:
bob young <alaspectrum@netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:<40650E26.D0E13483@netvigator.com>...
Family Man wrote:
"RoyBoy" <armageddon79@email.com> wrote in message
news:F6Q8c.8935$n37.1108948@read2.cgocable.net...
"Family Man" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
"Lawrence Hyde" <revolutionarian@earthlink.net> wrote in
message
Question: What is the 12,000 pound bombs referring to?
The pre-planned, pre-meditated illegal holy war against Iraq
that has taken the lives of 575 (latest figure) of our troops
and thousands of Iraqi civilians.
The christians decided to have a "Shock & Awe" party dropping
12,000 pound bombs across Iraq. I guess this was some kind of
tension relief for the right-wing extremists and corporations
that now own America.
Where does it end?
freedom for the people of Iraq?
We can impose freedom on people by waging
war against them, brilliant.
Nice slogan. Too bad we're not waging war
against the ones who will
accept freedom for everyone.
Since Iraq is composed of Shiite's, Sunni's
and Kurd's, who all hate each other,
it will be nearly impossible for a
democracy to exist there.
Since many of the leaders of each of those groups
*have* embraced the democratic process, there's a
good chance that it can be made to work.
What would you say the odds are, 50%, 25%, is that worth
the 500 American lives, plus the 500 billion dollars
that we and are children are going to have to
work to pay off.
How much is freedom worth to you? Why don't Iraqis deserve the same?
Its not worth my life. But I will support fighting and
paying for my freedom as well as my fellow Americans
freedom, but we are talking about Iraqi freedom, why must
we pay for theirs?
If a democracy fails to happen, it will all have been for nothing.
If we never try, it definitely won't happen.
That is true, when do you suggest we invade
Burma, China, Iran, Iraq, North Korea, Sudan
Vietnam, and Isreal. I list Isreal because
it only grants full rights to people with
25% Jewish heritage.
Larry
.
|
|
|
| User: "Fred Stone" |
|
| Title: Re: "Atheist" is an "inhumanists" label. |
09 Apr 2004 06:05:46 PM |
|
|
(Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404091407.57fd2b77@posting.google.com:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message
news:<Xns94C67387A1FFEfstone69@207.69.154.201>...
(Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404090642.1a5048ff@posting.google.com:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message
news:<Xns94C475C59C17Cfstone69@207.69.154.203>...
(Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404070626.51ffb4b6@posting.google.com:
bob young <alaspectrum@netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:<40650E26.D0E13483@netvigator.com>...
Family Man wrote:
"RoyBoy" <armageddon79@email.com> wrote in message
news:F6Q8c.8935$n37.1108948@read2.cgocable.net...
"Family Man" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
"Lawrence Hyde" <revolutionarian@earthlink.net> wrote in
message
Question: What is the 12,000 pound bombs referring to?
The pre-planned, pre-meditated illegal holy war against Iraq
that has taken the lives of 575 (latest figure) of our troops
and thousands of Iraqi civilians.
The christians decided to have a "Shock & Awe" party dropping
12,000 pound bombs across Iraq. I guess this was some kind of
tension relief for the right-wing extremists and corporations
that now own America.
Where does it end?
freedom for the people of Iraq?
We can impose freedom on people by waging
war against them, brilliant.
Nice slogan. Too bad we're not waging war
against the ones who will
accept freedom for everyone.
Since Iraq is composed of Shiite's, Sunni's
and Kurd's, who all hate each other,
it will be nearly impossible for a
democracy to exist there.
Since many of the leaders of each of those groups
*have* embraced the democratic process, there's a
good chance that it can be made to work.
What would you say the odds are, 50%, 25%, is that worth
the 500 American lives, plus the 500 billion dollars
that we and are children are going to have to
work to pay off.
How much is freedom worth to you? Why don't Iraqis deserve the same?
Its not worth my life. But I will support fighting and
paying for my freedom as well as my fellow Americans
freedom, but we are talking about Iraqi freedom, why must
we pay for theirs?
Because they need our help.
If a democracy fails to happen, it will all have been for nothing.
If we never try, it definitely won't happen.
That is true, when do you suggest we invade
Burma, China, Iran, Iraq, North Korea, Sudan
Vietnam, and Isreal. I list Isreal because
it only grants full rights to people with
25% Jewish heritage.
Oh, we've got them on the list. I understand that serious efforts
involving other concerned nations is going on with most of them,
including Israel.
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
Cthulhu for President! Why vote for a lesser evil?
.
|
|
|
| User: "Lawrence Seib" |
|
| Title: Re: "Atheist" is an "inhumanists" label. |
12 Apr 2004 08:50:56 AM |
|
|
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message news:<Xns94C6C245977B2fstone69@207.69.154.204>...
lseib@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu (Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404091407.57fd2b77@posting.google.com:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message
news:<Xns94C67387A1FFEfstone69@207.69.154.201>...
lseib@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu (Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404090642.1a5048ff@posting.google.com:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message
news:<Xns94C475C59C17Cfstone69@207.69.154.203>...
lseib@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu (Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404070626.51ffb4b6@posting.google.com:
bob young <alaspectrum@netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:<40650E26.D0E13483@netvigator.com>...
Family Man wrote:
"RoyBoy" <armageddon79@email.com> wrote in message
news:F6Q8c.8935$n37.1108948@read2.cgocable.net...
"Family Man" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
"Lawrence Hyde" <revolutionarian@earthlink.net> wrote in
message
Question: What is the 12,000 pound bombs referring to?
The pre-planned, pre-meditated illegal holy war against Iraq
that has taken the lives of 575 (latest figure) of our troops
and thousands of Iraqi civilians.
The christians decided to have a "Shock & Awe" party dropping
12,000 pound bombs across Iraq. I guess this was some kind of
tension relief for the right-wing extremists and corporations
that now own America.
Where does it end?
freedom for the people of Iraq?
We can impose freedom on people by waging
war against them, brilliant.
Nice slogan. Too bad we're not waging war
against the ones who will
accept freedom for everyone.
Since Iraq is composed of Shiite's, Sunni's
and Kurd's, who all hate each other,
it will be nearly impossible for a
democracy to exist there.
Since many of the leaders of each of those groups
*have* embraced the democratic process, there's a
good chance that it can be made to work.
What would you say the odds are, 50%, 25%, is that worth
the 500 American lives, plus the 500 billion dollars
that we and are children are going to have to
work to pay off.
How much is freedom worth to you? Why don't Iraqis deserve the same?
Its not worth my life. But I will support fighting and
paying for my freedom as well as my fellow Americans
freedom, but we are talking about Iraqi freedom, why must
we pay for theirs?
Because they need our help.
Yes they do and that is why pulling out at
an arbitrary date, Like Shrubs June 30 is
wrong. But where was freedom when Iraq was
gassing to death there own citizens, as
well as Iran. ***** Cheney and Shrub
Senior not only knew about it, but they
were suppling Saddam Hussein with weapons.
This proves the Iraqi war is not about
freeing people, Cheney did not care
then and he does not care now.
See http://www.ljworld.com/section/opinionlead/story/156811
If a democracy fails to happen, it will all have been for nothing.
If we never try, it definitely won't happen.
That is true, when do you suggest we invade
Burma, China, Iran, Iraq, North Korea, Sudan
Vietnam, and Isreal. I list Isreal because
it only grants full rights to people with
25% Jewish heritage.
Oh, we've got them on the list. I understand that serious efforts
involving other concerned nations is going on with most of them,
including Israel.
And this is exactly why we MUST vote Shrub out of office.
The project for a new millinium spelled out Cheneys
desire to keep two war fronts going contiously.
The man is pure evil, you can tell by just looking
at him.
Larry
.
|
|
|
| User: "Fred Stone" |
|
| Title: Re: "Atheist" is an "inhumanists" label. |
12 Apr 2004 09:05:14 AM |
|
|
(Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404120550.366f73e0@posting.google.com:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message
news:<Xns94C6C245977B2fstone69@207.69.154.204>...
(Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404091407.57fd2b77@posting.google.com:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message
news:<Xns94C67387A1FFEfstone69@207.69.154.201>...
(Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404090642.1a5048ff@posting.google.com:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message
news:<Xns94C475C59C17Cfstone69@207.69.154.203>...
(Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404070626.51ffb4b6@posting.google.com:
bob young <alaspectrum@netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:<40650E26.D0E13483@netvigator.com>...
Family Man wrote:
"RoyBoy" <armageddon79@email.com> wrote in message
news:F6Q8c.8935$n37.1108948@read2.cgocable.net...
"Family Man" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
"Lawrence Hyde" <revolutionarian@earthlink.net> wrote
in message
Question: What is the 12,000 pound bombs referring to?
The pre-planned, pre-meditated illegal holy war against
Iraq that has taken the lives of 575 (latest figure) of
our troops and thousands of Iraqi civilians.
The christians decided to have a "Shock & Awe" party
dropping 12,000 pound bombs across Iraq. I guess this was
some kind of tension relief for the right-wing extremists
and corporations that now own America.
Where does it end?
freedom for the people of Iraq?
We can impose freedom on people by waging
war against them, brilliant.
Nice slogan. Too bad we're not waging war
against the ones who will
accept freedom for everyone.
Since Iraq is composed of Shiite's, Sunni's
and Kurd's, who all hate each other,
it will be nearly impossible for a
democracy to exist there.
Since many of the leaders of each of those groups
*have* embraced the democratic process, there's a
good chance that it can be made to work.
What would you say the odds are, 50%, 25%, is that worth
the 500 American lives, plus the 500 billion dollars
that we and are children are going to have to
work to pay off.
How much is freedom worth to you? Why don't Iraqis deserve the
same?
Its not worth my life. But I will support fighting and
paying for my freedom as well as my fellow Americans
freedom, but we are talking about Iraqi freedom, why must
we pay for theirs?
Because they need our help.
Yes they do and that is why pulling out at
an arbitrary date, Like Shrubs June 30 is
wrong.
We're not pulling out on June 30.
But where was freedom when Iraq was
gassing to death there own citizens, as
well as Iran. ***** Cheney and Shrub
Senior not only knew about it, but they
were suppling Saddam Hussein with weapons.
Most of Saddam's weapons came from the Russians and the French. The US
was barely on the list.
This proves the Iraqi war is not about
freeing people, Cheney did not care
then and he does not care now.
See http://www.ljworld.com/section/opinionlead/story/156811
Editorials. Big deal.
If a democracy fails to happen, it will all have been for
nothing.
If we never try, it definitely won't happen.
That is true, when do you suggest we invade
Burma, China, Iran, Iraq, North Korea, Sudan
Vietnam, and Isreal. I list Isreal because
it only grants full rights to people with
25% Jewish heritage.
Oh, we've got them on the list. I understand that serious efforts
involving other concerned nations is going on with most of them,
including Israel.
And this is exactly why we MUST vote Shrub out of office.
The project for a new millinium spelled out Cheneys
desire to keep two war fronts going contiously.
The man is pure evil, you can tell by just looking
at him.
Yeah, that's a good reason, you can tell just by looking at him.
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
Cthulhu for President! Why vote for a lesser evil?
.
|
|
|
|
|
|
| User: "" |
|
| Title: Re: "Atheist" is an "inhumanists" label. |
09 Apr 2004 06:04:09 PM |
|
|
In talk.atheism Lawrence Seib <lseib@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu> wrote:
Its not worth my life. But I will support fighting and
paying for my freedom as well as my fellow Americans
freedom, but we are talking about Iraqi freedom, why must
we pay for theirs?
"But I will support fighting and paying for my freedom as well as my fellow
South Carolinians's freedom, but we are talking about California freedom,
why must we pay for theirs?"
"But I will support fighting and paying for my freedom as well as my fellow
Rock Hill, SC's freedom, but we are talking about Fort Mill, SC's freedom,
why must we pay for theirs?"
"But I will support fighting and paying for my freedom as well as my fellow
East Main Street's freedom, but we are talking about West Main Street's freedom,
why must we pay for theirs?"
"But I will support fighting and paying for my freedom as well as my fellow
members of my home's freedom, but we are talking about my neighbor's
household's freedom, why must we pay for theirs?"
Get the idea yet?
--
Mike atheism: a non-prophet organization...
Creation Science: an oxymoron actually created by morons...
-------------------------------
Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes. That way when you
do criticize them, you're a mile away, and you have their shoes.
-------------------------------
The multi-named one posting under rooster/bob white/sceptic and various other
names (identifiable by the header line reading "NNTP-Posting-Host: 12.231.81.82")
might as well ignore this post. He is a lying, illogical troll who has been
kill-file'd and any posts of his will not be seen or replied to.
.
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| User: "Lawrence Seib" |
|
| Title: Re: "Atheist" is an "inhumanists" label. |
12 Apr 2004 08:54:22 AM |
|
|
wrote in message news:<JZFdc.4166$Yw5.2803@bignews4.bellsouth.net>...
In talk.atheism Lawrence Seib <lseib@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu> wrote:
Its not worth my life. But I will support fighting and
paying for my freedom as well as my fellow Americans
freedom, but we are talking about Iraqi freedom, why must
we pay for theirs?
"But I will support fighting and paying for my freedom as well as my fellow
South Carolinians's freedom, but we are talking about California freedom,
why must we pay for theirs?"
"But I will support fighting and paying for my freedom as well as my fellow
Rock Hill, SC's freedom, but we are talking about Fort Mill, SC's freedom,
why must we pay for theirs?"
ETC.
Get the idea yet?
It is such an intelligent idea, that it
is the duty of the United States to defend the entire
worlds freedom, because we are the worlds police.
We cannot achieve or afford this idea.
Larry
.
|
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| User: "Fred Stone" |
|
| Title: Re: "Atheist" is an "inhumanists" label. |
12 Apr 2004 09:07:39 AM |
|
|
(Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404120554.3cda7ccf@posting.google.com:
prabbit1@shamrocksgf.com wrote in message
news:<JZFdc.4166$Yw5.2803@bignews4.bellsouth.net>...
In talk.atheism Lawrence Seib < > wrote:
Its not worth my life. But I will support fighting and
paying for my freedom as well as my fellow Americans
freedom, but we are talking about Iraqi freedom, why must
we pay for theirs?
"But I will support fighting and paying for my freedom as well as my
fellow South Carolinians's freedom, but we are talking about
California freedom, why must we pay for theirs?"
"But I will support fighting and paying for my freedom as well as my
fellow Rock Hill, SC's freedom, but we are talking about Fort Mill,
SC's freedom, why must we pay for theirs?"
ETC.
Get the idea yet?
It is such an intelligent idea, that it
is the duty of the United States to defend the entire
worlds freedom, because we are the worlds police.
We cannot achieve or afford this idea.
We can't afford not to uphold our idea of freedom and democracy.
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
Cthulhu for President! Why vote for a lesser evil?
.
|
|
|
| User: "Lawrence Seib" |
|
| Title: Re: "Atheist" is an "inhumanists" label. |
12 Apr 2004 04:44:59 PM |
|
|
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message news:<Xns94C967088AB2Bfstone69@207.69.154.201>...
lseib@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu (Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404120554.3cda7ccf@posting.google.com:
prabbit1@shamrocksgf.com wrote in message
news:<JZFdc.4166$Yw5.2803@bignews4.bellsouth.net>...
In talk.atheism Lawrence Seib <lseib@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu> wrote:
Its not worth my life. But I will support fighting and
paying for my freedom as well as my fellow Americans
freedom, but we are talking about Iraqi freedom, why must
we pay for theirs?
"But I will support fighting and paying for my freedom as well as my
fellow South Carolinians's freedom, but we are talking about
California freedom, why must we pay for theirs?"
"But I will support fighting and paying for my freedom as well as my
fellow Rock Hill, SC's freedom, but we are talking about Fort Mill,
SC's freedom, why must we pay for theirs?"
ETC.
Get the idea yet?
It is such an intelligent idea, that it
is the duty of the United States to defend the entire
worlds freedom, because we are the worlds police.
We cannot achieve or afford this idea.
We can't afford not to uphold our idea of freedom and democracy.
True, but upholding an ideal, and declaring war on every
country that does not meet our idea of having *freedom*
are two different things.
Compared to Germany or Switzerland, the United States
is a totalitarian nation. Here you have to be
21 to legaly drink alchol. *if you want federal high
money which you paid out*. Here you must
have a prescribtion to get medicine and many Good
pain killers are illegal, no matter how much you need
them.
Larry
.
|
|
|
| User: "Fred Stone" |
|
| Title: Re: "Atheist" is an "inhumanists" label. |
12 Apr 2004 05:16:27 PM |
|
|
(Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404121344.634c5177@posting.google.com:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message
news:<Xns94C967088AB2Bfstone69@207.69.154.201>...
(Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404120554.3cda7ccf@posting.google.com:
prabbit1@shamrocksgf.com wrote in message
news:<JZFdc.4166$Yw5.2803@bignews4.bellsouth.net>...
In talk.atheism Lawrence Seib < > wrote:
Its not worth my life. But I will support fighting and
paying for my freedom as well as my fellow Americans
freedom, but we are talking about Iraqi freedom, why must
we pay for theirs?
"But I will support fighting and paying for my freedom as well as
my fellow South Carolinians's freedom, but we are talking about
California freedom, why must we pay for theirs?"
"But I will support fighting and paying for my freedom as well as
my fellow Rock Hill, SC's freedom, but we are talking about Fort
Mill, SC's freedom, why must we pay for theirs?"
ETC.
Get the idea yet?
It is such an intelligent idea, that it
is the duty of the United States to defend the entire
worlds freedom, because we are the worlds police.
We cannot achieve or afford this idea.
We can't afford not to uphold our idea of freedom and democracy.
True, but upholding an ideal, and declaring war on every
country that does not meet our idea of having *freedom*
are two different things.
Since when have we declared war on every country that doesn't meet our
ideal?
Compared to Germany or Switzerland, the United States
is a totalitarian nation.
And compared to Germany, we have a low unemployment rate.
Here you have to be
21 to legaly drink alchol.
Hangover from Prohibition (pun intended).
*if you want federal high
money which you paid out*. Here you must
have a prescribtion to get medicine and many Good
pain killers are illegal, no matter how much you need
them.
That's because those "good" painkillers are addictive and/or have
dangerous side effects.
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
Cthulhu for President! Why vote for a lesser evil?
.
|
|
|
| User: "freethinker" |
|
| Title: Re: "Atheist" is an "inhumanists" label. |
13 Apr 2004 05:23:09 PM |
|
|
On Mon, 12 Apr 2004 22:16:27 GMT, Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com>
wrote:
lseib@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu (Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404121344.634c5177@posting.google.com:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message
news:<Xns94C967088AB2Bfstone69@207.69.154.201>...
lseib@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu (Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404120554.3cda7ccf@posting.google.com:
prabbit1@shamrocksgf.com wrote in message
news:<JZFdc.4166$Yw5.2803@bignews4.bellsouth.net>...
In talk.atheism Lawrence Seib <lseib@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu> wrote:
Its not worth my life. But I will support fighting and
paying for my freedom as well as my fellow Americans
freedom, but we are talking about Iraqi freedom, why must
we pay for theirs?
"But I will support fighting and paying for my freedom as well as
my fellow South Carolinians's freedom, but we are talking about
California freedom, why must we pay for theirs?"
"But I will support fighting and paying for my freedom as well as
my fellow Rock Hill, SC's freedom, but we are talking about Fort
Mill, SC's freedom, why must we pay for theirs?"
ETC.
Get the idea yet?
It is such an intelligent idea, that it
is the duty of the United States to defend the entire
worlds freedom, because we are the worlds police.
We cannot achieve or afford this idea.
We can't afford not to uphold our idea of freedom and democracy.
True, but upholding an ideal, and declaring war on every
country that does not meet our idea of having *freedom*
are two different things.
Since when have we declared war on every country that doesn't meet our
ideal?
Compared to Germany or Switzerland, the United States
is a totalitarian nation.
And compared to Germany, we have a low unemployment rate.
Here you have to be
21 to legaly drink alchol.
Hangover from Prohibition (pun intended).
*if you want federal high
money which you paid out*. Here you must
have a prescribtion to get medicine and many Good
pain killers are illegal, no matter how much you need
them.
That's because those "good" painkillers are addictive and/or have
dangerous side effects.
Like alcohol and tobacco?
.
|
|
|
| User: "Fred Stone" |
|
| Title: Re: "Atheist" is an "inhumanists" label. |
13 Apr 2004 05:37:14 PM |
|
|
(freethinker) wrote in news:407c6805.8191081
@news.airmail.net:
That's because those "good" painkillers are addictive and/or have
dangerous side effects.
Like alcohol and tobacco?
Yes, like those, but those have political constituencies that resist
regulations.
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
Cthulhu for President! Why vote for a lesser evil?
.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| User: "" |
|
| Title: Re: "Atheist" is an "inhumanists" label. |
12 Apr 2004 03:37:28 PM |
|
|
In talk.atheism Lawrence Seib <lseib@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu> wrote:
prabbit1@shamrocksgf.com wrote in message news:<JZFdc.4166$Yw5.2803@bignews4.bellsouth.net>...
In talk.atheism Lawrence Seib <lseib@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu> wrote:
Its not worth my life. But I will support fighting and
paying for my freedom as well as my fellow Americans
freedom, but we are talking about Iraqi freedom, why must
we pay for theirs?
"But I will support fighting and paying for my freedom as well as my fellow
South Carolinians's freedom, but we are talking about California freedom,
why must we pay for theirs?"
"But I will support fighting and paying for my freedom as well as my fellow
Rock Hill, SC's freedom, but we are talking about Fort Mill, SC's freedom,
why must we pay for theirs?"
ETC.
Get the idea yet?
It is such an intelligent idea, that it
is the duty of the United States to defend the entire
worlds freedom, because we are the worlds police.
We cannot achieve or afford this idea.
I didn't say it was always possible to do. But just saying "I will support
group X because I'm part of group X but won't support group Y because I'm
not part of group Y" is a *****-poor excuse because group X and group Y are
also both part of group Z and you're a part of group Z. Either you do
nothing but help yourself and say "the hell with EVERYONE else" or you (and
others) do what you can to help others in your group. The closer the group,
the more you'd be doing as an induvidual to help. But in the long run, we're
all part of group W (world) and the whole world should be helping it's
members. But I do agree that it shouldn't be just the USA as the world's
police, just like Kansas City, KS shouldn't be trying to police the whole
USA.
--
Mike
W hat atheism: a non-prophet organization...
W ould
J enna
D rink?
-------------------------------
Creation Science: an oxymoron actually created by morons...
-------------------------------
Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes. That way when you
do criticize them, you're a mile away, and you have their shoes.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Lawrence Seib" |
|
| Title: Re: "Atheist" is an "inhumanists" label. |
14 Apr 2004 03:27:32 PM |
|
|
wrote in message news:<c6Dec.16611$ux4.8874@bignews5.bellsouth.net>...
In talk.atheism Lawrence Seib <lseib@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu> wrote:
wrote in message news:<JZFdc.4166$Yw5.2803@bignews4.bellsouth.net>...
In talk.atheism Lawrence Seib <lseib@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu> wrote:
Its not worth my life. But I will support fighting and
paying for my freedom as well as my fellow Americans
freedom, but we are talking about Iraqi freedom, why must
we pay for theirs?
"But I will support fighting and paying for my freedom as well as my fellow
South Carolinians's freedom, but we are talking about California freedom,
why must we pay for theirs?"
"But I will support fighting and paying for my freedom as well as my fellow
Rock Hill, SC's freedom, but we are talking about Fort Mill, SC's freedom,
why must we pay for theirs?"
ETC.
Get the idea yet?
It is such an intelligent idea, that it
is the duty of the United States to defend the entire
worlds freedom, because we are the worlds police.
We cannot achieve or afford this idea.
I didn't say it was always possible to do. But just saying "I will support
group X because I'm part of group X but won't support group Y because I'm
not part of group Y" is a *****-poor excuse because group X and group Y are
also both part of group Z and you're a part of group Z. Either you do
nothing but help yourself and say "the hell with EVERYONE else" or you (and
others) do what you can to help others in your group. The closer the group,
the more you'd be doing as an induvidual to help. But in the long run, we're
all part of group W (world) and the whole world should be helping it's
members. But I do agree that it shouldn't be just the USA as the world's
police, just like Kansas City, KS shouldn't be trying to police the whole
USA.
I too support Freedom. But freedom is not something you can
force on people. Iraq is mostly a Muslum country, and their
ideas of freedom are different than ours.
I too like to think globaly, and this country
should act like a good global citizen and not
start wars without the support of the UN.
The UN did not support the war in Iraq
because it was not in the best interest
of the people of Iraq. Sure we freed
them from Saddam, but it is estimated that
over 10 thousand of them died during the
invasion, and countless more were wounded.
Saddam my have killed nearly as many to
secure his power, but that was over,
most of his killing was through. As
one Iraqi citizen put it, under Saddam,
they knew the rules. That to me
means that life was more valuable to
them than freedom, and that they were
safer under Saddam than now.
Larry
.
|
|
|
| User: "Fred Stone" |
|
| Title: Re: "Atheist" is an "inhumanists" label. |
14 Apr 2004 05:39:40 PM |
|
|
(Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404141227.19331947@posting.google.com:
prabbit1@shamrocksgf.com wrote in message
news:<c6Dec.16611$ux4.8874@bignews5.bellsouth.net>...
In talk.atheism Lawrence Seib < > wrote:
prabbit1@shamrocksgf.com wrote in message
news:<JZFdc.4166$Yw5.2803@bignews4.bellsouth.net>...
In talk.atheism Lawrence Seib < > wrote:
Its not worth my life. But I will support fighting and
paying for my freedom as well as my fellow Americans
freedom, but we are talking about Iraqi freedom, why must
we pay for theirs?
"But I will support fighting and paying for my freedom as well as
my fellow South Carolinians's freedom, but we are talking about
California freedom, why must we pay for theirs?"
"But I will support fighting and paying for my freedom as well as
my fellow Rock Hill, SC's freedom, but we are talking about Fort
Mill, SC's freedom, why must we pay for theirs?"
ETC.
Get the idea yet?
It is such an intelligent idea, that it
is the duty of the United States to defend the entire
worlds freedom, because we are the worlds police.
We cannot achieve or afford this idea.
I didn't say it was always possible to do. But just saying "I will
support group X because I'm part of group X but won't support group Y
because I'm not part of group Y" is a *****-poor excuse because group
X and group Y are also both part of group Z and you're a part of
group Z. Either you do nothing but help yourself and say "the hell
with EVERYONE else" or you (and others) do what you can to help
others in your group. The closer the group, the more you'd be doing
as an induvidual to help. But in the long run, we're all part of
group W (world) and the whole world should be helping it's members.
But I do agree that it shouldn't be just the USA as the world's
police, just like Kansas City, KS shouldn't be trying to police the
whole USA.
I too support Freedom. But freedom is not something you can
force on people. Iraq is mostly a Muslum country, and their
ideas of freedom are different than ours.
That's probably why we're working with them to set up their government.
I too like to think globaly, and this country
should act like a good global citizen and not
start wars without the support of the UN.
The UN did not support the war in Iraq
because it was not in the best interest
of the people of Iraq. Sure we freed
them from Saddam, but it is estimated that
over 10 thousand of them died during the
invasion, and countless more were wounded.
Saddam my have killed nearly as many to
secure his power, but that was over,
most of his killing was through.
You're only off by a factor of at least thirty.
As
one Iraqi citizen put it, under Saddam,
they knew the rules.
Yeah, keep your head down, let your sons be murdered and your daughters
raped or your whole family will be fed to the Dobermans.
That to me
means that life was more valuable to
them than freedom, and that they were
safer under Saddam than now.
And that's just insane.
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
Cthulhu for President! Why vote for a lesser evil?
.
|
|
|
| User: "Lawrence Seib" |
|
| Title: Re: "Atheist" is an "inhumanists" label. |
19 Apr 2004 12:27:30 PM |
|
|
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message news:<Xns94CBBDD60233fstone69@207.69.154.204>...
lseib@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu (Lawrence Seib) wrote in
to set up their government.
I too like to think globaly, and this country
should act like a good global citizen and not
start wars without the support of the UN.
The UN did not support the war in Iraq
because it was not in the best interest
of the people of Iraq. Sure we freed
them from Saddam, but it is estimated that
over 10 thousand of them died during the
invasion, and countless more were wounded.
Saddam my have killed nearly as many to
secure his power, but that was over,
most of his killing was through.
You're only off by a factor of at least thirty.
The Associated Press conducted a major investigation
of Iraq's wartime civilian casualties, documenting
the deaths of 3,240 civilians between March 20 and
April 20 (2003). That investigation, conducted in May and
June, surveyed about half of Iraq's hospitals, and
reported that the real number of civilian deaths
was sure to be MUCH HIGHER.
http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/12/12/sprj.irq.human.rights.ap/
Larry
.
|
|
|
| User: "Fred Stone" |
|
| Title: Re: "Atheist" is an "inhumanists" label. |
19 Apr 2004 12:39:05 PM |
|
|
(Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404190927.4f2e64ed@posting.google.com:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message
news:<Xns94CBBDD60233fstone69@207.69.154.204>...
(Lawrence Seib) wrote in
to set up their government.
I too like to think globaly, and this country
should act like a good global citizen and not
start wars without the support of the UN.
The UN did not support the war in Iraq
because it was not in the best interest
of the people of Iraq. Sure we freed
them from Saddam, but it is estimated that
over 10 thousand of them died during the
invasion, and countless more were wounded.
Saddam my have killed nearly as many to
secure his power, but that was over,
most of his killing was through.
You're only off by a factor of at least thirty.
The Associated Press conducted a major investigation
of Iraq's wartime civilian casualties, documenting
the deaths of 3,240 civilians between March 20 and
April 20 (2003). That investigation, conducted in May and
June, surveyed about half of Iraq's hospitals, and
reported that the real number of civilian deaths
was sure to be MUCH HIGHER.
http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/12/12/sprj.irq.human.rights.ap/
Saddam's mass graves contain over 400,000 and still counting.
http://www.cpa-iraq.org/pressreleases/20040224_mass_graves.html
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
Cthulhu for President! Why vote for a lesser evil?
.
|
|
|
| User: "Lawrence Seib" |
|
| Title: Re: "Atheist" is an "inhumanists" label. |
20 Apr 2004 08:55:52 AM |
|
|
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message news:<Xns94D08AE0FC4C9fstone69@207.69.154.206>...
lseib@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu (Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404190927.4f2e64ed@posting.google.com:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message
news:<Xns94CBBDD60233fstone69@207.69.154.204>...
lseib@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu (Lawrence Seib) wrote in
to set up their government.
I too like to think globaly, and this country
should act like a good global citizen and not
start wars without the support of the UN.
The UN did not support the war in Iraq
because it was not in the best interest
of the people of Iraq. Sure we freed
them from Saddam, but it is estimated that
over 10 thousand of them died during the
invasion, and countless more were wounded.
Saddam my have killed nearly as many to
secure his power, but that was over,
most of his killing was through.
You're only off by a factor of at least thirty.
The Associated Press conducted a major investigation
of Iraq's wartime civilian casualties, documenting
the deaths of 3,240 civilians between March 20 and
April 20 (2003). That investigation, conducted in May and
June, surveyed about half of Iraq's hospitals, and
reported that the real number of civilian deaths
was sure to be MUCH HIGHER.
http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/12/12/sprj.irq.human.rights.ap/
Saddam's mass graves contain over 400,000 and still counting.
http://www.cpa-iraq.org/pressreleases/20040224_mass_graves.html
I do not feel responsible for all the worlds
evil, but it was the United States that killed the 10,000
Iraqis in 2003, not Saddam, and all the US citizens
are responsible for this tragedy that everyone seems
to have forgotten.
When did Saddam kill the 400,000 people, was it going
on while ***** Cheney was visiting him before the
Kuwait invasion, and telling him that Gassing
Iranians to death was OK with the Govt. of the USA!
Were they killing civilians while the United States
of America was giving Saddam 100's of millions
of dollars in aid.
http://www.ljworld.com/section/opinionlead/story/156811
You know they were and the right wingers
did not care about Iraqis then, and they do not
care now, all they care about is to justify this tragic
and sensless war that diverts our attention from Al Queida.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Fred Stone" |
|
| Title: Re: "Atheist" is an "inhumanists" label. |
20 Apr 2004 09:23:33 AM |
|
|
(Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404200555.4400e0df@posting.google.com:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message
news:<Xns94D08AE0FC4C9fstone69@207.69.154.206>...
(Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404190927.4f2e64ed@posting.google.com:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message
news:<Xns94CBBDD60233fstone69@207.69.154.204>...
(Lawrence Seib) wrote in
to set up their government.
I too like to think globaly, and this country
should act like a good global citizen and not
start wars without the support of the UN.
The UN did not support the war in Iraq
because it was not in the best interest
of the people of Iraq. Sure we freed
them from Saddam, but it is estimated that
over 10 thousand of them died during the
invasion, and countless more were wounded.
Saddam my have killed nearly as many to
secure his power, but that was over,
most of his killing was through.
You're only off by a factor of at least thirty.
The Associated Press conducted a major investigation
of Iraq's wartime civilian casualties, documenting
the deaths of 3,240 civilians between March 20 and
April 20 (2003). That investigation, conducted in May and
June, surveyed about half of Iraq's hospitals, and
reported that the real number of civilian deaths
was sure to be MUCH HIGHER.
http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/12/12/sprj.irq.human.rights.ap/
Saddam's mass graves contain over 400,000 and still counting.
http://www.cpa-iraq.org/pressreleases/20040224_mass_graves.html
I do not feel responsible for all the worlds
evil, but it was the United States that killed the 10,000
Iraqis in 2003, not Saddam, and all the US citizens
are responsible for this tragedy that everyone seems
to have forgotten.
No, "everyone" hasn't forgotten. We regret that the killing was
necessary to eliminate a government that was an enemy and which
supported our enemies.
When did Saddam kill the 400,000 people, was it going
on while ***** Cheney was visiting him before the
Kuwait invasion, and telling him that Gassing
Iranians to death was OK with the Govt. of the USA!
Do you have the minutes of that meeting? Did Cheney really tell him that
or was he meeting with Saddam the way any Cabinet minister would meet
with any leader with whom we had diplomatic relations?
Were they killing civilians while the United States
of America was giving Saddam 100's of millions
of dollars in aid.
http://www.ljworld.com/section/opinionlead/story/156811
You know they were and the right wingers
did not care about Iraqis then, and they do not
care now, all they care about is to justify this tragic
and sensless war that diverts our attention from Al Queida.
Iraq wasn't a diversion. The justification only gets stronger as we
investigate where the money from "Oil for Food" went.
http://www.nationalreview.com/comment/rosett200404182336.asp
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
Cthulhu for President! Why vote for a lesser evil?
.
|
|
|
| User: "Lawrence Seib" |
|
| Title: Re: "Atheist" is an "inhumanists" label. |
21 Apr 2004 04:52:51 PM |
|
|
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message news:<Xns94D169B892541fstone69@207.69.154.206>...
lseib@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu (Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404200555.4400e0df@posting.google.com:
Saddam's mass graves contain over 400,000 and still counting.
http://www.cpa-iraq.org/pressreleases/20040224_mass_graves.html
I do not feel responsible for all the worlds
evil, but it was the United States that killed the 10,000
Iraqis in 2003, not Saddam, and all the US citizens
are responsible for this tragedy that everyone seems
to have forgotten.
No, "everyone" hasn't forgotten. We regret that the killing was
necessary to eliminate a government that was an enemy and which
supported our enemies.
I suppose you think it was justified because the
war was so successful at, at, well, maybe Iraq
can become some kind of democracy, maybe.
When did Saddam kill the 400,000 people, was it going
on while ***** Cheney was visiting him before the
Kuwait invasion, and telling him that Gassing
Iranians to death was OK with the Govt. of the USA!
Do you have the minutes of that meeting? Did Cheney really tell him that
or was he meeting with Saddam the way any Cabinet minister would meet
with any leader with whom we had diplomatic relations?
see for your self
http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB82/
This site has scanned copies of Rumsfelds
written report about his trip to Iraq as
well as other documentation which proves
that Reagan and Shrub senior did not give
a fig about what Saddam was doing, only
that he could be an ally
Larry
.
|
|
|
| User: "Fred Stone" |
|
| Title: Re: "Atheist" is an "inhumanists" label. |
21 Apr 2004 05:16:23 PM |
|
|
(Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404211352.35706fff@posting.google.com:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message
news:<Xns94D169B892541fstone69@207.69.154.206>...
(Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404200555.4400e0df@posting.google.com:
Saddam's mass graves contain over 400,000 and still counting.
http://www.cpa-iraq.org/pressreleases/20040224_mass_graves.html
I do not feel responsible for all the worlds
evil, but it was the United States that killed the 10,000
Iraqis in 2003, not Saddam, and all the US citizens
are responsible for this tragedy that everyone seems
to have forgotten.
No, "everyone" hasn't forgotten. We regret that the killing was
necessary to eliminate a government that was an enemy and which
supported our enemies.
I suppose you think it was justified because the
war was so successful at, at, well, maybe Iraq
can become some kind of democracy, maybe.
When did Saddam kill the 400,000 people, was it going
on while ***** Cheney was visiting him before the
Kuwait invasion, and telling him that Gassing
Iranians to death was OK with the Govt. of the USA!
Do you have the minutes of that meeting? Did Cheney really tell him
that or was he meeting with Saddam the way any Cabinet minister would
meet with any leader with whom we had diplomatic relations?
see for your self
http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB82/
This site has scanned copies of Rumsfelds
written report about his trip to Iraq as
well as other documentation which proves
that Reagan and Shrub senior did not give
a fig about what Saddam was doing, only
that he could be an ally
"...Rumsfeld made no reference to chemical weapons, according to
detailed notes on the meeting."
That was the meeting that goes with the picture.
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
Cthulhu for President! Why vote for a lesser evil?
.
|
|
|
| User: "Lawrence Seib" |
|
| Title: Re: "Atheist" is an "inhumanists" label. |
22 Apr 2004 04:38:48 PM |
|
|
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message news:<Xns94D2B9E68E255fstone69@207.69.154.202>...
lseib@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu (Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404211352.35706fff@posting.google.com:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message
news:<Xns94D169B892541fstone69@207.69.154.206>...
When did Saddam kill the 400,000 people, was it going
on while ***** Cheney was visiting him before the
Kuwait invasion, and telling him that Gassing
Iranians to death was OK with the Govt. of the USA!
Do you have the minutes of that meeting? Did Cheney really tell him
that or was he meeting with Saddam the way any Cabinet minister would
meet with any leader with whom we had diplomatic relations?
see for your self
http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB82/
This site has scanned copies of Rumsfelds
written report about his trip to Iraq as
well as other documentation which proves
that Reagan and Shrub senior did not give
a fig about what Saddam was doing, only
that he could be an ally
"Rumsfeld made no reference to chemical
weapons, according to
detailed notes on the meeting."
That was the meeting that goes with the picture.
I was not talking about the cute little
picture of Rumsfeld shaking Saddams hand.
The following documents, one to the
head of the State Department, prove that
the United States Government Knew that Saddam
was using chemical weapons,a WMD.
http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB82/iraq24.pdf
http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB82/iraq25.pdf
Instead of invading Iraq, Rumsfeld went
there to make allies out of them.
Time shift to 2003, suddenly WMD is reason for
invasion. Quite a change and it is BULL.
Larry
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| User: "Brian E. Clark" |
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| Title: Re: "Atheist" is an "inhumanists" label. |
21 Apr 2004 06:04:02 PM |
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Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
That's probably why we're working with them to set up their government.
Meaning, we're wiring up the strings and looking for the marionettes.
We're also making sure that "democracy" can have no real meaning in
Iraq, as we work to ensure that all major segments of the Iraqi economy
become privatized.
--
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Brian E. Clark
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| User: "Fred Stone" |
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| Title: Re: "Atheist" is an "inhumanists" label. |
21 Apr 2004 07:40:43 PM |
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Brian E. Clark <reply@newsgroup.only.please> wrote in
news:MPG.1af0c8142f4da30598a34e@netnews.comcast.net:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
That's probably why we're working with them to set up their government.
Meaning, we're wiring up the strings and looking for the marionettes.
Yawn.
We're also making sure that "democracy" can have no real meaning in
Iraq, as we work to ensure that all major segments of the Iraqi economy
become privatized.
You seem to be confusing "socialism" with "democracy".
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
Cthulhu for President! Why vote for a lesser evil?
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: "Atheist" is an "inhumanists" label. |
15 Apr 2004 02:22:03 PM |
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In talk.atheism Lawrence Seib <lseib@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu> wrote:
prabbit1@shamrocksgf.com wrote in message news:<c6Dec.16611$ux4.8874@bignews5.bellsouth.net>...
In talk.atheism Lawrence Seib <lseib@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu> wrote:
prabbit1@shamrocksgf.com wrote in message news:<JZFdc.4166$Yw5.2803@bignews4.bellsouth.net>...
In talk.atheism Lawrence Seib <lseib@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu> wrote:
Its not worth my life. But I will support fighting and
paying for my freedom as well as my fellow Americans
freedom, but we are talking about Iraqi freedom, why must
we pay for theirs?
"But I will support fighting and paying for my freedom as well as my fellow
South Carolinians's freedom, but we are talking about California freedom,
why must we pay for theirs?"
"But I will support fighting and paying for my freedom as well as my fellow
Rock Hill, SC's freedom, but we are talking about Fort Mill, SC's freedom,
why must we pay for theirs?"
ETC.
Get the idea yet?
It is such an intelligent idea, that it
is the duty of the United States to defend the entire
worlds freedom, because we are the worlds police.
We cannot achieve or afford this idea.
I didn't say it was always possible to do. But just saying "I will support
group X because I'm part of group X but won't support group Y because I'm
not part of group Y" is a *****-poor excuse because group X and group Y are
also both part of group Z and you're a part of group Z. Either you do
nothing but help yourself and say "the hell with EVERYONE else" or you (and
others) do what you can to help others in your group. The closer the group,
the more you'd be doing as an induvidual to help. But in the long run, we're
all part of group W (world) and the whole world should be helping it's
members. But I do agree that it shouldn't be just the USA as the world's
police, just like Kansas City, KS shouldn't be trying to police the whole
USA.
I too support Freedom. But freedom is not something you can
force on people. Iraq is mostly a Muslum country, and their
ideas of freedom are different than ours.
I too like to think globaly, and this country
should act like a good global citizen and not
start wars without the support of the UN.
The UN did not support the war in Iraq
because it was not in the best interest
of the people of Iraq. Sure we freed
them from Saddam, but it is estimated that
over 10 thousand of them died during the
invasion, and countless more were wounded.
Saddam my have killed nearly as many to
secure his power, but that was over,
most of his killing was through. As
one Iraqi citizen put it, under Saddam,
they knew the rules. That to me
means that life was more valuable to
them than freedom, and that they were
safer under Saddam than now.
Yes, I agree that we should have had support. I also think it should have
been ALL countries helping out. IMHO, the way we did it was no different
than if my local police force had come to your town and tried to clean out
the crime. Even if your police department was so corrupt or just so
ineffectual that it couldn't or wouldn't clean up the crime, it should fall
upon the state or federal police department(s) to step in and not another
government at the same level as yours (much like I wouldn't try to boss
around a co-worker at the same level as myself.) In the case of Iraq, it
should have been the world 'police' (i.e. the UN) stepping in. But, just
like we pay taxes to support the FBI and they might even have some local
cops coming to help if needed, we should also support the UN with money and
manpower as needed.
Now, if things had been a bit different and the other party had ASKED us to
step in, it'd be a different matter. OR...if they were in such a state that
it was impossible for them to ask (example, your town's whole police
department was taken hostage and was help incommunicado. yeah, I know, it's
a far-fetched scenerio :) In the case of the Iraqi's, there's no showing
that the main population wanted our help. And even when they DO indicate
they want it, it should go through channels if at all possible.
/soapbox
--
Mike
W hat atheism: a non-prophet organization...
W ould
J enna
D rink?
-------------------------------
Creation Science: an oxymoron actually created by morons...
-------------------------------
Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes. That way when you
do criticize them, you're a mile away, and you have their shoes.
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| User: "freethinker" |
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| Title: Re: "Atheist" is an "inhumanists" label. |
10 Apr 2004 10:38:26 AM |
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On 9 Apr 2004 07:42:26 -0700, (Lawrence Seib)
wrote:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message news:<Xns94C475C59C17Cfstone69@207.69.154.203>...
(Lawrence Seib) wrote in
news:75ab6396.0404070626.51ffb4b6@posting.google.com:
bob young <alaspectrum@netvigator.com> wrote in message
news:<40650E26.D0E13483@netvigator.com>...
Family Man wrote:
"RoyBoy" <armageddon79@email.com> wrote in message
news:F6Q8c.8935$n37.1108948@read2.cgocable.net...
"Family Man" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
"Lawrence Hyde" <revolutionarian@earthlink.net> wrote in
message
Question: What is the 12,000 pound bombs referring to?
The pre-planned, pre-meditated illegal holy war against Iraq that
has taken the lives of 575 (latest figure) of our troops and
thousands of Iraqi civilians.
The christians decided to have a "Shock & Awe" party dropping
12,000 pound bombs across Iraq. I guess this was some kind of
tension relief for the right-wing extremists and corporations that
now own America.
Where does it end?
freedom for the people of Iraq?
We can impose freedom on people by waging
war against them, brilliant.
Nice slogan. Too bad we're not waging war
against the ones who will
accept freedom for everyone.
Since Iraq is composed of Shiite's, Sunni's
and Kurd's, who all hate each other,
it will be nearly impossible for a
democracy to exist there.
Since many of the leaders of each of those groups
*have* embraced the democratic process, there's a
good chance that it can be made to work.
What would you say the odds are, 50%, 25%, is that worth
the 500 American lives, plus the 500 billion dollars
that we and are children are going to have to
work to pay off. If a democracy fails to happen,
it will all have been for nothing.
Larry
And if a democracy is established, the majority will install a Islam
rule over the country. And the Imams will fight to control the
majority. Back to square one.
Until religion is in it`s proper place, as a creed to live by, but
not to be enforced. There will be no peace, a truce yes, but not real
peace. A secular government, that keeps religious fanatics from
forcing their beliefs on others, can enforce the truce.
Man truly embracing God and living a life as a godly man, will bring
lasting peace. Bigots using religion to force other to hate as they
hate, will only bring strife.
Bottom line; the American Government, and it`s Allies, are pissing
into the wind.
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