| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"Bear" |
| Date: |
09 Oct 2005 08:47:46 PM |
| Object: |
Re: Influence of Buddhism on the Christians - Q? |
"Close, striking parallels exist between early Buddhist texts and what Bible
scholars postulate as the 'Q' material - ('Q' is shorthand for Quelle, the
German for 'source'). The earliest translations of Buddhist texts into Greek
date back to the time of king Asoka (3rd century BC).
"It seems highly probable that the core of the body of Q material was made
up of aphorisms, sayings originally ascribed to the Buddha but later
attributed to Jesus. To these sayings were added mini-stories and
micro-scenes to produce what became the Gospels of Matthew and Luke."
(Kenneth Humphreys; Sourcing the Legend - The Syncretic Heritage of
Christianity)
--
Bear
"Do good, for good is good to do; Spurn bribe of heaven and threat of hell."
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| User: "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]" |
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| Title: Re: Influence of Buddhism on the Christians - Q? |
22 Oct 2005 12:42:45 AM |
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PMDavis wrote:
On 20 Oct 2005 20:14:10 -0700, "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]"
<hasatan@grex.cyberspace.org> wrote:
Martin Edwards wrote:
cantcy wrote:
Martin Edwards wrote:
rick++ wrote:
There is long tradition in the Church some of the first missions
were to India (St. Thomas). But I've seen little archeaological
evidence of this.
The Mar Thoma Church, which was already there when Roman Catholics
"discovered" India, has its liturgy in Syriac.
I heard that there were Christian sabbath-keepers in some part of China.
Possibly the descendants of Nestorians.
Probably one is referring to the `tai ping tian guo` a.k.a. Taiping
Rebellion.
a 19th century phenomenon introduced by Westerners.
Actually there were inscriptions indicating a small community of Jews
or Christians were living in, I believe, Shanghai. It died out (was
absorbed by the local population) sometime before the Jesuits arrived
in the 16th/17th century. The Christian imperative to evangelize all
the "uttermost parts of the earth" dates from the 1st century. It was
the last command that Jesus left us with.
the self-replicating disease in action yes
but i doubt the Yeshua character intended for any conversation with
non-Jews.
The religion to which you refer viz. Christianity is the invention of
RaPa.
Unrelated to some of the more egregious things that westerners later
left them with.
Circa the time the Khazarian kingdom converted to Judaism a group of
Turks arrived in central china and settled in what is now called
"Kaifeng." according to the northern dialect.
those are not Han Chinese. so they're not really Chinese by "race" or
by culture. until the 19th century that is.
Call them Chinese if you want to, if they packed their bags and went to
North America you could call them Americans too.
.
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| User: "PMDavis" |
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| Title: Re: Influence of Buddhism on the Christians - Q? |
22 Oct 2005 11:28:52 PM |
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On 21 Oct 2005 22:42:45 -0700, "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]"
<hasatan@grex.cyberspace.org> wrote:
PMDavis wrote:
On 20 Oct 2005 20:14:10 -0700, "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]"
<hasatan@grex.cyberspace.org> wrote:
Martin Edwards wrote:
cantcy wrote:
Martin Edwards wrote:
rick++ wrote:
There is long tradition in the Church some of the first missions
were to India (St. Thomas). But I've seen little archeaological
evidence of this.
The Mar Thoma Church, which was already there when Roman Catholics
"discovered" India, has its liturgy in Syriac.
I heard that there were Christian sabbath-keepers in some part of China.
Possibly the descendants of Nestorians.
Probably one is referring to the `tai ping tian guo` a.k.a. Taiping
Rebellion.
a 19th century phenomenon introduced by Westerners.
Actually there were inscriptions indicating a small community of Jews
or Christians were living in, I believe, Shanghai. It died out (was
absorbed by the local population) sometime before the Jesuits arrived
in the 16th/17th century. The Christian imperative to evangelize all
the "uttermost parts of the earth" dates from the 1st century. It was
the last command that Jesus left us with.
the self-replicating disease in action yes
but i doubt the Yeshua character intended for any conversation with
non-Jews.
The religion to which you refer viz. Christianity is the invention of
RaPa.
I am unaware of any reference to "RaPa". Whom would that be?
I agree that I doubt that Yeshua would have foreseen that for his
teachings and a religious cult based upon him would be adopted by the
non-Jews. It would seem from close study that His ministry was to the
children of Israel exclusively. It was not until He was rejected by
his own that God decided that the "chosen" people had become "frozen"
people and that it was necessary to carry out his work on earth
through other peoples having more willing hearts.
Unrelated to some of the more egregious things that westerners later
left them with.
Circa the time the Khazarian kingdom converted to Judaism a group of
Turks arrived in central china and settled in what is now called
"Kaifeng." according to the northern dialect.
those are not Han Chinese. so they're not really Chinese by "race" or
by culture. until the 19th century that is.
Call them Chinese if you want to, if they packed their bags and went to
North America you could call them Americans too.
Correct. Though I would expect that in China, as in America (and
europe for that matter), people living in proximity tend to
interbreed, sometimes in spite of social or religious distinctives. I
do indeed accept persons who have lately arrived in America as
"Americans", at least in one sense of the word. Though, of course,
only persons whose ancestoral lines first arrived prior to the
Revolutionary War are "real Americans".
.
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| User: "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]" |
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| Title: Re: Influence of Buddhism on the Christians - Q? |
23 Oct 2005 04:10:11 AM |
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PMDavis wrote:
On 21 Oct 2005 22:42:45 -0700, "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]"
<hasatan@grex.cyberspace.org> wrote:
PMDavis wrote:
On 20 Oct 2005 20:14:10 -0700, "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]"
<hasatan@grex.cyberspace.org> wrote:
Martin Edwards wrote:
cantcy wrote:
Martin Edwards wrote:
rick++ wrote:
There is long tradition in the Church some of the first missions
were to India (St. Thomas). But I've seen little archeaological
evidence of this.
The Mar Thoma Church, which was already there when Roman Catholics
"discovered" India, has its liturgy in Syriac.
I heard that there were Christian sabbath-keepers in some part of China.
Possibly the descendants of Nestorians.
Probably one is referring to the `tai ping tian guo` a.k.a. Taiping
Rebellion.
a 19th century phenomenon introduced by Westerners.
Actually there were inscriptions indicating a small community of Jews
or Christians were living in, I believe, Shanghai. It died out (was
absorbed by the local population) sometime before the Jesuits arrived
in the 16th/17th century. The Christian imperative to evangelize all
the "uttermost parts of the earth" dates from the 1st century. It was
the last command that Jesus left us with.
the self-replicating disease in action yes
but i doubt the Yeshua character intended for any conversation with
non-Jews.
The religion to which you refer viz. Christianity is the invention of
RaPa.
I am unaware of any reference to "RaPa". Whom would that be?
I agree that I doubt that Yeshua would have foreseen that for his
teachings and a religious cult based upon him would be adopted by the
non-Jews. It would seem from close study that His ministry was to the
children of Israel exclusively.
i would hardly say "ministry" he probably was a former Qumran ascetic
similar to his cousin Yochanan but abandons such and assumes a more
nationalist tone. Naturally with his background he has tremendous
concern for the poor and is at variance with the perushim. he is up
against what Judaism will call "baseless hatred."
It was not until He was rejected by
his own that God decided that the "chosen" people had become "frozen"
people and that it was necessary to carry out his work on earth
through other peoples having more willing hearts.
here i would have to say you have not looked at the different authors
of the diverse anthology called the "New Testament" whose different
Jesus characters represent irreconcilable religions and cosmologies and
theologies.
Unrelated to some of the more egregious things that westerners later
left them with.
Circa the time the Khazarian kingdom converted to Judaism a group of
Turks arrived in central china and settled in what is now called
"Kaifeng." according to the northern dialect.
those are not Han Chinese. so they're not really Chinese by "race" or
by culture. until the 19th century that is.
Call them Chinese if you want to, if they packed their bags and went to
North America you could call them Americans too.
Correct. Though I would expect that in China, as in America (and
europe for that matter), people living in proximity tend to
interbreed, sometimes in spite of social or religious distinctives. I
do indeed accept persons who have lately arrived in America as
"Americans", at least in one sense of the word. Though, of course,
only persons whose ancestoral lines first arrived prior to the
Revolutionary War are "real Americans".
You really make a good point there.
i would have to agree.
.
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| User: "PMDavis" |
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| Title: Re: Influence of Buddhism on the Christians - Q? |
23 Oct 2005 03:50:08 PM |
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On 23 Oct 2005 02:10:11 -0700, "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]"
<hasatan@grex.cyberspace.org> wrote:
PMDavis wrote:
On 21 Oct 2005 22:42:45 -0700, "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]"
<hasatan@grex.cyberspace.org> wrote:
PMDavis wrote:
On 20 Oct 2005 20:14:10 -0700, "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]"
<hasatan@grex.cyberspace.org> wrote:
Martin Edwards wrote:
cantcy wrote:
Martin Edwards wrote:
rick++ wrote:
There is long tradition in the Church some of the first missions
were to India (St. Thomas). But I've seen little archeaological
evidence of this.
The Mar Thoma Church, which was already there when Roman Catholics
"discovered" India, has its liturgy in Syriac.
I heard that there were Christian sabbath-keepers in some part of China.
Possibly the descendants of Nestorians.
Probably one is referring to the `tai ping tian guo` a.k.a. Taiping
Rebellion.
a 19th century phenomenon introduced by Westerners.
Actually there were inscriptions indicating a small community of Jews
or Christians were living in, I believe, Shanghai. It died out (was
absorbed by the local population) sometime before the Jesuits arrived
in the 16th/17th century. The Christian imperative to evangelize all
the "uttermost parts of the earth" dates from the 1st century. It was
the last command that Jesus left us with.
the self-replicating disease in action yes
but i doubt the Yeshua character intended for any conversation with
non-Jews.
The religion to which you refer viz. Christianity is the invention of
RaPa.
I am unaware of any reference to "RaPa". Whom would that be?
I agree that I doubt that Yeshua would have foreseen that for his
teachings and a religious cult based upon him would be adopted by the
non-Jews. It would seem from close study that His ministry was to the
children of Israel exclusively.
i would hardly say "ministry" he probably was a former Qumran ascetic
similar to his cousin Yochanan but abandons such and assumes a more
nationalist tone. Naturally with his background he has tremendous
concern for the poor and is at variance with the perushim. he is up
against what Judaism will call "baseless hatred."
I'll grant that there seem to be parallels between what little we know
of the Qumran ascetics and his cousin John. Perhaps he was one to
"abandon" the Qumran practice (or present a variation of it for the
masses). I'm personally dubious that Jesus was himself directly
involved at Qumran, but I allow that I could be wrong. Seems to be
primarily an argument with little evidence.
However, the Gospel record relates that Joseph took his family to
Egypt. Perhaps Jesus studed for a time at the Jewish community at
Alexandria? That would account for the transition from carpenter's
son to a teacher. He would have enough close relatives sympathetic to
Qumran to incorporate those ideas into his teaching, and could likely
have been exposed to Budhist teachings from India.
It was not until He was rejected by
his own that God decided that the "chosen" people had become "frozen"
people and that it was necessary to carry out his work on earth
through other peoples having more willing hearts.
here i would have to say you have not looked at the different authors
of the diverse anthology called the "New Testament" whose different
Jesus characters represent irreconcilable religions and cosmologies and
theologies.
Funny how I missed the "differant" Jesus characters and reconciled the
irreconcilable into being the traits of one complex individual. I
never considered Jesus (or Paul for that matter) to be "theologians"
in the mold of formal and logical thinkers. I see both more as
Charasmatic leaders who spoke from the heart about the matter that was
immediately presented before them, and left formal analysis of their
thinking for others persons to figure out for themself.
Unrelated to some of the more egregious things that westerners later
left them with.
Circa the time the Khazarian kingdom converted to Judaism a group of
Turks arrived in central china and settled in what is now called
"Kaifeng." according to the northern dialect.
those are not Han Chinese. so they're not really Chinese by "race" or
by culture. until the 19th century that is.
Call them Chinese if you want to, if they packed their bags and went to
North America you could call them Americans too.
Correct. Though I would expect that in China, as in America (and
europe for that matter), people living in proximity tend to
interbreed, sometimes in spite of social or religious distinctives. I
do indeed accept persons who have lately arrived in America as
"Americans", at least in one sense of the word. Though, of course,
only persons whose ancestoral lines first arrived prior to the
Revolutionary War are "real Americans".
You really make a good point there.
i would have to agree.
.
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| User: "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]" |
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| Title: Re: Influence of Buddhism on the Christians - Q? |
23 Oct 2005 10:55:50 PM |
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PMDavis wrote:
On 23 Oct 2005 02:10:11 -0700, "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]"
<hasatan@grex.cyberspace.org> wrote:
PMDavis wrote:
On 21 Oct 2005 22:42:45 -0700, "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]"
<hasatan@grex.cyberspace.org> wrote:
PMDavis wrote:
On 20 Oct 2005 20:14:10 -0700, "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]"
<hasatan@grex.cyberspace.org> wrote:
Martin Edwards wrote:
cantcy wrote:
Martin Edwards wrote:
rick++ wrote:
There is long tradition in the Church some of the first missions
were to India (St. Thomas). But I've seen little archeaological
evidence of this.
The Mar Thoma Church, which was already there when Roman Catholics
"discovered" India, has its liturgy in Syriac.
I heard that there were Christian sabbath-keepers in some part of China.
Possibly the descendants of Nestorians.
Probably one is referring to the `tai ping tian guo` a.k.a. Taiping
Rebellion.
a 19th century phenomenon introduced by Westerners.
Actually there were inscriptions indicating a small community of Jews
or Christians were living in, I believe, Shanghai. It died out (was
absorbed by the local population) sometime before the Jesuits arrived
in the 16th/17th century. The Christian imperative to evangelize all
the "uttermost parts of the earth" dates from the 1st century. It was
the last command that Jesus left us with.
the self-replicating disease in action yes
but i doubt the Yeshua character intended for any conversation with
non-Jews.
The religion to which you refer viz. Christianity is the invention of
RaPa.
I am unaware of any reference to "RaPa". Whom would that be?
I agree that I doubt that Yeshua would have foreseen that for his
teachings and a religious cult based upon him would be adopted by the
non-Jews. It would seem from close study that His ministry was to the
children of Israel exclusively.
i would hardly say "ministry" he probably was a former Qumran ascetic
similar to his cousin Yochanan but abandons such and assumes a more
nationalist tone. Naturally with his background he has tremendous
concern for the poor and is at variance with the perushim. he is up
against what Judaism will call "baseless hatred."
I'll grant that there seem to be parallels between what little we know
of the Qumran ascetics and his cousin John. Perhaps he was one to
"abandon" the Qumran practice (or present a variation of it for the
masses). I'm personally dubious that Jesus was himself directly
involved at Qumran, but I allow that I could be wrong. Seems to be
primarily an argument with little evidence.
his cousin seems to have been, the possibility is there and is more
likely than the AWOL in Afghanistan hypothesis. But as pointed out
there are criticisms he makes of the perushim that would not have
applied until circa 200 CE. so one option is that a redactor
exaggerated and edited his views on the mainstream sects.
the Gospel record relates that Joseph took his family to
Egypt. Perhaps Jesus studed for a time at the Jewish community at
Alexandria? That would account for the transition from carpenter's
son to a teacher. He would have enough close relatives sympathetic to
Qumran to incorporate those ideas into his teaching, and could likely
have been exposed to Budhist teachings from India.
Whatever traces of Indian proverbs or philosophy you see there would
have come from the TaNaKh.
The Jesus character of the torah observant authors is not a syncretist
or mystic.
The Jesus character of Ioannes is the eternally existent LOGOS THEOS
and that is Alexandria material without a doubt.
The Jesus character of RaPa is a universal vicarious sacrifice and
abolishes torah.
It was not until He was rejected by
his own that God decided that the "chosen" people had become "frozen"
people and that it was necessary to carry out his work on earth
through other peoples having more willing hearts.
here i would have to say you have not looked at the different authors
of the diverse anthology called the "New Testament" whose different
Jesus characters represent irreconcilable religions and cosmologies and
theologies.
Funny how I missed the "differant" Jesus characters and reconciled the
irreconcilable into being the traits of one complex individual. I
never considered Jesus (or Paul for that matter) to be "theologians"
in the mold of formal and logical thinkers. I see both more as
Charasmatic leaders who spoke from the heart about the matter that was
immediately presented before them, and left formal analysis of their
thinking for others persons to figure out for themself.
the essence of the character Yeshua / Jesus.
he is a torah observant Yehudi trying to reform what he sees as
"baseless hatred" and neglect of the poor.
he is possibly also the leader of a militant nationalist group and is
executed by the Romans for insurrection, not for religious views.
Look at the NT authors -
1. Jews circa Government of Pontius Pilate:
Mattityahu
Mark
2. Jews circa post - government of Pilate:
Group A: banned from temple
Rav Shaul a.k.a Paulos or RaPa
Group B: torah observant Jews worshiping in temple
Yaqov - James
Yehuda - Jude
Shimon Kefas - Simon Peter
3. Jews circa post - Roman War and destruction of Jerusalem:
Ioannes - John
Luke? we must consider him an extension of the Rav Paulos writings as
the Gentiles justify their position.
There are the authorship groupings and their basic perspectives and
historical circumstances.
What is the mystery here?
The Jews with the exception of the student of Philo (John) and Rav
Paulos are writing in Aramaic or Hebrew to torah observant Yehudim.
Unrelated to some of the more egregious things that westerners later
left them with.
Circa the time the Khazarian kingdom converted to Judaism a group of
Turks arrived in central china and settled in what is now called
"Kaifeng." according to the northern dialect.
those are not Han Chinese. so they're not really Chinese by "race" or
by culture. until the 19th century that is.
Call them Chinese if you want to, if they packed their bags and went to
North America you could call them Americans too.
Correct. Though I would expect that in China, as in America (and
europe for that matter), people living in proximity tend to
interbreed, sometimes in spite of social or religious distinctives. I
do indeed accept persons who have lately arrived in America as
"Americans", at least in one sense of the word. Though, of course,
only persons whose ancestoral lines first arrived prior to the
Revolutionary War are "real Americans".
You really make a good point there.
i would have to agree.
.
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| User: "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]" |
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| Title: Re: Influence of Buddhism on the Christians - Q? |
20 Oct 2005 10:15:51 PM |
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Martin Edwards wrote:
rick++ wrote:
There is long tradition in the Church some of the first missions
were to India (St. Thomas). But I've seen little archeaological
evidence of this.
The Mar Thoma Church, which was already there when Roman Catholics
"discovered" India, has its liturgy in Syriac. The faithful now Speak
the local languages, but still call themselves Syrian Christians.
Coming soon: Steven Spielbergs' greatest production ever --
AWOL IN AFGHANISTAN
"The story of a young Jew's search for Jesus -- Himself."
.
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| User: "Martin Edwards" |
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| Title: Re: Influence of Buddhism on the Christians - Q? |
21 Oct 2005 11:23:22 AM |
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Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Martin Edwards wrote:
rick++ wrote:
There is long tradition in the Church some of the first missions
were to India (St. Thomas). But I've seen little archeaological
evidence of this.
The Mar Thoma Church, which was already there when Roman Catholics
"discovered" India, has its liturgy in Syriac. The faithful now Speak
the local languages, but still call themselves Syrian Christians.
Coming soon: Steven Spielbergs' greatest production ever --
AWOL IN AFGHANISTAN
"The story of a young Jew's search for Jesus -- Himself."
Not a bad gag in itself, but irrelevant. The church is South Indian and
does not claim to be founded by Jesus, but St Thomas. The hazy picture
most Americans have of the outside world seems to be in play here.
--
You can't fool me: there ain't no Sanity Clause - Chico Marx
www.geocities.com/Athens/Agora/1955
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| User: "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]" |
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| Title: Re: Influence of Buddhism on the Christians - Q? |
17 Oct 2005 09:13:59 AM |
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rick++ wrote:
There is long tradition in the Church some of the first missions
were to India (St. Thomas). But I've seen little archeaological
evidence of this.
if you have opportunity to compare the sections of TaNaKh with greatest
similarity to Indian proverbs and philosophy there is where you will
find such influence since Yeshua is a torah observant Yehudi.
he did not go to school in Afghanistan as is proposed by some.
if one looks at Nag Hammadi codices many sections can be said to be
similar to Indian but one wonders whether this is merely wishful
thinking since mysticism [not speaking of the TaNaKh sections
referenced above] is seeking the answers to many of the same questions
across cultures and no wonder some of the answers seem to sound the
same. but just as Leibniz and Newton were not working in the same
study these things can be and are often independent.
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| User: "Bear" |
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| Title: Re: Influence of Buddhism on the Christians - Q? |
17 Oct 2005 06:02:51 PM |
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"Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]" wrote
: rick++ wrote:
: > There is long tradition in the Church some of the first missions
: > were to India (St. Thomas). But I've seen little archeaological
: > evidence of this.
:
: if you have opportunity to compare the sections of TaNaKh with greatest
: similarity to Indian proverbs and philosophy there is where you will
: find such influence since Yeshua is a torah observant Yehudi.
Therein lies evidence of influence other than Egyptian.
--
Bear
"Many are those who trade in tricks and simulated miracles, duping the
foolish multitude; and if nobody unmasked their subterfuges, they would
impose them on everyone." - Leonardo da Vinci (Manuscript F, Institut de
France, 5v)
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| User: "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]" |
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| Title: Re: Influence of Buddhism on the Christians - Q? |
18 Oct 2005 03:25:03 AM |
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Bear wrote:
"Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]" wrote
: rick++ wrote:
: > There is long tradition in the Church some of the first missions
: > were to India (St. Thomas). But I've seen little archeaological
: > evidence of this.
:
: if you have opportunity to compare the sections of TaNaKh with greatest
: similarity to Indian proverbs and philosophy there is where you will
: find such influence since Yeshua is a torah observant Yehudi.
Therein lies evidence of influence other than Egyptian.
yes i have said so many times but this has nothing to do with a
Hollywood film in technicolor of Jesus the Yeshiva student gone AWOL in
Afghanistan.
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| User: "Bear" |
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| Title: Re: Influence of Buddhism on the Christians - Q? |
18 Oct 2005 03:52:19 AM |
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"Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]" wrote
: Bear wrote:
: > "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]" wrote
: > : rick++ wrote:
: > : > There is long tradition in the Church some of the first missions
: > : > were to India (St. Thomas). But I've seen little archeaological
: > : > evidence of this.
: > :
: > : if you have opportunity to compare the sections of TaNaKh with
greatest
: > : similarity to Indian proverbs and philosophy there is where you will
: > : find such influence since Yeshua is a torah observant Yehudi.
: >
: > Therein lies evidence of influence other than Egyptian.
: yes i have said so many times
But you still argue that Judaism could not have been originated by the
Persians. I think there was much more back and forth influence between all
the people of the Middle East than you care to admit.
--
Bear
"Many are those who trade in tricks and simulated miracles, duping the
foolish multitude; and if nobody unmasked their subterfuges, they would
impose them on everyone." - Leonardo da Vinci (Manuscript F, Institut de
France, 5v)
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| User: "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]" |
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| Title: Re: Influence of Buddhism on the Christians - Q? |
18 Oct 2005 05:30:53 AM |
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Bear wrote:
"Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]" wrote
: Bear wrote:
: > "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]" wrote
: > : rick++ wrote:
: > : > There is long tradition in the Church some of the first missions
: > : > were to India (St. Thomas). But I've seen little archeaological
: > : > evidence of this.
: > :
: > : if you have opportunity to compare the sections of TaNaKh with
greatest
: > : similarity to Indian proverbs and philosophy there is where you will
: > : find such influence since Yeshua is a torah observant Yehudi.
: >
: > Therein lies evidence of influence other than Egyptian.
: yes i have said so many times
But you still argue that Judaism could not have been originated by the
Persians.
i never made such assertion as i recall ; what i believe i said is
Magee's hypothesis about Persians constructing Jewish or Judaic culture
doesn't have much of a foundation.
i have asked many times can someone show something like a rough draft
of a section of the TaNaKh between the Persian stage as alleged and the
Greek stage ? in order to see the changes ?
since Alexandria had a large Jewish population and later on there was
even a temple at Elephantine ? i think if such transitional works
existed they should have been captured in the Qumran site ?
but no what we see is 900 CE text and 150 BCE texts are virtually the
same.
I think there was much more back and forth influence between all
the people of the Middle East than you care to admit.
That is very ridiculous speculation about what i think or feel on the
subject.
regardless, Alexander tried to spread Greek culture throughout the area
with mass marriages et cetera but this hardly achieved a universal
ecumenical religion.
where there is syncretism we see such writers as Philo of Alexandria
but in opposition to hellenism we have the torah observant Judaic
culture, which does not yield to the Classical Culture and in the
syncretist Christian form eventually destroys it.
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| User: "Bear" |
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| Title: Re: Influence of Buddhism on the Christians - Q? |
18 Oct 2005 06:14:10 AM |
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"Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]" wrote
: i never made such assertion as i recall ; what i believe i said is
: Magee's hypothesis about Persians constructing Jewish or Judaic culture
: doesn't have much of a foundation.
And I have shown you that Magee is not the only one who has reached that
conclusion. Like you, I read material about what I am currently reading, and
like you as long as I am satisfied with what I have studied I reach a
provisional conclusion.
: i have asked many times can someone show something like a rough draft
: of a section of the TaNaKh between the Persian stage as alleged and the
: Greek stage? in order to see the changes?
The redactors of the Tanakh did their very best to disguise such things.
: since Alexandria had a large Jewish population and later on there was
: even a temple at Elephantine? i think if such transitional works
: existed they should have been captured in the Qumran site?
As if they would exhibit any objectivity.
: but no what we see is 900 CE text and 150 BCE texts are virtually the
: same.
900 CE? Where did you find evidence for that date?
: > I think there was much more back and forth influence between all
: > the people of the Middle East than you care to admit.
:
: That is very ridiculous speculation about what i think or feel on the
: subject.
:
: regardless, Alexander tried to spread Greek culture throughout the area
: with mass marriages et cetera but this hardly achieved a universal
: ecumenical religion.
:
: where there is syncretism we see such writers as Philo of Alexandria
: but in opposition to hellenism we have the torah observant Judaic
: culture, which does not yield to the Classical Culture and in the
: syncretist Christian form eventually destroys it.
I'm talking about before the Tanakh was ever written.
--
Bear
"Many are those who trade in tricks and simulated miracles, duping the
foolish multitude; and if nobody unmasked their subterfuges, they would
impose them on everyone." - Leonardo da Vinci (Manuscript F, Institut de
France, 5v)
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| User: "Martin Edwards" |
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| Title: Re: Influence of Buddhism on the Christians - Q? |
18 Oct 2005 12:48:25 PM |
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Bear wrote:
"Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]" wrote
: rick++ wrote:
: > There is long tradition in the Church some of the first missions
: > were to India (St. Thomas). But I've seen little archeaological
: > evidence of this.
:
: if you have opportunity to compare the sections of TaNaKh with greatest
: similarity to Indian proverbs and philosophy there is where you will
: find such influence since Yeshua is a torah observant Yehudi.
Therein lies evidence of influence other than Egyptian.
See the reply which should come in above.
--
You can't fool me: there ain't no Sanity Clause - Chico Marx
www.geocities.com/Athens/Agora/1955
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