| Topic: |
Religions > Bible |
| User: |
"IknowHimDoYou" |
| Date: |
11 Dec 2003 10:27:51 AM |
| Object: |
Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution |
Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution
Prigogine, a Nobel Prize winning thermodynamicist:
"The probability that at ordinary temperatures a macroscopic number of
molecules is assembled to rise to the highly ordered structures and to the
coordinated functions characterizing living organisms is vanishingly
small. The idea of spontaneous genesis of life in its present form is
therefore highly improbable even on the scale of the billions of years
during which prebiotic evolution is speculated to have occured."
Ilya Prigogine, et al, Nov 1972, Physics Today p. 23-31
Comment:
Neither abiogenesis not heterogenesis(spontaneous generation of inorganic
chemicals into living orgainc macromolecules) is possible within the pale
of science. It only remains specultion and opinion of those who claim it
occured.
--
Recte Faciendo Neminem Timeas
Is it opinion? Is it fact? Is it truth?
.
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| User: "Steve Zodiac" |
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| Title: Re: Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution |
11 Dec 2003 07:30:34 PM |
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"IknowHimDoYou" <IknowHim@leavingsoon.com> wrote in message
news:IknowHim-1112030827510001@pm4-09.kalama.com...
Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution
Prigogine, a Nobel Prize winning thermodynamicist:
"The probability that at ordinary temperatures a macroscopic number of
molecules is assembled to rise to the highly ordered structures and to the
coordinated functions characterizing living organisms is vanishingly
small. The idea of spontaneous genesis of life in its present form is
therefore highly improbable even on the scale of the billions of years
during which prebiotic evolution is speculated to have occured."
Ilya Prigogine, et al, Nov 1972, Physics Today p. 23-31
I suspect that not a single scientist including a Christian scientist would
propose that life spontaneously occured in its present form. I would think
however that no one knows the initial stages that started the process.
Comment:
Neither abiogenesis not heterogenesis(spontaneous generation of inorganic
chemicals into living orgainc macromolecules) is possible within the pale
of science. It only remains specultion and opinion of those who claim it
occured.
--
Recte Faciendo Neminem Timeas
Is it opinion? Is it fact? Is it truth?
Its neither, its the attempt of an unimaginative fundamentalist to twist the
truth.
Steve Zodiac
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| User: "Frank Reichenbacher" |
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| Title: Re: Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution |
11 Dec 2003 10:58:29 AM |
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"IknowHimDoYou" <IknowHim@leavingsoon.com> wrote in message
news:IknowHim-1112030827510001@pm4-09.kalama.com...
Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution
Prigogine, a Nobel Prize winning thermodynamicist:
"The probability that at ordinary temperatures a macroscopic number of
molecules is assembled to rise to the highly ordered structures and to the
coordinated functions characterizing living organisms is vanishingly
small. The idea of spontaneous genesis of life in its present form is
therefore highly improbable even on the scale of the billions of years
during which prebiotic evolution is speculated to have occured."
Thank God the origins of life didn't have to depend on random assemblage, or
we would still be waiting!
Ilya Prigogine, et al, Nov 1972, Physics Today p. 23-31
Comment:
Neither abiogenesis not heterogenesis(spontaneous generation of inorganic
chemicals into living orgainc macromolecules) is possible within the pale
of science. It only remains specultion and opinion of those who claim it
occured.
The mechanism of genesis is disputed, but that it happened, either here on
earth or elsewhere in the universe, is not disputed except by crackpots like
you.
Frank
--
Recte Faciendo Neminem Timeas
Is it opinion? Is it fact? Is it truth?
.
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| User: "Dave Oldridge" |
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| Title: Re: Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution |
11 Dec 2003 11:12:26 AM |
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(IknowHimDoYou) wrote in
news:IknowHim-1112030827510001@pm4-09.kalama.com:
Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution
Prigogine, a Nobel Prize winning thermodynamicist:
"The probability that at ordinary temperatures a macroscopic number of
molecules is assembled to rise to the highly ordered structures and to
the coordinated functions characterizing living organisms is
vanishingly small. The idea of spontaneous genesis of life in its
present form is therefore highly improbable even on the scale of the
billions of years during which prebiotic evolution is speculated to
have occured."
Ilya Prigogine, et al, Nov 1972, Physics Today p. 23-31
Comment:
Neither abiogenesis not heterogenesis(spontaneous generation of
inorganic chemicals into living orgainc macromolecules) is possible
within the pale of science. It only remains specultion and opinion of
those who claim it occured.
Another non sequitur fallacy. All that Prigogine is showing here is that
the larger molecular engines of life could not, themselves, have arisen
by purely random synthesis. In other words, there must have been SOME
precursors. Indeed it has been shown more recently that small, replicase
enzyme molecules, well within the range of random polymerization can and
do evolve through mutation and natural selection. We cannot, of course,
estimate with any real precision what would ensue if they were to do so
for 100 million years or more, but the more successful experimental ones
do look somewhat similar to some of the bits that make up DNA and RNA.
Thus it could well be that these complex organic systems are, themselves,
the result of eons of chemical evolution. To claim that this is
impossible is to misrepresent the facts.
--
Dave Oldridge
ICQ 1800667
Paradoxically, most real events are highly improbable.
.
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| User: "Michael" |
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| Title: Re: Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution |
11 Dec 2003 09:57:40 PM |
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In article <Xns944E5DE4F3270doldridgsprintca@24.69.255.211>, Dave Oldridge
<doldridg@leavethisoutshaw.ca> wrote:
IknowHim@leavingsoon.com (IknowHimDoYou) wrote in
news:IknowHim-1112030827510001@pm4-09.kalama.com:
Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution
Prigogine, a Nobel Prize winning thermodynamicist:
"The probability that at ordinary temperatures a macroscopic number of
molecules is assembled to rise to the highly ordered structures and to
the coordinated functions characterizing living organisms is
vanishingly small. The idea of spontaneous genesis of life in its
present form is therefore highly improbable even on the scale of the
billions of years during which prebiotic evolution is speculated to
have occured."
Ilya Prigogine, et al, Nov 1972, Physics Today p. 23-31
Comment:
Neither abiogenesis not heterogenesis(spontaneous generation of
inorganic chemicals into living orgainc macromolecules) is possible
within the pale of science. It only remains specultion and opinion of
those who claim it occured.
Another non sequitur fallacy. All that Prigogine is showing here is that
the larger molecular engines of life could not, themselves, have arisen
by purely random synthesis. In other words, there must have been SOME
precursors. Indeed it has been shown more recently that small, replicase
enzyme molecules, well within the range of random polymerization can and
do evolve through mutation and natural selection. We cannot, of course,
estimate with any real precision what would ensue if they were to do so
for 100 million years or more, but the more successful experimental ones
do look somewhat similar to some of the bits that make up DNA and RNA.
Thus it could well be that these complex organic systems are, themselves,
the result of eons of chemical evolution. To claim that this is
impossible is to misrepresent the facts.
And what is the statistical probability of your beliefs being true?
.
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| User: "Tom" |
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| Title: Re: Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution |
12 Dec 2003 08:17:04 AM |
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"Michael" <mikeburt@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:mikeburt-1112032257400001@192.168.1.55...
In article <Xns944E5DE4F3270doldridgsprintca@24.69.255.211>, Dave Oldridge
<doldridg@leavethisoutshaw.ca> wrote:
IknowHim@leavingsoon.com (IknowHimDoYou) wrote in
news:IknowHim-1112030827510001@pm4-09.kalama.com:
Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution
Prigogine, a Nobel Prize winning thermodynamicist:
"The probability that at ordinary temperatures a macroscopic number of
molecules is assembled to rise to the highly ordered structures and to
the coordinated functions characterizing living organisms is
vanishingly small. The idea of spontaneous genesis of life in its
present form is therefore highly improbable even on the scale of the
billions of years during which prebiotic evolution is speculated to
have occured."
Ilya Prigogine, et al, Nov 1972, Physics Today p. 23-31
Comment:
Neither abiogenesis not heterogenesis(spontaneous generation of
inorganic chemicals into living orgainc macromolecules) is possible
within the pale of science. It only remains specultion and opinion of
those who claim it occured.
Another non sequitur fallacy. All that Prigogine is showing here is
that
the larger molecular engines of life could not, themselves, have arisen
by purely random synthesis. In other words, there must have been SOME
precursors. Indeed it has been shown more recently that small,
replicase
enzyme molecules, well within the range of random polymerization can and
do evolve through mutation and natural selection. We cannot, of course,
estimate with any real precision what would ensue if they were to do so
for 100 million years or more, but the more successful experimental ones
do look somewhat similar to some of the bits that make up DNA and RNA.
Thus it could well be that these complex organic systems are,
themselves,
the result of eons of chemical evolution. To claim that this is
impossible is to misrepresent the facts.
Burt: And what is the statistical probability of your beliefs being true?
Tom: Tee hee hee, you don't understand the mechanics of statistical
probability do you, Burt?
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| User: "Dave Oldridge" |
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| Title: Re: Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution |
12 Dec 2003 01:53:00 AM |
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(Michael) wrote in
news:mikeburt-1112032257400001@192.168.1.55:
In article <Xns944E5DE4F3270doldridgsprintca@24.69.255.211>, Dave
Oldridge <doldridg@leavethisoutshaw.ca> wrote:
IknowHim@leavingsoon.com (IknowHimDoYou) wrote in
news:IknowHim-1112030827510001@pm4-09.kalama.com:
Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution
Prigogine, a Nobel Prize winning thermodynamicist:
"The probability that at ordinary temperatures a macroscopic number
of molecules is assembled to rise to the highly ordered structures
and to the coordinated functions characterizing living organisms is
vanishingly small. The idea of spontaneous genesis of life in its
present form is therefore highly improbable even on the scale of
the billions of years during which prebiotic evolution is
speculated to have occured."
Ilya Prigogine, et al, Nov 1972, Physics Today p. 23-31
Comment:
Neither abiogenesis not heterogenesis(spontaneous generation of
inorganic chemicals into living orgainc macromolecules) is possible
within the pale of science. It only remains specultion and opinion
of those who claim it occured.
Another non sequitur fallacy. All that Prigogine is showing here is
that the larger molecular engines of life could not, themselves, have
arisen by purely random synthesis. In other words, there must have
been SOME precursors. Indeed it has been shown more recently that
small, replicase enzyme molecules, well within the range of random
polymerization can and do evolve through mutation and natural
selection. We cannot, of course, estimate with any real precision
what would ensue if they were to do so for 100 million years or more,
but the more successful experimental ones do look somewhat similar to
some of the bits that make up DNA and RNA. Thus it could well be
that these complex organic systems are, themselves, the result of
eons of chemical evolution. To claim that this is impossible is to
misrepresent the facts.
And what is the statistical probability of your beliefs being true?
Considerably closer to one than it is of yours being true. I base mine
on the revealed teachings and traditions of Holy Church and, in
scientific matters, on observation and experiment in the real world.
YOU, on the other hand, seem to base yours on lies, slanders and some
sort of private interpretation of Genesis, and on conclusions derived
from fallacious, unsound logic.
--
Dave Oldridge
ICQ 1800667
Paradoxically, most real events are highly improbable.
.
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| User: "HoundDog" |
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| Title: Re: Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution |
12 Dec 2003 09:32:03 AM |
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(IknowHimDoYou) wrote in message news:<IknowHim-1112030827510001@pm4-09.kalama.com>...
Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution
Prigogine, a Nobel Prize winning thermodynamicist:
"The probability that at ordinary temperatures a macroscopic number of
molecules is assembled to rise to the highly ordered structures and to the
coordinated functions characterizing living organisms is vanishingly
small. The idea of spontaneous genesis of life in its present form is
therefore highly improbable even on the scale of the billions of years
during which prebiotic evolution is speculated to have occured."
Ilya Prigogine, et al, Nov 1972, Physics Today p. 23-31
YOu should read the entire paper and tell us what it is about rather
than taking out of context a passage that suits your political
agenda.
Nice try: You are quoting OUT OF CONTEXT:
the paper you quote from is about how evolution is consistent with the
Second Law.
The paper begins with this sentence:
"The functional order maintained within living systems seems to defy
the Second Law; nonequilibrium thermodynamics describes how such
systems come to terms with entropy."
HD
today's bible quote (NOTE: I give the source):
"Happy those who seize your children and smash them against a rock."
Psalms 137:9 NAB
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| User: "Michael" |
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| Title: Re: Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution |
16 Dec 2003 03:20:53 PM |
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In article <987f5b85.0312120732.1bb3cf24@posting.google.com>,
hounddog111@elvis.com (HoundDog) wrote:
IknowHim@leavingsoon.com (IknowHimDoYou) wrote in message
news:<IknowHim-1112030827510001@pm4-09.kalama.com>...
Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution
Prigogine, a Nobel Prize winning thermodynamicist:
"The probability that at ordinary temperatures a macroscopic number of
molecules is assembled to rise to the highly ordered structures and to the
coordinated functions characterizing living organisms is vanishingly
small. The idea of spontaneous genesis of life in its present form is
therefore highly improbable even on the scale of the billions of years
during which prebiotic evolution is speculated to have occured."
Ilya Prigogine, et al, Nov 1972, Physics Today p. 23-31
YOu should read the entire paper and tell us what it is about rather
than taking out of context a passage that suits your political
agenda.
Tee hee hee, there is more quoted here than most fundie evolutionists ever
come up with.
Nice try: You are quoting OUT OF CONTEXT:
the paper you quote from is about how evolution is consistent with the
Second Law.
The paper begins with this sentence:
"The functional order maintained within living systems seems to defy
the Second Law; nonequilibrium thermodynamics describes how such
systems come to terms with entropy."
Bet there is a lot of might have, could have, must have assumptions there,.
HD
today's bible quote (NOTE: I give the source):
"Happy those who seize your children and smash them against a rock."
Psalms 137:9 NAB
Not surprising out of context. Psalms 137:8 O daughter of Babylon, who
art to be destroyed; happy shall he be, that rewardeth thee as thou hast
served us. 9 Happy shall he be, that taketh and dasheth thy little ones
against the stones.
Which as Gill comments: Ver. 9. Happy [shall he be] that taketh and
dasheth thy little ones against the stones.] That takes the infants from
their mothers' breasts, or out of their arms, and dashes out their brains
against a "rock", as the word {k} signifies; which, though it may seem a
piece of cruelty, was but a just retaliation; the Babylonians having done
the same to the Israelite children, and is foretold elsewhere should be
done to theirs.
.
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| User: "Dave Oldridge" |
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| Title: Re: Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution |
17 Dec 2003 12:56:04 AM |
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(Michael) wrote in
news:mikeburt-1612031620550001@192.168.1.55:
In article <987f5b85.0312120732.1bb3cf24@posting.google.com>,
hounddog111@elvis.com (HoundDog) wrote:
IknowHim@leavingsoon.com (IknowHimDoYou) wrote in message
news:<IknowHim-1112030827510001@pm4-09.kalama.com>...
Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution
Prigogine, a Nobel Prize winning thermodynamicist:
"The probability that at ordinary temperatures a macroscopic number
of molecules is assembled to rise to the highly ordered structures
and to the coordinated functions characterizing living organisms is
vanishingly small. The idea of spontaneous genesis of life in its
present form is therefore highly improbable even on the scale of
the billions of years during which prebiotic evolution is
speculated to have occured."
Ilya Prigogine, et al, Nov 1972, Physics Today p. 23-31
YOu should read the entire paper and tell us what it is about rather
than taking out of context a passage that suits your political
agenda.
Tee hee hee, there is more quoted here than most fundie evolutionists
ever come up with.
Actually, the way creationists misuse this, it should be called a
misquote.
Nice try: You are quoting OUT OF CONTEXT:
the paper you quote from is about how evolution is consistent with
the Second Law.
The paper begins with this sentence:
"The functional order maintained within living systems seems to defy
the Second Law; nonequilibrium thermodynamics describes how such
systems come to terms with entropy."
Bet there is a lot of might have, could have, must have assumptions
there,.
Where. I see a single "seems to" and it is in direct reference to what
you are claiming is a fact.
You and others have already been issued my thermodynamics challenge to
creationists. You have responded with nothing. Therefore, you are liars
and followers of the father of lies. Nothing you can say or do will
convince me otherwise as long as you persist in lying about things like
the 2nd law of thermodynamics.
The challenge, in case anyone hasn't seen it, is for creationists to
produce one single, necessary step in the hypothetical evolution of man
from a single-cell organism that can be shown mathematically to increase
the overall entropy of the universe (in other words ACTUALLY violate the
2nd law of thermodynamics). To date they are batting zero, though a
couple have tried to lie about that.
--
Dave Oldridge
ICQ 1800667
Paradoxically, most real events are highly improbable.
.
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| User: "Elmer Bataitis" |
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| Title: Re: Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution |
16 Dec 2003 04:00:32 PM |
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Tee Hee hee wrote:
hounddog111@elvis.com (HoundDog) wrote:
IknowHim@leavingsoon.com (IknowHimDoYou) wrote in message
Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution
Prigogine, a Nobel Prize winning thermodynamicist:
"The probability that at ordinary temperatures a macroscopic number of
molecules is assembled to rise to the highly ordered structures and to the
coordinated functions characterizing living organisms is vanishingly
small. The idea of spontaneous genesis of life in its present form is
therefore highly improbable even on the scale of the billions of years
during which prebiotic evolution is speculated to have occured."
Ilya Prigogine, et al, Nov 1972, Physics Today p. 23-31
YOu should read the entire paper and tell us what it is about rather
than taking out of context a passage that suits your political
agenda.
Tee hee hee, there is more quoted here than most fundie evolutionists ever
come up with.
There is absolutely nothing in the statement above that conflicts with
evolutionary theory. That you think is does, says more about you than
anything else.
**********************************************************
Elmer Bataitis "Hot dog! Smooch city here I come!"
Planetech Services -Hobbes
585-442-2884
"Proudly wearing and displaying, as a badge of honor,
the straight jacket of conventional thought." - C.
Cagle
**********************************************************
.
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| User: "Michael" |
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| Title: Re: Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution |
17 Dec 2003 08:39:49 AM |
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In article <3FDF8108.F6A8EB03@frontiernet.net>, Elmer Bataitis
<nylicens@frontiernet.net> wrote:
Tee Hee hee wrote:
hounddog111@elvis.com (HoundDog) wrote:
IknowHim@leavingsoon.com (IknowHimDoYou) wrote in message
Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution
Prigogine, a Nobel Prize winning thermodynamicist:
"The probability that at ordinary temperatures a macroscopic number of
molecules is assembled to rise to the highly ordered structures
and to the
coordinated functions characterizing living organisms is vanishingly
small. The idea of spontaneous genesis of life in its present form is
therefore highly improbable even on the scale of the billions of years
during which prebiotic evolution is speculated to have occured."
Ilya Prigogine, et al, Nov 1972, Physics Today p. 23-31
YOu should read the entire paper and tell us what it is about rather
than taking out of context a passage that suits your political
agenda.
Tee hee hee, there is more quoted here than most fundie evolutionists ever
come up with.
There is absolutely nothing in the statement above that conflicts with
evolutionary theory. That you think is does, says more about you than
anything else.
Nor does it prove evolutionary theory. That you think is does, says more
about you than anything else.
.
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| User: "Tom" |
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| Title: Re: Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution |
17 Dec 2003 01:28:39 PM |
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"Michael" <mikeburt@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:mikeburt-1712030939540001@192.168.1.55...
In article <3FDF8108.F6A8EB03@frontiernet.net>, Elmer Bataitis
<nylicens@frontiernet.net> wrote:
Tee Hee hee wrote:
hounddog111@elvis.com (HoundDog) wrote:
IknowHim@leavingsoon.com (IknowHimDoYou) wrote in message
Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution
Prigogine, a Nobel Prize winning thermodynamicist:
"The probability that at ordinary temperatures a macroscopic
number of
molecules is assembled to rise to the highly ordered structures
and to the
coordinated functions characterizing living organisms is
vanishingly
small. The idea of spontaneous genesis of life in its present
form is
therefore highly improbable even on the scale of the billions of
years
during which prebiotic evolution is speculated to have occured."
Ilya Prigogine, et al, Nov 1972, Physics Today p. 23-31
YOu should read the entire paper and tell us what it is about rather
than taking out of context a passage that suits your political
agenda.
Tee hee hee, there is more quoted here than most fundie evolutionists
ever
come up with.
There is absolutely nothing in the statement above that conflicts with
evolutionary theory. That you think is does, says more about you than
anything else.
Burt: Nor does it prove evolutionary theory. That you think is does, says
more
about you than anything else.
Tom: Tee hee hee, Burt, the parrot speaks again. Are you capable of
answering a post without resorting to such childish antics?
.
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| User: "Elmer Bataitis" |
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| Title: Re: Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution |
17 Dec 2003 08:49:29 AM |
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Teeheehee wrote:
<nylicens@frontiernet.net> wrote:
Tee Hee hee wrote:
hounddog111@elvis.com (HoundDog) wrote:
IknowHim@leavingsoon.com (IknowHimDoYou) wrote in message
Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution
Prigogine, a Nobel Prize winning thermodynamicist:
"The probability that at ordinary temperatures a macroscopic number of
molecules is assembled to rise to the highly ordered structures and to the
coordinated functions characterizing living organisms is vanishingly
small. The idea of spontaneous genesis of life in its present form is
therefore highly improbable even on the scale of the billions of years
during which prebiotic evolution is speculated to have occured."
Ilya Prigogine, et al, Nov 1972, Physics Today p. 23-31
YOu should read the entire paper and tell us what it is about rather
than taking out of context a passage that suits your political
agenda.
Tee hee hee, there is more quoted here than most fundie evolutionists ever
come up with.
There is absolutely nothing in the statement above that conflicts with
evolutionary theory. That you think is does, says more about you than
anything else.
Nor does it prove evolutionary theory. That you think is does, says more
about you than anything else.
Why is it that reading is fundamental to all but fundamentalists?
**********************************************************
Elmer Bataitis "Hot dog! Smooch city here I come!"
Planetech Services -Hobbes
585-442-2884
"Proudly wearing and displaying, as a badge of honor,
the straight jacket of conventional thought." - C.
Cagle
**********************************************************
.
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| User: "Michael" |
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| Title: Re: Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution |
02 Jan 2004 04:03:09 PM |
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In article <3FE06D7F.FDF722C3@frontiernet.net>, Elmer Bataitis
<nylicens@frontiernet.net> wrote:
Teeheehee wrote:
<nylicens@frontiernet.net> wrote:
Tee Hee hee wrote:
hounddog111@elvis.com (HoundDog) wrote:
IknowHim@leavingsoon.com (IknowHimDoYou) wrote in message
Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution
Prigogine, a Nobel Prize winning thermodynamicist:
"The probability that at ordinary temperatures a macroscopic
number of
molecules is assembled to rise to the highly ordered
structures and to the
coordinated functions characterizing living organisms is vanishingly
small. The idea of spontaneous genesis of life in its present
form is
therefore highly improbable even on the scale of the billions
of years
during which prebiotic evolution is speculated to have occured."
Ilya Prigogine, et al, Nov 1972, Physics Today p. 23-31
YOu should read the entire paper and tell us what it is about rather
than taking out of context a passage that suits your political
agenda.
Tee hee hee, there is more quoted here than most fundie
evolutionists ever
come up with.
There is absolutely nothing in the statement above that conflicts with
evolutionary theory. That you think is does, says more about you than
anything else.
Nor does it prove evolutionary theory. That you think is does, says more
about you than anything else.
Why is it that reading is fundamental to all but fundamentalists?
Coming from you, I accept the compliment.
.
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| User: "Tom" |
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| Title: Re: Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution |
02 Jan 2004 08:54:24 PM |
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"Michael" <mikeburt@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:mikeburt-0201041703090001@192.168.1.55...
In article <3FE06D7F.FDF722C3@frontiernet.net>, Elmer Bataitis
<nylicens@frontiernet.net> wrote:
Teeheehee wrote:
<nylicens@frontiernet.net> wrote:
Tee Hee hee wrote:
hounddog111@elvis.com (HoundDog) wrote:
IknowHim@leavingsoon.com (IknowHimDoYou) wrote in message
Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution
Prigogine, a Nobel Prize winning thermodynamicist:
"The probability that at ordinary temperatures a macroscopic
number of
molecules is assembled to rise to the highly ordered
structures and to the
coordinated functions characterizing living organisms is
vanishingly
small. The idea of spontaneous genesis of life in its present
form is
therefore highly improbable even on the scale of the billions
of years
during which prebiotic evolution is speculated to have
occured."
Ilya Prigogine, et al, Nov 1972, Physics Today p. 23-31
YOu should read the entire paper and tell us what it is about
rather
than taking out of context a passage that suits your political
agenda.
Tee hee hee, there is more quoted here than most fundie
evolutionists ever
come up with.
There is absolutely nothing in the statement above that conflicts
with
evolutionary theory. That you think is does, says more about you
than
anything else.
Nor does it prove evolutionary theory. That you think is does, says
more
about you than anything else.
Why is it that reading is fundamental to all but fundamentalists?
Burt: Coming from you, I accept the compliment.
Tom: Tee hee hee, everyone is complimenting you. Gee, everyone must be out
of step except you :-).
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| User: "Elmer Bataitis" |
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| Title: Re: Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution |
02 Jan 2004 04:24:06 PM |
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Michael wrote:
In article <3FE06D7F.FDF722C3@frontiernet.net>, Elmer Bataitis(snip)
Why is it that reading is fundamental to all but fundamentalists?
Coming from you, I accept the compliment.
It wasn't meant as one Mike.
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Elmer Bataitis “Hot dog! Smooch city here I come!”
Planetech Services -Hobbes
585-442-2884
"...proudly wearing and displaying, as a badge of honor, the
straight jacket of conventional thought."
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| User: "Andrew" |
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| Title: Re: Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution |
12 Dec 2003 04:45:40 AM |
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(IknowHimDoYou) wrote in message news:<IknowHim-1112030827510001@pm4-09.kalama.com>...
Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution
Prigogine, a Nobel Prize winning thermodynamicist:
"The probability that at ordinary temperatures a macroscopic number of
molecules is assembled to rise to the highly ordered structures and to the
coordinated functions characterizing living organisms is vanishingly
small. The idea of spontaneous genesis of life in its present form is
therefore highly improbable even on the scale of the billions of years
during which prebiotic evolution is speculated to have occured."
Ilya Prigogine, et al, Nov 1972, Physics Today p. 23-31
That's nice, he's saying that the spontaneous geneis of like IN ITS
PRESENT FORM is highly unlikely! Can't you read? Nowhere does
evolution say that modern life sprung out of nothing! Even the various
abiogenesis hypotheses do not claim this! Yet time and time again
creationists are prepared to LIE through their teeth to perpetuate
this strawman! How much sin is required before fundamentalist
creationists such as yourself finally realise their error? Will they
ever realise it?
Comment:
Neither abiogenesis not heterogenesis(spontaneous generation of inorganic
chemicals into living orgainc macromolecules) is possible within the pale
of science. It only remains specultion and opinion of those who claim it
occured.
More lies from the chief liar. Mr IKHDY, you've probably done more to
swell the ranks of alt.atheism than the most militant anti-theist
could have ever achieved! You ignore the parts of the Bible that
matter most in order to elevate Genesis to god-like status.
Andrew
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| User: "Thore Schmechtig" |
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| Title: Re: Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution |
11 Dec 2003 12:01:22 PM |
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"The probability that at ordinary temperatures a macroscopic number of
molecules is assembled to rise to the highly ordered structures and to the
coordinated functions characterizing living organisms is vanishingly
small.
First, this has nothing to do with evolution but with abiogenesis. The
subject of the original posting thus was a LIE.
Second, as always, I-know-***** ignores that the theory of abiogenesis
is not based on the assumption that non-living atoms / molecules all of
a sudden combined to form a living organism.
Bottom line: I-know-***** still is the same reliable LIAR.
UNWRITTEN RULES OF FUNDAMENTALISM
1. "I'm right and you are wrong".
2. Never admit that you are wrong, even if you really are.
3. When you have nothing to say, hurl insults.
4. Regard and portray your own violence, whether physical,
psychological,
or verbal, at all times as defensive
5. Be prepared at all times to lie and bluster, particularly when backed
into a corner in an argument
6. Never accept responsibility for any mess you have personally caused.
7. When you are forced to admit to an error, regard the whole process of
error and correction as part of God's personal plan for you and not as a
something for which you should apologise retract or make amends except
verbally and secretly to God himself
8. Always see yourself and you personal actions as part of God's plans
for
the world. Recognise that even your errors are just part of Gods will
for
the betterment of mankind.
9.Profess humility but avoid the actual experience of it.
10.Refuse to take in information that differs from your own view and
oppose all such information through classification of such information
in
a derogatory and simplistic manner(eg by categorising it as left wing
propaganda)
11.Refuse to accept that truth is not black and white; that reality is
complex and there are shades of grey
12.Refuse to forgive anyone else for anything unless you purport to
forgive on behalf of other people unconnected with you for whom you
don't
have that right anyhow.
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| User: "Matt Silberstein matts 2nopam@ix netcom.nospamcom" |
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| Title: Re: Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution |
11 Dec 2003 03:50:35 PM |
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In alt.religion.christian I read this message from
IknowHim@leavingsoon.com (IknowHimDoYou):
Equilibrium Thermodynamics vs Evolution
Prigogine, a Nobel Prize winning thermodynamicist:
"The probability that at ordinary temperatures a macroscopic number of
molecules is assembled to rise to the highly ordered structures and to the
coordinated functions characterizing living organisms is vanishingly
small. The idea of spontaneous genesis of life in its present form is
therefore highly improbable even on the scale of the billions of years
during which prebiotic evolution is speculated to have occured."
Ilya Prigogine, et al, Nov 1972, Physics Today p. 23-31
Comment:
Neither abiogenesis not heterogenesis(spontaneous generation of inorganic
chemicals into living orgainc macromolecules) is possible within the pale
of science. It only remains specultion and opinion of those who claim it
occured.
Funny, Prigogine got his Nobel Prize for *non*-equilibrium
thermodynamics. Are you this ignorant or are you dishonest?
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