| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"Elroy Willis" |
| Date: |
31 Jul 2005 06:55:56 AM |
| Object: |
Trembling Before G-d |
Anyone else around here catch "Trembling Before G-d" on the LOGO
channel this week?
It's about how the orthodox Jews shun gay Jews in their communities,
and it was surprising and actually a bit depressing to watch.
http://channel.creative-capital.org/grantee_154.html
I thought anti-gay Christians were bad enough, but it seems that the
orthodox Jews are just as bad, with some of them wearing sackcloths on
the side of the street with signs saying things to the effect of "G-d
hates fags," no different than Fred Phelps and his ilk.
I'm not personally gay, but I feel sorry for the Jewish and Christian
gays who are shunned by their families and community, and I suspect
it's no different in the Muslim world.
If it weren't for religion, would other people really care if other
people were gay or straight?
--
Elroy Willis
www.elroysemporium.com
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| User: "GoDrex" |
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| Title: Re: Trembling Before G-d |
31 Jul 2005 10:31:37 AM |
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"Elroy Willis" <elroywillis@swbell.net> wrote in message
news:65epe1hqm6l9ta1dif380qrm88lao3851s@4ax.com...
If it weren't for religion, would other people really care if other
people were gay or straight?
I'm sure there'd still be homophobia. I've known guys that weren't religious
at all that hated gay people.
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| User: "Clayton From The Church Of Jesus Christ Youve Got To Be Kidding" |
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| Title: Re: Trembling Before G-d |
31 Jul 2005 05:20:49 PM |
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"GoDrex" <godrex35@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:YfGdnQo7-opFc3HfUSdV9g@ptd.net...
"Elroy Willis" <elroywillis@swbell.net> wrote in message
news:65epe1hqm6l9ta1dif380qrm88lao3851s@4ax.com...
If it weren't for religion, would other people really care if other
people were gay or straight?
I'm sure there'd still be homophobia. I've known guys that weren't
religious
at all that hated gay people.
True....we have a few right wing bigots in here who make no bones about
their homophobia!!
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| User: "dgillesp" |
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| Title: Re: Trembling Before G-d |
31 Jul 2005 04:42:05 PM |
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GoDrex wrote:
"Elroy Willis" <elroywillis@swbell.net> wrote in message
news:65epe1hqm6l9ta1dif380qrm88lao3851s@4ax.com...
If it weren't for religion, would other people really care if other
people were gay or straight?
I'm sure there'd still be homophobia. I've known guys that weren't religious
at all that hated gay people.
And so have I. But one really shouldn't mention it because it
compromises the case against religion as the bottom line culprit, rather
than innate human homophobia and bias against what is different and
exceptional.
Denny
--
"There cannot be a God because, If there were one, I would
not believe that I were not He." - Friedrich Nietzsche
"My husband and I divorced over religious differences.
He thought he was God and I didn't." - Minny A. Spouse
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| User: "Clayton From The Church Of Jesus Christ Youve Got To Be Kidding" |
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| Title: Re: Trembling Before G-d |
31 Jul 2005 05:18:40 PM |
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"Elroy Willis" <elroywillis@swbell.net> wrote in message
news:65epe1hqm6l9ta1dif380qrm88lao3851s@4ax.com...
Anyone else around here catch "Trembling Before G-d" on the LOGO
channel this week?
It's about how the orthodox Jews shun gay Jews in their communities,
and it was surprising and actually a bit depressing to watch.
It was shown here some time last year! Didn't you find that part where he
talked to that young Jewish man in the street facinating? He spoke with
such passion about his religion and his experiences and the young man was
open and understanding. I think that was the most reassuring and possitive
part of the film!
http://channel.creative-capital.org/grantee_154.html
I thought anti-gay Christians were bad enough, but it seems that the
orthodox Jews are just as bad, with some of them wearing sackcloths on
the side of the street with signs saying things to the effect of "G-d
hates fags," no different than Fred Phelps and his ilk.
I'm not personally gay, but I feel sorry for the Jewish and Christian
gays who are shunned by their families and community, and I suspect
it's no different in the Muslim world.
If it weren't for religion, would other people really care if other
people were gay or straight?
--
Elroy Willis
www.elroysemporium.com
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| User: "Clayton From The Church Of Jesus Christ Youve Got To Be Kidding" |
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| Title: Re: Trembling Before G-d |
31 Jul 2005 05:22:24 PM |
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"Elroy Willis" <elroywillis@swbell.net> wrote in message
news:65epe1hqm6l9ta1dif380qrm88lao3851s@4ax.com...
Anyone else around here catch "Trembling Before G-d" on the LOGO
channel this week?
If you get the chance, don't miss out on "The Land Of Sex And Sinners"...a
two part documentary about the tragic effect Christianity has had since it
was introduced to Ireland. Keep an eye out for it! (In Australia it's
sometimes shown on SBS)
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| User: "dgillesp" |
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| Title: Re: Trembling Before G-d |
31 Jul 2005 04:22:16 PM |
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Elroy Willis wrote:
If it weren't for religion, would other people really care if other
people were gay or straight?
If it weren't for religion, would other people really care if other
people were pedophile or straight?
If it weren't for religion, would other people really care if other
people were patriotic or insurgent?
If it weren't for religion, would other people really care if other
people were conventional or nonconformist?
If it weren't for religion, would other people really care if other
people were democrat or republican?
If it weren't for religion, would other people really care if other
people were rich or poor?
If it weren't for religion, would other people really care if other
people were white or of color?
We know that religion is the cause of all prejudice and all injustice in
the world, don't we? ;-\
--
Elroy Willis
www.elroysemporium.com
Denny
--
"There cannot be a God because, If there were one, I would
not believe that I were not He." - Friedrich Nietzsche
"My husband and I divorced over religious differences.
He thought he was God and I didn't." - Minny A. Spouse
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| User: "Josef Balluch" |
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| Title: Re: Trembling Before G-d |
31 Jul 2005 07:48:50 PM |
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In a message sent 'round the world, dgillesp poured fuel on the fire
with the following:
[ snip Denny's whining ]
We know that religion is the cause of all prejudice and all injustice in
the world, don't we? ;-\
And yet, I do not recall seeing you complain because religion claims the
credit for the good that people do.
Regards,
Josef
For good people to do evil things, it takes religion.
-- Steven Weinberg
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| User: "James Ascher" |
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| Title: Re: Trembling Before G-d |
31 Jul 2005 07:31:18 AM |
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Elroy Willis wrote:
Anyone else around here catch "Trembling Before G-d" on the LOGO
channel this week?
It's about how the orthodox Jews shun gay Jews in their communities,
and it was surprising and actually a bit depressing to watch.
http://channel.creative-capital.org/grantee_154.html
I thought anti-gay Christians were bad enough, but it seems that the
orthodox Jews are just as bad, with some of them wearing sackcloths on
the side of the street with signs saying things to the effect of "G-d
hates fags," no different than Fred Phelps and his ilk.
I'm not personally gay, but I feel sorry for the Jewish and Christian
gays who are shunned by their families and community, and I suspect
it's no different in the Muslim world.
If it weren't for religion, would other people really care if other
people were gay or straight?
This movie goes to show that religion and homosexuality don't mix.
Religion should be weeded out, not being sexually variant.
James
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| User: "Elroy Willis" |
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| Title: Re: Trembling Before G-d |
31 Jul 2005 08:01:08 AM |
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James Ascher <jwa1968@earthlink.net> wrote in alt.atheism
Elroy Willis wrote:
Anyone else around here catch "Trembling Before G-d" on the LOGO
channel this week?
It's about how the orthodox Jews shun gay Jews in their communities,
and it was surprising and actually a bit depressing to watch.
http://channel.creative-capital.org/grantee_154.html
I thought anti-gay Christians were bad enough, but it seems that the
orthodox Jews are just as bad, with some of them wearing sackcloths on
the side of the street with signs saying things to the effect of "G-d
hates fags," no different than Fred Phelps and his ilk.
I'm not personally gay, but I feel sorry for the Jewish and Christian
gays who are shunned by their families and community, and I suspect
it's no different in the Muslim world.
If it weren't for religion, would other people really care if other
people were gay or straight?
This movie goes to show that religion and homosexuality don't mix.
Religion should be weeded out, not being sexually variant.
Did you watch it?
--
Elroy Willis
www.elroysemporium.com
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| User: "James Ascher" |
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| Title: Re: Trembling Before G-d |
31 Jul 2005 01:47:59 PM |
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Elroy Willis wrote:
James Ascher <jwa1968@earthlink.net> wrote in alt.atheism
Elroy Willis wrote:
Anyone else around here catch "Trembling Before G-d" on the LOGO
channel this week?
It's about how the orthodox Jews shun gay Jews in their communities,
and it was surprising and actually a bit depressing to watch.
http://channel.creative-capital.org/grantee_154.html
I thought anti-gay Christians were bad enough, but it seems that the
orthodox Jews are just as bad, with some of them wearing sackcloths on
the side of the street with signs saying things to the effect of "G-d
hates fags," no different than Fred Phelps and his ilk.
I'm not personally gay, but I feel sorry for the Jewish and Christian
gays who are shunned by their families and community, and I suspect
it's no different in the Muslim world.
If it weren't for religion, would other people really care if other
people were gay or straight?
This movie goes to show that religion and homosexuality don't mix.
Religion should be weeded out, not being sexually variant.
Did you watch it?
Yes, I've seen it. The Orthodox Jews go to as extreme lengths as Fundy
Christers do to remain "religious" despite the religious proscriptions
of the gay mens' behaviors.
James
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| User: "johac" |
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| Title: Re: Trembling Before G-d |
01 Aug 2005 12:47:46 AM |
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In article <65epe1hqm6l9ta1dif380qrm88lao3851s@4ax.com>,
Elroy Willis <elroywillis@swbell.net> wrote:
Anyone else around here catch "Trembling Before G-d" on the LOGO
channel this week?
It's about how the orthodox Jews shun gay Jews in their communities,
and it was surprising and actually a bit depressing to watch.
http://channel.creative-capital.org/grantee_154.html
I thought anti-gay Christians were bad enough, but it seems that the
orthodox Jews are just as bad, with some of them wearing sackcloths on
the side of the street with signs saying things to the effect of "G-d
hates fags," no different than Fred Phelps and his ilk.
I'm not personally gay, but I feel sorry for the Jewish and Christian
gays who are shunned by their families and community, and I suspect
it's no different in the Muslim world.
Last week, they hung two people in in Iran for being gay. I'm sure that
the others would like to do the same.
If it weren't for religion, would other people really care if other
people were gay or straight?
--
John Hachmann aa #1782
"Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities"
-Voltaire
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| User: "*nemo*" |
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| Title: Re: Trembling Before G-d |
02 Aug 2005 06:39:48 PM |
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In article <65epe1hqm6l9ta1dif380qrm88lao3851s@4ax.com>,
Elroy Willis <elroywillis@swbell.net> wrote:
If it weren't for religion, would other people really care if other
people were gay or straight?
Depends on the religion. There are cultures where gays are considered
special favorites of the gods. The basic lesson to get is that people
are weird about some of the silliest things... and it's often a huge
tragedy.
--
Nemo - EAC Commissioner for Bible Belt Underwater Operations.
Atheist #1331 (the Palindrome of doom!)
BAAWA Knight! - One of those warm Southern Knights, y'all!
Charter member, SMASH!!
http://home.earthlink.net/~jehdjh/Relpg.html
Draco Dormiens Nunquam Titillandus
Quotemeister since March 2002
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| User: "John Baker" |
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| Title: Re: Trembling Before G-d |
31 Jul 2005 07:07:20 AM |
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On Sun, 31 Jul 2005 11:55:56 GMT, Elroy Willis <elroywillis@swbell.net> wrote:
Anyone else around here catch "Trembling Before G-d" on the LOGO
channel this week?
It's about how the orthodox Jews shun gay Jews in their communities,
and it was surprising and actually a bit depressing to watch.
http://channel.creative-capital.org/grantee_154.html
I thought anti-gay Christians were bad enough, but it seems that the
orthodox Jews are just as bad, with some of them wearing sackcloths on
the side of the street with signs saying things to the effect of "G-d
hates fags," no different than Fred Phelps and his ilk.
I'm not personally gay, but I feel sorry for the Jewish and Christian
gays who are shunned by their families and community, and I suspect
it's no different in the Muslim world.
If it weren't for religion, would other people really care if other
people were gay or straight?
G-d can kiss my *****.
.
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| User: "Brian Westley" |
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| Title: Re: Trembling Before G-d |
31 Jul 2005 03:15:06 PM |
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John Baker <nunya@bizniz.net> writes:
On Sun, 31 Jul 2005 11:55:56 GMT, Elroy Willis <elroywillis@swbell.net> wrote:
Anyone else around here catch "Trembling Before G-d" on the LOGO
channel this week?
It's about how the orthodox Jews shun gay Jews in their communities,
and it was surprising and actually a bit depressing to watch.
http://channel.creative-capital.org/grantee_154.html
I thought anti-gay Christians were bad enough, but it seems that the
orthodox Jews are just as bad, with some of them wearing sackcloths on
the side of the street with signs saying things to the effect of "G-d
hates fags," no different than Fred Phelps and his ilk.
I'm not personally gay, but I feel sorry for the Jewish and Christian
gays who are shunned by their families and community, and I suspect
it's no different in the Muslim world.
If it weren't for religion, would other people really care if other
people were gay or straight?
G-d can kiss my *****.
That should be:
"G-d can k-ss my -ss."
---
Merlyn LeRoy
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| User: "Clayton From The Church Of Jesus Christ Youve Got To Be Kidding" |
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| Title: Re: Trembling Before G-d |
31 Jul 2005 05:19:35 PM |
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"Brian Westley" <westley@visi.com> wrote in message
news:11eqcaapvl8f819@corp.supernews.com...
John Baker <nunya@bizniz.net> writes:
On Sun, 31 Jul 2005 11:55:56 GMT, Elroy Willis <elroywillis@swbell.net>
wrote:
Anyone else around here catch "Trembling Before G-d" on the LOGO
channel this week?
It's about how the orthodox Jews shun gay Jews in their communities,
and it was surprising and actually a bit depressing to watch.
http://channel.creative-capital.org/grantee_154.html
I thought anti-gay Christians were bad enough, but it seems that the
orthodox Jews are just as bad, with some of them wearing sackcloths on
the side of the street with signs saying things to the effect of "G-d
hates fags," no different than Fred Phelps and his ilk.
I'm not personally gay, but I feel sorry for the Jewish and Christian
gays who are shunned by their families and community, and I suspect
it's no different in the Muslim world.
If it weren't for religion, would other people really care if other
people were gay or straight?
G-d can kiss my *****.
That should be:
"G-d can k-ss my -ss."
I'd like to buy a vowel!
.
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| User: "Elroy Willis" |
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| Title: Re: Trembling Before G-d |
31 Jul 2005 08:05:22 AM |
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John Baker <nunya@bizniz.net> wrote in alt.atheism
Elroy Willis <elroywillis@swbell.net> wrote:
Anyone else around here catch "Trembling Before G-d" on the LOGO
channel this week?
It's about how the orthodox Jews shun gay Jews in their communities,
and it was surprising and actually a bit depressing to watch.
http://channel.creative-capital.org/grantee_154.html
I thought anti-gay Christians were bad enough, but it seems that the
orthodox Jews are just as bad, with some of them wearing sackcloths on
the side of the street with signs saying things to the effect of "G-d
hates fags," no different than Fred Phelps and his ilk.
I'm not personally gay, but I feel sorry for the Jewish and Christian
gays who are shunned by their families and community, and I suspect
it's no different in the Muslim world.
If it weren't for religion, would other people really care if other
people were gay or straight?
G-d can kiss my *****.
One of the rabbis in the movie told one gay Jewish man to eat dates or
figs in order to become non-gay. :)
--
Elroy Willis
www.elroysemporium.com
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| User: "Gregory Gadow" |
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| Title: Re: Trembling Before G-d |
01 Aug 2005 08:49:49 AM |
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Elroy Willis wrote:
John Baker <nunya@bizniz.net> wrote in alt.atheism
Elroy Willis <elroywillis@swbell.net> wrote:
Anyone else around here catch "Trembling Before G-d" on the LOGO
channel this week?
It's about how the orthodox Jews shun gay Jews in their communities,
and it was surprising and actually a bit depressing to watch.
http://channel.creative-capital.org/grantee_154.html
I thought anti-gay Christians were bad enough, but it seems that the
orthodox Jews are just as bad, with some of them wearing sackcloths on
the side of the street with signs saying things to the effect of "G-d
hates fags," no different than Fred Phelps and his ilk.
I'm not personally gay, but I feel sorry for the Jewish and Christian
gays who are shunned by their families and community, and I suspect
it's no different in the Muslim world.
If it weren't for religion, would other people really care if other
people were gay or straight?
G-d can kiss my *****.
One of the rabbis in the movie told one gay Jewish man to eat dates or
figs in order to become non-gay. :)
Clearly, that rabbi is ignorant of the vast folklore involving dates and
figs. ;-D
--
Gregory Gadow
techbear@serv.net
http://www.serv.net/~techbear
"It is necessary to the happiness of man that he be
mentally faithful to himself. Infidelity does not
consist in believing, or in disbelieving; it consists
in professing to believe what one does not believe. It
is impossible to calculate the moral mischief, if I may
so express it, that mental lying has produced in society.
When man has so far corrupted and prostituted the
chastity of his mind, as to subscribe his professional
belief to things he does not believe, he has prepared
himself for the commission of every other crime."
- Thomas Paine, "The Age of Reason"
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| User: "Elroy Willis" |
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| Title: Re: Trembling Before G-d |
01 Aug 2005 09:11:21 AM |
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Gregory Gadow <techbear@serv.net> wrote in alt.atheism
Elroy Willis wrote:
<snip>
One of the rabbis in the movie told one gay Jewish man to eat dates or
figs in order to become non-gay. :)
Clearly, that rabbi is ignorant of the vast folklore involving dates and
figs. ;-D
Such as?
--
Elroy Willis
www.elroysemporium.com
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| User: "Gregory Gadow" |
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| Title: Re: Trembling Before G-d |
01 Aug 2005 11:27:30 AM |
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Elroy Willis wrote:
Gregory Gadow <techbear@serv.net> wrote in alt.atheism
Elroy Willis wrote:
<snip>
One of the rabbis in the movie told one gay Jewish man to eat dates or
figs in order to become non-gay. :)
Clearly, that rabbi is ignorant of the vast folklore involving dates and
figs. ;-D
Such as?
The fundamental principle of sympathetic magic: If it has some quality
relating to something (color, shape, size, texture, etc) then it can be used
to represent that something. Dates have a similar shape to testicles, and
smaller dates are similar in size. Dried figs have a shape and texture similar
to a scrotum. Therefore, dates and figs can (so the theory goes) be eaten to
increase "masculine energy" and sexual potency, which is probably the folklore
for which the rabbi was reaching (putting aside the fact that dates and figs
are actually *female* sex organs.)
One thing the good rabbi seems to ignore: Oral contact with things resembling
dates and figs is probably how the gay Jewish man came to realize once and for
all that he was gay. I can't see how encouraging the consumption of symbols of
male genitals will straighten any man out.
--
Gregory Gadow
techbear@serv.net
http://www.serv.net/~techbear
"It is necessary to the happiness of man that he be
mentally faithful to himself. Infidelity does not
consist in believing, or in disbelieving; it consists
in professing to believe what one does not believe. It
is impossible to calculate the moral mischief, if I may
so express it, that mental lying has produced in society.
When man has so far corrupted and prostituted the
chastity of his mind, as to subscribe his professional
belief to things he does not believe, he has prepared
himself for the commission of every other crime."
- Thomas Paine, "The Age of Reason"
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| User: "Clayton From The Church Of Jesus Christ Youve Got To Be Kidding" |
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| Title: Re: Trembling Before G-d |
01 Aug 2005 06:19:40 PM |
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"Gregory Gadow" <techbear@serv.net> wrote in message
news:42EE4D72.B6A91E7F@serv.net...
Elroy Willis wrote:
Gregory Gadow <techbear@serv.net> wrote in alt.atheism
Elroy Willis wrote:
<snip>
One of the rabbis in the movie told one gay Jewish man to eat dates
or
figs in order to become non-gay. :)
Clearly, that rabbi is ignorant of the vast folklore involving dates
and
figs. ;-D
Such as?
The fundamental principle of sympathetic magic: If it has some quality
relating to something (color, shape, size, texture, etc) then it can be
used
to represent that something. Dates have a similar shape to testicles, and
smaller dates are similar in size. Dried figs have a shape and texture
similar
to a scrotum. Therefore, dates and figs can (so the theory goes) be eaten
to
increase "masculine energy" and sexual potency, which is probably the
folklore
for which the rabbi was reaching (putting aside the fact that dates and
figs
are actually *female* sex organs.)
One thing the good rabbi seems to ignore: Oral contact with things
resembling
dates and figs is probably how the gay Jewish man came to realize once and
for
all that he was gay. I can't see how encouraging the consumption of
symbols of
male genitals will straighten any man out.
Well you've ruined dried fruits as a snack for me!!!
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| User: "Elroy Willis" |
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| Title: Re: Trembling Before G-d |
01 Aug 2005 03:30:53 PM |
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Gregory Gadow <techbear@serv.net> wrote in alt.atheism
Elroy Willis wrote:
Gregory Gadow <techbear@serv.net> wrote in alt.atheism
Elroy Willis wrote:
<snip>
One of the rabbis in the movie told one gay Jewish man to eat dates or
figs in order to become non-gay. :)
Clearly, that rabbi is ignorant of the vast folklore involving dates and
figs. ;-D
Such as?
The fundamental principle of sympathetic magic: If it has some quality
relating to something (color, shape, size, texture, etc) then it can be used
to represent that something. Dates have a similar shape to testicles, and
smaller dates are similar in size. Dried figs have a shape and texture similar
to a scrotum. Therefore, dates and figs can (so the theory goes) be eaten to
increase "masculine energy" and sexual potency, which is probably the folklore
for which the rabbi was reaching (putting aside the fact that dates and figs
are actually *female* sex organs.)
One thing the good rabbi seems to ignore: Oral contact with things resembling
dates and figs is probably how the gay Jewish man came to realize once and for
all that he was gay. I can't see how encouraging the consumption of symbols of
male genitals will straighten any man out.
I thought maybe the sight of a withered fig would be like an
anti-aphrodisiac if you look at it in that way. Hmm...
--
Elroy Willis
www.elroysemporium.com
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| User: "dgillesp" |
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| Title: Re: Trembling Before G-d |
31 Jul 2005 04:26:22 PM |
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John Baker wrote:
On Sun, 31 Jul 2005 11:55:56 GMT, Elroy Willis <elroywillis@swbell.net> wrote:
Anyone else around here catch "Trembling Before G-d" on the LOGO
channel this week?
It's about how the orthodox Jews shun gay Jews in their communities,
and it was surprising and actually a bit depressing to watch.
http://channel.creative-capital.org/grantee_154.html
I thought anti-gay Christians were bad enough, but it seems that the
orthodox Jews are just as bad, with some of them wearing sackcloths on
the side of the street with signs saying things to the effect of "G-d
hates fags," no different than Fred Phelps and his ilk.
I'm not personally gay, but I feel sorry for the Jewish and Christian
gays who are shunned by their families and community, and I suspect
it's no different in the Muslim world.
If it weren't for religion, would other people really care if other
people were gay or straight?
G-d can kiss my *****.
If Nietzsche got it right, all one need do if simply bend over as far as
possible, and with head between one's legs, plant a big one or either or
both cheeks.
Denny
--
"There cannot be a God because, If there were one, I would
not believe that I were not He." - Friedrich Nietzsche
"My husband and I divorced over religious differences.
He thought he was God and I didn't." - Minny A. Spouse
.
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| User: "erikc" |
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| Title: Re: Trembling Before G-d |
31 Jul 2005 03:05:53 PM |
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On Sun, 31 Jul 2005 11:55:56 GMT, Elroy Willis <elroywillis@swbell.net> wrote:
Anyone else around here catch "Trembling Before G-d" on the LOGO
channel this week?
It's about how the orthodox Jews shun gay Jews in their communities,
and it was surprising and actually a bit depressing to watch.
http://channel.creative-capital.org/grantee_154.html
I thought anti-gay Christians were bad enough, but it seems that the
orthodox Jews are just as bad, with some of them wearing sackcloths on
the side of the street with signs saying things to the effect of "G-d
hates fags," no different than Fred Phelps and his ilk.
I'm not personally gay, but I feel sorry for the Jewish and Christian
gays who are shunned by their families and community, and I suspect
it's no different in the Muslim world.
The Muslims kill thier gays.
If it weren't for religion, would other people really care if other
people were gay or straight?
erikc
Erikc (alt.atheist #002) | "An Fhirinne in aghaidh an tSaoil."
BAAWA Knight (retired) | "The Truth against the World."
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