Religions > Bible > Evidence of heretic stupidity versus Paul's authentication
| Topic: |
Religions > Bible |
| User: |
"Disciple Gaius" |
| Date: |
18 Mar 2007 02:06:50 PM |
| Object: |
Evidence of heretic stupidity versus Paul's authentication |
The following is verbatim from a heretic's web page:
The False Apostle?
Paul’s authenticity:
Ephesians 1:1-2
Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, **to the saints
which are at Ephesus**, and to the faithful in Christ Jesus: 2 Grace
be to you, and peace, from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus
Christ.
Acts 19:8-9
8 And he went into the synagogue, and spake boldly for the space of
three months, **disputing and persuading** the things concerning the
kingdom of God. 9 **But when divers were hardened, and believed not,
but spake evil of that way before the multitude, he departed from
them**, and separated the disciples, disputing daily in the school of
one Tyrannus.
Revelation 2:1-2
Unto the angel of the church of **Ephesus** write; These things saith
he that holdeth the seven stars in his right hand, who walketh in the
midst of the seven golden candlesticks; 2 I know thy works, and thy
labour, and thy patience, and how thou canst not bear them which are
evil: and **thou hast tried them which say they are apostles, and are
not, and hast found them liars**:
THERE IS A MAJOR PROBLEM WITH THIS ARGUMENT, HE DID NOT QUOTE FULLY.
I suppose he accepts Luke's account in Acts 19 because he uses it in
his argument. So, what further did Luke state after Acts 19:9?
Acts 19:10 And this continued by the space of two years; so that all
they which dwelt in Asia heard the word of the Lord Jesus, both Jews
and Greeks.
11 And GOD WROUGHT SPECIAL MIRACLES BY THE HANDS OF PAUL:
12 So that from his body were brought unto the sick handkerchiefs or
aprons, and the diseases departed from them, and the evil spirits went
out of them.
Well, what do you know!! **God authenicated the Apostle Paul right
here** in the context of the passage chosen by the New Ager heretic.
Someone has even written a book based upon this foolishness and dug
back into the sparse information about the ancient Ebionite heresy for
support. I am ROTFL .... Remember, ignorance can be fixed;
stupidity is permanent! Saints, keep in mind the CONTEXT, full
CONTEXT.
Gaius
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| User: "Zadok" |
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| Title: Re: Evidence of heretic stupidity versus Paul's authentication |
19 Mar 2007 09:59:56 AM |
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"Disciple Gaius" <continuing to show his abject ignorance> wrote in message
....
THERE IS A MAJOR PROBLEM WITH THIS ARGUMENT, HE DID NOT QUOTE FULLY.
I suppose he accepts Luke's account in Acts 19 because he uses it in
his argument. So, what further did Luke state after Acts 19:9?
Bad Supposition!!
Luke got most of his information from Paul, so hardly is an independent
witness.
We know for a fact, that Luke never knew Jesus, never met Jesus, and never
studied with Jesus!!
Hey, just like Paul.
The apostolic succession of Luke goes something like this -
Jesus - FRIGGING BIG GAP - hallucination/dream/vision - Ananais (probably
Paul's buddy the high priest) - Paul - Luke!!
See the evidence shows your own stupidity!!
But hey, you follow the Herodian Saulus if you want.
We'll follow Jesus!!
Jesus told us about Paul -
Matthew 24: 5 and 24.
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| User: "Jude *+* Alexander" |
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| Title: Re: Evidence of heretic stupidity versus Paul's authentication |
18 Mar 2007 05:55:39 PM |
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++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
PAUL'S ILLOGICAL AGREEMENT WITH ABSURDITY
The first is his self referential statement in the letter to Titus who had
been left in Crete to attend to missionary tasks, and Paul later wrote to
him to
more clearly define his duties. Early in this letter, referring to the
Cretans,
he came forth with this astonishing statement:
One of themselves, a prophet of their own said, “Cretans are always liars,
evil beasts, lazy gluttons.” This testimony is true (Titus 1:12).
However, if Cretans are always liars, this statement by one of them must be
false. Yet, Paul says it is true. Paul has fallen into a trap of his own
making.
If the illogic statement is not obvious to you, read the following:
1. Paul writes that Epimenides says that Cretans are always liars.
2. Epimenides was a Cretan (a prophet of their own).
3. Therefore Epimenides always lies.
4. Paul says that what Epimenides said is true.
This is a pure conundrum and nonsense. Paul says that Epimenides'
testimony is true, the very testimony that says that Epimenides is a liar!
Surely this kind of human error in logic has it's orgin, not from God, from
the human Paul.
In fact, Epimenides' poem Cretica is quoted twice in the New Testament by
Paul. In the poem, Minos addresses Zeus thus:
They fashioned a tomb for thee, O holy and high one—
The Cretans, always liars, evil beasts, idle bellies!
and:
But thou art not dead: thou livest and abidest forever,
For in thee we live and move and have our being.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
PAUL'S CONTRADICTION TO JESUS'S LIFE AND/OR STATEMENTS
Jesus was known to eat with sinners, so much so that the it was held against
him by the religious leaders of His day, i.e. Luke 5:29. In contrast and
contradiction, Paul wrote that believers should not be seen in the company
with sinners (non-believers), i.e. 1 Corinthians 5:9-11, 2 Thessalonians
3:14.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
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| User: "Disciple Gaius" |
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| Title: Re: Evidence of heretic stupidity versus Paul's authentication |
19 Mar 2007 08:16:10 AM |
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On Sun, 18 Mar 2007 17:55:39 -0500, "Jude *+* Alexander"
<Jude@petitechenier.usa> wrote:
Ta Daaaa MORE EVIDENCE OF HERETIC STUPIDITY! See reponse at end..
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
PAUL'S ILLOGICAL AGREEMENT WITH ABSURDITY
The first is his self referential statement in the letter to Titus who had
been left in Crete to attend to missionary tasks, and Paul later wrote to
him to
more clearly define his duties. Early in this letter, referring to the
Cretans,
he came forth with this astonishing statement:
One of themselves, a prophet of their own said, “Cretans are always liars,
evil beasts, lazy gluttons.” This testimony is true (Titus 1:12).
However, if Cretans are always liars, this statement by one of them must be
false. Yet, Paul says it is true. Paul has fallen into a trap of his own
making.
If the illogic statement is not obvious to you, read the following:
1. Paul writes that Epimenides says that Cretans are always liars.
2. Epimenides was a Cretan (a prophet of their own).
3. Therefore Epimenides always lies.
4. Paul says that what Epimenides said is true.
This is a pure conundrum and nonsense. Paul says that Epimenides'
testimony is true, the very testimony that says that Epimenides is a liar!
Surely this kind of human error in logic has it's orgin, not from God, from
the human Paul.
When this Jude gets out of high school he will probably major in
communications at the Uni. Nah, he can't pass the entrance exams! Let
us now look at an example of everyday life and communicatioin.
My brother, my son's Uncle Bill is visiting from Washington, DC where
he has lived his entire adult life. My son lil' Bill and his wife are
preparing for a road trip to DC for a week's vacation and will be
leaving in the morning. Uncle Bill warns lil' Bill: "You guys be
careful up there, every Washingtonian drives like a maniac!" To which
I gave hearty agreement, "You know it!" [Now, what took place?]
1. Knowing human nature and the context, did Uncle Bill mean he
himself drove like a maniac? Surely not, he is the world's best.
2. Did Uncle Bill mean that every Washingtonian, without exception,
drove like a maniac? No and we all understand that.
3. Is Washington, DC known and joked about for their wild and crazy
drivers on their many traffic circles? They certainly are.
4. Is this sort of hypberbole found in Holy Scripture? Certainly it is
and anyone who knows the slightest thing about interpretation of any
writing knows how to deal with hyperbole. Apparently this moron, Jude,
is clueless...
Readers, you can enjoy a web page of middle-schoolers as they play
with "hyperbole" and offer their funny (?) examples. Sorry, Jude,
you'd not understand....
http://www.worsleyschool.net/socialarts/hyperbole/hyperbole2.html
Gaius
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| User: "Jude *+* Alexander" |
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| Title: Re: Evidence of heretic stupidity versus Paul's authentication |
19 Mar 2007 09:07:43 AM |
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Noted is that you resorted to a lengthy as well as juvenile and bizarre
flame but said NOTHING to dispute what I posted. This is the final act of
people who are caught with a true response to the issue...
"Disciple Gaius" <Gaius@inbox.com> wrote in message
news:45fe8500.2164672@news.east.cox.net...
On Sun, 18 Mar 2007 17:55:39 -0500, "Jude *+* Alexander"
<Jude@petitechenier.usa> wrote:
Ta Daaaa MORE EVIDENCE OF HERETIC STUPIDITY! See reponse at end..
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
PAUL'S ILLOGICAL AGREEMENT WITH ABSURDITY
The first is his self referential statement in the letter to Titus who
had
been left in Crete to attend to missionary tasks, and Paul later wrote to
him to
more clearly define his duties. Early in this letter, referring to the
Cretans,
he came forth with this astonishing statement:
One of themselves, a prophet of their own said, “Cretans are always liars,
evil beasts, lazy gluttons.” This testimony is true (Titus 1:12).
However, if Cretans are always liars, this statement by one of them must
be
false. Yet, Paul says it is true. Paul has fallen into a trap of his own
making.
If the illogic statement is not obvious to you, read the following:
1. Paul writes that Epimenides says that Cretans are always liars.
2. Epimenides was a Cretan (a prophet of their own).
3. Therefore Epimenides always lies.
4. Paul says that what Epimenides said is true.
This is a pure conundrum and nonsense. Paul says that Epimenides'
testimony is true, the very testimony that says that Epimenides is a liar!
Surely this kind of human error in logic has it's orgin, not from God,
from
the human Paul.
When this Jude gets out of high school he will probably major in
communications at the Uni. Nah, he can't pass the entrance exams! Let
us now look at an example of everyday life and communicatioin.
My brother, my son's Uncle Bill is visiting from Washington, DC where
he has lived his entire adult life. My son lil' Bill and his wife are
preparing for a road trip to DC for a week's vacation and will be
leaving in the morning. Uncle Bill warns lil' Bill: "You guys be
careful up there, every Washingtonian drives like a maniac!" To which
I gave hearty agreement, "You know it!" [Now, what took place?]
1. Knowing human nature and the context, did Uncle Bill mean he
himself drove like a maniac? Surely not, he is the world's best.
2. Did Uncle Bill mean that every Washingtonian, without exception,
drove like a maniac? No and we all understand that.
3. Is Washington, DC known and joked about for their wild and crazy
drivers on their many traffic circles? They certainly are.
4. Is this sort of hypberbole found in Holy Scripture? Certainly it is
and anyone who knows the slightest thing about interpretation of any
writing knows how to deal with hyperbole. Apparently this moron, Jude,
is clueless...
Readers, you can enjoy a web page of middle-schoolers as they play
with "hyperbole" and offer their funny (?) examples. Sorry, Jude,
you'd not understand....
http://www.worsleyschool.net/socialarts/hyperbole/hyperbole2.html
Gaius
.
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| User: "Zadok" |
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| Title: Re: Evidence of heretic stupidity versus Paul's authentication |
19 Mar 2007 11:02:38 AM |
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"Jude *+* Alexander" <> wrote in message ...
Noted is that you resorted to a lengthy as well as juvenile and bizarre
flame but said NOTHING to dispute what I posted. This is the final act of
people who are caught with a true response to the issue...
As Gaius confesses with every post, it is he who is the stupid one!!
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| User: "Jude *+* Alexander" |
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| Title: Re: Evidence of heretic stupidity versus Paul's authentication |
19 Mar 2007 12:29:04 PM |
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"Zadok" <nobler@accesswave.ca> wrote in message
news:yuyLh.129840$cE3.77584@edtnps89...
"Jude *+* Alexander" <> wrote in message ...
Noted is that you resorted to a lengthy as well as juvenile and bizarre
flame but said NOTHING to dispute what I posted. This is the final act
of
people who are caught without a true response to the issue...
As Gaius confesses with every post, it is he who is the stupid one!!
There are 100s more errors from exactly the SAME SOURCE where that one came
from! I'd like to see what "Gaius" has to say about some of them. Think
he's up to it?
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| User: "Zadok" |
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| Title: Re: Evidence of heretic stupidity versus Paul's authentication |
19 Mar 2007 05:06:02 PM |
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"Jude *+* Alexander" <> wrote in message ...
As Gaius confesses with every post, it is he who is the stupid one!!
There are 100s more errors from exactly the SAME SOURCE where that one
came
from! I'd like to see what "Gaius" has to say about some of them. Think
he's up to it?
Of course he is up to it. There is not a bible contradiction that
religionists are not aware of!!
And they can always explain it away with a probably, a maybe or likely that.
It's called apologetics -The art of apoligizing for idiotic answers!!
Smile.
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| User: "Jude @@ Alexander" |
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| Title: Re: Evidence of heretic stupidity versus Paul's authentication |
20 Mar 2007 11:58:13 AM |
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"Zadok" <nobler@accesswave.ca> wrote in message
news:ePDLh.64198$lY6.13877@edtnps90...
"Jude *+* Alexander" <> wrote in message ...
As Gaius confesses with every post, it is he who is the stupid one!!
There are 100s more errors from exactly the SAME SOURCE where that one
came from! I'd like to see what "Gaius" has to say about some of them.
Think
he's up to it?
Of course he is up to it. There is not a bible contradiction that
religionists are not aware of!!
And they can always explain it away with a probably, a maybe or likely
that.
It's called apologetics -The art of apoligizing for idiotic answers!!
Yes, and they've had many years to come up with the best excuses, most of
which are absolutely lame and very pitiful attempts of casting doubt.
There has been a lame excuses made for many years relative to the biblical
text about angels having sex with women and producing giants (not to say
that angels couldn't have sex but that the text was a misunderstanding of
what the "sons of God" meant) yet there are many inerrant bible believers
that don't try to put an spin on that particular text. I looked at many of
the internet apologist's sites and could not find one that addressed the
issue that the text was in absolute contradiction to Jesus talking about
angels being spirit and not having sex. I approached one large apologists
site and asked the guy about that contradiction. He said in all his studies
he had never had that pointed out to him and it took him all of a couple for
days to come up with an incredible lame excuse. I didn't tell him anything
as I wanted to keep the opportunity open to use him as a litmus test on how
quickly, simply and lame their research and excuses come about. He has
since put his lame reply on his site.
.
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| User: "john w" |
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| Title: Re: Evidence of heretic stupidity versus Paul's authentication |
19 Mar 2007 05:15:43 PM |
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x-no-archive: yes
On Sun, 18 Mar 2007 17:55:39 -0500, "Jude *+* Alexander"
<Jude@petitechenier.usa> wrote:
© 2007 John D Weatherly all rights reserved; no portion of this post
may be used anywhere else without written permission of the author.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
PAUL'S ILLOGICAL AGREEMENT WITH ABSURDITY
The first is his self referential statement in the letter to Titus who had
been left in Crete to attend to missionary tasks, and Paul later wrote to
him to
more clearly define his duties. Early in this letter, referring to the
Cretans,
he came forth with this astonishing statement:
One of themselves, a prophet of their own said, “Cretans are always liars,
evil beasts, lazy gluttons.” This testimony is true (Titus 1:12).
However, if Cretans are always liars, this statement by one of them must be
false. Yet, Paul says it is true. Paul has fallen into a trap of his own
making.
Because I took the time to read the passage, I noticed that it was one
of the PROPHETS to the Cretans who claimed that all Cretans were evil,
and that all were liars.
That doesn't not mean-- by default -- that the PROPHET would be
calling himself a liar, since God's prophets were set apart (and not
NECESSARILY of the same tribe).
For example, Jonah sent to Nineveh to preach the gospel. (presumably
because the Nineveh -ites were all corrupt. ) Merely because Jonah
went in as God's prophet doesn't make Jonah equally corrupt.
God would typically find the one or two righteous men among the whole
tribe and appoint him/them as prophets (those righteous ones with whom
God could successfully communicate)
So your attack on the Cretan prophet-- and your attack on Paul-- are
not well thought out.
john w
If the illogic statement is not obvious to you, read the following:
1. Paul writes that Epimenides says that Cretans are always liars.
2. Epimenides was a Cretan (a prophet of their own).
3. Therefore Epimenides always lies.
4. Paul says that what Epimenides said is true.
This is a pure conundrum and nonsense. Paul says that Epimenides'
testimony is true, the very testimony that says that Epimenides is a liar!
Surely this kind of human error in logic has it's orgin, not from God, from
the human Paul.
In fact, Epimenides' poem Cretica is quoted twice in the New Testament by
Paul. In the poem, Minos addresses Zeus thus:
They fashioned a tomb for thee, O holy and high one—
The Cretans, always liars, evil beasts, idle bellies!
and:
But thou art not dead: thou livest and abidest forever,
For in thee we live and move and have our being.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
PAUL'S CONTRADICTION TO JESUS'S LIFE AND/OR STATEMENTS
Jesus was known to eat with sinners, so much so that the it was held against
him by the religious leaders of His day, i.e. Luke 5:29. In contrast and
contradiction, Paul wrote that believers should not be seen in the company
with sinners (non-believers), i.e. 1 Corinthians 5:9-11, 2 Thessalonians
3:14.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
.
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| User: "Jude @@ Alexander" |
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| Title: Re: Evidence of heretic stupidity versus Paul's authentication |
20 Mar 2007 12:01:38 PM |
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"john w @yahoo.com>" <johnw<no> wrote in message
news:6k2uv2pcgss5ffpsm97ba0jdr6cfbnolle@4ax.com...
x-no-archive: yes
On Sun, 18 Mar 2007 17:55:39 -0500, "Jude *+* Alexander"
<Jude@petitechenier.usa> wrote:
© 2007 John D Weatherly all rights reserved; no portion of this post
may be used anywhere else without written permission of the author.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
PAUL'S ILLOGICAL AGREEMENT WITH ABSURDITY
The first is his self referential statement in the letter to Titus who
had
been left in Crete to attend to missionary tasks, and Paul later wrote to
him to
more clearly define his duties. Early in this letter, referring to the
Cretans,
he came forth with this astonishing statement:
One of themselves, a prophet of their own said, "Cretans are always liars,
evil beasts, lazy gluttons." This testimony is true (Titus 1:12).
However, if Cretans are always liars, this statement by one of them must
be
false. Yet, Paul says it is true. Paul has fallen into a trap of his own
making.
Because I took the time to read the passage, I noticed that it was one
of the PROPHETS to the Cretans who claimed that all Cretans were evil,
and that all were liars.
That doesn't not mean-- by default -- that the PROPHET would be
calling himself a liar, since God's prophets were set apart (and not
NECESSARILY of the same tribe).
Do you make this stuff up as you go? The PROPHET wasn't God's prophet. He
was a ZEUS prophet and a DEAD PAGAN at the time of Paul's statement about
him.
For example, Jonah sent to Nineveh to preach the gospel. (presumably
because the Nineveh -ites were all corrupt. ) Merely because Jonah
went in as God's prophet doesn't make Jonah equally corrupt.
God would typically find the one or two righteous men among the whole
tribe and appoint him/them as prophets (those righteous ones with whom
God could successfully communicate)
So your attack on the Cretan prophet-- and your attack on Paul-- are
not well thought out.
HA HA HA. MASSIVE PROJECTION. It's YOUR retort that isn't well thought out
OR, better said, NOT RESEARCHED. You made many comments on what you DON'T
UNDERSTAND! This is the lame stuff we deal with all the time, John W.
P.S. Read below regarding Epimenides. He was a PAGAN believer, writers and
story teller and Paul read his poem and used it to slam the Cretans where
Titus was preaching!!! Get a clue, pal!
john w
If the illogic statement is not obvious to you, read the following:
1. Paul writes that Epimenides says that Cretans are always liars.
2. Epimenides was a Cretan (a prophet of their own).
3. Therefore Epimenides always lies.
4. Paul says that what Epimenides said is true.
This is a pure conundrum and nonsense. Paul says that Epimenides'
testimony is true, the very testimony that says that Epimenides is a liar!
Surely this kind of human error in logic has it's orgin, not from God,
from
the human Paul.
In fact, Epimenides' poem Cretica is quoted twice in the New Testament by
Paul. In the poem, Minos addresses Zeus thus:
They fashioned a tomb for thee, O holy and high one-
The Cretans, always liars, evil beasts, idle bellies!
and:
But thou art not dead: thou livest and abidest forever,
For in thee we live and move and have our being.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
PAUL'S CONTRADICTION TO JESUS'S LIFE AND/OR STATEMENTS
Jesus was known to eat with sinners, so much so that the it was held
against
him by the religious leaders of His day, i.e. Luke 5:29. In contrast and
contradiction, Paul wrote that believers should not be seen in the company
with sinners (non-believers), i.e. 1 Corinthians 5:9-11, 2 Thessalonians
3:14.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
.
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| User: "john w" |
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| Title: Re: Evidence of heretic stupidity versus Paul's authentication |
20 Mar 2007 02:07:15 PM |
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x-no-archive: yes
On Tue, 20 Mar 2007 12:01:38 -0500, "Jude @@ Alexander"
<Jude@petitechenier.usa> wrote:
© 2007 John D Weatherly all rights reserved; no portion of this post
may be used anywhere else without written permission of the author.
"john w @yahoo.com>" <johnw<no> wrote in message
news:6k2uv2pcgss5ffpsm97ba0jdr6cfbnolle@4ax.com...
x-no-archive: yes
On Sun, 18 Mar 2007 17:55:39 -0500, "Jude *+* Alexander"
<Jude@petitechenier.usa> wrote:
© 2007 John D Weatherly all rights reserved; no portion of this post
may be used anywhere else without written permission of the author.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
PAUL'S ILLOGICAL AGREEMENT WITH ABSURDITY
The first is his self referential statement in the letter to Titus who
had
been left in Crete to attend to missionary tasks, and Paul later wrote to
him to
more clearly define his duties. Early in this letter, referring to the
Cretans,
he came forth with this astonishing statement:
One of themselves, a prophet of their own said, "Cretans are always liars,
evil beasts, lazy gluttons." This testimony is true (Titus 1:12).
However, if Cretans are always liars, this statement by one of them must
be
false. Yet, Paul says it is true. Paul has fallen into a trap of his own
making.
Because I took the time to read the passage, I noticed that it was one
of the PROPHETS to the Cretans who claimed that all Cretans were evil,
and that all were liars.
That doesn't not mean-- by default -- that the PROPHET would be
calling himself a liar, since God's prophets were set apart (and not
NECESSARILY of the same tribe).
Do you make this stuff up as you go?
No.
Do you always introduce yourself to people with an insult?
john w
snip
stopped reading here.
The PROPHET wasn't God's prophet. He
was a ZEUS prophet and a DEAD PAGAN at the time of Paul's statement about
him.
For example, Jonah sent to Nineveh to preach the gospel. (presumably
because the Nineveh -ites were all corrupt. ) Merely because Jonah
went in as God's prophet doesn't make Jonah equally corrupt.
God would typically find the one or two righteous men among the whole
tribe and appoint him/them as prophets (those righteous ones with whom
God could successfully communicate)
So your attack on the Cretan prophet-- and your attack on Paul-- are
not well thought out.
HA HA HA. MASSIVE PROJECTION. It's YOUR retort that isn't well thought out
OR, better said, NOT RESEARCHED. You made many comments on what you DON'T
UNDERSTAND! This is the lame stuff we deal with all the time, John W.
P.S. Read below regarding Epimenides. He was a PAGAN believer, writers and
story teller and Paul read his poem and used it to slam the Cretans where
Titus was preaching!!! Get a clue, pal!
john w
If the illogic statement is not obvious to you, read the following:
1. Paul writes that Epimenides says that Cretans are always liars.
2. Epimenides was a Cretan (a prophet of their own).
3. Therefore Epimenides always lies.
4. Paul says that what Epimenides said is true.
This is a pure conundrum and nonsense. Paul says that Epimenides'
testimony is true, the very testimony that says that Epimenides is a liar!
Surely this kind of human error in logic has it's orgin, not from God,
from
the human Paul.
In fact, Epimenides' poem Cretica is quoted twice in the New Testament by
Paul. In the poem, Minos addresses Zeus thus:
They fashioned a tomb for thee, O holy and high one-
The Cretans, always liars, evil beasts, idle bellies!
and:
But thou art not dead: thou livest and abidest forever,
For in thee we live and move and have our being.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
PAUL'S CONTRADICTION TO JESUS'S LIFE AND/OR STATEMENTS
Jesus was known to eat with sinners, so much so that the it was held
against
him by the religious leaders of His day, i.e. Luke 5:29. In contrast and
contradiction, Paul wrote that believers should not be seen in the company
with sinners (non-believers), i.e. 1 Corinthians 5:9-11, 2 Thessalonians
3:14.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
.
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| User: "Jude @ Alexander" |
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| Title: Re: Evidence of heretic stupidity versus Paul's authentication |
20 Mar 2007 04:55:20 PM |
|
|
"john w @yahoo.com>" <johnw<no> wrote in message
news:n4c003tq0e2131at2qfadtfk6vk1olrnrk@4ax.com...
x-no-archive: yes
On Tue, 20 Mar 2007 12:01:38 -0500, "Jude @@ Alexander"
<Jude@petitechenier.usa> wrote:
© 2007 John D Weatherly all rights reserved; no portion of this post
may be used anywhere else without written permission of the author.
"john w @yahoo.com>" <johnw<no> wrote in message
news:6k2uv2pcgss5ffpsm97ba0jdr6cfbnolle@4ax.com...
x-no-archive: yes
On Sun, 18 Mar 2007 17:55:39 -0500, "Jude *+* Alexander"
<Jude@petitechenier.usa> wrote:
© 2007 John D Weatherly all rights reserved; no portion of this post
may be used anywhere else without written permission of the author.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
PAUL'S ILLOGICAL AGREEMENT WITH ABSURDITY
The first is his self referential statement in the letter to Titus who
had
been left in Crete to attend to missionary tasks, and Paul later wrote
to
him to
more clearly define his duties. Early in this letter, referring to the
Cretans,
he came forth with this astonishing statement:
One of themselves, a prophet of their own said, "Cretans are always
liars,
evil beasts, lazy gluttons." This testimony is true (Titus 1:12).
However, if Cretans are always liars, this statement by one of them must
be
false. Yet, Paul says it is true. Paul has fallen into a trap of his
own
making.
Because I took the time to read the passage, I noticed that it was one
of the PROPHETS to the Cretans who claimed that all Cretans were evil,
and that all were liars.
That doesn't not mean-- by default -- that the PROPHET would be
calling himself a liar, since God's prophets were set apart (and not
NECESSARILY of the same tribe).
Do you make this stuff up as you go?
No.
Do you always introduce yourself to people with an insult?
john w
snip
stopped reading here.
Of course you stop reading there in order to STOP looking at something that
will prove to you that the bible is not inerrant. Sorry, you don't love
truth enough to feel uncomfortable. Some people will always love a
comfortable lie vs. an uncomfortable truth.
You insulted me FIRST with saying my methods were not well thought out and
yet I KNOW it was you who's thoughts were not not well researched calling
Epimenides a prophet of God! Epimenides was a PAGAN who worshipped Zeus.
You're just running from the truth because you are so comfortable with your
accepted dogma.
Lastly, I used to believe in inerrancy. I grew up in a home that called the
bible the "word of God" and I never questioned that. It was only after
being born again and being a Fundamentalist that I began to study the bible
hardily and found an error. At the time, I was in college and had a good
library available. I went there and laid out 6 different versions side and
side and new that translators had changed the meaning of a word over the
years to fall in line with dogma.
THAT was the beginning of a 6/7 year trek. Now I KNOW (not think) there are
100s of mistakes in the bible. If you include absuridites it's well above
thousand mark.
The PROPHET wasn't God's prophet. He
was a ZEUS prophet and a DEAD PAGAN at the time of Paul's statement about
him.
For example, Jonah sent to Nineveh to preach the gospel. (presumably
because the Nineveh -ites were all corrupt. ) Merely because Jonah
went in as God's prophet doesn't make Jonah equally corrupt.
God would typically find the one or two righteous men among the whole
tribe and appoint him/them as prophets (those righteous ones with whom
God could successfully communicate)
So your attack on the Cretan prophet-- and your attack on Paul-- are
not well thought out.
HA HA HA. MASSIVE PROJECTION. It's YOUR retort that isn't well thought
out
OR, better said, NOT RESEARCHED. You made many comments on what you
DON'T
UNDERSTAND! This is the lame stuff we deal with all the time, John W.
P.S. Read below regarding Epimenides. He was a PAGAN believer, writers
and
story teller and Paul read his poem and used it to slam the Cretans where
Titus was preaching!!! Get a clue, pal!
john w
If the illogic statement is not obvious to you, read the following:
1. Paul writes that Epimenides says that Cretans are always liars.
2. Epimenides was a Cretan (a prophet of their own).
3. Therefore Epimenides always lies.
4. Paul says that what Epimenides said is true.
This is a pure conundrum and nonsense. Paul says that Epimenides'
testimony is true, the very testimony that says that Epimenides is a
liar!
Surely this kind of human error in logic has it's orgin, not from God,
from
the human Paul.
In fact, Epimenides' poem Cretica is quoted twice in the New Testament
by
Paul. In the poem, Minos addresses Zeus thus:
They fashioned a tomb for thee, O holy and high one-
The Cretans, always liars, evil beasts, idle bellies!
and:
But thou art not dead: thou livest and abidest forever,
For in thee we live and move and have our being.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
PAUL'S CONTRADICTION TO JESUS'S LIFE AND/OR STATEMENTS
Jesus was known to eat with sinners, so much so that the it was held
against
him by the religious leaders of His day, i.e. Luke 5:29. In contrast
and
contradiction, Paul wrote that believers should not be seen in the
company
with sinners (non-believers), i.e. 1 Corinthians 5:9-11, 2 Thessalonians
3:14.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
.
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| User: "john w" |
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| Title: Re: Evidence of heretic stupidity versus Paul's authentication |
20 Mar 2007 09:44:26 PM |
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x-no-archive: yes
On Tue, 20 Mar 2007 16:55:20 -0500, "Jude @ Alexander"
<Jude@petitechenier.usa> wrote:
© 2007 John D Weatherly all rights reserved; no portion of this post
may be used anywhere else without written permission of the author.
"john w @yahoo.com>" <johnw<no> wrote in message
news:n4c003tq0e2131at2qfadtfk6vk1olrnrk@4ax.com...
x-no-archive: yes
On Tue, 20 Mar 2007 12:01:38 -0500, "Jude @@ Alexander"
<Jude@petitechenier.usa> wrote:
© 2007 John D Weatherly all rights reserved; no portion of this post
may be used anywhere else without written permission of the author.
"john w @yahoo.com>" <johnw<no> wrote in message
news:6k2uv2pcgss5ffpsm97ba0jdr6cfbnolle@4ax.com...
x-no-archive: yes
On Sun, 18 Mar 2007 17:55:39 -0500, "Jude *+* Alexander"
<Jude@petitechenier.usa> wrote:
© 2007 John D Weatherly all rights reserved; no portion of this post
may be used anywhere else without written permission of the author.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
PAUL'S ILLOGICAL AGREEMENT WITH ABSURDITY
The first is his self referential statement in the letter to Titus who
had
been left in Crete to attend to missionary tasks, and Paul later wrote
to
him to
more clearly define his duties. Early in this letter, referring to the
Cretans,
he came forth with this astonishing statement:
One of themselves, a prophet of their own said, "Cretans are always
liars,
evil beasts, lazy gluttons." This testimony is true (Titus 1:12).
However, if Cretans are always liars, this statement by one of them must
be
false. Yet, Paul says it is true. Paul has fallen into a trap of his
own
making.
Because I took the time to read the passage, I noticed that it was one
of the PROPHETS to the Cretans who claimed that all Cretans were evil,
and that all were liars.
That doesn't not mean-- by default -- that the PROPHET would be
calling himself a liar, since God's prophets were set apart (and not
NECESSARILY of the same tribe).
Do you make this stuff up as you go?
No.
Do you always introduce yourself to people with an insult?
john w
snip
stopped reading here.
Of course you stop reading there in order to
When some like you PRETEND that you can read people's minds and know
their intent, you crack me up!
You cannot read minds; nor can you know people's intent.
If you could, you would be a multi-millionaire on salary to the
government. You could tell the US where Osama is, for one thing.
That you claim you can read people's minds makes you the worst of
liars and pretenders.
And after such hyper-inflated claims (and lies), I have no interest in
anything else you might have to say.
john w
snip
STOP looking at something that
will prove to you that the bible is not inerrant. Sorry, you don't love
truth enough to feel uncomfortable. Some people will always love a
comfortable lie vs. an uncomfortable truth.
You insulted me FIRST with saying my methods were not well thought out and
yet I KNOW it was you who's thoughts were not not well researched calling
Epimenides a prophet of God! Epimenides was a PAGAN who worshipped Zeus.
You're just running from the truth because you are so comfortable with your
accepted dogma.
Lastly, I used to believe in inerrancy. I grew up in a home that called the
bible the "word of God" and I never questioned that. It was only after
being born again and being a Fundamentalist that I began to study the bible
hardily and found an error. At the time, I was in college and had a good
library available. I went there and laid out 6 different versions side and
side and new that translators had changed the meaning of a word over the
years to fall in line with dogma.
THAT was the beginning of a 6/7 year trek. Now I KNOW (not think) there are
100s of mistakes in the bible. If you include absuridites it's well above
thousand mark.
The PROPHET wasn't God's prophet. He
was a ZEUS prophet and a DEAD PAGAN at the time of Paul's statement about
him.
For example, Jonah sent to Nineveh to preach the gospel. (presumably
because the Nineveh -ites were all corrupt. ) Merely because Jonah
went in as God's prophet doesn't make Jonah equally corrupt.
God would typically find the one or two righteous men among the whole
tribe and appoint him/them as prophets (those righteous ones with whom
God could successfully communicate)
So your attack on the Cretan prophet-- and your attack on Paul-- are
not well thought out.
HA HA HA. MASSIVE PROJECTION. It's YOUR retort that isn't well thought
out
OR, better said, NOT RESEARCHED. You made many comments on what you
DON'T
UNDERSTAND! This is the lame stuff we deal with all the time, John W.
P.S. Read below regarding Epimenides. He was a PAGAN believer, writers
and
story teller and Paul read his poem and used it to slam the Cretans where
Titus was preaching!!! Get a clue, pal!
john w
If the illogic statement is not obvious to you, read the following:
1. Paul writes that Epimenides says that Cretans are always liars.
2. Epimenides was a Cretan (a prophet of their own).
3. Therefore Epimenides always lies.
4. Paul says that what Epimenides said is true.
This is a pure conundrum and nonsense. Paul says that Epimenides'
testimony is true, the very testimony that says that Epimenides is a
liar!
Surely this kind of human error in logic has it's orgin, not from God,
from
the human Paul.
In fact, Epimenides' poem Cretica is quoted twice in the New Testament
by
Paul. In the poem, Minos addresses Zeus thus:
They fashioned a tomb for thee, O holy and high one-
The Cretans, always liars, evil beasts, idle bellies!
and:
But thou art not dead: thou livest and abidest forever,
For in thee we live and move and have our being.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
PAUL'S CONTRADICTION TO JESUS'S LIFE AND/OR STATEMENTS
Jesus was known to eat with sinners, so much so that the it was held
against
him by the religious leaders of His day, i.e. Luke 5:29. In contrast
and
contradiction, Paul wrote that believers should not be seen in the
company
with sinners (non-believers), i.e. 1 Corinthians 5:9-11, 2 Thessalonians
3:14.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
.
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| User: "Ed" |
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| Title: Re: Evidence of heretic stupidity versus Paul's authentication |
20 Mar 2007 03:22:25 PM |
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john w <johnw<no>@yahoo.com> wrote in
news:n4c003tq0e2131at2qfadtfk6vk1olrnrk@4ax.com:
x-no-archive: yes
On Tue, 20 Mar 2007 12:01:38 -0500, "Jude @@ Alexander"
<Jude@petitechenier.usa> wrote:
© 2007 John D Weatherly all rights reserved; no portion of this post
may be used anywhere else without written permission of the author.
While it's possible that google will honor your XNA, there's plenty of
forums that scrape newsgroups for content and I don't know of any that
honor XNA.
- --
http://blog.peculiarplace.com
http://comments.lurasbookcase.com
http://peculiarplace.com
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| User: "john w" |
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| Title: Re: Evidence of heretic stupidity versus Paul's authentication |
20 Mar 2007 09:41:52 PM |
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x-no-archive: yes
On Tue, 20 Mar 2007 15:22:25 -0500, Ed
<apostle@REMOVETHISpeculiar.homeip.net> wrote:
© 2007 John D Weatherly all rights reserved; no portion of this post
may be used anywhere else without written permission of the author.
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256
john w <johnw<no>@yahoo.com> wrote in
news:n4c003tq0e2131at2qfadtfk6vk1olrnrk@4ax.com:
x-no-archive: yes
On Tue, 20 Mar 2007 12:01:38 -0500, "Jude @@ Alexander"
<Jude@petitechenier.usa> wrote:
© 2007 John D Weatherly all rights reserved; no portion of this post
may be used anywhere else without written permission of the author.
While it's possible that google will honor your XNA, there's plenty of
forums that scrape newsgroups for content and I don't know of any that
honor XNA.
Thanks for the tip.
And I know that there are many forums that scrape and scour the
groups for content. I have found my writing on more "other forums"
than I can count, including dozens of web pages dedicated to
re-posting/publishing content from elsewhere.
I continue to "XNA" as you put it to show my INTENT.
I also put a copyright notice on virtually all (not "all") of what I
post to show INTENT.
john w
.
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| User: "Ed" |
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| Title: Re: Evidence of heretic stupidity versus Paul's authentication |
21 Mar 2007 10:39:38 AM |
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Hash: SHA256
john w <johnw<no>@yahoo.com> wrote in
news:om6103lt3b8mc66lfl3ilr3mcrinm9uuck@4ax.com:
x-no-archive: yes
On Tue, 20 Mar 2007 15:22:25 -0500, Ed
<apostle@REMOVETHISpeculiar.homeip.net> wrote:
© 2007 John D Weatherly all rights reserved; no portion of this post
may be used anywhere else without written permission of the author.
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256
john w <johnw<no>@yahoo.com> wrote in
news:n4c003tq0e2131at2qfadtfk6vk1olrnrk@4ax.com:
x-no-archive: yes
On Tue, 20 Mar 2007 12:01:38 -0500, "Jude @@ Alexander"
<Jude@petitechenier.usa> wrote:
© 2007 John D Weatherly all rights reserved; no portion of this
post may be used anywhere else without written permission of the
author.
While it's possible that google will honor your XNA, there's plenty of
forums that scrape newsgroups for content and I don't know of any that
honor XNA.
Thanks for the tip.
And I know that there are many forums that scrape and scour the
groups for content. I have found my writing on more "other forums"
than I can count, including dozens of web pages dedicated to
re-posting/publishing content from elsewhere.
I continue to "XNA" as you put it to show my INTENT.
I also put a copyright notice on virtually all (not "all") of what I
post to show INTENT.
Makes no difference to me, but I don't see that it's going to protect
anything.. Or do you plan to bring suit against every site that contains
copies of your posts that you did not explicitly authorize?
- --
http://blog.peculiarplace.com
http://offthecuff.lurasbookcase.com
http://peculiarplace.com
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