"jwk" <jwkinraleigh@yahoo.com> wrote in
news:1109170770.727411.117760@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com:

Fred Stone wrote:

DJ Nozem <djn@thisaddressdoesnotexist.com> wrote in
news:7vio11pcrqnll50h50vi98jb96nrqu484v@4ax.com:

On Tue, 22 Feb 2005 14:13:13 +0000 (UTC), Fred Stone
<fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:

http://powerlineblog.com/archives/2005_02.php#009629

The humorless and now contemptible Al Franken peddles one of the
stupid Democratic lies concerning the last election in his

today (linked below) when he refers to "the [Republican]

voter suppression of yesteryear - by which I mean last year..."

The real news of the last election is the vote fraud and

misconduct that continues to come to light among Franken's

Democratic

allies. These stories not only demonstrate that Franken has the

story

upside down, but also explain why the race-card comes in so

for

Franken and his ilk.

Note: this is not a refutation of whatever Franken wrote (which

baldly called a lie all the same). Kind of what you'd expect

the

classy people at powerline.

It's not presented as a *refutation* of his whine; just evidence

Franken is a hypocrite like all the other Democrats.

The problem here is well known: Dems carp about voter

Republicans about voter fraud. The problem wouldn't exist if you

had a

register like the rest of the west, but that seems to be out of

question somehow...?

A register? Most American voting districts ("precincts") do have
voter registers, with some sort of requirement to register

election day. The Democrats are determined to do away with them,
since that interferes with their ability to commit fraud on the
massive scale required to steal national elections.

Shove it Fred. How can you expect us to credit anything you say

you make such outrageous, unsupported and blatantly biased

like that. *****.

When do you plan to start criticizing the libruls around here for
*their* outrageous, unsupported and blatantly biased statements?

DJ Nozem <djn@thisaddressdoesnotexist.com> wrote in
news:ngbp1111rmorfqs9nnog3latlbmrk56te1@4ax.com:

On Wed, 23 Feb 2005 14:23:46 GMT, Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com>
wrote:

DJ Nozem <djn@thisaddressdoesnotexist.com> wrote in
news:7vio11pcrqnll50h50vi98jb96nrqu484v@4ax.com:

On Tue, 22 Feb 2005 14:13:13 +0000 (UTC), Fred Stone
<fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:

http://powerlineblog.com/archives/2005_02.php#009629
The humorless and now contemptible Al Franken peddles one of the
stupid Democratic lies concerning the last election in his column
today (linked below) when he refers to "the [Republican] race-based
voter suppression of yesteryear — by which I mean last year..."
The real news of the last election is the vote fraud and election
misconduct that continues to come to light among Franken's
Democratic allies. These stories not only demonstrate that Franken
has the story upside down, but also explain why the race-card comes
in so handy for Franken and his ilk.

Note: this is not a refutation of whatever Franken wrote (which is
baldly called a lie all the same). Kind of what you'd expect from
the classy people at powerline.

It's not presented as a *refutation* of his whine; just evidence that
Franken is a hypocrite like all the other Democrats.

When you call something a lie, you take a burden upon yourself to
demonstrate that it is a known falsehood proclaimed in bad faith. End
of story.

It's Franken's burden to prove *his* case. Since no such proof has been
made available, he's lying when he says that it happened.

The problem here is well known: Dems carp about voter intimidation,
Republicans about voter fraud. The problem wouldn't exist if you had
a register like the rest of the west, but that seems to be out of
the question somehow...?

A register? Most American voting districts ("precincts") do have voter
registers, with some sort of requirement to register *before* election
day.

Ah, but they're not pre-existent, apparently? I mean, you have to go
there to register for elections, they don't get your data
automatically when you live there?

That's correct. Some states have what they call "motor-voter" where
you're registered to vote when you get a driver's license. One state,
(Montana? Wyoming?) doesn't require any registration at all.

The Democrats are determined to do away with them, since that
interferes with their ability to commit fraud on the massive scale
required to steal national elections.

Where's your evidence that they mean to do away with them?

In the fact that they seek to establish same-day registration and their
use of "provisional ballots".

Where's
your evidence that they seek to commit fraud?

See the story above.

On Wed, 23 Feb 2005 17:51:28 +0100, DJ Nozem
<djn@thisaddressdoesnotexist.com> wrote:

On 23 Feb 2005 08:31:06 -0600,

On Wed, 23 Feb 2005 10:26:30 +0100, DJ Nozem
<djn@thisaddressdoesnotexist.com> wrote:

On Tue, 22 Feb 2005 14:13:13 +0000 (UTC), Fred Stone
<fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:

http://powerlineblog.com/archives/2005_02.php#009629
The humorless and now contemptible Al Franken peddles one of the stupid
Democratic lies concerning the last election in his column today (linked
below) when he refers to "the [Republican] race-based voter suppression
of yesteryear — by which I mean last year..."
The real news of the last election is the vote fraud and election
misconduct that continues to come to light among Franken's Democratic
allies. These stories not only demonstrate that Franken has the story
upside down, but also explain why the race-card comes in so handy for
Franken and his ilk.

Note: this is not a refutation of whatever Franken wrote (which is
baldly called a lie all the same). Kind of what you'd expect from the
classy people at powerline.
The problem here is well known: Dems carp about voter intimidation,
Republicans about voter fraud. The problem wouldn't exist if you had a
register like the rest of the west, but that seems to be out of the
question somehow...?

What is a register?

Sorry, I meant to ask. Here in Europe we have these wonderful
registers whereby the government keeps track of your personal data.
Where you live, your marital status, all that stuff. When you
re-locate, you register. When you die, it gets registered. Etcetera. I
believe America doesn't do that kind of thing.
Before election day, we get a unique card that we have to turn in at
the voting booth. The volunteers there also have a list. This way,
voting fraud is very difficult.
I'm wondering at ways in which the problem of voting fraud and the
problem of groups of Republicans demanding ID cards for verification
at polling stations in Democratic areas would both go away. Clearly it
is ridiculous that one of the oldest and largest democracies on earth
has so many problems with its elections, problems that don't exist in
the rest of the civilised world.

We voluntarily register before the election. The process and rules
are different in every state. So it's not just one country you are
dealing with it's more like 50 different ones, with only some vague
general rules in common.

The problems have cropped up lately because of a couple of things.
The elections being close enough that corruption can make a difference
and that many states are just now dealing with computerized voting.
Obviously with voting on computers, you should have a paper trail,
otherwise you are completely dependent on the validity of the
programming. It doesn't take but one person to corrupt the
programming and set the voter tallies to anything he wants. The
current party in power (republican) has no interest in making sure
that the vote is uncorrupted (I'll let you guess why) and rely on the
lack of knowledge most people have about computerized voting to not
insist on paper trails.

I think most of the rest of the world isn't there yet with
computerized voting. I suspect the US is about to be the bad example
as to why each country cannot rely on it without a well established
and individually verified paper trail.