Religions > Bible > "And God said .. " The Bible's Accuracy and Authority
| Topic: |
Religions > Bible |
| User: |
"Gabriel" |
| Date: |
25 Dec 2007 10:44:42 PM |
| Object: |
"And God said .. " The Bible's Accuracy and Authority |
http://www.answersingenesis.org/articles/am/v2/n4/biblical-authority-god-said
"Ever since the serpent said to Eve, “Indeed, has God said?” the
Word of God has been questioned and attacked. The serpent’s words
focused on two important elements—the Bible’s accuracy and its
authority. .. "
See the web article for more.
Gabriel
.
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| User: "Gabriel" |
|
| Title: Re: "And God said .. " The Bible's Accuracy and Authority |
26 Dec 2007 07:51:33 AM |
|
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On Tue, 25 Dec 2007 23:44:42 -0500, Gabriel
<gabriel_baptist@hotmail.com> wrote:
http://www.answersingenesis.org/articles/am/v2/n4/biblical-authority-god-said
"Ever since the serpent said to Eve, “Indeed, has God said?” the
Word of God has been questioned and attacked. The serpent’s words
focused on two important elements—the Bible’s accuracy and its
authority. .. "
There are those who say that the Bible we have today cannot be
trusted. They say that it was written by men and, therefore,
contains errors. They also suggest that during the centuries of
copying, men introduced many errors.
The supreme argument for the accuracy of Scripture is simply that
God Himself tells us it can be trusted. Do you know why?However,
one important goal of anyone who defends the Bible is to give
evidence that we have in our hands exactly what God said and
exactly what He wants us to have.
One such evidence that the Bible has been copied accurately in
the past is shown in the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls. These
scrolls, found by a shepherd boy in 1947, are dated from 250 to
150 BC. This discovery pushed back our available oldest Scripture
text almost 1,000 years. And when the content of the scrolls was
compared to later copies, no significant differences were found.
That means scribes had been copying with great precision for
almost ten centuries. This amazing discovery moved us one
millennium closer to the originals.
We can also make sound arguments for the trustworthiness of
Scripture based on lower criticism, grammar, and contextual
evidence. We can show that the scribes were meticulous in their
copying of the text of Scripture. We can evidence the
life-changing qualities of the Bible in the lives of millions of
believers. We can evidence the historical accuracy of the text of
the Bible.
But there is another, internal argument for the accuracy of
Scripture, based on the character and attributes of God, and this
argument is supreme.
The Scriptures claim that God Himself breathed out Scripture
(using human instruments, 2 Peter 1:21) and that it can be
trusted to be His Word. His wisdom is infinite, and He is
all-powerful and holy, so everything He says is trustworthy,
accurate, and without error. Since God’s work will image His own
nature, the accuracy of Scripture is guaranteed.
But this argument goes even further, including the faithfulness
of God to preserve the record of His work through Christ. God
sent His own Son, the second person of the trinity, to take human
form for the purpose of redemption. What was the cost of God’s
incredible gift of salvation offered to man? His own Son’s life!
The Bible is the record of Christ’s coming, His payment for our
sin, and all the truths we need to know about Him.
The nature, character, and attributes of God demand that the
Scriptures be accurateSo here is a question. If God sent His Son,
paid the highest price imaginable for the redemption of human
beings, and made a record so all future generations could know,
would He allow the text to be adulterated and the message ruined
by error? Impossible!
If God allowed the text to be lost and the message to be muddled,
He would then be unfaithful to His own purpose and to His own Son
and His sacrifice on the Cross. Logically, theoretically,
practically, that is impossible.
God will not and cannot allow the record of the perfect work of
His Son to be lost to mankind. Otherwise, He would void—for
succeeding generations—the payment of His Son, Jesus Christ.
The nature, character, and attributes of God demand a faithful
witness of His decrees, promise, plan, and purpose, climaxed in
the death, burial, and resurrection of His Son.
Amen!
Glory to God in the highest!
Gabriel
.
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|
|
| User: "Wild Bill" |
|
| Title: Re: "And God said .. " The Bible's Accuracy and Authority |
26 Dec 2007 08:32:26 AM |
|
|
"Gabriel" <gabriel_baptist@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:cvm4n3h61v5h7gas3hr6gse15k41oml9k6@4ax.com...
On Tue, 25 Dec 2007 23:44:42 -0500, Gabriel
<gabriel_baptist@hotmail.com> wrote:
http://www.answersingenesis.org/articles/am/v2/n4/biblical-authority-god-said
"Ever since the serpent said to Eve, "Indeed, has God said?" the
Word of God has been questioned and attacked. The serpent's words
focused on two important elements-the Bible's accuracy and its
authority. .. "
There are those who say that the Bible we have today cannot be
trusted. They say that it was written by men and, therefore,
contains errors. They also suggest that during the centuries of
copying, men introduced many errors.
Yep, that is correct.
The supreme argument for the accuracy of Scripture is simply that
God Himself tells us it can be trusted. Do you know why?However,
one important goal of anyone who defends the Bible is to give
evidence that we have in our hands exactly what God said and
exactly what He wants us to have.
Your god allowed the originals to disappear. All we have are copies of
copies of still more copies.
One such evidence that the Bible has been copied accurately in
the past is shown in the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls. These
scrolls, found by a shepherd boy in 1947, are dated from 250 to
150 BC. This discovery pushed back our available oldest Scripture
text almost 1,000 years. And when the content of the scrolls was
compared to later copies, no significant differences were found.
That means scribes had been copying with great precision for
almost ten centuries. This amazing discovery moved us one
millennium closer to the originals.
See above, we don't know what the originals said.
We can also make sound arguments for the trustworthiness of
Scripture based on lower criticism, grammar, and contextual
evidence. We can show that the scribes were meticulous in their
copying of the text of Scripture. We can evidence the
life-changing qualities of the Bible in the lives of millions of
believers. We can evidence the historical accuracy of the text of
the Bible.
No, the Bible is historically incorrect in several places - see the cities
of Jericho and Ai as just one example.
But there is another, internal argument for the accuracy of
Scripture, based on the character and attributes of God, and this
argument is supreme.
No argument is supreme.
The Scriptures claim that God Himself breathed out Scripture
(using human instruments, 2 Peter 1:21) and that it can be
trusted to be His Word. His wisdom is infinite, and He is
all-powerful and holy, so everything He says is trustworthy,
accurate, and without error. Since God's work will image His own
nature, the accuracy of Scripture is guaranteed.
So all-powerful that he could not stop the originals from being lost, nor
stop the countless contradictions, inconsistencies, errors of science and
historical fact, etc.
But this argument goes even further, including the faithfulness
of God to preserve the record of His work through Christ. God
sent His own Son, the second person of the trinity, to take human
form for the purpose of redemption. What was the cost of God's
incredible gift of salvation offered to man? His own Son's life!
The sacrifice of innocent life to appease a deity is a barbaric and
primitive practice
The Bible is the record of Christ's coming, His payment for our
sin, and all the truths we need to know about Him.
The nature, character, and attributes of God demand that the
Scriptures be accurateSo here is a question. If God sent His Son,
paid the highest price imaginable for the redemption of human
beings, and made a record so all future generations could know,
would He allow the text to be adulterated and the message ruined
by error? Impossible!
Nothing is impossible...and yes, apparently your god did allow the Bible to
be rife with error.
If God allowed the text to be lost and the message to be muddled,
He would then be unfaithful to His own purpose and to His own Son
and His sacrifice on the Cross. Logically, theoretically,
practically, that is impossible.
See above.
God will not and cannot allow the record of the perfect work of
His Son to be lost to mankind. Otherwise, He would void-for
succeeding generations-the payment of His Son, Jesus Christ.
Your god cannot do something? Then why call him a God?
The nature, character, and attributes of God demand a faithful
witness of His decrees, promise, plan, and purpose, climaxed in
the death, burial, and resurrection of His Son.
You and your fundie mentors need to get your heads out of the sand and do
some real research. I suggest you start by obtaining copies of "Who Wrote
the New Testament, The Making of the Christian Myth," by Burton L. Mack, and
"Misquoting Jesus," by Bart D. Ehrman
Shalom,
Bill
Amen!
Glory to God in the highest!
Gabriel
.
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| User: "Gabriel" |
|
| Title: Re: "And God said .. " The Bible's Accuracy and Authority |
26 Dec 2007 01:14:35 PM |
|
|
On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 06:32:26 -0800, "Wild Bill"
<bilsgrdn@qwest.net> wrote:
"Gabriel" <gabriel_baptist@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:cvm4n3h61v5h7gas3hr6gse15k41oml9k6@4ax.com...
On Tue, 25 Dec 2007 23:44:42 -0500, Gabriel
<gabriel_baptist@hotmail.com> wrote:
http://www.answersingenesis.org/articles/am/v2/n4/biblical-authority-god-said
"Ever since the serpent said to Eve, "Indeed, has God said?" the
Word of God has been questioned and attacked. The serpent's words
focused on two important elements-the Bible's accuracy and its
authority. .. "
There are those who say that the Bible we have today cannot be
trusted. They say that it was written by men and, therefore,
contains errors. They also suggest that during the centuries of
copying, men introduced many errors.
Yep, that is correct.
The supreme argument for the accuracy of Scripture is simply that
God Himself tells us it can be trusted. Do you know why?However,
one important goal of anyone who defends the Bible is to give
evidence that we have in our hands exactly what God said and
exactly what He wants us to have.
Your god allowed the originals to disappear. All we have are copies of
copies of still more copies.
Do you know for a fact these copies of copies are incorrect? No,
you're taking other people's word for it. You can't have it both
ways.
And what you are not considering is perhaps it's part of God's
plan to make available to some people an excuse they need to
reject Him, even though the excuse does not hold water.
John 9:39-41 KJVR
39 And Jesus said, For judgment I am come into this world,
that they which see not might see; and that they which see might
be made blind.
40 And some of the Pharisees which were with him heard
these words and said unto him, Are we blind also?
41 Jesus said unto them, If ye were blind, ye should have
no sin: but now ye say, We see; therefore your sin remaineth.
One such evidence that the Bible has been copied accurately in
the past is shown in the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls. These
scrolls, found by a shepherd boy in 1947, are dated from 250 to
150 BC. This discovery pushed back our available oldest Scripture
text almost 1,000 years. And when the content of the scrolls was
compared to later copies, no significant differences were found.
That means scribes had been copying with great precision for
almost ten centuries. This amazing discovery moved us one
millennium closer to the originals.
See above, we don't know what the originals said.
The copies have been rechecked countless times to show that the
message has remain unchanged throughout, as the website is only
one such place that goes into detail of these efforts by numerous
scholars.
We can also make sound arguments for the trustworthiness of
Scripture based on lower criticism, grammar, and contextual
evidence. We can show that the scribes were meticulous in their
copying of the text of Scripture. We can evidence the
life-changing qualities of the Bible in the lives of millions of
believers. We can evidence the historical accuracy of the text of
the Bible.
No, the Bible is historically incorrect in several places - see the cities
of Jericho and Ai as just one example.
No, it's their word that their sources are more correct than the
source of the Bible.
http://www.answersingenesis.org/cec/docs/022601more_than_stories.asp
for more on Jericho for starters.
But there is another, internal argument for the accuracy of
Scripture, based on the character and attributes of God, and this
argument is supreme.
No argument is supreme.
God's is, which is the argument used to show us it is clearly His
Word.
The Scriptures claim that God Himself breathed out Scripture
(using human instruments, 2 Peter 1:21) and that it can be
trusted to be His Word. His wisdom is infinite, and He is
all-powerful and holy, so everything He says is trustworthy,
accurate, and without error. Since God's work will image His own
nature, the accuracy of Scripture is guaranteed.
So all-powerful that he could not stop the originals from being lost,
It's not the physical paper that's His Word, it's the message
they contain. Analysis of the consistencies of the copies shows
evidence that they are accurate and that we do still have His
Word. The onus is on you to prove they are wrong. All old
documents are considered accurate until proven wrong, not the
other way around when it comes to a document you do not like.
nor
stop the countless contradictions, inconsistencies, errors of science and
historical fact, etc.
But this argument goes even further, including the faithfulness
of God to preserve the record of His work through Christ. God
sent His own Son, the second person of the trinity, to take human
form for the purpose of redemption. What was the cost of God's
incredible gift of salvation offered to man? His own Son's life!
The sacrifice of innocent life to appease a deity is a barbaric and
primitive practice
Primitive? People sacrifice (murder) their own babies to appease
their own sense of _convenience_ (as opposed to saving the life
of every single person on this planet, which is what Jesus'
sacrifice did)! Talk about primitive! They murder these babies at
the count of over one million every year in the United States
_alone_. Your plea to primitive hurts your argument.
The Bible is the record of Christ's coming, His payment for our
sin, and all the truths we need to know about Him.
The nature, character, and attributes of God demand that the
Scriptures be accurateSo here is a question. If God sent His Son,
paid the highest price imaginable for the redemption of human
beings, and made a record so all future generations could know,
would He allow the text to be adulterated and the message ruined
by error? Impossible!
Nothing is impossible...and yes, apparently your god did allow the Bible to
be rife with error.
Saying it's so doesn't make it so. Any claimed errors have been
refuted more times than they've been brought up. They are not
errors at all, but instead things the natural man cannot
understand of the spirit of God. Not realizing this, the natural
man, who hates God, wants to see an error and thinks he sees one.
1 Corinthians 2:9-16 KJVR
9 But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard,
neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God
hath prepared for them that love him.
10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for
the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.
11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the
spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth
no man, but the Spirit of God.
12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but
the Spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that
are freely given to us of God.
13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's
wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing
spiritual things with spiritual.
14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the
Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he
know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
15 But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he
himself is judged of no man.
16 For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may
instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ.
If God allowed the text to be lost and the message to be muddled,
He would then be unfaithful to His own purpose and to His own Son
and His sacrifice on the Cross. Logically, theoretically,
practically, that is impossible.
See above.
God will not and cannot allow the record of the perfect work of
His Son to be lost to mankind. Otherwise, He would void-for
succeeding generations-the payment of His Son, Jesus Christ.
Your god cannot do something? Then why call him a God?
The nature, character, and attributes of God demand a faithful
witness of His decrees, promise, plan, and purpose, climaxed in
the death, burial, and resurrection of His Son.
You and your fundie mentors need to get your heads out of the sand and do
some real research.
Why is it that insults are the first attempt at actually backing
up anything you say? I find it interesting that those who reject
God and God's Word cannot do so without resorting to hatred and
insults.
I suggest you start by obtaining copies of "Who Wrote
the New Testament, The Making of the Christian Myth," by Burton L. Mack,
I suggest you read the one of the refutations:
http://home.ca.inter.net/~oblio/review1.htm
and
"Misquoting Jesus," by Bart D. Ehrman
One such refutation:
http://www.tektonics.org/books/ehrqurvw.html
You might also want to look into
http://www.niagarafrontierbible.com/catalog/godsword.php
http://www.answersingenesis.org/Home/Area/faq/bible.asp
http://www.juststopandthink.com/news_details.php?newsID=21
You are of course free to believe whatever you want. But you can
prove nothing when it comes to the opinion that we don't know
God's Word.
Glory to God in the highest!
Gabriel
.
|
|
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| User: "Wild Bill" |
|
| Title: Re: "And God said .. " The Bible's Accuracy and Authority |
26 Dec 2007 02:34:03 PM |
|
|
"Gabriel" <gabriel_baptist@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:tm95n3tf67h5gpvhoquk5kdo0uh1sg8ah0@4ax.com...
On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 06:32:26 -0800, "Wild Bill"
<bilsgrdn@qwest.net> wrote:
"Gabriel" <gabriel_baptist@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:cvm4n3h61v5h7gas3hr6gse15k41oml9k6@4ax.com...
On Tue, 25 Dec 2007 23:44:42 -0500, Gabriel
<gabriel_baptist@hotmail.com> wrote:
http://www.answersingenesis.org/articles/am/v2/n4/biblical-authority-god-said
"Ever since the serpent said to Eve, "Indeed, has God said?" the
Word of God has been questioned and attacked. The serpent's words
focused on two important elements-the Bible's accuracy and its
authority. .. "
There are those who say that the Bible we have today cannot be
trusted. They say that it was written by men and, therefore,
contains errors. They also suggest that during the centuries of
copying, men introduced many errors.
Yep, that is correct.
The supreme argument for the accuracy of Scripture is simply that
God Himself tells us it can be trusted. Do you know why?However,
one important goal of anyone who defends the Bible is to give
evidence that we have in our hands exactly what God said and
exactly what He wants us to have.
Your god allowed the originals to disappear. All we have are copies of
copies of still more copies.
Do you know for a fact these copies of copies are incorrect? No,
you're taking other people's word for it. You can't have it both
ways.
And what you are not considering is perhaps it's part of God's
plan to make available to some people an excuse they need to
reject Him, even though the excuse does not hold water.
John 9:39-41 KJVR
39 And Jesus said, For judgment I am come into this world,
that they which see not might see; and that they which see might
be made blind.
40 And some of the Pharisees which were with him heard
these words and said unto him, Are we blind also?
41 Jesus said unto them, If ye were blind, ye should have
no sin: but now ye say, We see; therefore your sin remaineth.
One such evidence that the Bible has been copied accurately in
the past is shown in the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls. These
scrolls, found by a shepherd boy in 1947, are dated from 250 to
150 BC. This discovery pushed back our available oldest Scripture
text almost 1,000 years. And when the content of the scrolls was
compared to later copies, no significant differences were found.
That means scribes had been copying with great precision for
almost ten centuries. This amazing discovery moved us one
millennium closer to the originals.
See above, we don't know what the originals said.
The copies have been rechecked countless times to show that the
message has remain unchanged throughout, as the website is only
one such place that goes into detail of these efforts by numerous
scholars.
We can also make sound arguments for the trustworthiness of
Scripture based on lower criticism, grammar, and contextual
evidence. We can show that the scribes were meticulous in their
copying of the text of Scripture. We can evidence the
life-changing qualities of the Bible in the lives of millions of
believers. We can evidence the historical accuracy of the text of
the Bible.
No, the Bible is historically incorrect in several places - see the cities
of Jericho and Ai as just one example.
No, it's their word that their sources are more correct than the
source of the Bible.
http://www.answersingenesis.org/cec/docs/022601more_than_stories.asp
for more on Jericho for starters.
But there is another, internal argument for the accuracy of
Scripture, based on the character and attributes of God, and this
argument is supreme.
No argument is supreme.
God's is, which is the argument used to show us it is clearly His
Word.
The Scriptures claim that God Himself breathed out Scripture
(using human instruments, 2 Peter 1:21) and that it can be
trusted to be His Word. His wisdom is infinite, and He is
all-powerful and holy, so everything He says is trustworthy,
accurate, and without error. Since God's work will image His own
nature, the accuracy of Scripture is guaranteed.
So all-powerful that he could not stop the originals from being lost,
It's not the physical paper that's His Word, it's the message
they contain. Analysis of the consistencies of the copies shows
evidence that they are accurate and that we do still have His
Word. The onus is on you to prove they are wrong. All old
documents are considered accurate until proven wrong, not the
other way around when it comes to a document you do not like.
nor
stop the countless contradictions, inconsistencies, errors of science and
historical fact, etc.
But this argument goes even further, including the faithfulness
of God to preserve the record of His work through Christ. God
sent His own Son, the second person of the trinity, to take human
form for the purpose of redemption. What was the cost of God's
incredible gift of salvation offered to man? His own Son's life!
The sacrifice of innocent life to appease a deity is a barbaric and
primitive practice
Primitive? People sacrifice (murder) their own babies to appease
their own sense of _convenience_ (as opposed to saving the life
of every single person on this planet, which is what Jesus'
sacrifice did)! Talk about primitive! They murder these babies at
the count of over one million every year in the United States
_alone_. Your plea to primitive hurts your argument.
The Bible is the record of Christ's coming, His payment for our
sin, and all the truths we need to know about Him.
The nature, character, and attributes of God demand that the
Scriptures be accurateSo here is a question. If God sent His Son,
paid the highest price imaginable for the redemption of human
beings, and made a record so all future generations could know,
would He allow the text to be adulterated and the message ruined
by error? Impossible!
Nothing is impossible...and yes, apparently your god did allow the Bible
to
be rife with error.
Saying it's so doesn't make it so. Any claimed errors have been
refuted more times than they've been brought up. They are not
errors at all, but instead things the natural man cannot
understand of the spirit of God. Not realizing this, the natural
man, who hates God, wants to see an error and thinks he sees one.
1 Corinthians 2:9-16 KJVR
9 But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard,
neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God
hath prepared for them that love him.
10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for
the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.
11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the
spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth
no man, but the Spirit of God.
12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but
the Spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that
are freely given to us of God.
13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's
wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing
spiritual things with spiritual.
14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the
Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he
know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
15 But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he
himself is judged of no man.
16 For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may
instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ.
If God allowed the text to be lost and the message to be muddled,
He would then be unfaithful to His own purpose and to His own Son
and His sacrifice on the Cross. Logically, theoretically,
practically, that is impossible.
See above.
God will not and cannot allow the record of the perfect work of
His Son to be lost to mankind. Otherwise, He would void-for
succeeding generations-the payment of His Son, Jesus Christ.
Your god cannot do something? Then why call him a God?
The nature, character, and attributes of God demand a faithful
witness of His decrees, promise, plan, and purpose, climaxed in
the death, burial, and resurrection of His Son.
You and your fundie mentors need to get your heads out of the sand and do
some real research.
Why is it that insults are the first attempt at actually backing
up anything you say? I find it interesting that those who reject
God and God's Word cannot do so without resorting to hatred and
insults.
I suggest you start by obtaining copies of "Who Wrote
the New Testament, The Making of the Christian Myth," by Burton L. Mack,
I suggest you read the one of the refutations:
http://home.ca.inter.net/~oblio/review1.htm
and
"Misquoting Jesus," by Bart D. Ehrman
One such refutation:
http://www.tektonics.org/books/ehrqurvw.html
You might also want to look into
http://www.niagarafrontierbible.com/catalog/godsword.php
http://www.answersingenesis.org/Home/Area/faq/bible.asp
http://www.juststopandthink.com/news_details.php?newsID=21
You are of course free to believe whatever you want. But you can
prove nothing when it comes to the opinion that we don't know
The onus isn't on me to prove anything. However, you must prove that the
Bible is God's word, but you must first prove that your god actually
exists...and you can't do that. And that AIG site - what a hoot!
Shalom,
Bill
God's Word.
Glory to God in the highest!
Gabriel
.
|
|
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| User: "Gabriel" |
|
| Title: Re: "And God said .. " The Bible's Accuracy and Authority |
26 Dec 2007 03:01:17 PM |
|
|
On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 12:34:03 -0800, "Wild Bill"
<bilsgrdn@qwest.net> wrote:
"Gabriel" <gabriel_baptist@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:tm95n3tf67h5gpvhoquk5kdo0uh1sg8ah0@4ax.com...
[ .. ]
You are of course free to believe whatever you want. But you can
prove nothing when it comes to the opinion that we don't know
The onus isn't on me to prove anything. However, you must prove that the
Bible is God's word, but you must first prove that your god actually
exists...
So the real issue is you don't believe in God. Please realize
that this presupposition of yours just might keep you from seeing
things clearly and objectively where God is concerned.
But you want evidence, so here's evidence you continue to
provide: you don't think He exists, yet
[1 ] you go out of your way to seek out newsgroups that worship
Him, and
[2] you spend your time there arguing about Him.
Your own behavior offers you ample evidence to start questioning
if perhaps you might be wrong; that your conscience is fully
aware of the truth of God's existence. Action speaks louder than
words.
If you cannot even see your own behavior objectively, what chance
have you of seeing any truth where God is concerned?
Thank you for posting.
Gabriel
.
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| User: "Feng" |
|
| Title: Re: "And God said .. " The Bible's Accuracy and Authority |
26 Dec 2007 02:36:14 PM |
|
|
On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 14:14:35 -0500, Gabriel
<gabriel_baptist@hotmail.com> wrote:
No argument is supreme.
God's is, which is the argument used to show us it is clearly His
Word.
It's not from God if it shows no love.
It's not from God if it shows no wisdom.
It's not from God if it shows no truth.
God's argument is indeed supreme, but it's not by force or fear, it's
by wisdom and love.
.
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| User: "Gabriel" |
|
| Title: Re: "And God said .. " The Bible's Accuracy and Authority |
26 Dec 2007 03:10:03 PM |
|
|
On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 15:36:14 -0500, Feng <Feng@earth.com> wrote:
On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 14:14:35 -0500, Gabriel
<gabriel_baptist@hotmail.com> wrote:
No argument is supreme.
God's is, which is the argument used to show us it is clearly His
Word.
It's not from God if it shows no love.
It's not from God if it shows no wisdom.
It's not from God if it shows no truth.
God's argument is indeed supreme, but it's not by force or fear, it's
by wisdom and love.
While this may be true, I don't see the relevance to the
discussion you're responding to, if you'd be so kind as to give
more details.
Gabriel
.
|
|
|
| User: "Feng" |
|
| Title: Re: "And God said .. " The Bible's Accuracy and Authority |
26 Dec 2007 03:31:57 PM |
|
|
On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:10:03 -0500, Gabriel
<gabriel_baptist@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 15:36:14 -0500, Feng <Feng@earth.com> wrote:
On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 14:14:35 -0500, Gabriel
<gabriel_baptist@hotmail.com> wrote:
No argument is supreme.
God's is, which is the argument used to show us it is clearly His
Word.
It's not from God if it shows no love.
It's not from God if it shows no wisdom.
It's not from God if it shows no truth.
God's argument is indeed supreme, but it's not by force or fear, it's
by wisdom and love.
While this may be true, I don't see the relevance to the
discussion you're responding to, if you'd be so kind as to give
more details.
Gabriel
First, I'm glad you agreed with me. I have to thank you for that.
My point is, in order to understand the Bible, the Bible should be
inspected to see what's from God and what's not from God. Just because
it was claimed to be the words of God, doesn't necessarily mean it was
really from God. The Devil appears to people by pretending to be God
also. That's why the Devil is called the great deceiver. If we can not
identify what's really from God and what's not from God, we will also
be deceived just like those ancient people in the Bible. Without the
correct understanding of the Bible, it's meaningless to argue whether
the Bible is accurate or not.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Gabriel" |
|
| Title: Re: "And God said .. " The Bible's Accuracy and Authority |
26 Dec 2007 04:12:24 PM |
|
|
On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:31:57 -0500, Feng <Feng@earth.com> wrote:
On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:10:03 -0500, Gabriel
<gabriel_baptist@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 15:36:14 -0500, Feng <Feng@earth.com> wrote:
On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 14:14:35 -0500, Gabriel
<gabriel_baptist@hotmail.com> wrote:
No argument is supreme.
God's is, which is the argument used to show us it is clearly His
Word.
It's not from God if it shows no love.
It's not from God if it shows no wisdom.
It's not from God if it shows no truth.
God's argument is indeed supreme, but it's not by force or fear, it's
by wisdom and love.
While this may be true, I don't see the relevance to the
discussion you're responding to, if you'd be so kind as to give
more details.
Gabriel
First, I'm glad you agreed with me. I have to thank you for that.
Just realize that many people have different definitions of love,
and certainly none of us can match God's love, and use their own
definition to reject things of God. For example, some don't think
it's loving to be made to accept punishment for spending an
entire lifetime of sinning against God, never having repented,
but having the loving chance from God of an entire lifetime to do
so. So the argument of using 'love' to discern what is and is not
God's Word is by no means a clear one.
My point is, in order to understand the Bible, the Bible should be
inspected to see what's from God and what's not from God.
So it's your belief that some of the Bible is not the Word of
God, correct?
But how, exactly, are you going to lay claim to what you believe
is from God and what is not from God in the Bible, since now if
that's to be believed, it's been reduced to a matter of human
opinion? Now you open the floodgates that every person can just
pick and choose what they think is 'really' part of God's Word,
and what's not.
Just because
it was claimed to be the words of God, doesn't necessarily mean it was
really from God.
And likewise, just because it's claimed to not be the Word of
God, that doesn't necessarily mean it's not .. ?
The Devil appears to people by pretending to be God
also.
Is this part of the evidence you bring to bear on the Bible
that's survived for 3,500 years?
That's why the Devil is called the great deceiver.
Yes, and you have to admit that the great deceiver would _also_
like nothing more than to deceive people into thinking God's Word
is not really His Word .. ?
If we can not
identify what's really from God and what's not from God, we will also
be deceived just like those ancient people in the Bible.
Which is why we look at the bible as a whole, comparing many
verses on topics, and pray to God for understanding. If the ideas
are harmonious across multiple books, and multiple author's,
backed by prayer asking for wisdom on such issues, it seems
that's about as far as we can take it, short of making ourselves
a personal authority on God, which would be dangerous ground.
Without the
correct understanding of the Bible, it's meaningless to argue whether
the Bible is accurate or not.
I don't agree. Who cares if people understand something that's
not God's Word? It's first important to realize it really is
God's Word before we undertake through study and prayer an
attempt to understand it. And it's clear not everyone will
understand God's Word, as it's spiritually discerned.
1 Corinthians 2:9-16 KJVR
9 But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard,
neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God
hath prepared for them that love him.
10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for
the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.
11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the
spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth
no man, but the Spirit of God.
12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but
the Spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that
are freely given to us of God.
13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's
wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing
spiritual things with spiritual.
14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the
Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he
know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
15 But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he
himself is judged of no man.
16 For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may
instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ.
Gabriel
.
|
|
|
| User: "Feng" |
|
| Title: Re: "And God said .. " The Bible's Accuracy and Authority |
26 Dec 2007 06:48:36 PM |
|
|
On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 17:12:24 -0500, Gabriel
<gabriel_baptist@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:31:57 -0500, Feng <Feng@earth.com> wrote:
On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:10:03 -0500, Gabriel
<gabriel_baptist@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 15:36:14 -0500, Feng <Feng@earth.com> wrote:
On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 14:14:35 -0500, Gabriel
<gabriel_baptist@hotmail.com> wrote:
No argument is supreme.
God's is, which is the argument used to show us it is clearly His
Word.
It's not from God if it shows no love.
It's not from God if it shows no wisdom.
It's not from God if it shows no truth.
God's argument is indeed supreme, but it's not by force or fear, it's
by wisdom and love.
While this may be true, I don't see the relevance to the
discussion you're responding to, if you'd be so kind as to give
more details.
Gabriel
First, I'm glad you agreed with me. I have to thank you for that.
Just realize that many people have different definitions of love,
and certainly none of us can match God's love, and use their own
definition to reject things of God. For example, some don't think
it's loving to be made to accept punishment for spending an
entire lifetime of sinning against God, never having repented,
but having the loving chance from God of an entire lifetime to do
so. So the argument of using 'love' to discern what is and is not
God's Word is by no means a clear one.
I understand everybody has their own version of love, but shouldn't
Christians know Christ's love? Shouldn't Christians follow Christ's
love? Shouldn't Christians live their life according to Christ's love?
So what are you trying to tell me in here? That you don't really know
Christ's love and you would not even try to discern what is or is not
God's words according to Christ's love?
My point is, in order to understand the Bible, the Bible should be
inspected to see what's from God and what's not from God.
So it's your belief that some of the Bible is not the Word of
God, correct?
No. I believe the entire Bible IS indeed the Word of God. Within the
Bible, there are many words from many people. Through those words and
through those people we may understand the Word of God.
But how, exactly, are you going to lay claim to what you believe
is from God and what is not from God in the Bible, since now if
that's to be believed, it's been reduced to a matter of human
opinion?
Not necessarily. If you know Christ, you should know what to do so
that it won't be a mere matter of human opinion.
Now you open the floodgates that every person can just
pick and choose what they think is 'really' part of God's Word,
and what's not.
There is no picking and choosing involved. Everything has to be
carefully investigated and properly organized to put them in their
rightful place according to the truth. I don't reject nothing in the
Bible. I need them all in order to show the true meaning of God's Word
which is the truth.
Just because
it was claimed to be the words of God, doesn't necessarily mean it was
really from God.
And likewise, just because it's claimed to not be the Word of
God, that doesn't necessarily mean it's not .. ?
Correct. That is the spirit of truth I like. Nothing should be taken
for granted.
Yes, that's include what I'm saying now.
The Devil appears to people by pretending to be God
also.
Is this part of the evidence you bring to bear on the Bible
that's survived for 3,500 years?
I have no intention to destroy the Bible. I rely on the Bible to
justify my cause. What I said above should be a simple common
knowledge. What's you objection to that?
That's why the Devil is called the great deceiver.
Yes, and you have to admit that the great deceiver would _also_
like nothing more than to deceive people into thinking God's Word
is not really His Word .. ?
Correct, except no one is trying to deny that the Bible is indeed
God's Word. So what is your point to say that?
If we can not
identify what's really from God and what's not from God, we will also
be deceived just like those ancient people in the Bible.
Which is why we look at the bible as a whole, comparing many
verses on topics, and pray to God for understanding. If the ideas
are harmonious across multiple books, and multiple author's,
backed by prayer asking for wisdom on such issues, it seems
that's about as far as we can take it, short of making ourselves
a personal authority on God, which would be dangerous ground.
Obviously, not far enough. As a Christian, apart from comparing
different verses, praying to God, and looking up references, shouldn't
you at least try to inspect the Bible story according to the love of
Christ in your heart?
I'm not asking you to be an authority on God or Bible. I'm asking you
to allow your Lord and Savior to have a say on this issue. Is that too
much to ask?
Without the
correct understanding of the Bible, it's meaningless to argue whether
the Bible is accurate or not.
I don't agree. Who cares if people understand something that's
not God's Word? It's first important to realize it really is
God's Word before we undertake through study and prayer an
attempt to understand it.
Apparently we are not talking on the same page. You are still looking
for recognition, when I'm here is attempting to understand the Word of
God correctly. Would you catch up?
And it's clear not everyone will
understand God's Word, as it's spiritually discerned.
That is indeed clear, but as a Christian, it is a shame not to
understand God's Word, and it would be a sin to misunderstand God's
Word. Right?
1 Corinthians 2:9-16 KJVR
9 But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard,
neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God
hath prepared for them that love him.
10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for
the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.
11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the
spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth
no man, but the Spirit of God.
12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but
the Spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that
are freely given to us of God.
13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's
wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing
spiritual things with spiritual.
14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the
Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he
know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
15 But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he
himself is judged of no man.
16 For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may
instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ.
Gabriel
.
|
|
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| User: "Wild Bill" |
|
| Title: Re: "And God said .. " The Bible's Accuracy and Authority |
26 Dec 2007 08:29:08 PM |
|
|
"Feng" <Feng@earth.com> wrote in message
news:6bq5n3de579rsltqm6g7fedgnt3qa1bi10@4ax.com...
On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 17:12:24 -0500, Gabriel
<gabriel_baptist@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:31:57 -0500, Feng <Feng@earth.com> wrote:
On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:10:03 -0500, Gabriel
<gabriel_baptist@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 15:36:14 -0500, Feng <Feng@earth.com> wrote:
On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 14:14:35 -0500, Gabriel
<gabriel_baptist@hotmail.com> wrote:
No argument is supreme.
God's is, which is the argument used to show us it is clearly His
Word.
It's not from God if it shows no love.
It's not from God if it shows no wisdom.
It's not from God if it shows no truth.
God's argument is indeed supreme, but it's not by force or fear, it's
by wisdom and love.
While this may be true, I don't see the relevance to the
discussion you're responding to, if you'd be so kind as to give
more details.
Gabriel
First, I'm glad you agreed with me. I have to thank you for that.
Just realize that many people have different definitions of love,
and certainly none of us can match God's love, and use their own
definition to reject things of God. For example, some don't think
it's loving to be made to accept punishment for spending an
entire lifetime of sinning against God, never having repented,
but having the loving chance from God of an entire lifetime to do
so. So the argument of using 'love' to discern what is and is not
God's Word is by no means a clear one.
I understand everybody has their own version of love, but shouldn't
Christians know Christ's love? Shouldn't Christians follow Christ's
love? Shouldn't Christians live their life according to Christ's love?
So what are you trying to tell me in here? That you don't really know
Christ's love and you would not even try to discern what is or is not
God's words according to Christ's love?
My point is, in order to understand the Bible, the Bible should be
inspected to see what's from God and what's not from God.
So it's your belief that some of the Bible is not the Word of
God, correct?
No. I believe the entire Bible IS indeed the Word of God. Within the
Bible, there are many words from many people. Through those words and
through those people we may understand the Word of God.
But how, exactly, are you going to lay claim to what you believe
is from God and what is not from God in the Bible, since now if
that's to be believed, it's been reduced to a matter of human
opinion?
Not necessarily. If you know Christ, you should know what to do so
that it won't be a mere matter of human opinion.
Now you open the floodgates that every person can just
pick and choose what they think is 'really' part of God's Word,
and what's not.
There is no picking and choosing involved. Everything has to be
carefully investigated and properly organized to put them in their
rightful place according to the truth. I don't reject nothing in the
Bible. I need them all in order to show the true meaning of God's Word
which is the truth.
Just because
it was claimed to be the words of God, doesn't necessarily mean it was
really from God.
And likewise, just because it's claimed to not be the Word of
God, that doesn't necessarily mean it's not .. ?
Correct. That is the spirit of truth I like. Nothing should be taken
for granted.
Yes, that's include what I'm saying now.
The Devil appears to people by pretending to be God
also.
Is this part of the evidence you bring to bear on the Bible
that's survived for 3,500 years?
I have no intention to destroy the Bible. I rely on the Bible to
justify my cause. What I said above should be a simple common
knowledge. What's you objection to that?
That's why the Devil is called the great deceiver.
Yes, and you have to admit that the great deceiver would _also_
like nothing more than to deceive people into thinking God's Word
is not really His Word .. ?
Correct, except no one is trying to deny that the Bible is indeed
God's Word. So what is your point to say that?
Billions of people world-wide (myself included), deny that the Bible is
God's Word. It is the words of many different men *about* what they conceive
God to be. Handicapped as they were by ignorance and superstition, they did
the best they could to describe the human condition. The Bible is simply a
very human book with many different human viewpoints. And, as you well know,
to be human is to err. There's nothing infallible or inerrant about this
very human construct.
Shalom,
Bill
If we can not
identify what's really from God and what's not from God, we will also
be deceived just like those ancient people in the Bible.
Which is why we look at the bible as a whole, comparing many
verses on topics, and pray to God for understanding. If the ideas
are harmonious across multiple books, and multiple author's,
backed by prayer asking for wisdom on such issues, it seems
that's about as far as we can take it, short of making ourselves
a personal authority on God, which would be dangerous ground.
Obviously, not far enough. As a Christian, apart from comparing
different verses, praying to God, and looking up references, shouldn't
you at least try to inspect the Bible story according to the love of
Christ in your heart?
I'm not asking you to be an authority on God or Bible. I'm asking you
to allow your Lord and Savior to have a say on this issue. Is that too
much to ask?
Without the
correct understanding of the Bible, it's meaningless to argue whether
the Bible is accurate or not.
I don't agree. Who cares if people understand something that's
not God's Word? It's first important to realize it really is
God's Word before we undertake through study and prayer an
attempt to understand it.
Apparently we are not talking on the same page. You are still looking
for recognition, when I'm here is attempting to understand the Word of
God correctly. Would you catch up?
And it's clear not everyone will
understand God's Word, as it's spiritually discerned.
That is indeed clear, but as a Christian, it is a shame not to
understand God's Word, and it would be a sin to misunderstand God's
Word. Right?
1 Corinthians 2:9-16 KJVR
9 But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard,
neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God
hath prepared for them that love him.
10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for
the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.
11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the
spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth
no man, but the Spirit of God.
12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but
the Spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that
are freely given to us of God.
13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's
wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing
spiritual things with spiritual.
14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the
Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he
know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
15 But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he
himself is judged of no man.
16 For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may
instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ.
Gabriel
.
|
|
|
| User: "Feng" |
|
| Title: Re: "And God said .. " The Bible's Accuracy and Authority |
26 Dec 2007 08:46:12 PM |
|
|
On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 18:29:08 -0800, "Wild Bill" <bilsgrdn@qwest.net>
wrote:
Correct, except no one is trying to deny that the Bible is indeed
God's Word. So what is your point to say that?
Billions of people world-wide (myself included), deny that the Bible is
God's Word. It is the words of many different men *about* what they conceive
God to be. Handicapped as they were by ignorance and superstition, they did
the best they could to describe the human condition. The Bible is simply a
very human book with many different human viewpoints. And, as you well know,
to be human is to err. There's nothing infallible or inerrant about this
very human construct.
That may be your opinion, but that is not mine. I have no problem to
recognize the Bible as the Word of God. I only have problem with
people who don't even try to understand the Word of God.
.
|
|
|
|
|
| User: "Gabriel" |
|
| Title: Re: "And God said .. " The Bible's Accuracy and Authority |
27 Dec 2007 10:27:23 AM |
|
|
On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 19:48:36 -0500, Feng <Feng@earth.com> wrote:
[ .. ]
I understand everybody has their own version of love, but shouldn't
Christians know Christ's love? Shouldn't Christians follow Christ's
love? Shouldn't Christians live their life according to Christ's love?
So what are you trying to tell me in here? That you don't really know
Christ's love and you would not even try to discern what is or is not
God's words according to Christ's love?
What I'm saying is you cannot discern what is and is not God's
Word based on "Christ's Love" when people will have their own
opinions on what exactly Christ's love is.
[ .. ]
So it's your belief that some of the Bible is not the Word of
God, correct?
No. I believe the entire Bible IS indeed the Word of God.
That's good to hear. :-)
Within the
Bible, there are many words from many people.
Inspired by God. So it's the Word of God, not the word of mere
people, correct?
2 Timothy 3:16-17 KJVR
16 All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is
profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for
instruction in righteousness:
17 That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished
unto all good works.
[ .. ]
But how, exactly, are you going to lay claim to what you believe
is from God and what is not from God in the Bible, since now if
that's to be believed, it's been reduced to a matter of human
opinion?
Not necessarily. If you know Christ, you should know what to do so
that it won't be a mere matter of human opinion.
But you've already now said you believe the entire Bible is the
Word of God, so there's no confusion: what the Bible says is what
God says.
[ .. ]
I have no intention to destroy the Bible. I rely on the Bible to
justify my cause. What I said above should be a simple common
knowledge. What's you objection to that?
Well then we must have had a communication gap going - Seems we
are both saying the Bible is the inerrant, inspired Word of God.
[ .. ]
Which is why we look at the bible as a whole, comparing many
verses on topics, and pray to God for understanding. If the ideas
are harmonious across multiple books, and multiple author's,
backed by prayer asking for wisdom on such issues, it seems
that's about as far as we can take it, short of making ourselves
a personal authority on God, which would be dangerous ground.
Obviously, not far enough. As a Christian, apart from comparing
different verses, praying to God, and looking up references, shouldn't
you at least try to inspect the Bible story according to the love of
Christ in your heart?
I'm not asking you to be an authority on God or Bible. I'm asking you
to allow your Lord and Savior to have a say on this issue. Is that too
much to ask?
Which is why I said 'pray to God for understanding'.
Well it seems we're on the same page, then. The Bible is the
inspired, inerrant Word of God. In your other post I thought you
weren't saying that, but it's clear you are, so we agree then!
Praise the Lord!
Gabriel
.
|
|
|
| User: "Feng" |
|
| Title: Re: "And God said .. " The Bible's Accuracy and Authority |
27 Dec 2007 12:11:11 PM |
|
|
On Thu, 27 Dec 2007 11:27:23 -0500, Gabriel
<gabriel_baptist@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 19:48:36 -0500, Feng <Feng@earth.com> wrote:
[ .. ]
I understand everybody has their own version of love, but shouldn't
Christians know Christ's love? Shouldn't Christians follow Christ's
love? Shouldn't Christians live their life according to Christ's love?
So what are you trying to tell me in here? That you don't really know
Christ's love and you would not even try to discern what is or is not
God's words according to Christ's love?
What I'm saying is you cannot discern what is and is not God's
Word based on "Christ's Love" when people will have their own
opinions on what exactly Christ's love is.
Christ's love is in every Christian heart, is it not?
[ .. ]
So it's your belief that some of the Bible is not the Word of
God, correct?
No. I believe the entire Bible IS indeed the Word of God.
That's good to hear. :-)
Thanks.
Within the
Bible, there are many words from many people.
Inspired by God. So it's the Word of God, not the word of mere
people, correct?
Inspired by God to show God's will and God's plan, yes. Inspired by
God to represent God's will and God's plan, no. We are vessels of God,
but we do not speak for God. What we say are entirely our own even
though God uses what we say and do to fulfill his will. For the people
in the Bible, the same applies.
2 Timothy 3:16-17 KJVR
16 All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is
profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for
instruction in righteousness:
17 That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished
unto all good works.
[ .. ]
But how, exactly, are you going to lay claim to what you believe
is from God and what is not from God in the Bible, since now if
that's to be believed, it's been reduced to a matter of human
opinion?
Not necessarily. If you know Christ, you should know what to do so
that it won't be a mere matter of human opinion.
But you've already now said you believe the entire Bible is the
Word of God, so there's no confusion: what the Bible says is what
God says.
The problem is, the Bible does not say a damn thing. It's always what
the people says in the name of God. They are either consciously or
unconsciously trying to represent God. Unfortunately, only Jesus and
there is no one else is qualified to represent God. So what the people
in the Bible says may or may not be what God says. It has to be
investigated based on our knowledge of God's love which is Jesus
Christ.
[ .. ]
I have no intention to destroy the Bible. I rely on the Bible to
justify my cause. What I said above should be a simple common
knowledge. What's you objection to that?
Well then we must have had a communication gap going - Seems we
are both saying the Bible is the inerrant, inspired Word of God.
Ok. Hope we clear out that misunderstanding. I have no intention to
deny the Bible. I need the Bible, every word of it.
[ .. ]
Which is why we look at the bible as a whole, comparing many
verses on topics, and pray to God for understanding. If the ideas
are harmonious across multiple books, and multiple author's,
backed by prayer asking for wisdom on such issues, it seems
that's about as far as we can take it, short of making ourselves
a personal authority on God, which would be dangerous ground.
Obviously, not far enough. As a Christian, apart from comparing
different verses, praying to God, and looking up references, shouldn't
you at least try to inspect the Bible story according to the love of
Christ in your heart?
I'm not asking you to be an authority on God or Bible. I'm asking you
to allow your Lord and Savior to have a say on this issue. Is that too
much to ask?
Which is why I said 'pray to God for understanding'.
The Lord lives in your heart. When you pray, do you pray to him?
Well it seems we're on the same page, then. The Bible is the
inspired, inerrant Word of God. In your other post I thought you
weren't saying that, but it's clear you are, so we agree then!
I certainly hope so, but I hope you also realize what people says in
the Bible may or may not be the Word of God. They only speak for
themselves. They do not represent God despite they believe they do.
They do not represent God despite they are used by God to fulfill
God's plan.
Agreed?
Praise the Lord!
Gabriel
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