| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"Jason Spaceman" |
| Date: |
04 Dec 2004 02:10:24 AM |
| Object: |
WingNutDaily columnist: The faith of unbelievers |
From the article:
------------------------------------------------------------
But wait, you say. Atheism is a no-faith belief, because according to
it, God does not exist.
However, atheism is very much a faith-based doctrine. Think about it:
It takes a great deal of faith to believe that God does not exist. In
fact, the basics of science will explain that proving a negative is
essentially impossible. The reason for this is that to prove something
does not exist, one must first identify everything that does exist.
How enlightened and devout are those who cannot possibly prove
everything that does exist, and so choose to rely entirely on their
faith in the non-existence of God.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Read it at
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=41765
J. Spaceman
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| User: "Ike" |
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| Title: Re: WingNutDaily columnist: The faith of unbelievers |
04 Dec 2004 09:33:50 PM |
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"Jason Spaceman" <notreally@jspaceman.homelinux.org> wrote in message
news:04s2r05pvjcobo29jdo9o681utshgas4tt@4ax.com...
From the article:
------------------------------------------------------------
But wait, you say. Atheism is a no-faith belief, because according to
it, God does not exist.
However, atheism is very much a faith-based doctrine. Think about it:
It takes a great deal of faith to believe that God does not exist. In
fact, the basics of science will explain that proving a negative is
essentially impossible. The reason for this is that to prove something
does not exist, one must first identify everything that does exist.
How enlightened and devout are those who cannot possibly prove
everything that does exist, and so choose to rely entirely on their
faith in the non-existence of God.
God exists, but not in the external world. Once you know what God is, you
can understand that God's objective existence isn't. God is internal to the
individual and has no relation to objective reality, except as a set of
instructions, something like the instructions in a coputer program. in
object-oriented programming you can create an object, but it has no
objective existence except as a set of machine-language instructions. God is
the smae. So there is no need to disprove the objective existence of God,
just as there is no need to disprove the class of objects in a computer
program that react in a certain way to IO streams of data.
--
www.1accordion.net
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| User: "Don Kresch" |
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| Title: Re: WingNutDaily columnist: The faith of unbelievers |
04 Dec 2004 09:15:53 AM |
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In alt.atheism on Sat, 04 Dec 2004 03:10:24 -0500, Jason Spaceman
<notreally@jspaceman.homelinux.org> let us all know that:
From the article:
------------------------------------------------------------
But wait, you say. Atheism is a no-faith belief, because according to
it, God does not exist.
However, atheism is very much a faith-based doctrine. Think about it:
It takes a great deal of faith to believe that God does not exist. In
fact, the basics of science will explain that proving a negative is
essentially impossible. The reason for this is that to prove something
does not exist, one must first identify everything that does exist.
How enlightened and devout are those who cannot possibly prove
everything that does exist, and so choose to rely entirely on their
faith in the non-existence of God.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Read it at
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=41765
I emailed her a point-by-point response/refutation.
'Twill be interesting to see if she can overcome reality.
Don
---
aa #51, Knight of BAAWA, DNRC o-, Member of the [H]orde
Atheist Minister for St. Dogbert.
"No being is so important that he can usurp the rights of another"
Picard to Data/Graves "The Schizoid Man"
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| User: "Mark K. Bilbo" |
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| Title: Re: WingNutDaily columnist: The faith of unbelievers |
04 Dec 2004 07:02:57 AM |
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In our last episode <04s2r05pvjcobo29jdo9o681utshgas4tt@4ax.com>, Jason
Spaceman lept out of the bushes shouting:
Think about it
That'd be a first for a Wingnut columnist...
--
Mark K. Bilbo - a.a. #1423
EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion
Alt-atheism website at: http://www.alt-atheism.org
-----------------------------------------------------------
"Being surprised at the fact that the universe
is fine tuned for life is akin to a puddle being
surprised at how well it fits its hole"
-- Douglas Adams
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| User: "Richard Smol" |
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| Title: Re: WingNutDaily columnist: The faith of unbelievers |
04 Dec 2004 05:34:00 AM |
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Jason Spaceman wrote:
From the article:
------------------------------------------------------------
But wait, you say. Atheism is a no-faith belief, because according to
it, God does not exist.
However, atheism is very much a faith-based doctrine. Think about it:
It takes a great deal of faith to believe that God does not exist. In
fact, the basics of science will explain that proving a negative is
essentially impossible. The reason for this is that to prove something
does not exist, one must first identify everything that does exist.
How enlightened and devout are those who cannot possibly prove
everything that does exist, and so choose to rely entirely on their
faith in the non-existence of God.
Reading that article caused an accute stupidity overload ...
RS
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: WingNutDaily columnist: The faith of unbelievers |
22 Dec 2004 11:41:43 AM |
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Richard Smol wrote:
Jason Spaceman wrote:
From the article:
------------------------------------------------------------
But wait, you say. Atheism is a no-faith belief, because according
to
it, God does not exist.
However, atheism is very much a faith-based doctrine. Think about
it:
It takes a great deal of faith to believe that God does not exist.
In
fact, the basics of science will explain that proving a negative is
essentially impossible. The reason for this is that to prove
something
does not exist, one must first identify everything that does exist.
How enlightened and devout are those who cannot possibly prove
everything that does exist, and so choose to rely entirely on their
faith in the non-existence of God.
Reading that article caused an accute stupidity overload ...
RS
No kidding.
Here is a rebuttal:
http://atheism.about.com/b/a/131132.htm?nl=1
From Austin Cline, Your Guide to Agnosticism / Atheism.
December 11, 2004
Faith of Unbelievers?
As Christmas becomes more and more secularized, conservative
evangelicals grow more and more defensive. After all, Christmas is
supposed to be "their" holiday and every time they see a secular
expression of it, they are reminded of how much they have lost. Thus,
they lash out at others in an attempt to salvage some self-esteem.
Rebecca D. Feldman writes at WorldNetDaily:
Granted, Islamic fascism is indeed a serious problem in this world.
However, what we are neglecting to realize is that the far left-wing
brand of non-religion is itself a religion. Liberals want no references
to God in our schools or on the steps of our courthouse buildings. This
is nothing more than a public acknowledgement that God does not exist.
This public acknowledgement is in essence a statement of faith, the
faith we know as atheism.
There are currently no references in schools or courthouses to the
existence of Zeus, Krishna, Odin. There are no mentions of the
importance of the Tao, the insights of the Buddha, or the desirability
of Vahalla. Does this, therefore, amount to "public acknowledgments"
that those gods do not exist or that the other principles are invalid?
Of course not. A failure by the government to say that some particular
god does exist is not the same thing as the government saying that this
god does not exist. A failure by the government to endorse some
particular religious doctrine is not the same as the government
opposing or denigrating that religious doctrine.
We can see the plain difference if we imagine the current situation,
where the government does not endorse the existence of God in schools,
and the possible situation where the government hangs "God Does Not
Exist" and "Christianity is for Gullible Fools" banners in public
schools. Now, is there anyone who cannot tell the difference between
the two? Is there anyone who cannot see how Christians would rightly
get upset at the latter case in ways that just wouldn't be justified by
the former?
Apparently, Rebecca Feldman can't tell the difference between the two.
Why do you suppose that is?
However, atheism is very much a faith-based doctrine. Think about
it: It takes a great deal of faith to believe that God does not exist.
In fact, the basics of science will explain that proving a negative is
essentially impossible. The reason for this is that to prove something
does not exist, one must first identify everything that does exist. How
enlightened and devout are those who cannot possibly prove everything
that does exist, and so choose to rely entirely on their faith in the
non-existence of God.
Now it's becoming a bit easier to see why Feldman can't tell the
difference between the two aforementioned scenarios. Science most
definitely does not say that proving a negative is "essentially
impossible." Proving a negative is quite possible given the right
circumstances. I can, for example, prove that married bachelors don't
exist - it's a trivial matter because the qualities of a "married
bachelor" are self-contradictory and thus such a being is logically
impossible.
The same is true for many alleged gods. Depending upon what a person
means by "god," proving its nonexistence is just as simple as proving
the non-existence of married bachelors. This is clear to anyone who has
studied a bit of logic and philosophy. Rebecca Feldman simply has no
earthly idea what she is writing about. She apparently read a few
clever sounding arguments in some trite, superficial apologetics
resources and sadly internalized them to the point where she feels
comfortable regurgitating the whole sorry mess on command.
Then again, this is World Net Daily we are talking about. Feldman's
piece almost qualifies as sophisticated literature where they are
concerned.
As we prepare to celebrate the birth of our Lord and Savior, Jesus
Christ, let us remember the faith of those who believe that He does not
exist and be praying for a conversion of a truly religious kind.
Maybe she should just pray for a clue?
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| User: "Al Klein" |
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| Title: Re: WingNutDaily columnist: The faith of unbelievers |
22 Dec 2004 11:10:00 PM |
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On 22 Dec 2004 09:41:43 -0800, said in alt.atheism:
Faith of Unbelievers?
As Christmas becomes more and more secularized, conservative
evangelicals grow more and more defensive. After all, Christmas is
supposed to be "their" holiday and every time they see a secular
expression of it, they are reminded of how much they have lost. Thus,
they lash out at others in an attempt to salvage some self-esteem.
Rebecca D. Feldman writes at WorldNetDaily:
Granted, Islamic fascism is indeed a serious problem in this world.
However, what we are neglecting to realize is that the far left-wing
brand of non-religion is itself a religion. Liberals want no references
to God in our schools or on the steps of our courthouse buildings. This
is nothing more than a public acknowledgement that God does not exist.
This public acknowledgement is in essence a statement of faith, the
faith we know as atheism.
Etc.
Try indicating which are your words and which are part of the quote.
The post is mildly confusing.
--
"To assume the existence of an unperceivable being ... does not facilitate understanding
the orderliness we find in the perceivable world."
- Letter to an Iowa student who asked, What is God? July, 1953; Einstein Archive 59-085
(random sig, produced by SigChanger)
rukbat at verizon dot net
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| User: "Vic Sagerquist" |
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| Title: Re: WingNutDaily columnist: The faith of unbelievers |
04 Dec 2004 12:46:33 PM |
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On 04 Dec 2004, Jason Spaceman dropped trou, farted, whirled, then shouted:
From the article:
However, atheism is very much a faith-based doctrine. Think about it:
It takes a great deal of faith to believe that God does not exist.
Obviously, to fundies, "think" means "imagine". And it somehow includes
imagining everyone on the planet imagines as they do.
In
fact, the basics of science will explain that proving a negative is
essentially impossible.
Another definition in fundyese: "science" means "logic".
The reason for this is that to prove something
does not exist, one must first identify everything that does exist.
How enlightened and devout are those who cannot possibly prove
everything that does exist, and so choose to rely entirely on their
faith in the non-existence of God.
And this is what remains of the human mind when "fantasy" means "reality".
--
Vic Sagerquist
aa#2011
Supervisor, EAC Department of little adhesive-backed "L" shaped
chrome-plastic doo-dads to add feet to Jesus fish department
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| User: "Meteorite Debris" |
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| Title: Re: WingNutDaily columnist: The faith of unbelievers |
04 Dec 2004 11:21:26 PM |
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On Sat, 04 Dec 2004 03:10:24 -0500 the ET form known as Jason
Spaceman<notreally@jspaceman.homelinux.org> sent a radio signal across
the vast expanse of deep space -._.--._.--._.--._.--._.--._.
From the article:
------------------------------------------------------------
But wait, you say. Atheism is a no-faith belief, because according to
it, God does not exist.
However, atheism is very much a faith-based doctrine. Think about it:
It takes a great deal of faith to believe that God does not exist. In
fact, the basics of science will explain that proving a negative is
essentially impossible. The reason for this is that to prove something
does not exist, one must first identify everything that does exist.
How enlightened and devout are those who cannot possibly prove
everything that does exist, and so choose to rely entirely on their
faith in the non-existence of God.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Read it at
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=41765
Textbook example of a strawman.
--
epicurus1*at*optusnet*dot*com*dot*au
apatriot #1, atheist #1417,
Chief EAC prophet
http://members.optusnet.com.au/~pk1956/
Apatriotism Yahoo Group
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/apatriotism
Sunday: A day given over by Americans to wishing that they themselves
were dead and in Heaven, and that their neighbors were dead and in
Hell.
-Mencken
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| User: "towelie" |
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| Title: Re: WingNutDaily columnist: The faith of unbelievers |
04 Dec 2004 04:00:43 AM |
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TV's Jason Spaceman wrote:
From the article:
------------------------------------------------------------
But wait, you say. Atheism is a no-faith belief, because according to
it, God does not exist.
However, atheism is very much a faith-based doctrine. Think about it:
It takes a great deal of faith to believe that God does not exist. In
fact, the basics of science will explain that proving a negative is
essentially impossible. The reason for this is that to prove something
does not exist, one must first identify everything that does exist.
How enlightened and devout are those who cannot possibly prove
everything that does exist, and so choose to rely entirely on their
faith in the non-existence of God.
Is he admitting there is no way to prove that his god exists?
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=41765
--
"Them white boys had me on crystal meth" - some crackhead in GTA:SA
aa #2133
ap #19
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| User: "Geoff" |
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| Title: Re: WingNutDaily columnist: The faith of unbelievers |
04 Dec 2004 09:01:21 AM |
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"towelie" <bugoNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:31dg6dF3a0vo0U1@individual.net...
TV's Jason Spaceman wrote:
From the article:
------------------------------------------------------------
But wait, you say. Atheism is a no-faith belief, because according to
it, God does not exist.
However, atheism is very much a faith-based doctrine. Think about it:
It takes a great deal of faith to believe that God does not exist. In
fact, the basics of science will explain that proving a negative is
essentially impossible. The reason for this is that to prove something
does not exist, one must first identify everything that does exist.
How enlightened and devout are those who cannot possibly prove
everything that does exist, and so choose to rely entirely on their
faith in the non-existence of God.
Is he admitting there is no way to prove that his god exists?
There is a way to prove God's existence. Suppose he came out
from under that rock he's been hiding under for the last couple
millenia and rained some frogs on us...that would do it right?
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| User: "kathryn" |
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| Title: Re: WingNutDaily columnist: The faith of unbelievers |
04 Dec 2004 12:53:54 PM |
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"Geoff" <gebobs@yahoo.nospam.com> wrote in message
news:5jksd.198613$R05.197043@attbi_s53...
"towelie" <bugoNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:31dg6dF3a0vo0U1@individual.net...
TV's Jason Spaceman wrote:
From the article:
------------------------------------------------------------
But wait, you say. Atheism is a no-faith belief, because according to
it, God does not exist.
However, atheism is very much a faith-based doctrine. Think about it:
It takes a great deal of faith to believe that God does not exist. In
fact, the basics of science will explain that proving a negative is
essentially impossible. The reason for this is that to prove something
does not exist, one must first identify everything that does exist.
How enlightened and devout are those who cannot possibly prove
everything that does exist, and so choose to rely entirely on their
faith in the non-existence of God.
Is he admitting there is no way to prove that his god exists?
There is a way to prove God's existence. Suppose he came out
from under that rock he's been hiding under for the last couple
millenia and rained some frogs on us...that would do it right?
Raining frogs? No, cause stuff like that happens due to freaky weather.
Kathryn
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| User: "Olrik" |
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| Title: Re: WingNutDaily columnist: The faith of unbelievers |
04 Dec 2004 11:20:18 PM |
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towelie wrote:
TV's Jason Spaceman wrote:
From the article:
------------------------------------------------------------
But wait, you say. Atheism is a no-faith belief, because according to
it, God does not exist.
However, atheism is very much a faith-based doctrine. Think about it:
It takes a great deal of faith to believe that God does not exist. In
fact, the basics of science will explain that proving a negative is
essentially impossible. The reason for this is that to prove something
does not exist, one must first identify everything that does exist.
How enlightened and devout are those who cannot possibly prove
everything that does exist, and so choose to rely entirely on their
faith in the non-existence of God.
Is he admitting there is no way to prove that his god exists?
I think the "writer" is a "she" : Rebecca D. Feldman
It's pure crap and lies anyway.
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=41765
--
Olrik
aa #1981
Qualified SMASH member
EAC Chief Food Inspector, Bacon Division
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