| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"Abhi" |
| Date: |
28 Dec 2004 01:44:01 PM |
| Object: |
Reason, Logic Vs Faith, Belief. |
Once upon a time I was walking down the road. One atheist X was arguing
with other atheist Y who was born blind.
Atheist X was telling the blind atheist Y that he can see the blue sky.
But every time atheist X went on explaining how blue color is, what sky
is, the blind atheist was throwing his arguments by one sentence,
"prove the existence of blue sky. I never experienced what it is".
In the end, atheists X shouted, "why don't you "believe" me, you
moron?"
Obviously the blind atheist is lacking one sense i.e. vision. That
blind atheist can not see the world we see and hence will never believe
existence of blue sky. He will have to believe other atheist.
This brings me to my very first thought when I began thinking about
origin of universe 5 years ago.
------------------------------
Do we human beings have enough senses to understand what "ultimate
truth" is?
-----------------------------
I don't know the answer of this question. But what I have experienced
through my present senses that that supernatural force, God does exist.
There are somethings which can not be proven. If you tell me that you
love your parents, kids, I will have to "believe" you. There is no way,
you can prove love. I feel that God loves you all the people, living
beings. You will have to "believe" me, people like me.
We can not undermine importance of "reason, logic" in our life. But
Faith, belief is also equally important. Through logic, reason we can
understand how our universe works. And through love, faith we can reach
to God. If we abandon one of these two things(logic and love), we will
be in darkness forever.
-Abhi.
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| User: "SReeseMe" |
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| Title: Re: Reason, Logic Vs Faith, Belief. |
28 Dec 2004 03:22:54 PM |
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<< Subject: Reason, Logic Vs Faith, Belief.
From: "Abhi"
Date: Tue, Dec 28, 2004 2:44 PM
Message-id: <1104263041.957109.106360@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com> >><BR><BR>
<***** SNIPPED>
<MORE ***** SNIPPED>
<EVEN MORE ***** SNIPPED>
Opps! Nothing left.
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| User: "Fred Stone" |
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| Title: Re: Reason, Logic Vs Faith, Belief. |
28 Dec 2004 02:14:26 PM |
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"Abhi" <Abhijeet_B_Patil@hotmail.com> wrote in
news:1104263041.957109.106360@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com:
Once upon a time I was walking down the road. One atheist X was
arguing with other atheist Y who was born blind.
Atheist X was telling the blind atheist Y that he can see the blue
sky. But every time atheist X went on explaining how blue color is,
what sky is, the blind atheist was throwing his arguments by one
sentence, "prove the existence of blue sky. I never experienced what
it is".
In the end, atheists X shouted, "why don't you "believe" me, you
moron?"
Obviously the blind atheist is lacking one sense i.e. vision. That
blind atheist can not see the world we see and hence will never
believe existence of blue sky. He will have to believe other atheist.
This brings me to my very first thought when I began thinking about
origin of universe 5 years ago.
------------------------------
Do we human beings have enough senses to understand what "ultimate
truth" is?
-----------------------------
I don't know the answer of this question. But what I have experienced
through my present senses that that supernatural force, God does
exist. There are somethings which can not be proven. If you tell me
that you love your parents, kids, I will have to "believe" you. There
is no way, you can prove love. I feel that God loves you all the
people, living beings. You will have to "believe" me, people like me.
No, we won't *have to* believe you. The best you can manage is to claim
that god is an emotion or some other subjective contents of your own
mind. Big deal.
We can not undermine importance of "reason, logic" in our life. But
Faith, belief is also equally important.
No it's not.
Through logic, reason we can
understand how our universe works. And through love, faith we can
reach to God. If we abandon one of these two things(logic and love),
we will be in darkness forever.
-Abhi.
Yawn. Another "you're too blind" argument.
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
Support bacteria! That's all the culture many people will ever have.
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| User: "Ron Baker, Pluralitas!" |
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| Title: Re: Reason, Logic Vs Faith, Belief. |
28 Dec 2004 03:05:11 PM |
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"Abhi" <Abhijeet_B_Patil@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1104263041.957109.106360@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Once upon a time I was walking down the road. One atheist X was arguing
with other atheist Y who was born blind.
Atheist X was telling the blind atheist Y that he can see the blue sky.
But every time atheist X went on explaining how blue color is, what sky
is, the blind atheist was throwing his arguments by one sentence,
"prove the existence of blue sky. I never experienced what it is".
In the end, atheists X shouted, "why don't you "believe" me, you
moron?"
Obviously the blind atheist is lacking one sense i.e. vision. That
blind atheist can not see the world we see and hence will never believe
existence of blue sky. He will have to believe other atheist.
This brings me to my very first thought when I began thinking about
origin of universe 5 years ago.
------------------------------
Do we human beings have enough senses to understand what "ultimate
truth" is?
-----------------------------
I don't know the answer of this question. But what I have experienced
through my present senses that that supernatural force, God does exist.
How is that? How have you sensed supernatural force?
There are somethings which can not be proven. If you tell me that you
love your parents, kids, I will have to "believe" you. There is no way,
you can prove love. I feel that God loves you all the people, living
beings. You will have to "believe" me, people like me.
We can not undermine importance of "reason, logic" in our life. But
Faith, belief is also equally important. Through logic, reason we can
understand how our universe works. And through love, faith we can reach
to God. If we abandon one of these two things(logic and love), we will
be in darkness forever.
-Abhi.
--
rb
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| User: "kathryn" |
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| Title: Re: Reason, Logic Vs Faith, Belief. |
29 Dec 2004 02:14:56 PM |
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"Abhi" <Abhijeet_B_Patil@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1104263041.957109.106360@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Once upon a time I was walking down the road. One atheist X was arguing
with other atheist Y who was born blind.
Atheist X was telling the blind atheist Y that he can see the blue sky.
But every time atheist X went on explaining how blue color is, what sky
is, the blind atheist was throwing his arguments by one sentence,
"prove the existence of blue sky. I never experienced what it is".
In the end, atheists X shouted, "why don't you "believe" me, you
moron?"
Obviously the blind atheist is lacking one sense i.e. vision. That
blind atheist can not see the world we see and hence will never believe
existence of blue sky. He will have to believe other atheist.
This brings me to my very first thought when I began thinking about
origin of universe 5 years ago.
------------------------------
Do we human beings have enough senses to understand what "ultimate
truth" is?
-----------------------------
I don't know the answer of this question. But what I have experienced
through my present senses that that supernatural force, God does exist.
There are somethings which can not be proven. If you tell me that you
love your parents, kids, I will have to "believe" you. There is no way,
you can prove love. I feel that God loves you all the people, living
beings. You will have to "believe" me, people like me.
We can not undermine importance of "reason, logic" in our life. But
Faith, belief is also equally important. Through logic, reason we can
understand how our universe works. And through love, faith we can reach
to God. If we abandon one of these two things(logic and love), we will
be in darkness forever.
-Abhi.
Hmm isn't that from Peter Pan? Tinkerbell needs the children to really
believe in fairies?
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| User: "Denis Loubet" |
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| Title: Re: Reason, Logic Vs Faith, Belief. |
28 Dec 2004 05:13:36 PM |
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"Abhi" <Abhijeet_B_Patil@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1104263041.957109.106360@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Once upon a time I was walking down the road. One atheist X was arguing
with other atheist Y who was born blind.
Atheist X was telling the blind atheist Y that he can see the blue sky.
But every time atheist X went on explaining how blue color is, what sky
is, the blind atheist was throwing his arguments by one sentence,
"prove the existence of blue sky. I never experienced what it is".
Give the blind atheist two pieces of paper, one blue and yellow, and have a
bunch of people enter the room one at a time and have them identify the
color of the paper the blind guy is holding up. Pretty soon the blind guy
will have to conclude that the people are using a sense that he does not
have because they are correctly identifying the color he is holding up from
clear across the room 100% of the time.
(Obviously, the stricter the experimental protocols, the more justified the
conclusion.)
In the end, atheists X shouted, "why don't you "believe" me, you
moron?"
Yes, you can have your enemy say whatever idiotic things you want him to say
if you are writing both sides of the story.
Obviously the blind atheist is lacking one sense i.e. vision. That
blind atheist can not see the world we see and hence will never believe
existence of blue sky. He will have to believe other atheist.
No, the blind guy can test for the existence of color, and a lot of other
physical phenomenon, by the careful application of science. I can't see into
the infrared, but I know it exists because my TV remote works.
Like the blind guy will never experience seeing blue, I'll never experience
seeing in the infrared, but I'll know it's there.
This brings me to my very first thought when I began thinking about
origin of universe 5 years ago.
Starting from this crippled beginning, this ought to be good.
------------------------------
Do we human beings have enough senses to understand what "ultimate
truth" is?
-----------------------------
No.
I don't know the answer of this question. But what I have experienced
through my present senses that that supernatural force, God does exist.
Then you should be able to show anyone the same thing with their present
senses.
How do you know that what you experienced was god?
There are somethings which can not be proven. If you tell me that you
love your parents, kids, I will have to "believe" you.
No, that claim can be justified by objective evidence. You can examine my
behavior and draw conclusions.
There is no way,
you can prove love.
But you can examine evidence and draw conclusions.
I feel that God loves you all the people, living
beings. You will have to "believe" me, people like me.
Show me the evidence. If you don't have any, then your conclusions are
unjustified.
We can not undermine importance of "reason, logic" in our life.
Sure we can, just watch yourself.
But
Faith, belief is also equally important.
There, you just undermined the importance of reason and logic.
Through logic, reason we can
understand how our universe works.
We can construct a pretty good model.
And through love, faith we can reach
to God.
This has not been established. Please provide an experiment that can be
performed that will demonstrate the existence of a god, like the blind guy
can design one to demonstrate the existence of color, that will make it
apparent to everyone.
If we abandon one of these two things(logic and love), we will
be in darkness forever.
We can examine behavior and other evidence to conclude that love and reason
exist. I have no problem with love or reason. What you have not established
is the existence of this god-thing you're talking about.
--
Denis Loubet
dloubet@io.com
http://www.io.com/~dloubet
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| User: "Dr Bukkake" |
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| Title: Re: Reason, Logic Vs Faith, Belief. |
28 Dec 2004 10:32:01 PM |
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This brings me to my very first thought when I began thinking about
origin of universe 5 years ago.
How did you manage to get so stupid in only five years?
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| User: "sAnToLiNa" |
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| Title: Re: Reason, Logic Vs Faith, Belief. |
28 Dec 2004 10:38:51 PM |
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Abhi <Abhijeet_B_Patil@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1104263041.957109.106360@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
This brings me to my very first thought when I began thinking about
origin of universe 5 years ago.
The universe originated more than 5 years ago, dumbass.
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| User: "Tukla Ratte" |
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| Title: Re: Reason, Logic Vs Faith, Belief. |
28 Dec 2004 03:21:10 PM |
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Abhi wrote:
< snip >
But what I have experienced
through my present senses that that supernatural force, God does exist.
Those are called "hallucinations", hon.
There are somethings which can not be proven. If you tell me that you
love your parents, kids, I will have to "believe" you. There is no way,
you can prove love. I feel that God loves you all the people, living
beings. You will have to "believe" me, people like me.
So God is nothing but your subjective feeling. Okay, I buy that.
We can not undermine importance of "reason, logic" in our life. But
Faith, belief is also equally important.
Um, no. It's not.
Through logic, reason we can
understand how our universe works. And through love, faith we can reach
to God.
Whatever you might imagine him/her/it/them to be.
If we abandon one of these two things(logic and love), we will
be in darkness forever.
Tell that to the rabid fundies running the US Government. They are
doing their best to abandon logic.
Most atheists, OTOH, embrace both logic and love. We just don't imagine
some sort of invisible "love creature" independent of us.
--
Tukla, Eater of Theists, Squeaker of Chew Toys
Official Mascot of Alt.Atheism, aa 1347
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| User: "bloodyvikings" |
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| Title: Re: Reason, Logic Vs Faith, Belief. |
29 Dec 2004 04:09:47 AM |
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Abhi wrote:
A stupid apocryphal anecdote about two straw atheists.
Followed by
An insinuation that Atheists lack some senses that believers possess
followed by
Some ridiculous speculation about extra-sensory reality
to which he auto replied
I don't know the answer of this question.
but nevertheless asserted:
God does exist.
but admitted
There are somethings which can not be proven.
Then went on:
If you tell me that you
love your parents, kids, I will have to "believe" you. There is no way,
you can prove love. I feel that God loves you all the people, living
beings. You will have to "believe" me, people like me.
'Prove that you love me, and buy the next round' - Janis Joplin.
We can not undermine importance of "reason, logic" in our life. But
Faith, belief is also equally important.
Faith, belief are only important, or indeed useful to the following
categories of people:
Snake oil salesmen
Self aggrandising charlatans
Monarchs
Capitalists
Liars
Gullible fuckwits (important but not useful).
.
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| User: "Josef Balluch" |
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| Title: Re: Reason, Logic Vs Faith, Belief. |
28 Dec 2004 02:30:53 PM |
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In a message sent 'round the world, Abhi poured fuel on the fire with
the following:
Once upon a time I was walking down the road.
This is quite an appropriate opening for your fairy tale.
[ snip some twaddle ]
....
Do we human beings have enough senses to understand what "ultimate
truth" is?
I don't know the answer of this question.
But you would never let that stop you from telling us all about your
speculations.
But what I have experienced
through my present senses that that supernatural force, God does exist.
Which god? Are you by chance referring to the Zero god?
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/alt.atheism/msg/157f4c74dba51fd3
There are somethings which can not be proven. If you tell me that you
love your parents, kids, I will have to "believe" you. There is no way,
you can prove love. I feel that God loves you all the people, living
beings. You will have to "believe" me, people like me.
You can believe what you wish. What makes you think I should share that
belief?
We can not undermine importance of "reason, logic" in our life. But
Faith, belief is also equally important. Through logic, reason we can
understand how our universe works. And through love, faith we can reach
to God. If we abandon one of these two things(logic and love), we will
be in darkness forever.
You can start by demonstrating the existence of a deity. Any deity.
Regards,
Josef
Faith may be defined briefly as an illogical belief in the occurrence of
the improbable.
-- H. L. Mencken
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| User: "Kate " |
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| Title: Re: Reason, Logic Vs Faith, Belief. |
29 Dec 2004 09:37:02 AM |
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On 28 Dec 2004 11:44:01 -0800, "Abhi" <Abhijeet_B_Patil@hotmail.com>
wrote:
Once upon a time I was walking down the road. One atheist X was arguing
with other atheist Y who was born blind.
Atheist X was telling the blind atheist Y that he can see the blue sky.
But every time atheist X went on explaining how blue color is, what sky
is, the blind atheist was throwing his arguments by one sentence,
"prove the existence of blue sky. I never experienced what it is".
In the end, atheists X shouted, "why don't you "believe" me, you
moron?"
Obviously the blind atheist is lacking one sense i.e. vision. That
blind atheist can not see the world we see and hence will never believe
existence of blue sky. He will have to believe other atheist.
This brings me to my very first thought when I began thinking about
origin of universe 5 years ago.
------------------------------
Do we human beings have enough senses to understand what "ultimate
truth" is?
-----------------------------
I don't know the answer of this question. But what I have experienced
through my present senses that that supernatural force, God does exist.
There are somethings which can not be proven. If you tell me that you
love your parents, kids, I will have to "believe" you. There is no way,
you can prove love. I feel that God loves you all the people, living
beings. You will have to "believe" me, people like me.
We can not undermine importance of "reason, logic" in our life. But
Faith, belief is also equally important. Through logic, reason we can
understand how our universe works. And through love, faith we can reach
to God. If we abandon one of these two things(logic and love), we will
be in darkness forever.
-Abhi.
So to take your analogy further, the blind man discovers that every
other 'sighted' person describes the sky totally differently and each
felt that the other 'sighted' people were blind too.
The blind man decided that there was no such thing as sight and all
these 'sighted' people were just wanting everyone else to let them do
their 'seeing' for them so he or she could feel important.
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| User: "Les Hellawell" |
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| Title: Re: Reason, Logic Vs Faith, Belief. |
28 Dec 2004 02:33:36 PM |
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On 28 Dec 2004 11:44:01 -0800, "Abhi" <Abhijeet_B_Patil@hotmail.com>
wrote:
Once upon a time I was walking down the road. One atheist X was arguing
with other atheist Y who was born blind.
Atheist X was telling the blind atheist Y that he can see the blue sky.
But every time atheist X went on explaining how blue color is, what sky
is, the blind atheist was throwing his arguments by one sentence,
"prove the existence of blue sky. I never experienced what it is".
In the end, atheists X shouted, "why don't you "believe" me, you
moron?"
Obviously the blind atheist is lacking one sense i.e. vision. That
blind atheist can not see the world we see and hence will never believe
existence of blue sky. He will have to believe other atheist.
Why other atheists. I would have thought that is the blind atheist
was sensible, as most atheists are he would have asked around
and, getting the same answer from disparate people that they
are clearly experiencing things he cannot.
This brings me to my very first thought when I began thinking about
origin of universe 5 years ago.
------------------------------
Do we human beings have enough senses to understand what "ultimate
truth" is?
-----------------------------
That depends I guess I whether you have an enquiring mind
or just fall back on belief and close your mind.
I don't know the answer of this question. But what I have experienced
through my present senses that that supernatural force, God does exist.
Then this belief is solely in your mind but it is only a belief not
a knowledge.
If you know god exists then you must be able to explain this
existence demonstrate how you know. If it only comes from your mind it
has to be a product of your mind.
There are somethings which can not be proven. If you tell me that you
love your parents, kids, I will have to "believe" you. There is no way,
you can prove love. I feel that God loves you all the people, living
beings. You will have to "believe" me, people like me.
I don't believe you know as I don't believe in gods but accept
you believe, Can you accept we do not believe?
We can not undermine importance of "reason, logic" in our life. But
Faith, belief is also equally important. Through logic, reason we can
understand how our universe works. And through love, faith we can reach
to God. If we abandon one of these two things(logic and love), we will
be in darkness forever.
Fine reach out, let your imagination run wild do your own thing just
don't expect others to join in your fantasy world.
--
Les Hellawell
greetings from
YORKSHIRE - The White Rose County
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| User: "bloodyvikings" |
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| Title: Re: Reason, Logic Vs Faith, Belief. |
29 Dec 2004 04:16:32 AM |
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Les Hellawell wrote:
I don't believe you know as I don't believe in gods but accept
you believe, Can you accept we do not believe?
I don't believe he can. (or is that 'I believe he can't').
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| User: "raven1" |
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| Title: Re: Reason, Logic Vs Faith, Belief. |
29 Dec 2004 03:20:07 AM |
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On 28 Dec 2004 11:44:01 -0800, "Abhi" <Abhijeet_B_Patil@hotmail.com>
wrote:
This brings me to my very first thought when I began thinking about
origin of universe 5 years ago.
Obviously you've had none either before or since.
<plonk>
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| User: "stoney" |
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| Title: Re: Reason, Logic Vs Faith, Belief. |
29 Dec 2004 06:08:47 PM |
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On 28 Dec 2004 11:44:01 -0800, "Abhi" <Abhijeet_B_Patil@hotmail.com>
wrote:
Take your superstitious ***** elsewhere, wanker.
[]
--
Contempt of Congress meter reading-offscale.
Hello, theocracy with a fundamentalist US Supreme
Court who will ensure church and state are joined
at the hip like clergy and altar boys.
America 1776-Jan 2001 RIP
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| User: "Christopher A. Lee" |
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| Title: Re: Reason, Logic Vs Faith, Belief. |
28 Dec 2004 01:50:56 PM |
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On 28 Dec 2004 11:44:01 -0800, "Abhi" <Abhijeet_B_Patil@hotmail.com>
wrote:
[more gratuitous in-your-face nastiness trimmed]
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| User: "Vic Sagerquist" |
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| Title: Re: Reason, Logic Vs Faith, Belief. |
28 Dec 2004 03:44:49 PM |
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On 28 Dec 2004, Abhi dropped trou, farted, whirled, then shouted:
Do we human beings have enough senses to understand what "ultimate
truth" is?
Yes. Unfortunately, too many people have been convinced by the promise of
afterlife that just about anything they can wish for exists.
--
Vic Sagerquist
aa#2011
Supervisor, EAC Department of little adhesive-backed "L" shaped
chrome-plastic doo-dads to add feet to Jesus fish department
--------
Hebrews 11:1
Faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not
seen.
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| User: "Martin Crisp" |
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| Title: Re: Reason, Logic Vs Faith, Belief. |
29 Dec 2004 05:54:03 AM |
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On Dec 29, 2004, Abhi sent message
<1104263041.957109.106360@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>, which
allegedly said:
Once upon a time I was walking down the road. One atheist X was arguing
with other atheist Y who was born blind.
Atheist Y was very excited, because, after his recent deconversion
from fundamentalist religion, where prayers for a cure had failed,
he had consulted a qualified ophthalmologist. The physician
reported that his blindness could be partially corrected, allowing
him to now see his devoted wife & children. Atheist X was merely
cautioning him that surgery is not an exact science, and that
'good' vision was not guaranteed.
Have Fun
Martin
[looking for happy endings]
--
aa #1792 Almost always SMASHed
AIM: Hypercube3141592
ICQ: 137333576
email: as given, or whatever you like @ tesseract.com.au
ph: http://www.whitepages.com.au/
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| User: "Abhi" |
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| Title: Re: Reason, Logic Vs Faith, Belief. |
29 Dec 2004 02:03:24 PM |
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Martin Crisp wrote:
On Dec 29, 2004, Abhi sent message
<1104263041.957109.106360@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>, which
allegedly said:
Once upon a time I was walking down the road. One atheist X was
arguing
with other atheist Y who was born blind.
Atheist Y was very excited, because, after his recent deconversion
from fundamentalist religion, where prayers for a cure had failed,
he had consulted a qualified ophthalmologist. The physician
reported that his blindness could be partially corrected, allowing
him to now see his devoted wife & children. Atheist X was merely
cautioning him that surgery is not an exact science, and that
'good' vision was not guaranteed.
Have Fun
Martin
[looking for happy endings]
I am also looking for happy endings. But at this moment I see over
80,000 people dead and millions with uncertain future. My heart goes
with them. I believe in God but I just don't understand when he is
goind to stop this evil.
Anyway, journey of life continues. I should be in journey over next 2-3
days. I wish you all USENET posters happy and prosperous new year.
-Abhi.
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| User: "kathryn" |
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| Title: Re: Reason, Logic Vs Faith, Belief. |
29 Dec 2004 03:10:39 PM |
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"Abhi" <Abhijeet_B_Patil@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1104350604.306744.40110@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Martin Crisp wrote:
On Dec 29, 2004, Abhi sent message
<1104263041.957109.106360@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>, which
allegedly said:
Once upon a time I was walking down the road. One atheist X was
arguing
with other atheist Y who was born blind.
Atheist Y was very excited, because, after his recent deconversion
from fundamentalist religion, where prayers for a cure had failed,
he had consulted a qualified ophthalmologist. The physician
reported that his blindness could be partially corrected, allowing
him to now see his devoted wife & children. Atheist X was merely
cautioning him that surgery is not an exact science, and that
'good' vision was not guaranteed.
Have Fun
Martin
[looking for happy endings]
I am also looking for happy endings. But at this moment I see over
80,000 people dead and millions with uncertain future. My heart goes
with them. I believe in God but I just don't understand when he is
goind to stop this evil.
Anyway, journey of life continues. I should be in journey over next 2-3
days. I wish you all USENET posters happy and prosperous new year.
-Abhi.
An earthquake is evil?
Funny you should mention that....
surely it's god fault.
"he" created the earth so he created it with moving tetonic plates and thin
crust.
Also he knows everything so he knew it was going to happen .
Yet he did nothing. Hmmmm.....god is evil then?
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| User: "Martin Crisp" |
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| Title: Re: Reason, Logic Vs Faith, Belief. |
30 Dec 2004 12:07:08 AM |
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On Dec 30, 2004, kathryn sent message
<cqv6ge$a6o$1@titan.btinternet.com>, which allegedly said:
An earthquake is evil?
Funny you should mention that....
surely it's god fault.
<groans> That's awful
Have Fun
Martin
--
aa #1792 Almost always SMASHed
AIM: Hypercube3141592
ICQ: 137333576
email: as given, or whatever you like @ tesseract.com.au
ph: http://www.whitepages.com.au/
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| User: "Martin Crisp" |
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| Title: Re: Reason, Logic Vs Faith, Belief. |
29 Dec 2004 06:36:04 PM |
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On Dec 30, 2004, Abhi sent message
<1104350604.306744.40110@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>, which
allegedly said:
Martin Crisp wrote:
On Dec 29, 2004, Abhi sent message
<1104263041.957109.106360@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>, which
allegedly said:
Once upon a time I was walking down the road. One atheist X was
arguing
with other atheist Y who was born blind.
Atheist Y was very excited, because, after his recent deconversion
from fundamentalist religion, where prayers for a cure had failed,
he had consulted a qualified ophthalmologist. The physician
reported that his blindness could be partially corrected, allowing
him to now see his devoted wife & children. Atheist X was merely
cautioning him that surgery is not an exact science, and that
'good' vision was not guaranteed.
Have Fun
Martin
[looking for happy endings]
I am also looking for happy endings. But at this moment I see over
80,000 people dead and millions with uncertain future. My heart goes
I see them too. And a blind person would understand, and believe,
without seeing the footage. As I'm sure you'd agree. So why the
bogus example to begin?
with them. I believe in God but I just don't understand when he is
goind to stop this evil.
Hint: he isn't. He didn't stop smallpox, we did. He doesn't stop
thousands starving each and every day (we should be able to).
*That* is the real human tragedy. [that the deaths in the tsunami
are less than a week's worth of starvation victims.]
Anyway, journey of life continues. I should be in journey over next 2-3
days. I wish you all USENET posters happy and prosperous new year.
-Abhi.
Ta.
Have Fun
Martin
--
aa #1792 Almost always SMASHed
AIM: Hypercube3141592
ICQ: 137333576
email: as given, or whatever you like @ tesseract.com.au
ph: http://www.whitepages.com.au/
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| User: "MarkA" |
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| Title: Re: Reason, Logic Vs Faith, Belief. |
28 Dec 2004 04:19:34 PM |
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On Tue, 28 Dec 2004 11:44:01 -0800, Abhi wrote:
Once upon a time I was walking down the road. One atheist X was arguing
with other atheist Y who was born blind.
<snip>
Why is "Faith, belief" equally important to "reason, logic?" If two
scientists disagree about a theory, they can devise experiments to supply
data to settle the question. If a Muslim and a Christian disagree about a
question of theologic significance, what can they do to resolve the
conflict? Nothing. They either have to tolerate the infidel, or try to
exterminate them. Unfortunately, far too many people are willing to kill
or be killed in the name of their god.
--
MarkA
(still caught in the maze of twisty little passages, all different)
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