| Topic: |
Religions > Bible |
| User: |
"Pastor Dave" |
| Date: |
27 Sep 2007 06:15:26 AM |
| Object: |
Dispensationalism’s Interpretive Inconsistencies |
DISPENSATIONALISM'S INTERPRETIVE INCONSISTENCIES
Dispensational author Paul Benware accuses Preterists
of not interpreting prophetic passages in a literal way.
As an example, he points to Matthew 24:29:
“But immediately after the tribulation of those days
THE SUN WILL BE DARKENED, AND THE MOON
WILL NOT GIVE ITS LIGHT, AND THE STARS WILL
FALL from the sky, and the powers of the heavens
will be shaken”.
Since Jesus tells His questioners that this event will take
place before “this generation passes away” (Matt. 24:34),
and “this generation” refers to the generation to whom
Jesus was speaking, the Sun, Moon, and stars language
must refer to events of the first century.
Dispensationalists say this is impossible given a literal
hermeneutic. When similar passages are found in
the Old Testament, Dispensationalists have no trouble
dropping their so-called literal hermeneutic.
Charles L. Feinberg, writing in the Dispensational Liberty
Bible Commentary, writes: “The Sun, Moon, and stars
indicate a complete system of government and remind
the reader of Genesis 37:9”. Notice that Feinberg argues
that Sun, Moon, and stars relate to “a complete system
of government” and not literal stellar phenomena.
He also references Genesis 37:9 where Sun, Moon,
and stars are used as symbols for Israel. Other
Dispensational authors follow a similar pattern
of interpretation.
John A. Martin, writing in the Dispensational-oriented
Bible Knowledge Commentary, argues that “the statements
in [Isaiah] 13:10 about the heavenly bodies (stars … Sun
… Moon) no longer functioning may figuratively describe
the total turnaround of the political structure of the Near
East. The same would be true of the heavens trembling
and the earth shaking (v. 13), figures of speech suggesting
all-encompassing destruction” . So why couldn’t Jesus be
using the language from Isaiah 13:10 in Matthew 24:29
to “figuratively describe the total turnaround of the
political structure of” Israel that took place with the
destruction of Jerusalem in A.D. 70?
Consider the comments of Dispensational author John
F. Walvoord on Revelation 12:1 and how he draws from
the Old Testament to explain the meaning of the cosmic
language used: “The description of the woman as clothed
with the Sun and the Moon is an allusion to Genesis 37:9–11,
where these heavenly bodies represent Jacob and Rachel,
thereby identifying the woman with the fulfillment of
the Abrahamic covenant. In the same context, the stars
represent the patriarchs, the sons of Jacob. The symbolism
may extend beyond this to represent in some sense the
glory of Israel and her ultimate triumph over her enemies.”.
If Sun, Moon, and stars represent Babylon (Isa. 13:10)
and Israel (Gen. 37:9) in the Old Testament and the
New Testament (Rev. 12:1), then why can’t Sun, Moon,
and stars represent Israel in Matthew 24:29?
Benware never discusses these issues and seems oblivious
to what his fellow Dispensationalists say about the nature
of cosmic language and how the prophets used it to describe
past local judgments.
R.T. France’s comments on the use of cosmic language
from his commentary on Mark 13:24–25, which parallel
Matthew 24:29, show how Jesus borrows language from
the prophets and uses them to make His judicial case
against Israel:
The passages cited in [Mark 13] vv. 24b–25 use the language
of cosmic disintegration to denote, as often in prophecy,
climactic (not climatic!) changes to the existing world
order. The lights are going out in the centres of power,
and the way is being prepared for a new world order. . . .
The language of v. 24b is paralleled at several points in
the prophetic literature (Ezk. 32:7; Jo. 2:10, 31; 3:15;
Amos 8:9) but is verbally most closely related to LXX5
Is. 13:10, part of the oracle against Babylon. . . . In most
of these passages the immediate reference is to the imminent
downfall of specific nations (Egypt, Babylon, Edom, Israel,
and Judah). . . . In the original prophetic context,
therefore, such ‘cosmic’ language conveys a powerful
symbolism of political changes with world history, and
is not naturally to be understood of a literal collapse of
the universe at the end of the world. . . . The natural
sense of such language, used in a Jewish context, is
surely clear. Mk. 13:24b–27 is not about the collapse
of the universe, but about drastic events on the world
scene, interpreted in the light of the divine judgment
and purpose. What is startling about the use of such
language by Jesus in this context is not that he uses
the same language as the prophetic, but that he uses
it with regard to the fate of Jerusalem and its temple.
A good way to test interpretive methodologies is to
compare Psalm 18 with the actual historical events
when “the LORD delivered [David] from the hand
of all his enemies and from the hand of Saul”.
The language of the Psalm is as apocalyptic to what we
find in Isaiah 13:10, Matthew 24:29, and Mark 13:24–25,
and yet Psalm 18 describes God’s deliverance of one man
over his flesh and blood enemies with depictions of a
“volcanic eruption that shook the mountains and raised
the sea bed”.
<Begin insert quote of Psalm 18 and comments>
Quoted in part, the Psalm reads about this deliverance
of one man:
Psalm 18:1-15
1) I will love You, O LORD, my strength.
2) The LORD is my rock and my fortress and my deliverer;
My God, my strength, in whom I will trust;
My shield and the horn of my salvation, my stronghold.
3) I will call upon the LORD, who is worthy to be praised;
So shall I be saved from my enemies.
6) In my distress I called upon the LORD,
And cried out to my God;
He heard my voice from His temple,
And my cry came before Him, even to His ears.
7) THEN THE EARTH SHOOK AND TREMBLED;
THE FOUNDATIONS OF THE HILLS ALSO QUAKED
AND WERE SHAKEN, because He was angry.
8) Smoke went up from His nostrils,
And devouring fire from His mouth;
Coals were kindled by it.
9) HE BOWED THE HEAVENS ALSO AND CAME DOWN
WITH DARKNESS UNDER HIS FEET.
10) *_AND HE RODE UPON A CHERUB AND FLEW;_*
He flew upon the wings of the wind.
11) He made darkness His secret place;
His canopy around Him was dark waters
And thick clouds of the skies.
12) From the brightness before Him,
His thick clouds passed WITH HAILSTONES
AND COALS OF FIRE.
13 The LORD thundered from heaven,
And the Most High uttered His voice,
Hailstones and coals of fire.
14) HE SENT OUT HIS ARROWS and scattered the foe,
LIGHTNINGS IN ABUNDANCE, and He vanquished
them.
15) Then the channels of the sea were seen,
The foundations of the world were uncovered
At Your rebuke, O LORD,
At the blast of the breath of Your nostrils.
Yes folks, this is about the deliverance of ONE MAN,
David! So how can anyone say that this type of
language is physically literal?! They claim that it is
when Jesus used it, but on what basis do they do that?
Certainly not by letting Scripture interpret Scripture,
since both the Old and New Testaments show that
this type of language is symbolic! So they pick one
place (and the parallels in Mark and Luke) in which
they WANT it to be physically literal and then have
the gall to call someone a heretic, because they
don't buy into the Dispy (Futurist) concept of;
"It's physically literal in this one spot, because we
said so and you're a heretic if you don't agree!".
Yea, that's some real scholarly work there! (:
<End insert of Psalm 18 and comments>
A reading of David’s encounter with Saul in the historical
narratives of 1 Samuel will show that no series of events
line up with the narrative of Psalm 18. Following the
standards of Dispensational interpretive principles, the
descriptions in Psalm 18 are yet to be fulfilled in some
future prophetic scenario when David and Saul are
raised from the dead to battle again.
Benware and other Dispensationalists insist on a literal
interpretation of Revelation. If the claim is made that
the “stars” are actually meteorites, then there is a problem
with Revelation 12:4 where a “great red dragon” uses his
“tail” to sweep a “third of the stars of heaven” to throw
“them to the earth”. Such a barrage would destroy
the earth, making it uninhabitable for man and beast
for millennia. And yet, we are to believe that the armies
of the entire world are going to pick a fight with Israel
(Rev. 16:13–16) after a third of the earth’s population
has been wiped out. Robert L. Thomas, who consistently
criticizes those who interpret much of Revelation as
symbolic, interprets the stars as “angels who fell with
Satan in history past”. He might be correct, but this
seems to violate his interpretive premise and that
of Dispensationalists in general that “a symbolic
interpretation assumes the absence of strict realism
in a vision”. So why not a real red dragon and
literal stars in this context?
As stated, Dispensationalists are inconsistent in their
interpretive method and their scenarios are pure fantasy
and not proper Scriptural interpretive methodology!
--
If you wouldn't say it in person, why say it online?
To email me, just remove the underscores.
.
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| User: "H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." |
|
| Title: Re: Dispensationalism's Interpretive Inconsistencies |
27 Sep 2007 10:43:26 PM |
|
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"Pastor Dave" <ananias917_@_gmail.com> wrote in message
news:a22nf3hhgjq7jcr6lslg6dg206jdlm3lgk@4ax.com...
DISPENSATIONALISM'S INTERPRETIVE INCONSISTENCIES
As opposed to Preterist interpretive inconsistencies?
Ike
.
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| User: "®andy" |
|
| Title: Re: Dispensationalism's Interpretive Inconsistencies |
03 Oct 2007 10:44:02 AM |
|
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On Fri, 28 Sep 2007 03:43:26 GMT,
in article <yL_Ki.6727$TH2.4978@trndny06>,
"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <xeickleberrybooks@verizon.net>
wrote:
"Pastor Dave" <ananias917_@_gmail.com> wrote in message
news:a22nf3hhgjq7jcr6lslg6dg206jdlm3lgk@4ax.com...
DISPENSATIONALISM'S INTERPRETIVE INCONSISTENCIES
As opposed to Preterist interpretive inconsistencies?
Ike
I haven't seen anyone in here who can do anything more than
throw names at dispensationalism. It's plainly taught in the
Bible:
First, the word dispensation occurs in the Bible, and means
"house rule", or "stewardship". Dispensationalism, is simply
a study of the different stewardships God has committed to men
in different ages.
In Genesis, God told Adam and Eve to multiply, fill the earth,
keep the garden, and avoid eating fruit from the tree of the
knowledge of good and evil. That WAS a stewardship that God
committed to man.
Man failed. This brought the judgment of God in banishing
them from the garden, a curse on the soil, labor by the sweat
of man's brow, and great pain in childbirth. That WAS a
change in God's dispensations, or stewardship for men.
God's redeeming grace, through Christ, however, is typified in
the animal skin coverings, and in the promise the seed of the
woman would crush the head of the serpent.
It is an irrefutable fact the Bible teaches a series of
dispensations, in which God gives man a stewardship, and man
fails, demonstrating in case after case, he cannot meet God's
requirements. Then God brings both judgment, and redeeming
grace. The study of these stewardships is dispensationalism,
and there's nothing you or anyone else can do about it, but
call it names.
Meanwhile, preterism claims words like "soon", "quickly", and
"generation", must ONLY be interpreted in the strictest,
literal sense, according to the specific literal definition
they wish, and MUST mean ONLY within the lifetime of the
people who heard Christ speak. Then, they are forced to
spiritualize almost every single other thing the Bible says
about prophecy, to the point it becomes a perfect
contradiction to what the Bible teaches, because it is
glaringly obvious the prophecies from Revelation 4-19 have not
had a literal fulfillment yet.
But that isn't enough. Then, after they practice the most
blatant and obvious inconsistencies in interpretation, they
have to try and make a vicarious atonement out of everyone
else, by constantly and boldly blaming them for their faults.
©2007 pulpitfire.net, pulpitfire.org, pulpitfire.com
--
We demolish arguments and every pretension that sets itself
up against the knowledge of God, and we take captive every
thought to make it obedient to Christ. †2 Corinthians 10:5
Christ died for our sins, and God raised Him from the dead.
Rely on this work alone to escape hell and receive eternal
life (Jn. 3:16; 1 Cor. 15:1-3; Eph. 2:8-10; 2 Thess. 1:8-9).
.
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| User: "H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." |
|
| Title: Re: Dispensationalism's Interpretive Inconsistencies |
03 Oct 2007 11:03:53 AM |
|
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"®andy" <pulpitfire@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:s8d7g3tbdnt9ml0dj87k1vnkig9hpg89rb@4ax.com...
On Fri, 28 Sep 2007 03:43:26 GMT,
in article <yL_Ki.6727$TH2.4978@trndny06>,
"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <xeickleberrybooks@verizon.net>
wrote:
"Pastor Dave" <ananias917_@_gmail.com> wrote in message
news:a22nf3hhgjq7jcr6lslg6dg206jdlm3lgk@4ax.com...
DISPENSATIONALISM'S INTERPRETIVE INCONSISTENCIES
As opposed to Preterist interpretive inconsistencies?
Ike
I haven't seen anyone in here who can do anything more than
throw names at dispensationalism. It's plainly taught in the
Bible:
1) I "throw" the facts at Dispensationalism.
2) It's NOT "plainly taught in the Bible." The Bible is evolutionary, just
like Isaiah said.
First, the word dispensation occurs in the Bible, and means
"house rule", or "stewardship".
No, it doesn't.
The word means "to pour out," i.e. dispense.
What the dispensationalists wrote into their dictionaries and lexicons is of
no account.
Dispensationalism, is simply
a study of the different stewardships God has committed to men
in different ages.
There are not "different stewardships" in the Bible, as if God were changing
His plan all the time. What IS in the Bible is God revealing His plan
step-by-step, line upon line, precept upon precept, here a little, and there
a little.
Hence, God "dispenses" information as He sees fit. But in the hands of the
Dispensationalists, these become "different" plans instead of one unified
plan.
In Genesis, God told Adam and Eve to multiply, fill the earth,
keep the garden, and avoid eating fruit from the tree of the
knowledge of good and evil. That WAS a stewardship that God
committed to man.
And that revelation is still in effect, as no one is to eat of the tree of
confusion.
Man failed.
But God didn't. Through Adams failure, God's plan was set in motion.
This brought the judgment of God in banishing
them from the garden, a curse on the soil, labor by the sweat
of man's brow, and great pain in childbirth. That WAS a
change in God's dispensations, or stewardship for men.
No it wasn't. It was the first step towards an ultimate end. In order to
create an independent character that was not a clone of Himself, God had to
introduce will into man, and let man make his mistakes.
God's redeeming grace, through Christ, however, is typified in
the animal skin coverings, and in the promise the seed of the
woman would crush the head of the serpent.
Everything about Christ is in the symbolisms of the Old Testament, going all
the way back to Genesis. Christ was no "change" in plans, and no "accident."
He was the plan all along.
It is an irrefutable fact the Bible teaches a series of
dispensations, in which God gives man a stewardship, and man
fails, demonstrating in case after case, he cannot meet God's
requirements.
It is a refutable fact. The "dispensations" are part of one long line of
God's ordained plan, not separate plans.
Then God brings both judgment, and redeeming
grace. The study of these stewardships is dispensationalism,
and there's nothing you or anyone else can do about it, but
call it names.
No, I can call it what it is--not true.
Meanwhile, preterism claims words like "soon", "quickly", and
"generation", must ONLY be interpreted in the strictest,
literal sense, according to the specific literal definition
they wish, and MUST mean ONLY within the lifetime of the
people who heard Christ speak. Then, they are forced to
spiritualize almost every single other thing the Bible says
about prophecy, to the point it becomes a perfect
contradiction to what the Bible teaches, because it is
glaringly obvious the prophecies from Revelation 4-19 have not
had a literal fulfillment yet.
Both Dispensationalism AND Preterism (and historicism, and idealism, etc.,
etc.) are wrong, because each focus on one aspect of prophetic
interpretation without seeing the big picture.
But that isn't enough. Then, after they practice the most
blatant and obvious inconsistencies in interpretation, they
have to try and make a vicarious atonement out of everyone
else, by constantly and boldly blaming them for their faults.
Just like the Dispensationalists.
Pot, Kettle.
Kettle, Pot.
Now come out swinging.
Ike
.
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| User: "Fred A Stover" |
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| Title: Re: Dispensationalism's Interpretive Inconsistencies |
03 Oct 2007 05:49:27 PM |
|
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"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <xeickleberrybooks@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:J3PMi.10664$1d2.10121@trndny05...
"®andy" <pulpitfire@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:s8d7g3tbdnt9ml0dj87k1vnkig9hpg89rb@4ax.com...
On Fri, 28 Sep 2007 03:43:26 GMT,
in article <yL_Ki.6727$TH2.4978@trndny06>,
"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <xeickleberrybooks@verizon.net>
wrote:
"Pastor Dave" <ananias917_@_gmail.com> wrote in message
news:a22nf3hhgjq7jcr6lslg6dg206jdlm3lgk@4ax.com...
DISPENSATIONALISM'S INTERPRETIVE INCONSISTENCIES
As opposed to Preterist interpretive inconsistencies?
Ike
I haven't seen anyone in here who can do anything more than
throw names at dispensationalism. It's plainly taught in the
Bible:
1) I "throw" the facts at Dispensationalism.
You have yet to demonstrate you have any facts or that you even know what a
fact is.
2) It's NOT "plainly taught in the Bible." The Bible is evolutionary, just
like Isaiah said.
The Bible is a record of the dispensations.
Why don't you cite what you misread in Isaiah and show everyone just how
crazy you are.
First, the word dispensation occurs in the Bible, and means
"house rule", or "stewardship".
No, it doesn't.
1 Cor. 9:17
For if I do this thing willingly, I have a reward: but if against my
will, a dispensation of the gospel is committed unto me.
Ephes. 1:10
That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather
together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which
are on earth; even in him:
Ephes. 3:2
If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given
me to youward:
Ephes. 3:9
And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which
from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things
by Jesus Christ:
Col. 1:25
Whereof I am made a minister, according to the dispensation of God which
is given to me for you, to fulfil the word of God;
The word means "to pour out," i.e. dispense.
What the dispensationalists wrote into their dictionaries and lexicons is
of no account.
Dispensationalism, is simply
a study of the different stewardships God has committed to men
in different ages.
There are not "different stewardships" in the Bible, as if God were
changing His plan all the time. What IS in the Bible is God revealing His
plan step-by-step, line upon line, precept upon precept, here a little,
and there a little.
Christ's stewardship: "I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house
of Israel" (Matt 15:24).
The Apostles stewardship: "Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel
to every creature" (Mark 16:15).
Hence, God "dispenses" information as He sees fit.
Enough! Get out of my face, Satan!
His,
The Three Dispensations
One of the points the Lord was making on the road to Emmaus as recorded in
the book of Hebrews is that salvation through faith was nothing new, for
salvation was through faith before the law was given: "By faith Noah, being
warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to
the saving of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became
heir of the righteousness which is by faith" (Heb. 11:7). However, under the
law salvation was through faith and doing the law, as Paul later wrote: "For
I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do
the whole law" (Gal. 5:3), Just as Noah and others before the law was given
were under a different dispensation than the circumcision, so are believers
in Christ under a different dispensation..
There are three dispensations in scripture as man is redeemed from the fall
of Adam. When Adam fell, he was no longer a servant of the Lord's house. He
had become a servant of Satan's house, the house of which all the
descendents of Adam are born: "he that believes not is condemned already"
(John 3:18). This is the condition resulting from Adam's original sin. As
servants of another, men were not called by the Lord. However, "the heavens
declare the glory of God; and the firmament shows his handywork" (Ps. 19:1),
and the Lord did find the runaway servants who sought Him: "then began men
to call upon the name of the Lord" (Gen. 4:26). Salvation was by faith, as
we are shown in Hebrews, but not free from the condemnation of sin,
"Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses (even over them that had not
sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression) who is the figure of
him that was to come" (Rom 5:14), and under this first dispensation
condemnation was immediate with death, the condemned under the first
dispensation are the people of old time in this verse: "When I shall bring
thee down with them that descend into the pit, with the people of old time,
and shall set thee in the low parts of the earth, in places desolate of old,
with them that go down to the pit, that thou be not inhabited; and I shall
set glory in the land of the living" (Ezek. 26:20). Satan made his claim for
the body of Moses (Jude 1:9) because Moses had killed the Egyptian (Ex.
2:11-12) under the first dispensation. Since some of Satan's servants were
slipping into salvation, a new agreement was sought to stop the gap. The
Lord's part in the agreement was deferment of condemnation until the
judgment, negating Satan's claim for the body of Moses, who died under this
dispensation, and bringing Jacob and his descendents to whom the law was
given into the Lord's house. The other guy's part in the agreement was the
adding of the curse of the law to salvation: "For as many as are of the
works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one
that continues not in all things which are written in the book of the law to
do them" (Gal. 3:10, 1Tim 4:1-3):"When you come to appear before me, who has
required this at your hand, to tread my courts?" (Is. 1:12,1 Tim. 4:1-4)
Salvation now came not merely through faith but also through doing the law.
Wayfaring Jews were people of His house and could be sought out and called
by Him: "Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the
Samaritans enter not. But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of
Israel" (Matt 10:5-6). When the price for all sin was paid on the cross, the
Lord was free to seek out all: "Go into all the world, and preach the gospel
to every creature" (Mark 16:15), and salvation of all in Him was through
faith, free from condemnation: "There is therefore now no condemnation to
them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the
Spirit" (Rom 8:1). All, not in Christ, remain under the condemnation of the
law, for "Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise
pass from the law, till all be fulfilled" (Matt 5:18).
The Jews and those who have come into Christ are servants in the Lord's
house; so, there are two groups of elect, the gospel elect (Col. 3:12) and
the enemy-of-the-gospel elect (Rom 11:28). Only the gospel-elect are free
from the condemnation of the law. One is not appointed to wrath (1 Thess
5:9), but the other is appointed to wrath (Ps 95:11)
.
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| User: "H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." |
|
| Title: Re: Dispensationalism's Interpretive Inconsistencies |
04 Oct 2007 01:23:04 AM |
|
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"Fred A Stover" <fredstover7@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:X%UMi.898$lD6.791@newssvr27.news.prodigy.net...
"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <xeickleberrybooks@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:J3PMi.10664$1d2.10121@trndny05...
"®andy" <pulpitfire@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:s8d7g3tbdnt9ml0dj87k1vnkig9hpg89rb@4ax.com...
On Fri, 28 Sep 2007 03:43:26 GMT,
in article <yL_Ki.6727$TH2.4978@trndny06>,
"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <xeickleberrybooks@verizon.net>
wrote:
"Pastor Dave" <ananias917_@_gmail.com> wrote in message
news:a22nf3hhgjq7jcr6lslg6dg206jdlm3lgk@4ax.com...
DISPENSATIONALISM'S INTERPRETIVE INCONSISTENCIES
As opposed to Preterist interpretive inconsistencies?
Ike
I haven't seen anyone in here who can do anything more than
throw names at dispensationalism. It's plainly taught in the
Bible:
1) I "throw" the facts at Dispensationalism.
You have yet to demonstrate you have any facts or that you even know what
a fact is.
LOL
I know this fact:
Ro 10:12a ¶ For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek...
And this fact:
Ro 11:32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have
mercy upon ALL.
And this fact:
1Co 7:19 Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the
keeping of the commandments of God.
And this fact:
Ga 5:6 For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor
uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love.
And this fact:
Ro 11:26-29
And so ALL Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out
of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: For this
is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away THEIR sins.
As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as
touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers’ sakes. For the
gifts and calling of God are without repentance.
And all these facts taken together outweigh your one silly doctrine created
by taking one verse out of the larger context of what Paul was actually
saying.
2) It's NOT "plainly taught in the Bible." The Bible is evolutionary,
just like Isaiah said.
The Bible is a record of the dispensations.
And God "dispenses" His knowledge from the very beginning, and in a straight
line, through many prophets, and at no time did God ever change His plan.
Each revelation was another step towards God's desired end.
Why don't you cite what you misread in Isaiah and show everyone just how
crazy you are.
LOL
Haven't misread a thing.
First, the word dispensation occurs in the Bible, and means
"house rule", or "stewardship".
No, it doesn't.
1 Cor. 9:17
For if I do this thing willingly, I have a reward: but if against my
will, a dispensation of the gospel is committed unto me.
Paul was saying that He owes God, and if he didn't do what he was supposed
to do voluntarily, God would call in his marker on what He had "dispensed"
to Paul, i.e. salvation by grace.
Ephes. 1:10
That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather
together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which
are on earth; even in him:
It just means that when the full measure of time has passed God will gather
all things in Christ.
Ephes. 3:2
If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given
me to youward:
Again, God "dispensed" grace to Paul. That has nothing to do with "ages" or
"destinies" as you people treat it.
God has been "dispensing" information just like He said, i.e. here a little
and there a little. And nothing God ever dispensed eliminated or replaced
anything God dispensed before hand.
That's your cults little lie.
Ephes. 3:9
And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which
from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all
things by Jesus Christ:
Which has nothing to do with "dispensations."
Every little thing God said from Genesis to Malachi was a gradual revealing
of Christ Himself. And it didn't stop when Christ came--God is STILL
dispensing more and more information on the subject.
Too bad your so locked up in your little cult teachings that you can't
perceive that.
Col. 1:25
Whereof I am made a minister, according to the dispensation of God
which is given to me for you, to fulfil the word of God;
Right. God dispensed power to Paul to pass on to the believers.
The word means "to pour out," i.e. dispense.
What the dispensationalists wrote into their dictionaries and lexicons is
of no account.
Dispensationalism, is simply
a study of the different stewardships God has committed to men
in different ages.
There are not "different stewardships" in the Bible, as if God were
changing His plan all the time. What IS in the Bible is God revealing His
plan step-by-step, line upon line, precept upon precept, here a little,
and there a little.
Christ's stewardship: "I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house
of Israel" (Matt 15:24).
That has nothing to do with "dispensations," except God was getting ready to
dispense some MORE information built on the foundation of the previously
given facts.
The Apostles stewardship: "Go ye into all the world, and preach the
gospel to every creature" (Mark 16:15).
Which is just another step in God's grand scheme.
Nothing in the commandment REPLACES what God had done before--it FULFILLED
it.
Hence, God "dispenses" information as He sees fit.
Enough! Get out of my face, Satan!
Still can't deal with the fact, eh?
There are not "three dispensations," but one long line of God "dispensing"
information, power, and authority, starting in Genesis and ending in
Revelation.
And this plan does NOT involved different fates for Israel and Christians,
but the combining of their fates into one Whole Israel, arrived at by
grafting branches from Christianity INTO Israel.
Thus, Paul says "boast not against the branches." Unfortunately, that's
PRECISELY what you do, missing the meaning of everything Paul said on the
subject.
Ike
.
|
|
|
| User: "Fred A Stover" |
|
| Title: Re: Dispensationalism's Interpretive Inconsistencies |
04 Oct 2007 04:09:09 AM |
|
|
"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <xeickleberrybooks@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:cF%Mi.9494$Jk2.1710@trndny03...
"Fred A Stover" <fredstover7@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:X%UMi.898$lD6.791@newssvr27.news.prodigy.net...
"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <xeickleberrybooks@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:J3PMi.10664$1d2.10121@trndny05...
"®andy" <pulpitfire@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:s8d7g3tbdnt9ml0dj87k1vnkig9hpg89rb@4ax.com...
On Fri, 28 Sep 2007 03:43:26 GMT,
in article <yL_Ki.6727$TH2.4978@trndny06>,
"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <xeickleberrybooks@verizon.net>
wrote:
"Pastor Dave" <ananias917_@_gmail.com> wrote in message
news:a22nf3hhgjq7jcr6lslg6dg206jdlm3lgk@4ax.com...
DISPENSATIONALISM'S INTERPRETIVE INCONSISTENCIES
As opposed to Preterist interpretive inconsistencies?
Ike
I haven't seen anyone in here who can do anything more than
throw names at dispensationalism. It's plainly taught in the
Bible:
1) I "throw" the facts at Dispensationalism.
You have yet to demonstrate you have any facts or that you even know what
a fact is.
LOL
I know this fact:
Ro 10:12a ¶ For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek...
Which is true in the church dispensation.
And which was true before Abraham, but not true under the law.
And this fact:
Ro 11:32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have
mercy upon ALL.
Which is true of the blinded part of Israel. Who through the mercy of the
church dispenstion are saved vs 31
Romans 11:25-33
For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery,
lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is
happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in. [26] And
so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion
the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: [27] For this is
my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins. [28] As concerning
the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election,
they are beloved for the fathers' sakes. [29] For the gifts and calling of
God are without repentance. [30] For as ye in times past have not believed
God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief: [31] Even so have
these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain
mercy. [32] For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have
mercy upon all.
!
1Co 7:19 Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the
keeping of the commandments of God.
And this fact:
Ga 5:6 For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor
uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love.
And this fact:
But outside the church, it is the circumcision in the bosom of Abraham.
Ro 11:26-29
And so ALL Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come
out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: For
this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away THEIR sins.
As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as
touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers’ sakes. For the
gifts and calling of God are without repentance.
And all these facts taken together outweigh your one silly doctrine
created by taking one verse out of the larger context of what Paul was
actually saying.
None of your facts remove one word of scripture. As noted going through your
list, some of your facts are conditional and don't apply to all
dispensations.
2) It's NOT "plainly taught in the Bible." The Bible is evolutionary,
just like Isaiah said.
The Bible is a record of the dispensations.
And God "dispenses" His knowledge from the very beginning, and in a
straight line, through many prophets, and at no time did God ever change
His plan. Each revelation was another step towards God's desired end.
????????? You're drifting into outer space again scatterbrain. The subject
is the Bible .
Why don't you cite what you misread in Isaiah and show everyone just how
crazy you are.
LOL
Haven't misread a thing.
First, the word dispensation occurs in the Bible, and means
"house rule", or "stewardship".
No, it doesn't.
1 Cor. 9:17
For if I do this thing willingly, I have a reward: but if against my
will, a dispensation of the gospel is committed unto me.
Paul was saying that He owes God, and if he didn't do what he was supposed
to do voluntarily, God would call in his marker on what He had "dispensed"
to Paul, i.e. salvation by grace.
Yes it does.
Ephes. 1:10
That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather
together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which
are on earth; even in him:
Yes it does.
It just means that when the full measure of time has passed God will
gather all things in Christ.
Ephes. 3:2
If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is
given me to youward:
Yes it does.
Again, God "dispensed" grace to Paul. That has nothing to do with "ages"
or "destinies" as you people treat it.
God has been "dispensing" information just like He said, i.e. here a
little and there a little. And nothing God ever dispensed eliminated or
replaced anything God dispensed before hand.
That's your cults little lie.
ROTFL
Isaiah 28:13
But the word of the Lord was unto them precept upon precept, precept
upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a
little; that they might go, and fall backward, and be broken, and snared,
and taken.
Ephes. 3:9
And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which
from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all
things by Jesus Christ:
Which has nothing to do with "dispensations."
ROTFL!!! Except the mystery of the one was hidden from the others
His,
The Three Dispensations
One of the points the Lord was making on the road to Emmaus as recorded in
the book of Hebrews is that salvation through faith was nothing new, for
salvation was through faith before the law was given: "By faith Noah, being
warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to
the saving of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became
heir of the righteousness which is by faith" (Heb. 11:7). However, under the
law salvation was through faith and doing the law, as Paul later wrote: "For
I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do
the whole law" (Gal. 5:3), Just as Noah and others before the law was given
were under a different dispensation than the circumcision, so are believers
in Christ under a different dispensation..
There are three dispensations in scripture as man is redeemed from the fall
of Adam. When Adam fell, he was no longer a servant of the Lord's house. He
had become a servant of Satan's house, the house of which all the
descendents of Adam are born: "he that believes not is condemned already"
(John 3:18). This is the condition resulting from Adam's original sin. As
servants of another, men were not called by the Lord. However, "the heavens
declare the glory of God; and the firmament shows his handywork" (Ps. 19:1),
and the Lord did find the runaway servants who sought Him: "then began men
to call upon the name of the Lord" (Gen. 4:26). Salvation was by faith, as
we are shown in Hebrews, but not free from the condemnation of sin,
"Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses (even over them that had not
sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression) who is the figure of
him that was to come" (Rom 5:14), and under this first dispensation
condemnation was immediate with death, the condemned under the first
dispensation are the people of old time in this verse: "When I shall bring
thee down with them that descend into the pit, with the people of old time,
and shall set thee in the low parts of the earth, in places desolate of old,
with them that go down to the pit, that thou be not inhabited; and I shall
set glory in the land of the living" (Ezek. 26:20). Satan made his claim for
the body of Moses (Jude 1:9) because Moses had killed the Egyptian (Ex.
2:11-12) under the first dispensation. Since some of Satan's servants were
slipping into salvation, a new agreement was sought to stop the gap. The
Lord's part in the agreement was deferment of condemnation until the
judgment, negating Satan's claim for the body of Moses, who died under this
dispensation, and bringing Jacob and his descendents to whom the law was
given into the Lord's house. The other guy's part in the agreement was the
adding of the curse of the law to salvation: "For as many as are of the
works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one
that continues not in all things which are written in the book of the law to
do them" (Gal. 3:10, 1Tim 4:1-3):"When you come to appear before me, who has
required this at your hand, to tread my courts?" (Is. 1:12,1 Tim. 4:1-4)
Salvation now came not merely through faith but also through doing the law.
Wayfaring Jews were people of His house and could be sought out and called
by Him: "Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the
Samaritans enter not. But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of
Israel" (Matt 10:5-6). When the price for all sin was paid on the cross, the
Lord was free to seek out all: "Go into all the world, and preach the gospel
to every creature" (Mark 16:15), and salvation of all in Him was through
faith, free from condemnation: "There is therefore now no condemnation to
them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the
Spirit" (Rom 8:1). All, not in Christ, remain under the condemnation of the
law, for "Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise
pass from the law, till all be fulfilled" (Matt 5:18).
The Jews and those who have come into Christ are servants in the Lord's
house; so, there are two groups of elect, the gospel elect (Col. 3:12) and
the enemy-of-the-gospel elect (Rom 11:28). Only the gospel-elect are free
from the condemnation of the law. One is not appointed to wrath (1 Thess
5:9), but the other is appointed to wrath (Ps 95:11)
.
|
|
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| User: "H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." |
|
| Title: Re: Dispensationalism's Interpretive Inconsistencies |
04 Oct 2007 12:27:10 PM |
|
|
"Fred A Stover" <fredstover7@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:V42Ni.992$lD6.659@newssvr27.news.prodigy.net...
"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <xeickleberrybooks@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:cF%Mi.9494$Jk2.1710@trndny03...
"Fred A Stover" <fredstover7@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:X%UMi.898$lD6.791@newssvr27.news.prodigy.net...
"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <xeickleberrybooks@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:J3PMi.10664$1d2.10121@trndny05...
"®andy" <pulpitfire@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:s8d7g3tbdnt9ml0dj87k1vnkig9hpg89rb@4ax.com...
On Fri, 28 Sep 2007 03:43:26 GMT,
in article <yL_Ki.6727$TH2.4978@trndny06>,
"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <xeickleberrybooks@verizon.net>
wrote:
"Pastor Dave" <ananias917_@_gmail.com> wrote in message
news:a22nf3hhgjq7jcr6lslg6dg206jdlm3lgk@4ax.com...
DISPENSATIONALISM'S INTERPRETIVE INCONSISTENCIES
As opposed to Preterist interpretive inconsistencies?
Ike
I haven't seen anyone in here who can do anything more than
throw names at dispensationalism. It's plainly taught in the
Bible:
1) I "throw" the facts at Dispensationalism.
You have yet to demonstrate you have any facts or that you even know
what a fact is.
LOL
I know this fact:
Ro 10:12a ¶ For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek...
Which is true in the church dispensation.
And which was true before Abraham, but not true under the law.
The law is done: Jesus fulfilled it.
And this fact:
Ro 11:32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have
mercy upon ALL.
Which is true of the blinded part of Israel. Who through the mercy of the
church dispensation are saved vs 31
Nope. It is true of ALL Israel, just like Paul said.
Romans 11:25-33
For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery,
lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is
happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in. [26] And
so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of
Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: [27] For
this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins. [28] As
concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching
the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes. [29] For the gifts
and calling of God are without repentance. [30] For as ye in times past
have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief:
[31] Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy
they also may obtain mercy. [32] For God hath concluded them all in
unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.
!
Yes, God has concluded them ALL in unbelief that He may have mercy on them
ALL.
1Co 7:19 Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the
keeping of the commandments of God.
And this fact:
Ga 5:6 For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor
uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love.
And this fact:
But outside the church, it is the circumcision in the bosom of Abraham.
1) Circumcision is just a sign.
2) Israel is "in" Christ, they just don't know it yet.
Ro 11:26-29
And so ALL Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come
out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away THEIR sins.
As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as
touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers’ sakes. For the
gifts and calling of God are without repentance.
And all these facts taken together outweigh your one silly doctrine
created by taking one verse out of the larger context of what Paul was
actually saying.
None of your facts remove one word of scripture. As noted going through
your list, some of your facts are conditional and don't apply to all
dispensations.
You have that quite backwards: Your misuse of one verse does not outweigh
Paul's conclusions.
And all "dispensations" apply to all "dispensations:" God's revelations are
built one upon another. They do NOT take off in different directions.
Paul was simply demonstrating to the Gentiles (to whom the letters are
addressed) the foolishness of putting the law back on in light of God's
grace.
2) It's NOT "plainly taught in the Bible." The Bible is evolutionary,
just like Isaiah said.
The Bible is a record of the dispensations.
And God "dispenses" His knowledge from the very beginning, and in a
straight line, through many prophets, and at no time did God ever change
His plan. Each revelation was another step towards God's desired end.
????????? You're drifting into outer space again scatterbrain. The subject
is the Bible .
And that is precisely what I'm talking about: The Bible is evolutionary, God
revealing one fact upon another.
And God's revelation move through the Bible in a straight line, not in
disparate "dispensations."
Why don't you cite what you misread in Isaiah and show everyone just how
crazy you are.
LOL
Haven't misread a thing.
First, the word dispensation occurs in the Bible, and means
"house rule", or "stewardship".
No, it doesn't.
1 Cor. 9:17
For if I do this thing willingly, I have a reward: but if against my
will, a dispensation of the gospel is committed unto me.
Paul was saying that He owes God, and if he didn't do what he was
supposed to do voluntarily, God would call in his marker on what He had
"dispensed" to Paul, i.e. salvation by grace.
Yes it does.
No, it doesn't.
Ephes. 1:10
That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather
together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and
which are on earth; even in him:
Yes it does.
No, it doesn't.
It just means that when the full measure of time has passed God will
gather all things in Christ.
Ephes. 3:2
If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is
given me to youward:
Yes it does.
No, it doesn't.
Again, God "dispensed" grace to Paul. That has nothing to do with "ages"
or "destinies" as you people treat it.
God has been "dispensing" information just like He said, i.e. here a
little and there a little. And nothing God ever dispensed eliminated or
replaced anything God dispensed before hand.
That's your cults little lie.
ROTFL
Well, it is. God says He is combining fates. You liars deny what God said.
Isaiah 28:13
But the word of the Lord was unto them precept upon precept, precept
upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a
little; that they might go, and fall backward, and be broken, and snared,
and taken.
Now try quoting it in context...
Isa 28:9-13
Whom shall he teach knowledge? and whom shall he make to understand
doctrine?
Them that are weaned from the milk, and drawn from the breasts.
For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line,
line upon line; here a little, and there a little: For with stammering lips
and another tongue will he speak to this people, to whom he said, "This is
the rest wherewith ye may cause the weary to rest; and this is the
refreshing:" yet they would not hear.
But the word of the LORD was unto them precept upon precept, precept
upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a
little; that they might go, and fall backward, and be broken, and snared,
and taken.
The very way God reveals knowledge--line upon line, and precept upon
precept--which is given through our Lord, who gives the rest, and the
refreshing (yet they, like you, would not hear)--is the same thing that
causes the obstinate (such as yourself) to fall, for the Lord just knows it
all, while men have to figure it out line upon line, and precept upon
precept, and they don't piece it together correctly until it has become a
snare and a trap to them. Hence, what should be positive becomes negative,
and what should be negative becomes positive.
That's PRECISELY the trap and snare you've fallen into, misconstruing what
Paul was saying, and turning it into something he was NOT saying.
Paul said "all Israel shall be saved," and he meant "all Israel."
Where they go from there is another problem altogether.
When Paul said circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing, he
meant it.
When Paul said there is now no difference between Jew and Greek, it means
there is now no difference between Jew and Greek.
Whereas the Gentiles are taken from the tree of the knowledge of good and
evil and grafted into the tree of life branch-by-branch, so, too, will
branches of Israel be taken from the tree of life and cast down into the
burning of the remaining branches of the tree of the knowledge of good and
evil if they don't abide in Christ when He is revealed to them in the
resurrection, when God sends them BACK to discern good and evil, and to know
who among them serves God and who does not.
Mal 3:17-18 And they shall be mine, saith the LORD of hosts, in that day
when I make up my jewels; and I will spare them, as a man spareth his own
son that serveth him. Then shall ye return, and discern between the
righteous and the wicked, between him that serveth God and him that serveth
him not.
God sorts the Gentiles pre-resurrection. He'll sort Israel
post-resurrection.
Ephes. 3:9
And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which
from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all
things by Jesus Christ:
Which has nothing to do with "dispensations."
ROTFL!!! Except the mystery of the one was hidden from the others
Yes, namely, you.
(And the passage still doesn't say anything about "dispensations.")
Ike
.
|
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| User: "Fred A Stover" |
|
| Title: Re: Dispensationalism's Interpretive Inconsistencies |
04 Oct 2007 10:57:39 PM |
|
|
"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <xeickleberrybooks@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:On9Ni.15809$bV2.13342@trndny02...
"Fred A Stover" <fredstover7@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:V42Ni.992$lD6.659@newssvr27.news.prodigy.net...
<Snip>
And this fact:
Ro 11:32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have
mercy upon ALL.
Which is true of the blinded part of Israel. Who through the mercy of the
church dispensation are saved vs 31
Romans 11:25-33
For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery,
lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is
happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in. [26]
And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out
of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: [27]
For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.
[28] As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as
touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes. [29] For
the gifts and calling of God are without repentance. [30] For as ye in
times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through
their unbelief: [31] Even so have these also now not believed, that
through your mercy they also may obtain mercy. [32] For God hath
concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.
Nope. It is true of ALL Israel, just like Paul said.
You lie again, Goofy, as He (not Paul) says above in verse 31 "Even so have
these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain
mercy" Their dispensation is judged by the church dispensation (Rev
20:4-5).
Yes, God has concluded them ALL in unbelief that He may have mercy on them
ALL.
So, you say, and you lie again. He says above in verse 32 "For God hath
concluded them all in
unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all." The blinded part of Israel
was blinded so the gentiles could come into the kingdom:
Romans 11:11
I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but
rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to
provoke them to jealousy.
His,
--
http://tinyurl.com/2hf6ak
ho echon ota akoueto Preparing the way of the Lord
Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a
little child, he shall not enter therein. (Matt 10:15)
<)))))))><
.
|
|
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| User: "H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." |
|
| Title: Re: Dispensationalism's Interpretive Inconsistencies |
05 Oct 2007 01:25:15 PM |
|
|
"Fred A Stover" <fredstover7@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:dFnNi.304$sm6.144@nlpi069.nbdc.sbc.com...
"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <xeickleberrybooks@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:On9Ni.15809$bV2.13342@trndny02...
"Fred A Stover" <fredstover7@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:V42Ni.992$lD6.659@newssvr27.news.prodigy.net...
<Snip>
And this fact:
Ro 11:32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might
have mercy upon ALL.
Which is true of the blinded part of Israel. Who through the mercy of
the church dispensation are saved vs 31
Romans 11:25-33
For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this
mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in
part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come
in. [26] And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall
come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from
Jacob: [27] For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away
their sins. [28] As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your
sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers'
sakes. [29] For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.
[30] For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now
obtained mercy through their unbelief: [31] Even so have these also now
not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy. [32]
For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy
upon all.
Nope. It is true of ALL Israel, just like Paul said.
You lie again, Goofy, as He (not Paul) says above in verse 31 "Even so
have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may
obtain mercy" Their dispensation is judged by the church dispensation
(Rev 20:4-5).
1) There are no "dispensations."
2) They're grace isn't judged by anyone--God simply gives it. If they don't
abide in that grace (and half won't), THEN they'll be cast down.
Yes, God has concluded them ALL in unbelief that He may have mercy on
them ALL.
So, you say, and you lie again.
I do not--Paul just told you that: "ALL Israel shall be saved."
He says above in verse 32 "For God hath concluded them all in
unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all."
Rom 11:26-29
And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out
of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: For this
is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.
As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as
touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers’ sakes. For the
gifts and calling of God are without repentance.
"ALL ISRAEL" means "all Israel." All Israel will be saved.
Then God will send them back to sort out the situation.
The blinded part of Israel
was blinded so the gentiles could come into the kingdom:
Romans 11:11
I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but
rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to
provoke them to jealousy.
Right: ALL Israel will be a saved.
The question is, will all Israel be staying?
Ike
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| User: "Fred A Stover" |
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| Title: Re: Dispensationalism's Interpretive Inconsistencies |
05 Oct 2007 07:03:04 PM |
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"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <xeickleberrybooks@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:fkvNi.287$ai2.102@trndny05...
"Fred A Stover" <fredstover7@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
The Three Dispensations
One of the points the Lord was making on the road to Emmaus as recorded in
the book of Hebrews is that salvation through faith was nothing new, for
salvation was through faith before the law was given: "By faith Noah, being
warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to
the saving of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became
heir of the righteousness which is by faith" (Heb. 11:7). However, under the
law salvation was through faith and doing the law, as Paul later wrote: "For
I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do
the whole law" (Gal. 5:3), Just as Noah and others before the law was given
were under a different dispensation than the circumcision, so are believers
in Christ under a different dispensation..
There are three dispensations in scripture as man is redeemed from the fall
of Adam. When Adam fell, he was no longer a servant of the Lord's house. He
had become a servant of Satan's house, the house of which all the
descendents of Adam are born: "he that believes not is condemned already"
(John 3:18). This is the condition resulting from Adam's original sin. As
servants of another, men were not called by the Lord. However, "the heavens
declare the glory of God; and the firmament shows his handywork" (Ps. 19:1),
and the Lord did find the runaway servants who sought Him: "then began men
to call upon the name of the Lord" (Gen. 4:26). Salvation was by faith, as
we are shown in Hebrews, but not free from the condemnation of sin,
"Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses (even over them that had not
sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression) who is the figure of
him that was to come" (Rom 5:14), and under this first dispensation
condemnation was immediate with death, the condemned under the first
dispensation are the people of old time in this verse: "When I shall bring
thee down with them that descend into the pit, with the people of old time,
and shall set thee in the low parts of the earth, in places desolate of old,
with them that go down to the pit, that thou be not inhabited; and I shall
set glory in the land of the living" (Ezek. 26:20). Satan made his claim for
the body of Moses (Jude 1:9) because Moses had killed the Egyptian (Ex.
2:11-12) under the first dispensation. Since some of Satan's servants were
slipping into salvation, a new agreement was sought to stop the gap. The
Lord's part in the agreement was deferment of condemnation until the
judgment, negating Satan's claim for the body of Moses, who died under this
dispensation, and bringing Jacob and his descendents to whom the law was
given into the Lord's house. The other guy's part in the agreement was the
adding of the curse of the law to salvation: "For as many as are of the
works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one
that continues not in all things which are written in the book of the law to
do them" (Gal. 3:10, 1Tim 4:1-3):"When you come to appear before me, who has
required this at your hand, to tread my courts?" (Is. 1:12,1 Tim. 4:1-4)
Salvation now came not merely through faith but also through doing the law.
Wayfaring Jews were people of His house and could be sought out and called
by Him: "Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the
Samaritans enter not. But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of
Israel" (Matt 10:5-6). When the price for all sin was paid on the cross, the
Lord was free to seek out all: "Go into all the world, and preach the gospel
to every creature" (Mark 16:15), and salvation of all in Him was through
faith, free from condemnation: "There is therefore now no condemnation to
them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the
Spirit" (Rom 8:1). All, not in Christ, remain under the condemnation of the
law, for "Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise
pass from the law, till all be fulfilled" (Matt 5:18).
The Jews and those who have come into Christ are servants in the Lord's
house; so, there are two groups of elect, the gospel elect (Col. 3:12) and
the enemy-of-the-gospel elect (Rom 11:28). Only the gospel-elect are free
from the condemnation of the law. One is not appointed to wrath (1 Thess
5:9), but the other is appointed to wrath (Ps 95:11)
.
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| User: "H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." |
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| Title: Re: Dispensationalism's Interpretive Inconsistencies |
06 Oct 2007 10:16:22 AM |
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"Fred A Stover" <fredstover7@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:ivKNi.381$LD2.106@newssvr17.news.prodigy.net...
"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <xeickleberrybooks@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:fkvNi.287$ai2.102@trndny05...
"Fred A Stover" <fredstover7@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
The Three Dispensations
The One continual dispensation.
Ike
.
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| User: "Fred A Stover" |
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| Title: Re: Dispensationalism's Interpretive Inconsistencies |
06 Oct 2007 02:56:19 PM |
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"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <xeickleberrybooks@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:aFNNi.3943$br2.1498@trndny03...
"Fred A Stover" <fredstover7@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:ivKNi.381$LD2.106@newssvr17.news.prodigy.net...
"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <xeickleberrybooks@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:fkvNi.287$ai2.102@trndny05...
"Fred A Stover" <fredstover7@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
The Three Dispensations
The One continual dispensation.
Romans 11:11-12
I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but
rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to
provoke them to jealousy. [12] Now if the fall of them be the riches of the
world, and the diminishing of them the riches of the Gentiles; how much more
their fulness?
Romans 11:25-32
For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery,
lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is
happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in. [26] And
so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion
the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: [27] For this is
my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins. [28] As concerning
the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election,
they are beloved for the fathers' sakes. [29] For the gifts and calling of
God are without repentance. [30] For as ye in times past have not believed
God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief: [31] Even so have
these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain
mercy. [32] For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have
mercy upon all.
Matthew 5:18
For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one
tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
Galatians 5:3
For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a
debtor to do the whole law.
Zech. 12:10
And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of
Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look
upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one
mourneth for his only son, and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that
is in bitterness for his firstborn.
Ezekiel 44:9
Thus saith the Lord God; No stranger, uncircumcised in heart, nor
uncircumcised in flesh, shall enter into my sanctuary, of any stranger that
is among the children of Israel.
Ezekiel 44:23-24
And they shall teach my people the difference between the holy and
profane, and cause them to discern between the unclean and the clean. [24]
And in controversy they shall stand in judgment; and they shall judge it
according to my judgments: and they shall keep my laws and my statutes in
all mine assemblies; and they shall hallow my sabbaths.
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| User: "Fred A Stover" |
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| Title: Re: Dispensationalism's Interpretive Inconsistencies |
06 Oct 2007 02:56:20 PM |
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"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <xeickleberrybooks@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:aFNNi.3943$br2.1498@trndny03...
"Fred A Stover" <fredstover7@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:ivKNi.381$LD2.106@newssvr17.news.prodigy.net...
"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <xeickleberrybooks@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:fkvNi.287$ai2.102@trndny05...
"Fred A Stover" <fredstover7@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
The Three Dispensations
The One continual dispensation.
Ike
Lyin' Ike!
Romans 8:1-2
There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ
Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. [2] For the law
of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin
and death.
Matthew 5:18
For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one
tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
Galatians 5:3
For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a
debtor to do the whole law.
Romans 11:25-29
For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery,
lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is
happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in. [26] And
so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion
the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: [27] For this is
my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins. [28] As concerning
the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election,
they are beloved for the fathers' sakes. [29] For the gifts and calling of
God are without repentance.
His,
--
http://tinyurl.com/2hf6ak
ho echon ota akoueto Preparing the way of the Lord
Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a
little child, he shall not enter therein. (Matt 10:15)
<)))))))><
.
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| User: "Fred A Stover" |
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| Title: Re: Dispensationalism's Interpretive Inconsistencies |
04 Oct 2007 11:41:09 PM |
|
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"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <xeickleberrybooks@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:On9Ni.15809$bV2.13342@trndny02...
"Fred A Stover" <fredstover7@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:V42Ni.992$lD6.659@newssvr27.news.prodigy.net...
<snip>
Ro 11:26-29
And so ALL Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come
out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away THEIR sins.
As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as
touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers’ sakes. For the
gifts and calling of God are without repentance.
And all these facts taken together outweigh your one silly doctrine
created by taking one verse out of the larger context of what Paul was
actually saying.
None of your facts remove one word of scripture. As noted going through
your list, some of your facts are conditional and don't apply to all
dispensations.
You have that quite backwards: Your misuse of one verse does not outweigh
Paul's conclusions.
No you have it backwards, and I've been citing those same verses for what
they are saying. You've been butchering and changing far more verses than in
your attempts to justify your heresy.
They will be saved in the millennium. They will worship in the temple to
which Jesus will return:
Malachi 3:1
Behold, I will send my messenger, and he shall prepare the way before
me: and the Lord, whom ye seek, shall suddenly come to his temple, even the
messenger of the covenant, whom ye delight in: behold, he shall come, saith
the Lord of hosts.
Ezekiel 44:9
Thus saith the Lord God; No stranger, uncircumcised in heart, nor
uncircumcised in flesh, shall enter into my sanctuary, of any stranger that
is among the children of Israel.
And they will fulfill their debt to the law, because it is the law:
Galatians 5:3
For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a
debtor to do the whole law.
And all "dispensations" apply to all "dispensations:"
There aren't any, but they apply to all????????
His.
--
http://tinyurl.com/2hf6ak
ho echon ota akoueto Preparing the way of the Lord
Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a
little child, he shall not enter therein. (Matt 10:15)
<)))))))><
.
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| User: "H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." |
|
| Title: Re: Dispensationalism's Interpretive Inconsistencies |
05 Oct 2007 02:47:53 PM |
|
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"Fred A Stover" <fredstover7@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:eFnNi.306$sm6.29@nlpi069.nbdc.sbc.com...
"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <xeickleberrybooks@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:On9Ni.15809$bV2.13342@trndny02...
"Fred A Stover" <fredstover7@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:V42Ni.992$lD6.659@newssvr27.news.prodigy.net...
<snip>
Ro 11:26-29
And so ALL Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come
out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away THEIR sins.
As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as
touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers’ sakes. For the
gifts and calling of God are without repentance.
And all these facts taken together outweigh your one silly doctrine
created by taking one verse out of the larger context of what Paul was
actually saying.
None of your facts remove one word of scripture. As noted going through
your list, some of your facts are conditional and don't apply to all
dispensations.
You have that quite backwards: Your misuse of one verse does not outweigh
Paul's conclusions.
No you have it backwards,
No, you do--you put the law back on those from whom the law is removed.
and I've been citing those same verses for what they are saying.
No, you haven't. I have.
The only thing you've been citing is one or two verses over and over again,
and that out of their context.
You've been butchering and changing far more verses than in your attempts
to justify your heresy.
The heresy is all yours, with your rapture myths, and different
"dispensations."
They will be saved in the millennium. They will worship in the temple to
which Jesus will return:
The millennium has nothing to do with the Israel that "was," or "is:" That's
the Israel that "will be."
Malachi 3:1
Behold, I will send my messenger, and he shall prepare the way before
me: and the Lord, whom ye seek, shall suddenly come to his temple, even
the messenger of the covenant, whom ye delight in: behold, he shall come,
saith the Lord of hosts.
This is about Elijah preceding Jesus in the millennium.
Ezekiel 44:9
Thus saith the Lord God; No stranger, uncircumcised in heart, nor
uncircumcised in flesh, shall enter into my sanctuary, of any stranger
that is among the children of Israel.
This is also about the millennium (but really about the eternal
congregation).
And they will fulfill their debt to the law, because it is the law:
Jesus already fulfilled their debt to the law.
Galatians 5:3
For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a
debtor to do the whole law.
Taken out of the context: Paul was talking about Peter circumcising
Gentiles, going backwards instead of forwards.
And all "dispensations" apply to all "dispensations:"
There aren't any, but they apply to all????????
I've already told you: God has been "dispensing" information since the
beginning, evolving knowledge from one step to the next. And nothing in one
step negates anything in the next.
Ike
--
www.eickleberrybooks.com
******************************
The Tree of Life (from "The Character Map")
The Beloved
Faith Hope
Righteousness Judgment Compassion
Courage Integrity Diligence Grace
Discipline of Thought Service Desire Decision and Belief
Glory Honor Power Wisdom Riches Blessing Strength w/Thanksgiving
He Who Loves
******************************
Remove X from address to reply
.
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| User: "Fred A Stover" |
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| Title: Re: Dispensationalism's Interpretive Inconsistencies |
05 Oct 2007 07:04:42 PM |
|
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"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <xeickleberrybooks@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:JxwNi.15$br2.14@trndny03...
"Fred A Stover" <fredstover7@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
The Three Dispensations
One of the points the Lord was making on the road to Emmaus as recorded in
the book of Hebrews is that salvation through faith was nothing new, for
salvation was through faith before the law was given: "By faith Noah, being
warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to
the saving of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became
heir of the righteousness which is by faith" (Heb. 11:7). However, under the
law salvation was through faith and doing the law, as Paul later wrote: "For
I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do
the whole law" (Gal. 5:3), Just as Noah and others before the law was given
were under a different dispensation than the circumcision, so are believers
in Christ under a different dispensation..
There are three dispensations in scripture as man is redeemed from the fall
of Adam. When Adam fell, he was no longer a servant of the Lord's house. He
had become a servant of Satan's house, the house of which all the
descendents of Adam are born: "he that believes not is condemned already"
(John 3:18). This is the condition resulting from Adam's original sin. As
servants of another, men were not called by the Lord. However, "the heavens
declare the glory of God; and the firmament shows his handywork" (Ps. 19:1),
and the Lord did find the runaway servants who sought Him: "then began men
to call upon the name of the Lord" (Gen. 4:26). Salvation was by faith, as
we are shown in Hebrews, but not free from the condemnation of sin,
"Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses (even over them that had not
sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression) who is the figure of
him that was to come" (Rom 5:14), and under this first dispensation
condemnation was immediate with death, the condemned under the first
dispensation are the people of old time in this verse: "When I shall bring
thee down with them that descend into the pit, with the people of old time,
and shall set thee in the low parts of the earth, in places desolate of old,
with them that go down to the pit, that thou be not inhabited; and I shall
set glory in the land of the living" (Ezek. 26:20). Satan made his claim for
the body of Moses (Jude 1:9) because Moses had killed the Egyptian (Ex.
2:11-12) under the first dispensation. Since some of Satan's servants were
slipping into salvation, a new agreement was sought to stop the gap. The
Lord's part in the agreement was deferment of condemnation until the
judgment, negating Satan's claim for the body of Moses, who died under this
dispensation, and bringing Jacob and his descendents to whom the law was
given into the Lord's house. The other guy's part in the agreement was the
adding of the curse of the law to salvation: "For as many as are of the
works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one
that continues not in all things which are written in the book of the law to
do them" (Gal. 3:10, 1Tim 4:1-3):"When you come to appear before me, who has
required this at your hand, to tread my courts?" (Is. 1:12,1 Tim. 4:1-4)
Salvation now came not merely through faith but also through doing the law.
Wayfaring Jews were people of His house and could be sought out and called
by Him: "Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the
Samaritans enter not. But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of
Israel" (Matt 10:5-6). When the price for all sin was paid on the cross, the
Lord was free to seek out all: "Go into all the world, and preach the gospel
to every creature" (Mark 16:15), and salvation of all in Him was through
faith, free from condemnation: "There is therefore now no condemnation to
them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the
Spirit" (Rom 8:1). All, not in Christ, remain under the condemnation of the
law, for "Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise
pass from the law, till all be fulfilled" (Matt 5:18).
The Jews and those who have come into Christ are servants in the Lord's
house; so, there are two groups of elect, the gospel elect (Col. 3:12) and
the enemy-of-the-gospel elect (Rom 11:28). Only the gospel-elect are free
from the condemnation of the law. One is not appointed to wrath (1 Thess
5:9), but the other is appointed to wrath (Ps 95:11)
.
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| User: "H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." |
|
| Title: Re: Dispensationalism's Interpretive Inconsistencies |
06 Oct 2007 10:17:38 AM |
|
|
"Fred A Stover" <fredstover7@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:jvKNi.383$LD2.20@newssvr17.news.prodigy.net...
"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <xeickleberrybooks@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:JxwNi.15$br2.14@trndny03...
"Fred A Stover" <fredstover7@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
The Three Dispensations
The One all-encompassing evolutionary ongoing dispensation.
Ike
.
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| User: "Fred A Stover" |
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| Title: Re: Dispensationalism's Interpretive Inconsistencies |
06 Oct 2007 02:56:21 PM |
|
|
Lyin' Ike!
Romans 8:1-2
There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ
Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. [2] For the law
of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin
and death.
Matthew 5:18
For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one
tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
Galatians 5:3
For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a
debtor to do the whole law.
Romans 11:25-29
For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery,
lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is
happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in. [26] And
so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion
the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: [27] For this is
my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins. [28] As concerning
the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election,
they are beloved for the fathers' sakes. [29] For the gifts and calling of
God are without repentance.
His,
--
http://tinyurl.com/2hf6ak
ho echon ota akoueto Preparing the way of the Lord
Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a
little child, he shall not enter therein. (Matt 10:15)
<)))))))><
"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <xeickleberrybooks@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:mGNNi.2820$ai2.426@trndny05...
"Fred A Stover" <fredstover7@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:jvKNi.383$LD2.20@newssvr17.news.prodigy.net...
"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <xeickleberrybooks@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:JxwNi.15$br2.14@trndny03...
"Fred A Stover" <fredstover7@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
The Three Dispensations
The One all-encompassing evolutionary ongoing dispensation.
Ike
.
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| User: "Fred A Stover" |
|
| Title: Re: Dispensationalism's Interpretive Inconsistencies |
04 Oct 2007 11:49:05 PM |
|
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"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <xeickleberrybooks@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:On9Ni.15809$bV2.13342@trndny02...
"Fred A Stover" <fredstover7@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:V42Ni.992$lD6.659@newssvr27.news.prodigy.net...
<snip>
God's revelations are built one upon another. They do NOT take off in
different directions.
God's revelations are built upon having His Spirit, and hearing His voice:
1 Cor. 2:14
But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for
they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are
spiritually discerned.
John 10:27
My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:
Scripture confirms the revelation:
2 Tim. 3:16
All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for
doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
Isaiah 28:13
But the word of the Lord was unto them precept upon precept, precept
upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a
little; that they might go, and fall backward, and be broken, and snared,
and taken.
His,
--
http://tinyurl.com/2hf6ak
ho echon ota akoueto Preparing the way of the Lord
Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a
little child, he shall not enter therein. (Matt 10:15)
<)))))))><
Paul was simply demonstrating to the Gentiles (to whom the letters are
addressed) the foolishness of putting the law back on in light of God's
grace.
2) It's NOT "plainly taught in the Bible." The Bible is evolutionary,
just like Isaiah said.
The Bible is a record of the dispensations.
And God "dispenses" His knowledge from the very beginning, and in a
straight line, through many prophets, and at no time did God ever change
His plan. Each revelation was another step towards God's desired end.
????????? You're drifting into outer space again scatterbrain. The
subject is the Bible .
And that is precisely what I'm talking about: The Bible is evolutionary,
God revealing one fact upon another.
And God's revelation move through the Bible in a straight line, not in
disparate "dispensations."
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