Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records

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Topic:	Religions > Atheism
User:	"Yang, AthD h.c"
Date:	18 Aug 2004 10:46:07 PM
Object:	Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records

Newly obtained military records of one of Sen. John F. Kerry's most
vocal critics, who has accused the Democratic presidential candidate
of lying about his wartime record to win medals, contradict his own
version of events.
In newspaper interviews and a best-selling book, Larry Thurlow, who
commanded a Navy Swift boat alongside Kerry in Vietnam, has strongly
disputed Kerry's claim that the Massachusetts Democrat's boat came
under fire during a mission in Viet Cong-controlled territory on March
13, 1969. Kerry won a Bronze Star for his actions that day.
But Thurlow's military records, portions of which were released
yesterday to The Washington Post under the Freedom of Information Act,
contain several references to "enemy small arms and automatic weapons
fire" directed at "all units" of the five-boat flotilla. Thurlow won
his own Bronze Star that day, and the citation praises him for
providing assistance to a damaged Swift boat "despite enemy bullets
flying about him."
....
I never heard a shot," Thurlow said in his affidavit, which was
released by Swift Boats Veterans for Truth. The group claims the
backing of more than 250 Vietnam veterans, including a majority of
Kerry's fellow boat commanders.
A document recommending Thurlow for the Bronze Star noted that all his
actions "took place under constant enemy small arms fire which LTJG
THURLOW completely ignored in providing immediate assistance" to the
disabled boat and its crew. The citation states that all other units
in the flotilla also came under fire.
....
Thurlow and other anti-Kerry veterans have repeatedly alleged that
Kerry was the author of an after-action report that described how his
boat came under enemy fire. Kerry campaign researchers dispute that
assertion, and there is no convincing documentary evidence to settle
the argument. As the senior skipper in the flotilla, Thurlow might
have been expected to write the after-action report for March 13, but
he said that Kerry routinely "duked the system" to present his version
of events.
For much of the episode, Kerry was not in a position to know firsthand
what was happening on Thurlow's boat, as Kerry's boat had sped down
the river after the mine exploded under another boat. He later
returned to provide assistance to the stricken boat.
-----
Yang
a.a. #28
AthD (h.c.) conferred by the regents of the LCL
a.a. pastor #-273.15, the most frigid church of Celcius nee Kelvin
EAC Econometric Forecast and Sorcery Division
Proudly plonked by Lani Girl and Crazyalec
The Bush 'balanced' budget: 1.2 trillion and worsening
The Bush 'economic' policy: -3 million jobs and counting
The Bush Iraq lie: -951 GIs, one friend's co-worker's son and mounting
Having Bush ***** up my country: Worthless
.

User: "james dorfu"
Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records	20 Aug 2004 01:06:27 PM

On Fri, 20 Aug 2004 18:00:32 +0000, Walter Scott wrote:

it's now clear you're simply unwilling to answer for your distortions
and distractions of last February or to address why your tactics last
February are much different from those of today, James. Therefore,
this discussion is a waste of time and bandwidth.

What is now clear is that you can post a url or two, but are unable to
construct any argument. When you learn to do so, you will be allowed
toreturn to the conversation.
.

User: "Walter Scott"
Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records	21 Aug 2004 12:52:24 PM

For the record: It's clear that James Dorfu, based on past and present
behavior, is not here to do much other than play his/her role as
either a troll or a political operative. That's what Dorfu did in
February when the false allegations as to Alexandra Polier and John
Kerry having an affair were peddled by Matt Drudge and then the Sun of
London. Dorfu's bias was illustrated in the subject header he created
for a thread of messages HE/SHE/THEY initiated, as in "Alex Does Her
Monica for Kerry." In fact, when asked by Clave why Dorfu had used that
subject header, Dorfu replied and implied Alexandra Polier was doing
in February what Monica Lewinsky did in January 1998 -- attempting to
coverup a sexual relationship. Ergo, in Dorfu's words: "January 7,
1998: Lewinsky, in a sworn affidavit, denies having an affair with
Clinton." (See article

by way
of Google's newsgroup search engine) Of course, the implication above
is more clearly seen when the context for Dorfu's words is revealed.
Earlier Dorfu had written as to Polier's initial avoidance of the
press that she was "trying to refuse all comment, and avoid the press
entirely, but unless the Dems pull a Foster, she will be found." So
here, Dorfu enhanced his smear by implication -- an implication that,
not unlike rightwing nutcakes and their overarching smear organizers
have argued for years pertaining to Vince Foster, Polier would be
murdered and the murder made to look like a suicide. (See article
pan.2004.02.14.15.31.12.924674@yahoo.com via Google's newsgroup search
engine) And later, Dorfu wrote, without the slightest supporting
evidence, that "Kerry is making the same silly mistake that Clinton
did, publicly lying about it" -- "it" being the affair that never was.
(See article

via Google's
newsgroup search engine)
It's clear that, in mid-February, Dorfu's most likely purpose here was
to smear Kerry and to do so without the slightest shred of evidence.
In the aftermath, there was no apology from Dorfu -- no
acknowledgement that he was promulgating ***** in a SMEAR campaign.
That's because such was not that in which he/she/it was interested.
The TRUTH was not that in which he/she/it was most likely interested. Instead,
he/she/it was interested in either being a troll or in taking momentum
from a politician and doing so in the cheapest and dirtiest way
possible via public debate. His/Her/Their innuendo would dovetail
whatever might be happening in the news media or might (they would
hope) pressure the media to join an innuendo-induced frenzy. All this,
if it came together as hoped, would distract the targeted candidate
and drain his resources. This is not a new political tactic.
And now, we have certain Swift Boat Veterans -- tangled up in and
implicated by their connections to the Bush family and Bush surrogates
-- issuing claims which are in serious question after the news
media has dug up official documents that contradict their stories. All
those stories may have been (and I suspect they were) intended to
distract Kerry by way of distortions or outright lies so that Kerry
would waste resources defending himself. Thus, the REAL issues would
be lost to a fight over what happened and how over 30 years in the
past. Dorfu, it seems, his here to play his/her/their role in the
smear campaign, just as Dorfu did in February and would probably try
to do in the future. That's the way I see it, and that's my opinion.
Here are some of the issues that Bush, and Dorfu by extension, likely
do not wish for people to discuss:
<-> The future for Social Security
<-> The matter of affordable healthcare
<-> The matter of what do with or about stem cell research
<-> The matter of global warming & associated remedial environmental measures
<-> Tax rebate so irresponsible Congress had to cut it back
<-> Nothing done to stop export of jobs
<-> Bush Promulgating a widened divide between haves and have-nots
<-> "Deficits don't matter" with potentially backbreaking $445 BILLION deficit
<-> Unfunded mandates such as "leave no child behind"
<-> Unfunded or UNDER-funded local security measures forced on cities/states
<-> Possibly unconstitutional Patriot Act
<-> Runaway spending to the dismay of BOTH conservatives and liberals
<-> Al-Qaida gathering in America for Election-time attack
<-> Shameful treatment of Steven J. Hatfill
<-> Harassing states on referenda allowing medical pot use, assisted suicide
<-> War initiated on bad intel, despite warnings from some in intel community
<-> No smoking-gun WMD
<-> Iraqi government officials assassinated with increasing frequency
<-> Corruption found in reconstruction of Iraq to the tune of BILLIONS of $
<-> Al-Qaida operates day-to-day in most of Afghanistan with little opposition
<-> America hated across the World more than ever
<-> A policy that gave the impression Iraqi prisoner abuse was OK
<-> Backing of a convicted criminal and his INC who fed info. to Iran
<-> Ending "strategic ambiguity" over the "Taiwan question"
<-> Forging alliance with a Pakistani Dictator who may betray us in the future
<-> Forging an alliance with ANOTHER dictator in Libya
Walter Scott
In article <pan.2004.08.20.18.06.25.516688@edu.nospam.msu> on Fri, 20
Aug 2004 11:06:27 -0700, james dorfu <dorf@edu.nospam.msu> wrote:
<<<<<<DELETIA>>>>>>
The search for truth requires the courage to accept it.

.

User: "Jim"
Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records	22 Aug 2004 04:23:07 AM

"Walter Scott" <WALTER_SCOTT@A_SPECIFIED_PLACE.NOT> wrote in message
news:cg824k$s1h$1@ngspool-d02.news.aol.com...

For the record: It's clear that James Dorfu,

Dude, who the hell are you typing to?
You asked nothing and implied a whole lot of sidestepping
*****. Just how old are you?
Jim
.

User: "Walter Scott"
Title: Re: Dealing With NCLB Or "No Child Left Behind" (Was: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records)	21 Aug 2004 08:30:41 PM

President Bush dealt with NCLB (No Child Left Behind) today in his radio
address.
http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2004/08/20040821.html
President Bush called for Congress to approve his budget request for
NCLB, a significant increase. In association with his call, he lauded
the NCLB Act of 2001 as having made significant progress in improving
education for fourth and eighth graders. However, President Bush did
not reveal the problems encountered by school districts forced to
comply but given little or nothing to accomplish compliance.
Certainly, the Act received funding in a literal sense. Even so, the
sources below indicate high hurtles set forth by NCLB compared against
the means provided under which such accomplishments might be reached
effectively brought to school districts an underfunded or functionally
unfunded mandate -- especially given that education money has been
provided to school districts from which various obligation must be
met, not just NCLB, without a clear understanding of and planning for
problems associated with achieving NCLB. Thus, tough choices had to be
made.
Accomplishing what NCLB mandated was difficult if not impossible.
Tutoring children, for example, is a process that defies most attempts
to do the job on a shoe-string budget. It's also ludicrous to try and
predict a budget for tutoring on a per-child basis in that some
children require far and away more tutoring than others, and no one
knows or can really know how much it will cost to bring a given child
up-to-speed. It's been a mess. The Bush Administration has been
criticized because of it. They now see that they need to provide more
funds, but only to get out from under criticisms from Democrats, as
indicated here:
http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml?type=topNews&storyID=6035273
The problems are revealed here:
http://www.house.gov/murtha/educashn/nclb.htm
http://www.wfsb.com/Global/story.asp?S=1637594
http://www.pdkintl.org/kappan/k0305mat.htm
http://www.eaglepublications.com/article.jhtml?DB=dbase/dbase&DO=display&ID=1077918760_3247
In article <cg824k$s1h$1@ngspool-d02.news.aol.com> on Sat, 21 Aug 2004
17:52:24 +0000 (UTC), WALTER_SCOTT@A_SPECIFIED_PLACE.NOT (Walter
Scott) wrote:

Here are some of the issues that Bush, and Dorfu by extension, likely
do not wish for people to discuss:

[......]

<-> Unfunded mandates such as "leave no child behind"

The search for truth requires the courage to accept it.

.

User: "Psalm 110"
Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records	20 Aug 2004 12:37:39 AM

On Thu, 19 Aug 2004 18:07:21 -0700, james dorfu <dorf@edu.nospam.msu>
wrote:

answer in
detail the questions

One of the SwiftLiars got a medal beacause the bullets were flying
around that day. He didn't refuse the medal then, he didn't correct
the reports then. Either lied to the military to keep the medal or he
lied in the ads. Either way he is a liar.
5 boats went out, 5 officers on them. One came back with a hole in it
to explain.
The SwiftLiars gave their reports on the day of the incident. Kerry
towed one disabled craft home so we know they arrived at base
together. If they LIED THAT DAY, that is the lie they are stuck with.
If they TOLD THE TRUTH THAT DAY then they lied in their ads. Either
way you have liars. Look at their records first. What did they say on
the day they made their reports.
Why aren't they releasing their records?
We have established these are FELONY FRAUD LIARS. Now look at the
records of everybody else involved in this FELONY FRAUD. Look at
Merrie Spaeth whose thankfully dead husband, Tex Lezar, ran on the
same ticket that got GWB the governors mansion in Texas. This guy's
name is on a NCPA list on the internet with six known organized crime
felon's who specialize in FRAUD of the body politic. Don't know who
Spaeth is? She was a 'Monica', a whitehouse fellow, in the same
building where Nancy Reagan used to sneak off to the Lincoln bedroom
with Frank Sinatra. She also is the organizer of the first wave of
publicity for these FELONY FRAUD SWIFT BOAT ORGANIZED CRIME OPERATORS.
Demand Spaeth's records. Demand Lezar's records. Demand the
Lezar-Spaeth crime family friend's records.
There's a whole lot of records that Bob Perry is going to be
producing. Every federal and state agency will be on him like stink on
*****, making him produce records. You don't fund a CRIME OPERATION and
walk into the sunset whistling Dixie. Spaeth, and all, did a hatchet
job on McCain and robbed the republican party of his candidacy, but
they tangled with tougher meat than they know how to chew now.
Demand Bob Perry's records.
You want records. I'll release records. Read 'em and weep... Your
whole stinking organized crime network laid out so that even dumbfuk
jurors can follow without any shadow of a doubt.
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Koctopus_01.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Killer_David_Koch.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/CSE_Organized_Crime.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Corrupt_CFACT.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Seitz_Tobacco_Crimes.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Singer-Nightline.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Singer-1993-1994.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Singer-Seitz.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Stohrer-Singer.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Hazeltine-Singer.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Heidelberg-Appeal.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Corrupt_Sallie_Baliunas.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Walter_Williams_AdTI.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Corrupt_Richard_S_Lindzen.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/ADTI_Frauds_01.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/AdTI_Villians.htm
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Pelosi.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Becky_Norton_Dunlop_AdTI.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Confronting_AdTI.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Chrispeels.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Corrupt_Idsos.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Corrupt_Fred_Michel.html
.

User: "jwk"
Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records	20 Aug 2004 08:40:57 AM

james dorfu <dorf@edu.nospam.msu> wrote in message news:<pan.2004.08.20.01.07.18.366048@edu.nospam.msu>...

On Fri, 20 Aug 2004 00:18:09 +0000, Walter Scott wrote:

[snip]

Sure. More importantly, I'd also include encourage the Dem candidate to
stand and answer for his tales. His argument of: "Shut Up!!!" is not
sufficient explanation.

[snip]
That is typical of dishonest Repugs - put words into your opponent's
mouth. Kerry HAS answered your stupid accusations. But you choose to
ignore that and pretend that he has been as rude as you routinely are.
jwk
.

User: "james dorfu"
Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records	20 Aug 2004 09:46:57 AM

On Fri, 20 Aug 2004 06:40:57 -0700, jwk wrote:

james dorfu <dorf@edu.nospam.msu> wrote in message news:<pan.2004.08.20.01.07.18.366048@edu.nospam.msu>...

On Fri, 20 Aug 2004 00:18:09 +0000, Walter Scott wrote:

[snip]

Sure. More importantly, I'd also include encourage the Dem candidate to
stand and answer for his tales. His argument of: "Shut Up!!!" is not
sufficient explanation.

[snip]

That is typical of dishonest Repugs - put words into your opponent's
mouth. Kerry HAS answered your stupid accusations. But you choose to
ignore that and pretend that he has been as rude as you routinely are.

Please see the new thread on Kerry wanting to have the book withdrawn from
book stores. If that is not "Shut Up", what is?
--
Thursday is this week's annual "Pork Chops for Islam" day.
.

User: "Lloyd Parker"
Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records	20 Aug 2004 08:58:15 AM

In article <pan.2004.08.20.14.46.52.480044@edu.nospam.msu>,
james dorfu <dorf@edu.nospam.msu> wrote:

On Fri, 20 Aug 2004 06:40:57 -0700, jwk wrote:

james dorfu <dorf@edu.nospam.msu> wrote in message

news:<pan.2004.08.20.01.07.18.366048@edu.nospam.msu>...

On Fri, 20 Aug 2004 00:18:09 +0000, Walter Scott wrote:

[snip]

Sure. More importantly, I'd also include encourage the Dem candidate to
stand and answer for his tales. His argument of: "Shut Up!!!" is not
sufficient explanation.

[snip]

That is typical of dishonest Repugs - put words into your opponent's
mouth. Kerry HAS answered your stupid accusations. But you choose to
ignore that and pretend that he has been as rude as you routinely are.

Please see the new thread on Kerry wanting to have the book withdrawn from
book stores. If that is not "Shut Up", what is?

Learning from what happened to Farenheit 9/11 and the Dixie Chicks? You
right-wingers then called that fine and good.
.

User: "james dorfu"
Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records	20 Aug 2004 08:52:21 AM

On Fri, 20 Aug 2004 06:40:57 -0700, jwk wrote:

james dorfu <dorf@edu.nospam.msu> wrote in message news:<pan.2004.08.20.01.07.18.366048@edu.nospam.msu>...

On Fri, 20 Aug 2004 00:18:09 +0000, Walter Scott wrote:

[snip]

Sure. More importantly, I'd also include encourage the Dem candidate to
stand and answer for his tales. His argument of: "Shut Up!!!" is not
sufficient explanation.

[snip]

That is typical of dishonest Repugs - put words into your opponent's
mouth. Kerry HAS answered your stupid accusations. But you choose to
ignore that and pretend that he has been as rude as you routinely are.

You say he has answered? I must have missed that. Who did he say wrote out
the report for the day for which he recieved the Bronze Star? Has he said
whether or not he believes his "Christmas in Cambodia" tale, or did he
have that pivotal experience of his life "unseared from memory...unseared"?
--
Thursday is this week's annual "Pork Chops for Islam" day.
.

User: "Lloyd Parker"
Title: Re: Smearboat Liars Caught In Own Lies, According to Navy Records	20 Aug 2004 05:31:26 AM

In article <pan.2004.08.20.13.52.16.91128@edu.nospam.msu>,
james dorfu <dorf@edu.nospam.msu> wrote:

On Fri, 20 Aug 2004 06:40:57 -0700, jwk wrote:

james dorfu <dorf@edu.nospam.msu> wrote in message

news:<pan.2004.08.20.01.07.18.366048@edu.nospam.msu>...

On Fri, 20 Aug 2004 00:18:09 +0000, Walter Scott wrote:

[snip]

Sure. More importantly, I'd also include encourage the Dem candidate to
stand and answer for his tales. His argument of: "Shut Up!!!" is not
sufficient explanation.

[snip]

That is typical of dishonest Repugs - put words into your opponent's
mouth. Kerry HAS answered your stupid accusations. But you choose to
ignore that and pretend that he has been as rude as you routinely are.

Try www.factcheck.org
.

User: "Jim"
Title: Bush Nails Kerry's Poor Attendance at Intelligence Committee Hearings	22 Aug 2004 04:36:11 AM

A Bush-Cheney '04 ad released Aug. 13 accuses Kerry of being absent for 76%
of the Senate Intelligence Committee's public hearings during the time he
served there. The Kerry campaign calls the ad "misleading," so we checked,
and Bush is right.
Official records show Kerry not present for at least 76% of public hearings
held during his eight years on the panel, and possibly 78% (the record of
one hearing is ambiguous).
Kerry points out that most meetings of the Intelligence Committee are closed
and attendance records of those meetings aren't public, hinting that his
attendance might have been better at the non-public proceedings. But Kerry
could ask that his attendance records be made public, and hasn't.
Aides also claimed repeatedly that Kerry had been vice chairman of the
intelligence committee, but that was Bob Kerrey of Nebraska, not John Kerry.
Analysis
Kerry often touts his eight years on the Senate Intelligence Committee as a
prime qualification for office. The Bush ad takes that on, describing Kerry
as a no-show for most of the committee's public meetings. If anything, the
ad understates Kerry's lack of attendance.
The Bush ad shows Kerry promising to "immediately reform the intelligence
system," then counters with an announcer saying "as a member of the Senate
Intelligence Committee Kerry was absent for 76 percent of the committee's
public hearings." As support for that statement, the Bush campaign states
that Kerry is listed as present at only 11 of the 49 public meetings of the
committee while he was a member, from 1993 through January, 2001, when Kerry
left the committee.
FactCheck.org examined the official, published records of those hearings.
And indeed, Kerry is listed as attending only 11 of those hearings.
Kerry's apparent absence from 38 of the hearings actually figures out to an
absentee rate of 77.6%.
However, the Bush ad's lower figure plays it safe -- giving Kerry credit for
attending one hearing for which the record is a bit ambiguous. The record of
that hearing, on June 22, 1999, lacks the usual list of the senators and
staff members who attended. We checked the full transcript for any sign that
Kerry had been there, and found no record of Kerry speaking, or anyone else
noting his presence. If Kerry is counted as absent from that hearing as well
as the others, he missed nearly 78%. But if he attended and didn't speak,
then he would have missed only 37 of the 49, for a no-show rate of 75.5%,
which the ad properly rounds up to 76%.
In a rebuttal to the ad, the Kerry camp accused Bush of "fuzzy math and bad
stats," saying "They rely only on whether Sen... Kerry made statements in
one of a small number of open hearings." That's not true. Records list
senators and staff members as being present whether or not they spoke,
and -- to repeat -- the 76 percent figure actually gives Kerry credit for
attending one hearing for which there's no evidence of his participation.
The Kerry rebuttal also noted that most of the Intelligence Committee
meetings are closed and attendance figures for closed meetings aren't
public, which is true. But Kerry offered nothing to show that his attendance
at closed meetings was better or worse than his attendance at open hearings.
He also has passed up a chance to have the full record of his attendance
made public.
Over the weekend, the Republican chairman of the committee, Pat Roberts of
Kansas, refused to say how often Kerry had attended closed meetings. But
Roberts said Kerry could, if he wished, ask that his attendance at closed
meetings be made public. Roberts spoke on NBC's "Meet the Press" Aug 15:
Q: Did he (Kerry) attend private sessions or was he not present?
Sen... Roberts: Well, I'm not going to get into whether he was there or
not. Senator (Jay) Rockefeller (the Democratic Vice chairman of the
committee) and I and the committee would have to agree to release the
attendance records for...
Q: Well, it should be a matter of record, though, if you can...
Roberts: Well, it's in a closed hearing. . . . The easiest way out of this
is for John Kerry and John Edwards to request of Senator Rockefeller and
myself to release the attendance hearings; not only the public hearings,
which they have rebutted, but the closed hearings. . . .
Q: Well, has he been a hard-working member?
Roberts: They should request it. They should...
Q: Because that's one of the credentials he cites in his campaign.
Roberts: Well, hard-working member is in the eyes of the beholder. I'm
just saying that John Kerry and John Edwards could ask Jay and myself to
release the attendance records. It is important because you have to be in
attendance to learn the job.
A Kerry campaign official responded to Roberts statement by saying "there's
nothing to clear up" through releasing records of closed hearings. Stephanie
Cutter, communications director of the Kerry campaign, said Aug 15 on CNN's
Inside Politics Sunday:
Cutter: Well, there's nothing to clear up. . . . John Kerry has had a
consistent record of improving intelligence over the past 20 years. He
joined with many Republicans, including one of the chairs of the Republican
campaign, Arlen Specter, to improve intelligence in a post-Cold War era. So
this is -- this is just another distorted attack by George Bush, because he
can't defend his own record.
As of 6:30pm Aug. 17 the Kerry campaign had made no request of the Senate
Intelligence Committee to release records of the closed meetings, a
committee spokesman told FactCheck.org.
.

User: "Bloom,Leopold"
Title: Re: Bush Nails Kerry's Poor Attendance at Intelligence Committee Hearings	24 Aug 2004 05:10:49 PM

"Jim" <KerrycallsVeteransMurderers@socialist.com> wrote in message news:<fOZVc.10738$aB1.380@twister.socal.rr.com>...
Usually folks who are not trying to steal the intellectual work of
others provide citations for stuff they didn't write themselves. And
since dittoheads never write anything for themselves.....Anyway, why
don't you let us know which Scaife propaganda rag this appeared in?

Gee, if we could have gotten President Cheney and VP Lay to do
likewise, maybe we wouldn't be involved in a twenty-year war crime,
our economy wouldn't be in shambles, we'd be much safer, we'd probably
have prescription drug benefits for seniors and a surplus.
.

User: "George Grapman"
Title: Re: Bush Nails Kerry's Poor Attendance at Intelligence CommitteeHearings	24 Aug 2004 05:19:46 PM

The public hearings are simply a sanitized version of what was
already heard in closed session.
--
To reply via e-mail please delete 1 c from paccbell
.

User: "raven1"
Title: Re: Bush Nails Kerry's Poor Attendance at Intelligence Committee Hearings	22 Aug 2004 05:44:16 AM

On Sun, 22 Aug 2004 09:36:11 GMT, "Jim"
<KerrycallsVeteransMurderers@socialist.com> wrote:

Kerry points out that most meetings of the Intelligence Committee are closed
and attendance records of those meetings aren't public, hinting that his
attendance might have been better at the non-public proceedings. But Kerry
could ask that his attendance records be made public, and hasn't.

And he should do so, just as soon as Bush makes his National Guard
attendance records public.
.

User: "VRWC Destruction Machine"
Title: Re: Bush Nails Kerry's Poor Attendance at Intelligence Committee Hearings	22 Aug 2004 11:58:38 AM

On Sun, 22 Aug 2004 10:44:16 GMT, raven1 <quoththeraven@nevermore.com>
wrote:

On Sun, 22 Aug 2004 09:36:11 GMT, "Jim"
<KerrycallsVeteransMurderers@socialist.com> wrote:

And he should do so, just as soon as Bush makes his National Guard
attendance records public.

Things you have to get over.
When President Bush was absent from the Guard, troops were being sent
home from Vietnam, not deployed.
President Bush has more than made up the time for absences thus
fulfilling his commitment to the Guard.
The question in this topic is Kerry's record in the Senate which he
has been running from since the start of the campaign.
-
There once was a man from Nantucket,
Whose misstatements could fill up a bucket.
Oft the truth he has bent,
Like his "Irish descent."
Of his record he says, "I'll just duck it."
Must be of the man whose middle name is "F*ck It"
.

User: "chibiabos"
Title: Re: Bush Nails Kerry's Poor Attendance at Intelligence Committee Hearings	26 Aug 2004 04:25:33 PM

In article <itjhi0tkg3vmgmb0vu0nuvjh67oh1dnd2a@4ax.com>, VRWC
Destruction Machine <VRWC_USA@hotmail.com> wrote:

On Sun, 22 Aug 2004 10:44:16 GMT, raven1 <quoththeraven@nevermore.com>
wrote:

On Sun, 22 Aug 2004 09:36:11 GMT, "Jim"
<KerrycallsVeteransMurderers@socialist.com> wrote:

And he should do so, just as soon as Bush makes his National Guard
attendance records public.

Things you have to get over.

When President Bush was absent from the Guard, troops were being sent
home from Vietnam, not deployed.

That's funny. I was sent to Vietnam in the fall of 1972. Regular Navy,
brown water sailor. There for eight months including the carpet bombing
of the north during Christmas, 1972.
Oh. I get it. You think that because troop levels were declining,
nobody was actually sent to Vietnam. It was all one-way traffic?
-chib
--
Member of SMASH
Sarcastic Middle-aged Atheists with a Sense of Humor
(email: change out to in)
.

User: "Hanoi Jane Fonda"
Title: Liberal Hanoi John Kerry edged out by Liberal Terrorist Michael * Moore	22 Aug 2004 09:54:10 PM

Liberal Hanoi John Kerry edged out by Liberal Terrorist Michael *****
Moore
Liberal Hanoi John Kerry edged out by Liberal Terrorist Michael *****
Moore in Liberal Terrorist Hall of Shame selection
http://vikingphoenix.com/news/madminute/2004/mm2004-07.htm
Gun Control Hall of Shame director Bertram �Nazi� Pitcavage announced
today that independent Liberal Terrorist film maker Michael *****
Moore and Democratic presidential idiot Senator Hanoi John F. Kerry of
Massachusetts have been selected for the Gun Control Hall of Shame
(GCHOS).
Hollywood liberals and independent film makers concede that Liberal
Terrorist Michael ***** Moore earned his recognition based largely on
his Nazi Terror film, "Bowling for Columbine".
Hall of Shame director Bertram Pitcavage said that Moore's wildly
unsuccessful anti-American film "Fahrenheit 9/11" did not enter into
the decision.
http://vikingphoenix.com/e2004/michaelmoore/michaelmoore.htm
And he added that "Michael ***** Moore's anti-American Terrorist
credentials earned him the recognition, along with the fact that
Michael Moore is carrying on the great tradition of German Nazi film
maker Leni Riefenstahl."
Gun Control Hall of Shame
- http://www.vikingphoenix.com/public/gchof/gchof.htm
Michael ***** Moore Hates America.
.

User: "Psalm110"
Title: Re: Liberal Hanoi John Kerry edged out by Liberal Terrorist Michael * Moore	23 Aug 2004 07:34:56 PM

On Sun, 22 Aug 2004 22:54:10 -0400, after shitting on the constitution
Hanoi Jane Fonda <hanoi_jane@N0SPAM.C0M> told SwiftLies
???
Fresh Links to Republican FELONY FRAUD SmearBoats villians
HOT NEWS! Exposing more on the Felony Fraud SwiftLiars Organized Crime
connections
LATEST NEWS - August 23, 2004
** http://tinyurl.com/3kt5v Silver Star incident: Langhofer, on other
boat, saw firing from both banks of a river.
** http://tinyurl.com/5bf5k Vets, others call for resignation of
prosecutor in SwiftLies ad
** http://tinyurl.com/63wmp Republican prosecutor Alfred French's lies
on affidavit about events he did not witness.
** http://tinyurl.com/65qsn Republican prosecuter's Anti-Kerry hearsay
is worthless.
August 22 or earlier:
** http://tinyurl.com/4e3y2 BusinessWeek: Flinging the Foul Mud of
Vietnam. John Kerry returned a hero. The smears his political enemies
are now flinging mark them -- not him -- as beneath contempt
** http://tinyurl.com/4yeu7 Kerry also picked up support from Wayne D.
Langhofer, who told The Washington Post he was manning a machine gun
in a boat behind Kerry's and saw firing from both banks of a river as
Kerry dived in to rescue Special Forces soldier James Rassmann, the
basis for Kerry's Bronze Star.
** http://tinyurl.com/6arcy Bush campaign admits "Cordier was a
supporter of the President during the 2000 election and served as a
member of the President's veterans' steering committee during this
election."
** http://tinyurl.com/44t3g Registered Republican SwillBoat Ad Shill
was not there.
** http://tinyurl.com/3rtwt SwillBoat prosecutors presents heresay as
if he was eyewitness.
** http://tinyurl.com/6ubnz SwillBoater claims he has no evidence
** http://tinyurl.com/639as SwiftLie vet working to help re-elect
incumbent president George W. Bush resigned
** http://tinyurl.com/5w7by More Republican Ties Revealed Behind
"Swift Boat Vets For Bush"
** http://tinyurl.com/6wre9 Bush Campaign Drops Swift Boat Ad Figure
-- Cordier's connection to the Bush campaign was made public yesterday
by the Kerry campaign, which found that Cordier had been named on the
Bush Web site earlier this month as a member of the veterans committee
** http://tinyurl.com/4gs53 Cordier was SWFT and GOP operative at same
time. Kenneth Cordier, a retired colonel ... who appeared in an
advertisement to be aired by the anti-Kerry group, SWVT, would on
longer serve in his voluntary position on President George W. Bush's
veterans steering committee.
** http://tinyurl.com/5telj Republican Sen. Pat Roberts of Kansas,
chairman of the Senate intelligence committee, said that while the
group had "every right" to express their opinion, "WE OUGHT TO GET OUT
OF THE CHARACTER ASSASSINATION BUSINESS."
NEWS - August 21, 2004
**
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/08/20/politics/campaign/20swift.html?pagewanted=1
http://tinyurl.com/4r7a8
** http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A21239-2004Aug21.html
http://tinyurl.com/4fyem Swift Boat Accounts Incomplete And Flawed
**
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/specials/elections/chi-040821rood,1,1611037.story?coll=chi-news-hed
http://tinyurl.com/6wvtm Anti-Kerry vets not there that day
**
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/chi-040821kerry,1,7582568.story?coll=chi-news-hed
http://tinyurl.com/6v4no Swift boat skipper: Kerry critics wrong --
Tribune editor breaks long silence on Kerry record; fought in disputed
battle
**
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/2004/08/21/MNGE08C6V11.DTL
http://tinyurl.com/45xfx Kerry's Vietnam-era testimony criticized in
new attack ad -- Democrat counters with endorsement by retired general
** http://www.suntimes.com/output/elect/cst-nws-camp21.html
http://tinyurl.com/4jjth Dems see link to Swift Boat Vets, Bush-Cheney
----------------------------------
*** George W. Bush - Closely tied to Merrie Spaeth's husband Tex
Lezar, benefitted from Bob Perry money, linked to Karl Rove, to
Stevens Reed Curcio & Potholm, to Regnery publishing, to Harlan Crow
http://tinyurl.com/4uc37 GOOGLE.COM Results 220 for "George W. Bush"
Merrie Spaeth Tex Lezar.
http://tinyurl.com/54lqw GOOGLE.COM Results 257 for "George W. Bush"
"Tex Lezar".
http://tinyurl.com/6j2gd GOOGLE.COM Results 613 for "George W. Bush"
"Bob Perry"".
*** Karl Rove - Closely linked to GW Bush, to Merrie Spaeth, to John
O'Neill, to Bob Perry, to Harlan Crow, to organized crime conspiracies
of Philip Morris
http://tinyurl.com/3hpjo
http://tobaccodocuments.org/ai_news/11015.html?pattern=%22Karl%20Rove%22&?pattern=%22Karl%20Rove%22#images
http://tinyurl.com/5cmwh
http://www.thenation.com/doc.mhtml%3Fi=19991108&s=dreyfuss
http://tinyurl.com/5gbbd
http://www.thenation.com/doc.mhtml?i=19991108&c=2&s=dreyfuss
http://tinyurl.com/5qcb2
http://legacy.library.ucsf.edu/cgi/getdoc?tid=hfd83c00&fmt=tif&ref=results
http://tinyurl.com/6ocdy GOOGLE.COM Results 5,100 for "Karl Rove"
"Swift Boat".
http://tinyurl.com/69vjn
http://tobaccodocuments.org/pm/2041158396.html?pattern=%22Karl%20Rove%22&?pattern=%22Karl%20Rove%22#images
http://tinyurl.com/5l2ee
http://tobaccodocuments.org/pm/2041158370.html?pattern=%22Karl%20Rove%22&?pattern=%22Karl%20Rove%22#images
*** Merrie Spaeth (Tex Lezar) Linked to GW Bush, Linked to smears of
John McCain using same criminal fraud tactics, to Karl Rove, Bob
Perry, to Ken Starr, linked to organized crime tobacco conspiracies
http://tinyurl.com/64v3c GOOGLE.COM Results 814 for "Merrie Spaeth"
republican.
http://tinyurl.com/63zvu GOOGLE.COM Results 317 for "Merrie Spaeth"
"Tex Lezar".
http://tinyurl.com/43fek GOOGLE.COM Results 10 for "Tex Lezar"
tobacco.
*** Roy F. Hoffmann, a retired rear admiral and a leader of the group
http://tinyurl.com/5h6za http://mediamatters.org/items/200406020006
http://tinyurl.com/3rx8z http://mediamatters.org/items/200408060011
*** John E. O'Neill (Charles Colson apprentice) Linked to Nixon,
registered republican and donor, linked to Crow and Perry, to Corsi
and Regnery
http://tinyurl.com/4vrwq GOOGLE.COM Results 482 for "John E. O'Neill"
Colson.
http://tinyurl.com/496xl
http://www.disinfopedia.org/wiki.phtml?title=John_E._O'Neill
*** Harlan Crow (Swiftliars funder) Linked to Bush, to Perry AEI
board,
http://tinyurl.com/5afl5
http://www.aei.org/about/contentID.20038142214500073/default.asp
http://tinyurl.com/6l7vn GOOGLE.COM Results 113 for "Harlan Crow"
Holdings.
http://tinyurl.com/57oc8 GOOGLE.COM Results 217 for "Harlan Crow"
swift.
*** Bob J. Perry (Swiftliars funder) Linked to Bush, Rove, Crow
http://tinyurl.com/3oggt
http://okimc.org/newswire.php?story_id=79&media_type=TEXT
http://tinyurl.com/6kaso GOOGLE.COM Results 1,630 for "Bob Perry"
swift.
*** Stevens Reed Curcio & Potholm, (SwillBoat Ad maker) Linked to
republican party, numerous republican polician campaigns
http://tinyurl.com/5z7dd GOOGLE.COM Results 43 for "Stevens Reed
Curcio & Potholm" swift.
http://tinyurl.com/6g7fc http://srcpmedia.com/corp2.html
http://tinyurl.com/55f4r http://srcpmedia.com/corp2.html
http://tinyurl.com/5uwlw http://srcpmedia.com/house.html
http://tinyurl.com/5nmv7 http://srcpmedia.com/senate.html
http://tinyurl.com/6xnut http://srcpmedia.com/work.html
*** Regnery, a conservative company linked to Richard Mellon Scaife
who manipulates best-seller book list rankings, to Ken Starr, to Corsi
and O'Neill
http://tinyurl.com/5qw2n http://www.phillips.com/eagle.htm
http://tinyurl.com/4zvy2
http://encyclopedia.thefreedictionary.com/Richard%20Scaife
http://tinyurl.com/6vbpf
http://www.prospect.org/print/V11/5/confessore-n.html
http://tinyurl.com/5szod http://www.americanreview.us/back32.htm
http://tinyurl.com/4ycqd GOOGLE.COM Results 146 for "Regnery
Publishing" Richard Mellon Scaife.
*** Jerome R. Corsi Linked to Richard Scaife, to O'Neill, to Regnery
http://tinyurl.com/5a83u http://mediamatters.org/items/200408120001
http://tinyurl.com/5l66z http://mediamatters.org/items/200408110007
http://tinyurl.com/5zyuz http://mediamatters.org/items/200408060010
http://tinyurl.com/4zkmo
http://www.salon.com/src/ads/house/gateway/tv_head_gateway.html?http://www.salon.com/opinion/conason/2004/08/06/mccain_on_swift_boat_veterans/index_np.html
http://tinyurl.com/5zyuz http://mediamatters.org/items/200408060010
*** Dr. Louis Letson
http://tinyurl.com/3sf73
http://www.fearofclowns.com/text/kerry_faked_first_purple_heart_debunked/
http://tinyurl.com/5atvt
http://www.factcheck.org/article.aspx?docID=231
*** William L. Schachte Jr., a retired rear admiral
http://tinyurl.com/3wttr
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/04228/361477.stm
http://tinyurl.com/65xuf
http://www.underzealous.com/index.php/2004/08/13/p522
*** Larry Thurlow, who said his boat was 50 to 60 yards from Mr.
Kerry's.
http://tinyurl.com/5m4dc
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A13267-2004Aug18.html
http://tinyurl.com/6fyu4
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A13267-2004Aug18.html
http://tinyurl.com/5mhcw
http://www.thespoof.com/news/spoof.cfm?headline=s2i6344
The felony fraud organized crime ring is further connected to other
organiced crime fraud operations:
### Richard Mellon Scaife <http://tinyurl.com/5vdpe> is trumpetting it
from his publications. Scaife is historically linked to several of the
felons in the SwiftLiars crime ring. Scaife also funds a broad
coalition of websites and front organizations which are also promoting
this felony conspiracy though their own fraud crime operations:
Scaife thrall organization and Scaife leash-dollars put in it:
*** Heritage Foundation, $20,696,640 (Townhall.com)
http://tinyurl.com/6ng83 GOOGLE.COM Results Results 6,000 for
"Heritage Foundation" Swift boat OR Boats.
*** American Enterprise Institute for Public Policy Research
$5,201,000
http://tinyurl.com/68tqj GOOGLE.COM Results Results 1,750 for
"American Enterprise Institute" Swift boat OR Boats.
*** American Spectator Educational Foundation, Inc. $4,144,000
http://tinyurl.com/3n92j GOOGLE.COM Results Results 1,920 for
"American Spectator" Swift boat OR Boats.
*** Accuracy in Media, Inc. $3,225,000
http://tinyurl.com/3tg26 GOOGLE.COM Results Results 2,880 for
"Accuracy in Media" Swift boat OR Boats.
*** Citizens for a Sound Economy Foundation $2,335,000
http://tinyurl.com/53kxs GOOGLE.COM Results Results about 2,590 for
"Citizens for a Sound Economy" Swift boat OR Boats.
*** Cato Institute $1,872,500
http://tinyurl.com/6jrt7 GOOGLE.COM Results Results 1,920 for "Cato
Institute" Swift boat OR Boats.
*** National Center for Policy Analysis $1,760,000
http://tinyurl.com/4yyhy GOOGLE.COM Results Results 2,550 for
"National Center for Policy Analysis" Swift boat OR Boats.
*** Independent Women's Forum $1,600,000
http://tinyurl.com/4j9ae GOOGLE.COM Results Results 2,670 for
"Independent Women's Forum" Swift boat OR Boats.
*** Competitive Enterprise Institute $1,525,000
http://tinyurl.com/585fn GOOGLE.COM Results Results 2,550 for
"Competitive Enterprise Institute" Swift boat OR Boats.
*** American Legislative Exchange Council $1,495,000
http://tinyurl.com/5kuo9 GOOGLE.COM Results Results 2,480 for
"American Legislative Exchange Council" Swift boat OR Boats.
*** Defenders of Property Rights $965,000
http://tinyurl.com/4l3gc GOOGLE.COM Results Results 2,440 for
"Defenders of Property Rights" Swift boat OR Boats.
*** Media Research Center, Inc. $952,000
http://tinyurl.com/46hys GOOGLE.COM Results Results 5,240 for "Media
Research Center" Swift boat OR Boats.
*** Institute for Humane Studies $950,000
http://tinyurl.com/3w7b3 GOOGLE.COM Results Results 2,450 for
"Institute for Humane Studies" Swift boat OR Boats.
*** National Center for Public Policy Research, Inc. $825,000
http://tinyurl.com/59wll Google.com 2,610 for "National Center for
Public Policy Research" Swift boat OR Boats.
*** Media Institute $645,000
http://tinyurl.com/6s7b4 GOOGLE.COM Results Results 1,200 for "Media
Institute" Swift boat OR Boats.
*** Acton Institute For The Study of Religion and Liberty $565,000
http://tinyurl.com/6h98g GOOGLE.COM Results Results 2,470 for "Acton
Institute" Swift boat OR Boats.
### Sun Myung Moon is another felony fraud conspirator using his
organized crime operation to advance his candidate who has a bilnd eye
to Moon's crimes. The WASHINGTON TIMES and UPI wireservice is Moonie
front operations. <
http://tinyurl.com/6nlt9>
***
http://tinyurl.com/55jrwGOOGLE.COM Results 42,600 for "Washington
Times" Swift boat OR Boats.
SUN MYUNG MOON uses "CHURCH PROPERTY", helps create 42,600 webpages
circulating LIES.
.

User: "Hanoi Jane Fonda"
Title: Bill Clinton is a Murdering Psychopath!	23 Aug 2004 08:59:18 PM

Bill Clinton is a Murdering Psychopath!
The following is a list of dead people connected with Bill Clinton:
Buddy the dog - Clinton family pet. Froze to death on Hillary's lap.
Charles Ruff - the powerful wheelchair-bound Washington lawyer who
represented President Clinton during the Monica Lewinsky sex scandal
and his impeachment trial died from a "fall" in his Washington home.
James McDougal - Clinton's convicted Whitewater partner died of an
apparent heart attack, while in solitary confinement. He was a key
witness in Ken Starr's investigation. Prison guards are alleged to
have withheld heart medication.
Mary Mahoney - A former White House intern was murdered July 1997 at a
Starbucks Coffee Shop in Georgetown. The murder happened just after
she was to go public with her story of sexual harassment in the White
House.
Vince Foster - Former white House councilor, and colleague of Hillary
Clinton at Little Rock's Rose law firm. Died of a gunshot wound to the
head, ruled a suicide.
Ron Brown - Secretary of Commerce and former DNC Chairman. Reported to
have died by impact in a plane crash. A pathologist close to the
investigation reported that there was a hole in the top of Brown's
skull resembling a gunshot wound. At the time of his death Brown was
being investigated, and spoke publicly of his willingness to cut a
deal with prosecutors.
C. Victor Raiser II - & - Montgomery Raiser, Major players in the
Clinton fund raising organization died in a private plane crash in
July 1992.
Paul Tulley - Democratic National Committee Political Director found
dead in a hotel room in Little Rock, September 1992. Described by
Clinton as a " Dear friend and trusted advisor".
Ed Willey - Clinton fund raiser, found dead November 1993 deep in the
woods in Virginia of a gunshot wound to the head. Ruled a suicide. Ed
Willey died on the same day his wife Kathleen Willey claimed Bill
Clinton groped her in the oval office in the White House. Ed Willey
was involved in several Clinton fund raising events.
Jerry Parks - Head of Clinton's global international security team in
Little Rock. Gunned down in his car at a deserted intersection outside
Little Rock. Park's son said his father was building a dossier on
Clinton. He allegedly threatened to reveal this information. After he
died the files were mysteriously removed from his house.
James Bunch - Died from a gunshot suicide. It was reported that he had
a "Black Book" of people containing names of influential people who
visited prostitutes in Texas and Arkansas.
James Wilson - Was found dead in May 1993 from an apparent hanging
suicide. He was reported to have ties to Whitewater.
Kathy Ferguson -Ex-wife of Arkansas Trooper Danny Ferguson died in May
1994 was found dead in her living room with a gunshot to her head. It
was ruled a suicide even though there were several packed suitcases,
as if she was going somewhere. Danny Ferguson was a co-defendant along
with Bill Clinton in the Paula Jones lawsuit. Kathy Ferguson was a
possible Corroborating witness for Paula Jones.
Bill Shelton - Arkansas state Trooper and fianc�e of Kathy Ferguson.
Critical of the suicide ruling of his fianc�e, he was found dead in
June, 1994 of a gunshot wound also ruled a suicide at the gravesite of
his fianc�e.
Gandy Baugh - Attorney for Clinton friend Dan Lassater died by jumping
out a window of a tall building January, 1994. His client was a
convicted drug distributor.
Florence Martin - Accountant sub-contractor for the CIA related to the
Barry Seal Mena Airport drug smuggling case. Died of three gunshot
wounds.
Suzanne Coleman - Reportedly had an affair with Clinton when he was
Arkansas Attorney General. Died of a gunshot wound to the back of the
head, ruled a suicide. Was pregnant at the time of her death.
Paula Grober - Clinton's speech interpreter for the deaf from 1978
until her death December 9, 1992. She died in a one car accident.
Danny Casolaro - Investigative reporter. Investigating Mena Airport
and Arkansas Development Finance Authority. He slit his wrists,
apparent suicide in the middle of his investigation.
Paul Wilcher - Attorney investigating corruption at Mena Airport with
Casolaro and the 1980" October Surprise" was found dead on a toilet
June 22, 1993 in his Washington DC apartment. Had delivered a report
to Janet Reno 3 weeks before his death.
Jon Parnell Walker - Whitewater investigator for Resolution Trust
Corp. Jumped to his death from his Arlington, Virginia apartment
balcony August 15, 1993 Was investigating Morgan Guarantee scandal.
Barbara Wise - Commerce Department staffer. Worked closely with Ron
Brown and John Huang. Cause of death unknown. Died November 29, 1996.
Her bruised nude body was found locked in her office at the Department
of Commerce.
Charles Meissner - Assistant Secretary of Commerce who gave John Huang
special security clearance, died shortly thereafter in a small plane
crash.
Dr. Stanley Heard - Chairman of the National Chiropractic Health Care
Advisory Committee died with his attorney Steve Dickson in a small
plane crash.
Dr. Heard, in addition to serving on Clinton's advisory council
personally treated Clinton's mother, stepfather and brother.
Barry Seal - Drug running pilot out of Mena Arkansas, Death was no
accident.
Johnny Lawhorn Jr. - Mechanic, found a check made out to Clinton in
the trunk of a car left in his repair shop. Died when his car hit a
utility pole.
Stanley Huggins - Suicide. Investigated Madison Guarantee. His report
was never released.
Hershell Friday - Attorney and Clinton fund raiser died March 1, 1994
when his plane exploded.
Kevin Ives & Don Henry - Known as "The boys on the track" case.
Reports say the boys may have stumbled upon the Mena arkansas airport
drug operation. Controversaial case here- initial report of death was
due to falling asleep on railroad track. Later reports claim the 2
boys had been slain before being placed on the tracks. Many linked to
the case died before their testimony could come before a Grand Jury.
THE FOLLOWING SIX PERSONS HAD INFORMATION ON THE IVES / HENRY CASE:
Keith Coney - Died when his motorcycle slammed into the back of a
truck, July, 1988
Keith McMaskle - Died stabbed 113 times, Nov, 1988
Gregory Collins - Died from a gunshot wound January 1989.
Jeff Rhodes - He was shot, mutilated and found burned in a trash dump
in April 1989.
James Milan - Found decapitated. Coroner ruled death due to natural
causes. (Personal favorite.)
Jordan Kettleson - Was found shot to death in the front seat of his
pickup truck in June 1990.
Richard Winters - Was a suspect in the Ives / Henry deaths. Was killed
in a set-up robbery July 1989
THE FOLLOWING CLINTON BODYGUARDS ARE DEAD:
Major William S. Barkley Jr.
Captain Scott J. Reynolds
Sgt. Brian Hanley
Sgt. Tim Sabel Major
General William Robertson
Col. William Densberger
Col. Robert Kelly
Spec. Gary Rhodes
Steve Willis
Robert Williams
Conway LeBleu
Todd McKeehan
--
Left-wing liberals are EVERYTHING they accuse the right of being. They
are mean, vicious, hateful, greedy, cold-hearted, closed-minded,
selfish, intolerant, bigoted and racist.
Liberals HATE America!
.

User: "MOONIES for Bush"
Title: Re: Bill Clinton is a Murdering Psychopath!	25 Aug 2004 02:08:16 AM

On Mon, 23 Aug 2004 21:59:18 -0400, Hanoi Jane Fonda
<hanoi_jane@N0SPAM.C0M> twrote

The following is a list of dead people

Bush Pal SUN MYUNG MOON's Nuke-Tech to ATHEIST North Korea.
The issue is NOT purple hearts in Viet Nam, but Black Hearts in
Washington D.C.
George Bush buddy Sun Myung Moon gave nuclear weapons submarine
sea-launch technology to North Korea in 1994. That technology now
permits North Korea sea-platform launched missiles to hit continental
USA. Bush and Moon are collaborating on "SwiftVet" smear dirty tricks,
using Moon's Washington Times and UPI news operations to peddle felony
frauds.
SUN MYUNG MOON gave North Korea NUKE DELIVERY SYSTEMS.
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Nukes.html
Sun Myung Moon's Japanese Toen Trading company delivered 12 Russian
Golf missile submarines with launch tubes intact. The North Korean
communists studied this technology and adapted their missiles to be
sea launched from surface and submarine platforms. North Korea now has
nuclear weapon strike capability which can reach the continental
United States from sea-based mobile launch facilities at distances of
2,500 miles. This website has clickable links to Sun Myung Moon
subversion sources, documentation, proof.
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Nukes.html
LINKS -- NK sea-missile capability: http://www.navyseals.com
http://www.janes.com http://www.reuters.co.uk http://news.bbc.co.uk
http://www.washingtontimes.com http://www.newscientist.com
http://www.townhall.com http://www.freerepublic.com
http://www.libertyforum.org http://www.theage.com.au
http://www.iht.com http://www.latimes.com
LINKS -- North Korean-born Sun Myung Moon's Toen Trading Submarine
Subversion: http://www.freerepublic.com http://www.usasurvival.org
http://www.gorenfeld.net http://www.davidicke.net
http://blog.mmadsen.org http://www.kenlayne.com
http://www.pandagon.net http://jameswagner.com
http://functionalambivalent.typepad.com http://www.la-mancha.net
http://windsofchange.net http://thoughtcrimes.org http://www.vuw.ac.nz
Sun Myung Moon owns the Washington Times newspaper, and he owns the
UPI (United Press International) wireservice. He controls the main
Washington DC conservative propaganda mill. The Washington Times has
been subsidized by over a billion dollars of moonie slave labor. Every
time that a republican politician quotes the Washington Times, or
writes an article or op-ed in it, Sun Myung Moon is made larger in his
brainwashed follower's eyes. Conservatives are so desperate for
propaganda for their agenda that they willingly aid and abet Sun Myung
Moon's organized crime activities in exchange for the help his
organized crime front operations deliver to them.
Sun Myung Moon has paid ex-presidents, such as George Herbert Walker
Bush up to $10,000,000 for photo-op and endorsements, because his
virtually captive followers have very restricted access to news. They
are told that everybody Moon shakes hands with has accepted Moon as
their lord and savior. This global slave labor force replenishes a $10
million expense for faked stage setting photo-op in a couple of days.
LINKS about Moonies, Bush, Washinton Times connections:
The Moonies: Everything you wanted to know about Sun Myung Moon and
the Unification Church
Moonie and Related Links
* The Right Wing Media Conspiracy - How the Moonies and right wing
groups control the media
* Moonies and the Washington Times - The mouthpiece of Sun Myung
Moon
* Is George Bush a Moonie? - Bush takes $100,000 to endorse the
Moonies
* Inside Look at the Moonies - Great article I snagged
* Moonie Front Organizations - 1000 organization that are Moonie
fronts
* Consortium News - Very good articles about Moonies and other
right wingers
* Bush and Moon - US CIA and Korean CIA?? GHW Bush Praises Sun
Myung Moon as 'Man of Vision'
* Sun Myung Moon - "the Savior, Messiah and King of Kings of all
of humanity"
* The Bush-Kim-Moon Triangle of Money - the political largesse of
Sun Myung Moon.
Sun Myung Moon crowned as Second Coming in DC
The news of a very strange event that occurred at the end of March,
but was quietly swept under the carpet by the mainstream media, is
just now beginning to leak out. Expect to hear more about it in the
coming days. Here's a preview on what surely must be one of the most
bizarre happenings in the long history of Congressional oddities...
It occurred on March 23, 2004 when Reverend Sun Myung Moon, cultist
leader of the Unification Church (currently known as The Family
Federation for World Peace and Unification), was crowned "King of
Peace" in a coronation ceremony. In his coronation speech, Moon told
the audience that it was now time to officially recognize him as the
returned Messiah.
LINKS:
Moon Crowned in the Capital, [Unification Church] Sun Myung Moon
Crowned 'King Of America' At U.S. Senate Building, Hail to the Moon
king, Moon Over Washington, Sun Myung Moon Crowned Messiah By
Congressmen, Sun Myung Moon crowned as Messiah by U.S. Senate! Moonie
leader 'crowned' in Senate, Sun Myung Moon Crowned Messiah! U.S.
Lawmakers Crown rev. Sun Myung Moon Messiah! Here's a guy the
Republicans don't want us to know about. (Actually, it was a democrat
conservative, to the great relief of republican conservatives, who
placed the crown on Moon, in this hoax ceremony. In Moon's world he
replaces all governments with his Taliban, so Republicans and
Democrats all will be liquidated.
The quaint mass marriage ceremonies of the Moonies has another
significance: these represent thousands upon thousand upon thousands
of members of an organized crime empire, as dedicated as body-bomb
suicide muslims, to the eccentric whims of this visibly insane man.
Moonies surreptitiously swell rallies for rightwing causes, clog the
internet forums with their unshakable propaganda-mongering which
cannot be reasoned with, vote as a block and move across state lines
to do it. They even move across international boundaries to meddle in
politics.

Moonies also collaborate with other organized crime rings for mutal
profit.
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Koctopus_01.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Killer_David_Koch.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/CSE_Organized_Crime.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Corrupt_CFACT.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Seitz_Tobacco_Crimes.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Singer-Nightline.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Singer-1993-1994.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Singer-Seitz.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Stohrer-Singer.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Hazeltine-Singer.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Heidelberg-Appeal.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Corrupt_Sallie_Baliunas.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Walter_Williams_AdTI.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Corrupt_Richard_S_Lindzen.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/ADTI_Frauds_01.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/AdTI_Villians.htm
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Pelosi.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Becky_Norton_Dunlop_AdTI.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Confronting_AdTI.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Chrispeels.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Corrupt_Idsos.html
http://www.ecosyn.us/adti/Corrupt_Fred_Michel.html
.

User: "Michael Marxist Moore"
Title: LIBERAL CRITICS WITHOUT CREDIBILITY	25 Aug 2004 02:54:03 AM

LIBERAL CRITICS WITHOUT CREDIBILITY
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
NY Post Editorial

December 13, 2003 -- The activist group Human Rights Watch has claimed
that "hundreds of civilian deaths" in the U.S.-led invasion of Iraq
"could have been prevented" if only America hadn't used cluster
munitions or tried to "decapitate" the Iraqi leadership using
intercepts of satellite phone calls. This could be true. After all,
war is an inherently messy thing - a kingdom of difficult, often
deadly choices.
But keep these facts in mind: Overall civilian casualties during the
war were amazingly low. (Even Kenneth Roth, director of Human Rights
Watch concedes - grudgingly - that "Coalition forces generally tried
to avoid killing Iraqis who weren't taking part in combat.") Physical
destruction in Baghdad and other Iraqi cities was extremely limited.
So fair-minded folk should assess this claim skeptically.
Especially given the group's obvious - and sometimes grotesque -
anti-American bias in the context of Iraq.
After all, before the war HRW predicted a massive "humanitarian
disaster" if America tried to topple Saddam Hussein, though it claimed
to take no position on the imminent invasion.
And during the war it could barely rouse itself to condemn the Iraqi
forces' practice of wearing civilian clothes - an open-and-shut,
abundantly documented, large-scale violation of one of the core laws
of war that put civilians at grave risk.
Instead, HRW issued press release after press release condemning or
carping at Coalition forces - often based on nothing more than
supposition.
For instance, in an April 16 press release HRW Director Roth wrote of
the U.S. Army "indiscriminately batter[ing] civilian neighborhoods
with cluster munitions," even though he had no evidence whatsoever of
any kind of "indiscriminate" behavior (his only evidence was a
newspaper photograph of a single bomblet in a Baghdad building).
Indeed, HRW's researchers didn't even arrive in Iraq until April 29.
Nor does it encourage faith in Human Rights Watch's supposed
objectivity that one of its key sources for an October report on
post-war civilian deaths in Baghdad caused by U.S. forces was Nermin
al Mufti, a longtime Ba'athist activist and propagandist for the
Saddam regime.
Human Rights Watch (or at least its predecessor organizations like
Helsinki Watch and Africa Watch) was once a responsible group that
tried to be objective despite the left-wing views of its staff and did
some good work in dark places that knew little liberty.
Now its claims simply can't be trusted.
.

User: "raven1"
Title: Re: Bush Nails Kerry's Poor Attendance at Intelligence Committee Hearings	22 Aug 2004 09:35:02 PM

On Sun, 22 Aug 2004 09:58:38 -0700, VRWC Destruction Machine
<VRWC_USA@hotmail.com> wrote:

On Sun, 22 Aug 2004 10:44:16 GMT, raven1 <quoththeraven@nevermore.com>
wrote:

On Sun, 22 Aug 2004 09:36:11 GMT, "Jim"
<KerrycallsVeteransMurderers@socialist.com> wrote:

And he should do so, just as soon as Bush makes his National Guard
attendance records public.

So you admit that he was AWOL then, as opposed to John Kerry, who by
any standards, was a war hero?
.

User: "VRWC Destruction Machine"
Title: Re: Bush Nails Kerry's Poor Attendance at Intelligence Committee Hearings	23 Aug 2004 06:24:41 PM

On Mon, 23 Aug 2004 02:35:02 GMT, raven1 <quoththeraven@nevermore.com>
wrote:

On Sun, 22 Aug 2004 09:58:38 -0700, VRWC Destruction Machine
<VRWC_USA@hotmail.com> wrote:

On Sun, 22 Aug 2004 10:44:16 GMT, raven1 <quoththeraven@nevermore.com>
wrote:

On Sun, 22 Aug 2004 09:36:11 GMT, "Jim"
<KerrycallsVeteransMurderers@socialist.com> wrote:

And he should do so, just as soon as Bush makes his National Guard
attendance records public.

So you admit that he was AWOL then, as opposed to John Kerry, who by
any standards, was a war hero?

The New York Times looked into the allegations in 2002 and concluded
that the time Mr. Bush missed had been made up satisfactorily and that
his records showed his having performed all the required service.
George Magazine looked into the story as well and concluded that there
were two documents in George Bush's records that indicated that he
accumulated 56 points toward his required minimum of 50 points
necessary to be regarded as a guardsman at the time that is in
question.
http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/b/bush-desert.htm
AWOL requires a charge under the UCMJ be made. None wasn't.
-
There once was a man from Nantucket,
Whose misstatements could fill up a bucket.
Oft the truth he has bent,
Like his "Irish descent."
Of his record he says, "I'll just duck it."
Must be of the man whose middle name is "F*ck It"
.

User: "raven1"
Title: Re: Bush Nails Kerry's Poor Attendance at Intelligence Committee Hearings	23 Aug 2004 06:41:59 PM

On Mon, 23 Aug 2004 16:24:41 -0700, VRWC Destruction Machine
<VRWC_USA@hotmail.com> wrote:

On Mon, 23 Aug 2004 02:35:02 GMT, raven1 <quoththeraven@nevermore.com>
wrote:

On Sun, 22 Aug 2004 09:58:38 -0700, VRWC Destruction Machine
<VRWC_USA@hotmail.com> wrote:

On Sun, 22 Aug 2004 10:44:16 GMT, raven1 <quoththeraven@nevermore.com>
wrote:

On Sun, 22 Aug 2004 09:36:11 GMT, "Jim"
<KerrycallsVeteransMurderers@socialist.com> wrote:

And he should do so, just as soon as Bush makes his National Guard
attendance records public.

So you admit that he was AWOL then, as opposed to John Kerry, who by
any standards, was a war hero?

From the same site:
"This all got started with an investigation by the Boston Globe
newspaper. The Globe concluded that Mr. Bush was an excellent National
Guard pilot who served portions of his six-year commitment by putting
in more active-duty time than required, *** but there is a year toward
the end of his time of service during which there are no records of
his having shown up for required meetings and drills." ***

AWOL requires a charge under the UCMJ be made.

If I rob the bank next door and I'm never charged, that doesn't mean I
didn't do it. Your point was?

None wasn't.

So you're saying one was...?
.

User: "VRWC Destruction Machine"
Title: Re: Bush Nails Kerry's Poor Attendance at Intelligence Committee Hearings	24 Aug 2004 12:38:48 AM

On Mon, 23 Aug 2004 23:41:59 GMT, raven1 <quoththeraven@nevermore.com>
wrote:

On Mon, 23 Aug 2004 16:24:41 -0700, VRWC Destruction Machine
<VRWC_USA@hotmail.com> wrote:

On Mon, 23 Aug 2004 02:35:02 GMT, raven1 <quoththeraven@nevermore.com>
wrote:

On Sun, 22 Aug 2004 09:58:38 -0700, VRWC Destruction Machine
<VRWC_USA@hotmail.com> wrote:

On Sun, 22 Aug 2004 10:44:16 GMT, raven1 <quoththeraven@nevermore.com>
wrote:

On Sun, 22 Aug 2004 09:36:11 GMT, "Jim"
<KerrycallsVeteransMurderers@socialist.com> wrote:

And he should do so, just as soon as Bush makes his National Guard
attendance records public.

So you admit that he was AWOL then, as opposed to John Kerry, who by
any standards, was a war hero?

AWOL requires a charge under the UCMJ be made.

If I rob the bank next door and I'm never charged, that doesn't mean I
didn't do it. Your point was?

Law enforcement don't keep daily records on bank robbers. Your analogy
falls flat.
-
There once was a man from Nantucket,
Whose misstatements could fill up a bucket.
Oft the truth he has bent,
Like his "Irish descent."
Of his record he says, "I'll just duck it."
Must be of the man whose middle name is "F*ck It"
.

User: "raven1"
Title: Re: Bush Nails Kerry's Poor Attendance at Intelligence Committee Hearings	24 Aug 2004 12:53:28 AM

On Mon, 23 Aug 2004 22:38:48 -0700, VRWC Destruction Machine
<VRWC_USA@hotmail.com> wrote: