Thank you Libertarius. This is for you! You helped point me in the right direction



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Topic: Religions > Atheism
User: "sharon"
Date: 29 Sep 2003 10:59:55 AM
Object: Thank you Libertarius. This is for you! You helped point me in the right direction
I'm learning so much, more than I've ever known in my life, as I go through
and transcribing these kinds of information. I NEVER KNEW THESE THINGS.
Just last night, I transcribed the info about Servetus and Calvin, which
I've seen you posting so often about.
There's lots of visitors to these articles, people searching for information
on these things. I've found a really neat niche in cyberspace much in part,
thanks to you Libertarius.
*smile* on getting mushy. You're a smart man! Thank you for sharing your
knowledges so often, so generously with people.
this is for you Libertarius --- it's obscene.
http://www.skeptical-christian.net/christian_history/inquisition.html
Nothing could be more pitiable than the fate of the Jews. Many of them,
driven by intolerable persecution, had been led during the fourteenth and
fifteenth centuries to embrace the Christian faith. But their profession was
held under suspicion, and, stigmatized as "New Christians," they were
continually subject to inquisitorial scrutiny. In 1481 the wholesale
sacrifice began. Not less than two thousand were burned during the
administration of Torquemada, and a much larger
number were subjected to lesser punishments." 2 Llorente puts the number of
the burned at a much higher figure. (Histoire de l'Inquisition d'Espagne, i.
279, 280). Hefele, who complains that Llorente misquotes Mariana, says that
this historian reports the number burned in the time of Torquemada as two
thousand, which number was also given by Pulgar, a contemporary of the
inquisitor-general (Der Cardinal Ximenes, pp. 267, 268). The multitude of
the victims at Seville caused the governor at this time to erect the
Quemadero, or burning-place, that is, a large stone platform, set off with
huge statues, which might be permanently serviceable for the burning of
victims. l Llorente, i. 160. In 1492, as the crowning misery for the
persecuted race, all the Jews who would not give up their Jewish faith were
required to leave the kingdom. Indescribable suffering attended their
exodus.2 It is not an immoderate estimate which places the number of the
ex-patriated at 160,000, or 170,000 (Hefele, Der Card. Xim., p. 330). The
officers of the Inquisition were the foremost advocates of this expulsion.
As before stated, the first grand auto de fé for the burning of Spanish
Protestants took place in 1559, and by the year 1570 Protestantism was
substantially exterminated in Spain.
The sum total of the victims of the Spanish Inquisition, from the time of
Torquemada to the year 1809, is given by Llorente, ex-secretary of the
Madrid office, as follows: burnt alive, 31,912; burnt in effigy, 17,659;
otherwise punished, 291,450. 3 Histoire, iv. 271. It is possible that the
first of these estimates is somewhat too large. A suspicion that such is the
case can arise when it is considered that the inquisitors used every art to
secure a recantation, and that a recantation, except of a relapsed person,
ordinarily averted the capital sentence.
Still when writers who had no
motive to exaggerate report that two thousand were burned under the first
inquisitor-general, or that more than four thousand were sent to the stake
in Sevile alone befween 1480 and 1520, it is manifest that the victims of
the extreme penalty were not a small company. The greater measure of
suffering, nevertheless, was not at the stake. The blasted lives and injured
consciences of the vast multitude who were ground by the despotic machinery
of the Inquisition, but escaped sentence of death, represent by far the
larger total of misery.
http://www.skeptical-christian.net/christian_history/wycliffe.html
The most distinguished victim was Sir John Oldcastle, or Lord Cobham. He was
a man of distinction, having served with credit in the French wars. Though
he made no secret of his opinions, respect for his character secured him
comparative freedom from attack during the reign of Henry IV. But under
Henry V. he was adjudged a heretic, and consigned to the fewer. Escaping
thence, he remained concealed several years. A high price was set upon his
head, as he was accused
of being the patron and instigator of the insurrectionary movements which
took place at this time. Whether there was any truth in this charge or not,
it is difficult to determine. Very different verdicts have been rendered by
historians. In any case, all that we know of the man, whether in life or in
the ordeal of martyrdom, favors the conclusion that he was loyal to his
conscience, let his attitude toward his King have been what it may. Having
been apprehended in 1417, he was brought
to London and sentenced to the double punishment of being hanged as a
traitor and burned as a heretic.
"This sentence was literally carried out. He was placed upon a sledge, as if
he had been a traitor of the deepest dye, and thus dragged through the town
to St. Giles's Fields. On arriving there he was taken down from the sledge,
and, immediately falling on his knees, he began to pray for the forgiveness
of his enemies. His prayer ended, he rose, and, addressing the assembled
multitude, warned them to obey God's commands written down in the Bible, and
always to shun such teaching as they saw to be contrary to the life and
example of Christ. He was then suspended between
two gallows by chains, and the funeral pile was kindled beneath him, so that
he was slowly burned. So long as life remained in him, he continued to
praise God, and to commend his soul to His divine keeping." 1 Lechler, chap,
x. § 6
After the death of Lord Cobham no conspicuous leader appeared in the ranks
of the Lollards. While never wholly exterminated, the party was reduced to a
small remnant, which obtained immunity only because of its quietness and
obscurity.
------------------------------
And so "As The Stomach Turns", I continue on my work transcribing on the
soap opera known as the History of the Christian Church.
.

User: "Libertarius"

Title: Re: Thank you Libertarius. This is for you! You helped point me in theright direction 29 Sep 2003 05:24:19 PM
===>Thank YOU.
I am so glad that in some small way I may have helped.
As to the point:
Unfortunately, nothing better illustrates man's inhumanity to
his fellow man than the history of religion and religion-like
ideologies (Nazism, Bolshevism, Maoism, etc.).
The only antidote is LIBERTY.
Libertarius
============
sharon wrote:

I'm learning so much, more than I've ever known in my life, as I go through
and transcribing these kinds of information. I NEVER KNEW THESE THINGS.
Just last night, I transcribed the info about Servetus and Calvin, which
I've seen you posting so often about.

There's lots of visitors to these articles, people searching for information
on these things. I've found a really neat niche in cyberspace much in part,
thanks to you Libertarius.

*smile* on getting mushy. You're a smart man! Thank you for sharing your
knowledges so often, so generously with people.

this is for you Libertarius --- it's obscene.

http://www.skeptical-christian.net/christian_history/inquisition.html

Nothing could be more pitiable than the fate of the Jews. Many of them,
driven by intolerable persecution, had been led during the fourteenth and
fifteenth centuries to embrace the Christian faith. But their profession was
held under suspicion, and, stigmatized as "New Christians," they were
continually subject to inquisitorial scrutiny. In 1481 the wholesale
sacrifice began. Not less than two thousand were burned during the
administration of Torquemada, and a much larger
number were subjected to lesser punishments." 2 Llorente puts the number of
the burned at a much higher figure. (Histoire de l'Inquisition d'Espagne, i.
279, 280). Hefele, who complains that Llorente misquotes Mariana, says that
this historian reports the number burned in the time of Torquemada as two
thousand, which number was also given by Pulgar, a contemporary of the
inquisitor-general (Der Cardinal Ximenes, pp. 267, 268). The multitude of
the victims at Seville caused the governor at this time to erect the
Quemadero, or burning-place, that is, a large stone platform, set off with
huge statues, which might be permanently serviceable for the burning of
victims. l Llorente, i. 160. In 1492, as the crowning misery for the
persecuted race, all the Jews who would not give up their Jewish faith were
required to leave the kingdom. Indescribable suffering attended their
exodus.2 It is not an immoderate estimate which places the number of the
ex-patriated at 160,000, or 170,000 (Hefele, Der Card. Xim., p. 330). The
officers of the Inquisition were the foremost advocates of this expulsion.

As before stated, the first grand auto de fé for the burning of Spanish
Protestants took place in 1559, and by the year 1570 Protestantism was
substantially exterminated in Spain.

The sum total of the victims of the Spanish Inquisition, from the time of
Torquemada to the year 1809, is given by Llorente, ex-secretary of the
Madrid office, as follows: burnt alive, 31,912; burnt in effigy, 17,659;
otherwise punished, 291,450. 3 Histoire, iv. 271. It is possible that the
first of these estimates is somewhat too large. A suspicion that such is the
case can arise when it is considered that the inquisitors used every art to
secure a recantation, and that a recantation, except of a relapsed person,
ordinarily averted the capital sentence.

Still when writers who had no
motive to exaggerate report that two thousand were burned under the first
inquisitor-general, or that more than four thousand were sent to the stake
in Sevile alone befween 1480 and 1520, it is manifest that the victims of
the extreme penalty were not a small company. The greater measure of
suffering, nevertheless, was not at the stake. The blasted lives and injured
consciences of the vast multitude who were ground by the despotic machinery
of the Inquisition, but escaped sentence of death, represent by far the
larger total of misery.

http://www.skeptical-christian.net/christian_history/wycliffe.html

The most distinguished victim was Sir John Oldcastle, or Lord Cobham. He was
a man of distinction, having served with credit in the French wars. Though
he made no secret of his opinions, respect for his character secured him
comparative freedom from attack during the reign of Henry IV. But under
Henry V. he was adjudged a heretic, and consigned to the fewer. Escaping
thence, he remained concealed several years. A high price was set upon his
head, as he was accused
of being the patron and instigator of the insurrectionary movements which
took place at this time. Whether there was any truth in this charge or not,
it is difficult to determine. Very different verdicts have been rendered by
historians. In any case, all that we know of the man, whether in life or in
the ordeal of martyrdom, favors the conclusion that he was loyal to his
conscience, let his attitude toward his King have been what it may. Having
been apprehended in 1417, he was brought
to London and sentenced to the double punishment of being hanged as a
traitor and burned as a heretic.

"This sentence was literally carried out. He was placed upon a sledge, as if
he had been a traitor of the deepest dye, and thus dragged through the town
to St. Giles's Fields. On arriving there he was taken down from the sledge,
and, immediately falling on his knees, he began to pray for the forgiveness
of his enemies. His prayer ended, he rose, and, addressing the assembled
multitude, warned them to obey God's commands written down in the Bible, and
always to shun such teaching as they saw to be contrary to the life and
example of Christ. He was then suspended between
two gallows by chains, and the funeral pile was kindled beneath him, so that
he was slowly burned. So long as life remained in him, he continued to
praise God, and to commend his soul to His divine keeping." 1 Lechler, chap,
x. § 6

After the death of Lord Cobham no conspicuous leader appeared in the ranks
of the Lollards. While never wholly exterminated, the party was reduced to a
small remnant, which obtained immunity only because of its quietness and
obscurity.

------------------------------

And so "As The Stomach Turns", I continue on my work transcribing on the
soap opera known as the History of the Christian Church.

.


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