Religions > Atheism > The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids.
| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"J Young" |
| Date: |
06 Nov 2005 05:28:00 AM |
| Object: |
The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids. |
The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids.
The Catholic Church has been involved for years in Aids work at local
level through its various projects. In 1999 the SACBC Aids Office was
formed. It has grown exponentially, and is now recognised as a leading role
player in South Africa's response to Aids.
The office cooperates with the various Catholic projects. Through
extensive training, capacity building, resource provision and mentoring,
this response has been built into a network of more than 140 projects,
providing home based care, terminal care, orphan care, advocacy and
education to the most affected communities in the country.
.The Church is one of the few institutions with the moral authority to
make a difference. Several programmes for youth are in operation. Education
for Life was adopted by the SACBC as the chief prevention programme for
youth. It stresses long term abstinence, and fidelity to one partner. In the
various dioceses intensive training of trainers and follow-up courses take
place. The momentum is maintained through the establishment of youth alive
clubs.
It is in the field of caring for the sick and dying, that the Church
has made its most significant contribution. Over the past three years, its
network has grown to include more than 40 home-based care programmes in
every part of the country. Some of these (like the Caring Network in Cape
Town) have been in existence for years.
With the advent of Aids, they changed their focus. Caring Network
alone has more than 100 caregivers, each one looking after five patients in
the poorest areas of the city. Others, like Zanethemba in Newcastle,
northern KwaZulu-Natal, are new, but are already providing such good
services that the local state hospitals have entered into partnership with
them, providing them with training and medications, and referring patients
to them.
The importance of good nutrition in caring for Aids patients is beyond
dispute. Most home-based care programmes are responding creatively to the
challenges. In King Williams Town, Empilisweni has started successful pig
and chicken farming cooperatives for people with Aids.
Involvement in home based care, has resulted in caring for orphans.
Care programmes look after the parents, until they pass away. After that,
the orphans are left behind, with nobody else to turn to but the caregivers.
In addition, there are more than 20 programmes caring exclusively for
orphans. The tragedy is compounded by the fact that HIV positive orphans are
often shunned by their relatives.
Through its many home-based care and hospice programmes, and clinics,
the Church is providing treatment for opportunistic infections.
Prevention of Mother to Child Transmission Programmes operate at
Catholic sites in KwaZulu/Natal, and North West Province. Because of this,
the Church had such programmes in place before the government.
The Church is also pioneering the use of anti-retrovirals. Nazareth
House in Cape Town is the first orphan care institution in the country to
put all its HIV positive orphans on paediatric anti-retrovirals. At present,
the Aids Office is working on a programme to implement anti-retroviral
therapy in at least 13 sites.
Advocacy is a priority. In acknowledgement of its leadership in this
field, the Aids Office was co-opted to represent the faith sector on the
executive committee of the Treatment Action Campaign (TAC).
With the Catholic Parliamentary Liaison Office and the SACBC's Justice
and Peace department, the AIDS Office is working for legal reform regarding
children's rights, such as maintenance grants and free education for orphans
and disability grants for the sick.
The office has taken its work down to grassroots level, by
implementing a vigorous advocacy training programme. People are trained to
lobby for better access to treatment, government grants and other services.
In various dioceses, programmes are also in place to assist those who
qualify, to obtain the necessary documentation, and then to get grants.
Although many Church projects do outstanding work, they often lack the
capacity to write proposals, write reports and manage finances properly. The
Office has identified shortcomings, and strengthens projects' capacity in
those areas.
According Vatican data, the Church is responsible for about 25% of all
service provision to people with Aids worldwide. In South Africa, the Church
certainly has risen to Christ's challenge to care for the suffering, the
sick and the orphans.
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| User: "Shark school missionaries" |
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| Title: Re: The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids. |
06 Nov 2005 09:43:32 AM |
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"J Young" <youngopinions@aol.com> suddenly spluttered:
It is in the field of caring for the sick and dying, that the Church
has made its most significant contribution.
And every night they get down on their knees and give thanks to God
for the gift of human suffering. Canon fodder.
------------------------------------------------
Conflict over the exact will/purpose/nature of God cannot ever be
resolved, since there are no facts to go on.
D Silverman FLAHN, SMLAHN
AA #2208
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| User: "Colin Day" |
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| Title: Re: The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids. |
06 Nov 2005 05:06:54 PM |
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Shark school missionaries wrote:
"J Young" <youngopinions@aol.com> suddenly spluttered:
It is in the field of caring for the sick and dying, that the Church
has made its most significant contribution.
And every night they get down on their knees and give thanks to God
for the gift of human suffering. Canon fodder.
Canon fodder? What, does the Church need more saints?
------------------------------------------------
Conflict over the exact will/purpose/nature of God cannot ever be
resolved, since there are no facts to go on.
D Silverman FLAHN, SMLAHN
AA #2208
Colin Day aa #1500
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| User: "Peacenik" |
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| Title: Re: The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids. |
06 Nov 2005 12:51:27 PM |
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"J Young" <youngopinions@aol.com> wrote in message
news:Oa6dndqUYYJDCfDenZ2dnUVZ_tWdnZ2d@giganews.com...
The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids.
Does that mean they're going to finally start advocating condom use?
Wishful thinking...
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| User: "Hugh Betcha" |
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| Title: Re: The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids. |
07 Nov 2005 03:31:47 AM |
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The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids.
Does that mean they're going to finally start advocating condom use?
Wishful thinking...
Advocating condom use advocates forniction. It's a contradictory
position for the Church to be in; teaching chastity while at the same
time telling it's members how to fornicate safely. On the other hand,
The Church's formula for AIDS prevention (chastity) is 100% effective.
That beats condoms, AND it's a long term solution.
H.
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| User: "Andrealphus" |
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| Title: Re: The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids. |
07 Nov 2005 03:39:00 AM |
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In News 1131334307.187592.198740@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com,, Hugh Betcha
at gemond@canada.com, typed this:
The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids.
Does that mean they're going to finally start advocating condom use?
Wishful thinking...
Advocating condom use advocates forniction. It's a contradictory
position for the Church to be in; teaching chastity while at the same
time telling it's members how to fornicate safely. On the other hand,
The Church's formula for AIDS prevention (chastity) is 100% effective.
That beats condoms, AND it's a long term solution.
Unfortunately, it works 0% of the time. You people can't even keep your
priests chaste, much less control your congregations. Net result? Higher
instances of AIDS.
--
Question with boldness even the existence of god; because if there be
one, he must more approve the homage of reason than that of blindfolded
fear. - Thomas Jefferson
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| User: "Dennis Kemmerer" |
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| Title: Re: The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids. |
07 Nov 2005 04:06:51 AM |
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"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote in message
news:o%zbf.5219$2y.669@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
In News 1131334307.187592.198740@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com,, Hugh
Betcha at gemond@canada.com, typed this:
The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids.
Does that mean they're going to finally start advocating condom use?
Wishful thinking...
Advocating condom use advocates forniction. It's a contradictory
position for the Church to be in; teaching chastity while at the same
time telling it's members how to fornicate safely. On the other hand,
The Church's formula for AIDS prevention (chastity) is 100% effective.
That beats condoms, AND it's a long term solution.
Unfortunately, it works 0% of the time. You people can't even keep your
priests chaste, much less control your congregations. Net result?
Higher instances of AIDS.
Actually, I heard that the success rate of 'abstinence only' is about 12%.
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| User: "Andrealphus" |
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| Title: Re: The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids. |
07 Nov 2005 11:11:48 AM |
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In News vpAbf.10109$D13.9472@newssvr11.news.prodigy.com,, Dennis Kemmerer at
dk@suespammers.org, typed this:
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote in message
news:o%zbf.5219$2y.669@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
In News 1131334307.187592.198740@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com,, Hugh
Betcha at gemond@canada.com, typed this:
The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on
Aids.
Does that mean they're going to finally start advocating condom
use? Wishful thinking...
Advocating condom use advocates forniction. It's a contradictory
position for the Church to be in; teaching chastity while at the
same time telling it's members how to fornicate safely. On the
other hand, The Church's formula for AIDS prevention (chastity) is
100% effective. That beats condoms, AND it's a long term solution.
Unfortunately, it works 0% of the time. You people can't even keep
your priests chaste, much less control your congregations. Net
result? Higher instances of AIDS.
Actually, I heard that the success rate of 'abstinence only' is about
12%.
That's higher than I thought it would be.
--
Question with boldness even the existence of god; because if there be
one, he must more approve the homage of reason than that of blindfolded
fear. – Thomas Jefferson
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| User: "The Rock Is Peter" |
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| Title: Re: The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids. |
07 Nov 2005 04:10:10 AM |
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Andrealphus wrote:
In News 1131334307.187592.198740@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com,, Hugh Betcha
at gemond@canada.com, typed this:
The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids.
Does that mean they're going to finally start advocating condom use?
Wishful thinking...
Advocating condom use advocates forniction. It's a contradictory
position for the Church to be in; teaching chastity while at the same
time telling it's members how to fornicate safely. On the other hand,
The Church's formula for AIDS prevention (chastity) is 100% effective.
That beats condoms, AND it's a long term solution.
Unfortunately, it works 0% of the time.
Well it has to actually be done to be effective.
Having a bottle of medicine doesn't make you well. You have to actually
take it.
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| User: "No One" |
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| Title: Re: The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids. |
07 Nov 2005 06:53:06 AM |
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"The Rock Is Peter" <TheRockIsPeter@jesusanswers.com> writes:
Andrealphus wrote:
In News 1131334307.187592.198740@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com,, Hugh Betcha
at gemond@canada.com, typed this:
Advocating condom use advocates forniction. It's a contradictory
position for the Church to be in; teaching chastity while at the same
time telling it's members how to fornicate safely. On the other hand,
The Church's formula for AIDS prevention (chastity) is 100% effective.
That beats condoms, AND it's a long term solution.
Unfortunately, it works 0% of the time.
Well it has to actually be done to be effective. Having a bottle of
medicine doesn't make you well. You have to actually take it.
This reminds me of a cartoon I saw years ago, where a doctor was
examining a buxom babe. The doctor, pretending to take her
protestations of chasity seriously, was looking out the window saying,
"The last time this happened, a star appeared in the east."
The way I see it, handing out condoms while preaching chasity is no
different than the sentiment expressed by the World War I song, "Praise
the Lord but pass the ammunition."
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| User: "Andrealphus" |
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| Title: Re: The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids. |
07 Nov 2005 11:12:44 AM |
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In News 1131336610.297373.124360@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com,, The Rock Is
Peter at TheRockIsPeter@jesusanswers.com, typed this:
Andrealphus wrote:
In News 1131334307.187592.198740@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com,, Hugh
Betcha at gemond@canada.com, typed this:
The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on
Aids.
Does that mean they're going to finally start advocating condom
use?
Wishful thinking...
Advocating condom use advocates forniction. It's a contradictory
position for the Church to be in; teaching chastity while at the
same time telling it's members how to fornicate safely. On the
other hand, The Church's formula for AIDS prevention (chastity) is
100% effective. That beats condoms, AND it's a long term solution.
Unfortunately, it works 0% of the time.
Well it has to actually be done to be effective.
Which is the point. They can't even keep their priests chaste, much less
their congregation.
--
Question with boldness even the existence of god; because if there be
one, he must more approve the homage of reason than that of blindfolded
fear. - Thomas Jefferson
.
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| User: "€€R.L.Measures" |
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| Title: Re: The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids. |
08 Nov 2005 11:41:08 AM |
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In article <MEGbf.5915$m81.559@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News 1131336610.297373.124360@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com,, The Rock Is
Peter at TheRockIsPeter@jesusanswers.com, typed this:
Andrealphus wrote:
In News 1131334307.187592.198740@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com,, Hugh
Betcha at gemond@canada.com, typed this:
The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on
Aids.
Does that mean they're going to finally start advocating condom
use?
Wishful thinking...
Advocating condom use advocates forniction. It's a contradictory
position for the Church to be in; teaching chastity while at the
same time telling it's members how to fornicate safely. On the
other hand, The Church's formula for AIDS prevention (chastity) is
100% effective. That beats condoms, AND it's a long term solution.
Unfortunately, it works 0% of the time.
Well it has to actually be done to be effective.
Which is the point. They can't even keep their priests chaste, much less
their congregation.
• If chaste is not doing It with women, the one true Church is
apparently doing a pretty good job.
--
€ R.L.Measures, 805-386-3734, www.somis.org
remove _ from e-mail adr
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| User: "Andrealphus" |
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| Title: Re: The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids. |
08 Nov 2005 12:24:31 PM |
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In News r_-0811050341090001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at r_@somis.org,
typed this:
In article <MEGbf.5915$m81.559@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News 1131336610.297373.124360@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com,, The
Rock Is Peter at TheRockIsPeter@jesusanswers.com, typed this:
Andrealphus wrote:
In News 1131334307.187592.198740@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com,,
Hugh Betcha at gemond@canada.com, typed this:
The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on
Aids.
Does that mean they're going to finally start advocating condom
use?
Wishful thinking...
Advocating condom use advocates forniction. It's a contradictory
position for the Church to be in; teaching chastity while at the
same time telling it's members how to fornicate safely. On the
other hand, The Church's formula for AIDS prevention (chastity) is
100% effective. That beats condoms, AND it's a long term solution.
Unfortunately, it works 0% of the time.
Well it has to actually be done to be effective.
Which is the point. They can't even keep their priests chaste,
much less their congregation.
• If chaste is not doing It with women, the one true Church is
apparently doing a pretty good job.
True, I suppose it does depend on one's definitions...
"I did not have sexual relations with that woman..."
William Jefferson Clinton
--
Question with boldness even the existence of god; because if there be
one, he must more approve the homage of reason than that of blindfolded
fear. – Thomas Jefferson
.
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| User: "€€R.L.Measures" |
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| Title: Re: The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids. |
08 Nov 2005 11:33:42 PM |
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In article <3O0cf.6349$m81.101@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-0811050341090001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at r_@somis.org,
typed this:
In article <MEGbf.5915$m81.559@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News 1131336610.297373.124360@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com,, The
Rock Is Peter at TheRockIsPeter@jesusanswers.com, typed this:
Andrealphus wrote:
In News 1131334307.187592.198740@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com,,
Hugh Betcha at gemond@canada.com, typed this:
The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on
Aids.
Does that mean they're going to finally start advocating condom
use?
Wishful thinking...
Advocating condom use advocates forniction. It's a contradictory
position for the Church to be in; teaching chastity while at the
same time telling it's members how to fornicate safely. On the
other hand, The Church's formula for AIDS prevention (chastity) is
100% effective. That beats condoms, AND it's a long term solution.
Unfortunately, it works 0% of the time.
Well it has to actually be done to be effective.
Which is the point. They can't even keep their priests chaste,
much less their congregation.
• If chaste is not doing It with women, the one true Church is
apparently doing a pretty good job.
True, I suppose it does depend on one's definitions...
"I did not have sexual relations with that woman..."
William Jefferson Clinton
• If only Wild Bill had said: I did not have coitus with that woman.
--
€ R.L.Measures, 805-386-3734, www.somis.org
remove _ from e-mail adr
.
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| User: "Andrealphus" |
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| Title: Re: The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids. |
09 Nov 2005 12:57:23 AM |
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In News r_-0811051533420001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at r_@somis.org,
typed this:
In article <3O0cf.6349$m81.101@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-0811050341090001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
In article <MEGbf.5915$m81.559@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News 1131336610.297373.124360@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com,, The
Rock Is Peter at TheRockIsPeter@jesusanswers.com, typed this:
Andrealphus wrote:
In News 1131334307.187592.198740@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com,,
Hugh Betcha at gemond@canada.com, typed this:
The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on
Aids.
Does that mean they're going to finally start advocating condom
use?
Wishful thinking...
Advocating condom use advocates forniction. It's a contradictory
position for the Church to be in; teaching chastity while at the
same time telling it's members how to fornicate safely. On the
other hand, The Church's formula for AIDS prevention (chastity)
is 100% effective. That beats condoms, AND it's a long term
solution.
Unfortunately, it works 0% of the time.
Well it has to actually be done to be effective.
Which is the point. They can't even keep their priests chaste,
much less their congregation.
• If chaste is not doing It with women, the one true Church is
apparently doing a pretty good job.
True, I suppose it does depend on one's definitions...
"I did not have sexual relations with that woman..."
William Jefferson Clinton
• If only Wild Bill had said: I did not have coitus with that woman.
Well, hindsight and all... :c)
--
Question with boldness even the existence of god; because if there be
one, he must more approve the homage of reason than that of blindfolded
fear. – Thomas Jefferson
.
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| User: "€€R.L.Measures" |
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| Title: Re: The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids. |
09 Nov 2005 10:46:01 AM |
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In article <TPbcf.6915$AS6.5912@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-0811051533420001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at r_@somis.org,
typed this:
...
Which is the point. They can't even keep their priests chaste,
much less their congregation.
• If chaste is not doing It with women, the one true Church is
apparently doing a pretty good job.
True, I suppose it does depend on one's definitions...
"I did not have sexual relations with that woman..."
William Jefferson Clinton
• If only Wild Bill had said: I did not have coitus with that woman.
Well, hindsight and all... :c)
• All that adoo over a knob job.
--
€ R.L.Measures, 805-386-3734, www.somis.org
remove _ from e-mail adr
.
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| User: "Andrealphus" |
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| Title: Re: The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids. |
10 Nov 2005 03:20:56 AM |
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In News r_-0911050246010001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at r_@somis.org,
typed this:
In article <TPbcf.6915$AS6.5912@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-0811051533420001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
...
Which is the point. They can't even keep their priests chaste,
much less their congregation.
• If chaste is not doing It with women, the one true Church is
apparently doing a pretty good job.
True, I suppose it does depend on one's definitions...
"I did not have sexual relations with that woman..."
William Jefferson Clinton
• If only Wild Bill had said: I did not have coitus with that
woman.
Well, hindsight and all... :c)
• All that adoo over a knob job.
Well, perjury is perjury I suppose, even if it is about getting a bj... It
just seems rather trivial in comparison to current events.
--
Question with boldness even the existence of god; because if there be
one, he must more approve the homage of reason than that of blindfolded
fear. – Thomas Jefferson
.
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| User: "• Ninure Saunders" |
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| Title: (!) The Most Acceptable Prejudice |
10 Nov 2005 02:17:37 PM |
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In article <s0zcf.6429$2y.5773@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
(!) The Most Acceptable Prejudice
Sightings 11/10/05
The Most Acceptable Prejudice
-- Jon Pahl
One sad trend in the current controversy over pedophilia in the church is
that it has occasioned yet another rank of people of privilege in America
to represent themselves as victims. These mostly white, mostly male,
mostly well-off Roman Catholic leaders have taken to claiming
anti-Catholic "prejudice" -- and are doing so as a way of defending
against inexcusable crimes. Let's cut through this smokescreen, without
escalating the moral panic about pedophilia: It is prejudice against
children, and not Catholics, that is operative in this controversy.
Within the past five years, two Catholic scholars -- Philip Jenkins and
Mark S. Massa -- have written large books contending that anti-Catholicism
is "the last acceptable prejudice" in the United States. I grant them
their point. Historically, Catholics have been targets of suspicion and
violence in America, and some stereotypes still endure. Unfortunately, the
pedophilia uproar has brought these stereotypes to the surface in new
forms, despite the desire on the part of most Catholics to confront the
pedophilia problem.
And surely it is important to keep in mind that Catholic schools -- for
all the stereotypes sometimes associated with them -- have been crucial
agencies of intergenerational education and spiritual formation in
America. Through them, young people have discovered their voices and
vocations in service to the common good. Catholic congregations -- like
other communities of faith -- remain places in American culture where
generations can meet informally for conversation, mentoring, and mutual
learning. And Catholic social services -- like other faith-based charities
and advocacy groups -- have potential to provide much in the way of
front-line service to the poor and powerless.
But on September 21, 2005, the same day that a Philadelphia Grand Jury
released a 671-page report documenting decades of abuse of children by
priests, and a systemic cover-up, across the Philadelphia Archdiocese, the
Archdiocese released (under the authorship of its legal counsel) a 76-page
reply to the report, fraught with defensive evasions. While it points out,
rightly, that Catholics generally want to solve the problems of child
abuse, inside the church and without, it also claims that the Grand Jury
proceedings betrayed an "anti-Catholic" bias.
The potential of Catholic agencies to promote the common good is undercut
when certain Catholics claim to be targets of prejudice, powerless
victims. And denying the possession of power by asserting a pseudo-victim
status amounts to obscuring, even disclaiming, the relations of domination
at work in abuses against children.
As is well known, acts of pedophilia are not only "sex crimes." They are,
even more, exercises of power on the body of a young person. These acts
are often compared, rightly, to rape. But there are other analogies.
One example is found in corporal punishment. In America, a parent may
legally assault his or her child. An act that would be a crime when
perpetrated against an adult is, when committed against a child (and often
on or near their sexual organs), called "discipline." In some circles,
these acts of assault are positively praised, and their relationship to
sexual abuse and power over the young denied.
Such intimate violence is only one form that prejudice against the young
can take. Osama bin Laden and George W. Bush have both claimed to be on
the side of "innocent children." Yet Iraqi children have been the victims
of both suicide bombings and U.S. strategic military assaults.
And here at home, children will surely suffer from skewed federal
priorities. Common sense suggests that "No Child Left Behind" is nothing
more than empty rhetoric, when we still have to pay for the war on terror,
for hurricane relief, and continue to plan tax cuts for the wealthiest
citizens in America. Such logic defies rationality and reveals prejudice.
In the context of Christianity, what makes such expressions of prejudice
against the young especially scandalous is that they contradict the model
of power-with-others manifest in the life of Jesus. Opposing the age bias
of his own day, Jesus welcomed children into his presence. He called for
"child-like faith" among his disciples. He practiced only the power of
love.
Pedophilia is but one example of adults exercising power over children.
And when adults evade accusations of pedophilia by claiming victim status,
they deny the responsibility to exercise power with (or on behalf of)
children in ways that might actually address the systemic issues impeding
young peoples' fulfillment.
How truly sad, then, that a few Catholic priests perpetrated abusive acts,
a few officials covered up those acts, and a few Roman Catholic leaders
have tried to excuse them by appealing to victim status. What they were
all doing instead was deepening the hold of the most acceptable prejudice
in American culture: systematic and systemic abuse of the youngest and
weakest members of our society.
References:
The Grand Jury Report can be found at:
http://www.bishop-accountability.org/pa_philadelphia/Philly_GJ_report.htm.
The Archdiocese of Philadelphia's responses can be read at:
http://www.archdiocese-phl.org/grandjury.htm.
Jon Pahl is Professor of the History of Christianity in North America at
the Lutheran Theological Seminary at Philadelphia, and author of Youth
Ministry in Modern America: 1930-the Present.
----------
Sightings comes from the Martin Marty Center at the University of Chicago
Divinity School.
Submissions policy
Sightings welcomes submissions of 500 to 750 words in length that seek to
illuminate and interpret the forces of faith in a pluralist society.
Previous columns give a good indication of the topical range and tone for
acceptable essays. The editor also encourages new approaches to issues
related to religion and public life.
Attribution
Columns may be quoted or republished in full, with attribution to the
author of the column, Sightings, and the Martin Marty Center at the
University of Chicago Divinity School.
Contact information
Please send all inquiries, comments, and submissions to Jeremy Biles,
managing editor of Sightings, at sightings-admin@listhost.uchicago.edu.
Subscribe, unsubscribe, or manage your subscription at the Sightings
subscription page.
----------
-In News r_-0911050246010001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at r_@somis.org,
-typed this:
-
-> In article <TPbcf.6915$AS6.5912@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
-> "Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
->
->> In News r_-0811051533420001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at
->> r_@somis.org, typed this:
->>
->>> ...
->>>>>> Which is the point. They can't even keep their priests chaste,
->>>>>> much less their congregation.
->>>>>
->>>>> • If chaste is not doing It with women, the one true Church is
->>>>> apparently doing a pretty good job.
->>>>
->>>> True, I suppose it does depend on one's definitions...
->>>>
->>>> "I did not have sexual relations with that woman..."
->>>>
->>>> William Jefferson Clinton
->>>
->>> • If only Wild Bill had said: I did not have coitus with that
->>> woman.
->>
->> Well, hindsight and all... :c)
->
-> • All that adoo over a knob job.
-
-Well, perjury is perjury I suppose, even if it is about getting a bj... It
-just seems rather trivial in comparison to current events.
-
-
---
-Question with boldness even the existence of god; because if there be
-one, he must more approve the homage of reason than that of blindfolded
-fear. – Thomas Jefferson
--
Pax Christi,
• Ninure Saunders aka Rainbow Christian
Jesus is my Shepherd and He knows I'm Gay
http://Ninure-Saunders.tk
My Yahoo Group
http://Ninure.tk
Universal Fellowship of Metropolitan Community Churches
http://www.MCCchurch.org
The Bible Site - help provide free scripture
http://www.thebiblesite.org
To send e-mail, remove nohate from address
.
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| User: "€€R.L.Measures" |
|
| Title: Re: The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids. |
10 Nov 2005 11:24:11 AM |
|
|
In article <s0zcf.6429$2y.5773@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-0911050246010001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at r_@somis.org,
typed this:
In article <TPbcf.6915$AS6.5912@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-0811051533420001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
...
Which is the point. They can't even keep their priests chaste,
much less their congregation.
• If chaste is not doing It with women, the one true Church is
apparently doing a pretty good job.
True, I suppose it does depend on one's definitions...
"I did not have sexual relations with that woman..."
William Jefferson Clinton
• If only Wild Bill had said: I did not have coitus with that
woman.
Well, hindsight and all... :c)
• All that adoo over a knob job.
Well, perjury is perjury I suppose, even if it is about getting a bj... It
just seems rather trivial in comparison to current events.
• What if Monica had been a CIA undercover operative?
--
€ R.L.Measures, 805-386-3734, www.somis.org
remove _ from e-mail adr
.
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| User: "Andrealphus" |
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| Title: Re: The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids. |
10 Nov 2005 12:27:26 PM |
|
|
In News r_-1011050324110001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at r_@somis.org,
typed this:
In article <s0zcf.6429$2y.5773@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-0911050246010001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
In article <TPbcf.6915$AS6.5912@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-0811051533420001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
...
Which is the point. They can't even keep their priests
chaste, much less their congregation.
• If chaste is not doing It with women, the one true Church
is apparently doing a pretty good job.
True, I suppose it does depend on one's definitions...
"I did not have sexual relations with that woman..."
William Jefferson Clinton
• If only Wild Bill had said: I did not have coitus with that
woman.
Well, hindsight and all... :c)
• All that adoo over a knob job.
Well, perjury is perjury I suppose, even if it is about getting a
bj... It just seems rather trivial in comparison to current events.
• What if Monica had been a CIA undercover operative?
Maybe she was... :c)
--
Question with boldness even the existence of god; because if there be
one, he must more approve the homage of reason than that of blindfolded
fear. – Thomas Jefferson
.
|
|
|
| User: "€€R.L.Measures" |
|
| Title: Re: The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids. |
11 Nov 2005 02:21:37 AM |
|
|
In article <O0Hcf.7135$m81.6140@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-1011050324110001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at r_@somis.org,
typed this:
In article <s0zcf.6429$2y.5773@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-0911050246010001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
In article <TPbcf.6915$AS6.5912@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-0811051533420001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
...
Which is the point. They can't even keep their priests
chaste, much less their congregation.
• If chaste is not doing It with women, the one true Church
is apparently doing a pretty good job.
True, I suppose it does depend on one's definitions...
"I did not have sexual relations with that woman..."
William Jefferson Clinton
• If only Wild Bill had said: I did not have coitus with that
woman.
Well, hindsight and all... :c)
• All that adoo over a knob job.
Well, perjury is perjury I suppose, even if it is about getting a
bj... It just seems rather trivial in comparison to current events.
• What if Monica had been a CIA undercover operative?
Maybe she was... :c)
• Are you suggesting that she specialized in operating undercovers --
perhaps in the Lincoln Bedroom?
--
€ R.L.Measures, 805-386-3734, www.somis.org
remove _ from e-mail adr
.
|
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| User: "Andrealphus" |
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| Title: Re: The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids. |
11 Nov 2005 02:58:47 AM |
|
|
In News r_-1011051821370001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at r_@somis.org,
typed this:
In article <O0Hcf.7135$m81.6140@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-1011050324110001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
In article <s0zcf.6429$2y.5773@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-0911050246010001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
In article <TPbcf.6915$AS6.5912@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-0811051533420001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
...
Which is the point. They can't even keep their priests
chaste, much less their congregation.
• If chaste is not doing It with women, the one true Church
is apparently doing a pretty good job.
True, I suppose it does depend on one's definitions...
"I did not have sexual relations with that woman..."
William Jefferson Clinton
• If only Wild Bill had said: I did not have coitus with that
woman.
Well, hindsight and all... :c)
• All that adoo over a knob job.
Well, perjury is perjury I suppose, even if it is about getting a
bj... It just seems rather trivial in comparison to current
events.
• What if Monica had been a CIA undercover operative?
Maybe she was... :c)
• Are you suggesting that she specialized in operating undercovers --
perhaps in the Lincoln Bedroom?
Well, if she was, she wasn't outed.
--
Question with boldness even the existence of god; because if there be
one, he must more approve the homage of reason than that of blindfolded
fear. – Thomas Jefferson
.
|
|
|
| User: "€€R.L.Measures" |
|
| Title: Re: The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids. |
11 Nov 2005 11:24:57 AM |
|
|
In article <HNTcf.6953$2y.918@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-1011051821370001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at r_@somis.org,
typed this:
In article <O0Hcf.7135$m81.6140@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-1011050324110001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
In article <s0zcf.6429$2y.5773@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-0911050246010001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
In article <TPbcf.6915$AS6.5912@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-0811051533420001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
...
Which is the point. They can't even keep their priests
chaste, much less their congregation.
• If chaste is not doing It with women, the one true Church
is apparently doing a pretty good job.
True, I suppose it does depend on one's definitions...
"I did not have sexual relations with that woman..."
William Jefferson Clinton
• If only Wild Bill had said: I did not have coitus with that
woman.
Well, hindsight and all... :c)
• All that adoo over a knob job.
Well, perjury is perjury I suppose, even if it is about getting a
bj... It just seems rather trivial in comparison to current
events.
• What if Monica had been a CIA undercover operative?
Maybe she was... :c)
• Are you suggesting that she specialized in operating undercovers --
perhaps in the Lincoln Bedroom?
Well, if she was, she wasn't outed.
• The danger was being offed by Hillary.
--
€ R.L.Measures, 805-386-3734, www.somis.org
remove _ from e-mail adr
.
|
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| User: "Andrealphus" |
|
| Title: Re: The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids. |
11 Nov 2005 12:18:16 PM |
|
|
In News r_-1111050324570001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at r_@somis.org,
typed this:
In article <HNTcf.6953$2y.918@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-1011051821370001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
In article <O0Hcf.7135$m81.6140@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-1011050324110001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
In article <s0zcf.6429$2y.5773@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-0911050246010001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
In article
<TPbcf.6915$AS6.5912@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-0811051533420001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
...
Which is the point. They can't even keep their priests
chaste, much less their congregation.
• If chaste is not doing It with women, the one true
Church is apparently doing a pretty good job.
True, I suppose it does depend on one's definitions...
"I did not have sexual relations with that woman..."
William Jefferson Clinton
• If only Wild Bill had said: I did not have coitus with
that woman.
Well, hindsight and all... :c)
• All that adoo over a knob job.
Well, perjury is perjury I suppose, even if it is about getting a
bj... It just seems rather trivial in comparison to current
events.
• What if Monica had been a CIA undercover operative?
Maybe she was... :c)
• Are you suggesting that she specialized in operating undercovers
-- perhaps in the Lincoln Bedroom?
Well, if she was, she wasn't outed.
• The danger was being offed by Hillary.
Hillary was too busy chucking lamps at his head. Shame she missed.
--
Question with boldness even the existence of god; because if there be
one, he must more approve the homage of reason than that of blindfolded
fear. – Thomas Jefferson
.
|
|
|
| User: "€€R.L.Measures" |
|
| Title: Re: The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids. |
11 Nov 2005 05:16:01 PM |
|
|
In article <c_%cf.7796$AS6.2200@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-1111050324570001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at r_@somis.org,
typed this:
In article <HNTcf.6953$2y.918@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-1011051821370001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
In article <O0Hcf.7135$m81.6140@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-1011050324110001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
In article <s0zcf.6429$2y.5773@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-0911050246010001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
In article
<TPbcf.6915$AS6.5912@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-0811051533420001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
...
Which is the point. They can't even keep their priests
chaste, much less their congregation.
• If chaste is not doing It with women, the one true
Church is apparently doing a pretty good job.
True, I suppose it does depend on one's definitions...
"I did not have sexual relations with that woman..."
William Jefferson Clinton
• If only Wild Bill had said: I did not have coitus with
that woman.
Well, hindsight and all... :c)
• All that adoo over a knob job.
Well, perjury is perjury I suppose, even if it is about getting a
bj... It just seems rather trivial in comparison to current
events.
• What if Monica had been a CIA undercover operative?
Maybe she was... :c)
• Are you suggesting that she specialized in operating undercovers
-- perhaps in the Lincoln Bedroom?
Well, if she was, she wasn't outed.
• The danger was being offed by Hillary.
Hillary was too busy chucking lamps at his head. Shame she missed.
• Hillary was chucking, Monica was sucking. There oughta be a movie.
--
€ R.L.Measures, 805-386-3734, www.somis.org
remove _ from e-mail adr
.
|
|
|
| User: "Andrealphus" |
|
| Title: Re: The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids. |
12 Nov 2005 06:11:33 AM |
|
|
In News r_-1111050916010001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at r_@somis.org,
typed this:
In article <c_%cf.7796$AS6.2200@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-1111050324570001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
In article <HNTcf.6953$2y.918@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-1011051821370001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
In article <O0Hcf.7135$m81.6140@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-1011050324110001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
In article
<s0zcf.6429$2y.5773@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-0911050246010001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
In article
<TPbcf.6915$AS6.5912@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-0811051533420001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
...
Which is the point. They can't even keep their priests
chaste, much less their congregation.
• If chaste is not doing It with women, the one true
Church is apparently doing a pretty good job.
True, I suppose it does depend on one's definitions...
"I did not have sexual relations with that woman..."
William Jefferson Clinton
• If only Wild Bill had said: I did not have coitus with
that woman.
Well, hindsight and all... :c)
• All that adoo over a knob job.
Well, perjury is perjury I suppose, even if it is about
getting a bj... It just seems rather trivial in comparison to
current events.
• What if Monica had been a CIA undercover operative?
Maybe she was... :c)
• Are you suggesting that she specialized in operating
undercovers -- perhaps in the Lincoln Bedroom?
Well, if she was, she wasn't outed.
• The danger was being offed by Hillary.
Hillary was too busy chucking lamps at his head. Shame she missed.
• Hillary was chucking, Monica was sucking. There oughta be a movie.
I'm sure there will be one day. It will be titled, "Dress Stain"
--
Question with boldness even the existence of god; because if there be
one, he must more approve the homage of reason than that of blindfolded
fear. – Thomas Jefferson
.
|
|
|
| User: "€€R.L.Measures" |
|
| Title: Re: The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids. |
12 Nov 2005 11:29:14 AM |
|
|
In article <pIfdf.8067$m81.7305@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-1111050916010001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at r_@somis.org,
typed this:
In article <c_%cf.7796$AS6.2200@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
...
• If only Wild Bill had said: I did not have coitus with
that woman.
Well, hindsight and all... :c)
• All that adoo over a knob job.
Well, perjury is perjury I suppose, even if it is about
getting a bj... It just seems rather trivial in comparison to
current events.
• What if Monica had been a CIA undercover operative?
Maybe she was... :c)
• Are you suggesting that she specialized in operating
undercovers -- perhaps in the Lincoln Bedroom?
Well, if she was, she wasn't outed.
• The danger was being offed by Hillary.
Hillary was too busy chucking lamps at his head. Shame she missed.
• Hillary was chucking, Monica was sucking. There oughta be a movie.
I'm sure there will be one day. It will be titled, "Dress Stain"
• ... or how about Blue Velvet II?
--
€ R.L.Measures, 805-386-3734, www.somis.org
remove _ from e-mail adr
.
|
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| User: "Andrealphus" |
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| Title: Re: The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids. |
12 Nov 2005 12:14:20 PM |
|
|
In News r_-1211050329140001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at r_@somis.org,
typed this:
In article <pIfdf.8067$m81.7305@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-1111050916010001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
In article <c_%cf.7796$AS6.2200@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
...
• If only Wild Bill had said: I did not have coitus with
that woman.
Well, hindsight and all... :c)
• All that adoo over a knob job.
Well, perjury is perjury I suppose, even if it is about
getting a bj... It just seems rather trivial in comparison
to current events.
• What if Monica had been a CIA undercover operative?
Maybe she was... :c)
• Are you suggesting that she specialized in operating
undercovers -- perhaps in the Lincoln Bedroom?
Well, if she was, she wasn't outed.
• The danger was being offed by Hillary.
Hillary was too busy chucking lamps at his head. Shame she
missed.
• Hillary was chucking, Monica was sucking. There oughta be a
movie.
I'm sure there will be one day. It will be titled, "Dress Stain"
• ... or how about Blue Velvet II?
LOL! That's good too.
--
Question with boldness even the existence of god; because if there be
one, he must more approve the homage of reason than that of blindfolded
fear. – Thomas Jefferson
.
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| User: "David Jensen" |
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| Title: Re: The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids. |
10 Nov 2005 04:54:18 AM |
|
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On Thu, 10 Nov 2005 03:20:56 GMT, in alt.atheism
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote in
<s0zcf.6429$2y.5773@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net>:
In News r_-0911050246010001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at r_@somis.org,
typed this:
In article <TPbcf.6915$AS6.5912@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-0811051533420001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
...
Which is the point. They can't even keep their priests chaste,
much less their congregation.
• If chaste is not doing It with women, the one true Church is
apparently doing a pretty good job.
True, I suppose it does depend on one's definitions...
"I did not have sexual relations with that woman..."
William Jefferson Clinton
• If only Wild Bill had said: I did not have coitus with that
woman.
Well, hindsight and all... :c)
• All that adoo over a knob job.
Well, perjury is perjury I suppose, even if it is about getting a bj... It
just seems rather trivial in comparison to current events.
The point of perjury and obstructing justice is to keep the primary
event hidden. If there had been no essential crime, Libby wouldn't have
lied.
.
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| User: "Andrealphus" |
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| Title: Re: The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids. |
10 Nov 2005 12:26:35 PM |
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In News bik5n1p0etonacv67ju9cnhab2qbmmg050@4ax.com,, David Jensen at
david@dajensen-family.com, typed this:
On Thu, 10 Nov 2005 03:20:56 GMT, in alt.atheism
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote in
<s0zcf.6429$2y.5773@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net>:
In News r_-0911050246010001@192.168.1.100,, ??R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
In article <TPbcf.6915$AS6.5912@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-0811051533420001@192.168.1.100,, ??R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
...
Which is the point. They can't even keep their priests
chaste, much less their congregation.
. If chaste is not doing It with women, the one true Church
is apparently doing a pretty good job.
True, I suppose it does depend on one's definitions...
"I did not have sexual relations with that woman..."
William Jefferson Clinton
. If only Wild Bill had said: I did not have coitus with that
woman.
Well, hindsight and all... :c)
. All that adoo over a knob job.
Well, perjury is perjury I suppose, even if it is about getting a
bj... It just seems rather trivial in comparison to current events.
The point of perjury and obstructing justice is to keep the primary
event hidden. If there had been no essential crime, Libby wouldn't
have lied.
I agree. I think that Libby is just a little fish though. Cheney and Rove
will gladly sacrifice him to keep themselves safe. The more interesting
information will be what comes out of Libby's trial and further
investigation.
--
Question with boldness even the existence of god; because if there be
one, he must more approve the homage of reason than that of blindfolded
fear. - Thomas Jefferson
.
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| User: "€€R.L.Measures" |
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| Title: Re: The Catholic Church fights in the trenches in the war on Aids. |
10 Nov 2005 11:31:08 AM |
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In article <bik5n1p0etonacv67ju9cnhab2qbmmg050@4ax.com>, David Jensen
<david@dajensen-family.com> wrote:
On Thu, 10 Nov 2005 03:20:56 GMT, in alt.atheism
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote in
<s0zcf.6429$2y.5773@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net>:
In News r_-0911050246010001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at r_@somis.org,
typed this:
In article <TPbcf.6915$AS6.5912@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL10@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
In News r_-0811051533420001@192.168.1.100,, €€R.L.Measures at
r_@somis.org, typed this:
...
Which is the point. They can't even keep their priests chaste,
much less their congregation.
• If chaste is not doing It with women, the one true Church is
apparently doing a pretty good job.
True, I suppose it does depend on one's definitions...
"I did not have sexual relations with that woman..."
William Jefferson Clinton
• If only Wild Bill had said: I did not have coitus with that
woman.
Well, hindsight and all... :c)
• All that adoo over a knob job.
Well, perjury is perjury I suppose, even if it is about getting a bj... It
just seems rather trivial in comparison to current events.
The point of perjury and obstructing justice is to keep the primary
event hidden.
• Wild Bill's lies about who did what to who were completely justified
because they were intended to save the life of the President.
sinceIf there had been no essential crime, Libby wouldn't have
lied.
• good point
--
€ R.L.Measures, 805-386-3734, www.somis.org
remove _ from e-mail adr
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