| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"St. Jackanapes" |
| Date: |
22 Jan 2007 02:33:31 AM |
| Object: |
To Hell With Jesus: Zeus makes a comeback in Greece |
Zeus makes a comeback in Greece
ATHENS, Greece (AP) -- A clutch of modern pagans honored Zeus at a
1,800-year-old temple in the heart of Athens on Sunday -- the first
known ceremony of its kind held there since the ancient Greek religion
was outlawed by the Roman Empire in the fourth century.
Watched by curious onlookers, some 20 worshippers gathered next to the
ruins of the temple for a celebration organized by Ellinais, a year-old
Athens-based group that is campaigning to revive old religious practices
from the era when Greece was a fount of education and philosophy.
The group ignored a ban by the Culture Ministry, which declared the site
off limits to any kind of organized activity to protect the monument.
But participants did not try to enter the temple itself, which is closed
to everyone, and no officials sought to stop the ceremony.
Dressed in ancient costumes, worshippers standing near the temple's
imposing Corinthian columns recited hymns calling on the Olympian Zeus,
"King of the gods and the mover of things," to bring peace to the world.
"Our message is world peace and an ecological way of life in which
everyone has the right to education," said Kostas Stathopoulos, one of
three "high priests" overseeing the event, which celebrated the nuptials
of Zeus and Hera, the goddess of love and marriage.
To the Greeks, ecological awareness was fundamental, Stathopoulos said
after a priestess, with arms raised to the sky, called on Zeus "to bring
rain to the planet."
A herald holding a metal staff topped with two snake heads proclaimed
the beginning of the ceremony before priests in blue and red robes
released two white doves as symbols of peace. A priest poured libations
of wine and incense burned on a tiny copper tripod while a choir of men
and women chanted hymns.
"Our hymns stress the brotherhood of man and do not single out
nations," said priest Giorgos Alexelis.
More than a mere re-creation
For the organizers, who follow a calendar marking time from the first
Olympiad in 776 B.C., the ceremony was far more than a simple re-
creation.
"We are Greeks and we demand from the government the right to use our
temples," said high priestess Doreta Peppa.
Ellinais was founded last year and has 34 official members, mainly
academics, lawyers and other professionals. It won a court battle for
state recognition of the ancient Greek religion and is demanding the
government register its offices as a place of worship, a move that could
allow the group to perform weddings and other rites.
Christianity rose to prominence in Greece in the fourth century after
Roman Emperor Constantine's conversion. Emperor Theodosius wiped out the
last vestige of the Olympian gods when he abolished the Olympic Games in
A.D. 394.
Several isolated pockets of pagan worship lingered as late as the ninth
century.
"The Christians shut down our schools and destroyed our temples," said
Yiannis Panagidis, a 36-year-old accountant at the ceremony.
Most Greeks are baptized Orthodox Christians, and the church rejects
ancient religious practices as pagan. Church officials have refused to
attend flame ceremony re-enactments at Olympia before the Olympic Games
because Apollo, the ancient god of light, is invoked.
Unlike the monotheistic religions of Christianity, Judaism and Islam,
the old religion lacked written ethical guidelines, but its gods were
said to strike down mortals who displayed excessive pride or "hubris" --
a recurring theme in the tragedies of Euripides and other ancient
writers.
"We do not believe in dogmas and decrees, as the other religions do. We
believe in freedom of thought," Stathopoulos said.
Article at:
http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/europe/01/21/ancient.gods.ap/index.html
--
St. Jackanapes of Usenet
~ Bearer of The One True Liver ~
Ordained Minister & Saint - Universal Life Church
------------------------------------------------------
A Horrid Website: http://www.jackanapes.ws
A Horrid Forum: http://www.voy.com/20630/
.
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| User: "Greywolf" |
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| Title: Re: To Hell With Jesus: Zeus makes a comeback in Greece |
22 Jan 2007 04:59:21 AM |
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"St. Jackanapes" <mhasbjahgha@mjkjhkhs.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.201e40e161b6c4d79898d6@news.alt.net...
Zeus makes a comeback in Greece
ATHENS, Greece (AP) -- A clutch of modern pagans honored Zeus at a
1,800-year-old temple in the heart of Athens on Sunday -- the first
known ceremony of its kind held there since the ancient Greek religion
was outlawed by the Roman Empire in the fourth century.
Watched by curious onlookers, some 20 worshippers gathered next to the
ruins of the temple for a celebration organized by Ellinais, a year-old
Athens-based group that is campaigning to revive old religious practices
from the era when Greece was a fount of education and philosophy.
The group ignored a ban by the Culture Ministry, which declared the site
off limits to any kind of organized activity to protect the monument.
But participants did not try to enter the temple itself, which is closed
to everyone, and no officials sought to stop the ceremony.
Dressed in ancient costumes, worshippers standing near the temple's
imposing Corinthian columns recited hymns calling on the Olympian Zeus,
"King of the gods and the mover of things," to bring peace to the world.
"Our message is world peace and an ecological way of life in which
everyone has the right to education," said Kostas Stathopoulos, one of
three "high priests" overseeing the event, which celebrated the nuptials
of Zeus and Hera, the goddess of love and marriage.
To the Greeks, ecological awareness was fundamental, Stathopoulos said
after a priestess, with arms raised to the sky, called on Zeus "to bring
rain to the planet."
A herald holding a metal staff topped with two snake heads proclaimed
the beginning of the ceremony before priests in blue and red robes
released two white doves as symbols of peace. A priest poured libations
of wine and incense burned on a tiny copper tripod while a choir of men
and women chanted hymns.
"Our hymns stress the brotherhood of man and do not single out
nations," said priest Giorgos Alexelis.
More than a mere re-creation
For the organizers, who follow a calendar marking time from the first
Olympiad in 776 B.C., the ceremony was far more than a simple re-
creation.
"We are Greeks and we demand from the government the right to use our
temples," said high priestess Doreta Peppa.
Ellinais was founded last year and has 34 official members, mainly
academics, lawyers and other professionals. It won a court battle for
state recognition of the ancient Greek religion and is demanding the
government register its offices as a place of worship, a move that could
allow the group to perform weddings and other rites.
Christianity rose to prominence in Greece in the fourth century after
Roman Emperor Constantine's conversion. Emperor Theodosius wiped out the
last vestige of the Olympian gods when he abolished the Olympic Games in
A.D. 394.
Several isolated pockets of pagan worship lingered as late as the ninth
century.
"The Christians shut down our schools and destroyed our temples," said
Yiannis Panagidis, a 36-year-old accountant at the ceremony.
Most Greeks are baptized Orthodox Christians, and the church rejects
ancient religious practices as pagan. Church officials have refused to
attend flame ceremony re-enactments at Olympia before the Olympic Games
because Apollo, the ancient god of light, is invoked.
Unlike the monotheistic religions of Christianity, Judaism and Islam,
the old religion lacked written ethical guidelines, but its gods were
said to strike down mortals who displayed excessive pride or "hubris" --
a recurring theme in the tragedies of Euripides and other ancient
writers.
"We do not believe in dogmas and decrees, as the other religions do. We
believe in freedom of thought," Stathopoulos said.
Article at:
http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/europe/01/21/ancient.gods.ap/index.html
--
St. Jackanapes of Usenet
~ Bearer of The One True Liver ~
Ordained Minister & Saint - Universal Life Church
------------------------------------------------------
A Horrid Website: http://www.jackanapes.ws
A Horrid Forum: http://www.voy.com/20630/
Now you watch and see. The Christians are going to claim that belief in Zeus
& Friends is outrageous, preposterous, laughable, and flat-out idiocy; that
it is a 'false' religion with no basis in fact; that there is absolutely NO
scientific evidence for the existence of Zeus!
If only they could *prove* it, eh'?
Greywolf
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| User: "Nosterill" |
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| Title: Re: To Hell With Jesus: Zeus makes a comeback in Greece |
22 Jan 2007 06:28:34 AM |
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Greywolf wrote:
"St. Jackanapes" <mhasbjahgha@mjkjhkhs.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.201e40e161b6c4d79898d6@news.alt.net...
Zeus makes a comeback in Greece
ATHENS, Greece (AP) -- A clutch of modern pagans honored Zeus at a
1,800-year-old temple in the heart of Athens on Sunday -- the first
known ceremony of its kind held there since the ancient Greek religion
was outlawed by the Roman Empire in the fourth century.
Watched by curious onlookers, some 20 worshippers gathered next to the
ruins of the temple for a celebration organized by Ellinais, a year-old
Athens-based group that is campaigning to revive old religious practices
from the era when Greece was a fount of education and philosophy.
The group ignored a ban by the Culture Ministry, which declared the site
off limits to any kind of organized activity to protect the monument.
But participants did not try to enter the temple itself, which is closed
to everyone, and no officials sought to stop the ceremony.
Dressed in ancient costumes, worshippers standing near the temple's
imposing Corinthian columns recited hymns calling on the Olympian Zeus,
"King of the gods and the mover of things," to bring peace to the world.
"Our message is world peace and an ecological way of life in which
everyone has the right to education," said Kostas Stathopoulos, one of
three "high priests" overseeing the event, which celebrated the nuptials
of Zeus and Hera, the goddess of love and marriage.
To the Greeks, ecological awareness was fundamental, Stathopoulos said
after a priestess, with arms raised to the sky, called on Zeus "to bring
rain to the planet."
A herald holding a metal staff topped with two snake heads proclaimed
the beginning of the ceremony before priests in blue and red robes
released two white doves as symbols of peace. A priest poured libations
of wine and incense burned on a tiny copper tripod while a choir of men
and women chanted hymns.
"Our hymns stress the brotherhood of man and do not single out
nations," said priest Giorgos Alexelis.
More than a mere re-creation
For the organizers, who follow a calendar marking time from the first
Olympiad in 776 B.C., the ceremony was far more than a simple re-
creation.
"We are Greeks and we demand from the government the right to use our
temples," said high priestess Doreta Peppa.
Ellinais was founded last year and has 34 official members, mainly
academics, lawyers and other professionals. It won a court battle for
state recognition of the ancient Greek religion and is demanding the
government register its offices as a place of worship, a move that could
allow the group to perform weddings and other rites.
Christianity rose to prominence in Greece in the fourth century after
Roman Emperor Constantine's conversion. Emperor Theodosius wiped out the
last vestige of the Olympian gods when he abolished the Olympic Games in
A.D. 394.
Several isolated pockets of pagan worship lingered as late as the ninth
century.
"The Christians shut down our schools and destroyed our temples," said
Yiannis Panagidis, a 36-year-old accountant at the ceremony.
Most Greeks are baptized Orthodox Christians, and the church rejects
ancient religious practices as pagan. Church officials have refused to
attend flame ceremony re-enactments at Olympia before the Olympic Games
because Apollo, the ancient god of light, is invoked.
Unlike the monotheistic religions of Christianity, Judaism and Islam,
the old religion lacked written ethical guidelines, but its gods were
said to strike down mortals who displayed excessive pride or "hubris" --
a recurring theme in the tragedies of Euripides and other ancient
writers.
"We do not believe in dogmas and decrees, as the other religions do. We
believe in freedom of thought," Stathopoulos said.
Article at:
http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/europe/01/21/ancient.gods.ap/index.html
--
St. Jackanapes of Usenet
~ Bearer of The One True Liver ~
Ordained Minister & Saint - Universal Life Church
------------------------------------------------------
A Horrid Website: http://www.jackanapes.ws
A Horrid Forum: http://www.voy.com/20630/
Now you watch and see. The Christians are going to claim that belief in Zeus
& Friends is outrageous, preposterous, laughable, and flat-out idiocy; that
it is a 'false' religion with no basis in fact; that there is absolutely NO
scientific evidence for the existence of Zeus!
If only they could *prove* it, eh'?
Greywolf
Well the Christians did practically invent religious intolerance. The
Romans had been quite tolerant of other religions, even adopting parts
of local cults into their own, until they turned Christian. Thereafter,
things changed!
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| User: "Greywolf" |
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| Title: Re: To Hell With Jesus: Zeus makes a comeback in Greece |
22 Jan 2007 07:22:13 AM |
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"Nosterill" <fladgate@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1169468914.662480.125890@11g2000cwr.googlegroups.com...
Greywolf wrote:
"St. Jackanapes" <mhasbjahgha@mjkjhkhs.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.201e40e161b6c4d79898d6@news.alt.net...
Zeus makes a comeback in Greece
ATHENS, Greece (AP) -- A clutch of modern pagans honored Zeus at a
1,800-year-old temple in the heart of Athens on Sunday -- the first
known ceremony of its kind held there since the ancient Greek religion
was outlawed by the Roman Empire in the fourth century.
Watched by curious onlookers, some 20 worshippers gathered next to the
ruins of the temple for a celebration organized by Ellinais, a year-old
Athens-based group that is campaigning to revive old religious
practices
from the era when Greece was a fount of education and philosophy.
The group ignored a ban by the Culture Ministry, which declared the
site
off limits to any kind of organized activity to protect the monument.
But participants did not try to enter the temple itself, which is
closed
to everyone, and no officials sought to stop the ceremony.
Dressed in ancient costumes, worshippers standing near the temple's
imposing Corinthian columns recited hymns calling on the Olympian Zeus,
"King of the gods and the mover of things," to bring peace to the
world.
"Our message is world peace and an ecological way of life in which
everyone has the right to education," said Kostas Stathopoulos, one of
three "high priests" overseeing the event, which celebrated the
nuptials
of Zeus and Hera, the goddess of love and marriage.
To the Greeks, ecological awareness was fundamental, Stathopoulos said
after a priestess, with arms raised to the sky, called on Zeus "to
bring
rain to the planet."
A herald holding a metal staff topped with two snake heads proclaimed
the beginning of the ceremony before priests in blue and red robes
released two white doves as symbols of peace. A priest poured libations
of wine and incense burned on a tiny copper tripod while a choir of men
and women chanted hymns.
"Our hymns stress the brotherhood of man and do not single out
nations," said priest Giorgos Alexelis.
More than a mere re-creation
For the organizers, who follow a calendar marking time from the first
Olympiad in 776 B.C., the ceremony was far more than a simple re-
creation.
"We are Greeks and we demand from the government the right to use our
temples," said high priestess Doreta Peppa.
Ellinais was founded last year and has 34 official members, mainly
academics, lawyers and other professionals. It won a court battle for
state recognition of the ancient Greek religion and is demanding the
government register its offices as a place of worship, a move that
could
allow the group to perform weddings and other rites.
Christianity rose to prominence in Greece in the fourth century after
Roman Emperor Constantine's conversion. Emperor Theodosius wiped out
the
last vestige of the Olympian gods when he abolished the Olympic Games
in
A.D. 394.
Several isolated pockets of pagan worship lingered as late as the ninth
century.
"The Christians shut down our schools and destroyed our temples," said
Yiannis Panagidis, a 36-year-old accountant at the ceremony.
Most Greeks are baptized Orthodox Christians, and the church rejects
ancient religious practices as pagan. Church officials have refused to
attend flame ceremony re-enactments at Olympia before the Olympic Games
because Apollo, the ancient god of light, is invoked.
Unlike the monotheistic religions of Christianity, Judaism and Islam,
the old religion lacked written ethical guidelines, but its gods were
said to strike down mortals who displayed excessive pride or
"hubris" --
a recurring theme in the tragedies of Euripides and other ancient
writers.
"We do not believe in dogmas and decrees, as the other religions do. We
believe in freedom of thought," Stathopoulos said.
Article at:
http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/europe/01/21/ancient.gods.ap/index.html
--
St. Jackanapes of Usenet
~ Bearer of The One True Liver ~
Ordained Minister & Saint - Universal Life Church
------------------------------------------------------
A Horrid Website: http://www.jackanapes.ws
A Horrid Forum: http://www.voy.com/20630/
Now you watch and see. The Christians are going to claim that belief in
Zeus
& Friends is outrageous, preposterous, laughable, and flat-out idiocy;
that
it is a 'false' religion with no basis in fact; that there is absolutely
NO
scientific evidence for the existence of Zeus!
If only they could *prove* it, eh'?
Greywolf
Well the Christians did practically invent religious intolerance. The
Romans had been quite tolerant of other religions, even adopting parts
of local cults into their own, until they turned Christian. Thereafter,
things changed!
Isn't *that* the truth! What utter *hypocrites* and douche-bags the
Christians of the extreme kind turned out to be. After suffering
'persecution' themselves, they, nonetheless, go on to 'persecute' others
with a vengeance -- forgetting what being persecuted felt like, it seems.
*This*, from the 'peace and love' people! Hah!! What a *mockery* these
retardos make of their 'faith'! The hate-mongering bastards!
As to Zeus: How in the hell are the Christians going to deal with the fact
that their 'three deities' in *one* 'God' hasn't one more grain of
'evidence' for the existence of their 'Zeus' than the modern-day worshipers
of the *real* imaginary Zeus of ancient times? And what about the 'original'
God of the Bible (Torah) who lacks the 'Jesus' component the Christians so
highly cherish. The Jews' claim to a 'God' -- sans Jesus -- has a better,
more original, 'pedigree' than does the Johnny-come-lately' 'Christian
Jesus/God -- by several *miles*!
What are we left with? A bunch of ridiculous claims lacking *any* proof
they're true. Yet accepted as the truth by naive and gullible air-heads who
won't even *consider* the fact that they may be wrong. Again. If 'God' OR
'Zeus' actually existed, we'd all be sure that one, or *both*, of them do.
That is because they're existence would be able to be detected in manner
that would be without question. We would have no 'God' debate. Just as there
is no 'debate' in regards to the existence of the sun or the moon. Isn't
*that* quite obvious?!
Greywolf
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| User: "duke" |
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| Title: Re: To Hell With Jesus: Zeus makes a comeback in Greece |
23 Jan 2007 05:17:55 AM |
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On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 04:59:21 -0600, "Greywolf" <greywolf@cybrzn.com> wrote:
Now you watch and see. The Christians are going to claim that belief in Zeus
& Friends is outrageous, preposterous, laughable, and flat-out idiocy; that
it is a 'false' religion with no basis in fact; that there is absolutely NO
scientific evidence for the existence of Zeus!
If only they could *prove* it, eh'?
Zeus, a non entity, never did anything for his followers before. Why start now?
duke, American-American
*****
"The Mass is the most perfect form of Prayer."
Pope Paul VI
*****
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| User: "Greywolf" |
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| Title: Re: To Hell With Jesus: Zeus makes a comeback in Greece |
24 Jan 2007 12:34:59 AM |
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"duke" <duckgumbo32@cox.net> wrote in message
news:lkrbr2d5ndqrapf8m3fnfskplvecd691nr@4ax.com...
On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 04:59:21 -0600, "Greywolf" <greywolf@cybrzn.com>
wrote:
Now you watch and see. The Christians are going to claim that belief in
Zeus
& Friends is outrageous, preposterous, laughable, and flat-out idiocy;
that
it is a 'false' religion with no basis in fact; that there is absolutely
NO
scientific evidence for the existence of Zeus!
If only they could *prove* it, eh'?
Zeus, a non entity, never did anything for his followers before. Why
start now?
What are you saying? Don't you know your history? Zeus and his daughter,
Athena, saved Greece from being conquered by the Persians in the most
'miraculous' ways possible. Remember the 'Battle of Marathon'? 'Proof',
duke. Real 'proof'. Don't you agree? Or are you going to claim -- without
*any* proof whatsoever to 'prove your 'case' -- that Zeus and the rest of
the Greek gods are nothing more than the product of man's vivid imagination?
Who in the hell 'blessed' the ancient Greeks so much so that they became a
'father' of Western civilization? Or do you find that idea laughable? Say,
as 'laughable' as the 'Christian' God who is said to be made up of three
beings who act independently of each other, occupy separate areas of
'space', yet are only *ONE* being? Yeah, you're right, duke. When you think
about that clearly imaginary being, you *do* have to chuckle to yourself.
*Don't* you, duke?
Greywolf
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| User: "Cary Kittrell" |
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| Title: Re: To Hell With Jesus: Zeus makes a comeback in Greece |
24 Jan 2007 11:38:02 AM |
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In article <12rdvgti4rj3190@corp.supernews.com> "Greywolf" <greywolf@cybrzn.com> writes:
"duke" <duckgumbo32@cox.net> wrote in message
news:lkrbr2d5ndqrapf8m3fnfskplvecd691nr@4ax.com...
On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 04:59:21 -0600, "Greywolf" <greywolf@cybrzn.com>
wrote:
Now you watch and see. The Christians are going to claim that belief in
Zeus
& Friends is outrageous, preposterous, laughable, and flat-out idiocy;
that
it is a 'false' religion with no basis in fact; that there is absolutely
NO
scientific evidence for the existence of Zeus!
If only they could *prove* it, eh'?
Zeus, a non entity, never did anything for his followers before. Why
start now?
What are you saying? Don't you know your history? Zeus and his daughter,
Athena, saved Greece from being conquered by the Persians in the most
'miraculous' ways possible. Remember the 'Battle of Marathon'? 'Proof',
duke. Real 'proof'. Don't you agree? Or are you going to claim -- without
*any* proof whatsoever to 'prove your 'case' -- that Zeus and the rest of
the Greek gods are nothing more than the product of man's vivid imagination?
Who in the hell 'blessed' the ancient Greeks so much so that they became a
'father' of Western civilization? Or do you find that idea laughable? Say,
as 'laughable' as the 'Christian' God who is said to be made up of three
beings who act independently of each other, occupy separate areas of
'space', yet are only *ONE* being? Yeah, you're right, duke. When you think
about that clearly imaginary being, you *do* have to chuckle to yourself.
*Don't* you, duke?
And, as I pointed out elsewhere, you could hardly step out
onto the battlefield at Troy without tripping over some
god or goddess -- pretty much all the major players in
the Greek pantheon chose one side or the other, and
hilarity ensued.
-- cary
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| User: "655321" |
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| Title: Re: To Hell With Jesus: Zeus makes a comeback in Greece |
23 Jan 2007 12:50:35 PM |
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In article <lkrbr2d5ndqrapf8m3fnfskplvecd691nr@4ax.com>,
duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> wrote:
On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 04:59:21 -0600, "Greywolf" <greywolf@cybrzn.com> wrote:
Now you watch and see. The Christians are going to claim that belief in Zeus
& Friends is outrageous, preposterous, laughable, and flat-out idiocy; that
it is a 'false' religion with no basis in fact; that there is absolutely NO
scientific evidence for the existence of Zeus!
If only they could *prove* it, eh'?
Zeus, a non entity, never did anything for his followers before. Why start
now?
It's true that Zeus, being yet another non-existent god, never "did
anything for his followers." But considering it was these same
Zeus-worshippers who contributed to the intellectual development of some
of the fundamental elements of modern society that even he must revere,
one wonders exactly what Earl meant by the above. Then again, he seems
to have serious problems with a secular republican (small 'r') form of
government.
--
655321
"We are heroes in error" -- Ahmad Chalabi
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| User: "Lucifer" |
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| Title: Re: To Hell With Jesus: Zeus makes a comeback in Greece |
23 Jan 2007 05:53:51 AM |
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duke wrote:
On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 04:59:21 -0600, "Greywolf" <greywolf@cybrzn.com> wrote:
Now you watch and see. The Christians are going to claim that belief in Zeus
& Friends is outrageous, preposterous, laughable, and flat-out idiocy; that
it is a 'false' religion with no basis in fact; that there is absolutely NO
scientific evidence for the existence of Zeus!
If only they could *prove* it, eh'?
Zeus, a non entity, never did anything for his followers before. Why start now?
Indeed. No god has ever done anything at all. Interestingly, if one
were to believe the stories, then Pan can trump all the monotheistic
gods when it comes to intervention...
--
Lucifer the Unsubtle, EAC Librarian of Dark Tomes of Excessive Evil and
General Purpose Igor
The Anti-Theist, BAAWA Lowly Evilmeister and tamer of the Demon Duck of
Doom
Convicted by Earthquack
"Don't worry, I won't bite.......hard"
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| User: "0" |
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| Title: Re: To Hell With Jesus: Zeus makes a comeback in Greece |
22 Jan 2007 09:40:38 AM |
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"St. Jackanapes" <mhasbjahgha@mjkjhkhs.com> wrote in message news:MPG.201e40e161b6c4d79898d6@news.alt.net...
Zeus makes a comeback in Greece
ATHENS, Greece (AP) -- A clutch of modern pagans honored Zeus at a
1,800-year-old temple in the heart of Athens on Sunday -- the first
known ceremony of its kind held there since the ancient Greek religion
was outlawed by the Roman Empire in the fourth century.
Watched by curious onlookers, some 20 worshippers gathered next to the
ruins of the temple for a celebration organized by Ellinais, a year-old
Athens-based group that is campaigning to revive old religious practices
from the era when Greece was a fount of education and philosophy.
The group ignored a ban by the Culture Ministry, which declared the site
off limits to any kind of organized activity to protect the monument.
But participants did not try to enter the temple itself, which is closed
to everyone, and no officials sought to stop the ceremony.
Dressed in ancient costumes, worshippers standing near the temple's
imposing Corinthian columns recited hymns calling on the Olympian Zeus,
"King of the gods and the mover of things," to bring peace to the world.
"Our message is world peace and an ecological way of life in which
everyone has the right to education," said Kostas Stathopoulos, one of
three "high priests" overseeing the event, which celebrated the nuptials
of Zeus and Hera, the goddess of love and marriage.
To the Greeks, ecological awareness was fundamental, Stathopoulos said
after a priestess, with arms raised to the sky, called on Zeus "to bring
rain to the planet."
A herald holding a metal staff topped with two snake heads proclaimed
the beginning of the ceremony before priests in blue and red robes
released two white doves as symbols of peace. A priest poured libations
of wine and incense burned on a tiny copper tripod while a choir of men
and women chanted hymns.
"Our hymns stress the brotherhood of man and do not single out
nations," said priest Giorgos Alexelis.
More than a mere re-creation
For the organizers, who follow a calendar marking time from the first
Olympiad in 776 B.C., the ceremony was far more than a simple re-
creation.
"We are Greeks and we demand from the government the right to use our
temples," said high priestess Doreta Peppa.
Ellinais was founded last year and has 34 official members, mainly
academics, lawyers and other professionals. It won a court battle for
state recognition of the ancient Greek religion and is demanding the
government register its offices as a place of worship, a move that could
allow the group to perform weddings and other rites.
Christianity rose to prominence in Greece in the fourth century after
Roman Emperor Constantine's conversion. Emperor Theodosius wiped out the
last vestige of the Olympian gods when he abolished the Olympic Games in
A.D. 394.
Several isolated pockets of pagan worship lingered as late as the ninth
century.
"The Christians shut down our schools and destroyed our temples," said
Yiannis Panagidis, a 36-year-old accountant at the ceremony.
Most Greeks are baptized Orthodox Christians, and the church rejects
ancient religious practices as pagan. Church officials have refused to
attend flame ceremony re-enactments at Olympia before the Olympic Games
because Apollo, the ancient god of light, is invoked.
Unlike the monotheistic religions of Christianity, Judaism and Islam,
the old religion lacked written ethical guidelines, but its gods were
said to strike down mortals who displayed excessive pride or "hubris" --
a recurring theme in the tragedies of Euripides and other ancient
writers.
"We do not believe in dogmas and decrees, as the other religions do. We
believe in freedom of thought," Stathopoulos said.
Article at:
http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/europe/01/21/ancient.gods.ap/index.html
Eyewitness Testimony
In a court case, what kind of evidence is most condemning so far as
establishing the probability of guilt? Although circumstantial evidence can
play a significant role, by far the most important evidence a prosecutor can
muster is eyewitness testimony. Now note this. The most compelling and
irrefutable evidence for the resurrection of Jesus Christ comes from
recorded eyewitnesses (legal testimony). The major events in Jesus'
life-His miracles, teachings, trial, death, and post-resurrection
appearances-are recorded either by eyewitnesses to the events or by the
companions of eyewitnesses. In a court case, the New Testament Gospels
are primary source material, not second- or third-hand information and not
oral tradition.
The authors of the New Testament were careful to note this eyewitness
testimony in order to validate the authenticity of their writings. The apostle
Peter wrote, "For we did not follow cleverly devised tales when we made
known to you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but we were
eyewitnesses of His majesty" (2 Peter 1:16). The apostle John is even more
specific: "What was from the beginning, what we have heard, what we have
seen with our eyes, what we beheld and our hands handled, concerning the
Word of Life . what we have seen and heard we proclaim to you also" (1
John 1:1-3, emphasis mine).
Simon Greenleaf, in his work The Testimony of the Evangelists: The Gospels
Examined by the Rules of Evidence, wrote of the apostles' integrity.
Greenleaf concluded:
They had every possible motive to review carefully the grounds of their faith,
and the evidence of the great facts and truths which they asserted; and these
motives were pressed upon their attention with the most melancholy and
terrific frequency. It was therefore impossible that they could have persisted
in affirming the truths they have narrated, had not Jesus actually risen from
the dead and had they not know of this fact as certainly as they knew any
other fact.. And their writings show them to have been men of vigorous
understandings. If then their testimony was not true, there was no possible
motive for its fabrication.?14?
If the case for Christianity were to go through the rigors of our court system
and all the evidence available were presented, there is little doubt that the
resurrection of Jesus Christ (the absolute proof of His deity-Romans 1:4)
would be considered proven "to a moral certainty beyond reasonable
doubt." The historicity of Jesus' resurrection is proven to the highest level of
certainty possible.
On the basis of legal evidence alone, it is clear that Jesus Christ is who He
claims to be: God incarnate, the risen Messiah, our Lord and Savior.
[1]
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
14 Greenleaf, The Testimony of the Evangelists, 32.
[1]Story, D. (1998). Christianity on the offense : Responding to the beliefs
and assumptions of spiritual seekers (82). Grand Rapids, MI: Kregel
Publications.
--
Respond to Email.
.
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| User: "skyeyes" |
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| Title: Re: To Hell With Jesus: Zeus makes a comeback in Greece |
22 Jan 2007 11:03:16 AM |
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"0" <0...@john-14-6.info> wrote:
<Snippage>
Eyewitness Testimony
In a court case, what kind of evidence is most condemning so far as
establishing the probability of guilt? Although circumstantial evidence can
play a significant role, by far the most important evidence a prosecutor can
muster is eyewitness testimony.
Not in this millenium. Forensics trumps eye witness testimony. Eye
witnesses misperceive, misremember, and sometimes lie. Evidence
doesn't tell fibs. Evidence has cleared people falsely convicted of
crimes to which others offered eye-witness testimony that turned out to
be flawed.
And unfortunately, there's not one morsel of forensic evidence that
Jesus ever existed, nor any upholding most of the events in the Bible.
Too bad, so sad.
<Remaining drivel snipped>
A request: Would you Christers *please* get some new material? This
eye-witness argument has been refuted to death and back. We'd like
something fresh, if you can come up with anything. Thanks awfully.
Brenda Nelson, A.A.#34
EAC Professor of Feline Thermometrics and Cat-Herding
skyeyes at dakotacom dot net
.
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| User: "St. Jackanapes" |
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| Title: Re: To Hell With Jesus: Zeus makes a comeback in Greece |
23 Jan 2007 04:49:34 PM |
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In alt.flame.jesus.christ, skyeyes yammered...
"0" <0...@john-14-6.info> wrote:
<Snippage>
Eyewitness Testimony
In a court case, what kind of evidence is most condemning so far as
establishing the probability of guilt? Although circumstantial evidence can
play a significant role, by far the most important evidence a prosecutor can
muster is eyewitness testimony.
Not in this millenium. Forensics trumps eye witness testimony. Eye
witnesses misperceive, misremember, and sometimes lie. Evidence
doesn't tell fibs. Evidence has cleared people falsely convicted of
crimes to which others offered eye-witness testimony that turned out to
be flawed.
And unfortunately, there's not one morsel of forensic evidence that
Jesus ever existed, nor any upholding most of the events in the Bible.
Too bad, so sad.
<Remaining drivel snipped>
A request: Would you Christers *please* get some new material? This
eye-witness argument has been refuted to death and back. We'd like
something fresh, if you can come up with anything. Thanks awfully.
John "0" Loiodice's whole shtick is to vomit up loads of pointless
garbage. It's all he has. He doesn't have the ability to even speak for
himself in his replies.
--
St. Jackanapes of Usenet
~ Bearer of The One True Liver ~
Ordained Minister & Saint - Universal Life Church
------------------------------------------------------
A Horrid Website: http://www.jackanapes.ws
A Horrid Forum: http://www.voy.com/20630/
.
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| User: "Lamey" |
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| Title: Re: To Hell With Jesus: Zeus makes a comeback in Greece |
22 Jan 2007 11:34:09 AM |
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On 22 Jan 2007 09:03:16 -0800, "skyeyes" <skyeyes@dakotacom.net>
wrote:
"0" <0...@john-14-6.info> wrote:
<Snippage>
Eyewitness Testimony
In a court case, what kind of evidence is most condemning so far as
establishing the probability of guilt? Although circumstantial evidence can
play a significant role, by far the most important evidence a prosecutor can
muster is eyewitness testimony.
Not in this millenium. Forensics trumps eye witness testimony. Eye
witnesses misperceive, misremember, and sometimes lie. Evidence
doesn't tell fibs. Evidence has cleared people falsely convicted of
crimes to which others offered eye-witness testimony that turned out to
be flawed.
And unfortunately, there's not one morsel of forensic evidence that
Jesus ever existed, nor any upholding most of the events in the Bible.
Too bad, so sad.
<Remaining drivel snipped>
A request: Would you Christers *please* get some new material? This
eye-witness argument has been refuted to death and back. We'd like
something fresh, if you can come up with anything. Thanks awfully.
Brenda Nelson, A.A.#34
EAC Professor of Feline Thermometrics and Cat-Herding
skyeyes at dakotacom dot net
.
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| User: "Hatter" |
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| Title: Re: To Hell With Jesus: Zeus makes a comeback in Greece |
22 Jan 2007 11:11:34 AM |
|
|
skyeyes wrote:
"0" <0...@john-14-6.info> wrote:
<Snippage>
Eyewitness Testimony
In a court case, what kind of evidence is most condemning so far as
establishing the probability of guilt? Although circumstantial evidence can
play a significant role, by far the most important evidence a prosecutor can
muster is eyewitness testimony.
Not in this millenium. Forensics trumps eye witness testimony. Eye
witnesses misperceive, misremember, and sometimes lie. Evidence
doesn't tell fibs. Evidence has cleared people falsely convicted of
crimes to which others offered eye-witness testimony that turned out to
be flawed.
And unfortunately, there's not one morsel of forensic evidence that
Jesus ever existed, nor any upholding most of the events in the Bible.
Too bad, so sad.
<Remaining drivel snipped>
A request: Would you Christers *please* get some new material? This
eye-witness argument has been refuted to death and back. We'd like
something fresh, if you can come up with anything. Thanks awfully.
Addition, how many "eye witnesses" were to Jesus praying alone in the
garden, tempted by Satan?, How many were there at the nativity? Why do
the accounts vary?
Occam's razor. Apply it.
Hatter
.
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| User: "Llanzlan Klazmon the 15th" |
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| Title: Re: To Hell With Jesus: Zeus makes a comeback in Greece |
22 Jan 2007 05:49:27 PM |
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"Hatter" <Hatter23@gmail.com> wrote in
news:1169485893.970300.63740@11g2000cwr.googlegroups.com:
skyeyes wrote:
"0" <0...@john-14-6.info> wrote:
<Snippage>
Eyewitness Testimony
In a court case, what kind of evidence is most condemning so far as
establishing the probability of guilt? Although circumstantial
evidence can play a significant role, by far the most important
evidence a prosecutor can muster is eyewitness testimony.
Not in this millenium. Forensics trumps eye witness testimony. Eye
witnesses misperceive, misremember, and sometimes lie. Evidence
doesn't tell fibs. Evidence has cleared people falsely convicted of
crimes to which others offered eye-witness testimony that turned out to
be flawed.
And unfortunately, there's not one morsel of forensic evidence that
Jesus ever existed, nor any upholding most of the events in the Bible.
Too bad, so sad.
<Remaining drivel snipped>
A request: Would you Christers *please* get some new material? This
eye-witness argument has been refuted to death and back. We'd like
something fresh, if you can come up with anything. Thanks awfully.
Addition, how many "eye witnesses" were to Jesus praying alone in the
garden, tempted by Satan?, How many were there at the nativity? Why do
the accounts vary?
Occam's razor. Apply it.
Hatter
There is a similar problem with the Jesus trial before the Sanhedrin and
appearance before Pilate. None of the gospel writers were present even if
you allow the traditional Mathew, Mark etc. These names of course were not
added until the time of Irenaeus.
Klazmon.
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| User: "Lucifer" |
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| Title: Re: To Hell With Jesus: Zeus makes a comeback in Greece |
22 Jan 2007 02:18:52 PM |
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Hatter wrote:
skyeyes wrote:
"0" <0...@john-14-6.info> wrote:
<Snippage>
Eyewitness Testimony
In a court case, what kind of evidence is most condemning so far as
establishing the probability of guilt? Although circumstantial evidence can
play a significant role, by far the most important evidence a prosecutor can
muster is eyewitness testimony.
Not in this millenium. Forensics trumps eye witness testimony. Eye
witnesses misperceive, misremember, and sometimes lie. Evidence
doesn't tell fibs. Evidence has cleared people falsely convicted of
crimes to which others offered eye-witness testimony that turned out to
be flawed.
And unfortunately, there's not one morsel of forensic evidence that
Jesus ever existed, nor any upholding most of the events in the Bible.
Too bad, so sad.
<Remaining drivel snipped>
A request: Would you Christers *please* get some new material? This
eye-witness argument has been refuted to death and back. We'd like
something fresh, if you can come up with anything. Thanks awfully.
Addition, how many "eye witnesses" were to Jesus praying alone in the
garden, tempted by Satan?, How many were there at the nativity? Why do
the accounts vary?
Occam's razor. Apply it.
Hatter
Or any razor for that matter...
--
Lucifer the Unsubtle, EAC Librarian of Dark Tomes of Excessive Evil and
General Purpose Igor
The Anti-Theist, BAAWA Lowly Evilmeister and tamer of the Demon Duck of
Doom
Convicted by Earthquack
"Don't worry, I won't bite.......hard"
.
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| User: "skyeyes" |
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| Title: Re: To Hell With Jesus: Zeus makes a comeback in Greece |
22 Jan 2007 03:32:38 PM |
|
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Hatter wrote:
skyeyes wrote:
"0" <0...@john-14-6.info> wrote:
<Snippage>
Eyewitness Testimony
In a court case, what kind of evidence is most condemning so far as
establishing the probability of guilt? Although circumstantial evidence can
play a significant role, by far the most important evidence a prosecutor can
muster is eyewitness testimony.
Not in this millenium. Forensics trumps eye witness testimony. Eye
witnesses misperceive, misremember, and sometimes lie. Evidence
doesn't tell fibs. Evidence has cleared people falsely convicted of
crimes to which others offered eye-witness testimony that turned out to
be flawed.
And unfortunately, there's not one morsel of forensic evidence that
Jesus ever existed, nor any upholding most of the events in the Bible.
Too bad, so sad.
<Remaining drivel snipped>
A request: Would you Christers *please* get some new material? This
eye-witness argument has been refuted to death and back. We'd like
something fresh, if you can come up with anything. Thanks awfully.
Addition, how many "eye witnesses" were to Jesus praying alone in the
garden, tempted by Satan?, How many were there at the nativity? Why do
the accounts vary?
Occam's razor. Apply it.
I get a special kick out of the crucifiction story, the passage that
says "The dead came out of their graves and walked around, and hundreds
of people saw it!" But yet they don't bother to give a single name,
nor is there the least mention of this astounding occurrence in any
contemporary literature or letters. Good grief, you'd think *somebody*
would have written his mom about that, wouldn't you?
Brenda Nelson, A.A.#34
EAC Professor of Feline Thermometrics and Cat-Herding
skyeyes at dakotacom dot net
.
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| User: "stoney" |
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| Title: Re: To Hell With Jesus: Zeus makes a comeback in Greece |
31 Jan 2007 10:20:29 PM |
|
|
On 22 Jan 2007 13:32:38 -0800, "skyeyes" <skyeyes@dakotacom.net> wrote
in alt.atheism
Hatter wrote:
skyeyes wrote:
"0" <0...@john-14-6.info> wrote:
<Snippage>
Eyewitness Testimony
[]
And unfortunately, there's not one morsel of forensic evidence that
Jesus ever existed, nor any upholding most of the events in the Bible.
Too bad, so sad.
<Remaining drivel snipped>
A request: Would you Christers *please* get some new material? This
eye-witness argument has been refuted to death and back. We'd like
something fresh, if you can come up with anything. Thanks awfully.
Addition, how many "eye witnesses" were to Jesus praying alone in the
garden, tempted by Satan?, How many were there at the nativity? Why do
the accounts vary?
Occam's razor. Apply it.
I get a special kick out of the crucifiction story, the passage that
says "The dead came out of their graves and walked around, and hundreds
of people saw it!" But yet they don't bother to give a single name,
nor is there the least mention of this astounding occurrence in any
contemporary literature or letters. Good grief, you'd think *somebody*
would have written his mom about that, wouldn't you?
Well, they would have except for the news blackout.......
--
Fundies and trolls are cordially invited to
shove a wooden cross up their arses and rotate
at a high rate of speed. I trust you'll
be 'blessed' with a plethora of splinters.
.
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| User: "Lamey" |
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| Title: Re: To Hell With Jesus: Zeus makes a comeback in Greece |
22 Jan 2007 11:35:03 AM |
|
|
On 22 Jan 2007 09:11:34 -0800, "Hatter" <Hatter23@gmail.com> wrote:
skyeyes wrote:
"0" <0...@john-14-6.info> wrote:
<Snippage>
Eyewitness Testimony
In a court case, what kind of evidence is most condemning so far as
establishing the probability of guilt? Although circumstantial evidence can
play a significant role, by far the most important evidence a prosecutor can
muster is eyewitness testimony.
Not in this millenium. Forensics trumps eye witness testimony. Eye
witnesses misperceive, misremember, and sometimes lie. Evidence
doesn't tell fibs. Evidence has cleared people falsely convicted of
crimes to which others offered eye-witness testimony that turned out to
be flawed.
And unfortunately, there's not one morsel of forensic evidence that
Jesus ever existed, nor any upholding most of the events in the Bible.
Too bad, so sad.
<Remaining drivel snipped>
A request: Would you Christers *please* get some new material? This
eye-witness argument has been refuted to death and back. We'd like
something fresh, if you can come up with anything. Thanks awfully.
Addition, how many "eye witnesses" were to Jesus praying alone in the
garden, tempted by Satan?, How many were there at the nativity? Why do
the accounts vary?
Occam's razor. Apply it.
Are the blades expensive? Cus I'm happy with the 12 for $1.99 Bics at
the store.
.
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|
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| User: "WhewAustralopithicus" |
|
| Title: Re: To Hell With Jesus: Zeus makes a comeback in Greece |
22 Jan 2007 01:59:10 PM |
|
|
"Lamey" <teandson@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:45b5f596.11138046@news.alt.net...
On 22 Jan 2007 09:11:34 -0800, "Hatter" <Hatter23@gmail.com> wrote:
skyeyes wrote:
"0" <0...@john-14-6.info> wrote:
<Snippage>
Eyewitness Testimony
In a court case, what kind of evidence is most condemning so far as
establishing the probability of guilt? Although circumstantial
evidence can
play a significant role, by far the most important evidence a
prosecutor can
muster is eyewitness testimony.
Not in this millenium. Forensics trumps eye witness testimony. Eye
witnesses misperceive, misremember, and sometimes lie. Evidence
doesn't tell fibs. Evidence has cleared people falsely convicted of
crimes to which others offered eye-witness testimony that turned out to
be flawed.
And unfortunately, there's not one morsel of forensic evidence that
Jesus ever existed, nor any upholding most of the events in the Bible.
Too bad, so sad.
<Remaining drivel snipped>
A request: Would you Christers *please* get some new material? This
eye-witness argument has been refuted to death and back. We'd like
something fresh, if you can come up with anything. Thanks awfully.
Addition, how many "eye witnesses" were to Jesus praying alone in the
garden, tempted by Satan?, How many were there at the nativity? Why do
the accounts vary?
Occam's razor. Apply it.
Are the blades expensive? Cus I'm happy with the 12 for $1.99 Bics at
the store.
Isn't that cute? A little joke... btw you can get those for just $.99 at
the 99 Cent Only Store
.
|
|
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| User: "Lamey" |
|
| Title: Re: To Hell With Jesus: Zeus makes a comeback in Greece |
22 Jan 2007 03:32:47 PM |
|
|
On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 11:59:10 -0800, "WhewAustralopithicus"
<d.stefano@ca.rr.com> wrote:
"Lamey" <teandson@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:45b5f596.11138046@news.alt.net...
On 22 Jan 2007 09:11:34 -0800, "Hatter" <Hatter23@gmail.com> wrote:
skyeyes wrote:
"0" <0...@john-14-6.info> wrote:
<Snippage>
Eyewitness Testimony
In a court case, what kind of evidence is most condemning so far as
establishing the probability of guilt? Although circumstantial
evidence can
play a significant role, by far the most important evidence a
prosecutor can
muster is eyewitness testimony.
Not in this millenium. Forensics trumps eye witness testimony. Eye
witnesses misperceive, misremember, and sometimes lie. Evidence
doesn't tell fibs. Evidence has cleared people falsely convicted of
crimes to which others offered eye-witness testimony that turned out to
be flawed.
And unfortunately, there's not one morsel of forensic evidence that
Jesus ever existed, nor any upholding most of the events in the Bible.
Too bad, so sad.
<Remaining drivel snipped>
A request: Would you Christers *please* get some new material? This
eye-witness argument has been refuted to death and back. We'd like
something fresh, if you can come up with anything. Thanks awfully.
Addition, how many "eye witnesses" were to Jesus praying alone in the
garden, tempted by Satan?, How many were there at the nativity? Why do
the accounts vary?
Occam's razor. Apply it.
Are the blades expensive? Cus I'm happy with the 12 for $1.99 Bics at
the store.
Isn't that cute? A little joke... btw you can get those for just $.99 at
the 99 Cent Only Store
You're the joke, Anyway, Teh 99 cent ones are to dull.
.
|
|
|
| User: "WhewAustralopithicus" |
|
| Title: Re: To Hell With Jesus: Zeus makes a comeback in Greece |
22 Jan 2007 05:22:53 PM |
|
|
"Lamey" <teandson@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:45b62d5d.1749875@news.alt.net...
On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 11:59:10 -0800, "WhewAustralopithicus"
<d.stefano@ca.rr.com> wrote:
"Lamey" <teandson@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:45b5f596.11138046@news.alt.net...
On 22 Jan 2007 09:11:34 -0800, "Hatter" <Hatter23@gmail.com> wrote:
skyeyes wrote:
"0" <0...@john-14-6.info> wrote:
<Snippage>
Eyewitness Testimony
In a court case, what kind of evidence is most condemning so far as
establishing the probability of guilt? Although circumstantial
evidence can
play a significant role, by far the most important evidence a
prosecutor can
muster is eyewitness testimony.
Not in this millenium. Forensics trumps eye witness testimony. Eye
witnesses misperceive, misremember, and sometimes lie. Evidence
doesn't tell fibs. Evidence has cleared people falsely convicted of
crimes to which others offered eye-witness testimony that turned out
to
be flawed.
And unfortunately, there's not one morsel of forensic evidence that
Jesus ever existed, nor any upholding most of the events in the Bible.
Too bad, so sad.
<Remaining drivel snipped>
A request: Would you Christers *please* get some new material? This
eye-witness argument has been refuted to death and back. We'd like
something fresh, if you can come up with anything. Thanks awfully.
Addition, how many "eye witnesses" were to Jesus praying alone in the
garden, tempted by Satan?, How many were there at the nativity? Why do
the accounts vary?
Occam's razor. Apply it.
Are the blades expensive? Cus I'm happy with the 12 for $1.99 Bics at
the store.
Isn't that cute? A little joke... btw you can get those for just $.99 at
the 99 Cent Only Store
You're the joke, Anyway, Teh 99 cent ones are to dull.
XLNT! Then they'll be just perfect for you..
.
|
|
|
| User: "Lamey" |
|
| Title: Re: To Hell With Jesus: Zeus makes a comeback in Greece |
22 Jan 2007 05:59:54 PM |
|
|
On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 15:22:53 -0800, "WhewAustralopithicus"
<d.stefano@ca.rr.com> wrote:
"Lamey" <teandson@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:45b62d5d.1749875@news.alt.net...
On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 11:59:10 -0800, "WhewAustralopithicus"
<d.stefano@ca.rr.com> wrote:
"Lamey" <teandson@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:45b5f596.11138046@news.alt.net...
On 22 Jan 2007 09:11:34 -0800, "Hatter" <Hatter23@gmail.com> wrote:
skyeyes wrote:
"0" <0...@john-14-6.info> wrote:
<Snippage>
Eyewitness Testimony
In a court case, what kind of evidence is most condemning so far as
establishing the probability of guilt? Although circumstantial
evidence can
play a significant role, by far the most important evidence a
prosecutor can
muster is eyewitness testimony.
Not in this millenium. Forensics trumps eye witness testimony. Eye
witnesses misperceive, misremember, and sometimes lie. Evidence
doesn't tell fibs. Evidence has cleared people falsely convicted of
crimes to which others offered eye-witness testimony that turned out
to
be flawed.
And unfortunately, there's not one morsel of forensic evidence that
Jesus ever existed, nor any upholding most of the events in the Bible.
Too bad, so sad.
<Remaining drivel snipped>
A request: Would you Christers *please* get some new material? This
eye-witness argument has been refuted to death and back. We'd like
something fresh, if you can come up with anything. Thanks awfully.
Addition, how many "eye witnesses" were to Jesus praying alone in the
garden, tempted by Satan?, How many were there at the nativity? Why do
the accounts vary?
Occam's razor. Apply it.
Are the blades expensive? Cus I'm happy with the 12 for $1.99 Bics at
the store.
Isn't that cute? A little joke... btw you can get those for just $.99 at
the 99 Cent Only Store
You're the joke, Anyway, Teh 99 cent ones are to dull.
XLNT! Then they'll be just perfect for you..
Baby? I could sand the hardest Cedar from Canada with this beard.
.
|
|
|
| User: "WhewAustralopithicus" |
|
| Title: Re: To Hell With Jesus: Zeus makes a comeback in Greece |
22 Jan 2007 09:20:20 PM |
|
|
"Lamey" <teandson@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:45c64fd0.10568968@news.alt.net...
On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 15:22:53 -0800, "WhewAustralopithicus"
<d.stefano@ca.rr.com> wrote:
"Lamey" <teandson@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:45b62d5d.1749875@news.alt.net...
On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 11:59:10 -0800, "WhewAustralopithicus"
<d.stefano@ca.rr.com> wrote:
"Lamey" <teandson@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:45b5f596.11138046@news.alt.net...
On 22 Jan 2007 09:11:34 -0800, "Hatter" <Hatter23@gmail.com> wrote:
skyeyes wrote:
"0" <0...@john-14-6.info> wrote:
<Snippage>
Eyewitness Testimony
In a court case, what kind of evidence is most condemning so far
as
establishing the probability of guilt? Although circumstantial
evidence can
play a significant role, by far the most important evidence a
prosecutor can
muster is eyewitness testimony.
Not in this millenium. Forensics trumps eye witness testimony. Eye
witnesses misperceive, misremember, and sometimes lie. Evidence
doesn't tell fibs. Evidence has cleared people falsely convicted of
crimes to which others offered eye-witness testimony that turned out
to
be flawed.
And unfortunately, there's not one morsel of forensic evidence that
Jesus ever existed, nor any upholding most of the events in the
Bible.
Too bad, so sad.
<Remaining drivel snipped>
A request: Would you Christers *please* get some new material?
This
eye-witness argument has been refuted to death and back. We'd like
something fresh, if you can come up with anything. Thanks awfully.
Addition, how many "eye witnesses" were to Jesus praying alone in the
garden, tempted by Satan?, How many were there at the nativity? Why do
the accounts vary?
Occam's razor. Apply it.
Are the blades expensive? Cus I'm happy with the 12 for $1.99 Bics at
the store.
Isn't that cute? A little joke... btw you can get those for just $.99
at
the 99 Cent Only Store
You're the joke, Anyway, Teh 99 cent ones are to dull.
XLNT! Then they'll be just perfect for you..
Baby? I could sand the hardest Cedar from Canada with this beard.
the one on your back?
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "Neil Kelsey" |
|
| Title: Re: To Hell With Jesus: Zeus makes a comeback in Greece |
22 Jan 2007 06:08:45 PM |
|
|
Lamey wrote:
On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 15:22:53 -0800, "WhewAustralopithicus"
<d.stefano@ca.rr.com> wrote:
"Lamey" <teandson@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:45b62d5d.1749875@news.alt.net...
On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 11:59:10 -0800, "WhewAustralopithicus"
<d.stefano@ca.rr.com> wrote:
"Lamey" <teandson@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:45b5f596.11138046@news.alt.net...
On 22 Jan 2007 09:11:34 -0800, "Hatter" <Hatter23@gmail.com> wrote:
skyeyes wrote:
"0" <0...@john-14-6.info> wrote:
<Snippage>
Eyewitness Testimony
In a court case, what kind of evidence is most condemning so far as
establishing the probability of guilt? Although circumstantial
evidence can
play a significant role, by far the most important evidence a
prosecutor can
muster is eyewitness testimony.
Not in this millenium. Forensics trumps eye witness testimony. Eye
witnesses misperceive, misremember, and sometimes lie. Evidence
doesn't tell fibs. Evidence has cleared people falsely convicted of
crimes to which others offered eye-witness testimony that turned out
to
be flawed.
And unfortunately, there's not one morsel of forensic evidence that
Jesus ever existed, nor any upholding most of the events in the Bible.
Too bad, so sad.
<Remaining drivel snipped>
A request: Would you Christers *please* get some new material? This
eye-witness argument has been refuted to death and back. We'd like
something fresh, if you can come up with anything. Thanks awfully.
Addition, how many "eye witnesses" were to Jesus praying alone in the
garden, tempted by Satan?, How many were there at the nativity? Why do
the accounts vary?
Occam's razor. Apply it.
Are the blades expensive? Cus I'm happy with the 12 for $1.99 Bics at
the store.
Isn't that cute? A little joke... btw you can get those for just $.99 at
the 99 Cent Only Store
You're the joke, Anyway, Teh 99 cent ones are to dull.
XLNT! Then they'll be just perfect for you..
Baby? I could sand the hardest Cedar from Canada with this beard.
Cedar is almost as soft as butter.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Lamey" |
|
| Title: Re: To Hell With Jesus: Zeus makes a comeback in Greece |
22 Jan 2007 06:20:55 PM |
|
|
On 22 Jan 2007 16:08:45 -0800, "Neil Kelsey" <neil_kelsey@hotmail.com>
wrote:
Lamey wrote:
On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 15:22:53 -0800, "WhewAustralopithicus"
<d.stefano@ca.rr.com> wrote:
"Lamey" <teandson@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:45b62d5d.1749875@news.alt.net...
On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 11:59:10 -0800, "WhewAustralopithicus"
<d.stefano@ca.rr.com> wrote:
"Lamey" <teandson@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:45b5f596.11138046@news.alt.net...
On 22 Jan 2007 09:11:34 -0800, "Hatter" <Hatter23@gmail.com> wrote:
skyeyes wrote:
"0" <0...@john-14-6.info> wrote:
<Snippage>
Eyewitness Testimony
In a court case, what kind of evidence is most condemning so far as
establishing the probability of guilt? Although circumstantial
evidence can
play a significant role, by far the most important evidence a
prosecutor can
muster is eyewitness testimony.
Not in this millenium. Forensics trumps eye witness testimony. Eye
witnesses misperceive, misremember, and sometimes lie. Evidence
doesn't tell fibs. Evidence has cleared people falsely convicted of
crimes to which others offered eye-witness testimony that turned out
to
be flawed.
And unfortunately, there's not one morsel of forensic evidence that
Jesus ever existed, nor any upholding most of the events in the Bible.
Too bad, so sad.
<Remaining drivel snipped>
A request: Would you Christers *please* get some new material? This
eye-witness argument has been refuted to death and back. We'd like
something fresh, if you can come up with anything. Thanks awfully.
Addition, how many "eye witnesses" were to Jesus praying alone in the
garden, tempted by Satan?, How many were there at the nativity? Why do
the accounts vary?
Occam's razor. Apply it.
Are the blades expensive? Cus I'm happy with the 12 for $1.99 Bics at
the store.
Isn't that cute? A little joke... btw you can get those for just $.99 at
the 99 Cent Only Store
You're the joke, Anyway, Teh 99 cent ones are to dull.
XLNT! Then they'll be just perfect for you..
Baby? I could sand the hardest Cedar from Canada with this beard.
Cedar is almost as soft as butter.
And what kind of butter do you eat? I build log homes with cedar, I
wouldn't want it on my potatoes.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Neil Kelsey" |
|
| Title: Re: To Hell With Jesus: Zeus makes a comeback in Greece |
22 Jan 2007 06:28:30 PM |
|
|
Lamey wrote:
On 22 Jan 2007 16:08:45 -0800, "Neil Kelsey" <neil_kelsey@hotmail.com>
wrote:
Lamey wrote:
On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 15:22:53 -0800, "WhewAustralopithicus"
<d.stefano@ca.rr.com> wrote:
"Lamey" <teandson@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:45b62d5d.1749875@news.alt.net...
On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 11:59:10 -0800, "WhewAustralopithicus"
<d.stefano@ca.rr.com> wrote:
"Lamey" <teandson@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:45b5f596.11138046@news.alt.net...
On 22 Jan 2007 09:11:34 -0800, "Hatter" <Hatter23@gmail.com> wrote:
skyeyes wrote:
"0" <0...@john-14-6.info> wrote:
<Snippage>
Eyewitness Testimony
In a court case, what kind of evidence is most condemning so far as
establishing the probability of guilt? Although circumstantial
evidence can
play a significant role, by far the most important evidence a
prosecutor can
muster is eyewitness testimony.
Not in this millenium. Forensics trumps eye witness testimony. Eye
witnesses misperceive, misremember, and sometimes lie. Evidence
doesn't tell fibs. Evidence has cleared people falsely convicted of
crimes to which others offered eye-witness testimony that turned out
to
be flawed.
And unfortunately, there's not one morsel of forensic evidence that
Jesus ever existed, nor any upholding most of the events in the Bible.
Too bad, so sad.
<Remaining drivel snipped>
A request: Would you Christers *please* get some new material? This
eye-witness argument has been refuted to death and back. We'd like
something fresh, if you can come up with anything. Thanks awfully.
Addition, how many "eye witnesses" were to Jesus praying alone in the
garden, tempted by Satan?, How many were there at the nativity? Why do
the accounts vary?
Occam's razor. Apply it.
Are the blades expensive? Cus I'm happy with the 12 for $1.99 Bics at
the store.
Isn't that cute? A little joke... btw you can get those for just $.99 at
the 99 Cent Only Store
You're the joke, Anyway, Teh 99 cent ones are to dull.
XLNT! Then they'll be just perfect for you..
Baby? I could sand the hardest Cedar from Canada with this beard.
Cedar is almost as soft as butter.
And what kind of butter do you eat? I build log homes with cedar, I
wouldn't want it on my potatoes.
HA! I'm just saying, cedar is pretty soft. I live right beside Stanley
Park in Vancouver, and we had a pretty good wind a couple of weeks ago.
There are acres and acres of disintegrated cedars after that storm,
it's an awesome sight. And the view is improved.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Lamey" |
|
| Title: Re: To Hell With Jesus: Zeus makes a comeback in Greece |
22 Jan 2007 06:31:29 PM |
|
|
On 22 Jan 2007 16:28:30 -0800, "Neil Kelsey" <neil_kelsey@hotmail.com>
wrote:
Lamey wrote:
On 22 Jan 2007 16:08:45 -0800, "Neil Kelsey" <neil_kelsey@hotmail.com>
wrote:
Lamey wrote:
On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 15:22:53 -0800, "WhewAustralopithicus"
<d.stefano@ca.rr.com> wrote:
"Lamey" <teandson@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:45b62d5d.1749875@news.alt.net...
On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 11:59:10 -0800, "WhewAustralopithicus"
<d.stefano@ca.rr.com> wrote:
"Lamey" <teandson@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:45b5f596.11138046@news.alt.net...
On 22 Jan 2007 09:11:34 -0800, "Hatter" <Hatter23@gmail.com> wrote:
skyeyes wrote:
"0" <0...@john-14-6.info> wrote:
<Snippage>
Eyewitness Testimony
In a court case, what kind of evidence is most condemning so far as
establishing the probability of guilt? Although circumstantial
evidence can
play a significant role, by far the most important evidence a
prosecutor can
muster is eyewitness testimony.
Not in this millenium. Forensics trumps eye witness testimony. Eye
witnesses misperceive, misremember, and sometimes lie. Evidence
doesn't tell fibs. Evidence has cleared people falsely convicted of
crimes to which others offered eye-witness testimony that turned out
to
be flawed.
And unfortunately, there's not one morsel of forensic evidence that
Jesus ever existed, nor any upholding most of the events in the Bible.
Too bad, so sad.
<Remaining drivel snipped>
A request: Would you Christers *please* get some new material? This
eye-witness argument has been refuted to death and back. We'd like
something fresh, if you can come up with anything. Thanks awfully.
Addition, how many "eye witnesses" were to Jesus praying alone in the
garden, tempted by Satan?, How many were there at the nativity? Why do
the accounts vary?
Occam's razor. Apply it.
Are the blades expensive? Cus I'm happy with the 12 for $1.99 Bics at
the store.
Isn't that cute? A little joke... btw you can get those for just $.99 at
the 99 Cent Only Store
You're the joke, Anyway, Teh 99 cent ones are to dull.
XLNT! Then they'll be just perfect for you..
Baby? I could sand the hardest Cedar from Canada with this beard.
Cedar is almost as soft as butter.
And what kind of butter do you eat? I build log homes with cedar, I
wouldn't want it on my potatoes.
HA! I'm just saying, cedar is pretty soft. I live right beside Stanley
Park in Vancouver, and we had a pretty good wind a couple of weeks ago.
There are acres and acres of disintegrated cedars after that storm,
it's an awesome sight. And the view is improved.
You don't like trees?
Our base logs come from near there. You guys can get a drink by Mt Dew
called Dew Fuel, We can't get it here. I like it.
So tuff beard huh?
.
|
|
|
| User: "Neil Kelsey" |
|
| Title: Re: To Hell With Jesus: Zeus makes a comeback in Greece |
22 Jan 2007 06:50:40 PM |
|
|
Lamey wrote:
On 22 Jan 2007 16:28:30 -0800, "Neil Kelsey" <neil_kelsey@hotmail.com>
wrote:
Lamey wrote:
On 22 Jan 2007 16:08:45 -0800, "Neil Kelsey" <neil_kelsey@hotmail.com>
wrote:
Lamey wrote:
On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 15:22:53 -0800, "WhewAustralopithicus"
<d.stefano@ca.rr.com> wrote:
"Lamey" <teandson@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:45b62d5d.1749875@news.alt.net...
On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 11:59:10 -0800, "WhewAustralopithicus"
<d.stefano@ca.rr.com> wrote:
"Lamey" <teandson@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:45b5f596.11138046@news.alt.net...
On 22 Jan 2007 09:11:34 -0800, "Hatter" <Hatter23@gmail.com> wrote:
skyeyes wrote:
"0" <0...@john-14-6.info> wrote:
<Snippage>
Eyewitness Testimony
In a court case, what kind of evidence is most condemning so far as
establishing the probability of guilt? Although circumstantial
evidence can
play a significant role, by far the most important evidence a
prosecutor can
muster is eyewitness testimony.
Not in this millenium. Forensics trumps eye witness testimony. Eye
witnesses misperceive, misremember, and sometimes lie. Evidence
doesn't tell fibs. Evidence has cleared people falsely convicted of
crimes to which others offered eye-witness testimony that turned out
to
be flawed.
And unfortunately, there's not one morsel of forensic evidence that
Jesus ever existed, nor any upholding most of the events in the Bible.
Too bad, so sad.
<Remaining drivel snipped>
A request: Would you Christers *please* get some new material? This
eye-witness argument has been refuted to death and back. We'd like
something fresh, if you can come up with anything. Thanks awfully.
Addition, how many "eye witnesses" were to Jesus praying alone in the
garden, tempted by Satan?, How many were there at the nativity? Why do
the accounts vary?
Occam's razor. Apply it.
Are the blades expensive? Cus I'm happy with the 12 for $1.99 Bics at
the store.
Isn't that cute? A little joke... btw you can get those for just $.99 at
the 99 Cent Only Store
You're the joke, Anyway, Teh 99 cent ones are to dull.
XLNT! Then they'll be just perfect for you..
Baby? I could sand the hardest Cedar from Canada with this beard.
Cedar is almost as soft as butter.
And what kind of butter do you eat? I build log homes with cedar, I
wouldn't want it on my potatoes.
HA! I'm just saying, cedar is pretty soft. I live right beside Stanley
Park in Vancouver, and we had a pretty good wind a couple of weeks ago.
There are acres and acres of disintegrated cedars after that storm,
it's an awesome sight. And the view is improved.
You don't like trees?
Love them! I'm just saying, this is an amazing sight. The trees will
grow back, it's a rainforest.
Our base logs come from near there. You guys can get a drink by Mt Dew
called Dew Fuel, We can't get it here. I like it.
I'll look for it. Where are you?
So tuff beard huh?
Yes. I'd like some photographic evidence though.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Lamey" |
|
| Title: Re: To Hell With Jesus: Zeus makes a comeback in Greece |
22 Jan 2007 06:56:16 PM |
|
|
On 22 Jan 2007 16:50:40 -0800, "Neil Kelsey" <neil_kelsey@hotmail.com>
wrote:
Lamey wrote:
On 22 Jan 2007 16:28:30 -0800, "Neil Kelsey" <neil_kelsey@hotmail.com>
wrote:
Lamey wrote:
On 22 Jan 2007 16:08:45 -0800, "Neil Kelsey" <neil_kelsey@hotmail.com>
wrote:
Lamey wrote:
On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 15:22:53 -0800, "WhewAustralopithicus"
<d.stefano@ca.rr.com> wrote:
"Lamey" <teandson@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:45b62d5d.1749875@news.alt.net...
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
