Re: JESUS DIED OF FEAR, PANIC, ANXIETY, HEART ATTACK - FORENSIC EXPERT



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Topic: Religions > Atheism
User: "Dr. Jai Maharaj"
Date: 11 Jun 2005 07:02:10 AM
Object: Re: JESUS DIED OF FEAR, PANIC, ANXIETY, HEART ATTACK - FORENSIC EXPERT
In article <1118471756.510713.248380@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
"alen" <alen1@westserv.net.au> posted:

Dr. Jai Maharaj posted:

JESUS 'DIED OF A HEART ATTACK'

By John Follain
The Times of India
Saturday, June 12, 1999

Jesus Christ died on the cross of a heart attack,
rather than from asphyxiation, according to a leading
Italian forensic scientist who has compiled a detailed
medical history of Christ's last weeks on earth.

Working with accounts by the apostles as well as
laboratory simulations of the crucifixion, Luigi Baima
Bollone, a professor who heads Turin's forensic science
institute, argues that it is possible to use modern
medicine to analyse Christ's symptoms. The findings are
contained in a book, The Last Days of Christ, published
recently.

"If Christ had suffered only from asphyxiation he would
not have been able to talk," said Baima Bollone, who
specialises in dissecting murder victims. "But he is
known to have spoken several times while on the cross.
He did suffer from asphyxiation, but it was a very slow
process and he died of another cause, too."

The clue is Christ's death-cry of anguish: "Lord, Lord,
why have you forsaken me?" In the light of his earlier
condition, Baima Bollone believes it shows that he
suffered a heart attack, probably a coronary thrombosis
in which a clot forms in a branch of either of the
coronary arteries, resulting in its obstruction.

After the last supper, in the gardens of Gethsemane on
the site of the Mount of Olives, an anxious Jesus is
said to have broken down as the apostles fell asleep
around him. According to biblical accounts, he sweats,
wishes to flee, feels afraid of death and falls to the
ground -- all classic symptoms of a panic attack as
defined by modern science.

By the time he was crucified, Christ was exhausted and
dehydrated, and his blood was short of oxygen. The
psychological strain he had suffered, including fear
and frustration linked to the shame of arrest, was
compounded by episodes of physical torture: soldiers
beat him about the head and he was whipped 39 times.
His agony on the cross lasted only three hours because
of his weakened state.

"The apostles show great rigour in describing Christ's
condition. Luke had medical knowledge and it's almost
as if they had read our modern medical tomes," Baima
Bollone said. "There is enough material to issue
regular medical bulletins."

The book's findings have been favourably reviewed in
the Italian Catholic newspaper Avvenire, which likened
it to the professor entering the holy sepulchre and
examining Christ's body before a rock was placed across
the entrance.

Professor Bernard Knight, a former director of the
Forensic Medicine Institute in Cardiff, is sceptical,
however. "The data is too poor to say that Jesus died
of a heart attack and of asphyxiation, or that he died
faster than was normal for a crucifixion," he said.
"Scientifically, if you haven't got any basic data you
can't draw conclusions. It's like saying the moon is
made of green cheese."

(The Sunday Times)
[Caption: Bollone: examined evidence]

Source - http://www.timesofindia.com/today/12edit9.htm

I recently heard an evangelist teacher say that he believed
that it was the abandonment of Jesus by His Father that
actually killed Him. He could endure all things, but not to
be separated from the Eternal Father. That was the last blow
He had to suffer, and the one He could not hope to survive,
since all He ever did was only for the Father and, without
the Father, He had no more strength, and nothing more at all.

Jesus' father was a Roman soldier who raped his mother -- of
course, he must have abandoned him:
TV doco claims Virgin Mary was raped
ninemsn.com
Monday, December 23, 2002
A Catholic bishop criticised a British television
documentary that suggests the Virgin Mary may have been
raped by a Roman soldier.
The Bishop of Portsmouth said the BBC program, The Virgin
Mary, was crude and offensive by disregarding the
concerns and beliefs of millions of Christians.
The controversy came as a survey revealed that a quarter
of Church of England clergy do not believe in the virgin
birth of Christ.
The Sunday Telegraph survey found that 27 per cent of 500
clerics questioned doubt privately the traditional story
of Jesus's birth.
The program questions the Bible's interpretation of the
Virgin Mary, suggesting she may even have been called
Miriam, and that she may have been raped by a Roman
soldier.
Other theories suggest her husband Joseph could have made
her pregnant or that she had an illicit affair. . . .
[...]
This is only an excerpt -- read the complete news at:
http://news.ninemsn.com.au/World/story_44101.asp
BBC defends Jesus documentary after 500 complaints
Ananova
Monday December 23, 2002 9:02 PM
A BBC programme that suggested the Virgin Mary might have
been 13 when she gave birth to Jesus has prompted more
than 500 complaints.
The documentary, shown on BBC1 at 8pm last night, was
condemned by church groups before it was broadcast.
Virgin Mary led to a protest outside BBC TV headquarters
in London while it was being aired.
The programme speculated that Mary was probably just 13
when she gave birth. It also considered, before
rejecting, the possibility that the Virgin Mary became
pregnant after being raped by a Roman soldier.
Presented by Sue Johnston, the show also raised doubts
about the birth of Jesus in a Bethlehem stable and the
presence of the Three Wise Men.
Before the show was broadcast, the Bishop of Portsmouth,
the Rt Rev Crispian Hollis, expressed his displeasure in
a statement.
He said: "To include, within a historical examination of
her life, confused and unfounded guesswork, which carries
with it crude and offensive speculation, is not only
unscholarly but runs the risk of undermining the very
integrity of the project itself."
But a BBC spokeswoman said that Bishop Hollis was
commenting before the programme was aired and was basing
his views on "misleading reports" that the show suggested
Mary had been raped.
"The programme made it quite clear that this was anti-
Christian slander circulated about 100 years after Jesus'
death," the spokeswoman said.
She added that the majority of the "500-plus" complaints
were received before the show was broadcast.
End of forwarded message

The terrorist mission of Jesus stated in the Christian bible:

"Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not so send
peace, but a sword.
"For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the
daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in
law.
"And a man's foes shall be they of his own household.
- Matthew 10:34-36.


That is a hostile and false interpretation.

Nonsense. That is a cruel and hostile terrorist mission.
Jai Maharaj
http://www.mantra.com/jai
Om Shanti
.

User: "alen"

Title: Re: JESUS DIED OF FEAR, PANIC, ANXIETY, HEART ATTACK - FORENSIC EXPERT 11 Jun 2005 03:52:24 PM
Dr. Jai Maharaj wrote:


I recently heard an evangelist teacher say that he believed
that it was the abandonment of Jesus by His Father that
actually killed Him. He could endure all things, but not to
be separated from the Eternal Father. That was the last blow
He had to suffer, and the one He could not hope to survive,
since all He ever did was only for the Father and, without
the Father, He had no more strength, and nothing more at all.


Jesus' father was a Roman soldier who raped his mother -- of
course, he must have abandoned him:

TV doco claims Virgin Mary was raped

I am sure you know that, to me, such modern
speculation is just hostile, blasphemous rubbish,
which we see more of as time goes on. It doesn't
surprise me, because I am already aware of the
antagonism that exists against the Christian Faith.
Alen
.
User: "kathryn"

Title: Re: JESUS DIED OF FEAR, PANIC, ANXIETY, HEART ATTACK - FORENSIC EXPERT 11 Jun 2005 04:14:48 PM
"alen" <alen1@westserv.net.au> wrote in message
news:1118505144.294871.208950@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...


Dr. Jai Maharaj wrote:


I recently heard an evangelist teacher say that he believed
that it was the abandonment of Jesus by His Father that
actually killed Him. He could endure all things, but not to
be separated from the Eternal Father. That was the last blow
He had to suffer, and the one He could not hope to survive,
since all He ever did was only for the Father and, without
the Father, He had no more strength, and nothing more at all.


Jesus' father was a Roman soldier who raped his mother -- of
course, he must have abandoned him:

TV doco claims Virgin Mary was raped


I am sure you know that, to me, such modern
speculation is just hostile, blasphemous rubbish,
which we see more of as time goes on. It doesn't
surprise me, because I am already aware of the
antagonism that exists against the Christian Faith.

Alen

Poor little xians :( all they want to do is force everyone to believe the
same as they do what on earth is wrong with that?
.
User: "Jez"

Title: Re: JESUS DIED OF FEAR, PANIC, ANXIETY, HEART ATTACK - FORENSIC EXPERT 11 Jun 2005 05:20:06 PM
"kathryn" <nospam@here.com> wrote in
news:d8f2lo$dgk$1@nwrdmz02.dmz.ncs.ea.ibs-infra.bt.com:


"alen" <alen1@westserv.net.au> wrote in message
news:1118505144.294871.208950@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...


Dr. Jai Maharaj wrote:


I recently heard an evangelist teacher say that he believed
that it was the abandonment of Jesus by His Father that
actually killed Him. He could endure all things, but not to
be separated from the Eternal Father. That was the last blow
He had to suffer, and the one He could not hope to survive,
since all He ever did was only for the Father and, without
the Father, He had no more strength, and nothing more at all.


Jesus' father was a Roman soldier who raped his mother -- of
course, he must have abandoned him:

TV doco claims Virgin Mary was raped


I am sure you know that, to me, such modern
speculation is just hostile, blasphemous rubbish,
which we see more of as time goes on. It doesn't
surprise me, because I am already aware of the
antagonism that exists against the Christian Faith.

Alen



Poor little xians :( all they want to do is force everyone to believe
the same as they do what on earth is wrong with that?

LOL !
--
Jez, MBA.,
Country Dancing and Advanced Astrology, UBS.
'Realism is seductive because once you have accepted the reasonable
notion that you should base your actions on reality, you are too often
led to accept, without much questioning, someone else's version of what
that reality is. It is a crucial act of independent thinking to be
skeptical of someone else's description of reality.'-
Howard Zinn

.

User: "alen"

Title: Re: JESUS DIED OF FEAR, PANIC, ANXIETY, HEART ATTACK - FORENSIC EXPERT 13 Jun 2005 04:46:52 AM
kathryn wrote:

I am sure you know that, to me, such modern
speculation is just hostile, blasphemous rubbish,
which we see more of as time goes on. It doesn't
surprise me, because I am already aware of the
antagonism that exists against the Christian Faith.

Alen



Poor little xians :( all they want to do is force everyone to believe the
same as they do what on earth is wrong with that?

Where did I say a word about 'forcing' anyone
to do anything? Because I used the description
'hostile, blasphemous rubbish' doesn't mean I
want to take forceful action against anyone.
Alen
.
User: "kathryn"

Title: Re: JESUS DIED OF FEAR, PANIC, ANXIETY, HEART ATTACK - FORENSIC EXPERT 13 Jun 2005 06:15:44 AM
"alen" <alen1@westserv.net.au> wrote in message
news:1118638012.282784.29990@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...



kathryn wrote:

I am sure you know that, to me, such modern
speculation is just hostile, blasphemous rubbish,
which we see more of as time goes on. It doesn't
surprise me, because I am already aware of the
antagonism that exists against the Christian Faith.

Alen



Poor little xians :( all they want to do is force everyone to believe the
same as they do what on earth is wrong with that?


Where did I say a word about 'forcing' anyone
to do anything? Because I used the description
'hostile, blasphemous rubbish' doesn't mean I
want to take forceful action against anyone.

Alen

I just find it amusing when christians claim to be persecuted
the goal of your religion is to convert every single person on the
planet.....and you don't expect antagonism?
.
User: "Dr. Jai Maharaj"

Title: Re: JESUS DIED OF FEAR, PANIC, ANXIETY, HEART ATTACK - FORENSIC EXPERT 13 Jun 2005 08:11:56 AM
In article <d8j8ag$8dm$1@nwrdmz01.dmz.ncs.ea.ibs-infra.bt.com>,
"kathryn" <nospam@here.com> posted:


"alen" <alen1@westserv.net.au> wrote in message
news:1118638012.282784.29990@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...



kathryn wrote:

I am sure you know that, to me, such modern
speculation is just hostile, blasphemous rubbish,
which we see more of as time goes on. It doesn't
surprise me, because I am already aware of the
antagonism that exists against the Christian Faith.

Alen



Poor little xians :( all they want to do is force everyone to believe the
same as they do what on earth is wrong with that?


Where did I say a word about 'forcing' anyone
to do anything? Because I used the description
'hostile, blasphemous rubbish' doesn't mean I
want to take forceful action against anyone.

Alen



I just find it amusing when christians claim to be persecuted
the goal of your religion is to convert every single person on the
planet.....and you don't expect antagonism?

Missionaries use force and fraud to try to
convert people to Christianity. Several countries
have banned their conversion activities.
Jai Maharaj
http://www.mantra.com/jai
Om Shanti
.
User: ""

Title: Re: JESUS DIED OF FEAR, PANIC, ANXIETY, HEART ATTACK - FORENSIC EXPERT 13 Jun 2005 04:05:49 PM
Dr. Jai Maharaj wrote:

In article <d8j8ag$8dm$1@nwrdmz01.dmz.ncs.ea.ibs-infra.bt.com>,
"kathryn" <nospam@here.com> posted:

I just find it amusing when christians claim to be persecuted
the goal of your religion is to convert every single person on the
planet.....and you don't expect antagonism?


Missionaries use force and fraud to try to
convert people to Christianity. Several countries
have banned their conversion activities.

Give a recent example of use of force.
.


User: "Christopher A. Lee"

Title: Re: JESUS DIED OF FEAR, PANIC, ANXIETY, HEART ATTACK - FORENSIC EXPERT 13 Jun 2005 03:41:27 PM
On Mon, 13 Jun 2005 06:15:44 +0000 (UTC), "kathryn" <nospam@here.com>
wrote:


"alen" <alen1@westserv.net.au> wrote in message
news:1118638012.282784.29990@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...



kathryn wrote:

I am sure you know that, to me, such modern
speculation is just hostile, blasphemous rubbish,
which we see more of as time goes on. It doesn't
surprise me, because I am already aware of the
antagonism that exists against the Christian Faith.

Alen



Poor little xians :( all they want to do is force everyone to believe the
same as they do what on earth is wrong with that?


Where did I say a word about 'forcing' anyone
to do anything? Because I used the description
'hostile, blasphemous rubbish' doesn't mean I
want to take forceful action against anyone.

Alen



I just find it amusing when christians claim to be persecuted
the goal of your religion is to convert every single person on the
planet.....and you don't expect antagonism?

I had an evangelical in my car yesterday, and he was firmly convinced
that not being able to prosetylise was an attack on his religion.
But this is reflected in the sheer volume of lies and slander about
"liberals", "secular humanists", "evolutionists" etc. Or the alleged
aims of organisations like the ACLU.
Christianity isn't and has never been under threat in the USA. Even
evangelical fundamentalism.
They don't understand the difference between an initial action, and a
reaction which otherwise wouldn't even have happened.
And don't even realise their hypocrisy. Talk about beams, motes and
eyes.
.
User: ""

Title: Re: JESUS DIED OF FEAR, PANIC, ANXIETY, HEART ATTACK - FORENSIC EXPERT 13 Jun 2005 04:34:38 PM
Christopher A. Lee wrote:

"kathryn" <nospam@here.com> wrote:

I just find it amusing when christians claim to be persecuted
the goal of your religion is to convert every single person on the
planet.....and you don't expect antagonism?

If one expects antagonism and gets antagonism, what would be wrong with
calling it persecution if it is persecution?

I had an evangelical in my car yesterday, and he was firmly convinced
that not being able to prosetylise was an attack on his religion.

A few years back, in response to a similar complaint, I asked a
Christian in India what the state must do to people who try to prevent
preachers from spreading witchcraft. He responded that spreading
witchcraft must be banned. A secular state's policies would have to be
irrespective of the particular religion. That is, in order to be
secular, their policy would have to be "spreading X must be banned",
for all values of X. If they have a policy where the ban depends on the
value of X (such as banned if X=witchcraft and not banned if
X=Christianity), then the state is not being secular.

Christianity isn't and has never been under threat in the USA. Even
evangelical fundamentalism.

Even Evangelical fundamentalism? What do you understand by this?
http://www.ridgenet.net/~do_while/sage/v6i1t.htm
PBS, in an attempt to defuse public opposition to the teaching of
evolution in public schools, kept hammering away at the theme that
evolution and Christianity can coexist peacefully. Of course, if they
really believed that, they would have no objection to teaching
Christian explanations for the origin of species in science classes.
But they do object because they know full well that there is a
conflict.
.


User: "alen"

Title: Re: JESUS DIED OF FEAR, PANIC, ANXIETY, HEART ATTACK - FORENSIC EXPERT 14 Jun 2005 03:24:38 AM
kathryn wrote:

I just find it amusing when christians claim to be persecuted
the goal of your religion is to convert every single person on the
planet.....and you don't expect antagonism?

Such a goal is harmful only when people refuse
to respect the free will of others, and it is
justified for such others to defend their fee
will.
But I see the true Christians as people who believe
that they have a great truth that others don't
yet possess, and simply want to share it with
them. This is quite different to those who make
the conversion of others a personal competition
and achievement of their own.
But those who resist Chrisitans are also liable to
be unjust. For example, if a competitive Christian
missionary offended me, I could immediately not
only resist him legitimately, but characterise all
Christians as being the same, hate them all forever,
and seek to dismantle and insult their religion
by every means and at every opportunity, fair
or foul, etc.
Alen
.
User: "Terrell D Lewis"

Title: Re: JESUS DIED OF FEAR, PANIC, ANXIETY, HEART ATTACK - FORENSIC EXPERT 14 Jun 2005 04:06:49 AM
On 13 Jun 2005 20:24:38 -0700, "alen" <alen1@westserv.net.au> wrote:

fee will.

Freudian slip, or are you a Republican?
Terrell D Lewis
http://www.lastofall.com
.

User: ""

Title: Re: JESUS DIED OF FEAR, PANIC, ANXIETY, HEART ATTACK - FORENSIC EXPERT 14 Jun 2005 05:21:23 AM
alen wrote:

kathryn wrote:

I just find it amusing when christians claim to be persecuted
the goal of your religion is to convert every single person on the
planet.....and you don't expect antagonism?


Such a goal is harmful only when people refuse
to respect the free will of others, and it is
justified for such others to defend their free
will.

But I see the true Christians as people who believe
that they have a great truth that others don't
yet possess, and simply want to share it with
them.

But those who resist Chrisitans are also liable to
be unjust.

Certainly. They might even resist by committing crimes. So, what ought
to be done about such potential crimes?
.






User: "D-word"

Title: Re: JESUS DIED OF FEAR, PANIC, ANXIETY, HEART ATTACK - FORENSIC EXPERT 11 Jun 2005 03:59:18 PM
Dr. Jai Maharaj wrote:
Re: JESUS DIED OF FEAR, PANIC, ANXIETY, HEART ATTACK - FORENSIC EXPERT
I bet he pissed his shroud.
.


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