| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"" |
| Date: |
26 Jun 2005 10:18:22 AM |
| Object: |
secularism prospers in America |
From: "Robert Nordlander" [delete]
Subject: In spite of Christian opposition, secularism prospers in America
Date: Sat, 25 Jun 2005 23:28:59 -0500
In spite of Christian opposition, secularism prospers in America
----- Original Message -----
From: George Erickson
From AxisofLogic.com
http://www.axisoflogic.com/artman/publish/article_18735.shtml
Featured
In spite of Christian opposition, secularism prospers in America
By Lee Salisbury
Jun 24, 2005, 18:18
"The obvious question is why people of such extraordinary intellect
value the secular view over religion."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
The American Religious Identification Survey 2001 conducted under the
auspices of the Graduate Center of the City University of New York (CUNY) a
follow-up study of a similar 1990 census. The poll utilized a sample of
over 50,000 randomly selected respondents. It is described as “the most
comprehensive portrait of religious identification in the U.S. today.” Very
briefly, it revealed, for instance, that Roman Catholics as a percentage of
the population decreased nearly 2%. Protestant’s proportion dropped sharply
from 60% to 52%, a 13% decrease.
One of the most significant findings was the change in that segment
of the adult population "identifying with no religion." In 1990, 14.3
million or roughly 8% identified with this category. The 2001 ARIS count
shows that the non-believer population grew to 29.4 million, roughly 14.1%
of the American population, a 76% increase.
This growth in secularism is particularly interesting. American media
consistently give Christian spokes person’s opportunity to express their
bias in the most favorable light. Almost without fail, this always
includes statements maligning secularists. Rarely, is any secularist given
the same opportunity to state why the secular view might be more meaningful
or intellectually honest than the Christian view. Most significantly, the
secularists have no national platform or organized leadership or financial
funding remotely comparable to the Christians. In spite of all these
drawbacks, the secularist view is spreading significantly faster than
Christianity.
Secular does not necessarily equate to only agnosticism or atheism.
Pantheists and deists, though believing in God, accept a secular worldview.
Atheist means “without theism” or without God belief. The atheist has
considered the evidence for a God and concluded the evidence is
insufficient. Agnostic means “without knowledge”. Agnostics believe only
the material realm is capable of exact knowledge and that it is impossible
to know whether there is a God. Pantheists believe that God and the
universe are the same. Deists base their belief in God solely on reason.
Deism’s God created the universe and then abandoned it. He assumes no
control over life, exerts no influence on natural phenomena, and gives no
supernatural revelation.
Atheists include Thomas Edison, Elizabeth Cady Stanton, H L Mencken,
Warren Buffet, and Bill Gates. Agnostics include Robert G Ingersoll,
Charles Darwin, Abraham Lincoln, and Carl Sagan. Pantheists include Albert
Einstein, Ralph Waldo Emerson, and Frank Lloyd Wright. Deists include
George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Paine, Benjamin Franklin, and
James Madison.
The obvious question is why people of such extraordinary intellect
value the secular view over religion. Why does the bible’s threat of hell
and promise of heaven not affect these people as it does others? Is it any
wonder why secularism is such a threat to some Christian clergy? Pope
Benedict XVI contends that the chief adversaries of God and the church are
secularists. Baptist Tim LaHaye, author of the best-selling “Left Behind”
rapture novels in his book “Mind Siege” claims secularists undermine
America’s patriotism and moral fabric.
Since we desire objectivity and since religious views on secularism
are readily available, it is reasonable to consider a few rarely heard
secular responses to the religious defamation.
Agnostic Robert Ingersoll said, “The notion that faith in Christ is
to be rewarded by an eternity of bliss, while a dependence upon reason,
observation, and experience merits everlasting pain, is too absurd for
refutation, and can be relieved only by that unhappy mixture of insanity
and ignorance called ‘faith.’”
Elizabeth Cady Stanton, woman’s suffragist leader stated, "The Bible
and the Church have been the greatest stumbling blocks in the way of
women's emancipation."
Journalist H. L. Mencken stated, “The Christian religion is
fundamentally opposed to everything I hold in veneration- courage, clear
thinking, honesty, fairness, and above all, love of the truth.”
Astronomer Carl Sagan said, "My view is that if there is no evidence
for it, then forget about it. An agnostic is somebody who doesn't believe
in something until there is evidence for it, so I'm agnostic."
President Abraham Lincoln said, "The Bible is not my book, nor
Christianity my profession. I could never give assent to the long,
complicated statements of Christian dogma."
Pantheist Albert Einstein said, "I cannot imagine a God who rewards
and punishes the objects of his creation, whose purposes are modeled after
our own -- a God, in short, who is but a reflection of human frailty.
Neither can I believe that the individual survives the death of his body,
although feeble souls harbor such thoughts through fear or ridiculous
egotism."
President Thomas Jefferson said, "The Christian god can easily be
pictured as virtually the same god as the many ancient gods of past
civilizations. The Christian god is a three headed monster; cruel, vengeful
and capricious. If one wishes to know more of this raging, three headed
beast-like god, one only needs to look at the caliber of people who say
they serve him. They are always of two classes: fools and hypocrites."
President James Madison said, “During almost fifteen centuries has
the legal establishment of Christianity been on trial. What have been its
fruits? More or less, in all places, pride and indolence in the clergy;
ignorance and servility in the laity; in both, superstition, bigotry, and
persecution."
Granted, the above views are harsh, stinging, and undiplomatic.
Nevertheless, the contributions to America by non-religious people with
secular views are overwhelming, worthy of respect and appreciation, not
vilification.
© Copyright 2005 by AxisofLogic.com
*****************************************************************************************
You are invited to check out the following:
The Constitutional Principle: Separation of Church and State
http://members.tripod.com/~candst/index.html
[and the discussion group for the above site listed below]
HRSepCnS · Hampton Roads SepChurch&State
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HRSepCnS/
[Its not just Hampton Roads folks who are members]
For people in Hampton Roads you are also invited to join
NORFOLK/VA. B. SEPARATION OF CHURCH AND STATE MEETUP GROUP
http://churchandstate.meetup.com/47/
Virginia Chapter Americans United for Separation of Church and State
http://au-va.org/
***************************************************************
.. . . You can't understand a phrase such as "Congress shall make no law
respecting an establishment of religion" by syllogistic reasoning. Words
take their meaning from social as well as textual contexts, which is why "a
page of history is worth a volume of logic." New York Trust Co. v. Eisner,
256 U.S. 345, 349, 41 S.Ct. 506, 507, 65 L.Ed. 963 (1921) (Holmes, J.).
Sherman v. Community Consol. Dist. 21, 980 F.2d 437, 445 (7th Cir. 1992)
.. . .
****************************************************************
THE CONSTITUTIONAL PRINCIPLE:
SEPARATION OF CHURCH AND STATE
http://members.tripod.com/~candst/index.html
"Dedicated to combatting 'history by sound bite'."
Now including a re-publication of Tom Peters
SEPARATION OF CHURCH AND STATE HOME PAGE
and
Audio links to Supreme Court oral arguments and
Speech by civil rights/constitutional lawyer and others.
This site is a member of the following web rings:
Freethought Ring--&--Freethought, Religion & Beliefs Ring
The First Amendment Ring--&--The Church-State Ring
American History WebRing--&--The History Ring
Let Freedom Ring--&--Religious Freedom Ring
Law Issues Ring--&--Legal Research Ring
****************************************************************
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| User: "Dana" |
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| Title: Re: secularism prospers in America |
26 Jun 2005 02:41:50 PM |
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<buckeye-ELO@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:pohtb1pf66k2k9oes3ha7itchd2381apao@4ax.com...
From: "Robert Nordlander" [delete]
Subject: In spite of Christian opposition, secularism prospers in America
There is no Christian opposition to secularism.
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| User: "Michelle Malkin" |
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| Title: Re: secularism prospers in America |
26 Jun 2005 05:42:54 PM |
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"Dana" <whoya@whoya.com> wrote in message
news:11bu140ao7ub888@corp.supernews.com...
<buckeye-ELO@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:pohtb1pf66k2k9oes3ha7itchd2381apao@4ax.com...
From: "Robert Nordlander" [delete]
Subject: In spite of Christian opposition, secularism prospers in
America
There is no Christian opposition to secularism.
Wow! I can hear the theme from "The Twilight Zone".
That must be where Dana is living these days.
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| User: "Dana" |
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| Title: Re: secularism prospers in America |
26 Jun 2005 07:20:41 PM |
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"Michelle Malkin" <hypatiab7@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:cc2dnSJoHb30siLfRVn-qA@comcast.com...
"Dana" <whoya@whoya.com> wrote in message
news:11bu140ao7ub888@corp.supernews.com...
<buckeye-ELO@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:pohtb1pf66k2k9oes3ha7itchd2381apao@4ax.com...
From: "Robert Nordlander" [delete]
Subject: In spite of Christian opposition, secularism prospers in
America
There is no Christian opposition to secularism.
Wow! I can hear the theme from "The Twilight Zone".
That must be where Dana is living these days.
And notice how you failed to provide any examples of Christians being
opposed to secularism.
What Christians are opposed too is when secular humanists use the courts to
force their beliefs on society.
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| User: "Jeff Welch" |
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| Title: Re: secularism prospers in America |
27 Jun 2005 12:49:40 AM |
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"Dana" <whoya@whoya.com> wrote in message
news:11buheqnp3ut8fd@corp.supernews.com...
And notice how you failed to provide any examples of Christians being
opposed to secularism.
http://www.noapathy.org/tracts/mythofseparation.html
http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2004/11/30/MNGVNA3PE11.DTL
http://mbhs.bergtraum.k12.ny.us/cybereng/nyt/teach-ev.htm
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=35420
http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2003/8/29/91853.shtml
http://www.townhall.com/columnists/davidlimbaugh/dl20030830.shtml
http://www.creationists.org/churchandstate.html
http://www.lc.org/Resources/separation.html
That's a start, ignorant right-wing fool.
-Jeff
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: secularism prospers in America |
27 Jun 2005 07:41:47 AM |
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Dana wrote:
"Michelle Malkin" <hypatiab7@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:cc2dnSJoHb30siLfRVn-qA@comcast.com...
"Dana" <whoya@whoya.com> wrote in message
news:11bu140ao7ub888@corp.supernews.com...
<buckeye-ELO@nospam.net> wrote i n message
news:pohtb1pf66k2k9oes3ha7itchd2381apao@4ax.com...
From: "Robert Nordlander" [delete]
Subject: In spite of Christian opposition, secularism prospers in
America
There is no Christian opposition to secularism.
Wow! I can hear the theme from "The Twilight Zone".
That must be where Dana is living these days.
And notice how you failed to provide any examples of Christians being
opposed to secularism.
What Christians are opposed too i s when secular humanists use the courts to
force their beliefs on society.
I love this. To the fundy mind, disallowing special
treatment for their religion (state sponsored school
prayer for example) is the same as forcing secular
humanist beliefs on society. Yes, to not be biased
in your favor is to be biased against you. To not
accomidate you with special consideration is persecution.
Viscount of alt.atheism Debate Standards and Practices
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| User: "Cary Kittrell" |
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| Title: Re: secularism prospers in America |
27 Jun 2005 12:34:37 PM |
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In article <1119876107.498974.40530@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com> writes:
Dana wrote:
"Michelle Malkin" <hypatiab7@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:cc2dnSJoHb30siLfRVn-qA@comcast.com...
"Dana" <whoya@whoya.com> wrote in message
news:11bu140ao7ub888@corp.supernews.com...
<buckeye-ELO@nospam.net> wrote i n message
news:pohtb1pf66k2k9oes3ha7itchd2381apao@4ax.com...
From: "Robert Nordlander" [delete]
Subject: In spite of Christian opposition, secularism prospers in
America
There is no Christian opposition to secularism.
Wow! I can hear the theme from "The Twilight Zone".
That must be where Dana is living these days.
And notice how you failed to provide any examples of Christians being
opposed to secularism.
What Christians are opposed too i s when secular humanists use the courts to
force their beliefs on society.
I love this. To the fundy mind, disallowing special
treatment for their religion (state sponsored school
prayer for example) is the same as forcing secular
humanist beliefs on society. Yes, to not be biased
in your favor is to be biased against you. To not
accomidate you with special consideration is persecution.
That's pretty much the standard argument these days: if you
don't preach religion, then you're preaching atheism.
Presumably if the teachers don't urge their kids to grow
up Republican, they're manufacturing little Democrats too...
-- cary
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| User: "thomas p" |
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| Title: Re: secularism prospers in America |
27 Jun 2005 02:57:05 PM |
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On 27 Jun 2005 05:41:47 -0700, wrote:
Dana wrote:
"Michelle Malkin" <hypatiab7@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:cc2dnSJoHb30siLfRVn-qA@comcast.com...
"Dana" <whoya@whoya.com> wrote in message
news:11bu140ao7ub888@corp.supernews.com...
<buckeye-ELO@nospam.net> wrote i n message
news:pohtb1pf66k2k9oes3ha7itchd2381apao@4ax.com...
From: "Robert Nordlander" [delete]
Subject: In spite of Christian opposition, secularism prospers in
America
There is no Christian opposition to secularism.
Wow! I can hear the theme from "The Twilight Zone".
That must be where Dana is living these days.
And notice how you failed to provide any examples of Christians being
opposed to secularism.
What Christians are opposed too i s when secular humanists use the courts to
force their beliefs on society.
I love this. To the fundy mind, disallowing special
treatment for their religion (state sponsored school
prayer for example) is the same as forcing secular
humanist beliefs on society. Yes, to not be biased
in your favor is to be biased against you. To not
accomidate you with special consideration is persecution.
Well yes - of course. Christians are special; didn't you know?
Thomas P.
"Life must be lived forwards but understood backwards"
(Kierkegaard)
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| User: "thomas p" |
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| Title: Re: secularism prospers in America |
27 Jun 2005 12:20:53 PM |
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On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 16:20:41 -0800, "Dana" <whoya@whoya.com> wrote:
"Michelle Malkin" <hypatiab7@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:cc2dnSJoHb30siLfRVn-qA@comcast.com...
"Dana" <whoya@whoya.com> wrote in message
news:11bu140ao7ub888@corp.supernews.com...
<buckeye-ELO@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:pohtb1pf66k2k9oes3ha7itchd2381apao@4ax.com...
From: "Robert Nordlander" [delete]
Subject: In spite of Christian opposition, secularism prospers in
America
There is no Christian opposition to secularism.
Wow! I can hear the theme from "The Twilight Zone".
That must be where Dana is living these days.
And notice how you failed to provide any examples of Christians being
opposed to secularism.
What Christians are opposed too is when secular humanists use the courts to
force their beliefs on society.
Especially when they insist that people must pledge allegiance to
secularism at football games. I just hate that.
Thomas P.
"Life must be lived forwards but understood backwards"
(Kierkegaard)
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| User: "Gray Shockley" |
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| Title: Re: secularism prospers in America |
27 Jun 2005 02:46:32 PM |
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On Mon, 27 Jun 2005 12:20:53 -0500, thomas p wrote
Especially when they insist that people must pledge allegiance to
secularism at football games. I just hate that.
Thomas P.
##############################
In April of year 2005, ce, I typed
(in honor of ArchBishop "Squeaky" Scalia):
##############################
My Prayer Offered Up
at the First Football Game of the Fall
Dear [fill in name of diety],
We ask thy blessings on these fine young men of the home
team. May their passes be accurate, their blocking
magnificient, the tackles be rough and may the ends not be
tight.
We beseech thy condemnation of the enemy. May the
quarterback have his arms broken, may their line be
dumbfounded and may the Dove of Peace pluck the eyes from
their running backs and ends.
We are reminded of that [insert name of religious book]
wherein is said, "Winning is not the major thing, winning
is the only thing."
May the band be in tune, the cheerleaders lusty and the
announcers, sober for a change. We ask it as the winning
side. [close with close word(s)]
Hey, Coach Scalia gave that prayer.
Didn't "He"?
Gray Shockley
----------------------------
If you're not pro-life, I'll kill you!
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| User: "Jeff Welch" |
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| Title: Re: secularism prospers in America |
27 Jun 2005 12:45:51 AM |
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"Dana" <whoya@whoya.com> wrote in message
news:11bu140ao7ub888@corp.supernews.com...
Subject: In spite of Christian opposition, secularism prospers in America
There is no Christian opposition to secularism.
"I don't believe in separation between church and state."
-Jerry Falwell
-Jeff
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| User: "Rudy Canoza" |
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| Title: Re: secularism prospers in America |
19 Jul 2005 05:39:52 PM |
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Jeff Welch wrote:
"Dana" <whoya@whoya.com> wrote in message
news:11bu140ao7ub888@corp.supernews.com...
Subject: In spite of Christian opposition, secularism prospers in America
There is no Christian opposition to secularism.
"I don't believe in separation between church and state."
-Jerry Falwell
I don't believe Falwell said this, Jeffy (although I
believe he might say it.) I think you made it up. I
did a search in Google for the precise sentence you
attribute to Falwell, and the *only* instance of it is
your post of it!
You fabricated it, Jeffy. You lied.
Why do you lie about people you don't like, Jeffy?
You're a lying *****.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Stupidity prospers in America |
19 Jul 2005 09:19:20 PM |
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On Tue, 19 Jul 2005 22:39:52 GMT, Rudy Canoza <someguy@ph.con> wrote:
I don't believe Falwell said this, Jeffy (although I
believe he might say it.)
Yes, he probably did. He says a kazillion things pertaining to HIS
belief that fundamentalist religious dogma should be incorporated into
public policy. He doesn't bat an eye when he does.
But a lot of it is in forums not recorded or archived.
===================================================================
"The commandments carry no internal evidence of divinity with them;
they contain some good moral precepts, such as any man qualified
to be a law-giver, or a legislator, could produce himself, without
having recourse to supernatural intervention.*
Thomas Paine---Founder
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: secularism prospers in America |
27 Jun 2005 08:31:19 AM |
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wrote:
:|Dana wrote:
:|> There is no Christian opposition to secularism.
:|
:|So Pat Robertson, Jerry Falwell, Fred Phelps,
:|James Dobson, and all the rest are what? Muslims?
Dippy Dana gets exactly what he wants from you people, that is, replies and
attention as you react to his one liners that push your buttons.
It's interesting how people give him that kind of people over them.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: secularism prospers in America |
27 Jun 2005 07:25:54 AM |
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Dana wrote:
<buckeye-ELO@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:pohtb1pf66k2k9oes3ha7itchd2381apao@4ax.com...
From: "Robert Nordlander" [delete]
Subject: In spite of Christian opposition, secularism prospers in America
There is no Christian opposition to secularism.
Hey, if someone named "Dana" sez so, that's good enough
for me!
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| User: "Cary Kittrell" |
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| Title: Re: secularism prospers in America |
27 Jun 2005 12:27:11 PM |
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In article <11bu140ao7ub888@corp.supernews.com> "Dana" <whoya@whoya.com> writes:
<buckeye-ELO@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:pohtb1pf66k2k9oes3ha7itchd2381apao@4ax.com...
From: "Robert Nordlander" [delete]
Subject: In spite of Christian opposition, secularism prospers in America
There is no Christian opposition to secularism.
A claim that Dana himself disproves with dreary regluarity.
-- cary
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| User: "Curly Surmudgeon" |
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| Title: Re: secularism prospers in America |
26 Jun 2005 07:12:41 PM |
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On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 11:41:50 -0800, Dana wrote:
<buckeye-ELO@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:pohtb1pf66k2k9oes3ha7itchd2381apao@4ax.com...
From: "Robert Nordlander" [delete]
Subject: In spite of Christian opposition, secularism prospers in America
There is no Christian opposition to secularism.
Does that mean the Methodist across the street who tells me I'm going to
hell for having a Vampire fish on my car isn't a Christian?
-- Regards, Curly
------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://curlysurmudgeon.com/documents/bush_lies.txt
------------------------------------------------------------------------
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| User: "Gray Shockley" |
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| Title: Re: secularism prospers in America |
26 Jun 2005 09:53:11 PM |
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On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 19:12:41 -0500, Curly Surmudgeon wrote
On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 11:41:50 -0800, Dana wrote:
<buckeye-ELO@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:pohtb1pf66k2k9oes3ha7itchd2381apao@4ax.com...
From: "Robert Nordlander" [delete]
Subject: In spite of Christian opposition, secularism prospers in America
There is no Christian opposition to secularism.
Does that mean the Methodist across the street who tells me I'm going to
hell for having a Vampire fish on my car isn't a Christian?
The "standardized test" for determining whether someone is
a Christian or not a Christian is a simple test of whether
that person lives a Christ-like life.
From the evidence you have provided, the answer is "no".
This person seems to be best suited for being categorized
as a blasphemer and to spend eternity as a nude model in
californian pornography as the butt of the subject.
Gray Shockley
--------------------------
The right of the people to be secure in their persons,
houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches
and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall
issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or
affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be
searched, and the persons or things to be seized. #4
George W C Bush43 does not have a note from
his mommie and da-da allowing him to destroy
the United States Constitution.
-- Regards, Curly
------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://curlysurmudgeon.com/documents/bush_lies.txt
------------------------------------------------------------------------
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| User: "Jeff Welch" |
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| Title: Re: secularism prospers in America |
27 Jun 2005 12:50:14 AM |
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"Gray Shockley" <grayshockley@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:0001HW.BEE4D44700B9CDD9082ACB90@news.giganews.com...
The "standardized test" for determining whether someone is
a Christian or not a Christian is a simple test of whether
that person lives a Christ-like life.
I guess that leaves out all Republicans then.
-Jeff
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: secularism prospers in America |
27 Jun 2005 08:09:32 AM |
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Gray Shockley wrote:
On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 19:12:41 -0500, Curly Surmudgeon wrote
On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 11:41:50 -0800, Dana wrote:
<buckeye-ELO@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:pohtb1pf66k2k9oes3ha7itchd2381apao@4ax.com...
Fro m: "Robert Nordlander" [delete]
Subject: In spite of Christian opposition, secularism prospers in America
There is no Christian opposition to secularism.
Does that mean the Methodist across the street who tells me I'm going to
hell for having a Vampire fish on my car isn't a Christian?
The "standardized test" for determining whether someone is
a Christian or not a Christian is a simple test of whether
that person lives a Christ-like life.
"Standardized test"?
From the evidence you have provided, the answer is "no".
This person seems to be best suited for being categorized
as a blasphemer and to spend eternity as a nude model in
californian pornography as the butt of the subject.
Gray Shockley
--------------------------
The right of the people to be secure in their persons,
houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches
and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall
issue, but upon probable ca use, supported by Oath or
affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be
searched, and the persons or things to be seized. #4
George W C Bush43 does not have a note from
his mommie and da-da allowing him to destroy
the United States Constitution.
-- Regards, Curly
------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://curlysurmudgeon.com/documents/bush_lies.txt
------------------------------------------------------------------------
dd
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| User: "Gray Shockley" |
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| Title: Re: secularism prospers in America |
27 Jun 2005 10:53:31 AM |
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On Mon, 27 Jun 2005 08:09:32 -0500,
wrote
Gray Shockley wrote:
On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 19:12:41 -0500, Curly Surmudgeon wrote
On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 11:41:50 -0800, Dana wrote:
<buckeye-ELO@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:pohtb1pf66k2k9oes3ha7itchd2381apao@4ax.com...
Fro m: "Robert Nordlander" [delete]
Subject: In spite of Christian opposition, secularism prospers in America
There is no Christian opposition to secularism.
Does that mean the Methodist across the street who tells me I'm going to
hell for having a Vampire fish on my car isn't a Christian?
The "standardized test" for determining whether someone is
a Christian or not a Christian is a simple test of whether
that person lives a Christ-like life.
"Standardized test"?
Sure. For convenience, we simply call it the:
SCPDSS-PCWCCHSSJAPCSC Test
++ gray
From the evidence you have provided, the answer is "no".
This person seems to be best suited for being categorized
as a blasphemer and to spend eternity as a nude model in
californian pornography as the butt of the subject.
Gray Shockley
--------------------------
The right of the people to be secure in their persons,
houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches
and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall
issue, but upon probable ca use, supported by Oath or
affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be
searched, and the persons or things to be seized. #4
George W C Bush43 does not have a note from
his mommie and da-da allowing him to destroy
the United States Constitution.
-- Regards, Curly
------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://curlysurmudgeon.com/documents/bush_lies.txt
------------------------------------------------------------------------
dd
That would be the: Standardized Comparative Procedure for
Determing the Status of a self-professed Christian when
compared to Christ Himself by the Simple Selection of
Justification of an action by the person claiming to be
said Christian.
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| User: "Santolina chamaecyparissus" |
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| Title: Re: secularism prospers in America |
30 Jun 2005 08:36:41 PM |
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Gray Shockley wrote:
On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 19:12:41 -0500, Curly Surmudgeon wrote
On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 11:41:50 -0800, Dana wrote:
<buckeye-ELO@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:pohtb1pf66k2k9oes3ha7itchd2381apao@4ax.com...
From: "Robert Nordlander" [delete]
Subject: In spite of Christian opposition, secularism prospers in America
There is no Christian opposition to secularism.
Does that mean the Methodist across the street who tells me I'm going to
hell for having a Vampire fish on my car isn't a Christian?
The "standardized test" for determining whether someone is
a Christian or not a Christian is a simple test of whether
that person lives a Christ-like life.
Well, there you have it. There is no such thing as a christian.
Simplifies things, at least.
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| User: "Sid9" |
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| Title: Re: secularism prospers in America |
30 Jun 2005 08:45:14 PM |
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Santolina chamaecyparissus wrote:
Gray Shockley wrote:
On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 19:12:41 -0500, Curly Surmudgeon wrote
On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 11:41:50 -0800, Dana wrote:
<buckeye-ELO@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:pohtb1pf66k2k9oes3ha7itchd2381apao@4ax.com...
From: "Robert Nordlander" [delete]
Subject: In spite of Christian opposition, secularism prospers in
America
There is no Christian opposition to secularism.
Does that mean the Methodist across the street who tells me I'm
going to hell for having a Vampire fish on my car isn't a Christian?
The "standardized test" for determining whether someone is
a Christian or not a Christian is a simple test of whether
that person lives a Christ-like life.
Well, there you have it. There is no such thing as a christian.
Simplifies things, at least.
I don't agree.
Anyone who proclaims himself a Christian is a Christian.
There are so many flavors of Christian, who is to say which are for real or
not.
Therefore.....Anyone who proclaims himself a Christian is a Christian.
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| User: "Greywolf" |
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| Title: Re: secularism prospers in America |
30 Jun 2005 09:40:26 PM |
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"Sid9" <sid9@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:Gd1xe.7169$qm.6844@bignews5.bellsouth.net...
Santolina chamaecyparissus wrote:
Gray Shockley wrote:
On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 19:12:41 -0500, Curly Surmudgeon wrote
On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 11:41:50 -0800, Dana wrote:
<buckeye-ELO@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:pohtb1pf66k2k9oes3ha7itchd2381apao@4ax.com...
From: "Robert Nordlander" [delete]
Subject: In spite of Christian opposition, secularism prospers in
America
There is no Christian opposition to secularism.
Does that mean the Methodist across the street who tells me I'm
going to hell for having a Vampire fish on my car isn't a Christian?
The "standardized test" for determining whether someone is
a Christian or not a Christian is a simple test of whether
that person lives a Christ-like life.
Well, there you have it. There is no such thing as a christian.
Simplifies things, at least.
I don't agree.
Anyone who proclaims himself a Christian is a Christian.
There are so many flavors of Christian, who is to say which are for real
or not.
Therefore.....Anyone who proclaims himself a Christian is a Christian.
***
Most definitely! They are nothing *but* until they renounce their religion
and proclaim themselves to be something else. And even if they're in
"transition," they remain a Christian until they formally declare themselves
otherwise.
Greywolf
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| User: "Sid9" |
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| Title: Re: secularism prospers in America |
30 Jun 2005 09:44:57 PM |
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Greywolf wrote:
"Sid9" <sid9@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:Gd1xe.7169$qm.6844@bignews5.bellsouth.net...
Santolina chamaecyparissus wrote:
Gray Shockley wrote:
On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 19:12:41 -0500, Curly Surmudgeon wrote
On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 11:41:50 -0800, Dana wrote:
<buckeye-ELO@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:pohtb1pf66k2k9oes3ha7itchd2381apao@4ax.com...
From: "Robert Nordlander" [delete]
Subject: In spite of Christian opposition, secularism prospers
in America
There is no Christian opposition to secularism.
Does that mean the Methodist across the street who tells me I'm
going to hell for having a Vampire fish on my car isn't a
Christian?
The "standardized test" for determining whether someone is
a Christian or not a Christian is a simple test of whether
that person lives a Christ-like life.
Well, there you have it. There is no such thing as a christian.
Simplifies things, at least.
I don't agree.
Anyone who proclaims himself a Christian is a Christian.
There are so many flavors of Christian, who is to say which are for
real or not.
Therefore.....Anyone who proclaims himself a Christian is a
Christian. ***
Most definitely! They are nothing *but* until they renounce their
religion and proclaim themselves to be something else. And even if
they're in "transition," they remain a Christian until they formally
declare themselves otherwise.
Greywolf
There are some Mighty News Group
Christians who post here regularly
who have denounced professed Christians
because they were not in agreement
politcally with the Mighty News Group Christians.
So who's the real Christian?
(Rhetorical question that does not require a reply)
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| User: "Ben Goren" |
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| Title: Re: secularism prospers in America |
26 Jun 2005 11:53:58 PM |
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Gray Shockley wrote:
The "standardized test" for determining whether someone is a
Christian or not a Christian is a simple test of whether that
person lives a Christ-like life.
No. The only test for whether or not somebody is a Christian is
whether or not that person honestly and sincerely professes faith
in Jesus Christ.
Cheers,
b&
--
BAAWA Knight of Blasphemy
God can never prove that this sentence is true.
----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==----
http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups
----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =----
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: secularism prospers in America |
27 Jun 2005 08:27:41 AM |
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Ben Goren wrote:
Gray Shockley wrote:
The "standardized test" for determining whether someone is a
Christian or not a Christian is a simple test of whether that
person lives a Christ-like life.
No. The only test for whether or not somebody is a Christian is
whether or not that person honestly and sincerely professes faith
in Jesus Christ.
Once again you confuse your opinion with fact. =CB=87
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| User: "Curly Surmudgeon" |
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| Title: Re: secularism prospers in America |
27 Jun 2005 01:44:02 AM |
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On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 21:53:58 -0700, Ben Goren wrote:
Gray Shockley wrote:
The "standardized test" for determining whether someone is a
Christian or not a Christian is a simple test of whether that
person lives a Christ-like life.
No. The only test for whether or not somebody is a Christian is
whether or not that person honestly and sincerely professes faith
in Jesus Christ.
Does Paul Crouch and Binnie Hind qualify?
-- Regards, Curly
------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://curlysurmudgeon.com/documents/bush_lies.txt
------------------------------------------------------------------------
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| User: "Gray Shockley" |
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| Title: Re: secularism prospers in America |
27 Jun 2005 10:29:27 AM |
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On Mon, 27 Jun 2005 01:44:02 -0500, Curly Surmudgeon wrote
On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 21:53:58 -0700, Ben Goren wrote:
Gray Shockley wrote:
The "standardized test" for determining whether someone is a
Christian or not a Christian is a simple test of whether that
person lives a Christ-like life.
No. The only test for whether or not somebody is a Christian is
whether or not that person honestly and sincerely professes faith
in Jesus Christ.
Does Paul Crouch and Binnie Hind qualify?
-- Regards, Curly
------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://curlysurmudgeon.com/documents/bush_lies.txt
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Who they be? Are they Chri$tian$?
++ gray
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| User: "Curly Surmudgeon" |
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| Title: Re: secularism prospers in America |
27 Jun 2005 12:44:52 PM |
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On Mon, 27 Jun 2005 10:29:27 -0500, Gray Shockley wrote:
On Mon, 27 Jun 2005 01:44:02 -0500, Curly Surmudgeon wrote
On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 21:53:58 -0700, Ben Goren wrote:
Gray Shockley wrote:
The "standardized test" for determining whether someone is a
Christian or not a Christian is a simple test of whether that
person lives a Christ-like life.
No. The only test for whether or not somebody is a Christian is
whether or not that person honestly and sincerely professes faith
in Jesus Christ.
Does Paul Crouch and Binnie Hind qualify?
Who they be? Are they Chri$tian$?
Decidedly. Paul Crouch runs the Trinity Broadcasting Network, TBN, and
has a pink-haired (sometimes blue) drag-queen wife. Paul paid a half
million dollars some years ago to silence a guy about their homosexual
love affair: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Crouch
Here's their photo when she wore a blond wig:
http://www.kristitynfoorumi.fi/tbnmenestys_tiedostot/image003.jpg
Bennie Hind is even more preposterous with his Faith Healing:
http://bennyhinn.org/default.cfm
Image: http://www.trinityfi.org/images/hinn016.jpg
Send your love gift today!
-- Regards, Curly
------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://curlysurmudgeon.com/documents/bush_lies.txt
------------------------------------------------------------------------
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| User: "Cary Kittrell" |
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| Title: Re: secularism prospers in America |
01 Jul 2005 11:09:48 AM |
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In article <11c0ee1143qvm83@corp.supernews.com> Curly Surmudgeon <curly@curlysurmudgeon.com> writes:
On Mon, 27 Jun 2005 10:29:27 -0500, Gray Shockley wrote:
On Mon, 27 Jun 2005 01:44:02 -0500, Curly Surmudgeon wrote
On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 21:53:58 -0700, Ben Goren wrote:
{...}
The "standardized test" for determining whether someone is a
Christian or not a Christian is a simple test of whether that
person lives a Christ-like life.
No. The only test for whether or not somebody is a Christian is
whether or not that person honestly and sincerely professes faith
in Jesus Christ.
Does Paul Crouch and Binnie Hind qualify?
Who they be? Are they Chri$tian$?
Decidedly. Paul Crouch runs the Trinity Broadcasting Network, TBN, and
has a pink-haired (sometimes blue) drag-queen wife. Paul paid a half
million dollars some years ago to silence a guy about their homosexual
love affair: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Crouch
Here's their photo when she wore a blond wig:
http://www.kristitynfoorumi.fi/tbnmenestys_tiedostot/image003.jpg
Yeah. A couple of Canadian girls came through here a few years
back, touring the country. One of them, who shall remain
nameless (FNC) started babbling about the STRANGEST woman
they had seen on an evangelical program on the TV in
their motel room...
So I <tap><tap><click><tap><tap><click>: "You mean her?"
Yep. Jan Crouch.
-- cary
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