In article <mnsbe.422$gd5.242@newssvr12.news.prodigy.com>, "Scott"
<scott@nospam.net> wrote:

"Brian E. Clark" <reply@newsgroup.only.please> wrote in message
news:MPG.1cd757dba9498889899a6@news.comcast.giganews.com...

In article <rSu9e.570$%L1.456@newssvr30.news.prodigy.com>, Scott
said...

So the damn question is: If they won't
follow the Church's teaching about drugs and sex
why of hell would they not
ignore it with regards to the use of condoms?

There is rather obvious difference between theologically based
teachings -- "You should refrain from sex before marriage" --
and science-derived information about public health -- "Condoms
considerably reduce the spread of AIDS."

Even if a devout and dutiful Catholic woman has sex with only
her husband, she can still become infected with AIDS if her
hubby decides to ignore Catholic directives on monogamy.

then why shouldn't he also ignore the condom issue.

If the

husband uses a condom, however, he protects himself, his wife,
the child she's carrying, and any other woman he sleeps with.

Well that sounds practical.....problem and it's a big one that your
ignoring. Men in these societies don't like using them for
social-emotional
reasons. ... ... ...

. According to a female family member, her cervix is so sensitive that
she can feel the ejaculate. Occasionally, this can push her over the edge
and an orgasm summarily results.

• According to a female family member, her cervix is so sensitive that
she can feel the ejaculate. Occasionally, this can push her over the edge
and an orgasm summarily results.

On Tue, 26 Apr 2005 14:38:10 GMT, "Scott" <scott@nospam.net> wrote:

"Brian E. Clark" <reply@newsgroup.only.please> wrote in message
news:MPG.1cd757dba9498889899a6@news.comcast.giganews.com...

In article <rSu9e.570$%L1.456@newssvr30.news.prodigy.com>, Scott
said...

So the damn question is: If they won't
follow the Church's teaching about drugs and sex
why of hell would they not
ignore it with regards to the use of condoms?

There is rather obvious difference between theologically based
teachings -- "You should refrain from sex before marriage" --
and science-derived information about public health -- "Condoms
considerably reduce the spread of AIDS."

Even if a devout and dutiful Catholic woman has sex with only
her husband, she can still become infected with AIDS if her
hubby decides to ignore Catholic directives on monogamy.

then why shouldn't he also ignore the condom issue.

If the

husband uses a condom, however, he protects himself, his wife,
the child she's carrying, and any other woman he sleeps with.

Well that sounds practical.....problem and it's a big one that your
ignoring. Men in these societies don't like using them for
social-emotional
reasons. It goes against their precieved manhood. In the same way you
can't
just talk about the practical reasons for getting married, you can't
ignore
the social-emotional of the cultural issue and simply (or nievely) blame
it
on the Church. The Church preaches abstanance. It's then up to them to
accepted or reject it.

The church has nothing to say but says it anyway.

If it were really concerned it would do something instead of
preaching abstinence.

Is it really so hard to grasp that people have sex no matter how much
you don't like them to.

And they're going to have it anyway regardless of what some senile
celibate in Rome says.

And that any help has to be practical rather than imposing the same
senile celibate's conscience on them.

If he wants to abstain, let him.

On Thu, 21 Apr 2005 15:09:30 GMT, "Scott" <scott@nospam.net> wrote:

"thomas p" <tonyofbexarnospam@yahoo.dk> wrote in message
news:v7ge619e5m7hia0abtq9ittad5d5tt5lki@4ax.com...

On Wed, 20 Apr 2005 15:49:43 GMT, "Scott" <scott@nospam.net> wrote:

"Christopher A. Lee" <calee@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:bjqc615qb4nchbpjtr67nl2u1h1qft7s99@4ax.com...

On 20 Apr 2005 07:38:54 -0700, "MrPepper11" <MrPepper11@go.com> wrote:

snipped

The Vatican needs to address reality and to come to terms with the
fact that eg their policy on condoms is helping spread AIDS in the
developing countries.

Oh how damn stupid. I get so tired of reading this. I thought you
atheists
gave up scapegoat to champion individual choice. The Church's position
is
to
stay away from illicit drug us and illicit sex - to only have monogamous
sex
within marriage. That HIV is being spread amongst Catholics is because
they
AREN'T following those teachings. So the damn question is: If they won't
follow the Church's teaching about drugs and sex why of hell would they
not
ignore it with regards to the use of condoms? *****! You read too much
liberal party line *****.

But I have yet to see a Pope with the courtesy and common sense to
realise that his doctrines only apply to Catholics. And then only that
subset who follow his word.

"And then only that subset who follow his word"??? And so here you just
contradicted yourself to what you said above on spreading HIV.

The Church has used its not inconsiderable political influence to
prevent the distribution of condoms in places like Africa and South
America, so, whether or not a person follows the Church's teachings,
millions have been prevented from obtaining condoms.

Assuming true, they sure haven't been able to slow drug use.

http://www.un-ngls.org/documents/publications.en/voices.africa/number10/a16niang.htm

http://www.unaids.org/ungass/en/global/UNGASS14_en.htm
Condom access gap. The United Nations Population Fund (UNFPA) estimates
that
the current supply of male condoms (6 to 9 billion a year) represents only
one-quarter of what is needed. The present supply of male condoms in
Africa,
where the epidemic is overwhelmingly driven by sexual transmission,
amounts
to only approximately three condoms per year for each adult male. UNFPA
estimates that international spending on condoms in 2000 represents only
19%
of what was needed. Likewise, even though numerous studies have
demonstrated
that female condoms are both effective in preventing HIV transmission and
generally acceptable to women and their sexual partners, access to female
condoms remains limited in low- and middle-income countries.

Maybe you think Catholic Charities should be the main despenser of
condoms.

No, I said nothing like that at all. What I said is true.

done its best, along with other medieval organizations, and with a
great deal of success, to keep condoms away from the people who need
them.

distributing condoms to the poor; but I certainly do not expect it. I
expect more of the same insane behavior from the Church.

I seems to me that in the spirit of Humanae Vitae the use of a condom to
prevent an infected person from spreading the disease is acceptable
because
the purpose is a moral medical reason and not contraceptive one.

I said nothing about your opinion. My comment applied to the
Catholic Church.

In addition,

while it is true that more and more Catholics (especially in the
developed world) pay little attention to the Church's opinion, many
do. The Church shares a great deal of the responsibility for the
spread of the disease.

HUH? That doesn't follow. How can these "many" who do follow the Church's
teaching and not have sex outside of marriage being increasing the spread
of
the disease?

Since I said no such thing, I have no need to answer your idiotic
question.