| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"angry pankration warrior" |
| Date: |
06 Jan 2005 06:34:01 PM |
| Object: |
What do you think? |
It is a scientific proven fact that prayer does chance circumstances.
A study was done where those with cancer and certain diseases were prayed
for and they made progress and those that weren't prayed for didn't make as
much.
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| User: "Phÿltêr" |
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| Title: Re: What do you think? |
15 Jan 2005 07:03:11 PM |
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astounded us with: news:1105814335.480403.318690
@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com:
Uv wrote:
was it his teacher at that famous college? or the teacher on that
famous
kid's show???
Why does it matter?
Remember a saying once taught to Dr. Chris Assaf, "Life is what your
teacher says it is."
Bull *****
--
Phÿltêr
AA#1938
Denizen of Darkness #44 & AFJC Antipodean Attaché
Remove "s" to respond
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| User: "Uv" |
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| Title: Re: What do you think? |
15 Jan 2005 07:36:11 PM |
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"Phÿltêr" <Phÿltêr@hsotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1105837391.2fa606278f06367beca3861c09b48368@teranews...
bedford_park2000@yahoo.ca astounded us with: news:1105814335.480403.318690
@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com:
Uv wrote:
was it his teacher at that famous college? or the teacher on that
famous
kid's show???
Why does it matter?
Remember a saying once taught to Dr. Chris Assaf, "Life is what your
teacher says it is."
Bull *****
Do they do that???
I've never seen a bull actually *****.. but I'll have to agree it
most likely smells alot like Dr. Chris Assaf's breath and posts.
Uv(just ain' got it in her)
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| User: "Phÿltêr" |
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| Title: Re: What do you think? |
15 Jan 2005 08:50:42 PM |
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[posted and mailed]
bedford_park2000@yahoo.ca astounded us with: news:1105814335.480403.318690
@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com:
Uv wrote:
was it his teacher at that famous college? or the teacher on that
famous
kid's show???
Why does it matter?
Remember a saying once taught to Dr. Chris Assaf, "Life is what your
teacher says it is."
Bull-fucking-***** it is, it's what you make it, you fucking loser.
--
Phÿltêr
AA#1938
Denizen of Darkness #44 & AFJC Antipodean Attaché
Remove "s" to respond
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| User: "CQMMAN" |
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| Title: Re: What do you think? |
07 Jan 2005 05:56:44 AM |
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angry pankration warrior <bedford_park2000@yahoo.ca> wrote:
It is a scientific proven fact that prayer does chance circumstances.
A study was done where those with cancer and certain diseases were
prayed for and they made progress and those that weren't prayed for
didn't make as much.
This study?
"The world's largest study into the effects of prayer on patients undergoing
heart surgery has found it appears to make no difference. "
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/3193902.stm
--
Saddam has continued to produce them, that he has existing and active
military plans for the use of chemical and biological weapons, which
could be activated within 45 minutes
- Tony Blair on Saddam 24/9/02
"For a century and a half now, America and Japan have formed one of the
great and enduring alliances of modern times."
George W Bush -Tokyo, Japan, Feb. 18, 2002
suicide bombing is not a belief
-CrazyAlec (internet spook)
"I hear there's rumors on the Internets"
- George W Bush -Oct. 9, 2004
Even today I am willing to volunteer to do the dirty work for Israel, to
kill as many Arabs as necessary, to deport them, to expel and burn
them, to have everyone hate us, to pull the rug from underneath the
feet of the Diaspora Jews, so that they will be forced to run to us
crying. Even if it means blowing up one or two synagogues here and
there, I don't care. -- Ariel Sharon, interviewed by Amos Oz (published
in the Israeli daily Davar, DEC 17, 1982
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| User: "CQMMAN" |
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| Title: Re: What do you think? |
07 Jan 2005 05:58:29 AM |
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CQMMAN <cqmman@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
angry pankration warrior <bedford_park2000@yahoo.ca> wrote:
It is a scientific proven fact that prayer does chance circumstances.
A study was done where those with cancer and certain diseases were
prayed for and they made progress and those that weren't prayed for
didn't make as much.
This study?
"The world's largest study into the effects of prayer on patients
undergoing heart surgery has found it appears to make no difference. "
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/3193902.stm
Or perhaps the recent one that links prayer to fertility and was also proven
to be a load of crap.
--
Saddam has continued to produce them, that he has existing and active
military plans for the use of chemical and biological weapons, which
could be activated within 45 minutes
- Tony Blair on Saddam 24/9/02
"For a century and a half now, America and Japan have formed one of the
great and enduring alliances of modern times."
George W Bush -Tokyo, Japan, Feb. 18, 2002
suicide bombing is not a belief
-CrazyAlec (internet spook)
"I hear there's rumors on the Internets"
- George W Bush -Oct. 9, 2004
Even today I am willing to volunteer to do the dirty work for Israel, to
kill as many Arabs as necessary, to deport them, to expel and burn
them, to have everyone hate us, to pull the rug from underneath the
feet of the Diaspora Jews, so that they will be forced to run to us
crying. Even if it means blowing up one or two synagogues here and
there, I don't care. -- Ariel Sharon, interviewed by Amos Oz (published
in the Israeli daily Davar, DEC 17, 1982
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| User: "Roy Jose Lorr" |
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| Title: Re: What do you think? |
07 Jan 2005 11:00:18 AM |
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CQMMAN wrote:
angry pankration warrior <bedford_park2000@yahoo.ca> wrote:
It is a scientific proven fact that prayer does chance circumstances.
A study was done where those with cancer and certain diseases were
prayed for and they made progress and those that weren't prayed for
didn't make as much.
This study?
"The world's largest study into the effects of prayer on patients undergoing
heart surgery has found it appears to make no difference. "
'Appears' isn't good enough.
--
The last stage of
utopian sentimentalism
is homicidal mania.
.
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| User: "Steve Mading" |
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| Title: Re: What do you think? |
07 Jan 2005 12:36:26 PM |
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On Fri, 07 Jan 2005 17:00:18 GMT, Roy Jose Lorr
<mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
CQMMAN wrote:
angry pankration warrior <bedford_park2000@yahoo.ca> wrote:
It is a scientific proven fact that prayer does chance circumstances.
A study was done where those with cancer and certain diseases were
prayed for and they made progress and those that weren't prayed for
didn't make as much.
This study?
"The world's largest study into the effects of prayer on patients undergoing
heart surgery has found it appears to make no difference. "
'Appears' isn't good enough.
"Make no difference" is the default hypothesis. "X has no effect on Y" is
not something you can prove. It's something you assume by default until
there's a reason to change that assumption.
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| User: "Roy Jose Lorr" |
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| Title: Re: What do you think? |
07 Jan 2005 03:04:59 PM |
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Steve Mading wrote:
On Fri, 07 Jan 2005 17:00:18 GMT, Roy Jose Lorr
<mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
CQMMAN wrote:
angry pankration warrior <bedford_park2000@yahoo.ca> wrote:
It is a scientific proven fact that prayer does chance circumstances.
A study was done where those with cancer and certain diseases were
prayed for and they made progress and those that weren't prayed for
didn't make as much.
This study?
"The world's largest study into the effects of prayer on patients undergoing
heart surgery has found it appears to make no difference. "
'Appears' isn't good enough.
"Make no difference" is the default hypothesis. "X has no effect on Y" is
not something you can prove. It's something you assume by default until
there's a reason to change that assumption.
'Assume' isn't good enough.
--
The last stage of
utopian sentimentalism
is homicidal mania.
.
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| User: "Pope Rudraigh" |
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| Title: Re: What do you think? |
12 Jan 2005 12:46:15 PM |
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On Fri, 07 Jan 2005 17:00:18 GMT, Roy Jose Lorr
<mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
CQMMAN wrote:
angry pankration warrior <bedford_park2000@yahoo.ca> wrote:
It is a scientific proven fact that prayer does chance circumstances.
A study was done where those with cancer and certain diseases were
prayed for and they made progress and those that weren't prayed for
didn't make as much.
This study?
"The world's largest study into the effects of prayer on patients undergoing
heart surgery has found it appears to make no difference. "
'Appears' isn't good enough.
Nah. It's gotta be totally fucking fucking invisible for you to
believe it. Y'know ... kinda like your gawd.
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| User: "Jim07D5" |
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| Title: Re: What do you think? |
07 Jan 2005 12:15:17 PM |
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Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> said:
CQMMAN wrote:
angry pankration warrior <bedford_park2000@yahoo.ca> wrote:
It is a scientific proven fact that prayer does chance circumstances.
A study was done where those with cancer and certain diseases were
prayed for and they made progress and those that weren't prayed for
didn't make as much.
This study?
"The world's largest study into the effects of prayer on patients undergoing
heart surgery has found it appears to make no difference. "
'Appears' isn't good enough.
The proper expression is "has found that it did not appear to make a
difference that rose to the level of statistical significance
specified in the study." Assuming it didn't.
But what all such studies fail to take into account is that I always
pray for the control groups in any such studies that might be going
on. I think any good theist should do so, study be damned. I also ask
for the intercession of all the saints and martyrs and any other
spiritual beings that happen to be around, and given that the control
group is so unprayed for, at least some fraction of them, if they are
good people, can be relied on to be sympathetic. If prayer works, this
makes the studies fail to see a difference or even tips the balance
the other way. It also means that any study that seems to show that
prayer works, is wrong.
I also have some other questions about prayer:
If I pray for those people who have no one praying for them, does my
praying for them remove them from the group of people I am praying
for, thereby leaving them with no one praying for them, so that I am
once again praying for them, and so forth?
If I pray that God not answer my prayers, what options does God have,
WRT this prayer? Is this where lightning bolts come into play?
If I pray for all those people who do not pray for themselves, do I
pray for myself?
What do you think? That's the Subject of this thread, right?
Jim07D5
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| User: "Roy Jose Lorr" |
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| Title: Re: What do you think? |
07 Jan 2005 03:31:30 PM |
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Jim07D5 wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> said:
CQMMAN wrote:
angry pankration warrior <bedford_park2000@yahoo.ca> wrote:
It is a scientific proven fact that prayer does chance circumstances.
A study was done where those with cancer and certain diseases were
prayed for and they made progress and those that weren't prayed for
didn't make as much.
This study?
"The world's largest study into the effects of prayer on patients undergoing
heart surgery has found it appears to make no difference. "
'Appears' isn't good enough.
The proper expression is "has found that it did not appear to make a
difference that rose to the level of statistical significance
specified in the study." Assuming it didn't.
Correct, appears is not good enough... neither is 'assuming'.
But what all such studies fail to take into account is that I always
pray for the control groups in any such studies that might be going
on. I think any good theist should do so, study be damned. I also ask
for the intercession of all the saints and martyrs and any other
spiritual beings that happen to be around, and given that the control
group is so unprayed for, at least some fraction of them, if they are
good people, can be relied on to be sympathetic. If prayer works, this
makes the studies fail to see a difference or even tips the balance
the other way. It also means that any study that seems to show that
prayer works, is wrong.
Studies are prayers.
I also have some other questions about prayer:
If I pray for those people who have no one praying for them, does my
praying for them remove them from the group of people I am praying
for, thereby leaving them with no one praying for them, so that I am
once again praying for them, and so forth?
Do you want me to pray for you or not?
If I pray that God not answer my prayers, what options does God have,
WRT this prayer? Is this where lightning bolts come into play?
True prayer does not take place consciously.
If I pray for all those people who do not pray for themselves, do I
pray for myself?
Everyone prays for themselves.
What do you think? That's the Subject of this thread, right?
Another of your enigmatic flights?
--
The last stage of
utopian sentimentalism
is homicidal mania.
.
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| User: "Jim07D5" |
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| Title: Re: What do you think? |
07 Jan 2005 03:44:52 PM |
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Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> said:
Jim07D5 wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> said:
CQMMAN wrote:
angry pankration warrior <bedford_park2000@yahoo.ca> wrote:
It is a scientific proven fact that prayer does chance circumstances.
A study was done where those with cancer and certain diseases were
prayed for and they made progress and those that weren't prayed for
didn't make as much.
This study?
"The world's largest study into the effects of prayer on patients undergoing
heart surgery has found it appears to make no difference. "
'Appears' isn't good enough.
The proper expression is "has found that it did not appear to make a
difference that rose to the level of statistical significance
specified in the study." Assuming it didn't.
Correct, appears is not good enough... neither is 'assuming'.
I had a boss once who said that good enough was not good enough. I had
an aunt who said enough's too much. Go figure.
But what all such studies fail to take into account is that I always
pray for the control groups in any such studies that might be going
on. I think any good theist should do so, study be damned. I also ask
for the intercession of all the saints and martyrs and any other
spiritual beings that happen to be around, and given that the control
group is so unprayed for, at least some fraction of them, if they are
good people, can be relied on to be sympathetic. If prayer works, this
makes the studies fail to see a difference or even tips the balance
the other way. It also means that any study that seems to show that
prayer works, is wrong.
Studies are prayers.
Sometimes involving ritual sacrifices of little white rats.
I also have some other questions about prayer:
If I pray for those people who have no one praying for them, does my
praying for them remove them from the group of people I am praying
for, thereby leaving them with no one praying for them, so that I am
once again praying for them, and so forth?
Do you want me to pray for you or not?
To the extent that prayer is powerful, please aim it somewhere else.
If I pray that God not answer my prayers, what options does God have,
WRT this prayer? Is this where lightning bolts come into play?
True prayer does not take place consciously.
I hear bagpipes.
If I pray for all those people who do not pray for themselves, do I
pray for myself?
Everyone prays for themselves.
What do you think? That's the Subject of this thread, right?
Another of your enigmatic flights?
This exchange shows that the world is seen as one's paradigm allows.
Jim07D5
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| User: "Roy Jose Lorr" |
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| Title: Re: What do you think? |
07 Jan 2005 04:10:13 PM |
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Jim07D5 wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> said:
Jim07D5 wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> said:
CQMMAN wrote:
angry pankration warrior <bedford_park2000@yahoo.ca> wrote:
It is a scientific proven fact that prayer does chance circumstances.
A study was done where those with cancer and certain diseases were
prayed for and they made progress and those that weren't prayed for
didn't make as much.
This study?
"The world's largest study into the effects of prayer on patients undergoing
heart surgery has found it appears to make no difference. "
'Appears' isn't good enough.
The proper expression is "has found that it did not appear to make a
difference that rose to the level of statistical significance
specified in the study." Assuming it didn't.
Correct, appears is not good enough... neither is 'assuming'.
I had a boss once who said that good enough was not good enough. I had
an aunt who said enough's too much. Go figure.
We all do philosophy... go figure.
But what all such studies fail to take into account is that I always
pray for the control groups in any such studies that might be going
on. I think any good theist should do so, study be damned. I also ask
for the intercession of all the saints and martyrs and any other
spiritual beings that happen to be around, and given that the control
group is so unprayed for, at least some fraction of them, if they are
good people, can be relied on to be sympathetic. If prayer works, this
makes the studies fail to see a difference or even tips the balance
the other way. It also means that any study that seems to show that
prayer works, is wrong.
Studies are prayers.
Sometimes involving ritual sacrifices of little white rats.
Most times involving sacrifice of reality.
I also have some other questions about prayer:
If I pray for those people who have no one praying for them, does my
praying for them remove them from the group of people I am praying
for, thereby leaving them with no one praying for them, so that I am
once again praying for them, and so forth?
Do you want me to pray for you or not?
To the extent that prayer is powerful, please aim it somewhere else.
If you get hit by one of my prayers it'll be due to your
getting in the way of my aim.
If I pray that God not answer my prayers, what options does God have,
WRT this prayer? Is this where lightning bolts come into play?
True prayer does not take place consciously.
I hear bagpipes.
I thought you hear one hand clapping.
If I pray for all those people who do not pray for themselves, do I
pray for myself?
Everyone prays for themselves.
What do you think? That's the Subject of this thread, right?
Another of your enigmatic flights?
This exchange shows that the world is seen as one's paradigm allows.
Pray for the paradigms.
--
The last stage of
utopian sentimentalism
is homicidal mania.
.
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| User: "Jim07D5" |
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| Title: Re: What do you think? |
07 Jan 2005 04:17:36 PM |
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Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> said:
Jim07D5 wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> said:
....
Studies are prayers.
Sometimes involving ritual sacrifices of little white rats.
Most times involving sacrifice of reality.
....
Yes, but we need the eggs.
Jim07D5
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| User: "Roy Jose Lorr" |
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| Title: Re: What do you think? |
07 Jan 2005 04:27:08 PM |
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Jim07D5 wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> said:
Jim07D5 wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> said:
...
Studies are prayers.
Sometimes involving ritual sacrifices of little white rats.
Most times involving sacrifice of reality.
...
Yes, but we need the eggs.
Egg-cetera.
--
The last stage of
utopian sentimentalism
is homicidal mania.
.
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| User: "CQMMAN" |
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| Title: Re: What do you think? |
07 Jan 2005 05:14:07 PM |
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Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
Jim07D5 wrote:
<snip>
Do you want me to pray for you or not?
Why would an atheist care if you prayed or not? Personally I am not keen on
strangers thinking about me, but since your prayers do nothing except make
you feel better, knock yourself out.
If I pray that God not answer my prayers, what options does God have,
WRT this prayer? Is this where lightning bolts come into play?
True prayer does not take place consciously.
Funny, I know many priests who would disagree (nothing new there though).
If I pray for all those people who do not pray for themselves, do I
pray for myself?
Everyone prays for themselves.
Rubbish.
--
Saddam has continued to produce them, that he has existing and active
military plans for the use of chemical and biological weapons, which
could be activated within 45 minutes
- Tony Blair on Saddam 24/9/02
"For a century and a half now, America and Japan have formed one of the
great and enduring alliances of modern times."
George W Bush -Tokyo, Japan, Feb. 18, 2002
suicide bombing is not a belief
-CrazyAlec (internet spook)
"I hear there's rumors on the Internets"
- George W Bush -Oct. 9, 2004
Even today I am willing to volunteer to do the dirty work for Israel, to
kill as many Arabs as necessary, to deport them, to expel and burn
them, to have everyone hate us, to pull the rug from underneath the
feet of the Diaspora Jews, so that they will be forced to run to us
crying. Even if it means blowing up one or two synagogues here and
there, I don't care. -- Ariel Sharon, interviewed by Amos Oz (published
in the Israeli daily Davar, DEC 17, 1982
.
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| User: "Roy Jose Lorr" |
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| Title: Re: What do you think? |
07 Jan 2005 06:10:33 PM |
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CQMMAN wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
Jim07D5 wrote:
<snip>
Do you want me to pray for you or not?
Why would an atheist care if you prayed or not? Personally I am not keen on
strangers thinking about me, but since your prayers do nothing except make
you feel better, knock yourself out.
All prayerists are at this moment praying for your speedy recovery.
If I pray that God not answer my prayers, what options does God have,
WRT this prayer? Is this where lightning bolts come into play?
True prayer does not take place consciously.
Funny, I know many priests who would disagree (nothing new there though).
How many priests do you know?
If I pray for all those people who do not pray for themselves, do I
pray for myself?
Everyone prays for themselves.
Rubbish.
Ok, we'll pray for you too... since you feel left out.
--
The last stage of
utopian sentimentalism
is homicidal mania.
.
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| User: "CQMMAN" |
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| Title: Re: What do you think? |
08 Jan 2005 04:13:58 AM |
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Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
CQMMAN wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
Jim07D5 wrote:
<snip>
Do you want me to pray for you or not?
Why would an atheist care if you prayed or not? Personally I am not
keen on strangers thinking about me, but since your prayers do
nothing except make you feel better, knock yourself out.
All prayerists are at this moment praying for your speedy recovery.
Recovery from what?
If I pray that God not answer my prayers, what options does God
have, WRT this prayer? Is this where lightning bolts come into
play?
True prayer does not take place consciously.
Funny, I know many priests who would disagree (nothing new there
though).
How many priests do you know?
I am on close terms with at least four.
If I pray for all those people who do not pray for themselves, do I
pray for myself?
Everyone prays for themselves.
Rubbish.
Ok, we'll pray for you too... since you feel left out.
As I said, you can pray for me all you like, it makes no difference.
--
Saddam has continued to produce them, that he has existing and active
military plans for the use of chemical and biological weapons, which
could be activated within 45 minutes
- Tony Blair on Saddam 24/9/02
"For a century and a half now, America and Japan have formed one of the
great and enduring alliances of modern times."
George W Bush -Tokyo, Japan, Feb. 18, 2002
suicide bombing is not a belief
-CrazyAlec (internet spook)
"I hear there's rumors on the Internets"
- George W Bush -Oct. 9, 2004
Even today I am willing to volunteer to do the dirty work for Israel, to
kill as many Arabs as necessary, to deport them, to expel and burn
them, to have everyone hate us, to pull the rug from underneath the
feet of the Diaspora Jews, so that they will be forced to run to us
crying. Even if it means blowing up one or two synagogues here and
there, I don't care. -- Ariel Sharon, interviewed by Amos Oz (published
in the Israeli daily Davar, DEC 17, 1982
.
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| User: "Roy Jose Lorr" |
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| Title: Re: What do you think? |
08 Jan 2005 05:10:09 AM |
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CQMMAN wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
CQMMAN wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
Jim07D5 wrote:
<snip>
Do you want me to pray for you or not?
Why would an atheist care if you prayed or not? Personally I am not
keen on strangers thinking about me, but since your prayers do
nothing except make you feel better, knock yourself out.
All prayerists are at this moment praying for your speedy recovery.
Recovery from what?
If I pray that God not answer my prayers, what options does God
have, WRT this prayer? Is this where lightning bolts come into
play?
True prayer does not take place consciously.
Funny, I know many priests who would disagree (nothing new there
though).
How many priests do you know?
I am on close terms with at least four.
How close?
If I pray for all those people who do not pray for themselves, do I
pray for myself?
Everyone prays for themselves.
Rubbish.
Ok, we'll pray for you too... since you feel left out.
As I said, you can pray for me all you like, it makes no difference.
How do you know this?
--
The last stage of
utopian sentimentalism
is homicidal mania.
.
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| User: "CQMMAN" |
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| Title: Re: What do you think? |
08 Jan 2005 06:51:26 AM |
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Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
CQMMAN wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
CQMMAN wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
Jim07D5 wrote:
<snip>
Do you want me to pray for you or not?
Why would an atheist care if you prayed or not? Personally I am not
keen on strangers thinking about me, but since your prayers do
nothing except make you feel better, knock yourself out.
All prayerists are at this moment praying for your speedy recovery.
Recovery from what?
If I pray that God not answer my prayers, what options does God
have, WRT this prayer? Is this where lightning bolts come into
play?
True prayer does not take place consciously.
Funny, I know many priests who would disagree (nothing new there
though).
How many priests do you know?
I am on close terms with at least four.
How close?
Not that close, at least two of them are gay!!
If I pray for all those people who do not pray for themselves,
do I pray for myself?
Everyone prays for themselves.
Rubbish.
Ok, we'll pray for you too... since you feel left out.
As I said, you can pray for me all you like, it makes no difference.
How do you know this?
There is no evidence that it does make a difference. If praying does make a
difference, please provide some evidence.
--
Saddam has continued to produce them, that he has existing and active
military plans for the use of chemical and biological weapons, which
could be activated within 45 minutes
- Tony Blair on Saddam 24/9/02
"For a century and a half now, America and Japan have formed one of the
great and enduring alliances of modern times."
George W Bush -Tokyo, Japan, Feb. 18, 2002
suicide bombing is not a belief
-CrazyAlec (internet spook)
"I hear there's rumors on the Internets"
- George W Bush -Oct. 9, 2004
Even today I am willing to volunteer to do the dirty work for Israel, to
kill as many Arabs as necessary, to deport them, to expel and burn
them, to have everyone hate us, to pull the rug from underneath the
feet of the Diaspora Jews, so that they will be forced to run to us
crying. Even if it means blowing up one or two synagogues here and
there, I don't care. -- Ariel Sharon, interviewed by Amos Oz (published
in the Israeli daily Davar, DEC 17, 1982
.
|
|
|
| User: "Roy Jose Lorr" |
|
| Title: Re: What do you think? |
08 Jan 2005 07:27:41 AM |
|
|
CQMMAN wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
CQMMAN wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
CQMMAN wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
Jim07D5 wrote:
<snip>
Do you want me to pray for you or not?
Why would an atheist care if you prayed or not? Personally I am not
keen on strangers thinking about me, but since your prayers do
nothing except make you feel better, knock yourself out.
All prayerists are at this moment praying for your speedy recovery.
Recovery from what?
If I pray that God not answer my prayers, what options does God
have, WRT this prayer? Is this where lightning bolts come into
play?
True prayer does not take place consciously.
Funny, I know many priests who would disagree (nothing new there
though).
How many priests do you know?
I am on close terms with at least four.
How close?
Not that close, at least two of them are gay!!
How do you know this?
If I pray for all those people who do not pray for themselves,
do I pray for myself?
Everyone prays for themselves.
Rubbish.
Ok, we'll pray for you too... since you feel left out.
As I said, you can pray for me all you like, it makes no difference.
How do you know this?
There is no evidence that it does make a difference. If praying does make a
difference, please provide some evidence.
I'm not saying praying makes a difference. But, I am mildly puzzled as to
how one can accept, on faith alone, an idea like one species changing
into another (you do subscribe to that idea... no?) while at the same
time rejecting other faith based ideas.
--
The last stage of
utopian sentimentalism
is homicidal mania.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Gary Bohn" |
|
| Title: Re: What do you think? |
08 Jan 2005 12:03:49 PM |
|
|
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote in
news:41DFE030.6BA49123@worldnet.att.net:
CQMMAN wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
CQMMAN wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
CQMMAN wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
Jim07D5 wrote:
<snip>
Do you want me to pray for you or not?
Why would an atheist care if you prayed or not? Personally I am
not keen on strangers thinking about me, but since your prayers
do nothing except make you feel better, knock yourself out.
All prayerists are at this moment praying for your speedy
recovery.
Recovery from what?
If I pray that God not answer my prayers, what options does
God have, WRT this prayer? Is this where lightning bolts come
into play?
True prayer does not take place consciously.
Funny, I know many priests who would disagree (nothing new there
though).
How many priests do you know?
I am on close terms with at least four.
How close?
Not that close, at least two of them are gay!!
How do you know this?
If I pray for all those people who do not pray for themselves,
do I pray for myself?
Everyone prays for themselves.
Rubbish.
Ok, we'll pray for you too... since you feel left out.
As I said, you can pray for me all you like, it makes no
difference.
How do you know this?
There is no evidence that it does make a difference. If praying does
make a difference, please provide some evidence.
I'm not saying praying makes a difference. But, I am mildly puzzled
as to how one can accept, on faith alone, an idea like one species
changing into another (you do subscribe to that idea... no?) while at
the same time rejecting other faith based ideas.
--
The last stage of
utopian sentimentalism
is homicidal mania.
Why do you believe that speciation is based on faith?
Before we head too far into this, give me a definition for speciation we
can work with.
--
Gary Bohn
"Education is the ability listen to almost anything without losing your
temper."
Robert Frost
.
|
|
|
| User: "Roy Jose Lorr" |
|
| Title: Re: What do you think? |
08 Jan 2005 02:47:03 PM |
|
|
Gary Bohn wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote in
news:41DFE030.6BA49123@worldnet.att.net:
CQMMAN wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
CQMMAN wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
CQMMAN wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
Jim07D5 wrote:
<snip>
Do you want me to pray for you or not?
Why would an atheist care if you prayed or not? Personally I am
not keen on strangers thinking about me, but since your prayers
do nothing except make you feel better, knock yourself out.
All prayerists are at this moment praying for your speedy
recovery.
Recovery from what?
If I pray that God not answer my prayers, what options does
God have, WRT this prayer? Is this where lightning bolts come
into play?
True prayer does not take place consciously.
Funny, I know many priests who would disagree (nothing new there
though).
How many priests do you know?
I am on close terms with at least four.
How close?
Not that close, at least two of them are gay!!
How do you know this?
If I pray for all those people who do not pray for themselves,
do I pray for myself?
Everyone prays for themselves.
Rubbish.
Ok, we'll pray for you too... since you feel left out.
As I said, you can pray for me all you like, it makes no
difference.
How do you know this?
There is no evidence that it does make a difference. If praying does
make a difference, please provide some evidence.
I'm not saying praying makes a difference. But, I am mildly puzzled
as to how one can accept, on faith alone, an idea like one species
changing into another (you do subscribe to that idea... no?) while at
the same time rejecting other faith based ideas.
--
The last stage of
utopian sentimentalism
is homicidal mania.
Why do you believe that speciation is based on faith?
Before we head too far into this, give me a definition for speciation we
can work with.
Why should a person you've called a troll give you the time of day?
Buzz off, slop chute.
--
Gary Bohn
"Education is the ability listen to almost anything without losing your
temper."
Robert Frost
'Education is a system of imposed ignorance'
- Noam Chomsky - Manufacturing Consent
--
The last stage of
utopian sentimentalism
is homicidal mania.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Gary Bohn" |
|
| Title: Re: What do you think? |
08 Jan 2005 05:04:55 PM |
|
|
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote in
news:41E0472B.7E20A1AC@worldnet.att.net:
Gary Bohn wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote in
news:41DFE030.6BA49123@worldnet.att.net:
CQMMAN wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
CQMMAN wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
CQMMAN wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
Jim07D5 wrote:
<snip>
Do you want me to pray for you or not?
Why would an atheist care if you prayed or not? Personally I
am not keen on strangers thinking about me, but since your
prayers do nothing except make you feel better, knock
yourself out.
All prayerists are at this moment praying for your speedy
recovery.
Recovery from what?
If I pray that God not answer my prayers, what options does
God have, WRT this prayer? Is this where lightning bolts
come into play?
True prayer does not take place consciously.
Funny, I know many priests who would disagree (nothing new
there though).
How many priests do you know?
I am on close terms with at least four.
How close?
Not that close, at least two of them are gay!!
How do you know this?
If I pray for all those people who do not pray for
themselves, do I pray for myself?
Everyone prays for themselves.
Rubbish.
Ok, we'll pray for you too... since you feel left out.
As I said, you can pray for me all you like, it makes no
difference.
How do you know this?
There is no evidence that it does make a difference. If praying
does make a difference, please provide some evidence.
I'm not saying praying makes a difference. But, I am mildly
puzzled as to how one can accept, on faith alone, an idea like one
species changing into another (you do subscribe to that idea...
no?) while at the same time rejecting other faith based ideas.
--
The last stage of
utopian sentimentalism
is homicidal mania.
Why do you believe that speciation is based on faith?
Before we head too far into this, give me a definition for speciation
we can work with.
Why should a person you've called a troll give you the time of day?
Buzz off, slop chute.
I don't remember asking for the time of day. You made stupid comment
that I felt needed to addressed.
I still think you are a troll.
Until you come forward with something other than unbased one liners
along the lines of 'your wrong I'm right', that's all anyone can think
of you.
--
apatriot #23, aa #1779, Grand Poobah (Pubbah)(Hell! head honcho), EAC
Department of Oxygen Deprivation Responsible for brain damage
everywhere!
Gary Bohn
Conservatism is the political philosophy that it ain't broke so don't
try to fix it. Therefore, if that is indeed how it is, that is what
ought to be.
The Wilkins
.
|
|
|
| User: "Roy Jose Lorr" |
|
| Title: Re: What do you think? |
08 Jan 2005 05:54:35 PM |
|
|
Gary Bohn wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote in
news:41E0472B.7E20A1AC@worldnet.att.net:
Gary Bohn wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote in
news:41DFE030.6BA49123@worldnet.att.net:
CQMMAN wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
CQMMAN wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
CQMMAN wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
Jim07D5 wrote:
<snip>
Do you want me to pray for you or not?
Why would an atheist care if you prayed or not? Personally I
am not keen on strangers thinking about me, but since your
prayers do nothing except make you feel better, knock
yourself out.
All prayerists are at this moment praying for your speedy
recovery.
Recovery from what?
If I pray that God not answer my prayers, what options does
God have, WRT this prayer? Is this where lightning bolts
come into play?
True prayer does not take place consciously.
Funny, I know many priests who would disagree (nothing new
there though).
How many priests do you know?
I am on close terms with at least four.
How close?
Not that close, at least two of them are gay!!
How do you know this?
If I pray for all those people who do not pray for
themselves, do I pray for myself?
Everyone prays for themselves.
Rubbish.
Ok, we'll pray for you too... since you feel left out.
As I said, you can pray for me all you like, it makes no
difference.
How do you know this?
There is no evidence that it does make a difference. If praying
does make a difference, please provide some evidence.
I'm not saying praying makes a difference. But, I am mildly
puzzled as to how one can accept, on faith alone, an idea like one
species changing into another (you do subscribe to that idea...
no?) while at the same time rejecting other faith based ideas.
--
The last stage of
utopian sentimentalism
is homicidal mania.
Why do you believe that speciation is based on faith?
Before we head too far into this, give me a definition for speciation
we can work with.
Why should a person you've called a troll give you the time of day?
Buzz off, slop chute.
I don't remember asking for the time of day. You made stupid comment
that I felt needed to addressed.
You made a stupid request when you asked me for a definition that
even the speciation specialists can't agree on.
I still think you are a troll.
Until you come forward with something other than unbased one liners
along the lines of 'your wrong I'm right', that's all anyone can think
of you.
Why do you continue conversing with someone you
consider a troll... you got a screw loose somewhere?
--
The last stage of
utopian sentimentalism
is homicidal mania.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Gary Bohn" |
|
| Title: Re: What do you think? |
08 Jan 2005 07:19:07 PM |
|
|
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote in
news:41E0731E.2E2A4D4@worldnet.att.net:
<snip>
I don't remember asking for the time of day. You made stupid comment
that I felt needed to addressed.
You made a stupid request when you asked me for a definition that
even the speciation specialists can't agree on.
If you have no definition then any example I or anyone else can give you
can be excused out of hand. There are commonly agreed to definitions
among biologists.
It is very difficult to reasonably excuse something without being able
to define it, which is what you have attempted to do.
I still think you are a troll.
Until you come forward with something other than unbased one liners
along the lines of 'your wrong I'm right', that's all anyone can
think of you.
Why do you continue conversing with someone you
consider a troll... you got a screw loose somewhere?
Why do you not take your self assured beliefs to a group that is full of
research scientists and other interested parties practised in dealing
with anti-evolution misinformation such as yours? Why just take them to
forums where most are interested in other things? Do places like
talk.origins frighten you a bit?
--
<snip>
--
apatriot #23, aa #1779, Grand Poobah (Pubbah)(Hell! head honcho), EAC
Department of Oxygen Deprivation Responsible for brain damage
everywhere!
Gary Bohn
Conservatism is the political philosophy that it ain't broke so don't
try to fix it. Therefore, if that is indeed how it is, that is what
ought to be.
The Wilkins
.
|
|
|
| User: "Roy Jose Lorr" |
|
| Title: Re: What do you think? |
08 Jan 2005 08:33:53 PM |
|
|
Gary Bohn wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote in
news:41E0731E.2E2A4D4@worldnet.att.net:
<snip>
I don't remember asking for the time of day. You made stupid comment
that I felt needed to addressed.
You made a stupid request when you asked me for a definition that
even the speciation specialists can't agree on.
If you have no definition then any example I or anyone else can give you
can be excused out of hand. There are commonly agreed to definitions
among biologists.
Which one should I pick... its eeny meeny miny mo. Why
don't you pick one for me.
It is very difficult to reasonably excuse something without being able
to define it, which is what you have attempted to do.
Hardly.
I still think you are a troll.
Until you come forward with something other than unbased one liners
along the lines of 'your wrong I'm right', that's all anyone can
think of you.
Why do you continue conversing with someone you
consider a troll... you got a screw loose somewhere?
Why do you not take your self assured beliefs to a group that is full of
research scientists and other interested parties practised in dealing
with anti-evolution misinformation such as yours?
What makes you think I haven't?
Why just take them to
forums where most are interested in other things? Do places like
talk.origins frighten you a bit?
More stupid questions.
--
The last stage of
utopian sentimentalism
is homicidal mania.
.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| User: "CQMMAN" |
|
| Title: Re: What do you think? |
08 Jan 2005 08:21:11 AM |
|
|
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
CQMMAN wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
CQMMAN wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
CQMMAN wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
Jim07D5 wrote:
<snip>
Do you want me to pray for you or not?
Why would an atheist care if you prayed or not? Personally I am
not keen on strangers thinking about me, but since your prayers
do nothing except make you feel better, knock yourself out.
All prayerists are at this moment praying for your speedy
recovery.
Recovery from what?
If I pray that God not answer my prayers, what options does God
have, WRT this prayer? Is this where lightning bolts come into
play?
True prayer does not take place consciously.
Funny, I know many priests who would disagree (nothing new there
though).
How many priests do you know?
I am on close terms with at least four.
How close?
Not that close, at least two of them are gay!!
How do you know this?
Because they are not very good at covering their tracks on the Internet.
Amazing how dangerous an internet connection can be to a priests reputation.
If I pray for all those people who do not pray for themselves,
do I pray for myself?
Everyone prays for themselves.
Rubbish.
Ok, we'll pray for you too... since you feel left out.
As I said, you can pray for me all you like, it makes no
difference.
How do you know this?
There is no evidence that it does make a difference. If praying does
make a difference, please provide some evidence.
I'm not saying praying makes a difference. But, I am mildly puzzled
as to how one can accept, on faith alone, an idea like one species
changing
into another (you do subscribe to that idea... no?) while at the same
time rejecting other faith based ideas.
Because we know that evolution works on a smaller scale. We know for a fact
that species can change over time, and we know that new species of organisms
like bacteria can be produced in a relatively short space of time (oh wait,
don't tell me, god created SARS to punish us right?). I personally have not
see a new species on the scale of large mammals, but then the difference in
generations between a human and a dog (for example) is tiny as opposed to a
human and a virus, bacteria, even an insect.
So we know that the building blocks of evolution certainly do exist. There
is no such evidence (in fact none whatsoever) that prayer works, or that the
christian god exists.
--
Saddam has continued to produce them, that he has existing and active
military plans for the use of chemical and biological weapons, which
could be activated within 45 minutes
- Tony Blair on Saddam 24/9/02
"For a century and a half now, America and Japan have formed one of the
great and enduring alliances of modern times."
George W Bush -Tokyo, Japan, Feb. 18, 2002
suicide bombing is not a belief
-CrazyAlec (internet spook)
"I hear there's rumors on the Internets"
- George W Bush -Oct. 9, 2004
Even today I am willing to volunteer to do the dirty work for Israel, to
kill as many Arabs as necessary, to deport them, to expel and burn
them, to have everyone hate us, to pull the rug from underneath the
feet of the Diaspora Jews, so that they will be forced to run to us
crying. Even if it means blowing up one or two synagogues here and
there, I don't care. -- Ariel Sharon, interviewed by Amos Oz (published
in the Israeli daily Davar, DEC 17, 1982
.
|
|
|
| User: "Roy Jose Lorr" |
|
| Title: Re: What do you think? |
08 Jan 2005 11:24:40 AM |
|
|
CQMMAN wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
CQMMAN wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
CQMMAN wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
CQMMAN wrote:
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
Jim07D5 wrote:
<snip>
Do you want me to pray for you or not?
Why would an atheist care if you prayed or not? Personally I am
not keen on strangers thinking about me, but since your prayers
do nothing except make you feel better, knock yourself out.
All prayerists are at this moment praying for your speedy
recovery.
Recovery from what?
If I pray that God not answer my prayers, what options does God
have, WRT this prayer? Is this where lightning bolts come into
play?
True prayer does not take place consciously.
Funny, I know many priests who would disagree (nothing new there
though).
How many priests do you know?
I am on close terms with at least four.
How close?
Not that close, at least two of them are gay!!
How do you know this?
Because they are not very good at covering their tracks on the Internet.
Amazing how dangerous an internet connection can be to a priests reputation.
If I pray for all those people who do not pray for themselves,
do I pray for myself?
Everyone prays for themselves.
Rubbish.
Ok, we'll pray for you too... since you feel left out.
As I said, you can pray for me all you like, it makes no
difference.
How do you know this?
There is no evidence that it does make a difference. If praying does
make a difference, please provide some evidence.
I'm not saying praying makes a difference. But, I am mildly puzzled
as to how one can accept, on faith alone, an idea like one species
changing
into another (you do subscribe to that idea... no?) while at the same
time rejecting other faith based ideas.
Because we know that evolution works on a smaller scale. We know for a fact
that species can change over time, and we know that new species of organisms
like bacteria can be produced in a relatively short space of time (oh wait,
don't tell me, god created SARS to punish us right?). I personally have not
see a new species on the scale of large mammals, but then the difference in
generations between a human and a dog (for example) is tiny as opposed to a
human and a virus, bacteria, even an insect.
So we know that the building blocks of evolution certainly do exist. There
is no such evidence (in fact none whatsoever) that prayer works, or that the
christian god exists.
I've been watching for some time with great amusement the twists and turns
of evolutionists, their constant revision of definitions and the repeated
denials that theirs is a faith based religious construct. All this simply
because
of the lack of concrete evidence pertaining to the changing of one species
into another. When evolution theory becomes the messenger for its own
validity (like saying the bible is true because it says so), or by formula based
on the "contrasting pairs" hypothesis of terms, "mutation" evolves into
"speciation", the evolution priests set themselves up for comedic ridicule.
The irony is in the fact that none state the case against "one species changing
into another" more profoundly than evolutionists themselves. Never do they
realize that their particular "profundity" amounts to the same sort of prayer
issued by all religious fundamentalists, no matter the denomination.
--
The last stage of
utopian sentimentalism
is homicidal mania.
.
|
|
|
| User: "CQMMAN" |
|
| Title: Re: What do you think? |
08 Jan 2005 12:14:55 PM |
|
|
Roy Jose Lorr <mosestorah@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
I've been watching for some time with great amusement the twists and
turns
of evolutionists, their constant revision of definitions and the
repeated denials that theirs is a faith based religious construct.
All this simply because
of the lack of concrete evidence pertaining to the changing of one
species into another. When evolution theory becomes the messenger
for its own validity (like saying the bible is true because it says
so), or by formula based
on the "contrasting pairs" hypothesis of terms, "mutation" evolves
into "speciation", the evolution priests set themselves up for
comedic ridicule.
The irony is in the fact that none state the case against "one
species changing into another" more profoundly than evolutionists
themselves. Never do they realize that their particular "profundity"
amounts to the same sort of prayer issued by all religious
fundamentalists, no matter the denomination.
I think you need to understand what causes evolution before you mouth off
about it. As I said, we know that evolution within species works, and we
also know new species have appeared in our lifetime (especially viri etc).
We also know that change takes many, many, many generations. All this is
INFINITELY more supporting evidence for evolution than there is for the
christian god.
--
Saddam has continued to produce them, that he has existing and active
military plans for the use of chemical and biological weapons, which
could be activated within 45 minutes
- Tony Blair on Saddam 24/9/02
"For a century and a half now, America and Japan have formed one of the
great and enduring alliances of modern times."
George W Bush -Tokyo, Japan, Feb. 18, 2002
suicide bombing is not a belief
-CrazyAlec (internet spook)
"I hear there's rumors on the Internets"
- George W Bush -Oct. 9, 2004
Even today I am willing to volunteer to do the dirty work for Israel, to
kill as many Arabs as necessary, to deport them, to expel and burn
them, to have everyone hate us, to pull the rug from underneath the
feet of the Diaspora Jews, so that they will be forced to run to us
crying. Even if it means blowing up one or two synagogues here and
there, I don't care. -- Ariel Sharon, interviewed by Amos Oz (published
in the Israeli daily Davar, DEC 17, 1982
.
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