| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"Pastor Frank" |
| Date: |
25 Nov 2005 07:46:41 AM |
| Object: |
Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
"Ike" <accordiondocxyzxyzxyz@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:7FUaf.5046$m81.2275@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net...
"Carl Rooker" <rookerc@dnx.net> wrote in message
news:1131029388.882916@w9.dnx.net...
"Bill" <wmech@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:2Y7af.47815$Pp1.37118@bignews3.bellsouth.net...
Religious types claim that the universe would need a God creator and
that
God always was. It is more logical to conclude the Universe always was.
There is physical objective verifiable evidence for the existence of the
Universe. There is absolutely no objective verifiable evidence for the
existence of ANY Gods.
Well, for once you have part of this correct. We do believe that God is
eternal, and the universe is not.
What universe? How can I observe a universe? Scientific method requires
replicable observations. You can look out the window and so can I. We will
see different things. Where is the universe? If you say all around, then
all around what... all around everything? Is there anything around what is
all around? That can't be proved or disproved since it is too general or
too self-referencing a statement. It is not a thing that can be observed.
Or if it is, where can I see it?
It's obviously a miracle, and perhaps Shakespeare was right in saying:
"The world is of the stuff that dreams are made of". The consequence would
be, that we are always in the process of having our expectations fulfilled.
"What you seek you will find" said Christ, and people that look to love and
care and to be humane, will find that returned to them multiplied. However
those who look for punishment for past sins, will find that too. That is why
in Christianity God's grace, the repentance and forgiveness of sins is so
central.
.
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| User: "Yournameheres personal Cthulhu" |
|
| Title: Re: Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
25 Nov 2005 10:48:26 AM |
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"Pastor Frank" <PastorFrank@christfirst.edu> suddenly spluttered:
It's obviously a miracle, and perhaps Shakespeare was right in saying:
"The world is of the stuff that dreams are made of".
You misspelled 'bovine scatology'.
------------------------------------------------
Conflict over the exact will/purpose/nature of God cannot ever be
resolved, since there are no facts to go on.
D Silverman FLAHN, SMLAHN
AA #2208
.
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| User: "Pastor Frank" |
|
| Title: Re: Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
27 Nov 2005 03:09:40 AM |
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"<Yournamehere>'s personal Cthulhu" <yournamehere@martyrdom.org> wrote in
message news:utqdo19b6bnck81v28sj622c22pa45o929@4ax.com...
"Pastor Frank" <PastorFrank@christfirst.edu> suddenly spluttered:
It's obviously a miracle, and perhaps Shakespeare was right in saying:
"The world is of the stuff that dreams are made of".
You misspelled 'bovine scatology'.
Conflict over the exact will/purpose/nature of God cannot ever be
resolved, since there are no facts to go on.
D Silverman FLAHN, SMLAHN
AA #2208
Dreams are a fact for most normal people. Are you abnormal?
.
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| User: "Pramod Subramanyan" |
|
| Title: Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
26 Nov 2005 08:49:12 AM |
|
|
Pastor Frank wrote:
"Ike" <accordiondocxyzxyzxyz@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:7FUaf.5046$m81.2275@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net...
"Carl Rooker" <rookerc@dnx.net> wrote in message
news:1131029388.882916@w9.dnx.net...
"Bill" <wmech@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:2Y7af.47815$Pp1.37118@bignews3.bellsouth.net...
Religious types claim that the universe would need a God creator and
that
God always was. It is more logical to conclude the Universe always was.
There is physical objective verifiable evidence for the existence of the
Universe. There is absolutely no objective verifiable evidence for the
existence of ANY Gods.
Well, for once you have part of this correct. We do believe that God is
eternal, and the universe is not.
What universe? How can I observe a universe? Scientific method requires
replicable observations. You can look out the window and so can I. We will
see different things. Where is the universe? If you say all around, then
all around what... all around everything? Is there anything around what is
all around? That can't be proved or disproved since it is too general or
too self-referencing a statement. It is not a thing that can be observed.
Or if it is, where can I see it?
It's obviously a miracle, and perhaps Shakespeare was right in saying:
"The world is of the stuff that dreams are made of".
The world is an amazing place, and probably can be described as a
miracle. But the implication that beauty and truth require the
existence of intelligence is questionable.
The consequence would be, that we are always in the process of having
our expectations fulfilled.
Not quite. Unfortunate and unplanned things do happen and there is no
running away from them.
"What you seek you will find" said Christ, and people that look to love and
care and to be humane, will find that returned to them multiplied.
True. But do we really need an imaginary enforcer threatening eternal
punishment to be decent people? The religious attempt to portray men as
evil beasts who need to be kept on a tight leash with a system of
reward and punishment is one of my prime complaints.
However those who look for punishment for past sins, will find that too.
That is why in Christianity God's grace, the repentance and forgiveness
of sins is so central.
A human being is a part of the whole, called by us "Universe," a part
limited in time and space. He experiences himself, his thoughts and
feelings as something separated from the rest a kind of optical
delusion of his consciousness. This delusion is a kind of prison for
us, restricting us to our personal desires and to affection for a few
persons nearest to us. Our task must be to free ourselves from this
prison by widening our circle of compassion to embrace all living
creatures and the whole of nature in its beauty. Nobody is able to
achieve this completely, but the striving for such achievement is in
itself a part of the liberation and a foundation for inner security.
-- Albert Einstein
.
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| User: "Carl Rooker" |
|
| Title: Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
26 Nov 2005 02:45:15 PM |
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|
"Pramod Subramanyan" <pramod.sub@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1132994951.956804.109680@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Pastor Frank wrote:
"Ike" <accordiondocxyzxyzxyz@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:7FUaf.5046$m81.2275@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net...
"Carl Rooker" <rookerc@dnx.net> wrote in message
news:1131029388.882916@w9.dnx.net...
"Bill" <wmech@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:2Y7af.47815$Pp1.37118@bignews3.bellsouth.net...
Religious types claim that the universe would need a God creator and
that
God always was. It is more logical to conclude the Universe always
was.
There is physical objective verifiable evidence for the existence of
the
Universe. There is absolutely no objective verifiable evidence for
the
existence of ANY Gods.
Well, for once you have part of this correct. We do believe that God
is
eternal, and the universe is not.
What universe? How can I observe a universe? Scientific method
requires
replicable observations. You can look out the window and so can I. We
will
see different things. Where is the universe? If you say all around,
then
all around what... all around everything? Is there anything around
what is
all around? That can't be proved or disproved since it is too general
or
too self-referencing a statement. It is not a thing that can be
observed.
Or if it is, where can I see it?
It's obviously a miracle, and perhaps Shakespeare was right in saying:
"The world is of the stuff that dreams are made of".
The world is an amazing place, and probably can be described as a
miracle. But the implication that beauty and truth require the
existence of intelligence is questionable.
The consequence would be, that we are always in the process of having
our expectations fulfilled.
Not quite. Unfortunate and unplanned things do happen and there is no
running away from them.
"What you seek you will find" said Christ, and people that look to love
and
care and to be humane, will find that returned to them multiplied.
True. But do we really need an imaginary enforcer threatening eternal
punishment to be decent people? The religious attempt to portray men as
evil beasts who need to be kept on a tight leash with a system of
reward and punishment is one of my prime complaints.
But, that is NOT the message of Christ, and the Bible.
The message is that we already are sinners, and it does not matter how tight
a leash is used, we are under Judgement.
But, on the same token, God took steps to reconcile His wayward children.
It is not a system of reward and punishment, for all have sinned, and are
under the punishment. It is a relationship being restored to the Creator.
However those who look for punishment for past sins, will find that too.
That is why in Christianity God's grace, the repentance and forgiveness
of sins is so central.
A human being is a part of the whole, called by us "Universe," a part
limited in time and space. He experiences himself, his thoughts and
feelings as something separated from the rest a kind of optical
delusion of his consciousness. This delusion is a kind of prison for
us, restricting us to our personal desires and to affection for a few
persons nearest to us. Our task must be to free ourselves from this
prison by widening our circle of compassion to embrace all living
creatures and the whole of nature in its beauty. Nobody is able to
achieve this completely, but the striving for such achievement is in
itself a part of the liberation and a foundation for inner security.
-- Albert Einstein
Then, take that one step further. To reach out to Him who created us, and
is outside of our realm.
We can't do it, but He has taken steps to reach those who would be reached.
God Bless
Carl
.
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| User: "Pramod Subramanyan" |
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| Title: Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
27 Nov 2005 04:30:00 AM |
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Carl Rooker wrote:
/snip
True. But do we really need an imaginary enforcer threatening eternal
punishment to be decent people? The religious attempt to portray men as
evil beasts who need to be kept on a tight leash with a system of
reward and punishment is one of my prime complaints.
But, that is NOT the message of Christ, and the Bible.
The message is that we already are sinners, and it does not matter how tight
a leash is used, we are under Judgement.
What does "we already are sinners" mean? Are you talking about the
"sins" of our predecessors? If so, why shoud I be "judged" for them.
Obviously, we all make some mistakes, but as long as those mistakes are
not malicious and there is an attempt not to repeat them, they're not
such a big deal. Making people think that there is something inherently
"wrong" with them is what I was referring to.
What about implied "or else ..." clause in the contract? Isn't that
blatant blackmail?
But, on the same token, God took steps to reconcile His wayward children.
It is not a system of reward and punishment, for all have sinned, and are
under the punishment. It is a relationship being restored to the Creator.
However those who look for punishment for past sins, will find that too.
That is why in Christianity God's grace, the repentance and forgiveness
of sins is so central.
A human being is a part of the whole, called by us "Universe," a part
limited in time and space. He experiences himself, his thoughts and
feelings as something separated from the rest a kind of optical
delusion of his consciousness. This delusion is a kind of prison for
us, restricting us to our personal desires and to affection for a few
persons nearest to us. Our task must be to free ourselves from this
prison by widening our circle of compassion to embrace all living
creatures and the whole of nature in its beauty. Nobody is able to
achieve this completely, but the striving for such achievement is in
itself a part of the liberation and a foundation for inner security.
-- Albert Einstein
Then, take that one step further. To reach out to Him who created us, and
is outside of our realm.
We can't do it, but He has taken steps to reach those who would be reached.
First of all, you need to prove that god exists or at least provide
some sort of evidence for the claim. Then you need to demonstrate that
prayer and "reaching out to Him" are required.
God Bless
Carl
.
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| User: "Carl Rooker" |
|
| Title: Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
27 Nov 2005 05:50:58 PM |
|
|
"Pramod Subramanyan" <pramod.sub@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1133065800.651062.70880@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
Carl Rooker wrote:
/snip
True. But do we really need an imaginary enforcer threatening eternal
punishment to be decent people? The religious attempt to portray men
as
evil beasts who need to be kept on a tight leash with a system of
reward and punishment is one of my prime complaints.
But, that is NOT the message of Christ, and the Bible.
The message is that we already are sinners, and it does not matter how
tight
a leash is used, we are under Judgement.
What does "we already are sinners" mean? Are you talking about the
"sins" of our predecessors? If so, why shoud I be "judged" for them.
Obviously, we all make some mistakes, but as long as those mistakes are
not malicious and there is an attempt not to repeat them, they're not
such a big deal. Making people think that there is something inherently
"wrong" with them is what I was referring to.
Using your standard here, have you ever once in your life told a lie about
someone? Even a little lie?
Have you ever gossiped about someone?
Have you ever taken something you knew was not yours, even if it was a
little thing?
Have you never hated anyone?
We all do things that we know are wrong. We may try to justify them, but
even in justifying our wrong, we are admitting that they are wrong.
A mistake is saying 1+1= 6. Doing wrong is not a mistake, it is a choice.
What about implied "or else ..." clause in the contract? Isn't that
blatant blackmail?
If you are in a building on fire, and a fireman tells you to go to the exit
or you will die, is that black mail?
God is not blackmailing you into anything. He is providine the "fire exit".
But, on the same token, God took steps to reconcile His wayward
children.
It is not a system of reward and punishment, for all have sinned, and
are
under the punishment. It is a relationship being restored to the
Creator.
However those who look for punishment for past sins, will find that
too.
That is why in Christianity God's grace, the repentance and
forgiveness
of sins is so central.
A human being is a part of the whole, called by us "Universe," a part
limited in time and space. He experiences himself, his thoughts and
feelings as something separated from the rest a kind of optical
delusion of his consciousness. This delusion is a kind of prison for
us, restricting us to our personal desires and to affection for a few
persons nearest to us. Our task must be to free ourselves from this
prison by widening our circle of compassion to embrace all living
creatures and the whole of nature in its beauty. Nobody is able to
achieve this completely, but the striving for such achievement is in
itself a part of the liberation and a foundation for inner security.
-- Albert Einstein
Then, take that one step further. To reach out to Him who created us,
and
is outside of our realm.
We can't do it, but He has taken steps to reach those who would be
reached.
First of all, you need to prove that god exists or at least provide
some sort of evidence for the claim. Then you need to demonstrate that
prayer and "reaching out to Him" are required.
Actually, I do not have to prove a thing. I am only posting in
alt.Christian,religion, but certain cross posters invade here to spread
their own lies. Only in answering them do groups like alt.atheism get my
messages.
However, God has proven His existence, and His care for us, in an Historical
Person.
It is not us reaching out to Him that counts, it is His reaching out to us.
How we respond is the only difference.
God Bless
Carl
.
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| User: "xavier" |
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| Title: Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
01 Dec 2005 04:23:47 PM |
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Your logic is flawed.
A fireman does not create the fire, then offer you a choice of an exit
or firery end.
If God is the creator of all things, then he is also the creator of
hell-fire.
snip
If you are in a building on fire, and a fireman tells you to go to the exit
or you will die, is that black mail?
God is not blackmailing you into anything. He is providine the "fire exit".
.
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| User: "L.Roberts" |
|
| Title: Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
27 Nov 2005 04:25:19 AM |
|
|
Carl Rooker wrote:
"Pramod Subramanyan" <pramod.sub@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1132994951.956804.109680@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Pastor Frank wrote:
"Ike" <accordiondocxyzxyzxyz@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:7FUaf.5046$m81.2275@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net...
"Carl Rooker" <rookerc@dnx.net> wrote in message
news:1131029388.882916@w9.dnx.net...
"Bill" <wmech@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:2Y7af.47815$Pp1.37118@bignews3.bellsouth.net...
Religious types claim that the universe would need a God creator and
that
God always was. It is more logical to conclude the Universe always
was.
There is physical objective verifiable evidence for the existence of
the
Universe. There is absolutely no objective verifiable evidence for
the
existence of ANY Gods.
Well, for once you have part of this correct. We do believe that God
is
eternal, and the universe is not.
What universe? How can I observe a universe? Scientific method
requires
replicable observations. You can look out the window and so can I. We
will
see different things. Where is the universe? If you say all around,
then
all around what... all around everything? Is there anything around
what is
all around? That can't be proved or disproved since it is too general
or
too self-referencing a statement. It is not a thing that can be
observed.
Or if it is, where can I see it?
It's obviously a miracle, and perhaps Shakespeare was right in saying:
"The world is of the stuff that dreams are made of".
The world is an amazing place, and probably can be described as a
miracle. But the implication that beauty and truth require the
existence of intelligence is questionable.
The consequence would be, that we are always in the process of having
our expectations fulfilled.
Not quite. Unfortunate and unplanned things do happen and there is no
running away from them.
"What you seek you will find" said Christ, and people that look to love
and
care and to be humane, will find that returned to them multiplied.
True. But do we really need an imaginary enforcer threatening eternal
punishment to be decent people? The religious attempt to portray men as
evil beasts who need to be kept on a tight leash with a system of
reward and punishment is one of my prime complaints.
But, that is NOT the message of Christ, and the Bible.
The message is that we already are sinners, and it does not matter how tight
a leash is used, we are under Judgement.
But, on the same token, God took steps to reconcile His wayward children.
It is not a system of reward and punishment, for all have sinned, and are
under the punishment. It is a relationship being restored to the Creator.
However those who look for punishment for past sins, will find that too.
That is why in Christianity God's grace, the repentance and forgiveness
of sins is so central.
A human being is a part of the whole, called by us "Universe," a part
limited in time and space. He experiences himself, his thoughts and
feelings as something separated from the rest a kind of optical
delusion of his consciousness. This delusion is a kind of prison for
us, restricting us to our personal desires and to affection for a few
persons nearest to us. Our task must be to free ourselves from this
prison by widening our circle of compassion to embrace all living
creatures and the whole of nature in its beauty. Nobody is able to
achieve this completely, but the striving for such achievement is in
itself a part of the liberation and a foundation for inner security.
-- Albert Einstein
Then, take that one step further. To reach out to Him who created us, and
is outside of our realm.
We can't do it, but He has taken steps to reach those who would be reached.
God Bless
Carl
So, you really would have us believe that God made a great, great
sacrifice, the life of his only begotten son, for us. For us, who are
only human, who make mistakes. Jesus, you say, suffered and died, but
then you say, God, resurrected him; so, then, God didn't lose anything
after all and neither did Jesus. Were you to tell me that Jesus,
instead of going on to the second, or, at the least, the third most
estimable position in God's kingdom, had gone instead to eternal Hell,
for my sake, why, then, if I believed it, I might be moved.
And what of Christ's suffering? It wasn't, as described, anything too
all bad when compared to the suffering inflicted upon some of the
victims of the Inquisition, or worse, the suffering of those who lived
for days and months after being horribly burned by the atom bombs
dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki for instance.
And, for me, as I slowly turned away from the church, the most
compelling reason to doubt the teachings of my youth was that which
fancies itself to be Christianity.
L.Roberts.
.
|
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| User: "Carl Rooker" |
|
| Title: Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
27 Nov 2005 05:43:25 PM |
|
|
"L.Roberts" <ozzcat2003@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1133065519.340072.19250@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Carl Rooker wrote:
"Pramod Subramanyan" <pramod.sub@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1132994951.956804.109680@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Pastor Frank wrote:
"Ike" <accordiondocxyzxyzxyz@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:7FUaf.5046$m81.2275@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net...
"Carl Rooker" <rookerc@dnx.net> wrote in message
news:1131029388.882916@w9.dnx.net...
"Bill" <wmech@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:2Y7af.47815$Pp1.37118@bignews3.bellsouth.net...
Religious types claim that the universe would need a God creator
and
that
God always was. It is more logical to conclude the Universe
always
was.
There is physical objective verifiable evidence for the
existence of
the
Universe. There is absolutely no objective verifiable evidence
for
the
existence of ANY Gods.
Well, for once you have part of this correct. We do believe that
God
is
eternal, and the universe is not.
What universe? How can I observe a universe? Scientific method
requires
replicable observations. You can look out the window and so can I.
We
will
see different things. Where is the universe? If you say all
around,
then
all around what... all around everything? Is there anything around
what is
all around? That can't be proved or disproved since it is too
general
or
too self-referencing a statement. It is not a thing that can be
observed.
Or if it is, where can I see it?
It's obviously a miracle, and perhaps Shakespeare was right in
saying:
"The world is of the stuff that dreams are made of".
The world is an amazing place, and probably can be described as a
miracle. But the implication that beauty and truth require the
existence of intelligence is questionable.
The consequence would be, that we are always in the process of
having
our expectations fulfilled.
Not quite. Unfortunate and unplanned things do happen and there is no
running away from them.
"What you seek you will find" said Christ, and people that look to
love
and
care and to be humane, will find that returned to them multiplied.
True. But do we really need an imaginary enforcer threatening eternal
punishment to be decent people? The religious attempt to portray men
as
evil beasts who need to be kept on a tight leash with a system of
reward and punishment is one of my prime complaints.
But, that is NOT the message of Christ, and the Bible.
The message is that we already are sinners, and it does not matter how
tight
a leash is used, we are under Judgement.
But, on the same token, God took steps to reconcile His wayward
children.
It is not a system of reward and punishment, for all have sinned, and
are
under the punishment. It is a relationship being restored to the
Creator.
However those who look for punishment for past sins, will find that
too.
That is why in Christianity God's grace, the repentance and
forgiveness
of sins is so central.
A human being is a part of the whole, called by us "Universe," a part
limited in time and space. He experiences himself, his thoughts and
feelings as something separated from the rest a kind of optical
delusion of his consciousness. This delusion is a kind of prison for
us, restricting us to our personal desires and to affection for a few
persons nearest to us. Our task must be to free ourselves from this
prison by widening our circle of compassion to embrace all living
creatures and the whole of nature in its beauty. Nobody is able to
achieve this completely, but the striving for such achievement is in
itself a part of the liberation and a foundation for inner security.
-- Albert Einstein
Then, take that one step further. To reach out to Him who created us,
and
is outside of our realm.
We can't do it, but He has taken steps to reach those who would be
reached.
God Bless
Carl
So, you really would have us believe that God made a great, great
sacrifice, the life of his only begotten son, for us. For us, who are
only human, who make mistakes. Jesus, you say, suffered and died, but
then you say, God, resurrected him; so, then, God didn't lose anything
after all and neither did Jesus. Were you to tell me that Jesus,
instead of going on to the second, or, at the least, the third most
estimable position in God's kingdom, had gone instead to eternal Hell,
for my sake, why, then, if I believed it, I might be moved.
Your lack of thankfulness, or even understanding has no bearing on what God
did.
And what of Christ's suffering? It wasn't, as described, anything too
all bad when compared to the suffering inflicted upon some of the
victims of the Inquisition, or worse, the suffering of those who lived
for days and months after being horribly burned by the atom bombs
dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki for instance.
And, what do these acts of man's inhumanity to man have to do with it?
Christ still suffered and died to reconcile us to God.
And, for me, as I slowly turned away from the church, the most
compelling reason to doubt the teachings of my youth was that which
fancies itself to be Christianity.
Well, from your comments it is clear that you moved away from not
Christianity, but your false idea of what Christianity was all about.
God Bless
Carl
L.Roberts.
.
|
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|
| User: "Bill" |
|
| Title: Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
27 Nov 2005 06:39:03 PM |
|
|
"Carl Rooker" <rookerc@dnx.net> wrote in message
news:1133113412.290947@w9.dnx.net...
"L.Roberts" <ozzcat2003@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1133065519.340072.19250@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Carl Rooker wrote:
"Pramod Subramanyan" <pramod.sub@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1132994951.956804.109680@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Pastor Frank wrote:
"Ike" <accordiondocxyzxyzxyz@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:7FUaf.5046$m81.2275@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net...
"Carl Rooker" <rookerc@dnx.net> wrote in message
news:1131029388.882916@w9.dnx.net...
"Bill" <wmech@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:2Y7af.47815$Pp1.37118@bignews3.bellsouth.net...
Religious types claim that the universe would need a God
creator
and
that
God always was. It is more logical to conclude the Universe
always
was.
There is physical objective verifiable evidence for the
existence of
the
Universe. There is absolutely no objective verifiable evidence
for
the
existence of ANY Gods.
Well, for once you have part of this correct. We do believe
that
God
is
eternal, and the universe is not.
What universe? How can I observe a universe? Scientific method
requires
replicable observations. You can look out the window and so can
I.
We
will
see different things. Where is the universe? If you say all
around,
then
all around what... all around everything? Is there anything
around
what is
all around? That can't be proved or disproved since it is too
general
or
too self-referencing a statement. It is not a thing that can be
observed.
Or if it is, where can I see it?
It's obviously a miracle, and perhaps Shakespeare was right in
saying:
"The world is of the stuff that dreams are made of".
The world is an amazing place, and probably can be described as a
miracle. But the implication that beauty and truth require the
existence of intelligence is questionable.
The consequence would be, that we are always in the process of
having
our expectations fulfilled.
Not quite. Unfortunate and unplanned things do happen and there is no
running away from them.
"What you seek you will find" said Christ, and people that look to
love
and
care and to be humane, will find that returned to them multiplied.
True. But do we really need an imaginary enforcer threatening eternal
punishment to be decent people? The religious attempt to portray men
as
evil beasts who need to be kept on a tight leash with a system of
reward and punishment is one of my prime complaints.
But, that is NOT the message of Christ, and the Bible.
The message is that we already are sinners, and it does not matter how
tight
a leash is used, we are under Judgement.
But, on the same token, God took steps to reconcile His wayward
children.
It is not a system of reward and punishment, for all have sinned, and
are
under the punishment. It is a relationship being restored to the
Creator.
However those who look for punishment for past sins, will find that
too.
That is why in Christianity God's grace, the repentance and
forgiveness
of sins is so central.
A human being is a part of the whole, called by us "Universe," a part
limited in time and space. He experiences himself, his thoughts and
feelings as something separated from the rest a kind of optical
delusion of his consciousness. This delusion is a kind of prison for
us, restricting us to our personal desires and to affection for a few
persons nearest to us. Our task must be to free ourselves from this
prison by widening our circle of compassion to embrace all living
creatures and the whole of nature in its beauty. Nobody is able to
achieve this completely, but the striving for such achievement is in
itself a part of the liberation and a foundation for inner security.
-- Albert Einstein
Then, take that one step further. To reach out to Him who created us,
and
is outside of our realm.
We can't do it, but He has taken steps to reach those who would be
reached.
God Bless
Carl
So, you really would have us believe that God made a great, great
sacrifice, the life of his only begotten son, for us. For us, who are
only human, who make mistakes. Jesus, you say, suffered and died, but
then you say, God, resurrected him; so, then, God didn't lose anything
after all and neither did Jesus. Were you to tell me that Jesus,
instead of going on to the second, or, at the least, the third most
estimable position in God's kingdom, had gone instead to eternal Hell,
for my sake, why, then, if I believed it, I might be moved.
Your lack of thankfulness, or even understanding has no bearing on what
God
did.
Why should he be thankful for somehting he doesn't believe exists?
Your lack of ANY objective verifiable evidence for the existence of your god
does not
provide evidence that your god actually did anything!
And what of Christ's suffering? It wasn't, as described, anything too
all bad when compared to the suffering inflicted upon some of the
victims of the Inquisition, or worse, the suffering of those who lived
for days and months after being horribly burned by the atom bombs
dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki for instance.
And, what do these acts of man's inhumanity to man have to do with it?
You seem to have forgotten that the suffering in the inquisition was caused
by and delivered
by your fellow Christians!
Christ still suffered and died to reconcile us to God.
Pure fable!
And, for me, as I slowly turned away from the church, the most
compelling reason to doubt the teachings of my youth was that which
fancies itself to be Christianity.
Well, from your comments it is clear that you moved away from not
Christianity, but your false idea of what Christianity was all about.
Duh!
God Bless
Carl
L.Roberts.
.
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| User: "Christopher A. Lee" |
|
| Title: Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
27 Nov 2005 06:25:35 PM |
|
|
On Sun, 27 Nov 2005 12:43:25 -0500, "Carl Rooker" <rookerc@dnx.net>
wrote:
And what of Christ's suffering? It wasn't, as described, anything too
all bad when compared to the suffering inflicted upon some of the
victims of the Inquisition, or worse, the suffering of those who lived
for days and months after being horribly burned by the atom bombs
dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki for instance.
And, what do these acts of man's inhumanity to man have to do with it?
Christ still suffered and died to reconcile us to God.
Only in your mythology, moron. Are you really so stupid you can't
grasp that your audience doesn't share your religious beliefs?
And, for me, as I slowly turned away from the church, the most
compelling reason to doubt the teachings of my youth was that which
fancies itself to be Christianity.
Well, from your comments it is clear that you moved away from not
Christianity, but your false idea of what Christianity was all about.
We know perfectly. It's about creating mindless zombies like you who
can't cope with the real world outside your religion.
God Bless
Spend eternity in your religion's hell, sanctimonious hypocrite.
Carl
L.Roberts.
.
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| User: "Pastor Frank" |
|
| Title: Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
01 Dec 2005 11:45:19 AM |
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"Christopher A. Lee" <calee@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:bcujo1h9osgoi4lbh17dge7g01ihv0nel4@4ax.com...
On Sun, 27 Nov 2005 12:43:25 -0500, "Carl Rooker" <rookerc@dnx.net>
wrote:
God Bless
Spend eternity in your religion's hell, sanctimonious hypocrite.
It's you Chris who is already in hell, for the main activity of those
there is screeching invective and gnash teeth furiously, while we just keep
on praising the Lord in all circumstances.
Pastor Frank
Jesus in Mt:8:12: But the children of Satan's kingdom shall be cast into
outer darkness: There shall be wailing (of interminable complaints) and
gnashing of teeth (in furious anger and frustration).
.
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|
|
| User: "Virgil" |
|
| Title: Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
01 Dec 2005 08:55:47 PM |
|
|
In article
<1133437519.89ed023cd69e57b7b3bfb8ded2746c71@fe5.teranews.com>,
"Pastor Frank" <PastorFrank@christfirst.edu> wrote:
"Christopher A. Lee" <calee@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:bcujo1h9osgoi4lbh17dge7g01ihv0nel4@4ax.com...
On Sun, 27 Nov 2005 12:43:25 -0500, "Carl Rooker" <rookerc@dnx.net>
wrote:
God Bless
Spend eternity in your religion's hell, sanctimonious hypocrite.
It's you Chris who is already in hell, for the main activity of those
there is screeching invective and gnash teeth furiously, while we just keep
on praising the Lord in all circumstances.
Pastor Frank
Your god must be a flaming egomaniac to need all that praise.
.
|
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| User: "Pastor Frank" |
|
| Title: Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
03 Dec 2005 11:56:33 PM |
|
|
"Virgil" <ITSnetNOTcom#virgil@COMCAST.com> wrote in message
news:ITSnetNOTcom%23virgil-4FD6A2.13554701122005@comcast.dca.giganews.com...
In article
<1133437519.89ed023cd69e57b7b3bfb8ded2746c71@fe5.teranews.com>,
"Pastor Frank" <PastorFrank@christfirst.edu> wrote:
"Christopher A. Lee" <calee@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:bcujo1h9osgoi4lbh17dge7g01ihv0nel4@4ax.com...
On Sun, 27 Nov 2005 12:43:25 -0500, "Carl Rooker" <rookerc@dnx.net>
wrote:
God Bless
Spend eternity in your religion's hell, sanctimonious hypocrite.
It's you Chris who is already in hell, for the main activity of those
there is screeching invective and gnash teeth furiously, while we just
keep
on praising the Lord in all circumstances.
Your god must be a flaming egomaniac to need all that praise.
Wrong!!! It's not God who needs the praise. It's we who need to praise
and worship to be happy, for to be an atheist means to be permanently
critical, condemnatory, cynical, paranoid and despairing. Atheists post from
the depth of their hell, we post from the glorious heights of our heaven.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Pramod Subramanyan" |
|
| Title: Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
04 Dec 2005 07:28:30 AM |
|
|
Pastor Frank wrote:
"Virgil" <ITSnetNOTcom#virgil@COMCAST.com> wrote in message
news:ITSnetNOTcom%23virgil-4FD6A2.13554701122005@comcast.dca.giganews.com...
In article
<1133437519.89ed023cd69e57b7b3bfb8ded2746c71@fe5.teranews.com>,
"Pastor Frank" <PastorFrank@christfirst.edu> wrote:
"Christopher A. Lee" <calee@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:bcujo1h9osgoi4lbh17dge7g01ihv0nel4@4ax.com...
On Sun, 27 Nov 2005 12:43:25 -0500, "Carl Rooker" <rookerc@dnx.net>
wrote:
God Bless
Spend eternity in your religion's hell, sanctimonious hypocrite.
It's you Chris who is already in hell, for the main activity of those
there is screeching invective and gnash teeth furiously, while we just
keep
on praising the Lord in all circumstances.
Your god must be a flaming egomaniac to need all that praise.
Wrong!!! It's not God who needs the praise. It's we who need to praise
and worship to be happy, for to be an atheist means to be permanently
critical, condemnatory, cynical, paranoid and despairing. Atheists post from
the depth of their hell, we post from the glorious heights of our heaven.
"To be an atheist means to be permanently critical, condemnatory,
cynical, paranoid and despairing.Atheists post from the depth of their
hell, we post from the glorious heights of our heaven."
How do you come with these Unassailable Arguments?
.
|
|
|
| User: "Pastor Frank" |
|
| Title: Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
06 Dec 2005 02:59:02 AM |
|
|
"Pramod Subramanyan" <pramod.sub@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1133681310.851663.108410@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Pastor Frank wrote:
"Virgil" <ITSnetNOTcom#virgil@COMCAST.com> wrote in message
news:ITSnetNOTcom%23virgil-4FD6A2.13554701122005@comcast.dca.giganews.com...
In article
<1133437519.89ed023cd69e57b7b3bfb8ded2746c71@fe5.teranews.com>,
"Pastor Frank" <PastorFrank@christfirst.edu> wrote:
"Christopher A. Lee" <calee@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:bcujo1h9osgoi4lbh17dge7g01ihv0nel4@4ax.com...
On Sun, 27 Nov 2005 12:43:25 -0500, "Carl Rooker" <rookerc@dnx.net>
wrote:
God Bless
Spend eternity in your religion's hell, sanctimonious hypocrite.
It's you Chris who is already in hell, for the main activity of
those
there is screeching invective and gnash teeth furiously, while we just
keep on praising the Lord in all circumstances.
Your god must be a flaming egomaniac to need all that praise.
Wrong!!! It's not God who needs the praise. It's we who need to
praise
and worship to be happy, for to be an atheist means to be permanently
critical, condemnatory, cynical, paranoid and despairing. Atheists post
from
the depth of their hell, we post from the glorious heights of our heaven.
How do you come with these Unassailable Arguments?
Why, are an atheist who supports, advocates, affirms, praises and
glorifies anything or anyone? Let's hear it then. Who is your paradigm of
rectitude, virtue and grace, whose expectations we should make our own and
seek to live up to?
.
|
|
|
| User: "Fred Stone" |
|
| Title: Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
06 Dec 2005 03:28:12 AM |
|
|
"Pastor Frank" <PastorFrank@christfirst.edu> wrote in
news:1133837942.4c7327c272e3e9ee9aa5abe178d77010@fe5.teranews.com:
"Pramod Subramanyan" <pramod.sub@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1133681310.851663.108410@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Pastor Frank wrote:
"Virgil" <ITSnetNOTcom#virgil@COMCAST.com> wrote in message
news:ITSnetNOTcom%23virgil-4FD6A2.13554701122005
@comcast.dca.giganews
.com...
In article
<1133437519.89ed023cd69e57b7b3bfb8ded2746c71@fe5.teranews.com>,
"Pastor Frank" <PastorFrank@christfirst.edu> wrote:
"Christopher A. Lee" <calee@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:bcujo1h9osgoi4lbh17dge7g01ihv0nel4@4ax.com...
On Sun, 27 Nov 2005 12:43:25 -0500, "Carl Rooker"
<rookerc@dnx.net> wrote:
God Bless
Spend eternity in your religion's hell, sanctimonious
hypocrite.
It's you Chris who is already in hell, for the main activity
of
those
there is screeching invective and gnash teeth furiously, while we
just keep on praising the Lord in all circumstances.
Your god must be a flaming egomaniac to need all that praise.
Wrong!!! It's not God who needs the praise. It's we who need to
praise
and worship to be happy, for to be an atheist means to be
permanently critical, condemnatory, cynical, paranoid and
despairing. Atheists post from
the depth of their hell, we post from the glorious heights of our
heaven.
How do you come with these Unassailable Arguments?
Why, are an atheist who supports, advocates, affirms, praises and
glorifies anything or anyone? Let's hear it then. Who is your paradigm
of rectitude, virtue and grace, whose expectations we should make our
own and seek to live up to?
"To thine own self be true".
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
"The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's
just that they know so much that isn't so." - Ronald Reagan
.
|
|
|
| User: "Pastor Frank" |
|
| Title: Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
07 Dec 2005 10:05:13 PM |
|
|
"Fred Stone" <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message
news:Xns9723E4BE9D84Dfstone69@213.155.197.138...
"Pastor Frank" <PastorFrank@christfirst.edu> wrote in
news:1133837942.4c7327c272e3e9ee9aa5abe178d77010@fe5.teranews.com:
"Pramod Subramanyan" <pramod.sub@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1133681310.851663.108410@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Pastor Frank wrote:
"Virgil" <ITSnetNOTcom#virgil@COMCAST.com> wrote in message
news:ITSnetNOTcom%23virgil-4FD6A2.13554701122005
@comcast.dca.giganews
.com...
In article
<1133437519.89ed023cd69e57b7b3bfb8ded2746c71@fe5.teranews.com>,
"Pastor Frank" <PastorFrank@christfirst.edu> wrote:
"Christopher A. Lee" <calee@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:bcujo1h9osgoi4lbh17dge7g01ihv0nel4@4ax.com...
On Sun, 27 Nov 2005 12:43:25 -0500, "Carl Rooker"
<rookerc@dnx.net> wrote:
God Bless
Spend eternity in your religion's hell, sanctimonious
hypocrite.
It's you Chris who is already in hell, for the main activity
of
those
there is screeching invective and gnash teeth furiously, while we
just keep on praising the Lord in all circumstances.
Your god must be a flaming egomaniac to need all that praise.
Wrong!!! It's not God who needs the praise. It's we who need to
praise
and worship to be happy, for to be an atheist means to be
permanently critical, condemnatory, cynical, paranoid and
despairing. Atheists post from
the depth of their hell, we post from the glorious heights of our
heaven.
How do you come with these Unassailable Arguments?
Why, are an atheist who supports, advocates, affirms, praises and
glorifies anything or anyone? Let's hear it then. Who is your paradigm
of rectitude, virtue and grace, whose expectations we should make our
own and seek to live up to?
"To thine own self be true".
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
Another atheists Narcissus worshipping himself. Sheeeesh!!!!! All that
effort to esteem yourself is merely mental masturbation, for you likely know
yourself to be far from perfect and in no way a shining example of rectitude
worthy of emulation either by yourself nor by others. Surely you can't be
THAT conceited, or are you?
.
|
|
|
| User: "Fred Stone" |
|
| Title: Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
07 Dec 2005 10:51:42 PM |
|
|
"Pastor Frank" <PastorFrank@christfirst.edu> wrote in
news:1133993113.79638d45f2ff61fb072ed021208b8487@roc.usenetexchange.com:
"Fred Stone" <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message
news:Xns9723E4BE9D84Dfstone69@213.155.197.138...
"Pastor Frank" <PastorFrank@christfirst.edu> wrote in
news:1133837942.4c7327c272e3e9ee9aa5abe178d77010@fe5.teranews.com:
"Pramod Subramanyan" <pramod.sub@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1133681310.851663.108410@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Pastor Frank wrote:
"Virgil" <ITSnetNOTcom#virgil@COMCAST.com> wrote in message
news:ITSnetNOTcom%23virgil-4FD6A2.13554701122005
@comcast.dca.giganews
.com...
In article
<1133437519.89ed023cd69e57b7b3bfb8ded2746c71@fe5.teranews.com>,
"Pastor Frank" <PastorFrank@christfirst.edu> wrote:
"Christopher A. Lee" <calee@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:bcujo1h9osgoi4lbh17dge7g01ihv0nel4@4ax.com...
On Sun, 27 Nov 2005 12:43:25 -0500, "Carl Rooker"
<rookerc@dnx.net> wrote:
God Bless
Spend eternity in your religion's hell, sanctimonious
hypocrite.
It's you Chris who is already in hell, for the main
activity of
those
there is screeching invective and gnash teeth furiously, while
we just keep on praising the Lord in all circumstances.
Your god must be a flaming egomaniac to need all that praise.
Wrong!!! It's not God who needs the praise. It's we who need
to
praise
and worship to be happy, for to be an atheist means to be
permanently critical, condemnatory, cynical, paranoid and
despairing. Atheists post from
the depth of their hell, we post from the glorious heights of our
heaven.
How do you come with these Unassailable Arguments?
Why, are an atheist who supports, advocates, affirms, praises
and
glorifies anything or anyone? Let's hear it then. Who is your
paradigm of rectitude, virtue and grace, whose expectations we
should make our own and seek to live up to?
"To thine own self be true".
Another atheists Narcissus worshipping himself. Sheeeesh!!!!! All
that effort to esteem yourself is merely mental masturbation, for you
likely know yourself to be far from perfect and in no way a shining
example of rectitude worthy of emulation either by yourself nor by
others. Surely you can't be THAT conceited, or are you?
I'm sorry to hear that you suck so bad that you can't even emulate
yourself, Frankie. Why do you feel that you need to wear a badge
"Christian" to prove to others that you're a good boy? Didn't your real
father love you enough, you have to pretend that God loves you where
your daddy let you down?
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
"The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's
just that they know so much that isn't so." - Ronald Reagan
.
|
|
|
| User: "Pastor Frank" |
|
| Title: Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
12 Dec 2005 09:00:03 PM |
|
|
"Fred Stone" <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message
news:Xns9725B5DD5C814fstone69@213.155.197.138...
"Pastor Frank" <PastorFrank@christfirst.edu> wrote in
news:1133993113.79638d45f2ff61fb072ed021208b8487@roc.usenetexchange.com:
"Fred Stone" <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message
news:Xns9723E4BE9D84Dfstone69@213.155.197.138...
"Pastor Frank" <PastorFrank@christfirst.edu> wrote in
news:1133837942.4c7327c272e3e9ee9aa5abe178d77010@fe5.teranews.com:
"Pramod Subramanyan" <pramod.sub@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1133681310.851663.108410@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Pastor Frank wrote:
"Virgil" <ITSnetNOTcom#virgil@COMCAST.com> wrote in message
news:ITSnetNOTcom%23virgil-4FD6A2.13554701122005
@comcast.dca.giganews
.com...
In article
<1133437519.89ed023cd69e57b7b3bfb8ded2746c71@fe5.teranews.com>,
"Pastor Frank" <PastorFrank@christfirst.edu> wrote:
"Christopher A. Lee" <calee@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:bcujo1h9osgoi4lbh17dge7g01ihv0nel4@4ax.com...
On Sun, 27 Nov 2005 12:43:25 -0500, "Carl Rooker"
<rookerc@dnx.net> wrote:
God Bless
Spend eternity in your religion's hell, sanctimonious
hypocrite.
It's you Chris who is already in hell, for the main
activity of
those
there is screeching invective and gnash teeth furiously, while
we just keep on praising the Lord in all circumstances.
Your god must be a flaming egomaniac to need all that praise.
Wrong!!! It's not God who needs the praise. It's we who need
to
praise
and worship to be happy, for to be an atheist means to be
permanently critical, condemnatory, cynical, paranoid and
despairing. Atheists post from
the depth of their hell, we post from the glorious heights of our
heaven.
How do you come with these Unassailable Arguments?
Why, are an atheist who supports, advocates, affirms, praises
and
glorifies anything or anyone? Let's hear it then. Who is your
paradigm of rectitude, virtue and grace, whose expectations we
should make our own and seek to live up to?
"To thine own self be true".
Another atheists Narcissus worshipping himself. Sheeeesh!!!!! All
that effort to esteem yourself is merely mental masturbation, for you
likely know yourself to be far from perfect and in no way a shining
example of rectitude worthy of emulation either by yourself nor by
others. Surely you can't be THAT conceited, or are you?
I'm sorry to hear that you suck so bad that you can't even emulate
yourself, Frankie. Why do you feel that you need to wear a badge
"Christian" to prove to others that you're a good boy? Didn't your real
father love you enough, you have to pretend that God loves you where
your daddy let you down?
You're not answering the question, Freddie!!! Do you or don't you think
you are the greatest since sliced bread and worthy to be the paradigm for
all who need an example to follow, including yourself?
.
|
|
|
| User: "Pastor Frank" |
|
| Title: Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
19 Dec 2005 10:02:07 PM |
|
|
"Fred Stone" <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message
news:Xns972AEFE6C71CAfstone69@213.155.197.138...
Why do you feel that you need to wear a badge "Christian" to prove to
others that you're a good boy? Didn't your real father love you enough,
you have to pretend that God loves you where your daddy let you down?
I am a Christian, because I believe in the definition of "good" Christ
gave us. Whose definitions of being / doing good do you accept? I bet it's
your own, so you can wriggle out of its obligations the more easily. Isn't
that true?
.
|
|
|
| User: "Fred Stone" |
|
| Title: Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
20 Dec 2005 01:07:50 AM |
|
|
"Pastor Frank" <PastorFrank@christfirst.edu> wrote in
news:1135029727.927f4b18785e1fec200cde1a15468e06@roc.usenetexchange.com:
"Fred Stone" <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message
news:Xns972AEFE6C71CAfstone69@213.155.197.138...
Why do you feel that you need to wear a badge "Christian" to prove to
others that you're a good boy? Didn't your real father love you
enough, you have to pretend that God loves you where your daddy let
you down?
I am a Christian, because I believe in the definition of "good"
Christ gave us.
And I'm sure you parade around with your cross so that everybody will
know that you're a good boy, right Frank?
Whose definitions of being / doing good do you accept?
I bet it's your own, so you can wriggle out of its obligations the
more easily. Isn't that true?
No, Frank, it's not true. I don't have some fairy tale "spirit" that I
can use to make excuses for me.
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
"I either want less corruption, or more chances to participate."
- Ashleigh Brilliant -
.
|
|
|
| User: "Pastor Frank" |
|
| Title: Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
20 Dec 2005 10:59:47 PM |
|
|
"Fred Stone" <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message
news:Xns9731CCF43BE54fstone69@213.155.197.138...
"Pastor Frank" <PastorFrank@christfirst.edu> wrote in
news:1135029727.927f4b18785e1fec200cde1a15468e06@roc.usenetexchange.com:
Whose definitions of being / doing good do you accept?
I bet it's your own, so you can wriggle out of its obligations the
more easily. Isn't that true?
No, Frank, it's not true. I don't have some fairy tale "spirit" that I
can use to make excuses for me.
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
Right!! You can make up all the rules AND all your excuses all by
yourself, hey Freddie?
Thanks for proving my point.
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| User: "Fred Stone" |
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| Title: Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
13 Dec 2005 04:33:57 AM |
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"Pastor Frank" <PastorFrank@christfirst.edu> wrote in
news:1134421203.d861ffea53a3864aa514f6cb3a643b90@roc.usenetexchange.com:
"Fred Stone" <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message
news:Xns9725B5DD5C814fstone69@213.155.197.138...
"Pastor Frank" <PastorFrank@christfirst.edu> wrote in
news:1133993113.79638d45f2ff61fb072ed021208b8487
@roc.usenetexchange.co
m:
"Fred Stone" <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message
news:Xns9723E4BE9D84Dfstone69@213.155.197.138...
"Pastor Frank" <PastorFrank@christfirst.edu> wrote in
news:1133837942.4c7327c272e3e9ee9aa5abe178d77010@fe5.teranews.com:
"Pramod Subramanyan" <pramod.sub@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1133681310.851663.108410@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Pastor Frank wrote:
"Virgil" <ITSnetNOTcom#virgil@COMCAST.com> wrote in message
news:ITSnetNOTcom%23virgil-4FD6A2.13554701122005
@comcast.dca.giganews
.com...
In article
<1133437519.89ed023cd69e57b7b3bfb8ded2746c71
@fe5.teranews.com>,
"Pastor Frank" <PastorFrank@christfirst.edu> wrote:
"Christopher A. Lee" <calee@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:bcujo1h9osgoi4lbh17dge7g01ihv0nel4@4ax.com...
On Sun, 27 Nov 2005 12:43:25 -0500, "Carl Rooker"
<rookerc@dnx.net> wrote:
God Bless
Spend eternity in your religion's hell, sanctimonious
hypocrite.
It's you Chris who is already in hell, for the main
activity of
those
there is screeching invective and gnash teeth furiously,
while we just keep on praising the Lord in all circumstances.
Your god must be a flaming egomaniac to need all that praise.
Wrong!!! It's not God who needs the praise. It's we who need
to
praise
and worship to be happy, for to be an atheist means to be
permanently critical, condemnatory, cynical, paranoid and
despairing. Atheists post from
the depth of their hell, we post from the glorious heights of
our heaven.
How do you come with these Unassailable Arguments?
Why, are an atheist who supports, advocates, affirms, praises
and
glorifies anything or anyone? Let's hear it then. Who is your
paradigm of rectitude, virtue and grace, whose expectations we
should make our own and seek to live up to?
"To thine own self be true".
Another atheists Narcissus worshipping himself. Sheeeesh!!!!! All
that effort to esteem yourself is merely mental masturbation, for
you likely know yourself to be far from perfect and in no way a
shining example of rectitude worthy of emulation either by yourself
nor by others. Surely you can't be THAT conceited, or are you?
I'm sorry to hear that you suck so bad that you can't even emulate
yourself, Frankie. Why do you feel that you need to wear a badge
"Christian" to prove to others that you're a good boy? Didn't your
real father love you enough, you have to pretend that God loves you
where your daddy let you down?
You're not answering the question, Freddie!!! Do you or don't you
think you are the greatest since sliced bread and worthy to be the
paradigm for all who need an example to follow, including yourself?
You're not answering the question, Frankie!
Why do you feel that you need to wear a badge "Christian" to prove to
others that you're a good boy? Didn't your real father love you enough,
you have to pretend that God loves you where your daddy let you down?
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
"I can say one thing about these plans of ours: They are not being
decided by the typewriter strategists who expound their views in the
press or on the radio." - FDR
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| User: "Pastor Frank" |
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| Title: Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
10 Dec 2005 01:58:37 PM |
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"Fred Stone" <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message
news:Xns9723E4BE9D84Dfstone69@213.155.197.138...
"Pastor Frank" <PastorFrank@christfirst.edu> wrote in
news:1133837942.4c7327c272e3e9ee9aa5abe178d77010@fe5.teranews.com:
"Pramod Subramanyan" <pramod.sub@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1133681310.851663.108410@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Pastor Frank wrote:
"Virgil" <ITSnetNOTcom#virgil@COMCAST.com> wrote in message
news:ITSnetNOTcom%23virgil-4FD6A2.13554701122005
@comcast.dca.giganews
.com...
In article
<1133437519.89ed023cd69e57b7b3bfb8ded2746c71@fe5.teranews.com>,
"Pastor Frank" <PastorFrank@christfirst.edu> wrote:
"Christopher A. Lee" <calee@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:bcujo1h9osgoi4lbh17dge7g01ihv0nel4@4ax.com...
On Sun, 27 Nov 2005 12:43:25 -0500, "Carl Rooker"
<rookerc@dnx.net> wrote:
God Bless
Spend eternity in your religion's hell, sanctimonious
hypocrite.
It's you Chris who is already in hell, for the main activity
of those
there is screeching invective and gnash teeth furiously, while we
just keep on praising the Lord in all circumstances.
Your god must be a flaming egomaniac to need all that praise.
Wrong!!! It's not God who needs the praise. It's we who need to
praise and worship to be happy, for to be an atheist means to be
permanently critical, condemnatory, cynical, paranoid and
despairing. Atheists post from
the depth of their hell, we post from the glorious heights of our
heaven.
How do you come with these Unassailable Arguments?
Why, are you an atheist who supports, advocates, affirms, praises
and glorifies anything or anyone? Let's hear it then. Who is your
paradigm
of rectitude, virtue and grace, whose expectations we should make our
own and seek to live up to?
"To thine own self be true".
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
Fred Stone, atheist number 1369, as the world's "paradigm of rectitude,
virtue and grace" we all should live up to? You sound like Lucifer, the very
pinnacle of God's creation, who went over the edge shouting: "And I shall
exalt myself above the highest heaven"!!!! If you are looking for him, he
fell into hell like lightening. There he still is, hating God, wailing
complaints and gnashing teeth angrily, for no one admires him when he knows
he is the best.
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| User: "Fred Stone" |
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| Title: Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
10 Dec 2005 02:12:41 PM |
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"Pastor Frank" <PastorFrank@christfirst.edu> wrote in
news:1134223117.f21b7b8ce295e7995746066ea2d47ded@roc.usenetexchange.com:
"Fred Stone" <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message
news:Xns9723E4BE9D84Dfstone69@213.155.197.138...
"Pastor Frank" <PastorFrank@christfirst.edu> wrote in
news:1133837942.4c7327c272e3e9ee9aa5abe178d77010@fe5.teranews.com:
"Pramod Subramanyan" <pramod.sub@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1133681310.851663.108410@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Pastor Frank wrote:
"Virgil" <ITSnetNOTcom#virgil@COMCAST.com> wrote in message
news:ITSnetNOTcom%23virgil-4FD6A2.13554701122005
@comcast.dca.giganews
.com...
In article
<1133437519.89ed023cd69e57b7b3bfb8ded2746c71@fe5.teranews.com>,
"Pastor Frank" <PastorFrank@christfirst.edu> wrote:
"Christopher A. Lee" <calee@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:bcujo1h9osgoi4lbh17dge7g01ihv0nel4@4ax.com...
On Sun, 27 Nov 2005 12:43:25 -0500, "Carl Rooker"
<rookerc@dnx.net> wrote:
God Bless
Spend eternity in your religion's hell, sanctimonious
hypocrite.
It's you Chris who is already in hell, for the main
activity of those
there is screeching invective and gnash teeth furiously, while
we just keep on praising the Lord in all circumstances.
Your god must be a flaming egomaniac to need all that praise.
Wrong!!! It's not God who needs the praise. It's we who need
to
praise and worship to be happy, for to be an atheist means to be
permanently critical, condemnatory, cynical, paranoid and
despairing. Atheists post from
the depth of their hell, we post from the glorious heights of our
heaven.
How do you come with these Unassailable Arguments?
Why, are you an atheist who supports, advocates, affirms,
praises
and glorifies anything or anyone? Let's hear it then. Who is your
paradigm
of rectitude, virtue and grace, whose expectations we should make
our own and seek to live up to?
"To thine own self be true".
Fred Stone, atheist number 1369, as the world's "paradigm of
rectitude, virtue and grace" we all should live up to?
They could do worse.
You sound like
Lucifer, the very pinnacle of God's creation, who went over the edge
shouting: "And I shall exalt myself above the highest heaven"!!!! If
you are looking for him, he fell into hell like lightening. There he
still is, hating God, wailing complaints and gnashing teeth angrily,
for no one admires him when he knows he is the best.
And heeeeere's Frank, who calls himself a Christian is so that other
people will admire him.
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
"The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's
just that they know so much that isn't so." - Ronald Reagan
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| User: "Bear" |
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| Title: Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
04 Dec 2005 07:31:50 AM |
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"Pramod Subramanyan" wrote
: "To be an atheist means to be permanently critical, condemnatory,
: cynical, paranoid and despairing.Atheists post from the depth of their
: hell, we post from the glorious heights of our heaven."
:
: How do you come with these Unassailable Arguments?
Don't you mean bald-faced lies?
--
Bear
There but for circumstances go I.
Being an atheist isn't a choice or act of will - like theism; it's a
consequence of what one knows and how one reasons.
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| User: "Pastor Frank" |
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| Title: Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
06 Dec 2005 02:59:05 AM |
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"Bear" <bigbear1wh@nativeweb.net> wrote in message
news:n_ydnaw3aJoYBg_eRVn-jQ@comcast.com...
"Pramod Subramanyan" wrote:
:
: "To be an atheist means to be permanently critical, condemnatory,
: cynical, paranoid and despairing.Atheists post from the depth of their
: hell, we post from the glorious heights of our heaven."
: How do you come with these Unassailable Arguments?
Don't you mean bald-faced lies?
LOL Thanks for proving my point.
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| User: "Pramod Subramanyan" |
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| Title: Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
04 Dec 2005 01:43:31 PM |
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Bear wrote:
"Pramod Subramanyan" wrote
: "To be an atheist means to be permanently critical, condemnatory,
: cynical, paranoid and despairing.Atheists post from the depth of their
: hell, we post from the glorious heights of our heaven."
:
: How do you come with these Unassailable Arguments?
Don't you mean bald-faced lies?
The way he says it, I'm fairly certain he thinks they are Unassailable
Arguments.
What the rest of the world thinks, now THAT is a wholly different
matter.
--
Bear
There but for circumstances go I.
Being an atheist isn't a choice or act of will - like theism; it's a
consequence of what one knows and how one reasons.
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| User: "Bill Gamelson" |
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| Title: Re: INTELLIGENT DESIGN? |
27 Nov 2005 06:45:49 PM |
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"Christopher A. Lee" <calee@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:bcujo1h9osgoi4lbh17dge7g01ihv0nel4@4ax.com...
On Sun, 27 Nov 2005 12:43:25 -0500, "Carl Rooker" <rookerc@dnx.net>
wrote:
And what of Christ's suffering? It wasn't, as described, anything too
all bad when compared to the suffering inflicted upon some of the
victims of the Inquisition, or worse, the suffering of those who lived
for days and months after being horribly burned by the atom bombs
dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki for instance.
That is one of the most ignorant, crule and most stupid comment I have ever
heard in my entire life. Jesus had to feel every single emotion that man
would ever feel, and he had to feel it harder than any man would ever feel
it for him to be able to say "I paid your price."
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