| Topic: |
Religions > Bible |
| User: |
"Pastor Dave" |
| Date: |
15 Dec 2007 06:51:08 PM |
| Object: |
Eschatology of Christmas |
The Eschatology of Christmas,
by Brandon Vallorani
An article that I wrote earlier this year,
Hymnbook Eschatology, made the case
that Dispensational theology is hard to
find in the hymnbook.
Of course, it is not found in the pages of Scripture either.
Dispensationalism is a theological persuasion that believes
Christianity will shrink from the Earth until the "Rapture"
comes and rescues a few remaining Christians from final
destruction.
Dispensationalism does not inspire the Church to greatness.
Neither does it inspire great hymns. Ironically, even in
the most Dispensational churches you'll hear the singing
of hymns which speak of the advancement of the Gospel
and the Kingdom of Christ on the earth.
One of my favorite things to do during the Christmas season
is listen to the old Christmas hymns. These hymns have
a lot to say about eschatology (the study of the end times).
Consider the fact that defeatist or retreatist language
is nowhere to be found in their verses. Rather than
the usual Dispensational doom and gloom, you hear
words of glorious victory.
Reread verses 2-4 from "Joy to the World", by Isaac Watts:
Joy to the earth, the Savior reigns!
Let men their songs employ;
While fields and floods, rocks, hills and plains
Repeat the sounding joy,
Repeat the sounding joy,
Repeat, repeat, the sounding joy.
No more let sins and sorrows grow,
Nor thorns infest the ground;
He comes to make His blessings flow
Far as the curse is found,
Far as the curse is found,
Far as, far as, the curse is found.
He rules the world with truth and grace,
And makes the nations prove
The glories of His righteousness,
And wonders of His love,
And wonders of His love,
And wonders, wonders, of His love.
<How can He "rule the world", if the Dispy's are right?
Yet they hypocritically sing these words, while later
claiming that Christ doesn't rule the world yet!>
Unlike many Dispensationalists today, Isaac Watts
recognized that Jesus IS ALREADY on the throne
of his father David ruling and reigning (Acts 2:29-35)!
Joy to the earth, the Savior reigns!
Let men their songs employ;
He also understood that Christ is gradually extending
his righteous rule and putting all of his enemies under
his feet (1 Cor. 15:25-26)!
He comes to make His blessings flow
Far as the curse is found
Lastly, he reminds us that all of the world's governments
rest on Christ's shoulders and that His government will
increase forever (Is. 9:6-7).
<Please look at Isaiah 9:6-7 and you will see that it was
never about every single person in every single nation
worshipping Christ at the same time! If that were true,
then why does Scripture say that His Government would
never stop increasing?! How can it's "increase be
without end", if everyone's already worshipping Him?!
Dispy's talk about what the OT says, but do they read
it right?!>
Isaiah 9:6-7
6) For unto us a Child is born,
Unto us a Son is given;
And the government will be upon His shoulder.
And His name will be called
Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.
7) Of the increase of His government and peace
There will be no end,
Upon the throne of David and over His kingdom,
To order it and establish it with judgment and justice
From that time forward, even forever.
The zeal of the Lord of hosts will perform this.
<And how can it be all about the physical, when Jesus said
it would not be?! And can any Dispy please show me just
one verse in which Jesus Himself said; "But later it will
be physical." ??? Not verses that you wish to interpret
that way and not verses that you claim say it will be,
which would mean that Jesus contradicted Himself,
but verses in which HE HIMSELF ACTUALLY SAID
that it would be physical! Remember, in Luke 17:20-21,
Jesus was answering the Pharisees' question about the
FUTURE (from that point in time) Kingdom of God,
which THEY DID BELIEVE WAS PHYSICAL and what
did Jesus say???>
Luke 17:20-24
20) Now when He was asked by the Pharisees
when the Kingdom of God *WOULD* come,
He answered them and said, The kingdom of
God does *NOT* come with observation;
21) *NOR* will they say, ‘See here!’ or ‘See there!’
For indeed, the kingdom of God is *WITHIN* you.
Now let's compare what Jesus said, to what Dispy's say
and remember, no, the next verses do not have Jesus
contradicting Himself! Please look at His CLEAR WORDS!
JESUS: It does *NOT* come by observation
(seeing with the human eye (v20)).
DISPY: It *DOES* come by observation (seeing with
the human eye, which is their obviously bad
interpretation of v20).
JESUS: They *WON'T* say, "Look! There it is!"
(it cannot be pointed at (v21)).
DISPY: That *WILL* say, "Look! There it is!" (their
obviously bad interpretation of v21).
JESUS: The Kingdom of God is *WITHIN* you (v21).
DISPY: The Kingdom of God will be *PHYSICALLY
ALL AROUND YOU SOMEDAY* (their obviously
bad interpretation of v21)!
Now do these statements by Jesus and the Dispy's match???
We both know better, don't we? If not, then you obviously
need to check yourself into a mental ward! <lol!> :)
Back to the subject of hymns...
He rules the world with truth and grace,
And makes the nations prove
The glories of His righteousness,
And wonders of His love,
As you celebrate the advent of our King this season,
I remind you to reflect on the fact that Jesus did not
stay in the manger, nor did he stay on the cross.
Rather, he ascended to the throne and rules as
King of Kings!
The eschatology of Christmas in one of hope and victory.
"His dominion shall be also from sea to sea and from
the river unto the ends of the land." (Psalm 72:8,
1599 Geneva Bible).
So what think ye? Do the hymns you sing, line up
with the theology you claim is truth???
Again, I think we both know better and if you say that
you don't see this, then we both know that you do,
but that you're just being stubborn!
Now do we proceed on stubbornness, choosing our
doctrine over the actual words of Christ? Or do we
take the Lord at His word and proceed from there?
--
The Bible says that death came by sin and sin came
by Adam (Rom 5:12; 1 Cor 15:21-22).
Evolution says lots of things lived and died before
Adam and Eve got here and therefore attempts to rule
out what the Bible says.
One or the other is right, but they can't both be right.
.
|
|
| User: "gatekeeper" |
|
| Title: Re: Eschatology of Christmas |
15 Dec 2007 08:35:38 PM |
|
|
On Dec 15, 5:51 pm, Pastor Dave <ananias917_@_gmail.com> wrote:
The Eschatology of Christmas,
by Brandon Vallorani
An article that I wrote earlier this year,
Hymnbook Eschatology, made the case
that Dispensational theology is hard to
find in the hymnbook.
Of course, it is not found in the pages of Scripture either.
Dispensationalism is a theological persuasion that believes
Christianity will shrink from the Earth until the "Rapture"
comes and rescues a few remaining Christians from final
destruction.
Dispensationalism does not inspire the Church to greatness.
Neither does it inspire great hymns. Ironically, even in
the most Dispensational churches you'll hear the singing
of hymns which speak of the advancement of the Gospel
and the Kingdom of Christ on the earth.
One of my favorite things to do during the Christmas season
is listen to the old Christmas hymns. These hymns have
a lot to say about eschatology (the study of the end times).
Consider the fact that defeatist or retreatist language
is nowhere to be found in their verses. Rather than
the usual Dispensational doom and gloom, you hear
words of glorious victory.
Reread verses 2-4 from "Joy to the World", by Isaac Watts:
Joy to the earth, the Savior reigns!
Let men their songs employ;
While fields and floods, rocks, hills and plains
Repeat the sounding joy,
Repeat the sounding joy,
Repeat, repeat, the sounding joy.
No more let sins and sorrows grow,
Nor thorns infest the ground;
He comes to make His blessings flow
Far as the curse is found,
Far as the curse is found,
Far as, far as, the curse is found.
He rules the world with truth and grace,
And makes the nations prove
The glories of His righteousness,
And wonders of His love,
And wonders of His love,
And wonders, wonders, of His love.
<How can He "rule the world", if the Dispy's are right?
Yet they hypocritically sing these words, while later
claiming that Christ doesn't rule the world yet!>
Unlike many Dispensationalists today, Isaac Watts
recognized that Jesus IS ALREADY on the throne
of his father David ruling and reigning (Acts 2:29-35)!
Joy to the earth, the Savior reigns!
Let men their songs employ;
He also understood that Christ is gradually extending
his righteous rule and putting all of his enemies under
his feet (1 Cor. 15:25-26)!
He comes to make His blessings flow
Far as the curse is found
Lastly, he reminds us that all of the world's governments
rest on Christ's shoulders and that His government will
increase forever (Is. 9:6-7).
<Please look at Isaiah 9:6-7 and you will see that it was
never about every single person in every single nation
worshipping Christ at the same time! If that were true,
then why does Scripture say that His Government would
never stop increasing?! How can it's "increase be
without end", if everyone's already worshipping Him?!
Dispy's talk about what the OT says, but do they read
it right?!>
Isaiah 9:6-7
6) For unto us a Child is born,
Unto us a Son is given;
And the government will be upon His shoulder.
And His name will be called
Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.
7) Of the increase of His government and peace
There will be no end,
Upon the throne of David and over His kingdom,
To order it and establish it with judgment and justice
From that time forward, even forever.
The zeal of the Lord of hosts will perform this.
<And how can it be all about the physical, when Jesus said
it would not be?! And can any Dispy please show me just
one verse in which Jesus Himself said; "But later it will
be physical." ??? Not verses that you wish to interpret
that way and not verses that you claim say it will be,
which would mean that Jesus contradicted Himself,
but verses in which HE HIMSELF ACTUALLY SAID
that it would be physical! Remember, in Luke 17:20-21,
Jesus was answering the Pharisees' question about the
FUTURE (from that point in time) Kingdom of God,
which THEY DID BELIEVE WAS PHYSICAL and what
did Jesus say???>
Luke 17:20-24
20) Now when He was asked by the Pharisees
when the Kingdom of God *WOULD* come,
He answered them and said, The kingdom of
God does *NOT* come with observation;
21) *NOR* will they say, 'See here!' or 'See there!'
For indeed, the kingdom of God is *WITHIN* you.
Now let's compare what Jesus said, to what Dispy's say
and remember, no, the next verses do not have Jesus
contradicting Himself! Please look at His CLEAR WORDS!
JESUS: It does *NOT* come by observation
(seeing with the human eye (v20)).
DISPY: It *DOES* come by observation (seeing with
the human eye, which is their obviously bad
interpretation of v20).
JESUS: They *WON'T* say, "Look! There it is!"
(it cannot be pointed at (v21)).
DISPY: That *WILL* say, "Look! There it is!" (their
obviously bad interpretation of v21).
JESUS: The Kingdom of God is *WITHIN* you (v21).
DISPY: The Kingdom of God will be *PHYSICALLY
ALL AROUND YOU SOMEDAY* (their obviously
bad interpretation of v21)!
Now do these statements by Jesus and the Dispy's match???
We both know better, don't we? If not, then you obviously
need to check yourself into a mental ward! <lol!> :)
Back to the subject of hymns...
He rules the world with truth and grace,
And makes the nations prove
The glories of His righteousness,
And wonders of His love,
As you celebrate the advent of our King this season,
I remind you to reflect on the fact that Jesus did not
stay in the manger, nor did he stay on the cross.
Rather, he ascended to the throne and rules as
King of Kings!
The eschatology of Christmas in one of hope and victory.
"His dominion shall be also from sea to sea and from
the river unto the ends of the land." (Psalm 72:8,
1599 Geneva Bible).
So what think ye? Do the hymns you sing, line up
with the theology you claim is truth???
Again, I think we both know better and if you say that
you don't see this, then we both know that you do,
but that you're just being stubborn!
Now do we proceed on stubbornness, choosing our
doctrine over the actual words of Christ? Or do we
take the Lord at His word and proceed from there?
--
The Bible says that death came by sin and sin came
by Adam (Rom 5:12; 1 Cor 15:21-22).
Evolution says lots of things lived and died before
Adam and Eve got here and therefore attempts to rule
out what the Bible says.
One or the other is right, but they can't both be right.
Evening Dave, a great post!
I have always noted this as well. Who has heard Handel's Messiah, and
not wanted to get up and shout and hollar out God's Praises! A true
standing ovation unto the King of Kings, and Lord of Lords!
I would like to dare the Dispys, next time that they hear Handel's
Messiah, to shout out, that Jesus is not King yet here on earth, only
in Heaven.
I am sure they will get a standing ovation, instead of the Messiah!
The Eastgate is open, the King is in Residence!
Whosoever will, may come in!
Gatekeeper
.
|
|
|
| User: "Pastor Dave" |
|
| Title: Re: Eschatology of Christmas |
17 Dec 2007 10:31:42 AM |
|
|
On Sat, 15 Dec 2007 18:35:38 -0800 (PST), gatekeeper
<gatekeeper.eastgate@hotmail.com> said the following:
I would like to dare the Dispys, next time that they hear Handel's
Messiah, to shout out, that Jesus is not King yet here on earth, only
in Heaven.
I am sure they will get a standing ovation, instead of the Messiah!
Hahaha!!! Amen, Tom, Amen!!!
--
The fact is, if you can't believe the beginning,
you can't believe the end and shouldn't claim to.
To disbelieve the beginning, is to doubt many things
that Jesus said. After all, He made it clear that
He believed it. If you believe in the Trinity, how
can you believe that God wouldn't know how it all
started? If you can't believe the beginning, then
get off the pulpit.
.
|
|
|
|
|

|
Related Articles |
|
|