| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"FireBirdBlue" |
| Date: |
14 Sep 2006 04:28:07 AM |
| Object: |
TOBS: Science and the Future |
R. Pierce Butler wrote:
You can believe what your want and so can everyone else. That still
doesn't prove that God exists.
Try again
Also, science cannot foresee the future. It cannot even foresee the
results of its own discoveries. When DDT was developed, for example, it
was hoped that this new weapon would forever solve the problem of
insect pests. It would provide protection for plants and keep in check
those insects that spread diseases such as malaria. However, the German
newspaper Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung said that this "blessing for
mankind . . . an undreamed-of achievement for chemistry" later
became "a rather questionable blessing. . . . DDT's victory march
through Germany is over." And not only in Germany but also in many
other countries where its use has been banned. Science failed to
foresee the negative effects it would have on other forms of life,
including man.
Remember, too, Alfred Nobel, after whom the Nobel peace prize is named.
He was a man of peace, yet he invented dynamite. Why? He wrote to a
friend: "I should like to invent a substance or machine with such
terrible power of mass destruction that war would thereby be made
impossible for ever." Two world wars since Nobel's death have
proved that his invention failed to have the effect he hoped for.
Albert Einstein also hoped that the development of the atom bomb, based
largely upon his theories, would eliminate forever the danger of war.
Yet bitter wars are still being fought, and civilization finds itself
sitting on a nuclear powder keg, terrified that someone will light the
fuse. Shortly before he died, Einstein is reported to have said: "If
I had only known, I would have been a locksmith."
It is sadly ironic that science, which has improved the lives of so
many millions, has also provided the means by which man can destroy
himself. If only scientists could foretell the future! They cannot, of
course, but the Bible does.
.
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| User: "Bob Kolker" |
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| Title: Re: TOBS: Science and the Future |
14 Sep 2006 06:37:16 AM |
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FireBirdBlue wrote:
Also, science cannot foresee the future. It cannot even foresee the
results of its own discoveries. When DDT was developed, for example, it
was hoped that this new weapon would forever solve the problem of
insect pests. It would provide protection for plants and keep in check
those insects that spread diseases such as malaria. However, the German
newspaper Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung said that this "blessing for
mankind . . . an undreamed-of achievement for chemistry" later
became "a rather questionable blessing. . . . DDT's victory march
through Germany is over." And not only in Germany but also in many
other countries where its use has been banned. Science failed to
foresee the negative effects it would have on other forms of life,
including man.
In the case of DDT an evolutionist might well have allowed the
possiblility of bugs and chiggers to adapt to this chemical attack. It
was already know that bacteria and viruses adapt to anti-biotics, so why
not insects. Probably the chemists who developed DDT were not thorough
going biologists will studied in the theory of evolution.
Remember, too, Alfred Nobel, after whom the Nobel peace prize is named.
He was a man of peace, yet he invented dynamite. Why? He wrote to a
friend: "I should like to invent a substance or machine with such
terrible power of mass destruction that war would thereby be made
impossible for ever." Two world wars since Nobel's death have
proved that his invention failed to have the effect he hoped for.
Gattling, who invented the rapid fire gun bearing his name also had
similar hopes. Who hoped that his gun would make war so terrible that
people would stop going to war.
Albert Einstein also hoped that the development of the atom bomb, based
largely upon his theories, would eliminate forever the danger of war.
Yet bitter wars are still being fought, and civilization finds itself
sitting on a nuclear powder keg, terrified that someone will light the
fuse. Shortly before he died, Einstein is reported to have said: "If
I had only known, I would have been a locksmith."
Ditto, ditto. These failures to forsee the future are not failures of
scientific theories at all. Scientfic theory never have and never will
tell humans what they -ought- to do or not do. Science has absolutely
nothing to do with ethics or morality, especially physical science.
It is sadly ironic that science, which has improved the lives of so
many millions, has also provided the means by which man can destroy
himself. If only scientists could foretell the future! They cannot, of
course, but the Bible does.
Science tells us how the heavens go, not how to go to heaven. There is a
zero overlap between physical science and ethics. Physical science tells
us what the material universe is and how it works (in part, at least).
It has absolutely nothing to say about what is good or how we ought to act.
Bob Kolker
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| User: "=?iso-8859-1?B?fiBT5GJs6yB+?=" |
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| Title: Re: TOBS: Science and the Future from CREATIONIST literature |
14 Sep 2006 09:46:52 AM |
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"Bob Kolker" <nowhere@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:4mspp9F7k9svU1@individual.net...
FireBirdBlue (JABRIOL) wrote:
It is sadly ironic that science, which has improved the lives of so
many millions, has also provided the means by which man can destroy
himself. If only scientists could foretell the future! They cannot, of
course, but the Bible does.
Science tells us how the heavens go, not how to go to heaven. There is a
zero overlap between physical science and ethics. Physical science tells
us what the material universe is and how it works (in part, at least). It
has absolutely nothing to say about what is good or how we ought to act.
Bob Kolker
The material you replied to was copy & paste from the Watchtower Society
magazine. It's a technique used to get non-Jehovah's Witnesses to read
their rubbish and the poster gets time on his timecard for proselytizing.
Note: He selfishly adds a pond keepers NG which is totally off-topic just to
harass a woman poster there named Jan.
--
WE .....
"Men never do evil so completely and
cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
~ Blaise Pascal (1623-1662) ~
~~* ~~* ~~* ~~* ~~* ~~* ~~* ~~* ~~* ~~* ~~*
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| User: "Harvey@NZ" |
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| Title: Re: TOBS: Science and the Future |
14 Sep 2006 06:16:33 PM |
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Bob Kolker <nowhere@nowhere.com> wrote in
news:4mspp9F7k9svU1@individual.net:
FireBirdBlue wrote:
Also, science cannot foresee the future. It cannot even foresee the
results of its own discoveries. When DDT was developed, for example,
it was hoped that this new weapon would forever solve the problem of
insect pests. It would provide protection for plants and keep in
check those insects that spread diseases such as malaria. However,
the German newspaper Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung said that this
"blessing for mankind . . . an undreamed-of achievement for
chemistry" later became "a rather questionable blessing. . . . DDT's
victory march through Germany is over." And not only in Germany but
also in many other countries where its use has been banned. Science
failed to foresee the negative effects it would have on other forms
of life, including man.
In the case of DDT an evolutionist might well have allowed the
possiblility of bugs and chiggers to adapt to this chemical attack. It
was already know that bacteria and viruses adapt to anti-biotics, so
why not insects. Probably the chemists who developed DDT were not
thorough going biologists will studied in the theory of evolution.
Remember, too, Alfred Nobel, after whom the Nobel peace prize is
named. He was a man of peace, yet he invented dynamite. Why? He wrote
to a friend: "I should like to invent a substance or machine with
such terrible power of mass destruction that war would thereby be
made impossible for ever." Two world wars since Nobel's death have
proved that his invention failed to have the effect he hoped for.
Gattling, who invented the rapid fire gun bearing his name also had
similar hopes. Who hoped that his gun would make war so terrible that
people would stop going to war.
Albert Einstein also hoped that the development of the atom bomb,
based largely upon his theories, would eliminate forever the danger
of war. Yet bitter wars are still being fought, and civilization
finds itself sitting on a nuclear powder keg, terrified that someone
will light the fuse. Shortly before he died, Einstein is reported to
have said: "If I had only known, I would have been a locksmith."
Ditto, ditto. These failures to forsee the future are not failures of
scientific theories at all. Scientfic theory never have and never will
tell humans what they -ought- to do or not do. Science has absolutely
nothing to do with ethics or morality, especially physical science.
It is sadly ironic that science, which has improved the lives of so
many millions, has also provided the means by which man can destroy
himself. If only scientists could foretell the future! They cannot,
of course, but the Bible does.
Science tells us how the heavens go, not how to go to heaven. There is
a zero overlap between physical science and ethics. Physical science
tells us what the material universe is and how it works (in part, at
least). It has absolutely nothing to say about what is good or how we
ought to act.
Bob Kolker
We need to use the tools of science - reason and logic, and apply
these standards to religion, so that we can admit which
religions do in fact lead us on the wrong path.
And if it means proving that 'God' does not exist -
in the Jewish, Christian and Muslim sense (God is one and the
same, in all these cases) - then so be it.
To not use your reason and logic (ie. plain commonsense)
is to be foolish. Otherwise, people will lead you astray
(ie. church leaders, etc) and they do.
Harvey
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| User: "cactus" |
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| Title: Re: TOBS: Science and the Future |
14 Sep 2006 12:05:34 PM |
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FireBirdBlue wrote:
R. Pierce Butler wrote:
You can believe what your want and so can everyone else. That still
doesn't prove that God exists.
Try again
Also, science cannot foresee the future. It cannot even foresee the
results of its own discoveries. When DDT was developed, for example, it
was hoped that this new weapon would forever solve the problem of
insect pests. It would provide protection for plants and keep in check
those insects that spread diseases such as malaria. However, the German
newspaper Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung said that this "blessing for
mankind . . . an undreamed-of achievement for chemistry" later
became "a rather questionable blessing. . . . DDT's victory march
through Germany is over." And not only in Germany but also in many
other countries where its use has been banned. Science failed to
foresee the negative effects it would have on other forms of life,
including man.
Remember, too, Alfred Nobel, after whom the Nobel peace prize is named.
He was a man of peace, yet he invented dynamite. Why? He wrote to a
friend: "I should like to invent a substance or machine with such
terrible power of mass destruction that war would thereby be made
impossible for ever." Two world wars since Nobel's death have
proved that his invention failed to have the effect he hoped for.
Albert Einstein also hoped that the development of the atom bomb, based
largely upon his theories, would eliminate forever the danger of war.
Yet bitter wars are still being fought, and civilization finds itself
sitting on a nuclear powder keg, terrified that someone will light the
fuse. Shortly before he died, Einstein is reported to have said: "If
I had only known, I would have been a locksmith."
It is sadly ironic that science, which has improved the lives of so
many millions, has also provided the means by which man can destroy
himself. If only scientists could foretell the future! They cannot, of
course, but the Bible does.
The Bible does a great job of foretelling the mythic past. We are better
off taking it for what it is, a great mythic work that provides ethical
guidance that was far ahead of its time and is relevant today.
.
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| User: "Lucifer" |
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| Title: Re: TOBS: Science and the Future |
14 Sep 2006 01:21:25 PM |
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<snip>
The Bible does a great job of foretelling the mythic past. We are better
off taking it for what it is, a great mythic work that provides ethical
guidance that was far ahead of its time and is relevant today.
The bible is relevant today?
Cool, I really need some advice on how to beat my slaves properly
And as for my silk/viscose panne velvet, well I guess I'll have to
chuck that...shame, was looking forward to getting that coat finished.
.
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| User: "=?iso-8859-1?B?fiBT5GJs6yB+?=" |
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| Title: Re: TOBS: Science and the Future |
14 Sep 2006 02:04:33 PM |
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"Lucifer" <wyrdology@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1158258085.048520.192490@p79g2000cwp.googlegroups.com...
<snip>
The Bible does a great job of foretelling the mythic past. We are better
off taking it for what it is, a great mythic work that provides ethical
guidance that was far ahead of its time and is relevant today.
The bible is relevant today?
Cool, I really need some advice on how to beat my slaves properly
And as for my silk/viscose panne velvet, well I guess I'll have to
chuck that...shame, was looking forward to getting that coat finished.
And if you want another wife or concubine (unwilling sex toy and breeder)
you simply buy one or kill her family and kidnap her. See the OT for more
information.
--
SA........
That is really funny! The proscriptions of the Watchtower, which teaches
the traditions of MERE MEN, i.e., heretics, at that, as being equal with
the
pronouncements of Christ Himself! In most cases, they even SUPERSEDE
Christ
and have to 'reinterpret' him for the rest of society. (Credit to
BlackJack)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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| User: "WhiteDwarf" |
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| Title: Re: TOBS: Science and the Future |
14 Sep 2006 04:34:20 PM |
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~ Säblë ~ wrote:
"Lucifer" <wyrdology@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1158258085.048520.192490@p79g2000cwp.googlegroups.com...
<snip>
The Bible does a great job of foretelling the mythic past. We are better
off taking it for what it is, a great mythic work that provides ethical
guidance that was far ahead of its time and is relevant today.
The bible is relevant today?
Cool, I really need some advice on how to beat my slaves properly
And as for my silk/viscose panne velvet, well I guess I'll have to
chuck that...shame, was looking forward to getting that coat finished.
And if you want another wife or concubine (unwilling sex toy and
breeder) you simply buy one or kill her family and kidnap her. See the
OT for more information.
Or you can do what Carol's husband does, download porn about little
girls, and go at it like pee-wee herman turbo fist doll.
America you have that freedom.
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| User: "Henry Mankinna" |
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| Title: Re: TOBS: Science and the Future of JABRIOL - sex crazed Jehovahs Witness!!!!!!!!! |
14 Sep 2006 04:45:59 PM |
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"WhiteDwarf" is JABRIOL (sex obsessed sociopathic JW net stalker of Carol)
<WhiteDwarf@pornkiller.org> wrote in message
news:wVjOg.9453$Rw2.8815@trnddc02...
Tell us about the fine and holy fruit these Jehovahs Witnesses produced here
on Usenet:
Here's one from Jehovah's witness Sherwood:
Subject: Re: MMM? Madman or Genius??
From: SKP <sktoplay@ix.netcom.com>
Date: 2000/07/24
Newsgroups: alt.religion.jehovahs-witn
Sucking is fine as long as you are "not" thinking it is sexual even if it
your own *****.
Regards,
Sherwood
---------------- and:
And from JW FreezaFrost:
JeremyQuest@webtv.net (Freeza Frost) wrote, in Message-ID:
<4397-41392E3C-6@storefull-3136.bay.webtv.net>
lance, YER the pervert! sucked any dicks lately>
~Freeza Frost
-------------- and:
And from JW Botdette:
From: (Boydette)
Newsgroups: alt.religion.jehovahs-witn
Message-ID: <12503-41783D2D-929@storefull-3211.bay.webtv.net>
OMG YOU are such an *****!!! I knew you werent genuine....so go ahead
now when my email gets posted I guess you will deny its you....what a
dirty SOB you are... ...anyway how do you know any of that stuff I said
was...
true...***** YOU!!!!!
----------- and:
One from that fine JW L.Perez aka Lying Louie:
Louie Perez in Message ID <eb91c9d7.0205082019.5669cf91@posting.google.com>
AFAIC these are just FUCKHEAD spammers trying to pretend they
know how to write when everyone knows they just paid some out of work
writer to post these racist views from the money they got selling their
mama's
stank ***** on the street corner in the nearest city to the redneck
backwash they call home.-- Louie Perez
----------------and:
Here's two from the Jehovah's Witness jABRIOL:
A fine "witness" from a Jehovah Witness:
"WhiteDwarf" is JABRIOL aka Antonio L Santana <WhiteDwarf@pornkiller.org>
wrote in message news:wVjOg.9453$Rw2.8815@trnddc02...
Or you can do what Carol's husband does, download porn about little girls,
and go at it like pee-wee herman turbo fist doll.
America you have that freedom.
=========================================
Here's one from Antonio aka Jabriol:
Jabriol gives us a fine WITNESS:
"Kenran Butoh Sai" is JABRIOL; a Jehovah's Witness<sai@mailinator.com> wrote
in message news:BbmMg.1166$xr.100@trnddc03...
You left because you couldn't masturbate and screw women at 14?
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| User: "Bob Kolker" |
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| Title: Re: TOBS: Science and the Future |
14 Sep 2006 04:52:46 PM |
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~ Säblë ~ wrote:
And if you want another wife or concubine (unwilling sex toy and
breeder) you simply buy one or kill her family and kidnap her. See the
OT for more information.
The only people who take the OT literally are Protestants. For Jews, the
Main Book is the Talmud.
Bob Kolker
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| User: "=?iso-8859-1?B?fiBT5GJs6yB+?=" |
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| Title: Re: TOBS: Science and the Future |
14 Sep 2006 04:47:06 PM |
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"Bob Kolker" <nowhere@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:4mttr9F7sf7vU1@individual.net...
~ Säblë ~ wrote:
And if you want another wife or concubine (unwilling sex toy and breeder)
you simply buy one or kill her family and kidnap her. See the OT for
more information.
The only people who take the OT literally are Protestants. For Jews, the
Main Book is the Talmud.
Bob Kolker
Jews are a small number of our population.
--
SA.......
What the world needs is not dogma but an attitude of scientific
inquiry combined with a belief that the torture of millions is
not desirable, whether inflicted by Stalin or by a Deity imagined
in the likeness of the believer. ~ Bertrand Russell ~
~~ * ~~ * ~~ * ~~ * ~~ * ~~ * ~~ * ~~ * ~~ * ~~ * ~~ * ~~ * ~~
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| User: "FireBirdBlue" |
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| Title: Re: TOBS: Science and the Future |
14 Sep 2006 05:34:24 PM |
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~ S=E4bl=EB ~ wrote:
Jews are a small number of our population.
--
SA.......
What the world needs is not dogma but an attitude of scientific
inquiry combined with a belief that the torture of millions is
not desirable, whether inflicted by Stalin or by a Deity imagined
in the likeness of the believer. ~ Bertrand Russell ~
~~ * ~~ * ~~ * ~~ * ~~ * ~~ * ~~ * ~~ * ~~ * ~~ * ~~ * ~~ * ~~
What Carol is saying, Hitler saw to that, and thus the Jews are not
important.
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| User: "Bob Kolker" |
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| Title: Re: TOBS: Science and the Future |
14 Sep 2006 06:41:02 PM |
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~ Säblë ~ wrote:
Jews are a small number of our population.
Then talk to the Protestants. Strange. The OT was written by an for
Jews, but it is the Protestants who take it literally.
Bob Kolker
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| User: "=?iso-8859-1?B?fiBT5GJs6yB+?=" |
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| Title: Re: TOBS: Science and the Future |
14 Sep 2006 06:15:50 PM |
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"Bob Kolker" <nowhere@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:4mu469F7oh3vU1@individual.net...
~ Säblë ~ wrote:
Jews are a small number of our population.
Then talk to the Protestants. Strange. The OT was written by an for Jews,
but it is the Protestants who take it literally.
No one should take it literally. It's nothing but ancient myths and fables
designed to scare people into someone's idea of acceptable behavior.
I know little about the Jewish faith so lets stick to Christendom. :-)
--
SA........
Deuteronomy 22:23-24 " If a damsel that is a virgin be betrothed unto an
husband, and a man find her in the city, and lie with her; Then ye shall
bring them both out unto the gate of that city, and ye shall stone them with
stones that they die.
God punishes the INNOCENT along with the guilty!
~~~<~~~~~<~~~<~~~{@ ~~~~<~~~~~<~~~~<~~~{@
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| User: "Bob Kolker" |
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| Title: Re: TOBS: Science and the Future |
15 Sep 2006 03:51:14 AM |
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~ Säblë ~ wrote:
No one should take it literally. It's nothing but ancient myths and
fables designed to scare people into someone's idea of acceptable behavior.
It also has some ethical content. It was precisely the ethical aspect
(and some ceremonial practices) that was abstracted into the Talmud. R.
Hillel teaches that the whole content of the Bible can be mapped onto
the Golden Rule.* All the fire and brimstone material is purely for
entertainment and good storty telling.
I know little about the Jewish faith so lets stick to Christendom. :-)
Christianity is all yours. I would not touch it with a long stick.
Bob Kolker
Golden Rule. Not the Christian version which is a muck-up. The Jewish
version is: what every you find hateful if done to you, don't do it to
the other guy. The Christian version is altruistic nonsense.
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| User: "=?iso-8859-1?B?fiBT5GJs6yB+?=" |
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| Title: Re: TOBS: Science and the Future |
15 Sep 2006 10:58:01 AM |
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"Bob Kolker" <nowhere@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:4mv4e0F7o1acU1@individual.net...
~ Säblë ~ wrote:
No one should take it literally. It's nothing but ancient myths and
fables designed to scare people into someone's idea of acceptable
behavior.
It also has some ethical content. It was precisely the ethical aspect (and
some ceremonial practices) that was abstracted into the Talmud. R. Hillel
teaches that the whole content of the Bible can be mapped onto the Golden
Rule.* All the fire and brimstone material is purely for entertainment and
good storty telling.
LOL!!!! :-) If you're into murder and mayhem! Old Jehovah sure liked to
kill off his pet humans. We don't kill dogs like this ancient god killed
people. Reading the bible really turned me off to this old god.
I know little about the Jewish faith so lets stick to Christendom. :-)
Christianity is all yours. I would not touch it with a long stick.
No thanks.... just look at how people who claim to be Christians treat
others on these NGs. Who on earth would want to be one of them?
Bob Kolker
Golden Rule. Not the Christian version which is a muck-up. The Jewish
version is: what every you find hateful if done to you, don't do it to the
other guy. The Christian version is altruistic nonsense.
SA........
This JW L.Perez aka Lying Louie gave us this "witness":
Louie Perez in Message ID <eb91c9d7.0205082019.5669cf91@posting.google.com>
AFAIC these are just FUCKHEAD spammers trying to pretend they
know how to write when everyone knows they just paid some out of work
writer to post these racist views from the money they got selling their
mama's
stank ***** on the street corner in the nearest city to the redneck
backwash they call home.-- Louie Perez
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| User: "cactus" |
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| Title: Re: TOBS: Science and the Future |
14 Sep 2006 04:54:34 PM |
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Bob Kolker wrote:
~ Säblë ~ wrote:
And if you want another wife or concubine (unwilling sex toy and
breeder) you simply buy one or kill her family and kidnap her. See
the OT for more information.
The only people who take the OT literally are Protestants. For Jews, the
Main Book is the Talmud.
Bob Kolker
With all due respect, this is not completely true. Judaism's Main Book
is Torah, the Five Books of Moses. The other books in Tanach are history
and literature. The Talmudim (Babylonian and Palestinian) are documents
that explain how to live life according to the principles set out in Torah.
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| User: "Bob Kolker" |
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| Title: Re: TOBS: Science and the Future |
14 Sep 2006 06:43:04 PM |
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cactus wrote:
With all due respect, this is not completely true. Judaism's Main Book
is Torah, the Five Books of Moses. The other books in Tanach are history
and literature. The Talmudim (Babylonian and Palestinian) are documents
that explain how to live life according to the principles set out in Torah.
The Torah as interpreted by the Rabbis. Hence the Oral Tradition, which
when it was finally written down became the Talmud. Judaism ceased to be
a biblically based religion thousands of years ago. Do you see Jews
carrying a little shovel to bury their *****? But that is one of the 613
mitvot. Carry a shovel to bury your ***** or God will step in it.
Bob Kolker
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| User: "=?iso-8859-1?B?fiBT5GJs6yB+?=" |
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| Title: Re: TOBS: Science and the Future |
14 Sep 2006 06:18:37 PM |
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"Bob Kolker" <nowhere@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:4mu4a3F7oh3vU2@individual.net...
The Torah as interpreted by the Rabbis. Hence the Oral Tradition, which
when it was finally written down became the Talmud. Judaism ceased to be a
biblically based religion thousands of years ago. Do you see Jews carrying
a little shovel to bury their *****? But that is one of the 613 mitvot.
Carry a shovel to bury your ***** or God will step in it.
And don't forget to marry off the victim of rape to her rapist so her life
is totally destroyed. And if your brother dies you *MUST* have sex with is
wife so she can bear a child in his name. Where did this god come up with
this stuff?
SA...........
Here you will find clinical studies proving that the Jehovah's Witnesses
exhibit rates of mental illness between four and forty times the average
for the population at large:
http://www.rickross.com/reference/jw/jw73.html
http://google.com/groups?selm=D3J0QI5Z38234.4565046296@anonymous.poster
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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| User: "WhiteDwarf" |
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| Title: Re: TOBS: Science and the Future |
14 Sep 2006 04:28:37 PM |
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Lucifer wrote:
<snip>
The Bible does a great job of foretelling the mythic past. We are better
off taking it for what it is, a great mythic work that provides ethical
guidance that was far ahead of its time and is relevant today.
The bible is relevant today?
Cool, I really need some advice on how to beat my slaves properly
And as for my silk/viscose panne velvet, well I guess I'll have to
chuck that...shame, was looking forward to getting that coat finished.
Don't go too far back. The US constitution was written That all men were
igual...except blacks. If you consider the Bible as not useful nor
valid. Neither is the american constitution. Look at what freedom of
Press and religion has done.
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| User: "=?iso-8859-1?B?fiBT5GJs6yB+?=" |
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| Title: Re: TOBS: Science and the Future |
14 Sep 2006 02:02:05 PM |
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"cactus" <bm1@nonespam.com> wrote in message
news:yZfOg.1165$6S3.680@newssvr25.news.prodigy.net...
The Bible does a great job of foretelling the mythic past. We are better
off taking it for what it is, a great mythic work that provides ethical
guidance that was far ahead of its time and is relevant today.
Relevant today? Would you kill a girl's family just to have her as an
unwilling concubine or 2nd or 3rd wife? Would you keep human slaves? Would
you stone your new bride to death if you suspected he wasn't a virgin on
your wedding night? Would you stone an unruly child to death? I think you
need to actually READ the bible. :-)
--
SA.............
Would you enjoy having someone read each issue of The Watchtower to you for
the next year? Well, then, fill in and mail the accompanying coupon, along
with the proper contribution, and receive your subscription for The
Watchtower on cassette tapes. A recording of each issue of the magazine on a
single cassette will be mailed to you, two cassettes a month, 24 for the
year's subscription. The contribution is only $36 (U.S.). For persons
certified as blind or physically unable to read normal reading material, the
year's subscription will be only $12 (U.S.).
Please send a year's subscription for the cassettes of The Watchtower. Check
the applicable box, and remit the proper contribution.
[ ] English, 1 year. I enclose $36.
[ ] English, 1 year. I enclose $12, as well as certification of my
disability (as supplied by organizations for the blind, doctors,
rehabilitation professionals, or others).
----------> This Is The Watchtower's Idea of FREE literature <-------
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| User: "WhiteDwarf" |
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| Title: Re: TOBS: Science and the Future |
14 Sep 2006 04:31:58 PM |
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~ Säblë ~ wrote:
"cactus" <bm1@nonespam.com> wrote in message
news:yZfOg.1165$6S3.680@newssvr25.news.prodigy.net...
The Bible does a great job of foretelling the mythic past. We are
better off taking it for what it is, a great mythic work that provides
ethical guidance that was far ahead of its time and is relevant today.
Relevant today? Would you kill a girl's family just to have her as an
unwilling concubine or 2nd or 3rd wife?
And yet American troops will drop a bomb on a house during an Iraqi
wedding ceremony... in self defense, and Carolyn Gulley says that some
types of porn is ok. Like the Porn her husbands downloads to satisfy his
addiction.
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| User: "=?iso-8859-1?B?fiBT5GJs6yB+?=" |
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| Title: Re: TOBS: Science and the Future |
14 Sep 2006 04:49:08 PM |
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"WhiteDwarf" <WhiteDwarf@pornkiller.org> is (JABRIOL) Jehovah's Witness Porn
addicted pervert,
net-stalker, pathological liar and well known sociopath
wrote in message: /SNIP slander of victims.
Here's the complete original lists of the porn groups either Antonio L. or
Norma I.
Santana downloaded:
NOTE: Jabriol is not Carol's husband or is she the daughter (named Revis)
that he abused and lost to the state of NJ.
Complaint addresses (for tracking only, do not use):
Verizon 71.245.204.107
Verizon does not have internet service in the area where Antonio Santana's
victims live.
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
@@BEGIN NCM HEADERS
Version: 0.9
Issuer:
Verizon 71.245.204.107
Type: spam
Action: hide
Notice-ID: binnew.20021021210432
Hierarchies: acc,alt,alt.binaries
Count: 7
@@BEGIN NCM BODY
# NNTP-Posting-Host: Verizon 71.245.204.107 jtQmrZaFIfFMRSA9YuWzjA==
21.304/5
<cDAr9.5520$NV...@news.Verizon.com>
alt.binaires.pictures.erotica.teen
alt.binaries.erotica.fetish
alt.binaries.erotica.sex.in.the.morning
alt.binaries.pictures.child.erotica.female
alt.binaries.pictures.child.erotica.male
alt.binaries.pictures.cocks
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.bestiality
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.bestiality.hamster.duct-tape
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.teen.*****
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.transvestites
# NNTP-Posting-Host: Verizon 71.245.204.107 jtQmrZaFIfFMRSA9YuWzjA==
21.304/5
<Pgks9.6177$NV.111...@news.Verizon.com> alt.religion.christian.baptist
alt.religion.christianity
alt.religion.gnostic.orders
alt.religion.goddess
alt.religion.gods
alt.religion.hindu
alt.religion.islam
alt.religion.islam.shia
alt.religion.jaffo
alt.religion.jehovahs-witn
alt.religion.sexuality
# NNTP-Posting-Host: Verizon 71.245.204.107 jtQmrZaFIfFMRSA9YuWzjA==
21.304/5
<lahs9.5872$NV.109...@news.verizon.com>
alt.binaires.pictures.erotica.teen
alt.binaries.erotica.fetish
alt.binaries.erotica.sex.in.the.morning
alt.binaries.pictures.child.erotica.female
alt.binaries.pictures.child.erotica.male
alt.binaries.pictures.cocks
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.bestiality
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.bestiality.hamster.duct-tape
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.teen.*****
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.transvestites
# NNTP-Posting-Host: Verizon 71.245.204.107 21.304/5
<obis9.5980$NV.110...@news.Verizon.com>
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.transexual.action
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.transvestites
# NNTP-Posting-Host: Verizon 71.245.204.107 21.304/5
<1IWs9.7257$NV.125...@news.Verizon.com>
alt.personal
alt.personal.ads
alt.personals
alt.personals.ads
alt.personals.aliens
alt.personals.asian
alt.personals.bi
alt.personals.bi.newjersey
alt.personals.big-folk
alt.personals.big-folks
alt.personals.homosexual
alt.religion.sexuality
# NNTP-Posting-Host: Verizon 71.245.204.107 21.304/5
<OiXs9.7361$NV.125...@news.Verizon.com>
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.teen.female.*****
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.teen.female.masterbation
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.teen.female.masturbation
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.teen.female.orgasm
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.teen.*****
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.teen.male
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.teensex
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.torture.alt.binaries.pictures
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.transexual.action
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.transvestites
@@END NCM BODY
Checked your logs Antonio Santana Camden NJ for all messages from the
following originating IP
: Verizon 71.245.204.107
This account is being monitored for Child Pornography activity by
Anti-child Porn organizations. Since you are located in the USA, your
service may be investigated by Federal authorities.
The Spammer Antonio L. Santana
has sent more than 100 MCP and ECP to these groups. Please take action in
the next 24 hours or you will be reported to
news.admin.net-abuse.blocklisting and you will never be ale to run a
server again. Please read news.admin.net-abuse.blocklisting FAQ's
talk
The same originating IP has been responsivle for a NoCem Alert
The NoCeM protocol and clients see http://www.cm.org/
Please review:
The following NoCeM notice lists articles which have been determined
to be excessively posted. This determination is made by applying the
normal spam thresholds to all encoded (base64 or uuencoded) entities
present in the article. (Entities under a minimum size are ignored
unless they constitute most of the article body.)
This is a newly-detected spam.
The additional information provided is:
# ORIGIN-SITE NNTP-POSTING-HOST TRACKING-ID BI/DAYS
Complaint addresses (for tracking only, do not use):
Verizon 71.245.204.107
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
@@BEGIN NCM HEADERS
Version: 0.9
Issuer:
Verizon 71.245.204.107
Type: spam
Action: hide
Notice-ID: binnew.20021021210432
Hierarchies: acc,alt,alt.binaries
Count: 7
@@BEGIN NCM BODY
# NNTP-Posting-Host: Verizon 71.245.204.107 jtQmrZaFIfFMRSA9YuWzjA==
21.304/5
<cDAr9.5520$NV...@news.Verizon.com>
alt.binaires.pictures.erotica.teen
alt.binaries.erotica.fetish
alt.binaries.erotica.sex.in.the.morning
alt.binaries.pictures.child.erotica.female
alt.binaries.pictures.child.erotica.male
alt.binaries.pictures.cocks
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.bestiality
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.bestiality.hamster.duct-tape
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.teen.*****
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.transvestites
# NNTP-Posting-Host: Verizon 71.245.204.107 jtQmrZaFIfFMRSA9YuWzjA==
21.304/5
<Pgks9.6177$NV.111...@news.Verizon.com> alt.religion.christian.baptist
alt.religion.christianity
alt.religion.gnostic.orders
alt.religion.goddess
alt.religion.gods
alt.religion.hindu
alt.religion.islam
alt.religion.islam.shia
alt.religion.jaffo
alt.religion.jehovahs-witn
alt.religion.sexuality
# NNTP-Posting-Host: Verizon 71.245.204.107 jtQmrZaFIfFMRSA9YuWzjA==
21.304/5
<lahs9.5872$NV.109...@news.Verizon.com>
alt.binaires.pictures.erotica.teen
alt.binaries.erotica.fetish
alt.binaries.erotica.sex.in.the.morning
alt.binaries.pictures.child.erotica.female
alt.binaries.pictures.child.erotica.male
alt.binaries.pictures.cocks
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.bestiality
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.bestiality.hamster.duct-tape
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.teen.*****
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.transvestites
# NNTP-Posting-Host: Verizon 71.245.204.107 21.304/5
<obis9.5980$NV.110...@news.Verizon.com>
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.transexual.action
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.transvestites
# NNTP-Posting-Host: Verizon 71.245.204.107 21.304/5
<1IWs9.7257$NV.125...@news.Verizon.com> alt.personal
alt.personal.ads
alt.personals
alt.personals.ads
alt.personals.aliens
alt.personals.asian
alt.personals.bi
alt.personals.bi.newjersey
alt.personals.big-folk
alt.personals.big-folks
alt.personals.homosexual
alt.religion.sexuality
# NNTP-Posting-Host: Verizon 71.245.204.107 21.304/5
<OiXs9.7361$NV.125...@news.Verizon.com>
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.teen.female.*****
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.teen.female.masterbation
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.teen.female.masturbation
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.teen.female.orgasm
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.teen.*****
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.teen.male
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.teensex
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.torture.alt.binaries.pictures
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.transexual.action
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.transvestites
@@END NCM BODY
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Verizon: 2.6.3i
Charset: noconv
Jersey City hub: vn%.nj
===============
SA........
Antonio L Santana givea a fine "Witness" to Usenet.
"LowCarb" JABRIOL (Antonio L Santana) wrote in message
news:1158114517.098013.296750@i3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
I guees her conscious pains her, that she is not woman enough to satify
her husband, that he turn to porn... and this is the only way that fat
Sow can respond.
*Note: Antonio Santana not only calls African Americans
"black ***** human wannabe baboons" but calls women "fat
sows." What a fine "witness" he gives!!!!!!!
=======================================================
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| User: "FireBirdBlue" |
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| Title: Re: TOBS: Science and the Future |
14 Sep 2006 05:25:57 PM |
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cactus wrote:
The Bible does a great job of foretelling the mythic past. We are better
Let think about what you said, consider just a few examples from the
past where the Bible has accurately foretold what was going to happen.
In the book of Daniel, a part of the Bible written during the time of
the Babylonian Empire in the sixth century BCE, a prophecy was
recorded foretelling that Persia and then Greece would follow Babylon
as world powers. It then foretold that the great Greek Empire would be
divided into four smaller powers, and it convincingly described the
ironlike empire of Rome that would come next. (Daniel 7:1-8; 8:3-8,
20-22) Everything happened as prophesied.
An interesting foreview of the future had to do with the city of Tyre,
to the north of Israel. Ezekiel prophesied that Tyre would be destroyed
by Nebuchadnezzar and gave these details about its ultimate fate: "I
will scrape her dust away from her and make her a shining, bare surface
of a crag. . . . And your stones and your woodwork and your dust they
will place in the very midst of the water. . . . The vast waters will
have covered you." (Ezekiel 26:4, 12, 19) Did this happen?
Yes, it did. Sometime after he destroyed Jerusalem, King Nebuchadnezzar
came against Tyre and overpowered it. However, the city did not totally
disappear. Its inhabitants fled to an offshore island, which they
fortified. Then, almost three hundred years later, Alexander the Great
besieged what by then had become the island city of Tyre. So that his
army could attack the island, he took the ruins of the ancient mainland
city and threw them into the sea to make a causeway out to the island
city. Hence, in remarkably literal detail, the prophecy was fulfilled.
The dust of the ancient city of Tyre was scraped away, and the stones,
the woodwork and the very dust were thrown into the water.
Even more remarkable are the prophecies relating to Jesus Christ. The
Bible foretold not only the time of his appearance as Messiah but also
the things he would do, and even the death he would die. Jesus' whole
life course was in fulfillment of prophecies written hundreds of years
in advance.-Daniel 9:24-27; Isaiah 53:3-9; 61:1, 2.
Even today, Bible students can see remarkable fulfillments of prophecy
in the present political developments. (See, for example, Matthew
24:7-15 and Luke 21:25-28.) And when they read Paul's words in Second
Timothy chapter three, verses one to five, they see a very accurate
description of this world's deteriorating moral climate. Moreover,
the Bible prophesies things for our future too.
It foretells a startling solution to the world's present political
crisis. Speaking of today's competing world rulers, it says: "In
the days of those kings the God of heaven will set up a kingdom that
will never be brought to ruin. And the kingdom itself will not be
passed on to any other people. It will crush and put an end to all
these kingdoms, and it itself will stand to times
indefinite."-Daniel 2:44.
There are many reasons why we can believe that promise, not the least
being that, up to now, all the prophecies in the Bible have come true.
But just consider the implications. This means that God's kingdom
will soon provide just one government for the whole earth, replacing
the nationalistic, warring governments of today. What a difference this
will make!
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| User: "Bob Kolker" |
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| Title: Re: TOBS: Science and the Future |
14 Sep 2006 06:45:07 PM |
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FireBirdBlue wrote:
Let think about what you said, consider just a few examples from the
past where the Bible has accurately foretold what was going to happen.
In the book of Daniel, a part of the Bible written during the time of
the Babylonian Empire in the sixth century BCE, a prophecy was
recorded foretelling that Persia and then Greece would follow Babylon
as world powers. It then foretold that the great Greek Empire would be
divided into four smaller powers, and it convincingly described the
ironlike empire of Rome that would come next. (Daniel 7:1-8; 8:3-8,
20-22) Everything happened as prophesied.
The book of Daniel never mentioned Rome, not even once. It is only crazy
Protestants that read their delusions into the Book of Daniel which is
an Aramaic hodge podge. When Daniel was in Babylon there was no Rome.
The worst thing that ever happened to the TNKH (the Hebrew Scriptures)
was that the goyim got a hold of it.
Bob Kolker
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| User: "FireBirdBlue" |
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| Title: Re: TOBS: Science and the Future |
14 Sep 2006 05:53:22 PM |
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Bob Kolker wrote:
The book of Daniel never mentioned Rome, not even once. It is only crazy
Protestants that read their delusions into the Book of Daniel which is
an Aramaic hodge podge. When Daniel was in Babylon there was no Rome.
The worst thing that ever happened to the TNKH (the Hebrew Scriptures)
was that the goyim got a hold of it.
Bob Kolker
The Bible gives us a record, either actual or prophetic, of seven world
powers during mankind's history. These are not small, insignificant
powers, but powers that had the greatest influence during their term of
existence. Each, during its time, was the Number One Power with which
the nations had to reckon. These were: Egypt, Assyria, Babylon,
Medo-Persia, Greece, Rome and the Anglo-American World Power. The
prophecy of the Bible book of Daniel accurately spoke of the powers of
Daniel's own day, namely, Babylon and Medo-Persia, then foretold the
three to follow. The prophecy called the Medo-Persian and the Grecian
World Powers by name and described the following two. What did
Daniel's prophecy have to say about them?
In the vision that God gave him, Daniel saw four huge beasts,
representing or picturing "kings." (Dan. 7:17) These symbolic
beasts were a lion (Babylon), a bear (Medo-Persia) and a leopard
(Greece), followed by a fearsome beast with teeth of iron, different
from all the others, and having ten horns. Out of this beast another
"king," a small horn, grew to become prominent, speaking grandiose
words. This final horn faced judgment, not inflicted by another world
power, but a judgment directly administered by the Almighty God. The
terrible beast was the Roman World Power and the horn growing out of it
was the Seventh World Power, which would constitute the last one on
earth. That is the Anglo-American World Power.-Dan. 7:2-12; compare
Daniel 8:20-22.
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| User: "Bob Kolker" |
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| Title: Re: TOBS: Science and the Future |
15 Sep 2006 03:47:15 AM |
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FireBirdBlue wrote:
The Bible gives us a record, either actual or prophetic,
Stop! Right there! Prophecy is insanity!
The Bible, taken literally also tells us the world is 6000 years old
(give or take a few hundred) and the Sun was created on the forth day.
This is anti-factual *****.
Rabbi Schlomo Yitzak (the Rashi) never took Genesis seriously. He
explained the creation story was part of TNKH only to show God was the
maker and owner of the world and that He could give the Holy Land to
whomsoever He pleased. In this case, it was gifted to the Jews. Now this
non-literal understanding is saner than anything you propose. It is also
more convenient from the point of view of Jewish interests.
That is why the TNKH was morphed into the ethical guidance of the Talmud
and that is why Judiasm is a Talmudic Religion rather than a Biblical
Religion. Now if the people who wrote the bible in the first place (the
Jews) do not take it literally and regard it only as an ethical guide
(and this pertains only to parts of the Bible), which do Protestant
wingdings take the Bible as literal truth? It is totally insane. It is
like basing a religion on Tolkien's novels. Sane people do not do this
sort of thing.
Bob Kolker
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| User: "WhiteDwarf" |
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| Title: Re: TOBS: Science and the Future |
15 Sep 2006 04:30:16 AM |
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Bob Kolker wrote:
FireBirdBlue wrote:
The Bible gives us a record, either actual or prophetic,
Stop! Right there! Prophecy is insanity!
The Bible, taken literally also tells us the world is 6000 years old
(give or take a few hundred) and the Sun was created on the forth day.
This is anti-factual *****.
Not at all. The Bible understood in it original language would tell you
the world and life on it is a few millions years old. Please don't
parrot YEC.
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| User: "Bob Kolker" |
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| Title: Re: TOBS: Science and the Future |
15 Sep 2006 08:41:50 AM |
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WhiteDwarf wrote:
Not at all. The Bible understood in it original language would tell you
the world and life on it is a few millions years old. Please don't
parrot YEC.
I read the Bible in Hebrew. In any language, the Creation story is
literally nonsensical. The word Yom in hebrew means day. The twenty four
hour variety. Erev and Boker means evening and morning. But require a
sunrise (or more exactly, an earth-turn). So their could not have been
an evening and a morning on days one to three.
And then we come to the Flood. There never was enough water on this
planet or in its atmospher to cover the earth to a depth of the highest
mountains plus fifteen cubits. Take the depth equal to the height of Mt.
Everest plus fifteen cubits and work out what volume of water that would
require. There is not enough water on this planet and there never was.
B'rayshis (Genesis) is literal nonsense. A fairy tale. Tolkien's
creation myth in -The Silmarillion- is better written.
Bob Kolker
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| User: "=?iso-8859-1?B?fiBT5GJs6yB+?=" |
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| Title: Re: TOBS: Science and the Future |
15 Sep 2006 11:04:27 AM |
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"Bob Kolker" <nowhere@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:4mvlesF84j55U1@individual.net...
B'rayshis (Genesis) is literal nonsense. A fairy tale. Tolkien's creation
myth in -The Silmarillion- is better written.
The story of Adam and Eve and the talking animals is equally
nonsensical.......
--
SA............
http://silentlambs.org
http://www.cultwatch.com/jw.html
www.freeminds.org
http://dbhome.dk/carlo/ secret Elder's Manual
"Properly read, the Bible is the most potent
force for atheism ever conceived."
-= Isaac Asimov =-
~~~~ }<((((o> ~~~~ }<{{{{{Ò> ~~~~ }<((({ö> ~~~~
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| User: "Bob Kolker" |
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| Title: Re: TOBS: Science and the Future |
15 Sep 2006 12:24:06 PM |
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~ Säblë ~ wrote:>
The story of Adam and Eve and the talking animals is equally
nonsensical.......
Genesis is where the Adam and Chayah story is. Talking asses occur in
the Book of Number (Ba Midbar) in parshat Balak. Bilam's talking ***** is
probably part of a dream sequence. Asses don't talk.
Bob Kolker
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