Religions > Atheism > SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion
| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"Yang, AthD h.c" |
| Date: |
04 Sep 2007 10:36:16 AM |
| Object: |
SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
Let me guess, he voted Republican too.
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority
http://www.wistv.com/Global/story.asp?S=7013869
CHARLOTTE, N.C. (AP) - A pastor accused of stealing from his
congregation has been sentenced to more than five years in prison.
Reverend John Henry Walker was also ordered to pay more than $277,000
in restitution to the government. He pleaded guilty to tax evasion,
bank fraud and lying to federal agents.
--
Yang
a.a.#28
"I can hardly wait for your head to explode when the Repubs hold onto
both houses of Congress this November. And Yang can quote me on that."
-Fred Stone, 6/14/2006
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
12 Sep 2007 10:17:46 AM |
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On Sep 4, 11:36 am, "Yang, AthD (h.c)" <eacmole@/*AWOLBUSH*/mail.com>
wrote:
Let me guess, he voted Republican too.
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority that the vast majority
of Christians make no actual claims of having but anti-religious
zealots attribute to them so they'll have something to rant about.
The common Christian position is that every Christian is a sinner.
Not morally superior. That's what salvation is all about.
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| User: "The Chief Instigator" |
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| Title: Re: SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
12 Sep 2007 11:59:41 AM |
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writes:
On Sep 4, 11:36 am, "Yang, AthD (h.c)" <eacmole@/*AWOLBUSH*/mail.com>
wrote:
Let me guess, he voted Republican too.
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority that the vast majority
of Christians make no actual claims of having but anti-religious
zealots attribute to them so they'll have something to rant about.
The common Christian position is that every Christian is a sinner.
Not morally superior. That's what salvation is all about.
Beliefs are one thing, actions are a whole other can of worms...and the two do
not match up very well when it comes to the plethora of Christian churches.
--
Patrick "The Chief Instigator" Humphrey (patrick@io.com) Houston, Texas
chiefinstigator.us.tt/aeros.php (TCI's 2006-07 Houston Aeros) AA#2273
LAST GAME: San Antonio 4, Houston 2 (April 15)
NEXT GAME: Saturday, October 6 vs. Chicago, 7:35
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
13 Sep 2007 01:49:46 PM |
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On Sep 12, 12:59 pm, The Chief Instigator <patr...@io.com> wrote:
patrick.bar...@standardregister.com writes:
On Sep 4, 11:36 am, "Yang, AthD (h.c)" <eacmole@/*AWOLBUSH*/mail.com>
wrote:
Let me guess, he voted Republican too.
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority that the vast majority
of Christians make no actual claims of having but anti-religious
zealots attribute to them so they'll have something to rant about.
The common Christian position is that every Christian is a sinner.
Not morally superior. That's what salvation is all about.
Beliefs are one thing, actions are a whole other can of worms...and the two do
not match up very well when it comes to the plethora of Christian churches.
That's true. I can't argue with that.
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| User: "Hatter" |
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| Title: Re: SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
19 Sep 2007 08:57:37 AM |
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On Sep 12, 11:17 am, wrote:
On Sep 4, 11:36 am, "Yang, AthD (h.c)" <eacmole@/*AWOLBUSH*/mail.com>
wrote:
Let me guess, he voted Republican too.
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority that the vast majority
of Christians make no actual claims of having but anti-religious
zealots attribute to them so they'll have something to rant about.
The common Christian position is that every Christian is a sinner.
Not morally superior. That's what salvation is all about.
Heh, nice try
No the common Christian position is that everyBODY is a sinner. The
only way to absolve oneself and to turn away from Sin is to follow
Christ. Since Christians state they are at least ATTEMPTING to follow
Christ, there is a very clear implication of moral superiorty.
It is nearly the foundation of Christianity, or frankly any dogmatic
moral system. The major difference that since they claim that the
creator of the universe has the same(just perfect) moral system, that
the fabric of the universe itself supports them in their moral
superiority.
That can lead down a dangerous path indeed, and often has.
Hatter
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| User: "altheim" |
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| Title: Re: SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
19 Sep 2007 02:14:05 PM |
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"Hatter" <Hatter23@gmail.com> wrote:
patrick.bar...@standardregister.com wrote:
"Yang, AthD (h.c)" <eacmole@/*AWOLBUSH*/mail.com>
wrote:
Let me guess, he voted Republican too.
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority that the vast majority
of Christians make no actual claims of having but anti-religious
zealots attribute to them so they'll have something to rant about.
The common Christian position is that every Christian is a sinner.
Not morally superior. That's what salvation is all about.
Heh, nice try
No the common Christian position is that everyBODY is a sinner. The
only way to absolve oneself and to turn away from Sin is to follow
Christ. Since Christians state they are at least ATTEMPTING to follow
Christ, there is a very clear implication of moral superiorty.
How do you arrive at that conclusion. To acknowledge ones
own sinfulness and turn to Christ in an attempt to do something
about it is surely a clear demonstration of humility.
It is nearly the foundation of Christianity, or frankly any dogmatic
moral system. The major difference that since they claim that the
creator of the universe has the same(just perfect) moral system, that
the fabric of the universe itself supports them in their moral
superiority.
That can lead down a dangerous path indeed, and often has.
Only for those who misunderstand the message.
Hatter
--
altheim
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| User: "Hatter" |
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| Title: Re: SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
20 Sep 2007 02:41:31 PM |
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On Sep 19, 3:14 pm, "altheim" <alth...@freeuk.com> wrote:
"Hatter" <Hatte...@gmail.com> wrote:
patrick.bar...@standardregister.com wrote:
"Yang, AthD (h.c)" <eacmole@/*AWOLBUSH*/mail.com>
wrote:
Let me guess, he voted Republican too.
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority that the vast majority
of Christians make no actual claims of having but anti-religious
zealots attribute to them so they'll have something to rant about.
The common Christian position is that every Christian is a sinner.
Not morally superior. That's what salvation is all about.
Heh, nice try
No the common Christian position is that everyBODY is a sinner. The
only way to absolve oneself and to turn away from Sin is to follow
Christ. Since Christians state they are at least ATTEMPTING to follow
Christ, there is a very clear implication of moral superiorty.
How do you arrive at that conclusion. To acknowledge ones
own sinfulness and turn to Christ in an attempt to do something
about it is surely a clear demonstration of humility.
The Christian assertion "I am following in the steps of the most
perfect, the almighty, the creator of the universe, and everyone else
will suffer" is hardly one of humility
It is nearly the foundation of Christianity, or frankly any dogmatic
moral system. The major difference that since they claim that the
creator of the universe has the same(just perfect) moral system, that
the fabric of the universe itself supports them in their moral
superiority.
That can lead down a dangerous path indeed, and often has.
Only for those who misunderstand the message.
Ahh the bagpipes are my favorite.
Hatter
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| User: "Michael Gray" |
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| Title: Re: SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
19 Sep 2007 07:07:46 PM |
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On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 19:14:05 GMT, "altheim" <alth...@freeuk.com>
wrote:
"Hatter" <Hatter23@gmail.com> wrote:
patrick.bar...@standardregister.com wrote:
"Yang, AthD (h.c)" <eacmole@/*AWOLBUSH*/mail.com>
wrote:
Let me guess, he voted Republican too.
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority that the vast majority
of Christians make no actual claims of having but anti-religious
zealots attribute to them so they'll have something to rant about.
The common Christian position is that every Christian is a sinner.
Not morally superior. That's what salvation is all about.
Heh, nice try
No the common Christian position is that everyBODY is a sinner. The
only way to absolve oneself and to turn away from Sin is to follow
Christ. Since Christians state they are at least ATTEMPTING to follow
Christ, there is a very clear implication of moral superiorty.
How do you arrive at that conclusion. To acknowledge ones
own sinfulness and turn to Christ in an attempt to do something
about it is surely a clear demonstration of humility.
It is a very clear sign of complete insanity.
:
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| User: "Michael Gray" |
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| Title: Re: SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
12 Sep 2007 10:54:44 PM |
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On Wed, 12 Sep 2007 08:17:46 -0700,
patrick.barnes@standardregister.com wrote:
On Sep 4, 11:36 am, "Yang, AthD (h.c)" <eacmole@/*AWOLBUSH*/mail.com>
wrote:
Let me guess, he voted Republican too.
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority that the vast majority
of Christians make no actual claims of having but anti-religious
zealots attribute to them so they'll have something to rant about.
The common Christian position is that every Christian is a sinner.
Not morally superior. That's what salvation is all about.
"Salvation" makes no sense at all.
It is an incoherent bunch of ad hoc babble.
.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
13 Sep 2007 01:48:23 PM |
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On Sep 12, 11:54 pm, Michael Gray <mikeg...@newsguy.com> wrote:
On Wed, 12 Sep 2007 08:17:46 -0700,
patrick.bar...@standardregister.com wrote:
On Sep 4, 11:36 am, "Yang, AthD (h.c)" <eacmole@/*AWOLBUSH*/mail.com>
wrote:
Let me guess, he voted Republican too.
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority that the vast majority
of Christians make no actual claims of having but anti-religious
zealots attribute to them so they'll have something to rant about.
The common Christian position is that every Christian is a sinner.
Not morally superior. That's what salvation is all about.
"Salvation" makes no sense at all.
It is an incoherent bunch of ad hoc babble.
In your opinion.
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| User: "Talk-n-Dog" |
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| Title: Re: SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
13 Sep 2007 01:51:03 PM |
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wrote:
On Sep 12, 11:54 pm, Michael Gray <mikeg...@newsguy.com> wrote:
On Wed, 12 Sep 2007 08:17:46 -0700,
patrick.bar...@standardregister.com wrote:
On Sep 4, 11:36 am, "Yang, AthD (h.c)" <eacmole@/*AWOLBUSH*/mail.com>
wrote:
Let me guess, he voted Republican too.
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority that the vast majority
of Christians make no actual claims of having but anti-religious
zealots attribute to them so they'll have something to rant about.
The common Christian position is that every Christian is a sinner.
Not morally superior. That's what salvation is all about.
"Salvation" makes no sense at all.
It is an incoherent bunch of ad hoc babble.
In your opinion.
It's God will...
--
http://OutSourcedNews.com
I suppose I could buy meteor insurance too, to help rebuild on that
impact crater, destined to be where my house is.
Our constitution protects criminals, sexual deviants and U.S. Senators.
Which at times are, one and the same...
The problem with the global warming theory, is that a theory is like a
bowl of ice-cream, it only takes a little dab of ***** to ruin the
whole thing. - Gump That -
How to outsmart Global Warming -- Plant your corn when the oak leaves
are as big as a squirrels ear.
Insanity is only synapses deep.
It's not if, it's just when, No one gets out alive.
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| User: "Al Klein" |
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| Title: Re: SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
13 Sep 2007 09:30:48 PM |
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On Thu, 13 Sep 2007 11:48:23 -0700,
patrick.barnes@standardregister.com wrote:
On Sep 12, 11:54 pm, Michael Gray <mikeg...@newsguy.com> wrote:
On Wed, 12 Sep 2007 08:17:46 -0700,
patrick.bar...@standardregister.com wrote:
On Sep 4, 11:36 am, "Yang, AthD (h.c)" <eacmole@/*AWOLBUSH*/mail.com>
wrote:
Let me guess, he voted Republican too.
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority that the vast majority
of Christians make no actual claims of having but anti-religious
zealots attribute to them so they'll have something to rant about.
The common Christian position is that every Christian is a sinner.
Not morally superior. That's what salvation is all about.
"Salvation" makes no sense at all.
It is an incoherent bunch of ad hoc babble.
In your opinion.
If Adam and Eve were aware that what they were doing was wrong, what
they were doing, learning what right and wrong were, wouldn't have
been wrong, it would have been impossible. (You can't "learn" what
you already know.)
If they weren't aware that what they were doing was wrong, it couldn't
have been a sin. You can't be responsible for things you aren't aware
of.
--
Al at Webdingers dot com
"They laughed at Newton, they laughed at Einstein, but they also laughed at
Bozo the Clown."
- Carl Sagan
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
18 Sep 2007 09:38:07 AM |
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On Sep 13, 10:30 pm, Al Klein <ruk...@pern.invalid> wrote:
On Thu, 13 Sep 2007 11:48:23 -0700,
patrick.bar...@standardregister.com wrote:
On Sep 12, 11:54 pm, Michael Gray <mikeg...@newsguy.com> wrote:
On Wed, 12 Sep 2007 08:17:46 -0700,
patrick.bar...@standardregister.com wrote:
On Sep 4, 11:36 am, "Yang, AthD (h.c)" <eacmole@/*AWOLBUSH*/mail.com>
wrote:
Let me guess, he voted Republican too.
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority that the vast majority
of Christians make no actual claims of having but anti-religious
zealots attribute to them so they'll have something to rant about.
The common Christian position is that every Christian is a sinner.
Not morally superior. That's what salvation is all about.
"Salvation" makes no sense at all.
It is an incoherent bunch of ad hoc babble.
In your opinion.
If Adam and Eve were aware that what they were doing was wrong, what
they were doing, learning what right and wrong were, wouldn't have
been wrong, it would have been impossible. (You can't "learn" what
you already know.)
If they weren't aware that what they were doing was wrong, it couldn't
have been a sin. You can't be responsible for things you aren't aware
of.
According to the story, Adam & Eve had no worldly knowledge. They
were, however, told by God not to eat from that tree. So they did
know eating from the tree was disobeying God but hey had no knowledge
of the sins of the world until they'd eaten from it.
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| User: "Al Klein" |
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| Title: Re: SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
18 Sep 2007 12:20:29 PM |
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On Tue, 18 Sep 2007 07:38:07 -0700,
patrick.barnes@standardregister.com wrote:
On Sep 13, 10:30 pm, Al Klein <ruk...@pern.invalid> wrote:
On Thu, 13 Sep 2007 11:48:23 -0700,
patrick.bar...@standardregister.com wrote:
On Sep 12, 11:54 pm, Michael Gray <mikeg...@newsguy.com> wrote:
On Wed, 12 Sep 2007 08:17:46 -0700,
patrick.bar...@standardregister.com wrote:
On Sep 4, 11:36 am, "Yang, AthD (h.c)" <eacmole@/*AWOLBUSH*/mail.com>
wrote:
Let me guess, he voted Republican too.
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority that the vast majority
of Christians make no actual claims of having but anti-religious
zealots attribute to them so they'll have something to rant about.
The common Christian position is that every Christian is a sinner.
Not morally superior. That's what salvation is all about.
"Salvation" makes no sense at all.
It is an incoherent bunch of ad hoc babble.
In your opinion.
If Adam and Eve were aware that what they were doing was wrong, what
they were doing, learning what right and wrong were, wouldn't have
been wrong, it would have been impossible. (You can't "learn" what
you already know.)
If they weren't aware that what they were doing was wrong, it couldn't
have been a sin. You can't be responsible for things you aren't aware
of.
According to the story, Adam & Eve had no worldly knowledge. They
were, however, told by God not to eat from that tree.
Since they had no knowledge of right and wrong, they couldn't know
that disobeying him was wrong, so disobeying him wasn't a sin.
So they did
know eating from the tree was disobeying God but hey had no knowledge
of the sins of the world until they'd eaten from it.
That's what I said - until they disobeyed him, nothing they did was
knowingly (by them) wrong, so they couldn't have sinned.
So we still haven't seen a *coherent* explanation.
--
Al at Webdingers dot com
"They laughed at Newton, they laughed at Einstein, but they also laughed at
Bozo the Clown."
- Carl Sagan
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
19 Sep 2007 08:05:49 AM |
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On Sep 18, 1:20 pm, Al Klein <ruk...@pern.invalid> wrote:
On Tue, 18 Sep 2007 07:38:07 -0700,
patrick.bar...@standardregister.com wrote:
On Sep 13, 10:30 pm, Al Klein <ruk...@pern.invalid> wrote:
On Thu, 13 Sep 2007 11:48:23 -0700,
patrick.bar...@standardregister.com wrote:
On Sep 12, 11:54 pm, Michael Gray <mikeg...@newsguy.com> wrote:
On Wed, 12 Sep 2007 08:17:46 -0700,
patrick.bar...@standardregister.com wrote:
On Sep 4, 11:36 am, "Yang, AthD (h.c)" <eacmole@/*AWOLBUSH*/mail.com>
wrote:
Let me guess, he voted Republican too.
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority that the vast majority
of Christians make no actual claims of having but anti-religious
zealots attribute to them so they'll have something to rant about.
The common Christian position is that every Christian is a sinner.
Not morally superior. That's what salvation is all about.
"Salvation" makes no sense at all.
It is an incoherent bunch of ad hoc babble.
In your opinion.
If Adam and Eve were aware that what they were doing was wrong, what
they were doing, learning what right and wrong were, wouldn't have
been wrong, it would have been impossible. (You can't "learn" what
you already know.)
If they weren't aware that what they were doing was wrong, it couldn't
have been a sin. You can't be responsible for things you aren't aware
of.
According to the story, Adam & Eve had no worldly knowledge. They
were, however, told by God not to eat from that tree.
Since they had no knowledge of right and wrong, they couldn't know
that disobeying him was wrong, so disobeying him wasn't a sin.
So they did
know eating from the tree was disobeying God but hey had no knowledge
of the sins of the world until they'd eaten from it.
That's what I said - until they disobeyed him, nothing they did was
knowingly (by them) wrong, so they couldn't have sinned.
So we still haven't seen a *coherent* explanation.
It is perfectly coherent. Your reply is leaving out the 'worldly'
context. Adam & Eve were completely naive about the world. But they
were still rational human beings. They had no experience with lying,
stealing, cheating, violence, disease, hunger, jealousy, etc. Those
are the sorts of wrongs they had no knowledge of. That does not mean
they had no concept that disobeying God was something they probably
shouldn't do. You're only making it incoherent by taking it to an
absurd extreme.
I don't believe the story of Adam & Eve is at all a true story, but it
certainly does make sense. As a myth to communicate the idea of
mankind's inherent disconnection from the spiritual and need for
purging of worldly concerns in order to connect with something more
pure, it is a reasonable story.
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| User: "Al Klein" |
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| Title: Re: SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
19 Sep 2007 10:00:07 AM |
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On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 06:05:49 -0700,
patrick.barnes@standardregister.com wrote:
On Sep 18, 1:20 pm, Al Klein <ruk...@pern.invalid> wrote:
On Tue, 18 Sep 2007 07:38:07 -0700,
patrick.bar...@standardregister.com wrote:
On Sep 13, 10:30 pm, Al Klein <ruk...@pern.invalid> wrote:
On Thu, 13 Sep 2007 11:48:23 -0700,
patrick.bar...@standardregister.com wrote:
On Sep 12, 11:54 pm, Michael Gray <mikeg...@newsguy.com> wrote:
On Wed, 12 Sep 2007 08:17:46 -0700,
patrick.bar...@standardregister.com wrote:
On Sep 4, 11:36 am, "Yang, AthD (h.c)" <eacmole@/*AWOLBUSH*/mail.com>
wrote:
Let me guess, he voted Republican too.
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority that the vast majority
of Christians make no actual claims of having but anti-religious
zealots attribute to them so they'll have something to rant about.
The common Christian position is that every Christian is a sinner.
Not morally superior. That's what salvation is all about.
"Salvation" makes no sense at all.
It is an incoherent bunch of ad hoc babble.
In your opinion.
If Adam and Eve were aware that what they were doing was wrong, what
they were doing, learning what right and wrong were, wouldn't have
been wrong, it would have been impossible. (You can't "learn" what
you already know.)
If they weren't aware that what they were doing was wrong, it couldn't
have been a sin. You can't be responsible for things you aren't aware
of.
According to the story, Adam & Eve had no worldly knowledge. They
were, however, told by God not to eat from that tree.
Since they had no knowledge of right and wrong, they couldn't know
that disobeying him was wrong, so disobeying him wasn't a sin.
So they did
know eating from the tree was disobeying God but hey had no knowledge
of the sins of the world until they'd eaten from it.
That's what I said - until they disobeyed him, nothing they did was
knowingly (by them) wrong, so they couldn't have sinned.
So we still haven't seen a *coherent* explanation.
It is perfectly coherent. Your reply is leaving out the 'worldly'
context. Adam & Eve were completely naive about the world. But they
were still rational human beings. They had no experience with lying,
stealing, cheating, violence, disease, hunger, jealousy, etc. Those
are the sorts of wrongs they had no knowledge of. That does not mean
they had no concept that disobeying God was something they probably
shouldn't do. You're only making it incoherent by taking it to an
absurd extreme.
Either they DID know that lying was wrong, in which case they
committed no sin because you can't learn something you already know,
or they DIDN'T know that it was wrong, in which case they committed no
sin because unwittingly committing an error isn't sin.
No matter how you spin it, that's how it works.
I don't believe the story of Adam & Eve is at all a true story, but it
certainly does make sense. As a myth to communicate the idea of
mankind's inherent disconnection from the spiritual and need for
purging of worldly concerns in order to connect with something more
pure, it is a reasonable story.
For someone with the intelligence of a 3-year-old, maybe. I've heard
5-year-olds question how they could sin if they hadn't learned it was
wrong UNTIL they "sinned".
("Eating of the fruit of the tree of knowledge of right and wrong"
means learning the difference between right and wrong. That's the
deal breaker - you either know the difference or you don't, there's no
"kinda-sorta" here, unless you need the concept of original sin to be
coherent, which non-Christians, and many Christians, don't.)
--
Al at Webdingers dot com
"They laughed at Newton, they laughed at Einstein, but they also laughed at
Bozo the Clown."
- Carl Sagan
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| User: "Michael Gray" |
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| Title: Re: SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
14 Sep 2007 06:40:44 PM |
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On Thu, 13 Sep 2007 11:48:23 -0700,
patrick.barnes@standardregister.com wrote:
On Sep 12, 11:54 pm, Michael Gray <mikeg...@newsguy.com> wrote:
On Wed, 12 Sep 2007 08:17:46 -0700,
patrick.bar...@standardregister.com wrote:
On Sep 4, 11:36 am, "Yang, AthD (h.c)" <eacmole@/*AWOLBUSH*/mail.com>
wrote:
Let me guess, he voted Republican too.
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority that the vast majority
of Christians make no actual claims of having but anti-religious
zealots attribute to them so they'll have something to rant about.
The common Christian position is that every Christian is a sinner.
Not morally superior. That's what salvation is all about.
"Salvation" makes no sense at all.
It is an incoherent bunch of ad hoc babble.
In your opinion.
Oh derr...
I have yet to have anyone explain it coherently, or have heard of
anyone explained it coherently.
Wanna have a go?
You seem to think that it is a doddle.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
18 Sep 2007 09:22:54 AM |
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On Sep 14, 7:40 pm, Michael Gray <mikeg...@newsguy.com> wrote:
On Thu, 13 Sep 2007 11:48:23 -0700,
patrick.bar...@standardregister.com wrote:
On Sep 12, 11:54 pm, Michael Gray <mikeg...@newsguy.com> wrote:
On Wed, 12 Sep 2007 08:17:46 -0700,
patrick.bar...@standardregister.com wrote:
On Sep 4, 11:36 am, "Yang, AthD (h.c)" <eacmole@/*AWOLBUSH*/mail.com>
wrote:
Let me guess, he voted Republican too.
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority that the vast majority
of Christians make no actual claims of having but anti-religious
zealots attribute to them so they'll have something to rant about.
The common Christian position is that every Christian is a sinner.
Not morally superior. That's what salvation is all about.
"Salvation" makes no sense at all.
It is an incoherent bunch of ad hoc babble.
In your opinion.
Oh derr...
I have yet to have anyone explain it coherently, or have heard of
anyone explained it coherently.
Wanna have a go?
You seem to think that it is a doddle.-
There's a difference between something being coherent and it being
right. I didn't claim you should believe in salvation if you choose
not to, I'm just saying that it isn't incoherent babble. It is a
clear and internally consistent concept, whether you believe in the
truth of it or not.
.
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| User: "Michael Gray" |
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| Title: Re: SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
18 Sep 2007 05:21:18 PM |
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On Tue, 18 Sep 2007 07:22:54 -0700,
patrick.barnes@standardregister.com wrote:
On Sep 14, 7:40 pm, Michael Gray <mikeg...@newsguy.com> wrote:
On Thu, 13 Sep 2007 11:48:23 -0700,
patrick.bar...@standardregister.com wrote:
On Sep 12, 11:54 pm, Michael Gray <mikeg...@newsguy.com> wrote:
On Wed, 12 Sep 2007 08:17:46 -0700,
patrick.bar...@standardregister.com wrote:
On Sep 4, 11:36 am, "Yang, AthD (h.c)" <eacmole@/*AWOLBUSH*/mail.com>
wrote:
Let me guess, he voted Republican too.
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority that the vast majority
of Christians make no actual claims of having but anti-religious
zealots attribute to them so they'll have something to rant about.
The common Christian position is that every Christian is a sinner.
Not morally superior. That's what salvation is all about.
"Salvation" makes no sense at all.
It is an incoherent bunch of ad hoc babble.
In your opinion.
Oh derr...
I have yet to have anyone explain it coherently, or have heard of
anyone explained it coherently.
Wanna have a go?
You seem to think that it is a doddle.-
There's a difference between something being coherent and it being
right. I didn't claim you should believe in salvation if you choose
not to, I'm just saying that it isn't incoherent babble. It is a
clear and internally consistent concept, whether you believe in the
truth of it or not.
I didn't think that you would be able to explain it, but am surprised
that you did not even attempt a half-hearted lame version of an
explanation.
I conclude that you were lying when you implied that it was not
incoherent babble.
If it is so clear to you, then you should be able to explain it to a
child in a short paragraph.
But not even you actually understand it!
Your posts here have only served to make Christianity look even more
infantile and insane than does already.
I urge you to keep posting, on behalf of atheism around the globe.
.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
19 Sep 2007 08:40:05 AM |
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On Sep 18, 6:21 pm, Michael Gray <mikeg...@newsguy.com> wrote:
On Tue, 18 Sep 2007 07:22:54 -0700,
patrick.bar...@standardregister.com wrote:
On Sep 14, 7:40 pm, Michael Gray <mikeg...@newsguy.com> wrote:
On Thu, 13 Sep 2007 11:48:23 -0700,
patrick.bar...@standardregister.com wrote:
On Sep 12, 11:54 pm, Michael Gray <mikeg...@newsguy.com> wrote:
On Wed, 12 Sep 2007 08:17:46 -0700,
patrick.bar...@standardregister.com wrote:
On Sep 4, 11:36 am, "Yang, AthD (h.c)" <eacmole@/*AWOLBUSH*/mail.com>
wrote:
Let me guess, he voted Republican too.
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority
Yep, that vaunted Christian moral superiority that the vast majority
of Christians make no actual claims of having but anti-religious
zealots attribute to them so they'll have something to rant about.
The common Christian position is that every Christian is a sinner.
Not morally superior. That's what salvation is all about.
"Salvation" makes no sense at all.
It is an incoherent bunch of ad hoc babble.
In your opinion.
Oh derr...
I have yet to have anyone explain it coherently, or have heard of
anyone explained it coherently.
Wanna have a go?
You seem to think that it is a doddle.-
There's a difference between something being coherent and it being
right. I didn't claim you should believe in salvation if you choose
not to, I'm just saying that it isn't incoherent babble. It is a
clear and internally consistent concept, whether you believe in the
truth of it or not.
I didn't think that you would be able to explain it, but am surprised
that you did not even attempt a half-hearted lame version of an
explanation.
I conclude that you were lying when you implied that it was not
incoherent babble.
If it is so clear to you, then you should be able to explain it to a
child in a short paragraph.
But not even you actually understand it!
Your posts here have only served to make Christianity look even more
infantile and insane than does already.
I urge you to keep posting, on behalf of atheism around the globe.
Well, Michael, tell you what -- the person here who is being vile and
intolerant isn't the believer. I am perfectly confident in leaving
this record in the Google archives for any neutral observer who might
come along in the future. They are free to judge which of us is more
reasonable and mature, which is representing his side in a better
manner.
.
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| User: "Michael Gray" |
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| Title: Re: SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
19 Sep 2007 07:06:02 PM |
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I note that you have yet to provide a single shred of evidence for
your ludicrous assertions.
You have managed to waste a considerable opportunity on rank
distractions though.
Present the evidence, or shut up.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
25 Sep 2007 09:06:44 AM |
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On Sep 19, 8:06 pm, Michael Gray <mikeg...@newsguy.com> wrote:
I note that you have yet to provide a single shred of evidence for
your ludicrous assertions.
I made no assertion other than that your inability to understand
something does not make that thing incoherent.
You have managed to waste a considerable opportunity on rank
distractions though.
Then killfile me. But truth be told I believe your hostile
intolerance and bizarre insistence that I back up some imaginary
assertion I never made are more distracting than anything I've said.
Present the evidence, or shut up.
Present the quote including assertion you claim I made.
.
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| User: "Al Klein" |
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| Title: Re: SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
19 Sep 2007 10:22:18 AM |
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On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 06:40:05 -0700,
patrick.barnes@standardregister.com wrote:
Well, Michael, tell you what -- the person here who is being vile and
intolerant isn't the believer.
Posting to alt.atheism with the "'my god exists' is a given" viewpoint
is, at the very least, inflammatory, if not downright nasty.
I am perfectly confident in leaving
this record in the Google archives for any neutral observer who might
come along in the future. They are free to judge which of us is more
reasonable and mature
You're a Christian - that alone is proof of immaturity.
which is representing his side in a better manner.
You're violating the rules of a group to which you're posting. that's
not "a better manner".
--
Al at Webdingers dot com
"They laughed at Newton, they laughed at Einstein, but they also laughed at
Bozo the Clown."
- Carl Sagan
.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
24 Sep 2007 05:55:15 PM |
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On Sep 19, 11:22 am, Al Klein <ruk...@pern.invalid> wrote:
On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 06:40:05 -0700,
patrick.bar...@standardregister.com wrote:
Well, Michael, tell you what -- the person here who is being vile and
intolerant isn't the believer.
Posting to alt.atheism with the "'my god exists' is a given" viewpoint
is, at the very least, inflammatory, if not downright nasty.
Okay, when I do such a thing then you're free to call me downright
nasty. As it is, I challenge you to produce even one amongst my
hundreds of postings which claims God is a given.
I am perfectly confident in leaving
this record in the Google archives for any neutral observer who might
come along in the future. They are free to judge which of us is more
reasonable and mature
You're a Christian - that alone is proof of immaturity.
But whining insults are demonstrations of intellectual superiority, I
suppose?
which is representing his side in a better manner.
You're violating the rules of a group to which you're posting. that's
not "a better manner".
Name the violation.
.
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| User: "Bill Ward" |
|
| Title: Re: SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
19 Sep 2007 12:02:23 PM |
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On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 11:22:18 -0400, Al Klein wrote:
On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 06:40:05 -0700,
patrick.barnes@standardregister.com wrote:
Well, Michael, tell you what -- the person here who is being vile and
intolerant isn't the believer.
Posting to alt.atheism with the "'my god exists' is a given" viewpoint is,
at the very least, inflammatory, if not downright nasty.
I am perfectly confident in leaving
this record in the Google archives for any neutral observer who might
come along in the future. They are free to judge which of us is more
reasonable and mature
You're a Christian - that alone is proof of immaturity.
which is representing his side in a better manner.
You're violating the rules of a group to which you're posting. that's not
"a better manner".
FWIW, you're cross posting to alt.global-warming.
.
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| User: "Al Klein" |
|
| Title: Re: SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
19 Sep 2007 01:17:16 PM |
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On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 10:02:23 -0700, Bill Ward
<bward@REMOVETHISix.netcom.com> wrote:
On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 11:22:18 -0400, Al Klein wrote:
On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 06:40:05 -0700,
patrick.barnes@standardregister.com wrote:
Well, Michael, tell you what -- the person here who is being vile and
intolerant isn't the believer.
Posting to alt.atheism with the "'my god exists' is a given" viewpoint is,
at the very least, inflammatory, if not downright nasty.
I am perfectly confident in leaving
this record in the Google archives for any neutral observer who might
come along in the future. They are free to judge which of us is more
reasonable and mature
You're a Christian - that alone is proof of immaturity.
which is representing his side in a better manner.
You're violating the rules of a group to which you're posting. that's not
"a better manner".
FWIW, you're cross posting to alt.global-warming.
And there's a rule there prohibiting the contents of my posts?
--
Al at Webdingers dot com
"They laughed at Newton, they laughed at Einstein, but they also laughed at
Bozo the Clown."
- Carl Sagan
.
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| User: "Bill Ward" |
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| Title: Re: SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
19 Sep 2007 02:12:08 PM |
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On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 14:17:16 -0400, Al Klein wrote:
On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 10:02:23 -0700, Bill Ward
<bward@REMOVETHISix.netcom.com> wrote:
On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 11:22:18 -0400, Al Klein wrote:
On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 06:40:05 -0700,
patrick.barnes@standardregister.com wrote:
Well, Michael, tell you what -- the person here who is being vile and
intolerant isn't the believer.
Posting to alt.atheism with the "'my god exists' is a given" viewpoint
is, at the very least, inflammatory, if not downright nasty.
I am perfectly confident in leaving
this record in the Google archives for any neutral observer who might
come along in the future. They are free to judge which of us is more
reasonable and mature
You're a Christian - that alone is proof of immaturity.
which is representing his side in a better manner.
You're violating the rules of a group to which you're posting. that's
not "a better manner".
FWIW, you're cross posting to alt.global-warming.
And there's a rule there prohibiting the contents of my posts?
A bit off topic, unless Hell is heating up.
.
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| User: "Al Klein" |
|
| Title: Re: SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
19 Sep 2007 07:26:55 PM |
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On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 12:12:08 -0700, Bill Ward
<bward@REMOVETHISix.netcom.com> wrote:
On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 14:17:16 -0400, Al Klein wrote:
On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 10:02:23 -0700, Bill Ward
<bward@REMOVETHISix.netcom.com> wrote:
On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 11:22:18 -0400, Al Klein wrote:
On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 06:40:05 -0700,
patrick.barnes@standardregister.com wrote:
Well, Michael, tell you what -- the person here who is being vile and
intolerant isn't the believer.
Posting to alt.atheism with the "'my god exists' is a given" viewpoint
is, at the very least, inflammatory, if not downright nasty.
I am perfectly confident in leaving
this record in the Google archives for any neutral observer who might
come along in the future. They are free to judge which of us is more
reasonable and mature
You're a Christian - that alone is proof of immaturity.
which is representing his side in a better manner.
You're violating the rules of a group to which you're posting. that's
not "a better manner".
FWIW, you're cross posting to alt.global-warming.
And there's a rule there prohibiting the contents of my posts?
A bit off topic, unless Hell is heating up.
And there's a rule against off-topic posts to alt.global-warming?
--
Al at Webdingers dot com
"They laughed at Newton, they laughed at Einstein, but they also laughed at
Bozo the Clown."
- Carl Sagan
.
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| User: "Bill Ward" |
|
| Title: Re: SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
19 Sep 2007 08:56:43 PM |
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On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 20:26:55 -0400, Al Klein wrote:
On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 12:12:08 -0700, Bill Ward
<bward@REMOVETHISix.netcom.com> wrote:
On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 14:17:16 -0400, Al Klein wrote:
On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 10:02:23 -0700, Bill Ward
<bward@REMOVETHISix.netcom.com> wrote:
On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 11:22:18 -0400, Al Klein wrote:
On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 06:40:05 -0700,
patrick.barnes@standardregister.com wrote:
Well, Michael, tell you what -- the person here who is being vile and
intolerant isn't the believer.
Posting to alt.atheism with the "'my god exists' is a given"
viewpoint is, at the very least, inflammatory, if not downright
nasty.
I am perfectly confident in leaving
this record in the Google archives for any neutral observer who might
come along in the future. They are free to judge which of us is more
reasonable and mature
You're a Christian - that alone is proof of immaturity.
which is representing his side in a better manner.
You're violating the rules of a group to which you're posting.
that's not "a better manner".
FWIW, you're cross posting to alt.global-warming.
And there's a rule there prohibiting the contents of my posts?
A bit off topic, unless Hell is heating up.
And there's a rule against off-topic posts to alt.global-warming?
Only for those who know better. If you're not house-broken...
.
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| User: "Al Klein" |
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| Title: Re: SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
19 Sep 2007 10:59:41 PM |
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On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 18:56:43 -0700, Bill Ward
<bward@REMOVETHISix.netcom.com> wrote:
On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 20:26:55 -0400, Al Klein wrote:
On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 12:12:08 -0700, Bill Ward
<bward@REMOVETHISix.netcom.com> wrote:
On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 14:17:16 -0400, Al Klein wrote:
On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 10:02:23 -0700, Bill Ward
<bward@REMOVETHISix.netcom.com> wrote:
On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 11:22:18 -0400, Al Klein wrote:
On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 06:40:05 -0700,
patrick.barnes@standardregister.com wrote:
Well, Michael, tell you what -- the person here who is being vile and
intolerant isn't the believer.
Posting to alt.atheism with the "'my god exists' is a given"
viewpoint is, at the very least, inflammatory, if not downright
nasty.
I am perfectly confident in leaving
this record in the Google archives for any neutral observer who might
come along in the future. They are free to judge which of us is more
reasonable and mature
You're a Christian - that alone is proof of immaturity.
which is representing his side in a better manner.
You're violating the rules of a group to which you're posting.
that's not "a better manner".
FWIW, you're cross posting to alt.global-warming.
And there's a rule there prohibiting the contents of my posts?
A bit off topic, unless Hell is heating up.
And there's a rule against off-topic posts to alt.global-warming?
Only for those who know better. If you're not house-broken...
Oh, I see - Bill's Rule.
<plonk>
--
Al at Webdingers dot com
"They laughed at Newton, they laughed at Einstein, but they also laughed at
Bozo the Clown."
- Carl Sagan
.
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| User: "Al Klein" |
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| Title: Re: SoT Christianity: NC Pastor Sentenced for Fraud, Tax Evasion |
18 Sep 2007 10:18:51 AM |
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On Tue, 18 Sep 2007 07:22:54 -0700,
patrick.barnes@standardregister.com wrote:
On Sep 14, 7:40 pm, Michael Gray <mikeg...@newsguy.com> wrote:
On Thu, 13 Sep 2007 11:48:23 -0700,
"Salvation" makes no sense at all.
It is an incoherent bunch of ad hoc babble.
In your opinion.
Oh derr...
I have yet to have anyone explain it coherently, or have heard of
anyone explained it coherently.
Wanna have a go?
You seem to think that it is a doddle.-
There's a difference between something being coherent and it being
right.
An incoherent explanation can't, by its very nature, be right.
I didn't claim you should believe in salvation if you choose
not to, I'm just saying that it isn't incoherent babble. It is a
clear and internally consistent concept, whether you believe in the
truth of it or not.
So explain it in a coherent manner.
How, if Adam and Eve DIDN'T know the difference between right and
wrong, could they sin? (Sinning is KNOWINGLY doing wrong.)
How, if Adam and Eve DID know the difference between right and wrong,
would it be a sin (or even possible) to "learn" the difference between
right and wrong (which is what "eating of the fruit of the tree of
knowledge or good and evil" means)?
What other possibility is there? Either they did know or they didn't
know.
Coherent explanation here, please:
--
Al at Webdingers dot com
"They laughed at Newton, they laughed at Einstein, but they also laughed at
Bozo the Clown."
- Carl Sagan
.
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