| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"maff" |
| Date: |
08 Jan 2005 04:50:25 AM |
| Object: |
Slavery |
'Though the Heavens May Fall' and 'Bury the Chains': Freed
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/01/09/books/review/09COVERRO.html?pagewanted=all&position=
By MARILYNNE ROBINSON
The slave trade was vast, entrenched and profitable for the British
Empire. New books by Steven M. Wise and Adam Hochschild examine the
movement that ended it.
THOUGH THE HEAVENS MAY FALL
The Landmark Trial That Led to the End of Human Slavery.
By Steven M. Wise.
Illustrated. 282 pp. Da Capo Press. $25.
Steven Wise
http://news.google.com/news?tab=gn&q=Steven%20Wise&safe=images&lr=&num=100&hl=en&
http://www.google.com/search?tab=nw&q=Steven+Wise&lr=&num=100&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&sa=N
http://www.google.com/search?q=Steven+Wise&num=100&hl=en&lr=&output=search&cat=gwd/Top
http://groups-beta.google.com/groups?as_q=Steven%20Wise&safe=images&lr=&num=100&hl=en
http://groups-beta.google.com/groups?as_q=Steven%20Wise&safe=images&as_scoring=d&lr=&num=100&hl=en
BURY THE CHAINS
Prophets and Rebels in the Fight to Free an Empire's Slaves.
By Adam Hochschild.
Illustrated. 468 pp. Houghton Mifflin Company. $26.95.
Adam Hochschild
http://news.google.com/news?tab=gn&q=%22Adam%20Hochschild%22&safe=images&lr=&num=100&hl=en&
http://www.google.com/search?tab=nw&q=%22Adam+Hochschild%22&lr=&num=100&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&sa=N
http://www.google.com/search?q=%22Adam+Hochschild%22&num=100&hl=en&lr=&output=search&cat=gwd/Top
http://groups-beta.google.com/groups?as_epq=Adam%20Hochschild&safe=images&as_scoring=d&lr=&num=100&hl=en
slave slaves slavery enslaved slaving
http://news.google.com/news?num=100&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=+slave+OR+slaves+OR+slavery+OR+enslaved+OR+slaving&sa=N&tab=gn
http://www.google.com/search?num=100&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&tab=gn&q=slave+OR+slaves+OR+slavery+OR+enslaved+OR+slaving&sa=N&tab=nw
http://www.google.com/search?num=100&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=slave+OR+slaves+OR+slavery+OR+enslaved+OR+slaving&sa=N&tab=wd&cat=gwd%2FTop
http://groups.google.com/groups?as_oq=slave%20slaves%20slavery%20enslaved%20slaving&safe=images&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&as_scoring=d&lr=&num=100&hl=en
.
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| User: "Les Hellawell" |
|
| Title: Re: Slavery |
08 Jan 2005 07:06:07 AM |
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On 8 Jan 2005 02:50:25 -0800, "maff" <maff91@yahoo.com> wrote:
'Though the Heavens May Fall' and 'Bury the Chains': Freed
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/01/09/books/review/09COVERRO.html?pagewanted=all&position=
By MARILYNNE ROBINSON
The slave trade was vast, entrenched and profitable for the British
Empire. New books by Steven M. Wise and Adam Hochschild examine the
movement that ended it.
Blimey what a revelation!
Sorry but we knew all about the triangular trade and the vast profits
it brought bothe sides of the Atlantic a long time ago,
Thanks to the work of William Wilbeforce who awoke the conscience
of the nation we were the first to break the triangular link.
--
Les Hellawell
greetings from
YORKSHIRE - The White Rose County
.
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| User: "maff" |
|
| Title: Re: Slavery |
08 Jan 2005 07:22:24 AM |
|
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Les Hellawell wrote:
On 8 Jan 2005 02:50:25 -0800, "maff" <maff91@yahoo.com> wrote:
'Though the Heavens May Fall' and 'Bury the Chains': Freed
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/01/09/books/review/09COVERRO.html?pagewanted=all&position=
By MARILYNNE ROBINSON
The slave trade was vast, entrenched and profitable for the British
Empire. New books by Steven M. Wise and Adam Hochschild examine the
movement that ended it.
Blimey what a revelation!
Sorry but we knew all about the triangular trade and the vast profits
it brought bothe sides of the Atlantic a long time ago,
Thanks to the work of William Wilbeforce who awoke the conscience
of the nation we were the first to break the triangular link.
Opponents of slavery including Wilberforce and Paine ....
were savagely attacked by the churches for presuming to know better
than the
Bible, and the anti-slavery attitude of the Quakers made them unpopular
with
orthodox Christians. The first country to abolish slavery was
France..."
(1990, RPA. p97)
And Don Cupitt claims "It was not Wilberforce the Christian who
pioneered
abolition, as popular legend has it. On the contrary, as Wilberforce
himself
told the Commons on February 18, 1796, revolutionary France had already
freed its slaves overseas: Christian England was not to free them for
37
years. It was the same revolutionary Assembly which gave Jews the
citizen-ship which Christian France had denied them." (1972 p90) And
Chapman
Cohen noted in his essay on Christianity: "The modern black-slave
trade, it
must be noted, was pre-eminently a Christian traffic - instituted by
Christians.....And it remained, backed up by Christians, who quoted the
New
Testament....as their authority."
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/alt.atheism/msg/db2052e7179dc5ba
--
Les Hellawell
greetings from
YORKSHIRE - The White Rose County
.
|
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| User: "Les Hellawell" |
|
| Title: Re: Slavery |
08 Jan 2005 07:49:55 AM |
|
|
On 8 Jan 2005 05:22:24 -0800, "maff" <maff91@yahoo.com> wrote:
Les Hellawell wrote:
On 8 Jan 2005 02:50:25 -0800, "maff" <maff91@yahoo.com> wrote:
'Though the Heavens May Fall' and 'Bury the Chains': Freed
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/01/09/books/review/09COVERRO.html?pagewanted=all&position=
By MARILYNNE ROBINSON
The slave trade was vast, entrenched and profitable for the British
Empire. New books by Steven M. Wise and Adam Hochschild examine the
movement that ended it.
Blimey what a revelation!
Sorry but we knew all about the triangular trade and the vast profits
it brought bothe sides of the Atlantic a long time ago,
Thanks to the work of William Wilbeforce who awoke the conscience
of the nation we were the first to break the triangular link.
Opponents of slavery including Wilberforce and Paine ....
were savagely attacked by the churches for presuming to know better
than the
Bible, and the anti-slavery attitude of the Quakers made them unpopular
with
orthodox Christians. The first country to abolish slavery was
France..."
(1990, RPA. p97)
That's why I was more specific when I said triangular link. We
abolished slavery the USA didn't nor did the slave trading
countries of Africa. Some countries never had slavery of
course so never needed to abolish it. Though the UK clearly
traded slaves and profitted from it we actually had few within the UK.
And Don Cupitt claims "It was not Wilberforce the Christian who
pioneered
abolition, as popular legend has it. On the contrary, as Wilberforce
himself
told the Commons on February 18, 1796, revolutionary France had already
freed its slaves overseas: Christian England was not to free them for
37
years. It was the same revolutionary Assembly which gave Jews the
citizen-ship which Christian France had denied them." (1972 p90) And
Chapman
Cohen noted in his essay on Christianity: "The modern black-slave
trade, it
must be noted, was pre-eminently a Christian traffic - instituted by
Christians.....And it remained, backed up by Christians, who quoted the
New
Testament....as their authority."
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/alt.atheism/msg/db2052e7179dc5ba
--
Les Hellawell
greetings from
YORKSHIRE - The White Rose County
--
Les Hellawell
greetings from
YORKSHIRE - The White Rose County
.
|
|
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| User: "maff" |
|
| Title: Re: Slavery |
08 Jan 2005 01:56:19 PM |
|
|
Les Hellawell wrote:
On 8 Jan 2005 05:22:24 -0800, "maff" <maff91@yahoo.com> wrote:
Les Hellawell wrote:
On 8 Jan 2005 02:50:25 -0800, "maff" <maff91@yahoo.com> wrote:
'Though the Heavens May Fall' and 'Bury the Chains': Freed
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/01/09/books/review/09COVERRO.html?pagewanted=all&position=
By MARILYNNE ROBINSON
The slave trade was vast, entrenched and profitable for the
British
Empire. New books by Steven M. Wise and Adam Hochschild examine
the
movement that ended it.
Blimey what a revelation!
Sorry but we knew all about the triangular trade and the vast
profits
it brought bothe sides of the Atlantic a long time ago,
Thanks to the work of William Wilbeforce who awoke the conscience
of the nation we were the first to break the triangular link.
Opponents of slavery including Wilberforce and Paine ....
were savagely attacked by the churches for presuming to know better
than the
Bible, and the anti-slavery attitude of the Quakers made them
unpopular
with
orthodox Christians. The first country to abolish slavery was
France..."
(1990, RPA. p97)
That's why I was more specific when I said triangular link. We
abolished slavery the USA didn't nor did the slave trading
countries of Africa. Some countries never had slavery of
course so never needed to abolish it. Though the UK clearly
traded slaves and profitted from it we actually had few within the
UK.
A judge in Britain declared slavery illegal in 1659 but slavery wasn't
abolished in the colonies until 1833.
And Don Cupitt claims "It was not Wilberforce the Christian who
pioneered
abolition, as popular legend has it. On the contrary, as Wilberforce
himself
told the Commons on February 18, 1796, revolutionary France had
already
freed its slaves overseas: Christian England was not to free them
for
37
years. It was the same revolutionary Assembly which gave Jews the
citizen-ship which Christian France had denied them." (1972 p90) And
Chapman
Cohen noted in his essay on Christianity: "The modern black-slave
trade, it
must be noted, was pre-eminently a Christian traffic - instituted by
Christians.....And it remained, backed up by Christians, who quoted
the
New
Testament....as their authority."
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/alt.atheism/msg/db2052e7179dc5ba
--
Les Hellawell
greetings from
YORKSHIRE - The White Rose County
--
Les Hellawell
greetings from
YORKSHIRE - The White Rose County
.
|
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| User: "maff" |
|
| Title: Re: Slavery |
09 Jan 2005 04:35:51 AM |
|
|
Les Hellawell wrote:
On 8 Jan 2005 05:22:24 -0800, "maff" <maff91@yahoo.com> wrote:
Les Hellawell wrote:
On 8 Jan 2005 02:50:25 -0800, "maff" <maff91@yahoo.com> wrote:
'Though the Heavens May Fall' and 'Bury the Chains': Freed
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/01/09/books/review/09COVERRO.html?pagewanted=all&position=
By MARILYNNE ROBINSON
The slave trade was vast, entrenched and profitable for the
British
Empire. New books by Steven M. Wise and Adam Hochschild examine
the
movement that ended it.
Blimey what a revelation!
Sorry but we knew all about the triangular trade and the vast
profits
it brought bothe sides of the Atlantic a long time ago,
Thanks to the work of William Wilbeforce who awoke the conscience
of the nation we were the first to break the triangular link.
Opponents of slavery including Wilberforce and Paine ....
were savagely attacked by the churches for presuming to know better
than the
Bible, and the anti-slavery attitude of the Quakers made them
unpopular
with
orthodox Christians. The first country to abolish slavery was
France..."
(1990, RPA. p97)
That's why I was more specific when I said triangular link. We
abolished slavery the USA didn't nor did the slave trading
countries of Africa. Some countries never had slavery of
course so never needed to abolish it. Though the UK clearly
traded slaves and profitted from it we actually had few within the
UK.
The egalitarian instinct
http://www.guardian.co.uk/saturday_review/story/0,3605,687232,00.html
The British anti-slavery movement was grounded in the belief that
colonial subjects could be 'civilised' by Christianity. But, writes
Catherine Hall, this vision gave way to a harsher view of race
Saturday April 20, 2002
The Guardian
The language of civilisation and barbarism has long provided ways of
marking off self and other, legitimising relations of power between
"the west" and "the rest". The encounter with difference, the
questioning as to "what kind of people they are", and by implication
what kind of people "we" are, has been part of the global world, in its
European colonising epoch, symbolically inaugurated by Columbus in
1492.
"Are they true men?" the Europeans asked of the Indians of the new
world. And once the question of one or several creations was settled,
they continued to debate the nature of "the Indian", "the Aboriginal"
and "the African". They, in turn, debated the nature of the white man.
After the demise of European imperialism, the formal power of the
British empire was immeasurably diminished. But the decolonisation of
the mind was a different matter. As Frantz Fanon observed, black people
had internalised their inferiority: decolonisation had to be about the
creation not just of new states but of new subjects, new men and women.
Catherine Hall
http://news.google.com/news?tab=gn&q=%22Catherine%20Hall%22&safe=images&lr=&num=100&hl=en&
http://www.google.com/search?tab=nw&q=%22Catherine+Hall%22&lr=&num=100&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&sa=N
http://www.google.com/search?q=%22Catherine+Hall%22&num=100&hl=en&lr=&output=search&cat=gwd/Top
http://groups-beta.google.com/groups?as_epq=Catherine%20Hall&safe=images&as_scoring=d&lr=&num=100&hl=en
And Don Cupitt claims "It was not Wilberforce the Christian who
pioneered
abolition, as popular legend has it. On the contrary, as Wilberforce
himself
told the Commons on February 18, 1796, revolutionary France had
already
freed its slaves overseas: Christian England was not to free them
for
37
years. It was the same revolutionary Assembly which gave Jews the
citizen-ship which Christian France had denied them." (1972 p90) And
Chapman
Cohen noted in his essay on Christianity: "The modern black-slave
trade, it
must be noted, was pre-eminently a Christian traffic - instituted by
Christians.....And it remained, backed up by Christians, who quoted
the
New
Testament....as their authority."
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/alt.atheism/msg/db2052e7179dc5ba
--
Les Hellawell
greetings from
YORKSHIRE - The White Rose County
--
Les Hellawell
greetings from
YORKSHIRE - The White Rose County
.
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