Religions > Atheism > Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records
| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"Yang, AthD h.c" |
| Date: |
18 Aug 2004 10:46:07 PM |
| Object: |
Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records |
Newly obtained military records of one of Sen. John F. Kerry's most
vocal critics, who has accused the Democratic presidential candidate
of lying about his wartime record to win medals, contradict his own
version of events.
In newspaper interviews and a best-selling book, Larry Thurlow, who
commanded a Navy Swift boat alongside Kerry in Vietnam, has strongly
disputed Kerry's claim that the Massachusetts Democrat's boat came
under fire during a mission in Viet Cong-controlled territory on March
13, 1969. Kerry won a Bronze Star for his actions that day.
But Thurlow's military records, portions of which were released
yesterday to The Washington Post under the Freedom of Information Act,
contain several references to "enemy small arms and automatic weapons
fire" directed at "all units" of the five-boat flotilla. Thurlow won
his own Bronze Star that day, and the citation praises him for
providing assistance to a damaged Swift boat "despite enemy bullets
flying about him."
....
I never heard a shot," Thurlow said in his affidavit, which was
released by Swift Boats Veterans for Truth. The group claims the
backing of more than 250 Vietnam veterans, including a majority of
Kerry's fellow boat commanders.
A document recommending Thurlow for the Bronze Star noted that all his
actions "took place under constant enemy small arms fire which LTJG
THURLOW completely ignored in providing immediate assistance" to the
disabled boat and its crew. The citation states that all other units
in the flotilla also came under fire.
....
Thurlow and other anti-Kerry veterans have repeatedly alleged that
Kerry was the author of an after-action report that described how his
boat came under enemy fire. Kerry campaign researchers dispute that
assertion, and there is no convincing documentary evidence to settle
the argument. As the senior skipper in the flotilla, Thurlow might
have been expected to write the after-action report for March 13, but
he said that Kerry routinely "duked the system" to present his version
of events.
For much of the episode, Kerry was not in a position to know firsthand
what was happening on Thurlow's boat, as Kerry's boat had sped down
the river after the mine exploded under another boat. He later
returned to provide assistance to the stricken boat.
-----
Yang
a.a. #28
AthD (h.c.) conferred by the regents of the LCL
a.a. pastor #-273.15, the most frigid church of Celcius nee Kelvin
EAC Econometric Forecast and Sorcery Division
Proudly plonked by Lani Girl and Crazyalec
The Bush 'balanced' budget: 1.2 trillion and worsening
The Bush 'economic' policy: -3 million jobs and counting
The Bush Iraq lie: -951 GIs, one friend's co-worker's son and mounting
Having Bush ***** up my country: Worthless
.
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| User: "CJT" |
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| Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records |
20 Aug 2004 10:29:06 PM |
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james dorfu wrote:
On Sat, 21 Aug 2004 03:09:21 +0000, CJT wrote:
Igtheist wrote:
"Yang, AthD (h.c)" <eacmole@/*AWOLBUSH*/mail.com> wrote in message news:<a288i0d06ld98e1j8t68q6nrnd08mvbf9r@4ax.com>...
Newly obtained military records of one of Sen. John F. Kerry's most
vocal critics, who has accused the Democratic presidential candidate
of lying about his wartime record to win medals, contradict his own
version of events.
Of course since those records are based on the fraudulent reports made
by Kerry.
According to Thurlow, who is the guy whose integrity is in question.
The guy whose integrity is most in question is, of course, John Kerry. Not
even his own campaign staff believe his "Christmas in Cambodia" tale, the
one that was "seared into memory...seared". No sane person can now doubt
that Kerry has repeatedly lied about that.
Nonsense.
--
The e-mail address in our reply-to line is reversed in an attempt to
minimize spam. Our true address is of the form che...@prodigy.net.
.
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| User: "Lloyd Parker" |
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| Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records |
21 Aug 2004 06:23:41 AM |
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In article <ec75c602.0408201847.5dfa8672@posting.google.com>,
(Igtheist) wrote:
"Yang, AthD (h.c)" <eacmole@/*AWOLBUSH*/mail.com> wrote in message
news:<a288i0d06ld98e1j8t68q6nrnd08mvbf9r@4ax.com>...
Newly obtained military records of one of Sen. John F. Kerry's most
vocal critics, who has accused the Democratic presidential candidate
of lying about his wartime record to win medals, contradict his own
version of events.
Of course since those records are based on the fraudulent reports made
by Kerry.
www.factcheck.org
I've read all this stuff and the only person proven to have made false
statements was John "Christmas in Cambodia" "Magic Hat" Kerry.
Here's what Thurlow has to say about this BS attack:
http://swift2.he.net/~swift2/article.php?story=20040819100856500
The fellow who Kerry pulled out of the water claimed he underwater
during most of the action. He claims that he dove down several times
to avoid the boats and gunfire. So how could he be a good witness.
Can he see from underwater. Plus he has changed his story. He
originally said there were no boats in the area the first time he came
up for air. But how could that be since one had hit a mine and was
being rescued by three of the other boats while Kerry fled in his.
The only gunfire he heard came from the swift boats laying down
suppression fire. There was one mine explosion and that is it.
None of the boats had any bullet damage.
Not true. See factcheck
Furthermore the fellow cannot even get his story straight on which
boat he fell out of while eating his cookie. One time it's Kerry's
then another time it is one of the other boats. Kerrys biographer
even had him falling out of two separate boats in the same paragraph
in Kerrys book.
Prove it.
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| User: "Dave Cook" |
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| Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records |
19 Aug 2004 07:09:54 AM |
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"Yang, AthD (h.c)" <eacmole@/*AWOLBUSH*/mail.com> wrote in message news:<a288i0d06ld98e1j8t68q6nrnd08mvbf9r@4ax.com>...
Newly obtained military records of one of Sen. John F. Kerry's most
vocal critics, who has accused the Democratic presidential candidate
of lying about his wartime record to win medals, contradict his own
version of events.
Sure, Kerry didn't lie about killing babies, or how he got his wounds
which were too minor for other vets to consider as wounds.
These "newly obtained records" were "found" by someone after almost 40
years, and probably can be traced back to Kerry"s efforts to get a
bronze medal. It is just another effort of the major leftwing media
conglomerates like CNN, ABC, CBS, NBC, PBS, MSNBC, Reuters, Google,
Time-Warner and others to obscure, deflect, run interference for,
publish disinformation about, bury or otherwise obfuscate the story,
but it's starting to reach more and more people - through the efforts
of talk radio, the blogosphere, e-mail lists, and newsgroup posters.
Articles by the Associated Press and other media outlets cannot be
trusted.
The Swift Boat Veterans provide detailed accounts from dozens and
dozens of eyewitnesses which contrasts with Kerry's boastful
descriptions of the exact same incidents. If the 254 veterans against
Kerry got one-tenth as much media coverage for calling Kerry a liar as
Clown Joe Wilson did for calling Bush a liar, the veterans wouldn't
need to buy ad time to get their message out.
Kerry is demanding to be made president on the basis of spending four
months in Vietnam 35 years ago. And yet the men who know what he did
during those four months don't think he's fit to be dog catcher. That
seems newsworthy to me, but I must be wrong since the media have
engineered a total blackout of the Swift Boat Veterans.
Two hundred fifty-four Swift Boat Veterans have signed a letter saying
John Kerry is not fit to be commander in chief, a point developed in
some detail in the blockbuster new book by John O'Neill, aptly titled
"Unfit for Command." (Note - "Unfit for Command" is now number ONE on
both Amazon.com and Barnes and Noble, and currently number THREE on
the New York Times Bestseller List.)
At the 2003 reunion of Swift Boat Veterans, about 300 men showed up:
85 percent of them think Kerry is unfit to be president. Fewer than 10
percent of all Swift Boat Veterans contacted refused to sign the
letter.
Senator Kerry is claiming that he ferried CIA operatives into Cambodia
on a clandestine basis. It is another unbelievable Kerry claim. As
late as June 2004, in a Times interview, Kerry said: 'I celebrated
Christmas Eve on the border of Cambodia.' And he added that on a later
mission, 'I went into Cambodia with the CIA.'
The statement, "I went into Cambodia with the CIA." shows of how much
truth there is NOT in Kerry's Vietnam stories. Sure you did, John.Who
would use a 55' boat with a crew of six for a covert insertion of
inserting one man? The Swift boat is much too big for that kind of
work and, second, with a crew of six, that's a high number of tongues
that might talk. That just defies logic.
Of course, the clincher is that none of Kerry's crew supports his
Cambodia lies.
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| User: "steve horan" |
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| Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records |
19 Aug 2004 07:38:25 PM |
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(Dave Cook) wrote in message >...
Lookee here...
http://www.eriposte.com/media/liars_inc/swiftboat.htm
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| User: "Barney Lyon" |
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| Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records |
20 Aug 2004 06:27:13 PM |
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(Dave Cook) wrote in message news:<c687e307.0408190409.513ffbb6@posting.google.com>...
"Yang, AthD (h.c)" <eacmole@/*AWOLBUSH*/mail.com> wrote in message news:<a288i0d06ld98e1j8t68q6nrnd08mvbf9r@4ax.com>...
Newly obtained military records of one of Sen. John F. Kerry's most
vocal critics, who has accused the Democratic presidential candidate
of lying about his wartime record to win medals, contradict his own
version of events.
Sure, Kerry didn't lie about killing babies, or how he got his wounds
which were too minor for other vets to consider as wounds.
I have some serious concerns about conservatives' ability to listen,
to hear, what has actually been said.
Atrocities were committed in the Viet Nam war by American soldiers.
Atrocities have been committed by American soldiers in every war.
It's a fact of war. Viet Nam wasn't honorable in any way.
Conservatives get ***** when they can't get their way, and since
their war on communism got shut down in Viet Nam, their anger has been
festering. In 2004, it's going volcanic.
Kerry never claimed to have killed babies, despite Hannity's putting
those words in his mouth. Anybody can read or listen for themselves
what Kerry said to the Foreign Relations Committee. Kerry never said
that ALL American soldiers committed atrocities. Kerry referred to
known cases, and a war that was being waged not according to
established standards of military behavior. Kerry talked about how
atrocities happened due to the approval, explicit or implicit, of the
officers.
Wounds are wounds, rules are rules, and Kerry didn't manufacture the
purple heart and award it to himself. If Bush got an honorable
discharge with his ridiculous non-service record, then how you fault
Kerry is beyond me.
These "newly obtained records" were "found" by someone after almost 40
years, and probably can be traced back to Kerry"s efforts to get a
bronze medal. It is just another effort of the major leftwing media
conglomerates like CNN, ABC, CBS, NBC, PBS, MSNBC, Reuters, Google,
Time-Warner and others to obscure, deflect, run interference for,
publish disinformation about, bury or otherwise obfuscate the story,
but it's starting to reach more and more people - through the efforts
of talk radio, the blogosphere, e-mail lists, and newsgroup posters.
Articles by the Associated Press and other media outlets cannot be
trusted.
The swiftboat vet making the claim that there were no bullets being
fired that day refused to release his own military records so that the
media could see his after-action statement of the events of the day.
The swiftboat vets are demanding both air and print time, and expect
the media to give it to them based on their word alone. These men are
unknowns. Fewer than a handful even knew John Kerry in Viet Nam. I
heard one on the radio, who only saw Kerry when all lieutenants were
called to orders (rarely), describe him as "imperious." They had
never spoken, and this guy builds up a grudge in his own mind of who
Kerry is. On a first impression. Kerry's own crew talk about him in
glowing terms. Haven't you ever had a negative first impression of
somebody, which you realize later was all wrong? The more I hear
these swiftboat vets in interviews, the more I realize how fucked up
in the head they are.
The Washington Post got the swiftboat vet's military records, after he
refused to release them, through the Freedom of Information Act. Just
recently. He's been saying that there were no bullets flying, and
guess what his own statement at the time says? BULLETS WERE FLYING!
The guy lied.
The Swift Boat Veterans provide detailed accounts from dozens and
dozens of eyewitnesses which contrasts with Kerry's boastful
descriptions of the exact same incidents. If the 254 veterans against
Kerry got one-tenth as much media coverage for calling Kerry a liar as
Clown Joe Wilson did for calling Bush a liar, the veterans wouldn't
need to buy ad time to get their message out.
Fewer than a handful of "the 254 veterans" served with Kerry or even
knew Kerry. They weren't even there. And those that were there
weren't on Kerry's boat.
Kerry is demanding to be made president on the basis of spending four
months in Vietnam 35 years ago. And yet the men who know what he did
during those four months don't think he's fit to be dog catcher. That
seems newsworthy to me, but I must be wrong since the media have
engineered a total blackout of the Swift Boat Veterans.
The media engineered a total blackout of the swiftboat veterans???
They are everywhere. On TV, radio, newspapers. They're over-exposed.
It's now into farcical proportions.
Two hundred fifty-four Swift Boat Veterans have signed a letter saying
John Kerry is not fit to be commander in chief, a point developed in
some detail in the blockbuster new book by John O'Neill, aptly titled
"Unfit for Command." (Note - "Unfit for Command" is now number ONE on
both Amazon.com and Barnes and Noble, and currently number THREE on
the New York Times Bestseller List.)
At the 2003 reunion of Swift Boat Veterans, about 300 men showed up:
85 percent of them think Kerry is unfit to be president. Fewer than 10
percent of all Swift Boat Veterans contacted refused to sign the
letter.
That should have been your first clue that they are fucked up in the
head. To carry such venom toward Kerry (and you know that it's really
all about his efforts to end the Viet Nam war), and think that Bush IS
fit is certifiable.
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| User: "Harry" |
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| Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records |
20 Aug 2004 06:02:27 PM |
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(Dave Cook) wrote in message news:<c687e307.0408190409.513ffbb6@posting.google.com>...
"Yang, AthD (h.c)" <eacmole@/*AWOLBUSH*/mail.com> wrote in message news:<a288i0d06ld98e1j8t68q6nrnd08mvbf9r@4ax.com>...
Newly obtained military records of one of Sen. John F. Kerry's most
vocal critics, who has accused the Democratic presidential candidate
of lying about his wartime record to win medals, contradict his own
version of events.
Sure, Kerry didn't lie about killing babies, or how he got his wounds
which were too minor for other vets to consider as wounds.
These "newly obtained records" were "found" by someone after almost 40
years, and probably can be traced back to Kerry"s efforts to get a
bronze medal. It is just another effort of the major leftwing media
conglomerates like CNN, ABC, CBS, NBC, PBS, MSNBC, Reuters, Google,
Time-Warner and others to obscure, deflect, run interference for,
publish disinformation about, bury or otherwise obfuscate the story,
Yeah yeah. It's all a conspiracy. All these newspapers and news
services are obviously part of a giant conspiracy. It couldn't have
anything to do with the fact that this is the third attempt to smear
the Kerry campaign, beginning with a doctored photo Stalin would have
been proud of, followed by the intern who wasn't an intern and who
wasn't harassed.
And all those lies! They couldn't have anything to do with the
largest single military and political blunder in US history, the most
corrupt and dishonest administration in US history, the commission of
war crimes in our name, the trashing of working people in favor of the
very rich, the trashing of enviromental laws and safeguards (already
laughably weak), the first administration since Hoover to lose jobs
over the four year term.
Right. It's a conspiracy. Has nothing to do with the wonderful job
the Cheney-Lay administration is doing. You ready for the war in
Iran?
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| User: "Martin W. Smith" |
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| Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records |
19 Aug 2004 07:15:53 AM |
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(Dave Cook) wrote:
These "newly obtained records" were "found" by someone after almost 40
years, and probably can be traced back to Kerry"s efforts to get a
bronze medal.
If you had ever been *in* the military you would know that one doesn't
make "efforts" to get a medal. Someone nominates you for a medal,
normally your commander.
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| User: "Al" |
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| Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records |
19 Aug 2004 02:09:44 PM |
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Martin W. Smith <no.email@this.time> wrote in message news:<kc69i0ttqg4522lf43u0i7em2puem9efo7@4ax.com>...
saguaro@surfbest.net (Dave Cook) wrote:
These "newly obtained records" were "found" by someone after almost 40
years, and probably can be traced back to Kerry"s efforts to get a
bronze medal.
If you had ever been *in* the military
What military were you in?
you would know that one doesn't
make "efforts" to get a medal. Someone nominates you for a medal,
normally your commander.
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| User: "Martin W. Smith" |
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| Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records |
20 Aug 2004 12:47:25 AM |
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(Al) wrote:
Martin W. Smith <no.email@this.time> wrote in message news:<kc69i0ttqg4522lf43u0i7em2puem9efo7@4ax.com>...
saguaro@surfbest.net (Dave Cook) wrote:
These "newly obtained records" were "found" by someone after almost 40
years, and probably can be traced back to Kerry"s efforts to get a
bronze medal.
If you had ever been *in* the military
What military were you in?
The US. The one you weren't in.
you would know that one doesn't
make "efforts" to get a medal. Someone nominates you for a medal,
normally your commander.
.
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| User: "Jim" |
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| Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records |
21 Aug 2004 06:17:18 AM |
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"Martin W. Smith" <no.email@this.time> wrote in message
news:724bi09eeihhucchq96gsj7b89rh7ef350@4ax.com...
caddyshack_al@my-deja.com (Al) wrote:
Martin W. Smith <no.email@this.time> wrote in message
news:<kc69i0ttqg4522lf43u0i7em2puem9efo7@4ax.com>...
saguaro@surfbest.net (Dave Cook) wrote:
These "newly obtained records" were "found" by someone after almost 40
years, and probably can be traced back to Kerry"s efforts to get a
bronze medal.
If you had ever been *in* the military
What military were you in?
The US. The one you weren't in.
you would know that one doesn't
make "efforts" to get a medal. Someone nominates you for a medal,
normally your commander.
Martin I am in the military and judging from the statements
from the late Admiral Zumwalt and now over 254 of Kerry's
brothers in arms. Kerry was making "efforts" to get medals.
Didn't it ever strike you odd that of all who served in Vietnam,
Kerry in only 4 months.....bronze, silver, 3 purple hearts which
triggered a get out of Vietnam free clause. Also why when
he was riding the anti-war momemtum into the Senate around 71'
his Nam service and everyone else was "raping, murdering, torturing"
But now in 2004 his service transformed into "honorable, and look
at my medals!" Where did all that "redone" war footage come from?
Kerry himself filmed it! Who the hell outside of a reporter filmed
that much in Vietnam?
As the late Admiral Zumwalt remarked on LtJg Kerry
"he is a loose cannon. It seems he's punching a ticket here
for something later on!"
Jim
--
The hard-line, anti-American Tehran Times published the entire text of the
seven-paragraph e-mail under a triumphant headline announcing that Kerry
pledged to "repair damage if he wins election." By claiming that the Kerry
campaign had sent the message directly to an Iranian news agency in Tehran,
the paper indicated that the e-mail was a demonstration of Kerry's support
for a murderous regime that even today tops the State Department's list of
supporters of international terrorism.
According to dissident Ayatollah Mehdi Haeri, who fled Iran for Germany
after being held for four years in a regime prison, Iran's hard-line clerics
"fear President Bush." In an interview with Insight, Haeri says that
President Bush's messages of support to pro-democracy forces inside Iran and
his insistence that the Iranian regime abandon its nuclear-weapons program
"have given these people the shivers. They think that if Bush is re-elected,
they'll be gone. That's why they want to see Kerry elected."
.
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| User: "Martin W. Smith" |
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| Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records |
22 Aug 2004 01:32:50 AM |
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"Jim" <KerrycallsVeteransMurderers@socialist.com> wrote:
"Martin W. Smith" <no.email@this.time> wrote in message
news:724bi09eeihhucchq96gsj7b89rh7ef350@4ax.com...
caddyshack_al@my-deja.com (Al) wrote:
Martin W. Smith <no.email@this.time> wrote in message
news:<kc69i0ttqg4522lf43u0i7em2puem9efo7@4ax.com>...
saguaro@surfbest.net (Dave Cook) wrote:
These "newly obtained records" were "found" by someone after almost 40
years, and probably can be traced back to Kerry"s efforts to get a
bronze medal.
If you had ever been *in* the military
What military were you in?
The US. The one you weren't in.
you would know that one doesn't
make "efforts" to get a medal. Someone nominates you for a medal,
normally your commander.
Martin I am in the military and judging from the statements
from the late Admiral Zumwalt and now over 254 of Kerry's
brothers in arms. Kerry was making "efforts" to get medals.
What is the evidence for their claim?
Didn't it ever strike you odd that of all who served in Vietnam,
Kerry in only 4 months.....bronze, silver, 3 purple hearts which
triggered a get out of Vietnam free clause.
That isn't a complete sentence, so I'm not sure what you are asking,
but nothing about the reports of Kerry's service record strikes me as
odd.
Also why when
he was riding the anti-war momemtum into the Senate around 71'
his Nam service and everyone else was "raping, murdering, torturing"
But now in 2004 his service transformed into "honorable, and look
at my medals!"
I think you don't understand. The raping, murdering, and torturing,
all of which did occur in Vietnam, was not honorable. It wasn't
honorable then, and it isn't honorable now in Iraq. His service was
not transformed into honorable. His service, and the service of most
of our sodiers, was honorable and remains honorable. The war was
morally wrong, right from the start. It was started based on lies by
the government, just like the war in Iraq.
Where did all that "redone" war footage come from?
Kerry himself filmed it! Who the hell outside of a reporter filmed
that much in Vietnam?
I don't know the answers to these questions. Do you have evidence?
As the late Admiral Zumwalt remarked on LtJg Kerry
"he is a loose cannon. It seems he's punching a ticket here
for something later on!"
He should have been a loose cannon. We needed more loose cannons. The
war was immoral. We never should have gone there to fight it. The
loose cannons helped get us out. Zumwalt didn't.
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| User: "jet" |
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| Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records |
22 Aug 2004 04:17:08 AM |
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In article <22fgi09j95t8cqat58jupjut4kj4n8mh42@4ax.com>, Martin W. Smith <no.email@this.time> wrote:
"Jim" <KerrycallsVeteransMurderers@socialist.com> wrote:
As the late Admiral Zumwalt remarked on LtJg Kerry
"he is a loose cannon. It seems he's punching a ticket here
for something later on!"
He should have been a loose cannon. We needed more loose cannons. The
war was immoral. We never should have gone there to fight it. The
loose cannons helped get us out. Zumwalt didn't.
Zumwalt didn't say that, Rear Adm. Roy Hoffman (ret) did. What Zumwalt
said was "Kerry's calmness, professionalism and great personal courage
under fire were in keeping with the highest traditions of the United
States Naval Service."
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| User: "Enkidu" |
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| Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records |
22 Aug 2004 01:42:34 AM |
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Martin W. Smith <no.email@this.time> wrote in
news:22fgi09j95t8cqat58jupjut4kj4n8mh42@4ax.com:
"Jim" <KerrycallsVeteransMurderers@socialist.com> wrote:
"Martin W. Smith" <no.email@this.time> wrote in message
news:724bi09eeihhucchq96gsj7b89rh7ef350@4ax.com...
caddyshack_al@my-deja.com (Al) wrote:
Martin W. Smith <no.email@this.time> wrote in message
news:<kc69i0ttqg4522lf43u0i7em2puem9efo7@4ax.com>...
saguaro@surfbest.net (Dave Cook) wrote:
These "newly obtained records" were "found" by someone after
almost 40 years, and probably can be traced back to Kerry"s
efforts to get a bronze medal.
If you had ever been *in* the military
What military were you in?
The US. The one you weren't in.
you would know that one doesn't
make "efforts" to get a medal. Someone nominates you for a medal,
normally your commander.
Martin I am in the military and judging from the statements
from the late Admiral Zumwalt and now over 254 of Kerry's
brothers in arms. Kerry was making "efforts" to get medals.
What is the evidence for their claim?
Didn't it ever strike you odd that of all who served in Vietnam,
Kerry in only 4 months.....bronze, silver, 3 purple hearts which
triggered a get out of Vietnam free clause.
That isn't a complete sentence, so I'm not sure what you are asking,
but nothing about the reports of Kerry's service record strikes me as
odd.
Also why when
he was riding the anti-war momemtum into the Senate around 71'
his Nam service and everyone else was "raping, murdering, torturing"
But now in 2004 his service transformed into "honorable, and look
at my medals!"
I think you don't understand. The raping, murdering, and torturing,
all of which did occur in Vietnam, was not honorable. It wasn't
honorable then, and it isn't honorable now in Iraq. His service was
not transformed into honorable. His service, and the service of most
of our sodiers, was honorable and remains honorable. The war was
morally wrong, right from the start. It was started based on lies by
the government, just like the war in Iraq.
Where did all that "redone" war footage come from?
Kerry himself filmed it! Who the hell outside of a reporter filmed
that much in Vietnam?
I don't know the answers to these questions. Do you have evidence?
My father filmed in Vietnam with a super-8 camera. He was a Navy
corpsman. Several of his friends did as well. Pictures, film, audio of
events in Vietnam were all common when I was growing up a Navy brat.
Ship's crews put together "Cruise Books", just like high school
yearbooks, of each cruise. Pictures of gunfire, shore targets exploding,
etc, were included. Kerry filming would not have been unusual in any
way.
As the late Admiral Zumwalt remarked on LtJg Kerry
"he is a loose cannon. It seems he's punching a ticket here
for something later on!"
Does anyone have a cite for this quote. I don't believe it.
He should have been a loose cannon. We needed more loose cannons. The
war was immoral. We never should have gone there to fight it. The
loose cannons helped get us out. Zumwalt didn't.
Sadly, after 58,000 bodybags came home.
--
Enkidu aa 2165
Now playing: Jet - Are You Gonna Be My Girl
That wall, embodied in the First Amendment, is perhaps
America's most important contribution to political progress
on this planet.
Lowell Weicker
Republican Senator 1971-1989
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| User: "Lloyd Parker" |
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| Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records |
21 Aug 2004 05:27:53 AM |
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|
In article <2bGVc.9254$Bt5.7155@twister.socal.rr.com>,
"Jim" <KerrycallsVeteransMurderers@socialist.com> wrote:
"Martin W. Smith" <no.email@this.time> wrote in message
news:724bi09eeihhucchq96gsj7b89rh7ef350@4ax.com...
caddyshack_al@my-deja.com (Al) wrote:
Martin W. Smith <no.email@this.time> wrote in message
news:<kc69i0ttqg4522lf43u0i7em2puem9efo7@4ax.com>...
saguaro@surfbest.net (Dave Cook) wrote:
These "newly obtained records" were "found" by someone after almost 40
years, and probably can be traced back to Kerry"s efforts to get a
bronze medal.
If you had ever been *in* the military
What military were you in?
The US. The one you weren't in.
you would know that one doesn't
make "efforts" to get a medal. Someone nominates you for a medal,
normally your commander.
Martin I am in the military and judging from the statements
from the late Admiral Zumwalt and now over 254 of Kerry's
brothers in arms. Kerry was making "efforts" to get medals.
www.factcheck.org
Didn't it ever strike you odd that of all who served in Vietnam,
Kerry in only 4 months.....
Liar. He served TWO tours.
bronze, silver, 3 purple hearts which
triggered a get out of Vietnam free clause. Also why when
he was riding the anti-war momemtum into the Senate around 71'
his Nam service and everyone else was "raping, murdering, torturing"
But now in 2004 his service transformed into "honorable, and look
at my medals!" Where did all that "redone" war footage come from?
Kerry himself filmed it! Who the hell outside of a reporter filmed
that much in Vietnam?
Lots of vets. Ask them.
As the late Admiral Zumwalt remarked on LtJg Kerry
"he is a loose cannon. It seems he's punching a ticket here
for something later on!"
Not what he said when he awarded him his Silver Star. The admiral that did
so said he wished it could have been a Navy Cross.
Jim
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| User: "Al" |
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| Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records |
22 Aug 2004 05:58:27 PM |
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(Lloyd Parker) wrote in message news:<cg7m38$n1l$11@puck.cc.emory.edu>...
In article <2bGVc.9254$Bt5.7155@twister.socal.rr.com>,
"Jim" <KerrycallsVeteransMurderers@socialist.com> wrote:
"Martin W. Smith" <no.email@this.time> wrote in message
news:724bi09eeihhucchq96gsj7b89rh7ef350@4ax.com...
caddyshack_al@my-deja.com (Al) wrote:
Martin W. Smith <no.email@this.time> wrote in message
news:<kc69i0ttqg4522lf43u0i7em2puem9efo7@4ax.com>...
saguaro@surfbest.net (Dave Cook) wrote:
These "newly obtained records" were "found" by someone after almost 40
years, and probably can be traced back to Kerry"s efforts to get a
bronze medal.
If you had ever been *in* the military
What military were you in?
The US. The one you weren't in.
you would know that one doesn't
make "efforts" to get a medal. Someone nominates you for a medal,
normally your commander.
Martin I am in the military and judging from the statements
from the late Admiral Zumwalt and now over 254 of Kerry's
brothers in arms. Kerry was making "efforts" to get medals.
www.factcheck.org
Didn't it ever strike you odd that of all who served in Vietnam,
Kerry in only 4 months.....
Liar. He served TWO tours.
This is true. He was on the USS Gridley which never saw any enemy action.
.
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| User: "Jim" |
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| Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records |
23 Aug 2004 03:18:04 AM |
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"Al" <caddyshack_al@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:3965eb5d.0408221458.1c4f2474@posting.google.com...
lparker@NOSPAMemory.edu (Lloyd Parker) wrote in message
news:<cg7m38$n1l$11@puck.cc.emory.edu>...
In article <2bGVc.9254$Bt5.7155@twister.socal.rr.com>,
"Jim" <KerrycallsVeteransMurderers@socialist.com> wrote:
"Martin W. Smith" <no.email@this.time> wrote in message
news:724bi09eeihhucchq96gsj7b89rh7ef350@4ax.com...
caddyshack_al@my-deja.com (Al) wrote:
Martin W. Smith <no.email@this.time> wrote in message
news:<kc69i0ttqg4522lf43u0i7em2puem9efo7@4ax.com>...
saguaro@surfbest.net (Dave Cook) wrote:
These "newly obtained records" were "found" by someone after
almost 40
years, and probably can be traced back to Kerry"s efforts to get
a
bronze medal.
If you had ever been *in* the military
What military were you in?
The US. The one you weren't in.
you would know that one doesn't
make "efforts" to get a medal. Someone nominates you for a medal,
normally your commander.
Martin I am in the military and judging from the statements
from the late Admiral Zumwalt and now over 254 of Kerry's
brothers in arms. Kerry was making "efforts" to get medals.
www.factcheck.org
Didn't it ever strike you odd that of all who served in Vietnam,
Kerry in only 4 months.....
Liar. He served TWO tours.
This is true. He was on the USS Gridley which never saw any enemy action.
HELL the Gridley NEVER saw Vietnam while John Kerry was apart of
her crew!
Jim
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| User: "z" |
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| Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records |
23 Aug 2004 08:06:35 PM |
|
|
"Jim" <KerrycallsVeteransMurderers@socialist.com> wrote in message news:<0LhWc.10400$Bt5.10082@twister.socal.rr.com>...
"Al" <caddyshack_al@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:3965eb5d.0408221458.1c4f2474@posting.google.com...
lparker@NOSPAMemory.edu (Lloyd Parker) wrote in message
news:<cg7m38$n1l$11@puck.cc.emory.edu>...
In article <2bGVc.9254$Bt5.7155@twister.socal.rr.com>,
"Jim" <KerrycallsVeteransMurderers@socialist.com> wrote:
"Martin W. Smith" <no.email@this.time> wrote in message
news:724bi09eeihhucchq96gsj7b89rh7ef350@4ax.com...
caddyshack_al@my-deja.com (Al) wrote:
Martin W. Smith <no.email@this.time> wrote in message
news:<kc69i0ttqg4522lf43u0i7em2puem9efo7@4ax.com>...
saguaro@surfbest.net (Dave Cook) wrote:
These "newly obtained records" were "found" by someone after
almost 40
years, and probably can be traced back to Kerry"s efforts to get
a
bronze medal.
If you had ever been *in* the military
What military were you in?
The US. The one you weren't in.
you would know that one doesn't
make "efforts" to get a medal. Someone nominates you for a medal,
normally your commander.
Martin I am in the military and judging from the statements
from the late Admiral Zumwalt and now over 254 of Kerry's
brothers in arms. Kerry was making "efforts" to get medals.
www.factcheck.org
Didn't it ever strike you odd that of all who served in Vietnam,
Kerry in only 4 months.....
Liar. He served TWO tours.
This is true. He was on the USS Gridley which never saw any enemy action.
HELL the Gridley NEVER saw Vietnam while John Kerry was apart of
her crew!
Jim
Oddly enough, neither did Bush. Coincidence? Or Conspiracy?
.
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| User: "Douglas Berry" |
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| Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records |
25 Aug 2004 03:06:25 PM |
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|
In our last thrilling episode, "Jim"
<KerrycallsVeteransMurderers@socialist.com> was pushed over the cliffs
of alt.atheism on Mon, 23 Aug 2004 08:18:04 GMT by Zoog, minion of
Zathar. As he fell, he screamed:
HELL the Gridley NEVER saw Vietnam while John Kerry was apart of
her crew!
Yep. Anf then Ensign Kerry volunteered to go into the fight. He
*asked* for a combat assignment.
Once in combat, according to the US Navy and his actual shipmates, he
performed his duties with excellence. Even some of the "Swift Boat
Veterans for Truth" are on record praising John Kerry's combat record.
Wonder how much they were bribed to change their stories...
--
Douglas E. Berry Do the OBVIOUS thing to send e-mail
Atheist #2147, Atheist Vet #5
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as
when they do it from religious conviction."
Blaise Pascal (1623-1662), Pense'es, #894.
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| User: "Kevin Anthoney" |
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| Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records |
25 Aug 2004 04:33:25 PM |
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Douglas Berry wrote:
In our last thrilling episode, "Jim"
<KerrycallsVeteransMurderers@socialist.com> was pushed over the cliffs
of alt.atheism on Mon, 23 Aug 2004 08:18:04 GMT by Zoog, minion of
Zathar. As he fell, he screamed:
HELL the Gridley NEVER saw Vietnam while John Kerry was apart of
her crew!
Yep. Anf then Ensign Kerry volunteered to go into the fight. He
*asked* for a combat assignment.
Once in combat, according to the US Navy and his actual shipmates, he
performed his duties with excellence. Even some of the "Swift Boat
Veterans for Truth" are on record praising John Kerry's combat record.
Wonder how much they were bribed to change their stories...
Maybe they thought they might as well get *something* out of Bush, now that
he's trashed their benefits?
--
Kevin Anthoney
kanthoney[a]dsl.pipex.com
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records |
25 Aug 2004 04:10:09 PM |
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On Wed, 25 Aug 2004 20:06:25 GMT, Douglas Berry
<penguin_boy@mindOBVIOUSspring.com> wrote:
In our last thrilling episode, "Jim"
<KerrycallsVeteransMurderers@socialist.com> was pushed over the cliffs
of alt.atheism on Mon, 23 Aug 2004 08:18:04 GMT by Zoog, minion of
Zathar. As he fell, he screamed:
HELL the Gridley NEVER saw Vietnam while John Kerry was apart of
her crew!
More swifties lies. The ship was billeted to the Gulf of Tonkin while
Kerry was on it.
_______
Vote Bush/Voldemort 2004!
.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records |
23 Aug 2004 09:41:14 AM |
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On Mon, 23 Aug 2004 08:18:04 GMT, "Jim"
<KerrycallsVeteransMurderers@socialist.com> wrote:
This is true. He was on the USS Gridley which never saw any enemy action.
HELL the Gridley NEVER saw Vietnam while John Kerry was apart of
her crew!
Utter nonsense it was billeted to the Gulf of Tonkin to provide cover
for aircraft carriers and aircraft.
_______
Vote Bush/Voldemort 2004!
.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records |
23 Aug 2004 09:45:55 AM |
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On Mon, 23 Aug 2004 08:18:04 GMT, "Jim"
<KerrycallsVeteransMurderers@socialist.com> wrote:
Kerry in only 4 months.....
Liar. He served TWO tours.
This is true. He was on the USS Gridley which never saw any enemy action.
HELL the Gridley NEVER saw Vietnam while John Kerry was apart of
her crew!
You guys always just jump straight to the next lie. How incredible.
How pathetic. You never even look into something before opening your
mouth.
http://www.vietnamwar.com/JohnKerrySilverStar.htm
March 22, 1967 – {Kerry}Reports to U.S. Fleet Anti-Air Warfare
Training Center (CA). Receives training as a Combat Information Center
Watch Officer.
June 8, 1967 – Kerry reports to USS Gridley-serves in several
capacities
February 9, 1968 – USS Gridley departs for a Western Pacific (WESTPAC)
deployment, to engage in operations in support of the Vietnam War.
Ship spends time in the Gulf of Tonkin off North Vietnam, at Subic Bay
in the Philippines and in Wellington, New Zealand
February 10, 1968 – Kerry requests duty in Vietnam He lists his first
preference for a position as an officer in charge of a Swift Boat
(designated PCF for Patrol Craft Fast), his second as an officer in a
patrol boat (designated PBR, for Patrol Boat River) squadron
May 27, 1968 – USS Gridley sets sail for the US
June 6, 1968 – Kerry arrives in Long Beach the day after Senator
Robert F. Kennedy is killed in Los Angeles
_______
Vote Bush/Voldemort 2004!
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| User: "Psalm110" |
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| Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records |
23 Aug 2004 08:00:12 PM |
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On Mon, 23 Aug 2004 08:18:04 GMT, after shitting on the constitution
"Jim" <KerrycallsVeteransMurderers@socialist.com> told SwiftLies
??? >
??? > This is true. He was on the USS Gridley which never saw any
enemy action.
???
??? HELL the Gridley NEVER saw Vietnam while John Kerry was apart of
??? her crew!
Fresh Links to Republican FELONY FRAUD SmearBoats villians
HOT NEWS! Exposing more on the Felony Fraud SwiftLiars Organized Crime
connections
LATEST NEWS - August 23, 2004
** http://tinyurl.com/3kt5v Silver Star incident: Langhofer, on other
boat, saw firing from both banks of a river.
** http://tinyurl.com/5bf5k Vets, others call for resignation of
prosecutor in SwiftLies ad
** http://tinyurl.com/63wmp Republican prosecutor Alfred French's lies
on affidavit about events he did not witness.
** http://tinyurl.com/65qsn Republican prosecuter's Anti-Kerry hearsay
is worthless.
August 22 or earlier:
** http://tinyurl.com/4e3y2 BusinessWeek: Flinging the Foul Mud of
Vietnam. John Kerry returned a hero. The smears his political enemies
are now flinging mark them -- not him -- as beneath contempt
** http://tinyurl.com/4yeu7 Kerry also picked up support from Wayne D.
Langhofer, who told The Washington Post he was manning a machine gun
in a boat behind Kerry's and saw firing from both banks of a river as
Kerry dived in to rescue Special Forces soldier James Rassmann, the
basis for Kerry's Bronze Star.
** http://tinyurl.com/6arcy Bush campaign admits "Cordier was a
supporter of the President during the 2000 election and served as a
member of the President's veterans' steering committee during this
election."
** http://tinyurl.com/44t3g Registered Republican SwillBoat Ad Shill
was not there.
** http://tinyurl.com/3rtwt SwillBoat prosecutors presents heresay as
if he was eyewitness.
** http://tinyurl.com/6ubnz SwillBoater claims he has no evidence
** http://tinyurl.com/639as SwiftLie vet working to help re-elect
incumbent president George W. Bush resigned
** http://tinyurl.com/5w7by More Republican Ties Revealed Behind
"Swift Boat Vets For Bush"
** http://tinyurl.com/6wre9 Bush Campaign Drops Swift Boat Ad Figure
-- Cordier's connection to the Bush campaign was made public yesterday
by the Kerry campaign, which found that Cordier had been named on the
Bush Web site earlier this month as a member of the veterans committee
** http://tinyurl.com/4gs53 Cordier was SWFT and GOP operative at same
time. Kenneth Cordier, a retired colonel ... who appeared in an
advertisement to be aired by the anti-Kerry group, SWVT, would on
longer serve in his voluntary position on President George W. Bush's
veterans steering committee.
** http://tinyurl.com/5telj Republican Sen. Pat Roberts of Kansas,
chairman of the Senate intelligence committee, said that while the
group had "every right" to express their opinion, "WE OUGHT TO GET OUT
OF THE CHARACTER ASSASSINATION BUSINESS."
NEWS - August 21, 2004
**
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/08/20/politics/campaign/20swift.html?pagewanted=1
http://tinyurl.com/4r7a8
** http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A21239-2004Aug21.html
http://tinyurl.com/4fyem Swift Boat Accounts Incomplete And Flawed
**
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/specials/elections/chi-040821rood,1,1611037.story?coll=chi-news-hed
http://tinyurl.com/6wvtm Anti-Kerry vets not there that day
**
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/chi-040821kerry,1,7582568.story?coll=chi-news-hed
http://tinyurl.com/6v4no Swift boat skipper: Kerry critics wrong --
Tribune editor breaks long silence on Kerry record; fought in disputed
battle
**
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/2004/08/21/MNGE08C6V11.DTL
http://tinyurl.com/45xfx Kerry's Vietnam-era testimony criticized in
new attack ad -- Democrat counters with endorsement by retired general
** http://www.suntimes.com/output/elect/cst-nws-camp21.html
http://tinyurl.com/4jjth Dems see link to Swift Boat Vets, Bush-Cheney
----------------------------------
*** George W. Bush - Closely tied to Merrie Spaeth's husband Tex
Lezar, benefitted from Bob Perry money, linked to Karl Rove, to
Stevens Reed Curcio & Potholm, to Regnery publishing, to Harlan Crow
http://tinyurl.com/4uc37 GOOGLE.COM Results 220 for "George W. Bush"
Merrie Spaeth Tex Lezar.
http://tinyurl.com/54lqw GOOGLE.COM Results 257 for "George W. Bush"
"Tex Lezar".
http://tinyurl.com/6j2gd GOOGLE.COM Results 613 for "George W. Bush"
"Bob Perry"".
*** Karl Rove - Closely linked to GW Bush, to Merrie Spaeth, to John
O'Neill, to Bob Perry, to Harlan Crow, to organized crime conspiracies
of Philip Morris
http://tinyurl.com/3hpjo
http://tobaccodocuments.org/ai_news/11015.html?pattern=%22Karl%20Rove%22&?pattern=%22Karl%20Rove%22#images
http://tinyurl.com/5cmwh
http://www.thenation.com/doc.mhtml%3Fi=19991108&s=dreyfuss
http://tinyurl.com/5gbbd
http://www.thenation.com/doc.mhtml?i=19991108&c=2&s=dreyfuss
http://tinyurl.com/5qcb2
http://legacy.library.ucsf.edu/cgi/getdoc?tid=hfd83c00&fmt=tif&ref=results
http://tinyurl.com/6ocdy GOOGLE.COM Results 5,100 for "Karl Rove"
"Swift Boat".
http://tinyurl.com/69vjn
http://tobaccodocuments.org/pm/2041158396.html?pattern=%22Karl%20Rove%22&?pattern=%22Karl%20Rove%22#images
http://tinyurl.com/5l2ee
http://tobaccodocuments.org/pm/2041158370.html?pattern=%22Karl%20Rove%22&?pattern=%22Karl%20Rove%22#images
*** Merrie Spaeth (Tex Lezar) Linked to GW Bush, Linked to smears of
John McCain using same criminal fraud tactics, to Karl Rove, Bob
Perry, to Ken Starr, linked to organized crime tobacco conspiracies
http://tinyurl.com/64v3c GOOGLE.COM Results 814 for "Merrie Spaeth"
republican.
http://tinyurl.com/63zvu GOOGLE.COM Results 317 for "Merrie Spaeth"
"Tex Lezar".
http://tinyurl.com/43fek GOOGLE.COM Results 10 for "Tex Lezar"
tobacco.
*** Roy F. Hoffmann, a retired rear admiral and a leader of the group
http://tinyurl.com/5h6za http://mediamatters.org/items/200406020006
http://tinyurl.com/3rx8z http://mediamatters.org/items/200408060011
*** John E. O'Neill (Charles Colson apprentice) Linked to Nixon,
registered republican and donor, linked to Crow and Perry, to Corsi
and Regnery
http://tinyurl.com/4vrwq GOOGLE.COM Results 482 for "John E. O'Neill"
Colson.
http://tinyurl.com/496xl
http://www.disinfopedia.org/wiki.phtml?title=John_E._O'Neill
*** Harlan Crow (Swiftliars funder) Linked to Bush, to Perry AEI
board,
http://tinyurl.com/5afl5
http://www.aei.org/about/contentID.20038142214500073/default.asp
http://tinyurl.com/6l7vn GOOGLE.COM Results 113 for "Harlan Crow"
Holdings.
http://tinyurl.com/57oc8 GOOGLE.COM Results 217 for "Harlan Crow"
swift.
*** Bob J. Perry (Swiftliars funder) Linked to Bush, Rove, Crow
http://tinyurl.com/3oggt
http://okimc.org/newswire.php?story_id=79&media_type=TEXT
http://tinyurl.com/6kaso GOOGLE.COM Results 1,630 for "Bob Perry"
swift.
*** Stevens Reed Curcio & Potholm, (SwillBoat Ad maker) Linked to
republican party, numerous republican polician campaigns
http://tinyurl.com/5z7dd GOOGLE.COM Results 43 for "Stevens Reed
Curcio & Potholm" swift.
http://tinyurl.com/6g7fc http://srcpmedia.com/corp2.html
http://tinyurl.com/55f4r http://srcpmedia.com/corp2.html
http://tinyurl.com/5uwlw http://srcpmedia.com/house.html
http://tinyurl.com/5nmv7 http://srcpmedia.com/senate.html
http://tinyurl.com/6xnut http://srcpmedia.com/work.html
*** Regnery, a conservative company linked to Richard Mellon Scaife
who manipulates best-seller book list rankings, to Ken Starr, to Corsi
and O'Neill
http://tinyurl.com/5qw2n http://www.phillips.com/eagle.htm
http://tinyurl.com/4zvy2
http://encyclopedia.thefreedictionary.com/Richard%20Scaife
http://tinyurl.com/6vbpf
http://www.prospect.org/print/V11/5/confessore-n.html
http://tinyurl.com/5szod http://www.americanreview.us/back32.htm
http://tinyurl.com/4ycqd GOOGLE.COM Results 146 for "Regnery
Publishing" Richard Mellon Scaife.
*** Jerome R. Corsi Linked to Richard Scaife, to O'Neill, to Regnery
http://tinyurl.com/5a83u http://mediamatters.org/items/200408120001
http://tinyurl.com/5l66z http://mediamatters.org/items/200408110007
http://tinyurl.com/5zyuz http://mediamatters.org/items/200408060010
http://tinyurl.com/4zkmo
http://www.salon.com/src/ads/house/gateway/tv_head_gateway.html?http://www.salon.com/opinion/conason/2004/08/06/mccain_on_swift_boat_veterans/index_np.html
http://tinyurl.com/5zyuz http://mediamatters.org/items/200408060010
*** Dr. Louis Letson
http://tinyurl.com/3sf73
http://www.fearofclowns.com/text/kerry_faked_first_purple_heart_debunked/
http://tinyurl.com/5atvt
http://www.factcheck.org/article.aspx?docID=231
*** William L. Schachte Jr., a retired rear admiral
http://tinyurl.com/3wttr
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/04228/361477.stm
http://tinyurl.com/65xuf
http://www.underzealous.com/index.php/2004/08/13/p522
*** Larry Thurlow, who said his boat was 50 to 60 yards from Mr.
Kerry's.
http://tinyurl.com/5m4dc
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A13267-2004Aug18.html
http://tinyurl.com/6fyu4
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A13267-2004Aug18.html
http://tinyurl.com/5mhcw
http://www.thespoof.com/news/spoof.cfm?headline=s2i6344
The felony fraud organized crime ring is further connected to other
organiced crime fraud operations:
### Richard Mellon Scaife <http://tinyurl.com/5vdpe> is trumpetting it
from his publications. Scaife is historically linked to several of the
felons in the SwiftLiars crime ring. Scaife also funds a broad
coalition of websites and front organizations which are also promoting
this felony conspiracy though their own fraud crime operations:
Scaife thrall organization and Scaife leash-dollars put in it:
*** Heritage Foundation, $20,696,640 (Townhall.com)
http://tinyurl.com/6ng83 GOOGLE.COM Results Results 6,000 for
"Heritage Foundation" Swift boat OR Boats.
*** American Enterprise Institute for Public Policy Research
$5,201,000
http://tinyurl.com/68tqj GOOGLE.COM Results Results 1,750 for
"American Enterprise Institute" Swift boat OR Boats.
*** American Spectator Educational Foundation, Inc. $4,144,000
http://tinyurl.com/3n92j GOOGLE.COM Results Results 1,920 for
"American Spectator" Swift boat OR Boats.
*** Accuracy in Media, Inc. $3,225,000
http://tinyurl.com/3tg26 GOOGLE.COM Results Results 2,880 for
"Accuracy in Media" Swift boat OR Boats.
*** Citizens for a Sound Economy Foundation $2,335,000
http://tinyurl.com/53kxs GOOGLE.COM Results Results about 2,590 for
"Citizens for a Sound Economy" Swift boat OR Boats.
*** Cato Institute $1,872,500
http://tinyurl.com/6jrt7 GOOGLE.COM Results Results 1,920 for "Cato
Institute" Swift boat OR Boats.
*** National Center for Policy Analysis $1,760,000
http://tinyurl.com/4yyhy GOOGLE.COM Results Results 2,550 for
"National Center for Policy Analysis" Swift boat OR Boats.
*** Independent Women's Forum $1,600,000
http://tinyurl.com/4j9ae GOOGLE.COM Results Results 2,670 for
"Independent Women's Forum" Swift boat OR Boats.
*** Competitive Enterprise Institute $1,525,000
http://tinyurl.com/585fn GOOGLE.COM Results Results 2,550 for
"Competitive Enterprise Institute" Swift boat OR Boats.
*** American Legislative Exchange Council $1,495,000
http://tinyurl.com/5kuo9 GOOGLE.COM Results Results 2,480 for
"American Legislative Exchange Council" Swift boat OR Boats.
*** Defenders of Property Rights $965,000
http://tinyurl.com/4l3gc GOOGLE.COM Results Results 2,440 for
"Defenders of Property Rights" Swift boat OR Boats.
*** Media Research Center, Inc. $952,000
http://tinyurl.com/46hys GOOGLE.COM Results Results 5,240 for "Media
Research Center" Swift boat OR Boats.
*** Institute for Humane Studies $950,000
http://tinyurl.com/3w7b3 GOOGLE.COM Results Results 2,450 for
"Institute for Humane Studies" Swift boat OR Boats.
*** National Center for Public Policy Research, Inc. $825,000
http://tinyurl.com/59wll Google.com 2,610 for "National Center for
Public Policy Research" Swift boat OR Boats.
*** Media Institute $645,000
http://tinyurl.com/6s7b4 GOOGLE.COM Results Results 1,200 for "Media
Institute" Swift boat OR Boats.
*** Acton Institute For The Study of Religion and Liberty $565,000
http://tinyurl.com/6h98g GOOGLE.COM Results Results 2,470 for "Acton
Institute" Swift boat OR Boats.
### Sun Myung Moon is another felony fraud conspirator using his
organized crime operation to advance his candidate who has a bilnd eye
to Moon's crimes. The WASHINGTON TIMES and UPI wireservice is Moonie
front operations. <
http://tinyurl.com/6nlt9>
***
http://tinyurl.com/55jrwGOOGLE.COM Results 42,600 for "Washington
Times" Swift boat OR Boats.
SUN MYUNG MOON uses "CHURCH PROPERTY", helps create 42,600 webpages
circulating LIES.
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| User: "Hanoi Jane Fonda" |
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| Title: Titanic or The Clinton Video? |
23 Aug 2004 09:16:07 PM |
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Titanic or The Clinton Video?
PROBLEM: Two Videos are for sale - Which to Buy?
Titanic or The Clinton Video?
TITANIC VIDEO: $9.99 on Internet
CLINTON VIDEO: $9.99 on Internet
TITANIC VIDEO: Over 3 hours long
CLINTON VIDEO: Over 3 hours long
TITANIC VIDEO: The story of Jack and Rose, their forbidden love, and
subsequent catastrophe.
CLINTON VIDEO: The story of Bill and Monica, their forbidden love, and
subsequent catastrophe.
TITANIC VIDEO: Jack is a starving artist
CLINTON VIDEO: Bill is a ***** artist
TITANIC VIDEO: In one scene, Jack enjoys a good cigar
CLINTON VIDEO: Ditto for Bill
TITANIC VIDEO: During ordeal, Rose's dress gets ruined
CLINTON VIDEO: Ditto for Monica
TITANIC VIDEO: Jack teaches Rose to spit
CLINTON VIDEO: Let's not go there
TITANIC VIDEO: Rose gets to keep her jewelry
CLINTON VIDEO: Monica's forced to return her gifts
TITANIC VIDEO: Rose remembers Jack for the rest of her life
CLINTON VIDEO: Clinton doesn't remember Jack
TITANIC VIDEO: Rose goes down on a vessel full of seamen
CLINTON VIDEO: Monica...ooh, never mind
TITANIC VIDEO: Jack surrenders to an icy death
CLINTON VIDEO: Bill goes home to Hillary ... basically the same thing.
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| User: "MOONIES for Bush" |
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| Title: Re: Titanic or The Clinton Video? |
25 Aug 2004 02:17:31 AM |
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On Mon, 23 Aug 2004 22:16:07 -0400, Hanoi Jane Fonda
<hanoi_jane@N0SPAM.C0M> twrote
forbidden love
Bush Pal SUN MYUNG MOON's Nuke-Tech to ATHEIST North Korea.
The issue is NOT purple hearts in Viet Nam, but Black Hearts in
Washington D.C.
George Bush buddy Sun Myung Moon gave nuclear weapons submarine
sea-launch technology to North Korea in 1994. That technology now
permits North Korea sea-platform launched missiles to hit continental
USA. Bush and Moon are collaborating on "SwiftVet" smear dirty tricks,
using Moon's Washington Times and UPI news operations to peddle felony
frauds.
SUN MYUNG MOON gave North Korea NUKE DELIVERY SYSTEMS.
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Nukes.html
Sun Myung Moon's Japanese Toen Trading company delivered 12 Russian
Golf missile submarines with launch tubes intact. The North Korean
communists studied this technology and adapted their missiles to be
sea launched from surface and submarine platforms. North Korea now has
nuclear weapon strike capability which can reach the continental
United States from sea-based mobile launch facilities at distances of
2,500 miles. This website has clickable links to Sun Myung Moon
subversion sources, documentation, proof.
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Nukes.html
LINKS -- NK sea-missile capability: http://www.navyseals.com
http://www.janes.com http://www.reuters.co.uk http://news.bbc.co.uk
http://www.washingtontimes.com http://www.newscientist.com
http://www.townhall.com http://www.freerepublic.com
http://www.libertyforum.org http://www.theage.com.au
http://www.iht.com http://www.latimes.com
LINKS -- North Korean-born Sun Myung Moon's Toen Trading Submarine
Subversion: http://www.freerepublic.com http://www.usasurvival.org
http://www.gorenfeld.net http://www.davidicke.net
http://blog.mmadsen.org http://www.kenlayne.com
http://www.pandagon.net http://jameswagner.com
http://functionalambivalent.typepad.com http://www.la-mancha.net
http://windsofchange.net http://thoughtcrimes.org http://www.vuw.ac.nz
Sun Myung Moon owns the Washington Times newspaper, and he owns the
UPI (United Press International) wireservice. He controls the main
Washington DC conservative propaganda mill. The Washington Times has
been subsidized by over a billion dollars of moonie slave labor. Every
time that a republican politician quotes the Washington Times, or
writes an article or op-ed in it, Sun Myung Moon is made larger in his
brainwashed follower's eyes. Conservatives are so desperate for
propaganda for their agenda that they willingly aid and abet Sun Myung
Moon's organized crime activities in exchange for the help his
organized crime front operations deliver to them.
Sun Myung Moon has paid ex-presidents, such as George Herbert Walker
Bush up to $10,000,000 for photo-op and endorsements, because his
virtually captive followers have very restricted access to news. They
are told that everybody Moon shakes hands with has accepted Moon as
their lord and savior. This global slave labor force replenishes a $10
million expense for faked stage setting photo-op in a couple of days.
LINKS about Moonies, Bush, Washinton Times connections:
The Moonies: Everything you wanted to know about Sun Myung Moon and
the Unification Church
Moonie and Related Links
* The Right Wing Media Conspiracy - How the Moonies and right wing
groups control the media
* Moonies and the Washington Times - The mouthpiece of Sun Myung
Moon
* Is George Bush a Moonie? - Bush takes $100,000 to endorse the
Moonies
* Inside Look at the Moonies - Great article I snagged
* Moonie Front Organizations - 1000 organization that are Moonie
fronts
* Consortium News - Very good articles about Moonies and other
right wingers
* Bush and Moon - US CIA and Korean CIA?? GHW Bush Praises Sun
Myung Moon as 'Man of Vision'
* Sun Myung Moon - "the Savior, Messiah and King of Kings of all
of humanity"
* The Bush-Kim-Moon Triangle of Money - the political largesse of
Sun Myung Moon.
Sun Myung Moon crowned as Second Coming in DC
The news of a very strange event that occurred at the end of March,
but was quietly swept under the carpet by the mainstream media, is
just now beginning to leak out. Expect to hear more about it in the
coming days. Here's a preview on what surely must be one of the most
bizarre happenings in the long history of Congressional oddities...
It occurred on March 23, 2004 when Reverend Sun Myung Moon, cultist
leader of the Unification Church (currently known as The Family
Federation for World Peace and Unification), was crowned "King of
Peace" in a coronation ceremony. In his coronation speech, Moon told
the audience that it was now time to officially recognize him as the
returned Messiah.
LINKS:
Moon Crowned in the Capital, [Unification Church] Sun Myung Moon
Crowned 'King Of America' At U.S. Senate Building, Hail to the Moon
king, Moon Over Washington, Sun Myung Moon Crowned Messiah By
Congressmen, Sun Myung Moon crowned as Messiah by U.S. Senate! Moonie
leader 'crowned' in Senate, Sun Myung Moon Crowned Messiah! U.S.
Lawmakers Crown rev. Sun Myung Moon Messiah! Here's a guy the
Republicans don't want us to know about. (Actually, it was a democrat
conservative, to the great relief of republican conservatives, who
placed the crown on Moon, in this hoax ceremony. In Moon's world he
replaces all governments with his Taliban, so Republicans and
Democrats all will be liquidated.
The quaint mass marriage ceremonies of the Moonies has another
significance: these represent thousands upon thousand upon thousands
of members of an organized crime empire, as dedicated as body-bomb
suicide muslims, to the eccentric whims of this visibly insane man.
Moonies surreptitiously swell rallies for rightwing causes, clog the
internet forums with their unshakable propaganda-mongering which
cannot be reasoned with, vote as a block and move across state lines
to do it. They even move across international boundaries to meddle in
politics.
Moonies also collaborate with other organized crime rings for mutal
profit.
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Koctopus_01.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Killer_David_Koch.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/CSE_Organized_Crime.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Corrupt_CFACT.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Seitz_Tobacco_Crimes.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Singer-Nightline.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Singer-1993-1994.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Singer-Seitz.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Stohrer-Singer.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Hazeltine-Singer.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Heidelberg-Appeal.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Corrupt_Sallie_Baliunas.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Walter_Williams_AdTI.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Corrupt_Richard_S_Lindzen.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/ADTI_Frauds_01.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/AdTI_Villians.htm
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Pelosi.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Becky_Norton_Dunlop_AdTI.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Confronting_AdTI.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Chrispeels.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Corrupt_Idsos.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Corrupt_Fred_Michel.html
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| User: "Michael Marxist Moore" |
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| Title: Black & right: Black Americans almost uniformly opposed to homosexual marriage |
25 Aug 2004 03:07:11 AM |
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Black & right: Black Americans almost uniformly opposed to homosexual
marriage
http://www.worldmag.com/newsite/content/subscriber/displayarticle.cfm?id=9425
THE METHODISTS FOUGHT, THE PRESBYTERIANS (USA) dithered, and the
Episcopalians gave in as their national conventions struggled over
what to do about homosexuality. But the African Methodist Episcopal
Church (AME), the largest black church in the country with 2.5 million
members, voted in its national convention unanimously not to allow
pastors to perform same-sex marriages.
Black Americans tend to be liberal politically. They are the most
reliable components of the Democratic Party's base, with the possible
exception of gays, whose causes Democrats and liberals are
championing. And yet, black Americans are among the demographic groups
most opposed to gay marriage.
This frustrates gay activists and their allies. African-Americans have
experienced terrible discrimination. Why aren't they more sympathetic
with the discrimination that gays experience? There used to be laws
against blacks marrying whites. Just as those racist laws needed to be
repealed, surely the laws against men marrying men also need to be
repealed. Blacks and gays should be natural allies, liberals are
saying.
Of course, some black leaders -- like former presidential candidate
and ordained minister Al Sharpton -- follow the party line of the
liberal establishment. But across the country, black pastors have been
staging rallies against gay marriage. African-Americans bitterly
resent the attempt by homosexual activists to appropriate the
civil-rights movement for their cause. Even the extremely liberal
Congressional Black Caucus has denounced comparisons of the
gay-marriage movement to the civil-rights struggles of the 1960s.
"Why are blacks, who know so well the reality of discrimination, so
uniformly unsympathetic to the case that the gay community is making?"
That question is raised by Star Parker, a black evangelical, in a
column for Scripps Howard News Service. She says that the main reason
is that the civil-rights movement depended on objective moral truth.
Homosexual marriage, on the contrary, depends on a rejection of
objective moral truth.
"It is not just that they know when their movement is being hijacked,"
she quotes Wilfred McClay, history professor at the University of
Tennessee, as saying. "It is that the religious sensibility that
animated the civil-rights movement, and that is still very much alive
in the American black community today, is bound up in a biblical
worldview that would no more countenance the radical redefinition of
marriage than it would the re-imposition of slavery."
"Blacks know instinctively that the debate on gay marriage is the
symptom and not the problem," says Ms. Parker. "They know that the
root problem is the implicit de-legitimization and marginalization in
the United States today of traditional standards of right and wrong."
She argues that it was just such a marginalization of right and wrong
that allowed slavery. "Without an anchor in ultimate standards, blacks
know that the best politics and law, even in as great a country as
ours, can lead anywhere."
Concepts such as justice, freedom, and human rights depend on a
worldview that recognizes transcendent, objective, moral truths. If
morality is just something that we can construct and reconstruct
according to our own preferences, as postmodernists believe, then
justice, freedom, and human rights will be in jeopardy. To reject
universal teachings about sexual morality and to presume to redefine
marriage to include homosexual relationships may seem kind and
tolerant. But that comes with a horrible price, the repudiation of the
very moral framework that makes kindness and tolerance possible.
One might say that black Americans are suffering the consequences of
the sexual revolution. The whole culture has drifted away from sexual
morality, and African-Americans have been paying the highest price, in
the troubled children, the crime, and the poverty that accompany
communities that do without marriage. But whites as well as blacks are
affected by the moral breakdown. Among white women, Ms. Parker points
out, the incidence of out-of-wedlock births is 25 percent -- what it
was for black women 40 years ago.
The civil-rights movement of the 1960s was moral. The gay-rights
movement is not. It is that simple. Perhaps African-Americans and
their churches could start exerting the moral leadership that our
whole country desperately needs.
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Liberals Hate America!
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| User: "z" |
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| Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records |
22 Aug 2004 10:23:51 PM |
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(Al) wrote in message news:<3965eb5d.0408221458.1c4f2474@posting.google.com>...
Didn't it ever strike you odd that of all who served in Vietnam,
Kerry in only 4 months.....
Liar. He served TWO tours.
This is true. He was on the USS Gridley which never saw any enemy action.
Granted, he's no George Bush, keeping the Cong out of Texas. And maybe
Alabama. Probably not, but maybe.
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| User: "jenn" |
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| Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records |
22 Aug 2004 06:22:53 PM |
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Al wrote:
lparker@NOSPAMemory.edu (Lloyd Parker) wrote in message news:<cg7m38$n1l$11@puck.cc.emory.edu>...
In article <2bGVc.9254$Bt5.7155@twister.socal.rr.com>,
"Jim" <KerrycallsVeteransMurderers@socialist.com> wrote:
"Martin W. Smith" <no.email@this.time> wrote in message
news:724bi09eeihhucchq96gsj7b89rh7ef350@4ax.com...
caddyshack_al@my-deja.com (Al) wrote:
Martin W. Smith <no.email@this.time> wrote in message
news:<kc69i0ttqg4522lf43u0i7em2puem9efo7@4ax.com>...
saguaro@surfbest.net (Dave Cook) wrote:
These "newly obtained records" were "found" by someone after almost 40
years, and probably can be traced back to Kerry"s efforts to get a
bronze medal.
If you had ever been *in* the military
What military were you in?
The US. The one you weren't in.
you would know that one doesn't
make "efforts" to get a medal. Someone nominates you for a medal,
normally your commander.
Martin I am in the military and judging from the statements
from the late Admiral Zumwalt and now over 254 of Kerry's
brothers in arms. Kerry was making "efforts" to get medals.
www.factcheck.org
Didn't it ever strike you odd that of all who served in Vietnam,
Kerry in only 4 months.....
Liar. He served TWO tours.
This is true. He was on the USS Gridley which never saw any enemy action.
and thus VOLUNTEERED though he nee | | | | | | | | |
