| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"leojerush" |
| Date: |
08 May 2007 06:11:14 AM |
| Object: |
Some Universal Questions |
Respected Sirs,
Religions are from Beliefs; all the Religions teach about an 'after-
life' to man. If 'after-life' was given to a man, (1) "what in him"
gets the 'after-life'? If 'the soul of an individual' is the one that
gets 'the after-life', then (2) "on what basis" the soul was given to
an individual? And (3) "in what form" it was given to an individual?
Does anybody have any idea about these?
Yours,
T. Sekharan.
.
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| User: "johac" |
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| Title: Re: Some Universal Questions |
09 May 2007 01:38:24 AM |
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In article <1178622674.032125.148630@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>,
leojerush <tsekharan@hotmail.com> wrote:
Respected Sirs,
Religions are from Beliefs; all the Religions teach about an 'after-
life' to man. If 'after-life' was given to a man, (1) "what in him"
gets the 'after-life'? If 'the soul of an individual' is the one that
gets 'the after-life', then (2) "on what basis" the soul was given to
an individual? And (3) "in what form" it was given to an individual?
Does anybody have any idea about these?
There is no evidence for a 'soul' or an afterlife.
Yours,
T. Sekharan.
--
John #1782
"We should always be disposed to believe that which appears to us to be
white is really black, if the hierarchy of the church so decides."
- Saint Ignatius Loyola (1491-1556) Founder of the Jesuit Order.
.
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| User: "leojerush" |
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| Title: Re: Some Universal Questions |
09 May 2007 09:15:52 PM |
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On May 9, 11:38 am, johac <jhachm...@remove.sbcglobal.net> wrote:
In article <1178622674.032125.148...@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>,
leojerush <tsekha...@hotmail.com> wrote:
Respected Sirs,
Religions are from Beliefs; all the Religions teach about an 'after-
life' to man. If 'after-life' was given to a man, (1) "what in him"
gets the 'after-life'? If 'the soul of an individual' is the one that
gets 'the after-life', then (2) "on what basis" the soul was given to
an individual? And (3) "in what form" it was given to an individual?
Does anybody have any idea about these?
There is no evidence for a 'soul' or an afterlife.
Yours,
T. Sekharan.
--
John #1782
"We should always be disposed to believe that which appears to us to be
white is really black, if the hierarchy of the church so decides."
- Saint Ignatius Loyola (1491-1556) Founder of the Jesuit Order.
Respected Sirs and Madams,
Church is 'the deciding hierarchy' to the "believers"; all the
Christian churches originated from the Holy Bible: so the Holy Bible
is 'the supreme authority' of all the Christian churches.
The elders of the churches had "interpreted" the verses of the Holy
Bible; but they did not know the interpretations of "all the verses of
the Holy Bible": for example, 'what are the differences between (i)
the Spirit of God dove - which comes down on Jesus in Matthew gospel
(ii) the Spirit dove - that comes on Jesus in Mark gospel (iii) the
Holy Spirit dove - that comes upon Jesus in Luke gospel and (iv) the
Spirit dove - that comes upon Jesus in John gospel?
Do not say 'all are the same'; because 'all the Christians believe
that the Holy Bible was "given" by Holy Spirit and not an iota of the
Holy Bible is a "waste or meaningless".
Further come to the verses:
(1) Mt.3: 16: And when Jesus was baptized..... the heavens were opened...
the Spirit of God descending like a dove
Note: Here, the verse is 'heavens' were opened and it is the Spirit of
God
(2) Mk.1: 10: .. the heavens opened ... and the Spirit descending upon
him like a dove
Note: Here, 'heavens' opened and it is the Spirit.
(3) Lk.3: 21: .... the heaven was opened, 22 and the Holy Spirit
descended upon him in bodily form, as a dove
Note: Here, it is 'heaven' and not 'heavens' and it is the Holy
Spirit
(4) Jn.1: 32: And John bore witness, "I saw the Spirit descend as a
dove from heaven ...
Note: Here it is 'Spirit from heaven'.
No Christian churches have explained these; I can show 'many and many
words' and 'many and many verses' - that 'remain to be explained':
when these are "revealed" this will come to fulfill: 1 Cor.15: 24:
Then comes the end, when he delivers the kingdom to God the Father
after destroying every rule and every authority and power.
Yours,
T. Sekharan.
.
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| User: "johac" |
|
| Title: Re: Some Universal Questions |
10 May 2007 05:40:10 PM |
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In article <1178763352.671946.187080@u30g2000hsc.googlegroups.com>,
leojerush <tsekharan@hotmail.com> wrote:
On May 9, 11:38 am, johac <jhachm...@remove.sbcglobal.net> wrote:
In article <1178622674.032125.148...@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>,
leojerush <tsekha...@hotmail.com> wrote:
Respected Sirs,
Religions are from Beliefs; all the Religions teach about an 'after-
life' to man. If 'after-life' was given to a man, (1) "what in him"
gets the 'after-life'? If 'the soul of an individual' is the one that
gets 'the after-life', then (2) "on what basis" the soul was given to
an individual? And (3) "in what form" it was given to an individual?
Does anybody have any idea about these?
There is no evidence for a 'soul' or an afterlife.
Yours,
T. Sekharan.
--
John #1782
"We should always be disposed to believe that which appears to us to be
white is really black, if the hierarchy of the church so decides."
- Saint Ignatius Loyola (1491-1556) Founder of the Jesuit Order.
Respected Sirs and Madams,
Church is 'the deciding hierarchy' to the "believers"; all the
Christian churches originated from the Holy Bible:
So it's all based on lies and fairy tales.
--
John #1782
"We should always be disposed to believe that which appears to us to be
white is really black, if the hierarchy of the church so decides."
- Saint Ignatius Loyola (1491-1556) Founder of the Jesuit Order.
.
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| User: "Michael Gray" |
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| Title: Re: Some Universal Questions |
09 May 2007 11:17:18 PM |
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On 9 May 2007 19:15:52 -0700, leojerush <tsekharan@hotmail.com> wrote:
- Refer: <1178763352.671946.187080@u30g2000hsc.googlegroups.com>
On May 9, 11:38 am, johac <jhachm...@remove.sbcglobal.net> wrote:
In article <1178622674.032125.148...@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>,
leojerush <tsekha...@hotmail.com> wrote:
Respected Sirs,
Religions are from Beliefs; all the Religions teach about an 'after-
life' to man. If 'after-life' was given to a man, (1) "what in him"
gets the 'after-life'? If 'the soul of an individual' is the one that
gets 'the after-life', then (2) "on what basis" the soul was given to
an individual? And (3) "in what form" it was given to an individual?
Does anybody have any idea about these?
There is no evidence for a 'soul' or an afterlife.
Yours,
T. Sekharan.
--
John #1782
"We should always be disposed to believe that which appears to us to be
white is really black, if the hierarchy of the church so decides."
- Saint Ignatius Loyola (1491-1556) Founder of the Jesuit Order.
Respected Sirs and Madams,
Church is 'the deciding hierarchy' to the "believers"; all the
Christian churches originated from the Holy Bible: so the Holy Bible
is 'the supreme authority' of all the Christian churches.
The elders of the churches had "interpreted" the verses of the Holy
Bible; but they did not know the interpretations of "all the verses of
the Holy Bible": for example, 'what are the differences between (i)
the Spirit of God dove - which comes down on Jesus in Matthew gospel
(ii) the Spirit dove - that comes on Jesus in Mark gospel (iii) the
Holy Spirit dove - that comes upon Jesus in Luke gospel and (iv) the
Spirit dove - that comes upon Jesus in John gospel?
Do not say 'all are the same'; because 'all the Christians believe
that the Holy Bible was "given" by Holy Spirit and not an iota of the
Holy Bible is a "waste or meaningless".
Further come to the verses:
(1) Mt.3: 16: And when Jesus was baptized..... the heavens were opened...
the Spirit of God descending like a dove
Note: Here, the verse is 'heavens' were opened and it is the Spirit of
God
(2) Mk.1: 10: .. the heavens opened ... and the Spirit descending upon
him like a dove
Note: Here, 'heavens' opened and it is the Spirit.
(3) Lk.3: 21: .... the heaven was opened, 22 and the Holy Spirit
descended upon him in bodily form, as a dove
Note: Here, it is 'heaven' and not 'heavens' and it is the Holy
Spirit
(4) Jn.1: 32: And John bore witness, "I saw the Spirit descend as a
dove from heaven ...
Note: Here it is 'Spirit from heaven'.
No Christian churches have explained these; I can show 'many and many
words' and 'many and many verses' - that 'remain to be explained':
when these are "revealed" this will come to fulfill: 1 Cor.15: 24:
Then comes the end, when he delivers the kingdom to God the Father
after destroying every rule and every authority and power.
Yours,
T. Sekharan.
Have you had a mental health checkup recently?
--
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| User: "Michael Gray" |
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| Title: Re: Some Universal Questions |
08 May 2007 06:04:32 PM |
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On 8 May 2007 04:11:14 -0700, leojerush <tsekharan@hotmail.com> wrote:
- Refer: <1178622674.032125.148630@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>
Respected Sirs,
Religions are from Beliefs;
So far, so good.
all the Religions teach about an 'after-
life' to man.
Not so good.
Not "all" do.
If 'after-life' was given to a man,
There is no such thing, so the rest of your post is meaningless
question-begging.
(1) "what in him"
gets the 'after-life'? If 'the soul of an individual' is the one that
gets 'the after-life', then (2) "on what basis" the soul was given to
an individual? And (3) "in what form" it was given to an individual?
Does anybody have any idea about these?
Yes it is a load of nonsense.
Yours,
T. Sekharan.
--
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Some Universal Questions |
08 May 2007 06:46:42 AM |
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On 8 mei, 13:11, leojerush <tsekha...@hotmail.com> wrote:
Respected Sirs,
Religions are from Beliefs; all the Religions teach about an 'after-
life' to man. If 'after-life' was given to a man, (1) "what in him"
gets the 'after-life'? If 'the soul of an individual' is the one that
gets 'the after-life', then (2) "on what basis" the soul was given to
an individual? And (3) "in what form" it was given to an individual?
Does anybody have any idea about these?
Yours,
T. Sekharan.
You are posting on alt.atheism, and atheism is not a believe,
when one is a weak atheists it is the lack of it. (I do not believe it
is true)
when one is strong atheist like me it isthe oposit of it. (I believe
it is not true).
To believe there is an after-life believers have invented the soul.
Originally it only meant the aspects of being alive.
In order to make an afterlife possible they needed to believe in
dualism.
Dualism supposes that besides ordinary matter (and energy) there is
some kind of spirituals "stuff" that - under normal circumstances is
not visible to the human eye.
the soul was supposed to be made of this spirirual stuff.
For those who believe in reincarnation, the soul does not maintain the
memory or the character of the person but only the Karma, that is the
virtue aquired by the actions of the person. This is nescessairy for
the soul to become a different person (even a different animal) all
together, and stilll explain why one is born a viper or a Buddha.
For those who believe in an after-life in heaven (or hell) the soul
does maintains both the character and the memory of the person. This
is nescessairy because otherwise the soul wouldn't understand why it
is in heaven (or in hell) and neither the reward nor the punishment
would seem justified.
For materialists (or monists) like me, this spirtitual stuff doesn not
exist.
In my view the spiritual is everything that exists solely in the
(human) mind.
Hence: There is no soul, and there is nothing to either reincarnate,
of enjoy/sufffer an afterlife in heaven or hell.
Those who do believe in souls and after-lifes probably have no clear
vision to what they mean, and probably cannot satisfactorily answer
your question, because once one ponders over it, the idea becomes less
and less believable (and the actions of God become less and less
justifiable)
But maybe if you wonder to their NG's some Christian or Muslim
will have an idea I have not considered.
Peter van Velzen
strong Atheist
May 2007
Amstelveen
The Netherlands
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| User: "leojerush" |
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| Title: Re: Some Universal Questions |
08 May 2007 10:49:46 AM |
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On May 8, 4:46 pm, "pba...@worldonline.nl" <pba...@worldonline.nl>
wrote:
On 8 mei, 13:11, leojerush <tsekha...@hotmail.com> wrote:
Respected Sirs,
Religions are from Beliefs; all the Religions teach about an 'after-
life' to man. If 'after-life' was given to a man, (1) "what in him"
gets the 'after-life'? If 'the soul of an individual' is the one that
gets 'the after-life', then (2) "on what basis" the soul was given to
an individual? And (3) "in what form" it was given to an individual?
Does anybody have any idea about these?
Yours,
T. Sekharan.
You are posting on alt.atheism, and atheism is not a believe,
when one is a weak atheists it is the lack of it. (I do not believe it
is true)
when one is strong atheist like me it isthe oposit of it. (I believe
it is not true).
To believe there is an after-life believers have invented the soul.
Originally it only meant the aspects of being alive.
In order to make an afterlife possible they needed to believe in
dualism.
Dualism supposes that besides ordinary matter (and energy) there is
some kind of spirituals "stuff" that - under normal circumstances is
not visible to the human eye.
the soul was supposed to be made of this spirirual stuff.
For those who believe in reincarnation, the soul does not maintain the
memory or the character of the person but only the Karma, that is the
virtue aquired by the actions of the person. This is nescessairy for
the soul to become a different person (even a different animal) all
together, and stilll explain why one is born a viper or a Buddha.
For those who believe in an after-life in heaven (or hell) the soul
does maintains both the character and the memory of the person. This
is nescessairy because otherwise the soul wouldn't understand why it
is in heaven (or in hell) and neither the reward nor the punishment
would seem justified.
For materialists (or monists) like me, this spirtitual stuff doesn not
exist.
In my view the spiritual is everything that exists solely in the
(human) mind.
Hence: There is no soul, and there is nothing to either reincarnate,
of enjoy/sufffer an afterlife in heaven or hell.
Those who do believe in souls and after-lifes probably have no clear
vision to what they mean, and probably cannot satisfactorily answer
your question, because once one ponders over it, the idea becomes less
and less believable (and the actions of God become less and less
justifiable)
But maybe if you wonder to their NG's some Christian or Muslim
will have an idea I have not considered.
Peter van Velzen
strong Atheist
May 2007
Amstelveen
The Netherlands
Respected Sir,
The thoughts about the 'existence of soul' comes from the Books like
the Hoyl bible, the Holy Koran and so on: so if you do not believe
such Books, you cannot be 'satisfied'.
T. Sekharan.
.
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| User: "Robibnikoff" |
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| Title: Re: Some Universal Questions |
08 May 2007 01:21:41 PM |
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"leojerush" <tsekharan@hotmail.com> wrote in
snip
Respected Sir,
The thoughts about the 'existence of soul' comes from the Books like
the Hoyl bible, the Holy Koran and so on:
So? That doesn't mean the soul exists.
so if you do not believe
such Books, you cannot be 'satisfied'.
Guess again. I'm quite satisfied ;)
--
Robyn
Resident Witchypoo
BAAWA Knight!
#1557
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| User: "Michael Gray" |
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| Title: Re: Some Universal Questions |
08 May 2007 06:02:49 PM |
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On 8 May 2007 08:49:46 -0700, leojerush <tsekharan@hotmail.com> wrote:
- Refer: <1178639386.392579.259040@e51g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>
:
Respected Sir,
The thoughts about the 'existence of soul' comes from the Books like
the Hoyl bible, the Holy Koran and so on: so if you do not believe
such Books, you cannot be 'satisfied'.
Says who?
T. Sekharan.
--
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Some Universal Questions |
08 May 2007 06:56:41 PM |
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On 8 mei, 17:49, leojerush <tsekha...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On May 8, 4:46 pm, "pba...@worldonline.nl" <pba...@worldonline.nl>
wrote:
On 8 mei, 13:11, leojerush <tsekha...@hotmail.com> wrote:
Respected Sirs,
Religions are from Beliefs; all the Religions teach about an 'after-
life' to man. If 'after-life' was given to a man, (1) "what in him"
gets the 'after-life'? If 'the soul of an individual' is the one that
gets 'the after-life', then (2) "on what basis" the soul was given to
an individual? And (3) "in what form" it was given to an individual?
Does anybody have any idea about these?
Yours,
T. Sekharan.
You are posting on alt.atheism, and atheism is not a believe,
when one is a weak atheists it is the lack of it. (I do not believe it
is true)
when one is strong atheist like me it isthe oposit of it. (I believe
it is not true).
To believe there is an after-life believers have invented the soul.
Originally it only meant the aspects of being alive.
In order to make an afterlife possible they needed to believe in
dualism.
Dualism supposes that besides ordinary matter (and energy) there is
some kind of spirituals "stuff" that - under normal circumstances is
not visible to the human eye.
the soul was supposed to be made of this spirirual stuff.
For those who believe in reincarnation, the soul does not maintain the
memory or the character of the person but only the Karma, that is the
virtue aquired by the actions of the person. This is nescessairy for
the soul to become a different person (even a different animal) all
together, and stilll explain why one is born a viper or a Buddha.
For those who believe in an after-life in heaven (or hell) the soul
does maintains both the character and the memory of the person. This
is nescessairy because otherwise the soul wouldn't understand why it
is in heaven (or in hell) and neither the reward nor the punishment
would seem justified.
For materialists (or monists) like me, this spirtitual stuff doesn not
exist.
In my view the spiritual is everything that exists solely in the
(human) mind.
Hence: There is no soul, and there is nothing to either reincarnate,
of enjoy/sufffer an afterlife in heaven or hell.
Those who do believe in souls and after-lifes probably have no clear
vision to what they mean, and probably cannot satisfactorily answer
your question, because once one ponders over it, the idea becomes less
and less believable (and the actions of God become less and less
justifiable)
But maybe if you wonder to their NG's some Christian or Muslim
will have an idea I have not considered.
Peter van Velzen
strong Atheist
May 2007
Amstelveen
The Netherlands
Respected Sir,
The thoughts about the 'existence of soul' comes from the Books like
the Hoyl bible, the Holy Koran and so on: so if you do not believe
such Books, you cannot be 'satisfied'.
T. Sekharan.- Tekst uit oorspronkelijk bericht niet weergeven -
- Tekst uit oorspronkelijk bericht weergeven -
In my opinion it holding something Holy is disrespectfull to other
things.
As far as I know those who consider the Bible to be Holy do generally
not think so about the Koran and vice versa. In order to keep a clear
mind, I regard nothing to be Holy.
If you read the Bible carefully you will find the passage where the
blood of an animal is being called it's soul. Nowhere in the Old
testament does it speak of an afterlife, that only occurs in the new
testament.
The Eastern Ideas about reincarnanation are quite seperate from the
afterlife as supposed by the new testament and they are much older.
You may notice in the Gospel (matthew 16, verse 13 thru 15) that those
ideas had reached Galilee too.
I am quite satisfied with the fact that I have no soul,
and that there is no devil to sell it too either.
The idea of living forever doesn't really attrackt me,
though my wife pleases me much by saying she wants to be together with
me for 50 years.
Peter van Velzen Daengprasert
May 2007
Amstelveen
The Netherlands
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| User: "leojerush" |
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| Title: Re: Some Universal Questions |
08 May 2007 07:36:42 PM |
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On May 8, 4:46 pm, "pba...@worldonline.nl" <pba...@worldonline.nl>
wrote:
On 8 mei, 13:11, leojerush <tsekha...@hotmail.com> wrote:
Respected Sirs,
Religions are from Beliefs; all the Religions teach about an 'after-
life' to man. If 'after-life' was given to a man, (1) "what in him"
gets the 'after-life'? If 'the soul of an individual' is the one that
gets 'the after-life', then (2) "on what basis" the soul was given to
an individual? And (3) "in what form" it was given to an individual?
Does anybody have any idea about these?
Yours,
T. Sekharan.
You are posting on alt.atheism, and atheism is not a believe,
when one is a weak atheists it is the lack of it. (I do not believe it
is true)
when one is strong atheist like me it isthe oposit of it. (I believe
it is not true).
To believe there is an after-life believers have invented the soul.
Originally it only meant the aspects of being alive.
In order to make an afterlife possible they needed to believe in
dualism.
Dualism supposes that besides ordinary matter (and energy) there is
some kind of spirituals "stuff" that - under normal circumstances is
not visible to the human eye.
the soul was supposed to be made of this spirirual stuff.
For those who believe in reincarnation, the soul does not maintain the
memory or the character of the person but only the Karma, that is the
virtue aquired by the actions of the person. This is nescessairy for
the soul to become a different person (even a different animal) all
together, and stilll explain why one is born a viper or a Buddha.
For those who believe in an after-life in heaven (or hell) the soul
does maintains both the character and the memory of the person. This
is nescessairy because otherwise the soul wouldn't understand why it
is in heaven (or in hell) and neither the reward nor the punishment
would seem justified.
For materialists (or monists) like me, this spirtitual stuff doesn not
exist.
In my view the spiritual is everything that exists solely in the
(human) mind.
Hence: There is no soul, and there is nothing to either reincarnate,
of enjoy/sufffer an afterlife in heaven or hell.
Those who do believe in souls and after-lifes probably have no clear
vision to what they mean, and probably cannot satisfactorily answer
your question, because once one ponders over it, the idea becomes less
and less believable (and the actions of God become less and less
justifiable)
But maybe if you wonder to their NG's some Christian or Muslim
will have an idea I have not considered.
Peter van Velzen
strong Atheist
May 2007
Amstelveen
The Netherlands
Respected Sirs,
I asked about 'the souls' and you responded; but 'our guessing, our
assumptions, our beliefs, our inferences and so on' will not yield to
Universal Truth. We must rely on (the verses of) the Books, termed as
the 'Words of God'.
For the last five years, I have been writing about these relying on
the verses of (and verses only) the Holy Bible and the Holy Koran. You
can see them in
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/theology_talk
But to go through them will be tedious and so you need not go through
them; rather we can start a "new discussion" - based on the verses and
verses only of the Holy Bible and the Holy Koran.
If anybody is interested in discussing such Universal Matters, let
him contact me in
tsekharan@hotmail.com or
tsekharan@yahoo.com
Yours,
T. Sekharan.
.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Some Universal Questions |
09 May 2007 09:57:27 AM |
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On 9 mei, 02:36, leojerush <tsekha...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On May 8, 4:46 pm, "pba...@worldonline.nl" <pba...@worldonline.nl>
wrote:
On 8 mei, 13:11, leojerush <tsekha...@hotmail.com> wrote:
Respected Sirs,
Religions are from Beliefs; all the Religions teach about an 'after-
life' to man. If 'after-life' was given to a man, (1) "what in him"
gets the 'after-life'? If 'the soul of an individual' is the one that
gets 'the after-life', then (2) "on what basis" the soul was given to
an individual? And (3) "in what form" it was given to an individual?
Does anybody have any idea about these?
Yours,
T. Sekharan.
You are posting on alt.atheism, and atheism is not a believe,
when one is a weak atheists it is the lack of it. (I do not believe it
is true)
when one is strong atheist like me it isthe oposit of it. (I believe
it is not true).
To believe there is an after-life believers have invented the soul.
Originally it only meant the aspects of being alive.
In order to make an afterlife possible they needed to believe in
dualism.
Dualism supposes that besides ordinary matter (and energy) there is
some kind of spirituals "stuff" that - under normal circumstances is
not visible to the human eye.
the soul was supposed to be made of this spirirual stuff.
For those who believe in reincarnation, the soul does not maintain the
memory or the character of the person but only the Karma, that is the
virtue aquired by the actions of the person. This is nescessairy for
the soul to become a different person (even a different animal) all
together, and stilll explain why one is born a viper or a Buddha.
For those who believe in an after-life in heaven (or hell) the soul
does maintains both the character and the memory of the person. This
is nescessairy because otherwise the soul wouldn't understand why it
is in heaven (or in hell) and neither the reward nor the punishment
would seem justified.
For materialists (or monists) like me, this spirtitual stuff doesn not
exist.
In my view the spiritual is everything that exists solely in the
(human) mind.
Hence: There is no soul, and there is nothing to either reincarnate,
of enjoy/sufffer an afterlife in heaven or hell.
Those who do believe in souls and after-lifes probably have no clear
vision to what they mean, and probably cannot satisfactorily answer
your question, because once one ponders over it, the idea becomes less
and less believable (and the actions of God become less and less
justifiable)
But maybe if you wonder to their NG's some Christian or Muslim
will have an idea I have not considered.
Peter van Velzen
strong Atheist
May 2007
Amstelveen
The Netherlands
Respected Sirs,
I asked about 'the souls' and you responded; but 'our guessing, our
assumptions, our beliefs, our inferences and so on' will not yield to
Universal Truth. We must rely on (the verses of) the Books, termed as
the 'Words of God'.
For the last five years, I have been writing about these relying on
the verses of (and verses only) the Holy Bible and the Holy Koran. You
can see them inhttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/theology_talk
But to go through them will be tedious and so you need not go through
them; rather we can start a "new discussion" - based on the verses and
verses only of the Holy Bible and the Holy Koran.
If anybody is interested in discussing such Universal Matters, let
him contact me in
tsekha...@hotmail.com or
tsekha...@yahoo.com
Yours,
T. Sekharan.- Tekst uit oorspronkelijk bericht niet weergeven -
- Tekst uit oorspronkelijk bericht weergeven -
Dear mister Sekharan,
Nothing will yield a universal truth for what is true in on place
might be untrue sometwhere else. However findings so far have shown
that all characteristics that might be attributed to a soul are
actually characteristics of the material body.
Verses in the Koran and the bible surely yield no universal truth.
For one the beliervers in these books disagree (sometimes violantly)
above that these books contain contradictions,
and furthermore some of there verses can be proven to be untrue.
(I know this for sure about the bible,
we have several experts on that subject.
The Koran isn't studied much by the atheists on this NG)
With Kind regards
Peter van Velzen
May 2007
Amstelveen
The Netherlands
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| User: "Neil Kelsey" |
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| Title: Re: Some Universal Questions |
08 May 2007 11:39:58 AM |
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On May 8, 4:11 am, leojerush <tsekha...@hotmail.com> wrote:
Respected Sirs,
Religions are from Beliefs; all the Religions teach about an 'after-
life' to man. If 'after-life' was given to a man, (1) "what in him"
gets the 'after-life'?
This is a conditional proposition. Your question is based on my
accepting that the afterlife WAS "given to a man." I see no reason to
accept that proposition. You have to give me some convincing evidence
that this is true before I can consider your first question.
If 'the soul of an individual' is the one that
gets 'the after-life', then (2) "on what basis" the soul was given to
an individual?
Again, your second question assumes the conclusion that there is an
afterlife. I see no reason to believe there's an afterlife or a god to
give one. Address that problem first.
And (3) "in what form" it was given to an individual?
And your third question suffers from the same logical lack as your
first two. I'm an atheist, I have no religious beliefs. Why are you
assuming I do?
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| User: "Elroy Willis" |
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| Title: Re: Some Universal Questions |
08 May 2007 07:30:19 AM |
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leojerush <tsekharan@hotmail.com> wrote in alt.atheism
Respected Sirs,
Religions are from Beliefs; all the Religions teach about an 'after-
life' to man. If 'after-life' was given to a man, (1) "what in him"
gets the 'after-life'? If 'the soul of an individual' is the one that
gets 'the after-life', then (2) "on what basis" the soul was given to
an individual? And (3) "in what form" it was given to an individual?
Does anybody have any idea about these?
Yours,
Yes, they're completely make believe.
--
Elroy Willis
www.elroysemporium.com
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| User: "Hatter" |
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| Title: Re: Some Universal Questions |
08 May 2007 07:55:05 AM |
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On May 8, 8:30 am, Elroy Willis <elroywil...@swbell.net> wrote:
leojerush <tsekha...@hotmail.com> wrote in alt.atheism
Respected Sirs,
Religions are from Beliefs; all the Religions teach about an 'after-
life' to man. If 'after-life' was given to a man, (1) "what in him"
gets the 'after-life'? If 'the soul of an individual' is the one that
gets 'the after-life', then (2) "on what basis" the soul was given to
an individual? And (3) "in what form" it was given to an individual?
Does anybody have any idea about these?
Yours,
Yes, they're completely make believe.
--
Elroy Williswww.elroysemporium.com
Unfortunate, but true <sigh> So unfortunate people found the need to
make them up.
Hatter
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| User: "Elroy Willis" |
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| Title: Re: Some Universal Questions |
08 May 2007 08:20:07 AM |
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Hatter <Hatter23@gmail.com> wrote in alt.atheism
Elroy Willis <elroywil...@swbell.net> wrote:
leojerush <tsekha...@hotmail.com> wrote in alt.atheism
Respected Sirs,
Religions are from Beliefs; all the Religions teach about an 'after-
life' to man. If 'after-life' was given to a man, (1) "what in him"
gets the 'after-life'? If 'the soul of an individual' is the one that
gets 'the after-life', then (2) "on what basis" the soul was given to
an individual? And (3) "in what form" it was given to an individual?
Does anybody have any idea about these?
Yours,
Yes, they're completely make believe.
Unfortunate, but true <sigh> So unfortunate people found the need to
make them up.
And others milked the ideas to make money and control people..
--
Elroy Willis
www.elroysemporium.com
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| User: "leojerush" |
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| Title: Re: Some Universal Questions |
08 May 2007 11:10:14 AM |
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On May 8, 6:20 pm, Elroy Willis <elroywil...@swbell.net> wrote:
Hatter <Hatte...@gmail.com> wrote in alt.atheism
Elroy Willis <elroywil...@swbell.net> wrote:
leojerush <tsekha...@hotmail.com> wrote in alt.atheism
Respected Sirs,
Religions are from Beliefs; all the Religions teach about an 'after-
life' to man. If 'after-life' was given to a man, (1) "what in him"
gets the 'after-life'? If 'the soul of an individual' is the one that
gets 'the after-life', then (2) "on what basis" the soul was given to
an individual? And (3) "in what form" it was given to an individual?
Does anybody have any idea about these?
Yours,
Yes, they're completely make believe.
Unfortunate, but true <sigh> So unfortunate people found the need to
make them up.
And others milked the ideas to make money and control people..
--
Elroy Williswww.elroysemporium.com
Respected Sir,
Your words: And others milked the ideas to make money and control
people..
I agree with you perfectly.
T. Sekharan.
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| User: "leojerush" |
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| Title: Re: Some Universal Questions |
08 May 2007 10:54:30 AM |
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On May 8, 5:55 pm, Hatter <Hatte...@gmail.com> wrote:
On May 8, 8:30 am, Elroy Willis <elroywil...@swbell.net> wrote:
leojerush <tsekha...@hotmail.com> wrote in alt.atheism
Respected Sirs,
Religions are from Beliefs; all the Religions teach about an 'after-
life' to man. If 'after-life' was given to a man, (1) "what in him"
gets the 'after-life'? If 'the soul of an individual' is the one that
gets 'the after-life', then (2) "on what basis" the soul was given to
an individual? And (3) "in what form" it was given to an individual?
Does anybody have any idea about these?
Yours,
Yes, they're completely make believe.
--
Elroy Williswww.elroysemporium.com
Unfortunate, but true <sigh> So unfortunate people found the need to
make them up.
Hatter
Respected Sir,
I am unable to understand.
T. Sekharan.
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| User: "Hatter" |
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| Title: Re: Some Universal Questions |
08 May 2007 12:39:05 PM |
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On May 8, 11:54 am, leojerush <tsekha...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On May 8, 5:55 pm,Hatter<Hatte...@gmail.com> wrote:
On May 8, 8:30 am, Elroy Willis <elroywil...@swbell.net> wrote:
leojerush <tsekha...@hotmail.com> wrote in alt.atheism
Respected Sirs,
Religions are from Beliefs; all the Religions teach about an 'after-
life' to man. If 'after-life' was given to a man, (1) "what in him"
gets the 'after-life'? If 'the soul of an individual' is the one that
gets 'the after-life', then (2) "on what basis" the soul was given to
an individual? And (3) "in what form" it was given to an individual?
Does anybody have any idea about these?
Yours,
Yes, they're completely make believe.
--
Elroy Williswww.elroysemporium.com
Unfortunate, but true <sigh> So unfortunate people found the need to
make them up.
Hatter
Respected Sir,
I am unable to understand.
T. Sekharan.- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
A soul is a fiction. It would be nice to live forever in a perfect
form, and that your loved ones get to live forever in perfect form.
But It is a lie. However, it is so desirable a lie, some people feel
the need to make up stories about souls and perpetuate the lie that
they exist. I feel saddened not only by the fact we do not get to live
forever, but that people delude themselves and others into thinking
that we do. Thus ignoring the reality of the here and now of
existence.
Hatter
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| User: "leojerush" |
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| Title: Re: Some Universal Questions |
14 May 2007 11:16:36 PM |
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On May 8, 10:39 pm, Hatter <Hatte...@gmail.com> wrote:
On May 8, 11:54 am, leojerush <tsekha...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On May 8, 5:55 pm,Hatter<Hatte...@gmail.com> wrote:
On May 8, 8:30 am, Elroy Willis <elroywil...@swbell.net> wrote:
leojerush <tsekha...@hotmail.com> wrote in alt.atheism
Respected Sirs,
Religions are from Beliefs; all the Religions teach about an 'after-
life' to man. If 'after-life' was given to a man, (1) "what in him"
gets the 'after-life'? If 'the soul of an individual' is the one that
gets 'the after-life', then (2) "on what basis" the soul was given to
an individual? And (3) "in what form" it was given to an individual?
Does anybody have any idea about these?
Yours,
Yes, they're completely make believe.
--
Elroy Williswww.elroysemporium.com
Unfortunate, but true <sigh> So unfortunate people found the need to
make them up.
Hatter
Respected Sir,
I am unable to understand.
T. Sekharan.- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
A soul is a fiction. It would be nice to live forever in a perfect
form, and that your loved ones get to live forever in perfect form.
But It is a lie. However, it is so desirable a lie, some people feel
the need to make up stories about souls and perpetuate the lie that
they exist. I feel saddened not only by the fact we do not get to live
forever, but that people delude themselves and others into thinking
that we do. Thus ignoring the reality of the here and now of
existence.
Hatter- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
Respected Sir,
In 'reality', we face many questions; those questions may be answered
through "the verses of the Books like Holy Bible and the Holy Koran".
Non-religous questions will be answered from Religiuos Books! If you
are interested, contact me in my e0mail address.
T. Sekharan.
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| User: "ThePhisherKIng Locker@BusStation" |
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| Title: Re: Some Universal Questions |
08 May 2007 06:52:52 AM |
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leojerush <tsekharan@hotmail.com> wrote in news:1178622674.032125.148630
@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com:
Respected Sirs,
Religions are from Beliefs; all the Religions teach about an 'after-
life' to man. If 'after-life' was given to a man, (1) "what in him"
gets the 'after-life'? If 'the soul of an individual' is the one that
gets 'the after-life', then (2) "on what basis" the soul was given to
an individual? And (3) "in what form" it was given to an individual?
Does anybody have any idea about these?
Yours,
T. Sekharan.
There is no "after life". When your body ceases to function, the
constituant elements that make up your body are eventually dispersed back
into the natural system and are reabsorbed in some other life process. Or
not at all. The atoms of iron in your blood, or the calcium in your bones,
may end up in a frog or some cow's milk. Or they may be dispersed in the
wind to land in the ocean, sink to the bottom, and be subducted into the
molten core of the earth in time. It's all part of the process that has
been going on since life appeared out of the primordial soup.
----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Unrestricted-Secure Usenet News==----
http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups
----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =----
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| User: "leojerush" |
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| Title: Re: Some Universal Questions |
08 May 2007 10:52:37 AM |
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On May 8, 4:52 pm, ThePhisherKIng <Locker@BusStation> wrote:
leojerush <tsekha...@hotmail.com> wrote in news:1178622674.032125.148630
@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com:
Respected Sirs,
Religions are from Beliefs; all the Religions teach about an 'after-
life' to man. If 'after-life' was given to a man, (1) "what in him"
gets the 'after-life'? If 'the soul of an individual' is the one that
gets 'the after-life', then (2) "on what basis" the soul was given to
an individual? And (3) "in what form" it was given to an individual?
Does anybody have any idea about these?
Yours,
T. Sekharan.
There is no "after life". When your body ceases to function, the
constituant elements that make up your body are eventually dispersed back
into the natural system and are reabsorbed in some other life process. Or
not at all. The atoms of iron in your blood, or the calcium in your bones,
may end up in a frog or some cow's milk. Or they may be dispersed in the
wind to land in the ocean, sink to the bottom, and be subducted into the
molten core of the earth in time. It's all part of the process that has
been going on since life appeared out of the primordial soup.
----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Unrestricted-Secure Usenet News==----http://www.newsfeeds.comThe #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups
----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =----
Respected Sir,
Certainly you think 'much'; if you believe in any Book like the Holy
Bible or the Holy Koran, I am sure that 'you will get heavenly light'.
T. Sekharan.
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| User: "Michael Gray" |
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| Title: Re: Some Universal Questions |
08 May 2007 06:05:17 PM |
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On 8 May 2007 08:52:37 -0700, leojerush <tsekharan@hotmail.com> wrote:
- Refer: <1178639557.382197.247340@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>
On May 8, 4:52 pm, ThePhisherKIng <Locker@BusStation> wrote:
leojerush <tsekha...@hotmail.com> wrote in news:1178622674.032125.148630
@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com:
Respected Sirs,
Religions are from Beliefs; all the Religions teach about an 'after-
life' to man. If 'after-life' was given to a man, (1) "what in him"
gets the 'after-life'? If 'the soul of an individual' is the one that
gets 'the after-life', then (2) "on what basis" the soul was given to
an individual? And (3) "in what form" it was given to an individual?
Does anybody have any idea about these?
Yours,
T. Sekharan.
There is no "after life". When your body ceases to function, the
constituant elements that make up your body are eventually dispersed back
into the natural system and are reabsorbed in some other life process. Or
not at all. The atoms of iron in your blood, or the calcium in your bones,
may end up in a frog or some cow's milk. Or they may be dispersed in the
wind to land in the ocean, sink to the bottom, and be subducted into the
molten core of the earth in time. It's all part of the process that has
been going on since life appeared out of the primordial soup.
----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Unrestricted-Secure Usenet News==----http://www.newsfeeds.comThe #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups
----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =----
Respected Sir,
Certainly you think 'much'; if you believe in any Book like the Holy
Bible or the Holy Koran, I am sure that 'you will get heavenly light'.
Is it coming by postal service?
T. Sekharan.
--
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