Re: Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in 2006!


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Topic: Religions > Atheism
User: "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD"
Date: 01 Jan 2006 07:34:21 PM
Object: Re: Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in 2006!
::: vera ::: wrote:

We know that the Son of God has come,

and has given us an understanding,

that we know him who is true,

and we are in him who is true,

in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

(1 John 5:20 WEB)

Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in
2006!

Praise the Lord!

Peace for 2006,

::: vera :::
____________________________________________________
::::::: http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de :::::::
::::::: http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de/Israel.htm :::::::
::::::: http://www.e-sword.net :::::::

Yes, all praises belong to the LORD, Whom we love with all of our
hearts, souls, minds, and strengths :-))
Here is to bigger boats in 2006:
http://tinyurl.com/7arg7
May the LORD continue to give you HIS peace which passes all worldly
understanding, in Jesus' most precious and holy name :-))
Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things
like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following
this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/05/06) from 6 to 7 pm
EST:
http://tinyurl.com/cpayh
For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for
how the LORD has reshaped me:
http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt
Prayerfully in Christ's love,
Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk
.

User: "Chuck Stamford"

Title: Re: Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in 2006! 02 Jan 2006 12:17:20 AM
"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <nospam7@heartmdphd.com> wrote in message
news:1136165661.009583.226720@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...

::: vera ::: wrote:

We know that the Son of God has come,

and has given us an understanding,

that we know him who is true,

and we are in him who is true,

in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

(1 John 5:20 WEB)

Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in
2006!

Praise the Lord!

Peace for 2006,

::: vera :::
____________________________________________________
::::::: http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de :::::::
::::::: http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de/Israel.htm :::::::
::::::: http://www.e-sword.net :::::::


Yes, all praises belong to the LORD, Whom we love with all of our
hearts, souls, minds, and strengths :-))

Here is to bigger boats in 2006:

http://tinyurl.com/7arg7

May the LORD continue to give you HIS peace which passes all worldly
understanding, in Jesus' most precious and holy name :-))

Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things
like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following
this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/05/06) from 6 to 7 pm
EST:

http://tinyurl.com/cpayh

For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for
how the LORD has reshaped me:

http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt

Prayerfully in Christ's love,

Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk

Andrew,
You need to stop adding newsgroups to those posts to which you choose to
respond. If you want to post to those additional groups, you are of course,
free to do so, but you only have the right to decide where your OWN remarks
will be posted, not those of another. Most ethical people understand these
fundamentals.
Chuck Stamford
.
User: "GaryG"

Title: Re: Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in 2006! 02 Jan 2006 08:25:33 PM
"Chuck Stamford" <shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote in message
news:jz3uf.905$jR.856@fed1read01...


"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <nospam7@heartmdphd.com> wrote in message
news:1136165661.009583.226720@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...

::: vera ::: wrote:

We know that the Son of God has come,

and has given us an understanding,

that we know him who is true,

and we are in him who is true,

in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

(1 John 5:20 WEB)

Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in
2006!

Praise the Lord!

Peace for 2006,

::: vera :::
____________________________________________________
::::::: http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de :::::::
::::::: http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de/Israel.htm :::::::
::::::: http://www.e-sword.net :::::::


Yes, all praises belong to the LORD, Whom we love with all of our
hearts, souls, minds, and strengths :-))

Here is to bigger boats in 2006:

http://tinyurl.com/7arg7

May the LORD continue to give you HIS peace which passes all worldly
understanding, in Jesus' most precious and holy name :-))

Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things
like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following
this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/05/06) from 6 to 7 pm
EST:

http://tinyurl.com/cpayh

For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for
how the LORD has reshaped me:

http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt

Prayerfully in Christ's love,

Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk


Andrew,

You need to stop adding newsgroups to those posts to which you choose to
respond. If you want to post to those additional groups, you are of

course,

free to do so, but you only have the right to decide where your OWN

remarks

will be posted, not those of another. Most ethical people understand

these

fundamentals.

Chuck Stamford

You may as well save your breath. Chung is an internet troll and whack-job
of long standing. He's been asked many, many times (nicely, and
not-so-nicely) to cease his incessant "Cross-Posting for Christ (TM)".
Unfortunately, he won't. His mental state is such that:
a) he believes he has been granted special powers of "truth discernment"
b) his postings are part of his "mission" from god
c) when he is "abused" for his anti-social behavior, it makes him feel more
like the "prophets" in the bible.
Lately, he seems to be implying that on Christmas day he "solved" the
mystery of the different genealogies listed for Jesus, thus opening the
"first of the 7 seals" as stated in Revelations. Based on this, he now
believes that he is an actor in "the final days" (and seems positively giddy
by the possibilities of the Second Coming).
GG
.
User: "Chuck Stamford"

Title: Re: Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in 2006! 03 Jan 2006 12:12:15 AM
"GaryG" <sorrynoemail@NOSPAMX.com> wrote in message
news:Ngluf.598$%G7.213@fe02.lga...

"Chuck Stamford" <shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote in message
news:jz3uf.905$jR.856@fed1read01...


"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <nospam7@heartmdphd.com> wrote in message
news:1136165661.009583.226720@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...

::: vera ::: wrote:

We know that the Son of God has come,

and has given us an understanding,

that we know him who is true,

and we are in him who is true,

in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

(1 John 5:20 WEB)

Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in
2006!

Praise the Lord!

Peace for 2006,

::: vera :::
____________________________________________________
::::::: http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de :::::::
::::::: http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de/Israel.htm :::::::
::::::: http://www.e-sword.net :::::::


Yes, all praises belong to the LORD, Whom we love with all of our
hearts, souls, minds, and strengths :-))

Here is to bigger boats in 2006:

http://tinyurl.com/7arg7

May the LORD continue to give you HIS peace which passes all worldly
understanding, in Jesus' most precious and holy name :-))

Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things
like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following
this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/05/06) from 6 to 7 pm
EST:

http://tinyurl.com/cpayh

For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for
how the LORD has reshaped me:

http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt

Prayerfully in Christ's love,

Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk


Andrew,

You need to stop adding newsgroups to those posts to which you choose to
respond. If you want to post to those additional groups, you are of

course,

free to do so, but you only have the right to decide where your OWN

remarks

will be posted, not those of another. Most ethical people understand

these

fundamentals.

Chuck Stamford


You may as well save your breath. Chung is an internet troll and
whack-job
of long standing. He's been asked many, many times (nicely, and
not-so-nicely) to cease his incessant "Cross-Posting for Christ (TM)".

Unfortunately, he won't. His mental state is such that:

a) he believes he has been granted special powers of "truth discernment"

b) his postings are part of his "mission" from god

c) when he is "abused" for his anti-social behavior, it makes him feel
more
like the "prophets" in the bible.

Lately, he seems to be implying that on Christmas day he "solved" the
mystery of the different genealogies listed for Jesus, thus opening the
"first of the 7 seals" as stated in Revelations. Based on this, he now
believes that he is an actor in "the final days" (and seems positively
giddy
by the possibilities of the Second Coming).

I'm sorry to hear there is yet one more person in the world who believes
that their relationship with God makes them some sort of "special" person.
Such people know neither God, nor the Gospel of Jesus Christ.
Chuck Stamford
.
User: "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD"

Title: Conqueror bent on conquest: The Lamb opened the 1st of the 7 seals on His birthday (12/25/2005) 03 Jan 2006 07:09:50 AM
Chuck Stamford wrote:
<snip>

I'm sorry to hear there is yet one more person in the world who believes
that their relationship with God makes them some sort of "special" person.

Those who walk with Christ regard HIM as the special person.

Such people know neither God, nor the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

That is not what I discern.
Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things
like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following
this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/05/06) from 6 to 7 pm
EST:
http://tinyurl.com/cpayh
For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for
how the LORD has reshaped me:
http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt
Prayerfully in Christ's love,
Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk
.
User: "Chuck Stamford"

Title: Re: Conqueror bent on conquest: The Lamb opened the 1st of the 7 seals on His birthday (12/25/2005) 03 Jan 2006 11:17:02 PM
"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <nospam8@heartmdphd.com> wrote in message
news:1136293790.441527.253530@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...

Chuck Stamford wrote:

<snip>

I'm sorry to hear there is yet one more person in the world who believes
that their relationship with God makes them some sort of "special"
person.


Those who walk with Christ regard HIM as the special person.

Such people know neither God, nor the Gospel of Jesus Christ.


That is not what I discern.

I don't care, Andrew. Have a nice life.
Chuck Stamford
.
User: "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD"

Title: Re: Conqueror bent on conquest: The Lamb opened the 1st of the 7 seals on His birthday (12/25/2005) 04 Jan 2006 04:29:20 AM
Chuck Stamford wrote:

"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <nospam8@heartmdphd.com> wrote in message
news:1136293790.441527.253530@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...

Chuck Stamford wrote:

<snip>

I'm sorry to hear there is yet one more person in the world who believes
that their relationship with God makes them some sort of "special"
person.


Those who walk with Christ regard HIM as the special person.

Such people know neither God, nor the Gospel of Jesus Christ.


That is not what I discern.


I don't care, Andrew.

Nonetheless, the crowned riders arrows continue to strike their targets
unerringly.

Have a nice life.

A life lived for the LORD is always nice :-))
Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things
like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following
this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/05/06) from 6 to 7 pm
EST:
http://tinyurl.com/cpayh
For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for
how the LORD has reshaped me:
http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt
Prayerfully in Christ's love,
Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk
.



User: "Michael Gray"

Title: Re: Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in 2006! 03 Jan 2006 02:29:55 AM
On Mon, 2 Jan 2006 22:12:15 -0800, "Chuck Stamford"
<shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote:
:

I'm sorry to hear there is yet one more person in the world who believes
that their relationship with God makes them some sort of "special" person.
Such people know neither God, nor the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

Chuck Stamford

Strike up the bagpipes again!!!
.
User: "Chuck Stamford"

Title: Re: Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in 2006! 03 Jan 2006 04:03:45 AM
"Michael Gray" <fleetg@newsguy.spam.com> wrote in message
news:cedkr19srmrob97a7qfsbsgd2elr9uesc6@4ax.com...

On Mon, 2 Jan 2006 22:12:15 -0800, "Chuck Stamford"
<shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote:

:

I'm sorry to hear there is yet one more person in the world who believes
that their relationship with God makes them some sort of "special" person.
Such people know neither God, nor the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

Chuck Stamford


Strike up the bagpipes again!!!

Meaning what?
.
User: "Michael Gray"

Title: Re: Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in 2006! 03 Jan 2006 05:20:04 AM
On Tue, 3 Jan 2006 02:03:45 -0800, "Chuck Stamford"
<shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote:


"Michael Gray" <fleetg@newsguy.spam.com> wrote in message
news:cedkr19srmrob97a7qfsbsgd2elr9uesc6@4ax.com...

On Mon, 2 Jan 2006 22:12:15 -0800, "Chuck Stamford"
<shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote:

:

I'm sorry to hear there is yet one more person in the world who believes
that their relationship with God makes them some sort of "special" person.
Such people know neither God, nor the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

Chuck Stamford


Strike up the bagpipes again!!!


Meaning what?

You espoused a truly classic case of the "No True Scotsman" fallacy.
.
User: "Chuck Stamford"

Title: Re: Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in 2006! 03 Jan 2006 11:16:00 PM
"Michael Gray" <fleetg@newsguy.spam.com> wrote in message
news:k9nkr1lbeaumffoomkil7dli69uqu5idc2@4ax.com...

On Tue, 3 Jan 2006 02:03:45 -0800, "Chuck Stamford"
<shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote:


"Michael Gray" <fleetg@newsguy.spam.com> wrote in message
news:cedkr19srmrob97a7qfsbsgd2elr9uesc6@4ax.com...

On Mon, 2 Jan 2006 22:12:15 -0800, "Chuck Stamford"
<shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote:

:

I'm sorry to hear there is yet one more person in the world who believes
that their relationship with God makes them some sort of "special"
person.
Such people know neither God, nor the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

Chuck Stamford


Strike up the bagpipes again!!!


Meaning what?


You espoused a truly classic case of the "No True Scotsman" fallacy.

Really? What makes you think that thinking oneself to be "special" isn't
actually contradictory both to the nature of God and the central message of
the Gospel from an evangelical's (that would be me) pov?
.
User: "Michael Gray"

Title: Re: Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in 2006! 04 Jan 2006 03:02:25 AM
On Tue, 3 Jan 2006 21:16:00 -0800, "Chuck Stamford"
<shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote:


"Michael Gray" <fleetg@newsguy.spam.com> wrote in message
news:k9nkr1lbeaumffoomkil7dli69uqu5idc2@4ax.com...

On Tue, 3 Jan 2006 02:03:45 -0800, "Chuck Stamford"
<shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote:


"Michael Gray" <fleetg@newsguy.spam.com> wrote in message
news:cedkr19srmrob97a7qfsbsgd2elr9uesc6@4ax.com...

On Mon, 2 Jan 2006 22:12:15 -0800, "Chuck Stamford"
<shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote:

:

I'm sorry to hear there is yet one more person in the world who believes
that their relationship with God makes them some sort of "special"
person.
Such people know neither God, nor the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

Chuck Stamford


Strike up the bagpipes again!!!


Meaning what?


You espoused a truly classic case of the "No True Scotsman" fallacy.


Really? What makes you think that thinking oneself to be "special" isn't
actually contradictory both to the nature of God and the central message of
the Gospel from an evangelical's (that would be me) pov?

"the nature of God"?
Singular?
To which particular imaginary sky-being out of the infinite number
possibilities are you referring?
Until you are able to answer that question, I cannot answer yours,
MacChuck.
.
User: "Chuck Stamford"

Title: Re: Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in 2006! 06 Jan 2006 08:48:22 PM
"Michael Gray" <fleetg@newsguy.spam.com> wrote in message
news:si3nr198jd4k10v7353se4gknmmsd91nr2@4ax.com...

On Tue, 3 Jan 2006 21:16:00 -0800, "Chuck Stamford"
<shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote:


"Michael Gray" <fleetg@newsguy.spam.com> wrote in message
news:k9nkr1lbeaumffoomkil7dli69uqu5idc2@4ax.com...

On Tue, 3 Jan 2006 02:03:45 -0800, "Chuck Stamford"
<shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote:


"Michael Gray" <fleetg@newsguy.spam.com> wrote in message
news:cedkr19srmrob97a7qfsbsgd2elr9uesc6@4ax.com...

On Mon, 2 Jan 2006 22:12:15 -0800, "Chuck Stamford"
<shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote:

:

I'm sorry to hear there is yet one more person in the world who
believes
that their relationship with God makes them some sort of "special"
person.
Such people know neither God, nor the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

Chuck Stamford


Strike up the bagpipes again!!!


Meaning what?


You espoused a truly classic case of the "No True Scotsman" fallacy.


Really? What makes you think that thinking oneself to be "special" isn't
actually contradictory both to the nature of God and the central message
of
the Gospel from an evangelical's (that would be me) pov?


"the nature of God"?
Singular?
To which particular imaginary sky-being out of the infinite number
possibilities are you referring?

Until you are able to answer that question, I cannot answer yours,
MacChuck.

I don't see the relevance to the question. You said you thought I had
committed a classic example of the "no true Scotsman" fallacy. That fallacy
involves, as I've seen it explained by various authors, in effect:
"This is actually a combination of several fallacies, but since it rests
ultimately on shifting the meaning of terms - a form of equivocation - and
begging the question, it receives special attention.
The name "No True Scotsman" comes from an odd example involving Scotsmen:
1. Suppose I assert that no Scotsman puts sugar on his porridge. You
counter this by pointing out that your friend Angus likes sugar with his
porridge. I then say "Ah, yes, but no true Scotsman puts sugar on his
porridge."
Obviously the original assertion about Scotsmen has been challenged quite
well, but in attempting to shore it up the speaker uses an ad hoc change
combined with a shifted meaning of the words from the original." (see at
http://atheism.about.com/od/logicalfallacies/a/notruescotsman.htm)
You also said that my saying:
"I'm sorry to hear there is yet one more person in the world who believes
that their relationship with God makes them some sort of "special" person.
Such people know neither God, nor the Gospel of Jesus Christ."
was a "classic example" of that fallacy.
I would say that puts the ball in your court rather than mine. You are the
one making the assertion that I have committed a logical fallacy in what I
said. I don't see it. Ergo, if it is up to anyone, it is up to you to
point out to me exactly why what I said contains a "no true scotsman"
fallacy. If you are not going to do that, why should I answer any questions
you may have. If the answers to those questions are important to you
pointing the fallacy out to me, then wouldn't the proper time to be asking
them be BEFORE you made the assertion??
Chuck Stamford
.
User: "Michael Gray"

Title: Re: Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in 2006! 07 Jan 2006 03:03:25 AM
On Fri, 6 Jan 2006 18:48:22 -0800, "Chuck Stamford"
<shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote:


"Michael Gray" <fleetg@newsguy.spam.com> wrote in message
news:si3nr198jd4k10v7353se4gknmmsd91nr2@4ax.com...

On Tue, 3 Jan 2006 21:16:00 -0800, "Chuck Stamford"
<shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote:


"Michael Gray" <fleetg@newsguy.spam.com> wrote in message
news:k9nkr1lbeaumffoomkil7dli69uqu5idc2@4ax.com...

On Tue, 3 Jan 2006 02:03:45 -0800, "Chuck Stamford"
<shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote:


"Michael Gray" <fleetg@newsguy.spam.com> wrote in message
news:cedkr19srmrob97a7qfsbsgd2elr9uesc6@4ax.com...

On Mon, 2 Jan 2006 22:12:15 -0800, "Chuck Stamford"
<shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote:

:

I'm sorry to hear there is yet one more person in the world who
believes
that their relationship with God makes them some sort of "special"
person.
Such people know neither God, nor the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

Chuck Stamford


Strike up the bagpipes again!!!


Meaning what?


You espoused a truly classic case of the "No True Scotsman" fallacy.


Really? What makes you think that thinking oneself to be "special" isn't
actually contradictory both to the nature of God and the central message
of
the Gospel from an evangelical's (that would be me) pov?


"the nature of God"?
Singular?
To which particular imaginary sky-being out of the infinite number
possibilities are you referring?

Until you are able to answer that question, I cannot answer yours,
MacChuck.


I don't see the relevance to the question. You said you thought I had
committed a classic example of the "no true Scotsman" fallacy. That fallacy
involves, as I've seen it explained by various authors, in effect:

"This is actually a combination of several fallacies, but since it rests
ultimately on shifting the meaning of terms - a form of equivocation - and
begging the question, it receives special attention.
The name "No True Scotsman" comes from an odd example involving Scotsmen:

1. Suppose I assert that no Scotsman puts sugar on his porridge. You
counter this by pointing out that your friend Angus likes sugar with his
porridge. I then say "Ah, yes, but no true Scotsman puts sugar on his
porridge."
Obviously the original assertion about Scotsmen has been challenged quite
well, but in attempting to shore it up the speaker uses an ad hoc change
combined with a shifted meaning of the words from the original." (see at
http://atheism.about.com/od/logicalfallacies/a/notruescotsman.htm)

You also said that my saying:

"I'm sorry to hear there is yet one more person in the world who believes
that their relationship with God makes them some sort of "special" person.
Such people know neither God, nor the Gospel of Jesus Christ."

was a "classic example" of that fallacy.

I would say that puts the ball in your court rather than mine. You are the
one making the assertion that I have committed a logical fallacy in what I
said. I don't see it. Ergo, if it is up to anyone, it is up to you to
point out to me exactly why what I said contains a "no true scotsman"
fallacy. If you are not going to do that, why should I answer any questions
you may have. If the answers to those questions are important to you
pointing the fallacy out to me, then wouldn't the proper time to be asking
them be BEFORE you made the assertion??

Chuck Stamford

It's rather simple, really.
The first part of the fallacy is implied, that there CAN be a person
who knows god, and the gospels.
(Otherwise your post evaporates into a pointless puff of hand-waving).
Your:
"I'm sorry to hear there is yet one more person in the world who
believes that their relationship with God makes them some sort of
"special" person. "
Equates to:
"pointing out that your friend Angus likes sugar with his porridge.
As an exception you the post-stated rule.
And your assertion:
"Such people know neither God, nor the Gospel of Jesus Christ."
Equates to:
"Ah, yes, but no true Scotsman puts sugar on his porridge."
As the rule that defines the fallacy, and gives it its name.
Implying that such people are not true christians based on your
unconnected assumptions that:
1) Belief that their relationship with God makes them some sort of
"special" person.
and
2) That excludes them from being "true Christians", in your personal
opinion. (Whereas they may or may not be. That status does not depend
on your personal opinion in any way whatsoever. That's the nub of the
fallacy.)
If you don't "get it" from this explanation, I suspect that you never
will.
Now that I have answered your question, how about having a go at mine?

"the nature of God"?
Singular?
To which particular imaginary sky-being out of the infinite number
possibilities are you referring?

.
User: "Chuck Stamford"

Title: Re: Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in 2006! 08 Jan 2006 02:48:08 AM
"Michael Gray" <fleetg@newsguy.spam.com> wrote in message
news:ru0vr1h6rvqehekcfdrci136t9k0vjovve@4ax.com...

On Fri, 6 Jan 2006 18:48:22 -0800, "Chuck Stamford"
<shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote:


"Michael Gray" <fleetg@newsguy.spam.com> wrote in message
news:si3nr198jd4k10v7353se4gknmmsd91nr2@4ax.com...

On Tue, 3 Jan 2006 21:16:00 -0800, "Chuck Stamford"
<shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote:


"Michael Gray" <fleetg@newsguy.spam.com> wrote in message
news:k9nkr1lbeaumffoomkil7dli69uqu5idc2@4ax.com...

On Tue, 3 Jan 2006 02:03:45 -0800, "Chuck Stamford"
<shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote:


"Michael Gray" <fleetg@newsguy.spam.com> wrote in message
news:cedkr19srmrob97a7qfsbsgd2elr9uesc6@4ax.com...

On Mon, 2 Jan 2006 22:12:15 -0800, "Chuck Stamford"
<shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote:

:

I'm sorry to hear there is yet one more person in the world who
believes
that their relationship with God makes them some sort of "special"
person.
Such people know neither God, nor the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

Chuck Stamford


Strike up the bagpipes again!!!


Meaning what?


You espoused a truly classic case of the "No True Scotsman" fallacy.


Really? What makes you think that thinking oneself to be "special"
isn't
actually contradictory both to the nature of God and the central message
of
the Gospel from an evangelical's (that would be me) pov?


"the nature of God"?
Singular?
To which particular imaginary sky-being out of the infinite number
possibilities are you referring?

Until you are able to answer that question, I cannot answer yours,
MacChuck.


I don't see the relevance to the question. You said you thought I had
committed a classic example of the "no true Scotsman" fallacy. That
fallacy
involves, as I've seen it explained by various authors, in effect:

"This is actually a combination of several fallacies, but since it rests
ultimately on shifting the meaning of terms - a form of equivocation - and
begging the question, it receives special attention.
The name "No True Scotsman" comes from an odd example involving Scotsmen:

1. Suppose I assert that no Scotsman puts sugar on his porridge. You
counter this by pointing out that your friend Angus likes sugar with his
porridge. I then say "Ah, yes, but no true Scotsman puts sugar on his
porridge."
Obviously the original assertion about Scotsmen has been challenged quite
well, but in attempting to shore it up the speaker uses an ad hoc change
combined with a shifted meaning of the words from the original." (see at
http://atheism.about.com/od/logicalfallacies/a/notruescotsman.htm)

You also said that my saying:

"I'm sorry to hear there is yet one more person in the world who believes
that their relationship with God makes them some sort of "special" person.
Such people know neither God, nor the Gospel of Jesus Christ."

was a "classic example" of that fallacy.

I would say that puts the ball in your court rather than mine. You are
the
one making the assertion that I have committed a logical fallacy in what I
said. I don't see it. Ergo, if it is up to anyone, it is up to you to
point out to me exactly why what I said contains a "no true scotsman"
fallacy. If you are not going to do that, why should I answer any
questions
you may have. If the answers to those questions are important to you
pointing the fallacy out to me, then wouldn't the proper time to be asking
them be BEFORE you made the assertion??

Chuck Stamford


It's rather simple, really.

The first part of the fallacy is implied, that there CAN be a person
who knows god, and the gospels.
(Otherwise your post evaporates into a pointless puff of hand-waving).

Your:
"I'm sorry to hear there is yet one more person in the world who
believes that their relationship with God makes them some sort of
"special" person. "
Equates to:
"pointing out that your friend Angus likes sugar with his porridge.
As an exception you the post-stated rule.

And your assertion:
"Such people know neither God, nor the Gospel of Jesus Christ."
Equates to:
"Ah, yes, but no true Scotsman puts sugar on his porridge."
As the rule that defines the fallacy, and gives it its name.

Implying that such people are not true christians based on your
unconnected assumptions that:
1) Belief that their relationship with God makes them some sort of
"special" person.
and
2) That excludes them from being "true Christians", in your personal
opinion. (Whereas they may or may not be. That status does not depend
on your personal opinion in any way whatsoever. That's the nub of the
fallacy.)

If you don't "get it" from this explanation, I suspect that you never
will.

Michael, to be blunt, I think you're exhibiting a foundational
misunderstanding of what it means to be a person who knows God, or/and a
foundational misunderstanding of the "no true Scotsman" fallacy. Let me see
if I can help you over this apparent conceptual hurdle:
The "no true Scotsman" fallacy is an example of a logical fallacy because
the exemplar used (a "Scotsman") in it is well defined. Being a Scotsman is
a matter of birth, of ancestry; and as such, is wide open to second party
scrutiny, regardless of the actions any "Scotsman" might take. The
quotation I gave you above demonstrates this fallacy (which it also notes is
really a compilation of different fallacies rolled into one), which is, when
faced with contradictory evidence for what constitutes the defining actions
of a Scotsman, one changes the definition of a "Scotsman" (that is not open
to change), rather than changing their opinion of what actions define a
Scotsman.
The reason this fallacy doesn't translate to what I said about people who
have a personal relationship with the one, true God, is because such a
relationship is NOT well defined in the sense that it is a matter of record
open to inquiry apart from any actions such people might take. Such people
would be better known BY their actions (a relationship with God being a
matter of the heart/soul/mind), rather than by any other catagorization
schema one might attempt. So, that being the case, it is not possible that
you could rightly apply the "no true Scotsman" fallacy to what I said; which
was in effect an observation on an attitude that such people will eventually
adopt about themselves. I was simply defining people by their actions, on
the assumption that people act out of what is in their heart/soul/mind, and
the understanding that knowing God is a matter of the heart/soul/mind. You
may not agree with my definition of such people, but clearly, I'm using no
fallacy, and certainly no "no true Scotsman" fallacy, to construct it.
I also think that what I said would obviously be true, given the existence
of the Creator of everything that has a beginning to its existence, and the
existence of a person who has a personal relationship with Him. I would
think it obvious that the contrast alone between the greatness of the
Creator and the greatness of the creature would tend to produce in the
creature who knows their Creator an attitude of humility; of thinking of
themselves as nothing very "special" relative to any other created person.
One may dispute the existence of God, or the existence of anyone that knows
God, but given the truth of those two premises (which I assumed in what I
did say), I don't see how what I said is either fallacious or controversial.


Now that I have answered your question, how about having a go at mine?

"the nature of God"?

Since you were gracious enough to explain yourself above, you deserve
answers here.
To put it simply (understanding that the nature of our Creator couldn't
possibly be completely captured by any language we creatures use to
communicate with each other), "God" is the perfect, eternal relationship of
selfless love between three eternal, spiritual, transcendent, omniscient,
omnipotent, and omnibenevolent persons.
And btw, because the above sentence IS putting it simply, each word used to
name an attribute of God in that sentence needs to be carefully
defined...which I'd be glad to do if you're interested.

Singular?

Yes.

To which particular imaginary sky-being out of the infinite number
possibilities are you referring?

The one revealed in Nature, Scripture (the Bible), and personal experience.
Chuck Stamford
.










User: "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD"

Title: Re: Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in 2006! 02 Jan 2006 12:55:20 AM
Chuck Stamford wrote:

"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <nospam7@heartmdphd.com> wrote in message
news:1136165661.009583.226720@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...

::: vera ::: wrote:

We know that the Son of God has come,

and has given us an understanding,

that we know him who is true,

and we are in him who is true,

in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

(1 John 5:20 WEB)

Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in
2006!

Praise the Lord!

Peace for 2006,

::: vera :::
____________________________________________________
::::::: http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de :::::::
::::::: http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de/Israel.htm :::::::
::::::: http://www.e-sword.net :::::::


Yes, all praises belong to the LORD, Whom we love with all of our
hearts, souls, minds, and strengths :-))

Here is to bigger boats in 2006:

http://tinyurl.com/7arg7

May the LORD continue to give you HIS peace which passes all worldly
understanding, in Jesus' most precious and holy name :-))

Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things
like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following
this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/05/06) from 6 to 7 pm
EST:

http://tinyurl.com/cpayh

For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for
how the LORD has reshaped me:

http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt

Prayerfully in Christ's love,

Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk


Andrew,

You need to stop adding newsgroups to those posts to which you choose to
respond. If you want to post to those additional groups, you are of course,
free to do so, but you only have the right to decide where your OWN remarks
will be posted, not those of another.

Actually I do not have the power to control where the remarks of
another will be posted.

Most ethical people understand these
fundamentals.

This would not be an issue of either ethics or understanding the
fundamentals but one of understanding limitations.
Thankfully, the LORD continues to guide me in all that I say, do, and
write. May HE do the same for you, in Jesus' most precious and holy
name.
Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things
like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following
this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/05/06) from 6 to 7 pm
EST:
http://tinyurl.com/cpayh
For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for
how the LORD has reshaped me:
http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt
Prayerfully in Christ's love,
Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk
.
User: "Chuck Stamford"

Title: Re: Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in 2006! 02 Jan 2006 04:20:56 AM
"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <nospam6@heartmdphd.com> wrote in message
news:1136184920.430503.160260@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...

Chuck Stamford wrote:

"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <nospam7@heartmdphd.com> wrote in message
news:1136165661.009583.226720@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...

::: vera ::: wrote:

We know that the Son of God has come,

and has given us an understanding,

that we know him who is true,

and we are in him who is true,

in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

(1 John 5:20 WEB)

Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in
2006!

Praise the Lord!

Peace for 2006,

::: vera :::
____________________________________________________
::::::: http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de :::::::
::::::: http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de/Israel.htm :::::::
::::::: http://www.e-sword.net :::::::


Yes, all praises belong to the LORD, Whom we love with all of our
hearts, souls, minds, and strengths :-))

Here is to bigger boats in 2006:

http://tinyurl.com/7arg7

May the LORD continue to give you HIS peace which passes all worldly
understanding, in Jesus' most precious and holy name :-))

Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things
like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following
this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/05/06) from 6 to 7 pm
EST:

http://tinyurl.com/cpayh

For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for
how the LORD has reshaped me:

http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt

Prayerfully in Christ's love,

Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk


Andrew,

You need to stop adding newsgroups to those posts to which you choose to
respond. If you want to post to those additional groups, you are of
course,
free to do so, but you only have the right to decide where your OWN
remarks
will be posted, not those of another.


Actually I do not have the power to control where the remarks of
another will be posted.

But you do have, and used the power to effect where they are posted.


Most ethical people understand these
fundamentals.


This would not be an issue of either ethics or understanding the
fundamentals but one of understanding limitations.

Just what we needed around here...another obfuscator on personal
responsibility.
Never mind what I told you. You obviously have much deeper ethical problems
than simply manipulating post headers willy-nilly.
Chuck Stamford
.
User: "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD"

Title: Conqueror bent on conquest: The Lamb opened the 1st of the 7 seals on His birthday (12/25/2005) 02 Jan 2006 06:40:21 AM
Chuck Stamford wrote:

"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <nospam6@heartmdphd.com> wrote in message
news:1136184920.430503.160260@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...

Chuck Stamford wrote:

"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <nospam7@heartmdphd.com> wrote in message
news:1136165661.009583.226720@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...

::: vera ::: wrote:

We know that the Son of God has come,

and has given us an understanding,

that we know him who is true,

and we are in him who is true,

in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

(1 John 5:20 WEB)

Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in
2006!

Praise the Lord!

Peace for 2006,

::: vera :::
____________________________________________________
::::::: http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de :::::::
::::::: http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de/Israel.htm :::::::
::::::: http://www.e-sword.net :::::::


Yes, all praises belong to the LORD, Whom we love with all of our
hearts, souls, minds, and strengths :-))

Here is to bigger boats in 2006:

http://tinyurl.com/7arg7

May the LORD continue to give you HIS peace which passes all worldly
understanding, in Jesus' most precious and holy name :-))

Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things
like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following
this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/05/06) from 6 to 7 pm
EST:

http://tinyurl.com/cpayh

For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for
how the LORD has reshaped me:

http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt

Prayerfully in Christ's love,

Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk


Andrew,

You need to stop adding newsgroups to those posts to which you choose to
respond. If you want to post to those additional groups, you are of
course,
free to do so, but you only have the right to decide where your OWN
remarks
will be posted, not those of another.


Actually I do not have the power to control where the remarks of
another **will** be posted.

**emphasis** added.

But you do have, and used the power to effect where they are posted.

No I do not. None of us have the power to control the future actions
of another. Only the LORD has such power.
May the following awaken you:
http://tinyurl.com/awken
Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things
like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following
this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/05/06) from 6 to 7 pm
EST:
http://tinyurl.com/cpayh
For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for
how the LORD has reshaped me:
http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt
Prayerfully in Christ's love,
Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk
.
User: "Chuck Stamford"

Title: Re: Conqueror bent on conquest: The Lamb opened the 1st of the 7 seals on His birthday (12/25/2005) 02 Jan 2006 11:46:11 AM
"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <nospam6@heartmdphd.com> wrote in message
news:1136205621.843832.58740@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...

Chuck Stamford wrote:

"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <nospam6@heartmdphd.com> wrote in message
news:1136184920.430503.160260@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...

Chuck Stamford wrote:

"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <nospam7@heartmdphd.com> wrote in message
news:1136165661.009583.226720@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...

::: vera ::: wrote:

We know that the Son of God has come,

and has given us an understanding,

that we know him who is true,

and we are in him who is true,

in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

(1 John 5:20 WEB)

Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also
in
2006!

Praise the Lord!

Peace for 2006,

::: vera :::
____________________________________________________
::::::: http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de :::::::
::::::: http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de/Israel.htm :::::::
::::::: http://www.e-sword.net :::::::


Yes, all praises belong to the LORD, Whom we love with all of our
hearts, souls, minds, and strengths :-))

Here is to bigger boats in 2006:

http://tinyurl.com/7arg7

May the LORD continue to give you HIS peace which passes all worldly
understanding, in Jesus' most precious and holy name :-))

Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other
things
like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those
following
this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/05/06) from 6 to 7
pm
EST:

http://tinyurl.com/cpayh

For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for
how the LORD has reshaped me:

http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt

Prayerfully in Christ's love,

Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk


Andrew,

You need to stop adding newsgroups to those posts to which you choose
to
respond. If you want to post to those additional groups, you are of
course,
free to do so, but you only have the right to decide where your OWN
remarks
will be posted, not those of another.


Actually I do not have the power to control where the remarks of
another **will** be posted.


**emphasis** added.

But you do have, and used the power to effect where they are posted.


No I do not. None of us have the power to control the future actions
of another. Only the LORD has such power.

Are you claiming it was "another" who changed the list of newsgroups in the
header of YOUR original response to Vera? I don't see how that is possible,
which means I can't believe you're anything but another in a long list of
intellectually dishonest trolls.
Chuck Stamford
.
User: "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD"

Title: Re: Conqueror bent on conquest: The Lamb opened the 1st of the 7 seals on His birthday (12/25/2005) 02 Jan 2006 07:10:31 PM
Chuck Stamford wrote:

"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <nospam6@heartmdphd.com> wrote in message
news:1136205621.843832.58740@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...

Chuck Stamford wrote:

"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <nospam6@heartmdphd.com> wrote in message
news:1136184920.430503.160260@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...

Chuck Stamford wrote:

"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <nospam7@heartmdphd.com> wrote in message
news:1136165661.009583.226720@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...

::: vera ::: wrote:

We know that the Son of God has come,

and has given us an understanding,

that we know him who is true,

and we are in him who is true,

in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

(1 John 5:20 WEB)

Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also
in
2006!

Praise the Lord!

Peace for 2006,

::: vera :::
____________________________________________________
::::::: http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de :::::::
::::::: http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de/Israel.htm :::::::
::::::: http://www.e-sword.net :::::::


Yes, all praises belong to the LORD, Whom we love with all of our
hearts, souls, minds, and strengths :-))

Here is to bigger boats in 2006:

http://tinyurl.com/7arg7

May the LORD continue to give you HIS peace which passes all worldly
understanding, in Jesus' most precious and holy name :-))

Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other
things
like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those
following
this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/05/06) from 6 to 7
pm
EST:

http://tinyurl.com/cpayh

For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for
how the LORD has reshaped me:

http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt

Prayerfully in Christ's love,

Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk


Andrew,

You need to stop adding newsgroups to those posts to which you choose
to
respond. If you want to post to those additional groups, you are of
course,
free to do so, but you only have the right to decide where your OWN
remarks
will be posted, not those of another.


Actually I do not have the power to control where the remarks of
another **will** be posted.


**emphasis** added.

But you do have, and used the power to effect where they are posted.


No I do not. None of us have the power to control the future actions
of another. Only the LORD has such power.


Are you claiming it was "another" who changed the list of newsgroups in the
header of YOUR original response to Vera?

I have written plainly.
Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things
like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following
this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/05/06) from 6 to 7 pm
EST:
http://tinyurl.com/cpayh
For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for
how the LORD has reshaped me:
http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt
Prayerfully in Christ's love,
Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk
.
User: "Chuck Stamford"

Title: Re: Conqueror bent on conquest: The Lamb opened the 1st of the 7 seals on His birthday (12/25/2005) 03 Jan 2006 12:06:34 AM
"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <nospam6@heartmdphd.com> wrote in message
news:1136250631.651081.186750@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...

Chuck Stamford wrote:

"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <nospam6@heartmdphd.com> wrote in message
news:1136205621.843832.58740@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...

Chuck Stamford wrote:

"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <nospam6@heartmdphd.com> wrote in message
news:1136184920.430503.160260@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...

Chuck Stamford wrote:

"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <nospam7@heartmdphd.com> wrote in message
news:1136165661.009583.226720@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...

::: vera ::: wrote:

We know that the Son of God has come,

and has given us an understanding,

that we know him who is true,

and we are in him who is true,

in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

(1 John 5:20 WEB)

Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be,
also
in
2006!

Praise the Lord!

Peace for 2006,

::: vera :::
____________________________________________________
::::::: http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de :::::::
::::::: http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de/Israel.htm :::::::
::::::: http://www.e-sword.net :::::::


Yes, all praises belong to the LORD, Whom we love with all of our
hearts, souls, minds, and strengths :-))

Here is to bigger boats in 2006:

http://tinyurl.com/7arg7

May the LORD continue to give you HIS peace which passes all
worldly
understanding, in Jesus' most precious and holy name :-))

Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other
things
like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those
following
this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/05/06) from 6
to 7
pm
EST:

http://tinyurl.com/cpayh

For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies
for
how the LORD has reshaped me:

http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt

Prayerfully in Christ's love,

Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk


Andrew,

You need to stop adding newsgroups to those posts to which you
choose
to
respond. If you want to post to those additional groups, you are
of
course,
free to do so, but you only have the right to decide where your OWN
remarks
will be posted, not those of another.


Actually I do not have the power to control where the remarks of
another **will** be posted.


**emphasis** added.

But you do have, and used the power to effect where they are posted.


No I do not. None of us have the power to control the future actions
of another. Only the LORD has such power.


Are you claiming it was "another" who changed the list of newsgroups in
the
header of YOUR original response to Vera?


I have written plainly.

A response worthy of an arrogant fool.
Chuck Stamford
.
User: "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD"

Title: Re: Conqueror bent on conquest: The Lamb opened the 1st of the 7 seals on His birthday (12/25/2005) 03 Jan 2006 08:22:34 PM
Chuck Stamford wrote:

"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <nospam6@heartmdphd.com> wrote in message
news:1136250631.651081.186750@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...

Chuck Stamford wrote:

"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <nospam6@heartmdphd.com> wrote in message
news:1136205621.843832.58740@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...

Chuck Stamford wrote:

"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <nospam6@heartmdphd.com> wrote in message
news:1136184920.430503.160260@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...

Chuck Stamford wrote:

"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <nospam7@heartmdphd.com> wrote in message
news:1136165661.009583.226720@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...

::: vera ::: wrote:

We know that the Son of God has come,

and has given us an understanding,

that we know him who is true,

and we are in him who is true,

in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

(1 John 5:20 WEB)

Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be,
also
in
2006!

Praise the Lord!

Peace for 2006,

::: vera :::
____________________________________________________
::::::: http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de :::::::
::::::: http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de/Israel.htm :::::::
::::::: http://www.e-sword.net :::::::


Yes, all praises belong to the LORD, Whom we love with all of our
hearts, souls, minds, and strengths :-))

Here is to bigger boats in 2006:

http://tinyurl.com/7arg7

May the LORD continue to give you HIS peace which passes all
worldly
understanding, in Jesus' most precious and holy name :-))

Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other
things
like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those
following
this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/05/06) from 6
to 7
pm
EST:

http://tinyurl.com/cpayh

For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies
for
how the LORD has reshaped me:

http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt

Prayerfully in Christ's love,

Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk


Andrew,

You need to stop adding newsgroups to those posts to which you
choose
to
respond. If you want to post to those additional groups, you are
of
course,
free to do so, but you only have the right to decide where your OWN
remarks
will be posted, not those of another.


Actually I do not have the power to control where the remarks of
another **will** be posted.


**emphasis** added.

But you do have, and used the power to effect where they are posted.


No I do not. None of us have the power to control the future actions
of another. Only the LORD has such power.


Are you claiming it was "another" who changed the list of newsgroups in
the
header of YOUR original response to Vera?


I have written plainly.


A response worthy of an arrogant fool.

As if writing plainly were a sign of either arrogance or foolishness.
Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things
like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following
this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/05/06) from 6 to 7 pm
EST:
http://tinyurl.com/cpayh
For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for
how the LORD has reshaped me:
http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt
Prayerfully in Christ's love,
Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk
.





User: "Michael Gray"

Title: Re: Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in 2006! 02 Jan 2006 05:07:30 AM
On Mon, 2 Jan 2006 02:20:56 -0800, "Chuck Stamford"
<shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote:
:

Just what we needed around here...another obfuscator on personal
responsibility.

Never mind what I told you. You obviously have much deeper ethical problems
than simply manipulating post headers willy-nilly.

:
Doctor Chung is the most complete fucking lunatic you could ever hope
not to meet.
.
User: "Darrell Stec"

Title: Re: Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in 2006! 02 Jan 2006 02:24:53 PM
Michael Gray wrote:

On Mon, 2 Jan 2006 02:20:56 -0800, "Chuck Stamford"
<shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote:

:

Just what we needed around here...another obfuscator on personal
responsibility.

Never mind what I told you. You obviously have much deeper ethical
problems than simply manipulating post headers willy-nilly.

:

Doctor Chung is the most complete fucking lunatic you could ever hope
not to meet.

Why play into his lunacy by calling him "doctor" without the quotes?
Are you paracticing for the role of enabler?
--
Later,
Darrell Stec

Webpage Sorcery
http://webpagesorcery.com
We Put the Magic in Your Webpages
.
User: "Christopher A. Lee"

Title: Re: Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in 2006! 02 Jan 2006 02:59:16 PM
On Mon, 02 Jan 2006 15:24:53 -0500, Darrell Stec
<darrell_stec@webpagesorcery.com> wrote:

Michael Gray wrote:

On Mon, 2 Jan 2006 02:20:56 -0800, "Chuck Stamford"
<shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote:

:

Just what we needed around here...another obfuscator on personal
responsibility.

Never mind what I told you. You obviously have much deeper ethical
problems than simply manipulating post headers willy-nilly.

:

Doctor Chung is the most complete fucking lunatic you could ever hope
not to meet.



Why play into his lunacy by calling him "doctor" without the quotes?
Are you paracticing for the role of enabler?

Apparently he really was one before his lunacy got him kicked out of
the profession. Specifically a cardiologist - which I find
particularly scary.
.
User: "Darrell Stec"

Title: Re: Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in 2006! 02 Jan 2006 06:32:32 PM
Christopher A. Lee wrote:

On Mon, 02 Jan 2006 15:24:53 -0500, Darrell Stec
<darrell_stec@webpagesorcery.com> wrote:

Michael Gray wrote:

On Mon, 2 Jan 2006 02:20:56 -0800, "Chuck Stamford"
<shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote:

:

Just what we needed around here...another obfuscator on personal
responsibility.

Never mind what I told you. You obviously have much deeper ethical
problems than simply manipulating post headers willy-nilly.

:

Doctor Chung is the most complete fucking lunatic you could ever
hope not to meet.



Why play into his lunacy by calling him "doctor" without the quotes?
Are you paracticing for the role of enabler?


Apparently he really was one before his lunacy got him kicked out of
the profession. Specifically a cardiologist - which I find
particularly scary.

How sure can we be that this is indeed the same doctor and not someone
with the same name or assuming his identity? Even among my computer
literate friends, and those in the computer field, none of them have
ever made it to the newsgroups for any reason. Any real doctor might
be unaware of someone appropriating his identity on newsgroups being
entirely unfamiliar with their existance.
I'm sorry, but I can't envision any real doctor attributing to demoniacs
that which resides under the auspices of hormones, genes and germs.
--
Later,
Darrell Stec

Webpage Sorcery
http://webpagesorcery.com
We Put the Magic in Your Webpages
.


User: "Michael Gray"

Title: Re: Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in 2006! 02 Jan 2006 05:40:30 PM
On Mon, 02 Jan 2006 15:24:53 -0500, Darrell Stec
<darrell_stec@webpagesorcery.com> wrote:

Michael Gray wrote:

On Mon, 2 Jan 2006 02:20:56 -0800, "Chuck Stamford"
<shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote:

:

Just what we needed around here...another obfuscator on personal
responsibility.

Never mind what I told you. You obviously have much deeper ethical
problems than simply manipulating post headers willy-nilly.

:

Doctor Chung is the most complete fucking lunatic you could ever hope
not to meet.



Why play into his lunacy by calling him "doctor" without the quotes?
Are you paracticing for the role of enabler?

Because, I'm sorry to say, he legally retains that formal title.
For the time being, at least.
Until a medical board comes to their senses, and not only relieves him
of his positions, but his license.
.
User: "Richard Smol"

Title: Re: Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in 2006! 03 Jan 2006 07:14:02 AM
Michael Gray wrote:

On Mon, 02 Jan 2006 15:24:53 -0500, Darrell Stec
<darrell_stec@webpagesorcery.com> wrote:

Michael Gray wrote:

On Mon, 2 Jan 2006 02:20:56 -0800, "Chuck Stamford"
<shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote:

:

Just what we needed around here...another obfuscator on personal
responsibility.

Never mind what I told you. You obviously have much deeper ethical
problems than simply manipulating post headers willy-nilly.

:

Doctor Chung is the most complete fucking lunatic you could ever hope
not to meet.



Why play into his lunacy by calling him "doctor" without the quotes?
Are you paracticing for the role of enabler?


Because, I'm sorry to say, he legally retains that formal title.
For the time being, at least.
Until a medical board comes to their senses, and not only relieves him
of his positions, but his license.

Unless he also has a Ph. D.
RS
.



User: "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD"

Title: Conqueror bent on conquest: The Lamb opened the 1st of the 7 seals on His birthday (12/25/2005) 02 Jan 2006 06:40:14 AM
Michael Gray wrote:

On Mon, 2 Jan 2006 02:20:56 -0800, "Chuck Stamford"
<shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote:

Just what we needed around here...another obfuscator on personal
responsibility.

Never mind what I told you. You obviously have much deeper ethical problems
than simply manipulating post headers willy-nilly.


Doctor Chung is the most complete fucking lunatic you could ever hope
not to meet.

May the following awaken you:
http://tinyurl.com/awken
Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things
like cardiology, diabetes and nutrition that interest those following
this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/05/06) from 6 to 7 pm
EST:
http://tinyurl.com/cpayh
For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for
how the LORD has reshaped me:
http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt
Prayerfully in Christ's love,
Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk
.




User: "Michael Gray"

Title: Re: Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in 2006! 02 Jan 2006 02:35:23 AM
On Sun, 1 Jan 2006 22:17:20 -0800, "Chuck Stamford"
<shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote:
:

Andrew,

You need to stop adding newsgroups to those posts to which you choose to
respond. If you want to post to those additional groups, you are of course,
free to do so, but you only have the right to decide where your OWN remarks
will be posted, not those of another. Most ethical people understand these
fundamentals.

Chuck Stamford

He won't listen to you, Chuck, polite as your request is.
Andrew is quite insane.
.
User: "Chuck Stamford"

Title: Re: Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in 2006! 02 Jan 2006 04:27:45 AM
"Michael Gray" <fleetg@newsguy.spam.com> wrote in message
news:5cphr1tbjgid1s59rhm7numapbap3mrrlt@4ax.com...

On Sun, 1 Jan 2006 22:17:20 -0800, "Chuck Stamford"
<shell__stamford@cox.net> wrote:

:

Andrew,

You need to stop adding newsgroups to those posts to which you choose to
respond. If you want to post to those additional groups, you are of
course,
free to do so, but you only have the right to decide where your OWN
remarks
will be posted, not those of another. Most ethical people understand
these
fundamentals.

Chuck Stamford


He won't listen to you, Chuck, polite as your request is.
Andrew is quite insane.

Well I know you're at least half right now. I've seldom seen a more subtle
and devious attempt to deflect a criticism than his response to me. That's
enough for me not to spend much time on seeing if you're completely right.
Not that I'm willing to take your word for his insanity...I just don't care
enough to find the prospect of dying without knowing something I should be
concerned about. ;-)
Chuck Stamford
.



User: "Richard Smol"

Title: Re: Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in 2006! 03 Jan 2006 07:16:00 AM
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:

::: vera ::: wrote:

We know that the Son of God has come,

and has given us an understanding,

that we know him who is true,

and we are in him who is true,

in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

(1 John 5:20 WEB)

Jesus, the Alpha, the Omega, who was, who is, and who will be, also in
2006!

Praise the Lord!

Peace for 2006,

::: vera :::
____________________________________________________
::::::: http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de :::::::
::::::: http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de/Israel.htm :::::::
::::::: http://www.e-sword.net :::::::


Yes, all praises belong to the LORD, Whom we love with all of our
hearts, souls, minds, and strengths :-))

Do you really think the people in alt.atheism are interested in your
psychotic delusions?
RS
.


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