| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"MsAnthrope" |
| Date: |
03 Feb 2005 08:41:57 AM |
| Object: |
Re: Is Anyone Here an ADVENTIST?! |
In article <1107423912.431243.254020@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>, Orion7
says...
Don't you know evolution is a farce? You are obviously a product of the
brain washing which goes on in our Schools, Colleges and Universities.
I have seen the desperate lengths these Professors and Scientists go to
make people believe in evolution, even fabricating evidence to support
their unsupportable theories.
1st Rule of Creationism: Ignored evidence will go away
2nd Rule of Creationism: Interpret any challenge as personal insult
3rd Rule of Creationism: Claim evidence then quietly slip away
4th Rule of Creationism: Don't be confused by facts
5th Rule of Creationism: Insist that science ignores your proof
6th Rule of Creationism: Claim superiority for Christian education.
7th Rule of Creationism: Always appear to know more than you do.
8th Rule of Creationism: Shift the burden of proof to your critics.
9th Rule of Creationism: Lying for the Lord is okay.
10th Rule of Creationism: Never acknowledge your demonstrated errors
--
MsAnthrope
http://web.newsguy.com/rubyred
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| User: "Don Kresch" |
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| Title: Re: Objective Evidence |
04 Feb 2005 07:17:27 AM |
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In alt.atheism on Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:34:55 -0800, "Andrew"
<andrew.321remov@usa.net> let us all know that:
"Al Klein" wrote in message news:d4l501lrudpteub8rbhovgag8gp19v06c9@4ax.com...
"Orion7" said in alt.atheism:
The fool is wrong. God is real.
Objective evidence?
--
Tell me Al....where is the *objective evidence* that life came from nonliving
chemicals which came from a primeval explosion which came from nothing.
Tell me, Andrew, if life can only come from life, and god is
alive, where did god come from? No, god can't always have been--that
would be contrary to the notion that life can only come from life, and
you would be a hypocrite for positing it.
Don
---
aa #51, Knight of BAAWA, DNRC o-, Member of the [H]orde
Atheist Minister for St. Dogbert.
"No being is so important that he can usurp the rights of another"
Picard to Data/Graves "The Schizoid Man"
.
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| User: "Andrew" |
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| Title: Re: Objective Evidence |
04 Feb 2005 12:14:24 PM |
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"Don Kresch" wrote in message news:ldt601t4hae06482ujtquqafk1o7nri6i6@4ax.com...
"Andrew" let us all know that:
Tell me Al....where is the *objective evidence* that life came from nonliving
chemicals which came from a primeval explosion which came from nothing.
Tell me, Andrew, if life can only come from life, and god is
alive, where did god come from? No, god can't always have been--that
would be contrary to the notion that life can only come from life, and
you would be a hypocrite for positing it.
Don
---
Although humans are unable to comprehend eternity and God...the fact
remains that life comes only from preexisting life. That is an established
law of science.
FROG BECOMES PRINCE = FAIRY TALE
FROG BECOMES MAN THROUGH EVOLUTION = HOAX
.
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| User: "snex" |
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| Title: Re: Objective Evidence |
04 Feb 2005 12:17:28 PM |
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Andrew wrote:
"Don Kresch" wrote in message
news:ldt601t4hae06482ujtquqafk1o7nri6i6@4ax.com...
"Andrew" let us all know that:
Tell me Al....where is the *objective evidence* that life came
from nonliving
chemicals which came from a primeval explosion which came from
nothing.
Tell me, Andrew, if life can only come from life, and god is
alive, where did god come from? No, god can't always have
been--that
would be contrary to the notion that life can only come from life,
and
you would be a hypocrite for positing it.
Don
---
Although humans are unable to comprehend eternity and God...the fact
remains that life comes only from preexisting life. That is an
established
law of science.
FROG BECOMES PRINCE = FAIRY TALE
FROG BECOMES MAN THROUGH EVOLUTION = HOAX
you did not address the question. if life only comes from preexisting
life, then god must come from preexisting life as well. to say
otherwise is special pleading and causes your initial premise to fail.
.
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| User: "Mike Painter" |
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| Title: Re: Objective Evidence |
04 Feb 2005 04:11:56 PM |
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Andrew wrote:
"Don Kresch" wrote in message
news:ldt601t4hae06482ujtquqafk1o7nri6i6@4ax.com...
"Andrew" let us all know that:
Tell me Al....where is the *objective evidence* that life came from
nonliving chemicals which came from a primeval explosion which came
from nothing.
Tell me, Andrew, if life can only come from life, and god is
alive, where did god come from? No, god can't always have been--that
would be contrary to the notion that life can only come from life,
and you would be a hypocrite for positing it.
Don
---
Although humans are unable to comprehend eternity and God...the fact
remains that life comes only from preexisting life. That is an
established
law of science.
Interesting. Here's a man who, if he has more than five coins in his hand,
can't tell how many there are without counting and he claims to comprehend
eternity AND god.
.
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| User: "Andrew" |
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| Title: Re: Objective Evidence |
04 Feb 2005 08:44:47 PM |
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"Mike Painter" wrote in message news:MqSMd.533$lz5.296@newssvr24.news.prodigy.net...
Andrew wrote:
"Don Kresch" wrote:
"Andrew" let us all know that:
Tell me Al....where is the *objective evidence* that life came from
nonliving chemicals which came from a primeval explosion which came
from nothing.
Tell me, Andrew, if life can only come from life, and god is
alive, where did god come from? No, god can't always have been--that
would be contrary to the notion that life can only come from life,
and you would be a hypocrite for positing it.
Don
---
Although humans are unable to comprehend eternity and God...the fact
remains that life comes only from preexisting life. That is an established
law of science.
Interesting. Here's a man who, if he has more than five coins in his hand,
can't tell how many there are without counting and he claims to comprehend
eternity AND god.
No, rather I said......."humans are unable to comprehend eternity and God"
.
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| User: "snex" |
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| Title: Re: Objective Evidence |
05 Feb 2005 08:54:55 AM |
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Andrew wrote:
"Mike Painter" wrote in message
news:MqSMd.533$lz5.296@newssvr24.news.prodigy.net...
Andrew wrote:
"Don Kresch" wrote:
"Andrew" let us all know that:
Tell me Al....where is the *objective evidence* that life came
from
nonliving chemicals which came from a primeval explosion which
came
from nothing.
Tell me, Andrew, if life can only come from life, and god is
alive, where did god come from? No, god can't always have
been--that
would be contrary to the notion that life can only come from
life,
and you would be a hypocrite for positing it.
Don
---
Although humans are unable to comprehend eternity and God...the
fact
remains that life comes only from preexisting life. That is an
established
law of science.
Interesting. Here's a man who, if he has more than five coins in
his hand,
can't tell how many there are without counting and he claims to
comprehend
eternity AND god.
No, rather I said......."humans are unable to comprehend eternity and
God"
then in what sense can you actually believe in them?
.
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| User: "Mike Painter" |
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| Title: Re: Objective Evidence |
05 Feb 2005 04:18:23 PM |
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Andrew wrote:
"Mike Painter" wrote in message
news:MqSMd.533$lz5.296@newssvr24.news.prodigy.net...
Andrew wrote:
"Don Kresch" wrote:
"Andrew" let us all know that:
Tell me Al....where is the *objective evidence* that life came
from nonliving chemicals which came from a primeval explosion
which came from nothing.
Tell me, Andrew, if life can only come from life, and god is
alive, where did god come from? No, god can't always have
been--that would be contrary to the notion that life can only come
from life, and you would be a hypocrite for positing it.
Don
---
Although humans are unable to comprehend eternity and God...the fact
remains that life comes only from preexisting life. That is an
established law of science.
Interesting. Here's a man who, if he has more than five coins in his
hand, can't tell how many there are without counting and he claims
to comprehend eternity AND god.
No, rather I said......."humans are unable to comprehend eternity and
God"
My mistake. Sadly it puts more of a burden on you than your original claim.
it should also be pointed out that there is no relation between the first
and last part of the sentence.
it's like saying the sky is blue but the fact remains that today is
Saturday.
There is no established law of science that states this, in fact just the
opposite is claimed.
.
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| User: "Don Kresch" |
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| Title: Re: Objective Evidence |
07 Feb 2005 07:53:55 PM |
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In alt.atheism on Fri, 4 Feb 2005 18:44:47 -0800, "Andrew"
<andrew.321remov@usa.net> let us all know that:
"Mike Painter" wrote in message news:MqSMd.533$lz5.296@newssvr24.news.prodigy.net...
Andrew wrote:
"Don Kresch" wrote:
"Andrew" let us all know that:
Tell me Al....where is the *objective evidence* that life came from
nonliving chemicals which came from a primeval explosion which came
from nothing.
Tell me, Andrew, if life can only come from life, and god is
alive, where did god come from? No, god can't always have been--that
would be contrary to the notion that life can only come from life,
and you would be a hypocrite for positing it.
Although humans are unable to comprehend eternity and God...the fact
remains that life comes only from preexisting life. That is an established
law of science.
Interesting. Here's a man who, if he has more than five coins in his hand,
can't tell how many there are without counting and he claims to comprehend
eternity AND god.
No, rather I said......."humans are unable to comprehend eternity and God"
Eternity isn't a place, and if you don't comprehend god, how is
it that you can talk about god and evidence for god? Isn't that just
slitting your own epistemic (big word--look it up, Andrew) throat?
Don
---
aa #51, Knight of BAAWA, DNRC o-, Member of the [H]orde
Atheist Minister for St. Dogbert.
"No being is so important that he can usurp the rights of another"
Picard to Data/Graves "The Schizoid Man"
.
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| User: "Jos Flachs" |
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| Title: Re: Objective Evidence |
05 Feb 2005 06:01:17 PM |
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On Fri, 4 Feb 2005 18:44:47 -0800, "Andrew" <andrew.321remov@usa.net>
wrote:
No, rather I said......."humans are unable to comprehend eternity and God"
Do tell me Andrew, did you get the first price in the stupid contest?
Or graduated with honors as village idiot?
.
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| User: "jesshc" |
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| Title: Re: Objective Evidence |
04 Feb 2005 03:14:25 PM |
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Andrew wrote:
Although humans are unable to comprehend eternity and God...the fact
remains that life comes only from preexisting life. That is an
established
law of science.
Really? Where is *that* written down?
FROG BECOMES PRINCE = FAIRY TALE
FROG BECOMES MAN THROUGH EVOLUTION = HOAX
GOD BECOMES HIS OWN SON, "DIES," GOES BACK TO BEING DAD = HALLUCINATION
.
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| User: "Don Kresch" |
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| Title: Re: Objective Evidence |
04 Feb 2005 04:42:14 PM |
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In alt.atheism on Fri, 4 Feb 2005 10:14:24 -0800, "Andrew"
<andrew.321remov@usa.net> let us all know that:
"Don Kresch" wrote in message news:ldt601t4hae06482ujtquqafk1o7nri6i6@4ax.com...
"Andrew" let us all know that:
Tell me Al....where is the *objective evidence* that life came from nonliving
chemicals which came from a primeval explosion which came from nothing.
Tell me, Andrew, if life can only come from life, and god is
alive, where did god come from? No, god can't always have been--that
would be contrary to the notion that life can only come from life, and
you would be a hypocrite for positing it.
Don
---
Although humans are unable to comprehend eternity
Ad hoc cop-out. Rejected.
and God...the fact
remains that life comes only from preexisting life.
Then where did god come from?
Don
---
aa #51, Knight of BAAWA, DNRC o-, Member of the [H]orde
Atheist Minister for St. Dogbert.
"No being is so important that he can usurp the rights of another"
Picard to Data/Graves "The Schizoid Man"
.
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| User: "Andrew" |
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| Title: Re: Objective Evidence |
04 Feb 2005 08:54:21 PM |
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"Don Kresch" <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote in message news:rtu701187bfh8ld3shncn74j4iro3dscps@4ax.com...
In alt.atheism on Fri, 4 Feb 2005 10:14:24 -0800, "Andrew"
<andrew.321remov@usa.net> let us all know that:
"Don Kresch" wrote in message news:ldt601t4hae06482ujtquqafk1o7nri6i6@4ax.com...
"Andrew" let us all know that:
Tell me Al....where is the *objective evidence* that life came from nonliving
chemicals which came from a primeval explosion which came from nothing.
Tell me, Andrew, if life can only come from life, and god is
alive, where did god come from? No, god can't always have been--that
would be contrary to the notion that life can only come from life, and
you would be a hypocrite for positing it.
Don
---
Although humans are unable to comprehend eternity
Ad hoc cop-out. Rejected.
and God...the fact
remains that life comes only from preexisting life.
Then where did god come from?
That would be like an ant asking where did you come from.
"Before the mountains were brought forth,
Or ever You had formed the earth and the world,
Even from everlasting to everlasting, You are God."
~ Psalms 90:2 ~
.
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| User: "Rev. Karl E. Taylor" |
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| Title: Re: Objective Evidence |
04 Feb 2005 09:22:51 PM |
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Andrew wrote:
"Don Kresch" <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote in message news:rtu701187bfh8ld3shncn74j4iro3dscps@4ax.com...
In alt.atheism on Fri, 4 Feb 2005 10:14:24 -0800, "Andrew"
<andrew.321remov@usa.net> let us all know that:
"Don Kresch" wrote in message news:ldt601t4hae06482ujtquqafk1o7nri6i6@4ax.com...
"Andrew" let us all know that:
Tell me Al....where is the *objective evidence* that life came from nonliving
chemicals which came from a primeval explosion which came from nothing.
Tell me, Andrew, if life can only come from life, and god is
alive, where did god come from? No, god can't always have been--that
would be contrary to the notion that life can only come from life, and
you would be a hypocrite for positing it.
Don
---
Although humans are unable to comprehend eternity
Ad hoc cop-out. Rejected.
and God...the fact
remains that life comes only from preexisting life.
Then where did god come from?
That would be like an ant asking where did you come from.
Well, since all humans come from the mating action of a man and a woman,
that begs the question:
Who was gods mother and father?
--
There are none more ignorant and useless,
than they that seek answers on their knees,
with their eyes closed.
____________________________________________________________________
Rev. Karl E. Taylor
A.A #1143 PLONKED by Bob
Apostle of Dr. Lao EAC: Virgin Conversion Unit Director
____________________________________________________________________
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| User: "MsAnthrope" |
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| Title: Re: Objective Evidence |
04 Feb 2005 10:10:27 PM |
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On Fri, 04 Feb 2005 20:22:51 -0700, "Rev. Karl E. Taylor"
<ktayloraz@getnet.net> wrote:
Well, since all humans come from the mating action of a man and a woman,
that begs the question:
Who was gods mother and father?
That's not fair, you're supposed to require parentage only until you
get to the desired goal (God) then you stop.
--
MsAnthrope
http://web.newsguy.com/rubyred
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| User: "Don Kresch" |
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| Title: Re: Objective Evidence |
04 Feb 2005 11:07:02 PM |
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In alt.atheism on Fri, 4 Feb 2005 18:54:21 -0800, "Andrew"
<andrew.321remov@usa.net> let us all know that:
"Don Kresch" <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote in message news:rtu701187bfh8ld3shncn74j4iro3dscps@4ax.com...
In alt.atheism on Fri, 4 Feb 2005 10:14:24 -0800, "Andrew"
<andrew.321remov@usa.net> let us all know that:
"Don Kresch" wrote in message news:ldt601t4hae06482ujtquqafk1o7nri6i6@4ax.com...
"Andrew" let us all know that:
Tell me Al....where is the *objective evidence* that life came from nonliving
chemicals which came from a primeval explosion which came from nothing.
Tell me, Andrew, if life can only come from life, and god is
alive, where did god come from? No, god can't always have been--that
would be contrary to the notion that life can only come from life, and
you would be a hypocrite for positing it.
Don
---
Although humans are unable to comprehend eternity
Ad hoc cop-out. Rejected.
and God...the fact
remains that life comes only from preexisting life.
Then where did god come from?
That would be like an ant asking where did you come from.
Where did god come from?
Don
---
aa #51, Knight of BAAWA, DNRC o-, Member of the [H]orde
Atheist Minister for St. Dogbert.
"No being is so important that he can usurp the rights of another"
Picard to Data/Graves "The Schizoid Man"
.
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| User: "Al Klein" |
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| Title: Re: Objective Evidence |
06 Feb 2005 09:04:19 PM |
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On Fri, 4 Feb 2005 18:54:21 -0800, "Andrew" <andrew.321remov@usa.net>
said in alt.atheism:
"Don Kresch" <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote in message news:rtu701187bfh8ld3shncn74j4iro3dscps@4ax.com...
Then where did god come from?
That would be like an ant asking where did you come from.
No clue, eh?
--
"I can't activate two neurons simultaneously, and I vote"
- The theistic majority
(random sig, produced by SigChanger)
rukbat at verizon dot net
.
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| User: "Jos Flachs" |
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| Title: Re: Objective Evidence |
05 Feb 2005 06:01:23 PM |
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On Fri, 4 Feb 2005 18:54:21 -0800, "Andrew" <andrew.321remov@usa.net>
wrote:
Then where did god come from?
That would be like an ant asking where did you come from.
We do ask an ant: you. Were did your three gods come from?
.
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| User: "Dubh Ghall" |
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| Title: Re: Objective Evidence |
05 Feb 2005 02:25:12 AM |
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On Fri, 4 Feb 2005 18:54:21 -0800, "Andrew" <andrew.321remov@usa.net> wrote:
"Don Kresch" <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote in message news:rtu701187bfh8ld3shncn74j4iro3dscps@4ax.com...
In alt.atheism on Fri, 4 Feb 2005 10:14:24 -0800, "Andrew"
<andrew.321remov@usa.net> let us all know that:
"Don Kresch" wrote in message news:ldt601t4hae06482ujtquqafk1o7nri6i6@4ax.com...
"Andrew" let us all know that:
Tell me Al....where is the *objective evidence* that life came from nonliving
chemicals which came from a primeval explosion which came from nothing.
Tell me, Andrew, if life can only come from life, and god is
alive, where did god come from? No, god can't always have been--that
would be contrary to the notion that life can only come from life, and
you would be a hypocrite for positing it.
Don
---
Although humans are unable to comprehend eternity
Ad hoc cop-out. Rejected.
and God...the fact
remains that life comes only from preexisting life.
Then where did god come from?
That would be like an ant asking where did you come from.
Irrelevant: Answer the question.
Or admit that you are talking through your arse.
--
Puck Greenman
The spelling Like any opinion stated here
purely my own
#162 BAAWA Knight.
Plonked by Rob Duncan
January 27th
Na bister 500,000
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| User: "snex" |
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| Title: Re: Objective Evidence |
04 Feb 2005 09:46:16 PM |
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Andrew wrote:
"Don Kresch" <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote in message
news:rtu701187bfh8ld3shncn74j4iro3dscps@4ax.com...
In alt.atheism on Fri, 4 Feb 2005 10:14:24 -0800, "Andrew"
<andrew.321remov@usa.net> let us all know that:
"Don Kresch" wrote in message
news:ldt601t4hae06482ujtquqafk1o7nri6i6@4ax.com...
"Andrew" let us all know that:
Tell me Al....where is the *objective evidence* that life came
from nonliving
chemicals which came from a primeval explosion which came from
nothing.
Tell me, Andrew, if life can only come from life, and god is
alive, where did god come from? No, god can't always have
been--that
would be contrary to the notion that life can only come from
life, and
you would be a hypocrite for positing it.
Don
---
Although humans are unable to comprehend eternity
Ad hoc cop-out. Rejected.
and God...the fact
remains that life comes only from preexisting life.
Then where did god come from?
That would be like an ant asking where did you come from.
"Before the mountains were brought forth,
Or ever You had formed the earth and the world,
Even from everlasting to everlasting, You are God."
~ Psalms 90:2 ~
once again, you miss the point completely. your assertion is that life
only comes from life. if this is true, then god must have come from
life. if god did not come from life, then your original assertion
fails, and life can come from non-life.
.
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| User: "Cary Kittrell" |
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| Title: Re: Objective Evidence |
04 Feb 2005 12:24:27 PM |
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In article <36hsbtF528ja7U1@individual.net> "Andrew" <andrew.321remov@usa.net> writes:
"Don Kresch" wrote in message news:ldt601t4hae06482ujtquqafk1o7nri6i6@4ax.com...
"Andrew" let us all know that:
Tell me Al....where is the *objective evidence* that life came from nonliving
chemicals which came from a primeval explosion which came from nothing.
Tell me, Andrew, if life can only come from life, and god is
alive, where did god come from? No, god can't always have been--that
would be contrary to the notion that life can only come from life, and
you would be a hypocrite for positing it.
Don
---
Although humans are unable to comprehend eternity and God...the fact
remains that life comes only from preexisting life. That is an established
law of science.
There is no such "established law of science". If there were, why
do you think that an increasing number of biologists are beginning
to dabble in the problem of the origin of life on this planet?
There WERE a fairly famous series of experiments aimed at ending
the debate, current at one time, over whether complex life was
constantly arising all around this -- mice from dirty underwear,
bacteria in sealed flasks of broth, maggots spontaneously arising
in rotting meat, things like that. The proponents of the
idea that this sort of thing does not happen won the debate.
That's a far cry from establishing some law that life always comes
from pre-existing life -- and always has.
FROG BECOMES PRINCE = FAIRY TALE
FROG BECOMES MAN THROUGH EVOLUTION = HOAX
No, not a hoax: ignorance. No biologist claims that
humans descended from frogs.
-- cary
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| User: "Andrew" |
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| Title: Re: Objective Evidence |
04 Feb 2005 03:24:52 PM |
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"Cary Kittrell" wrote in message news:cu0ekr$dpl$1@onion.ccit.arizona.edu...
"Andrew" writes:
"Don Kresch" wrote:
"Andrew" let us all know that:
Tell me Al....where is the *objective evidence* that life came from nonliving
chemicals which came from a primeval explosion which came from nothing.
Tell me, Andrew, if life can only come from life, and god is
alive, where did god come from? No, god can't always have been--that
would be contrary to the notion that life can only come from life, and
you would be a hypocrite for positing it.
Don
---
Although humans are unable to comprehend eternity and God...the fact
remains that life comes only from preexisting life. That is an established
law of science.
There is no such "established law of science".
It is The Law of Biogenesis...discoverd by Louis Pasteur. It IS a law of science.
If there were, why do you think that an increasing number of biologists are beginning
to dabble in the problem of the origin of life on this planet?
That's because it is untenable for them to accept the concept of a Creator.
There WERE a fairly famous series of experiments aimed at ending
the debate, current at one time, over whether complex life was
constantly arising all around this -- mice from dirty underwear,
bacteria in sealed flasks of broth, maggots spontaneously arising
in rotting meat, things like that. The proponents of the
idea that this sort of thing does not happen won the debate.
That's a far cry from establishing some law that life always comes
from pre-existing life -- and always has.
OK, but it has never been demonstrated to be OR could be otherwise.
FROG BECOMES PRINCE = FAIRY TALE
FROG BECOMES MAN THROUGH EVOLUTION = HOAX
No, not a hoax: ignorance. No biologist claims that
humans descended from frogs.
OK, *primordial soup*. It is STILL A HOAX.
-- cary
Andrew
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| User: "snex" |
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| Title: Re: Objective Evidence |
04 Feb 2005 03:30:31 PM |
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Andrew wrote:
"Cary Kittrell" wrote in message
news:cu0ekr$dpl$1@onion.ccit.arizona.edu...
"Andrew" writes:
"Don Kresch" wrote:
"Andrew" let us all know that:
Tell me Al....where is the *objective evidence* that life came
from nonliving
chemicals which came from a primeval explosion which came from
nothing.
Tell me, Andrew, if life can only come from life, and god is
alive, where did god come from? No, god can't always have
been--that
would be contrary to the notion that life can only come from
life, and
you would be a hypocrite for positing it.
Don
---
Although humans are unable to comprehend eternity and God...the
fact
remains that life comes only from preexisting life. That is an
established
law of science.
There is no such "established law of science".
It is The Law of Biogenesis...discoverd by Louis Pasteur. It IS a
law of science.
and it does not apply to single celled organisms or even simpler
replicators. it applies to plants and animals.
If there were, why do you think that an increasing number of
biologists are beginning
to dabble in the problem of the origin of life on this planet?
That's because it is untenable for them to accept the concept of a
Creator.
wrong again. many in fact DO believe in god, and they see it as
discovering how he created. you seem to be content to just accept magic
as the answer.
There WERE a fairly famous series of experiments aimed at ending
the debate, current at one time, over whether complex life was
constantly arising all around this -- mice from dirty underwear,
bacteria in sealed flasks of broth, maggots spontaneously arising
in rotting meat, things like that. The proponents of the
idea that this sort of thing does not happen won the debate.
That's a far cry from establishing some law that life always comes
from pre-existing life -- and always has.
OK, but it has never been demonstrated to be OR could be otherwise.
it has never been demonstrated that a man could rise from the dead or
that a virgin could give birth.
FROG BECOMES PRINCE = FAIRY TALE
FROG BECOMES MAN THROUGH EVOLUTION = HOAX
No, not a hoax: ignorance. No biologist claims that
humans descended from frogs.
OK, *primordial soup*. It is STILL A HOAX.
you obviously do not know what a hoax is. a hoax is a deliberate
attempt to fool people, such as the shroud of turin or the james
ossuary.
-- cary
Andrew
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| User: "Don Kresch" |
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| Title: Re: Objective Evidence |
04 Feb 2005 04:43:01 PM |
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In alt.atheism on Fri, 4 Feb 2005 13:24:52 -0800, "Andrew"
<andrew.321remov@usa.net> let us all know that:
"Cary Kittrell" wrote in message news:cu0ekr$dpl$1@onion.ccit.arizona.edu...
"Andrew" writes:
"Don Kresch" wrote:
"Andrew" let us all know that:
Tell me Al....where is the *objective evidence* that life came from nonliving
chemicals which came from a primeval explosion which came from nothing.
Tell me, Andrew, if life can only come from life, and god is
alive, where did god come from? No, god can't always have been--that
would be contrary to the notion that life can only come from life, and
you would be a hypocrite for positing it.
Don
---
Although humans are unable to comprehend eternity and God...the fact
remains that life comes only from preexisting life. That is an established
law of science.
There is no such "established law of science".
It is The Law of Biogenesis
There is no such law.
Find me any high school or college biology textbook that lists
it, please.
Oh, that's right--you can't. It doesn't exist. It's an invention
of the fundy xers.
Don
---
aa #51, Knight of BAAWA, DNRC o-, Member of the [H]orde
Atheist Minister for St. Dogbert.
"No being is so important that he can usurp the rights of another"
Picard to Data/Graves "The Schizoid Man"
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| User: "Andrew" |
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| Title: Re: Objective Evidence |
04 Feb 2005 08:38:50 PM |
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"Don Kresch" wrote in message news:6vu7015q8iijt04jionq75sl03c0n5t68g@4ax.com...
"Andrew" let us all know that:
"Cary Kittrell" wrote:
"Andrew" writes:
"Don Kresch" wrote:
"Andrew" let us all know that:
Tell me Al....where is the *objective evidence* that life came from nonliving
chemicals which came from a primeval explosion which came from nothing.
Tell me, Andrew, if life can only come from life, and god is
alive, where did god come from? No, god can't always have been--that
would be contrary to the notion that life can only come from life, and
you would be a hypocrite for positing it.
Don
---
Although humans are unable to comprehend eternity and God...the fact
remains that life comes only from preexisting life. That is an established
law of science.
There is no such "established law of science".
It is The Law of Biogenesis
There is no such law.
Find me any high school or college biology textbook that lists
it, please.
Biology: A Search for Order in Complexity
Moore and Slusher
"Historically the point of view that life comes only from life has been so
well established through the facts revealed by experiment that it is called
the Law of Biogenesis."
footnote: "Some philosophers call this a principle instead of a law, but this
is a matter of definition, and definitions are arbitrary. Some scientists call
this a superlaw, or a law about laws. Regardless of terminology, biogenesis
has the highest rank in these levels of generalization" (1974, p. 74)
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| User: "Mark Stahl" |
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| Title: Re: Objective Evidence |
07 Feb 2005 09:56:28 PM |
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"Andrew" <andrew.321remov@usa.net> wrote in message
news:36iptnF4t9ntrU1@individual.net...
"Don Kresch" wrote in message
news:6vu7015q8iijt04jionq75sl03c0n5t68g@4ax.com...
"Andrew" let us all know that:
"Cary Kittrell" wrote:
"Andrew" writes:
"Don Kresch" wrote:
"Andrew" let us all know that:
Tell me Al....where is the *objective evidence* that life came
from nonliving
chemicals which came from a primeval explosion which came from
nothing.
Tell me, Andrew, if life can only come from life, and god is
alive, where did god come from? No, god can't always have
been--that
would be contrary to the notion that life can only come from life,
and
you would be a hypocrite for positing it.
Don
---
Although humans are unable to comprehend eternity and God...the fact
remains that life comes only from preexisting life. That is an
established
law of science.
There is no such "established law of science".
It is The Law of Biogenesis
There is no such law.
Find me any high school or college biology textbook that lists
it, please.
Biology: A Search for Order in Complexity
Moore and Slusher
"Historically the point of view that life comes only from life has been so
well established through the facts revealed by experiment that it is
called
the Law of Biogenesis."
footnote: "Some philosophers call this a principle instead of a law, but
this
is a matter of definition, and definitions are arbitrary. Some scientists
call
this a superlaw, or a law about laws. Regardless of terminology,
biogenesis
has the highest rank in these levels of generalization" (1974, p. 74)
Andrew-
You're making a silly and obviously losing argument based on an incomplete
reading of what Pasteur found. Pasteur's "law" concerns what is happening
now: that life now comes from previously existing life, not from nonlife.
IOW, there is no spontaneous generation of complex organisms like maggots
from garbage. But that "law" was never meant to, and doesn't, apply to a
situation where there is no previously existing life. Obviously, it arose at
some point; how can you claim otherwise?
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| User: "Andrew" |
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| Title: Re: Objective Evidence |
07 Feb 2005 11:18:22 PM |
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"Mark Stahl" wrote in message news:DeCdnRxhSf6xqpXfRVn-ug@giganews.com...
"Andrew" wrote:
"Don Kresch" wrote:
"Andrew" let us all know that:
"Cary Kittrell" wrote:
"Andrew" writes:
"Don Kresch" wrote:
"Andrew" let us all know that:
Tell me Al....where is the *objective evidence* that life came
from nonliving
chemicals which came from a primeval explosion which came from
nothing.
Tell me, Andrew, if life can only come from life, and god is
alive, where did god come from? No, god can't always have
been--that
would be contrary to the notion that life can only come from life,
and
you would be a hypocrite for positing it.
Don
---
Although humans are unable to comprehend eternity and God...the fact
remains that life comes only from preexisting life. That is an
established
law of science.
There is no such "established law of science".
It is The Law of Biogenesis
There is no such law.
Find me any high school or college biology textbook that lists
it, please.
Biology: A Search for Order in Complexity
Moore and Slusher
"Historically the point of view that life comes only from life has been so
well established through the facts revealed by experiment that it is called
the Law of Biogenesis."
footnote: "Some philosophers call this a principle instead of a law, but this
is a matter of definition, and definitions are arbitrary. Some scientists call
this a superlaw, or a law about laws. Regardless of terminology,biogenesis
has the highest rank in these levels of generalization" (1974, p. 74)
Andrew-
You're making a silly and obviously losing argument based on an incomplete
reading of what Pasteur found. Pasteur's "law" concerns what is happening
now: that life now comes from previously existing life, not from nonlife.
IOW, there is no spontaneous generation of complex organisms like maggots
from garbage. But that "law" was never meant to, and doesn't, apply to a
situation where there is no previously existing life.
It has never been demonstrated that life can arise spontaneously from non living
chemicals. You may present theories,but they are unproven and also contrary to
common sense when you consider what we now know about the complexity of
a simply living cell, which has the intricacy of a city with its communication and
transportation and other systems..plus with the ability to copy (reproduce) itself.
The idea that the cell originated as a result of a primordial coincidence remains a
fanciful speculation and as I have said, a grand Hoax. .Furthermore, even if you
had a whole soup of these "primordial cells" going.....there is no mechanism for
them to evolve,change into the life we see today. It did not happen...it is a hoax.
Andrew
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| User: "Mark Stahl" |
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| Title: Re: Objective Evidence |
08 Feb 2005 07:00:58 PM |
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"Andrew" <andrew.321remov@usa.net> wrote in message
news:36r0cvF54hstaU1@individual.net...
"Mark Stahl" wrote in message news:DeCdnRxhSf6xqpXfRVn-ug@giganews.com...
"Andrew" wrote:
"Don Kresch" wrote:
"Andrew" let us all know that:
"Cary Kittrell" wrote:
"Andrew" writes:
"Don Kresch" wrote:
"Andrew" let us all know that:
Tell me Al....where is the *objective evidence* that life came
from nonliving
chemicals which came from a primeval explosion which came from
nothing.
Tell me, Andrew, if life can only come from life, and god is
alive, where did god come from? No, god can't always have
been--that
would be contrary to the notion that life can only come from
life,
and
you would be a hypocrite for positing it.
Don
---
Although humans are unable to comprehend eternity and God...the
fact
remains that life comes only from preexisting life. That is an
established
law of science.
There is no such "established law of science".
It is The Law of Biogenesis
There is no such law.
Find me any high school or college biology textbook that lists
it, please.
Biology: A Search for Order in Complexity
Moore and Slusher
"Historically the point of view that life comes only from life has been
so
well established through the facts revealed by experiment that it is
called
the Law of Biogenesis."
footnote: "Some philosophers call this a principle instead of a law,
but this
is a matter of definition, and definitions are arbitrary. Some
scientists call
this a superlaw, or a law about laws. Regardless of
terminology,biogenesis
has the highest rank in these levels of generalization" (1974, p. 74)
Andrew-
You're making a silly and obviously losing argument based on an
incomplete
reading of what Pasteur found. Pasteur's "law" concerns what is happening
now: that life now comes from previously existing life, not from nonlife.
IOW, there is no spontaneous generation of complex organisms like maggots
from garbage. But that "law" was never meant to, and doesn't, apply to a
situation where there is no previously existing life.
It has never been demonstrated that life can arise spontaneously from non
living
chemicals.
It has been demonstrated that organic material can arise spontaneously from
inorganic material, however. It has also been demonstrated that polymers of
those chemicals can spontaneously self-replicate. It is only a matter of
time and, frankly, desire before simple forms of what can only be called
life will be shown to be able to do just this. There are no known
theoretical barriers to this happening. Then what will your argument be?
You may present theories,but they are unproven
Many theories remain unproven; nevertheless their likelihood of being
correct is considered to be high. What do you present as the alternative?
and also contrary to
common sense
Hardly... in fact, mainstream theories of abiogenesis make perfect sense.
when you consider what we now know about the complexity of
a simply living cell, which has the intricacy of a city with its
communication and
transportation and other systems..plus with the ability to copy
(reproduce) itself.
Not when you consider what *I* know.... that may be the case for your more
limited knowledge. In that case, why not just do some research?
The idea that the cell originated as a result of a primordial coincidence
remains a
fanciful speculation
.... as long as by "fanciful" you mean grounded in a wealth of experimental
and theoretical knowledge.
and as I have said, a grand Hoax. .Furthermore, even if you
had a whole soup of these "primordial cells" going.....there is no
mechanism for
them to evolve,change into the life we see today.
You've apparently never heard of natural selection....
It did not happen...it is a hoax.
Just like the moon landing and the Holocaust, right? Andrew, you're nothing
but a garden variety kook.
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| User: "Don Kresch" |
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| Title: Re: Objective Evidence |
08 Feb 2005 07:12:51 AM |
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In alt.atheism on Mon, 7 Feb 2005 21:18:22 -0800, "Andrew"
<andrew.321remov@usa.net> let us all know that:
"Mark Stahl" wrote in message news:DeCdnRxhSf6xqpXfRVn-ug@giganews.com...
"Andrew" wrote:
"Don Kresch" wrote:
"Andrew" let us all know that:
"Cary Kittrell" wrote:
"Andrew" writes:
"Don Kresch" wrote:
"Andrew" let us all know that:
Tell me Al....where is the *objective evidence* that life came
from nonliving
chemicals which came from a primeval explosion which came from
nothing.
Tell me, Andrew, if life can only come from life, and god is
alive, where did god come from? No, god can't always have
been--that
would be contrary to the notion that life can only come from life,
and
you would be a hypocrite for positing it.
Don
---
Although humans are unable to comprehend eternity and God...the fact
remains that life comes only from preexisting life. That is an
established
law of science.
There is no such "established law of science".
It is The Law of Biogenesis
There is no such law.
Find me any high school or college biology textbook that lists
it, please.
Biology: A Search for Order in Complexity
Moore and Slusher
"Historically the point of view that life comes only from life has been so
well established through the facts revealed by experiment that it is called
the Law of Biogenesis."
footnote: "Some philosophers call this a principle instead of a law, but this
is a matter of definition, and definitions are arbitrary. Some scientists call
this a superlaw, or a law about laws. Regardless of terminology,biogenesis
has the highest rank in these levels of generalization" (1974, p. 74)
Andrew-
You're making a silly and obviously losing argument based on an incomplete
reading of what Pasteur found. Pasteur's "law" concerns what is happening
now: that life now comes from previously existing life, not from nonlife.
IOW, there is no spontaneous generation of complex organisms like maggots
from garbage. But that "law" was never meant to, and doesn't, apply to a
situation where there is no previously existing life.
It has never been demonstrated that life can arise spontaneously from non living
chemicals.
Where did god come from?
Why do you constantly put forth your god-hoax?
Don
---
aa #51, Knight of BAAWA, DNRC o-, Member of the [H]orde
Atheist Minister for St. Dogbert.
"No being is so important that he can usurp the rights of another"
Picard to Data/Graves "The Schizoid Man"
.
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| User: "Cary Kittrell" |
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| Title: Re: Objective Evidence |
08 Feb 2005 10:26:54 AM |
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In article <36r0cvF54hstaU1@individual.net> "Andrew" <andrew.321remov@usa.net> writes:
"Mark Stahl" wrote in message news:DeCdnRxhSf6xqpXfRVn-ug@giganews.com...
Andrew-
You're making a silly and obviously losing argument based on an incomplete
reading of what Pasteur found. Pasteur's "law" concerns what is happening
now: that life now comes from previously existing life, not from nonlife.
IOW, there is no spontaneous generation of complex organisms like maggots
from garbage. But that "law" was never meant to, and doesn't, apply to a
situation where there is no previously existing life.
{...}
It has never been demonstrated that life can arise spontaneously from non living
chemicals.
Quite correct. No on has demonstrated this. That's why they
call it "research".
You may present theories,but they are unproven and also contrary to
common sense
As is relativity, quantum theory, the idea that solid land
is drifting about, the contention that nearly all of an iron
cannon ball is empty space, and many other once speculative
propositions put forward for scientific investigation.
Common sense is a result of our experience in this world.
Common sense does function when a scale of four billion
years is the basis of the argument.
when you consider what we now know about the complexity of
a simply living cell, which has the intricacy of a city with its communication and
transportation and other systems..plus with the ability to copy (reproduce) itself.
The idea that the cell originated as a result of a primordial coincidence
Which statement shows that you cannot seem to grasp that
1) no one thinks the "cell arose", <WHAM!> all at once, with
no precursors, and
2) you fail to consider how much can happen, one small step
at a time, if you give it several hundred million years
in which to happen.
remains a
fanciful speculation and as I have said, a grand Hoax. .
Pick one. If it's admitted speculation, then it cannot be a hoax.
-- cary
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| User: "Al Klein" |
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| Title: Re: Objective Evidence |
10 Feb 2005 12:56:55 AM |
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On Mon, 7 Feb 2005 21:18:22 -0800, "Andrew" <andrew.321remov@usa.net>
said in alt.atheism:
It has never been demonstrated that life can arise spontaneously from non living
chemicals.
It has never been demonstrated that a god can create life, the
universe or anything, so that's at least as much an argument against
your case as for it.
--
"To assert that the earth revolves around the sun is as erroneous as to claim that Jesus
was not born of a virgin."
Cardinal Bellarmine,[1615, during the trial of Galileo]
(random sig, produced by SigChanger)
rukbat at verizon dot net
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