| Topic: |
Religions > Bible |
| User: |
"Geoman" |
| Date: |
25 Feb 2004 03:17:36 AM |
| Object: |
Germany and the residents of the killing towns |
After the Germans laid down their weapons, the citizens who lived in the towns where the
killing camps were doing their atrocities were lined up and forced to walk through those
camps to see first hand what they ignored to talk about while the murders were going on.
The entire town was lined up and commanded to view what they ignored for so many years.
The Germans in those towns were denying that the murders and inhuman treatment was going
on. And here is the key, some did not believe the stories, some were fearful to take a
stand against it and there were some who supported the murders.
No one can blame todays citizens for what took place then in the 1940's, that was a
different generation, But we must learn from it and not ignore the facts, the Germans
killed many Jews AND CHRISTIANS who stood up to Hitler's rule.
NOW, this is important, when in Washington DC, the holocaust museum stresses that idea
that if they don't emphasis this historical fact that it could happen over again. SO, WITH
THEIR OWN LOGIC I submit the following.
Today, The Passion is opened around the world. Many Jews are saying, "THIS DIDN'T HAPPEN!
WE DIDN'T DO THAT!" No one is saying that today's generation of Jews murdered Christ, but
it is INSULTING to me for them to deny the fact that they DID murder Christ! Why is it
that the Jews are so adamant to say that the terrible things Hitler did is important to
review but the murder of Christ is less important? They are guilty of the very things
that they claim the Germans are guilty of!
I BELIEVE that the Anti-defamation League is just making a fuss in hopes of being
portrayed by the Jewish community as a necessary organization that is fighting for the
Jews. But in reality, they make me upset with their childish acts, trying there best to
talk about how the Jews didn't force the hand of Pilot. The ADL thinks if they say it
enough maybe someone will believe it! Instead, its making me insensitive to their causes
and I just see it as a way for them to get free publicity.
The ADL propaganda is wearing thin on me. Its beginning to make me wonder if the Jews are
still following the Talmud and things haven't really changed that much with them after
all....... Are we still the Goy's in the Talmud? Anyone who has studied Jewish
literature knows that the Talmud is a vial and wicked teaching. It allows the rape of any
gentile from 3 years old and up, it allows for the murder of Goy's as long as the Jewish
religion can't be put on trial. It teaches that when there is a majority of Jews over the
other religions that it is THEIR DUTY to overcome the Goy's and suppress them, even murder
them.
Now, if the Jews want to start this Anti-Semite stuff they should be prepared to defend
what they have historically believed and teach today. I have written the ADL and of
course, they don't respond. I told them that I believe their intent is to stir the pot so
their support in the Jewish community will increase. Only a fool will say that the Jews
didn't demand Christ crucifixion, and only a fool can put today's Jews on trial for what
happened 2000 years ago. BTW, you fellow Christians who say that it was 'my sins who put
them there," are not looking at the total picture here. We are to condemn sin AND any
religion that promotes it. Jesus said if you (they) are not for Him then you (they) are
ENEMIES of his. Not my words but Christ's. These people committed MURDER and they are
judged for it just like we are to be judged for our sins. I'm sick of a few Jews who deny
their race/religion had anything to do with Christ's death and then want us to feel pain
for their trials and tribulations.
Rich
.
|
|
| User: "Wai Doan Hsu" |
|
| Title: Re: Germany and the residents of the killing towns |
25 Feb 2004 06:39:43 PM |
|
|
"Geoman" <Geomaan@yaaho.com> wrote in message news:<RsGdnZYK-bK69aHdRVn-gw@adelphia.com>...
After the Germans laid down their weapons, the citizens who lived in the towns where the
killing camps were doing their atrocities were lined up and forced to walk through those
camps to see first hand what they ignored to talk about while the murders were going on.
The entire town was lined up and commanded to view what they ignored for so many years.
The Germans in those towns were denying that the murders and inhuman treatment was going
on. And here is the key, some did not believe the stories, some were fearful to take a
stand against it and there were some who supported the murders.
No one can blame todays citizens for what took place then in the 1940's, that was a
different generation, But we must learn from it and not ignore the facts, the Germans
killed many Jews AND CHRISTIANS who stood up to Hitler's rule.
People who study the holocaust need to understand what happened in
context. There are those who insist on pointing out that Christians
were killed, so they can have a "so what" attitude toward the Jews as
if it were not significant.
Hitler did NOT target Christians as a whole, nor was it ever his goal
to wipe out Christians as a group or wipe out Christianity. When
Hitler started rounding up Jews, Christians saw it as nothing
different from what they had seen before; rounding up of Jews and
forcing them into ghettos to live in inhumane conditions had been
commonplace for centuries, as was the teaching of hatred toward Jews.
Out of 11 million Jews estimated to have been in Germany before WWII,
about 6 million were killed. Hitler tried to wipe Jews off the face
of the earth and nearly succeeded. He wanted to do the same with
Gypsys, homosexuals, the mentally ill, and other groups, but it was
never his goal to do that to Christians.
The Jews who were killed were NOT killed for standing up to Hitler.
They were NOT killed for specific actions or even beliefs. They were
killed because they were blamed for things that had nothing to do with
them.
NOW, this is important, when in Washington DC, the holocaust museum stresses that idea
that if they don't emphasis this historical fact that it could happen over again. SO, WITH
THEIR OWN LOGIC I submit the following.
Today, The Passion is opened around the world. Many Jews are saying, "THIS DIDN'T HAPPEN!
WE DIDN'T DO THAT!" No one is saying that today's generation of Jews murdered Christ, but
it is INSULTING to me for them to deny the fact that they DID murder Christ! Why is it
that the Jews are so adamant to say that the terrible things Hitler did is important to
review but the murder of Christ is less important? They are guilty of the very things
that they claim the Germans are guilty of!
The Jews are NOT holding all Germans responsible for the holocaust.
They are NOT claiming that Germans of today (with the exception of
those who were alive back then and committing war crimes) are
responsible. So if you want to use the same logic, that's the logic
you have to use. By that logic, Jews today have nothing to do with the
death of Jesus no matter what happened back then.
As for Jews denying that any Jews were involved, we need to look at
history. Jews did not control the area at the time. It had been taken
over by the Romans who ruled it with an iron fist. Pontius Pilate was
considered very brutal even by Roman standards. Jews had no government
and had no power to make such decisions.
What if something similar happened now? Suppose Saddam Hussein had put
somebody to death. Suppose it was an enemy of his regime, and he
hated that person even more for being Jewish. If Saddam had the
person executed, how credible would you find the following statement?
"Yes, I put him to death, but you can't blame me, really. It's not
actually my fault at all. I asked Israel what to do with him and they
told me to kill him. I didn't really want to, but the blood is on
their hands. Don't blame me just because I was the one who performed
the execution."
The obvious difference is that Pontius Pilate was far more brutal than
Saddam, and the Jews had no government at all.
As far as history goes, Jesus was Jewish. So were ALL his followers
when he was killed. Most Jews had never heard of Jesus. He was an
enemy of the Romans and a threat to them. The Romans were also the
enemies of the Jews and their oppressors. It's possible that some
Jews said what Pilate wanted them to say, and it's possible that the
whole thing was made up. However, there's nothing to suggest that
Jews as a whole wanted Jesus dead or even knew who he was.
You are expecting us to believe that Peter, Paul, and all the others
who were Jews and practicing Judaism told everybody that Jews
(including themselves) were at fault and that the Romans were not.
We know that the three gospels that describe the event were not
written until several hundred years later. We also know that there
were several others that were in common use at the time. Then the
Church decided to put all the books together in the Bible, but they
left out a number of books that were used regularly and included the
ones that made the Jews look bad. Objectively, there's legitimate
room for doubt as to whether the Jews (aside from all the followers of
Jesus) had any involvement, but it's difficult to rule it out
completely. However, it's very unlikely that Pilate cared in the
least bit what the Jews had to say about killing somebody or that he
would have listened. So if some Jews did or did not call for the death
of Jesus (which Christians say was a necessary event called for by God
anyway,) Pilate would have done whatever he wanted to do. And
Christianity still maintains that regardless of this, the event was
part of God's plan so blaming anybody for what God required so that
Jesus could die for the sins of Christians makes no sense.
I BELIEVE that the Anti-defamation League is just making a fuss in hopes of being
portrayed by the Jewish community as a necessary organization that is fighting for the
Jews. But in reality, they make me upset with their childish acts, trying there best to
talk about how the Jews didn't force the hand of Pilot. The ADL thinks if they say it
enough maybe someone will believe it! Instead, its making me insensitive to their causes
and I just see it as a way for them to get free publicity.
The ADL voiced concern that this may lead to anti-Semitism. Your post
is clear evidence that they were right.
The ADL propaganda is wearing thin on me. Its beginning to make me wonder if the Jews are
still following the Talmud and things haven't really changed that much with them after
all....... Are we still the Goy's in the Talmud? Anyone who has studied Jewish
literature knows that the Talmud is a vial and wicked teaching.
You have a rather strange definition of "anybody." You left out any
scholars or people who actually studied the Talmud.
It allows the rape of any
gentile from 3 years old and up, it allows for the murder of Goy's as long as the Jewish
religion can't be put on trial. It teaches that when there is a majority of Jews over the
other religions that it is THEIR DUTY to overcome the Goy's and suppress them, even murder
them.
Anybody who studied the Talmud or studied Judaism is well aware that
your statements are lies. I could give you references that describe
the history of these lies, but I'm assuming that asking you to read an
entire book would be beyond your capability. But for others who are
interested, I'd recommend "The Popes Against the Jews: The Vatican's
Role in the Rise of Modern Anti-Semitism" by David I. Kertzer. It
details the origins of these lies and uses the Vatican's own archives
as sources. Others reading this might want to get it from their
library or go to Amazon.com to read the reviews (not counting the ones
from people who obviously didn't read it, of course.) This book was
well accepted by Jews and Christians alike as a scholarly work.
Now, if the Jews want to start this Anti-Semite stuff they should be prepared to defend
what they have historically believed and teach today. I have written the ADL and of
course, they don't respond. I told them that I believe their intent is to stir the pot so
their support in the Jewish community will increase.
As I said before, they made their case clear and you supported it by
proving them right. Jews have no problem defending what they believe
and what they teach today. They don't have to defend the teaching of
your lies, because they are your lies and not the teachings of the
Jews. They never were.
Anybody who read the Bible knows about the part that says, "Thou shalt
not kill." The other things you mentioned are also clearly prohibited
in the Bible.
Only a fool will say that the Jews
didn't demand Christ crucifixion, and only a fool can put today's Jews on trial for what
happened 2000 years ago.
Only a fool thinks he can win an argument by mere name calling. You
didn't provide irrefutable evidence that the gospels are accurate, and
the fact that they are full of contradictions leads one to believe
that alternative arguments have merit. While they provide a generally
good history of Christianity and the teachings of Jesus, they were
written by men and are not perfect.
BTW, you fellow Christians who say that it was 'my sins who put
them there," are not looking at the total picture here. We are to condemn sin AND any
religion that promotes it. Jesus said if you (they) are not for Him then you (they) are
ENEMIES of his. Not my words but Christ's. These people committed MURDER and they are
judged for it just like we are to be judged for our sins. I'm sick of a few Jews who deny
their race/religion had anything to do with Christ's death and then want us to feel pain
for their trials and tribulations.
Jews don't blame you for their pain because you are Christian. Jews
blame you for their pain because you are a dangerous racist who
spreads lies about Judaism and does not have a clue what Judaism is
all about. You also don't have much of a clue what Christianity is
all about or why most Jews have a great deal of respect for many
modern Christian denominations and vice versa.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Geoman" |
|
| Title: Re: Germany and the residents of the killing towns |
25 Feb 2004 10:34:30 PM |
|
|
"Wai Doan Hsu" <waidoan@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:d31826ae.0402251639.643a29ad@posting.google.com...
"Geoman" <Geomaan@yaaho.com> wrote in message
news:<RsGdnZYK-bK69aHdRVn-gw@adelphia.com>...
After the Germans laid down their weapons, the citizens who lived in the towns where
the
killing camps were doing their atrocities were lined up and forced to walk through
those
camps to see first hand what they ignored to talk about while the murders were going
on.
The entire town was lined up and commanded to view what they ignored for so many
years.
The Germans in those towns were denying that the murders and inhuman treatment was
going
on. And here is the key, some did not believe the stories, some were fearful to take a
stand against it and there were some who supported the murders.
No one can blame todays citizens for what took place then in the 1940's, that was a
different generation, But we must learn from it and not ignore the facts, the Germans
killed many Jews AND CHRISTIANS who stood up to Hitler's rule.
People who study the holocaust need to understand what happened in
context. There are those who insist on pointing out that Christians
were killed, so they can have a "so what" attitude toward the Jews as
if it were not significant.
Hitler did NOT target Christians as a whole, nor was it ever his goal
to wipe out Christians as a group or wipe out Christianity. When
Hitler started rounding up Jews, Christians saw it as nothing
different from what they had seen before; rounding up of Jews and
forcing them into ghettos to live in inhumane conditions had been
commonplace for centuries, as was the teaching of hatred toward Jews.
Out of 11 million Jews estimated to have been in Germany before WWII,
about 6 million were killed. Hitler tried to wipe Jews off the face
of the earth and nearly succeeded. He wanted to do the same with
Gypsys, homosexuals, the mentally ill, and other groups, but it was
never his goal to do that to Christians.
I agree with you on that. However, the way history is being taught one would think that
the only ones gased were Jews, and this is simply not true.
The Jews who were killed were NOT killed for standing up to Hitler.
They were NOT killed for specific actions or even beliefs. They were
killed because they were blamed for things that had nothing to do with
them.
Partially true. History records that even the Jewish population was complaining about the
control and grip on Germany that the Jewish elite had upon the economy of Germany.
NOW, this is important, when in Washington DC, the holocaust museum stresses that idea
that if they don't emphasis this historical fact that it could happen over again. SO,
WITH
THEIR OWN LOGIC I submit the following.
Today, The Passion is opened around the world. Many Jews are saying, "THIS DIDN'T
HAPPEN!
WE DIDN'T DO THAT!" No one is saying that today's generation of Jews murdered Christ,
but
it is INSULTING to me for them to deny the fact that they DID murder Christ! Why is it
that the Jews are so adamant to say that the terrible things Hitler did is important
to
review but the murder of Christ is less important? They are guilty of the very things
that they claim the Germans are guilty of!
The Jews are NOT holding all Germans responsible for the holocaust.
They are NOT claiming that Germans of today (with the exception of
those who were alive back then and committing war crimes) are
responsible. So if you want to use the same logic, that's the logic
you have to use. By that logic, Jews today have nothing to do with the
death of Jesus no matter what happened back then.
I never said they did, on the contrary, I said "No one can blame todays citizens for what
took place then in the 1940's, that was a
different generation," However, the text was about a sect of the Jewish community called
the ADL. They are no different than Jessy Jackson. Jackson depends on racisim for support
from the blacks. If there isn't racism, get on TV and stir the pot. The ADL is doing the
very same thing, stirring the pot to create a cause and a reason for Jews to think that
they are champions of a great cause. The ADL is no different than J.Jackson in my opinion.
As for Jews denying that any Jews were involved, we need to look at
history. Jews did not control the area at the time. It had been taken
over by the Romans who ruled it with an iron fist. Pontius Pilate was
considered very brutal even by Roman standards. Jews had no government
and had no power to make such decisions.
The Jews had more power then than what you give credit too. Pilot, if he had so much power
why did he even offer the Jews Barabus? He was affraid of an insurrection and he caved
into the demands of the Jews.The scriptures teach in Mathew 27:16 "...the governor was
accustomed to release for the CROWD any one prisioner whom they wanted.....Pilot said to
them, Whom do you want me to release for you: Barabbas, or Jesus whis is called Christ,
for Pilot knew that it was out of envy that they had delivered him up. NOTICE that the
JEWS delievered Christ up. ALSO, it wasn't the Roman Soldiers that arrested Jesus. It was
the Temple guards. Matthew 26:47 "While he was till speaking, Judas came, one of the
twelve, and with him a GREAT CROWD with swords and clus, form the chief priest and the
elders of the people....... "" Seems your views don't alling very well with scriptures.
I thought you said the Jews werent in control? They arrest Jesus, NOT THE ROMANS but the
chief priests and crowds.
Mark 14:1 "And the chief priests and scribes were seeking how to arrest him by stealth
and kill him..." Your statments again prove to be in error. The Jewish leaders were
wicked, and the scriptures say that of all the chief priest there was only ONE who argued
in the defence of Jesus.
Mark 14:47 says that Peter cut the ear off of a high priests guard, NOT A ROMAN SOLDIER,
and you say they didn't have power?
What if something similar happened now? Suppose Saddam Hussein had put
somebody to death. Suppose it was an enemy of his regime, and he
hated that person even more for being Jewish. If Saddam had the
person executed, how credible would you find the following statement?
"Yes, I put him to death, but you can't blame me, really. It's not
actually my fault at all. I asked Israel what to do with him and they
told me to kill him. I didn't really want to, but the blood is on
their hands. Don't blame me just because I was the one who performed
the execution."
In light of your misrepresentations of historical facts listed above, I don't have any
idea what that last paragraph is saying.
The obvious difference is that Pontius Pilate was far more brutal than
Saddam, and the Jews had no government at all.
Wow, I think the quoted scriptures show that the Jewish High Priests were more brutal than
Saddam! Pilot offered a criminial to them in place of Jesus. The High Priests and the
CROWD chose to MURDER Jesus. Don't come here without some facts. You havent provided a
single historical fact or scripture verse. Everything you have stated I have proven a
misrepresentation with the written text. REad Matthew 26:57 about the wonderful treatment
the High Priest gave Jesus before turning him over to Pilot, hitting him while blind
folded and asking him who hit him, and spitting on him. Great bunch of people they were.
The type I would want my family to sit under on the Sabboth and learn about the love of
God.
As far as history goes, Jesus was Jewish. So were ALL his followers
when he was killed.
Nope, there were others who were NOT Jewish, the Cannaanite woman in Matthew 15:21-28.
Most Jews had never heard of Jesus
Wrong again. The Cannanite woman had to fight her way through the crowd to get to Jesus!
Have you forgot that at the BEGINING of his ministry he delivered the Sermon on the Mount
and fed over 5000 people !! Come on, read your bible and get your facts straight! Mark
states that the High Priests wanted to arrest him by stealth because they didn't want the
people to riot against them. The scriptures says that his fame went all througout Judea.
Again, you state things you know nothing about. I'm begining to think your with the ADL
and here for their cause to create a purpose for their existance.
He was an
enemy of the Romans and a threat to them.
WRONG WRONG WRONG!!! If he was an enemy of Rome then why did Pilot say in Matthew 27:23
after the crowd demanded him to be crucified, "Why should I crucify him, what evil has he
done?" This was a Roman court, and the Roman representative stated that he could not find
anything wrong with Jesus. You have really made yourself out to look silly with your post,
havent you................
The Romans were also the
enemies of the Jews and their oppressors. It's possible that some
Jews said what Pilate wanted them to say, and it's possible that the
whole thing was made up. However, there's nothing to suggest that
Jews as a whole wanted Jesus dead or even knew who he was.
Answered previously, if you can't understand what the word crowd is, and that his fame
went all throuout Judea, then take a course and become educated and then come back for a
discussion.
You are expecting us to believe that Peter, Paul, and all the others
who were Jews and practicing Judaism told everybody that Jews
(including themselves) were at fault and that the Romans were not.
Yep, read your bible, it mentions this very thing. I'll give you a hint, its talked about
as a vine and branch.
This is getting tired, my children know more about history than you do.
We know that the three gospels that describe the event were not
written until several hundred years later.
NO WE DONT KNOW THIS !! You either are a liar or very very ignorant..
Jesus was crucified around 30 AD
Matthew was written Pre 70AD
Mark 65-70AD
Luke 62 AD
John 90 AD,
Pauls writtings were before he died in 67 Ad.
I hate to say this, but I have never come across anyone before so wrong in every area of
their post. It hurts me to know that you are trusting your eteranal judgement with God
with such misinformation and totally off the wall stuff.
We also know that there
were several others that were in common use at the time. Then the
Church decided to put all the books together in the Bible, but they
left out a number of books that were used regularly and included the
ones that made the Jews look bad. Objectively, there's legitimate
room for doubt as to whether the Jews (aside from all the followers of
Jesus) had any involvement, but it's difficult to rule it out
completely.
Give me a break, This isn't wven worth answering.
However, it's very unlikely that Pilate cared in the
least bit what the Jews had to say about killing somebody or that he
would have listened.
Well, I posted the facts, all you have is "your opinoin' and since you have been
completely wrong on EVERY point, I don't have much respect for your opinion, let alone
trust it for an answer to God when I stand before him
So if some Jews did or did not call for the death
of Jesus (which Christians say was a necessary event called for by God
anyway,) Pilate would have done whatever he wanted to do. And
Christianity still maintains that regardless of this, the event was
part of God's plan so blaming anybody for what God required so that
Jesus could die for the sins of Christians makes no sense.
I BELIEVE that the Anti-defamation League is just making a fuss in hopes of being
portrayed by the Jewish community as a necessary organization that is fighting for the
Jews. But in reality, they make me upset with their childish acts, trying there best
to
talk about how the Jews didn't force the hand of Pilot. The ADL thinks if they say it
enough maybe someone will believe it! Instead, its making me insensitive to their
causes
and I just see it as a way for them to get free publicity.
The ADL voiced concern that this may lead to anti-Semitism. Your post
is clear evidence that they were right.
I guess then that Rabbis like the Orthodox Jewish writer David Klinghoffer, who wrote the
new book about the faults of HIS Jewish religion is wrong too? He stated in "Why the Jews
Rejected Christ" that """The Talmudic text seems clear. Jesus clashed with Jewish
leaders, debating them on the meaning of their laws. They hated him. Many wanted him
dead."""
This was a quote from a Jewish Rabbi buddy, stop showing to everyone that you are a
completely wrong in every issue.
Alfred Edersheime, the worlds leading expert on Jewish vs. Christian doctrine, and a
fundamentalist Rabbi wrote many books about the subject that contradicts all you are
saying. The ADL would be against this practicing Jew today. In the Life and Times of Jesus
the Messiah, Alfred states in his 1597 page book so many times that it was the Jewish
religious leaders who plotted to kill Jesus, and this was because he went against the the
teachings of the Talmud. Once again, I think your the ADL in disquise.
The ADL propaganda is wearing thin on me. Its beginning to make me wonder if the Jews
are
still following the Talmud and things haven't really changed that much with them after
all....... Are we still the Goy's in the Talmud? Anyone who has studied Jewish
literature knows that the Talmud is a vial and wicked teaching.
You have a rather strange definition of "anybody." You left out any
scholars or people who actually studied the Talmud.
Ah, so your true colors are showing through. Your of Jewish persuation. Fiqures you would
defend the Talmud, then my assumption is correct, and so is Edersheims, not much has
changed in the Jewish world of religion.
It allows the rape of any
gentile from 3 years old and up, it allows for the murder of Goy's as long as the
Jewish
religion can't be put on trial. It teaches that when there is a majority of Jews over
the
other religions that it is THEIR DUTY to overcome the Goy's and suppress them, even
murder
them.
Anybody who studied the Talmud or studied Judaism is well aware that
your statements are lies. I could give you references that describe
the history of these lies, but I'm assuming that asking you to read an
entire book would be beyond your capability.
The readers will determine who is lying. Not one single thing you presented was truth,
every point was proven to be false. Go ahead, proclaim your knowledge, but next time
present some facts that can't be contradicted with historic facts. I lost count as to the
number of errors and distortions you have made. You couldn't even get the dates of the
Gospels correct! Then you say I don't read? :-) I really am honestly smiling right now,
its kind of funny how you came here all proud and arrogant and NOT A SINGLE THING YOU SAID
was correct! :-)
But for others who are
interested, I'd recommend "The Popes Against the Jews: The Vatican's
Role in the Rise of Modern Anti-Semitism" by David I. Kertzer. It
details the origins of these lies and uses the Vatican's own archives
as sources. Others reading this might want to get it from their
library or go to Amazon.com to read the reviews (not counting the ones
from people who obviously didn't read it, of course.) This book was
well accepted by Jews and Christians alike as a scholarly work.
Now, if the Jews want to start this Anti-Semite stuff they should be prepared to
defend
what they have historically believed and teach today. I have written the ADL and of
course, they don't respond. I told them that I believe their intent is to stir the pot
so
their support in the Jewish community will increase.
As I said before, they made their case clear and you supported it by
proving them right. Jews have no problem defending what they believe
and what they teach today. They don't have to defend the teaching of
your lies, because they are your lies and not the teachings of the
Jews. They never were.
Oh really. Well now lets see, I will try next week to start in on the Talmud. It would be
good for the Christians and others to see exactly what you say it doesnt say. I love a
challenge. I bet this is going to be good after reading your mistakes listed above.
Anybody who read the Bible knows about the part that says, "Thou shalt
not kill." The other things you mentioned are also clearly prohibited
in the Bible.
Its evident you never read the bible, you were wrong on every issue you made above. Even
the dates :-)
Only a fool will say that the Jews
didn't demand Christ crucifixion, and only a fool can put today's Jews on trial for
what
happened 2000 years ago.
Only a fool thinks he can win an argument by mere name calling. You
didn't provide irrefutable evidence that the gospels are accurate,
OH HERE IT COMES!!! You come here as an expert, and misstated EVERY POINT above, saying
the gospels say this and that, but in reality YOU DON"T EVEN BELIVE IN THEM!!! What a
hypocrite and liar you are. You stated EVERYBODY KNOWS that the three gospels were written
hundreds of years after the crucifixtion. You are stating this as a fact. Then you say
that you can't rely upon the gospels! You have proven your a deciever and your only reason
coming here is because my post has hit a nerve in your Jewish pride.
and
the fact that they are full of contradictions leads one to believe
that alternative arguments have merit.
Blah blah blah.......... a Jew who never read the New Testament saying there are
contradictions. And earlier he says I havent read anything. Your really exposing yourself
to be the son of Satan, for he is the father of lies.
While they provide a generally
good history of Christianity and the teachings of Jesus, they were
written by men and are not perfect.
BTW, you fellow Christians who say that it was 'my sins who put
them there," are not looking at the total picture here. We are to condemn sin AND any
religion that promotes it. Jesus said if you (they) are not for Him then you (they)
are
ENEMIES of his. Not my words but Christ's. These people committed MURDER and they are
judged for it just like we are to be judged for our sins. I'm sick of a few Jews who
deny
their race/religion had anything to do with Christ's death and then want us to feel
pain
for their trials and tribulations.
Jews don't blame you for their pain because you are Christian. Jews
blame you for their pain because you are a dangerous racist who
spreads lies about Judaism and does not have a clue what Judaism is
all about.
Funny, I read Jewish authors, went to a Jewish school, studied Jewish customes, worship a
Jew named Jesus which you say is a liar. Yep, Jesus said he was the Son of God, you say he
isn't. You must be an anti-semite because you hate Jesus.
Also, I believe I know more about Judaism than you do. It is evident you know nothing
about history, just read your errors above.
You also don't have much of a clue what Christianity is
all about or why most Jews have a great deal of respect for many
modern Christian denominations and vice versa.
Yep, typical Jewish whining, if you say one thing about a Jew your an anti-Semite and you
don't know about the customs or religion and your not a good Christian.. Lets all have a
pity party for this guy, he's so in need of acceptance, everybody who says anything
against their religion or their historical murder of the Christ and we become the great
persecutors of the Jews. I really feel sorry for you. You think I'm an anti-Semite? Fine,
go for it, believe what you want. When we stand before the Lord PLEASE ask him to point me
out in the crowd and ask him to tell you the truth about me, ask him if it isn't true that
I'm an anti-Semite. Ask him how many times I prayed for the Jews and my Jewish friends and
how many times I prayed for Israel. Lets make a pact right now, when we both stand before
all mighty G*d ( I'll respect your limitations to say or type the word) but as I was
saying, when we both stand before the Lord, PLEASE ask him before he judges us if I hate
Jews, Ok? Then, after that it will be revealed if you loved or hated Jesus. He said that
if you don't love him you are his enemy. Man, the heat is on now...... go ahead, believe
the stuff you think is right, but in the end every knee shall bow and every tongue shall
confess that Jesus Chris is Lord.
Amen
Later.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Geoman" |
|
| Title: Re: Germany and the residents of the killing towns |
26 Feb 2004 08:08:03 AM |
|
|
Hm, Wai Doan Hsu, I've done some research and it seems that you are some kind of Newsgroup
cop.
Interesting that you reply to me was canned copy in EXACT words on other replies on MANY
newsgroups. Anytime someone mentioned the ADL, Holocaust or anything about the Jews, there
you are pasting replies. This goes back to 2002 on about 50 newsgroups, Asian, Black,
homosexual, racist, guns, racing, Jewish, Baptist, Religion, atheist, Bible, believers,
automotive you name the newsgroup and you copied and pasted the same reply and other times
the subject was always in defense to a post about Jews or the ADL. . I believe it was well
over 50 places where you tried to place your influence.
So, if you aren't going to be 'real' and only copy and paste from someone else's work, I
refuse to discuss with you anything. Your a fraud, and your magical way of replying to so
many that mention the ADL settles the thought in my mind that you are working for the Anti
Defamation League or some other Jewish group. It was in the Los Angelos Times that the ADL
is very involved in a computer program that filters anything on the net that is 'hate'
against the ADL or Jews. This article states that you and the ADL are very aggressive in
stopping free speech. Your reply to me was flavored all through it that you thought my
post was anti-semetic. It seems that the ADL sets themselves out to be judge and jury and
the constitution is second. The ADL was investigated by the FBI for working with the mob
in California and actually spying on anyone who mentioned anything against Jews. You are
doing the same thing on the net.
In closing, I stand with my post, the Jews DID have crowds, they did force the hand of
Pilot, Pilot did not find anything wrong with Jesus and gave the Jews the chance to free
him. I have also concluded after conversing with you that the Jews religion is no
different than that day. You have been deceptive and manipulative, exactly like those who
followed the Talmud and Mishna back in Christ's days.
"Geoman" <Geomaan@yaaho.com> wrote in message news:QLCdnfVxiK3T6qDdRVn-jw@adelphia.com...
"Wai Doan Hsu" <waidoan@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:d31826ae.0402251639.643a29ad@posting.google.com...
"Geoman" <Geomaan@yaaho.com> wrote in message
news:<RsGdnZYK-bK69aHdRVn-gw@adelphia.com>...
After the Germans laid down their weapons, the citizens who lived in the towns where
the
killing camps were doing their atrocities were lined up and forced to walk through
those
camps to see first hand what they ignored to talk about while the murders were going
on.
The entire town was lined up and commanded to view what they ignored for so many
years.
The Germans in those towns were denying that the murders and inhuman treatment was
going
on. And here is the key, some did not believe the stories, some were fearful to take
a
stand against it and there were some who supported the murders.
No one can blame todays citizens for what took place then in the 1940's, that was a
different generation, But we must learn from it and not ignore the facts, the
Germans
killed many Jews AND CHRISTIANS who stood up to Hitler's rule.
People who study the holocaust need to understand what happened in
context. There are those who insist on pointing out that Christians
were killed, so they can have a "so what" attitude toward the Jews as
if it were not significant.
Hitler did NOT target Christians as a whole, nor was it ever his goal
to wipe out Christians as a group or wipe out Christianity. When
Hitler started rounding up Jews, Christians saw it as nothing
different from what they had seen before; rounding up of Jews and
forcing them into ghettos to live in inhumane conditions had been
commonplace for centuries, as was the teaching of hatred toward Jews.
Out of 11 million Jews estimated to have been in Germany before WWII,
about 6 million were killed. Hitler tried to wipe Jews off the face
of the earth and nearly succeeded. He wanted to do the same with
Gypsys, homosexuals, the mentally ill, and other groups, but it was
never his goal to do that to Christians.
I agree with you on that. However, the way history is being taught one would think that
the only ones gased were Jews, and this is simply not true.
The Jews who were killed were NOT killed for standing up to Hitler.
They were NOT killed for specific actions or even beliefs. They were
killed because they were blamed for things that had nothing to do with
them.
Partially true. History records that even the Jewish population was complaining about
the
control and grip on Germany that the Jewish elite had upon the economy of Germany.
NOW, this is important, when in Washington DC, the holocaust museum stresses that
idea
that if they don't emphasis this historical fact that it could happen over again.
SO,
WITH
THEIR OWN LOGIC I submit the following.
Today, The Passion is opened around the world. Many Jews are saying, "THIS DIDN'T
HAPPEN!
WE DIDN'T DO THAT!" No one is saying that today's generation of Jews murdered
Christ,
but
it is INSULTING to me for them to deny the fact that they DID murder Christ! Why is
it
that the Jews are so adamant to say that the terrible things Hitler did is important
to
review but the murder of Christ is less important? They are guilty of the very
things
that they claim the Germans are guilty of!
The Jews are NOT holding all Germans responsible for the holocaust.
They are NOT claiming that Germans of today (with the exception of
those who were alive back then and committing war crimes) are
responsible. So if you want to use the same logic, that's the logic
you have to use. By that logic, Jews today have nothing to do with the
death of Jesus no matter what happened back then.
I never said they did, on the contrary, I said "No one can blame todays citizens for
what
took place then in the 1940's, that was a
different generation," However, the text was about a sect of the Jewish community called
the ADL. They are no different than Jessy Jackson. Jackson depends on racisim for
support
from the blacks. If there isn't racism, get on TV and stir the pot. The ADL is doing the
very same thing, stirring the pot to create a cause and a reason for Jews to think that
they are champions of a great cause. The ADL is no different than J.Jackson in my
opinion.
As for Jews denying that any Jews were involved, we need to look at
history. Jews did not control the area at the time. It had been taken
over by the Romans who ruled it with an iron fist. Pontius Pilate was
considered very brutal even by Roman standards. Jews had no government
and had no power to make such decisions.
The Jews had more power then than what you give credit too. Pilot, if he had so much
power
why did he even offer the Jews Barabus? He was affraid of an insurrection and he caved
into the demands of the Jews.The scriptures teach in Mathew 27:16 "...the governor was
accustomed to release for the CROWD any one prisioner whom they wanted.....Pilot said to
them, Whom do you want me to release for you: Barabbas, or Jesus whis is called Christ,
for Pilot knew that it was out of envy that they had delivered him up. NOTICE that the
JEWS delievered Christ up. ALSO, it wasn't the Roman Soldiers that arrested Jesus. It
was
the Temple guards. Matthew 26:47 "While he was till speaking, Judas came, one of the
twelve, and with him a GREAT CROWD with swords and clus, form the chief priest and the
elders of the people....... "" Seems your views don't alling very well with
scriptures.
I thought you said the Jews werent in control? They arrest Jesus, NOT THE ROMANS but the
chief priests and crowds.
Mark 14:1 "And the chief priests and scribes were seeking how to arrest him by stealth
and kill him..." Your statments again prove to be in error. The Jewish leaders were
wicked, and the scriptures say that of all the chief priest there was only ONE who
argued
in the defence of Jesus.
Mark 14:47 says that Peter cut the ear off of a high priests guard, NOT A ROMAN SOLDIER,
and you say they didn't have power?
What if something similar happened now? Suppose Saddam Hussein had put
somebody to death. Suppose it was an enemy of his regime, and he
hated that person even more for being Jewish. If Saddam had the
person executed, how credible would you find the following statement?
"Yes, I put him to death, but you can't blame me, really. It's not
actually my fault at all. I asked Israel what to do with him and they
told me to kill him. I didn't really want to, but the blood is on
their hands. Don't blame me just because I was the one who performed
the execution."
In light of your misrepresentations of historical facts listed above, I don't have any
idea what that last paragraph is saying.
The obvious difference is that Pontius Pilate was far more brutal than
Saddam, and the Jews had no government at all.
Wow, I think the quoted scriptures show that the Jewish High Priests were more brutal
than
Saddam! Pilot offered a criminial to them in place of Jesus. The High Priests and the
CROWD chose to MURDER Jesus. Don't come here without some facts. You havent provided a
single historical fact or scripture verse. Everything you have stated I have proven a
misrepresentation with the written text. REad Matthew 26:57 about the wonderful
treatment
the High Priest gave Jesus before turning him over to Pilot, hitting him while blind
folded and asking him who hit him, and spitting on him. Great bunch of people they were.
The type I would want my family to sit under on the Sabboth and learn about the love of
God.
As far as history goes, Jesus was Jewish. So were ALL his followers
when he was killed.
Nope, there were others who were NOT Jewish, the Cannaanite woman in Matthew 15:21-28.
Most Jews had never heard of Jesus
Wrong again. The Cannanite woman had to fight her way through the crowd to get to Jesus!
Have you forgot that at the BEGINING of his ministry he delivered the Sermon on the
Mount
and fed over 5000 people !! Come on, read your bible and get your facts straight! Mark
states that the High Priests wanted to arrest him by stealth because they didn't want
the
people to riot against them. The scriptures says that his fame went all througout Judea.
Again, you state things you know nothing about. I'm begining to think your with the ADL
and here for their cause to create a purpose for their existance.
He was an
enemy of the Romans and a threat to them.
WRONG WRONG WRONG!!! If he was an enemy of Rome then why did Pilot say in Matthew 27:23
after the crowd demanded him to be crucified, "Why should I crucify him, what evil has
he
done?" This was a Roman court, and the Roman representative stated that he could not
find
anything wrong with Jesus. You have really made yourself out to look silly with your
post,
havent you................
The Romans were also the
enemies of the Jews and their oppressors. It's possible that some
Jews said what Pilate wanted them to say, and it's possible that the
whole thing was made up. However, there's nothing to suggest that
Jews as a whole wanted Jesus dead or even knew who he was.
Answered previously, if you can't understand what the word crowd is, and that his fame
went all throuout Judea, then take a course and become educated and then come back for a
discussion.
You are expecting us to believe that Peter, Paul, and all the others
who were Jews and practicing Judaism told everybody that Jews
(including themselves) were at fault and that the Romans were not.
Yep, read your bible, it mentions this very thing. I'll give you a hint, its talked
about
as a vine and branch.
This is getting tired, my children know more about history than you do.
We know that the three gospels that describe the event were not
written until several hundred years later.
NO WE DONT KNOW THIS !! You either are a liar or very very ignorant..
Jesus was crucified around 30 AD
Matthew was written Pre 70AD
Mark 65-70AD
Luke 62 AD
John 90 AD,
Pauls writtings were before he died in 67 Ad.
I hate to say this, but I have never come across anyone before so wrong in every area of
their post. It hurts me to know that you are trusting your eteranal judgement with God
with such misinformation and totally off the wall stuff.
We also know that there
were several others that were in common use at the time. Then the
Church decided to put all the books together in the Bible, but they
left out a number of books that were used regularly and included the
ones that made the Jews look bad. Objectively, there's legitimate
room for doubt as to whether the Jews (aside from all the followers of
Jesus) had any involvement, but it's difficult to rule it out
completely.
Give me a break, This isn't wven worth answering.
However, it's very unlikely that Pilate cared in the
least bit what the Jews had to say about killing somebody or that he
would have listened.
Well, I posted the facts, all you have is "your opinoin' and since you have been
completely wrong on EVERY point, I don't have much respect for your opinion, let alone
trust it for an answer to God when I stand before him
So if some Jews did or did not call for the death
of Jesus (which Christians say was a necessary event called for by God
anyway,) Pilate would have done whatever he wanted to do. And
Christianity still maintains that regardless of this, the event was
part of God's plan so blaming anybody for what God required so that
Jesus could die for the sins of Christians makes no sense.
I BELIEVE that the Anti-defamation League is just making a fuss in hopes of being
portrayed by the Jewish community as a necessary organization that is fighting for
the
Jews. But in reality, they make me upset with their childish acts, trying there best
to
talk about how the Jews didn't force the hand of Pilot. The ADL thinks if they say
it
enough maybe someone will believe it! Instead, its making me insensitive to their
causes
and I just see it as a way for them to get free publicity.
The ADL voiced concern that this may lead to anti-Semitism. Your post
is clear evidence that they were right.
I guess then that Rabbis like the Orthodox Jewish writer David Klinghoffer, who wrote
the
new book about the faults of HIS Jewish religion is wrong too? He stated in "Why the
Jews
Rejected Christ" that """The Talmudic text seems clear. Jesus clashed with Jewish
leaders, debating them on the meaning of their laws. They hated him. Many wanted him
dead."""
This was a quote from a Jewish Rabbi buddy, stop showing to everyone that you are a
completely wrong in every issue.
Alfred Edersheime, the worlds leading expert on Jewish vs. Christian doctrine, and a
fundamentalist Rabbi wrote many books about the subject that contradicts all you are
saying. The ADL would be against this practicing Jew today. In the Life and Times of
Jesus
the Messiah, Alfred states in his 1597 page book so many times that it was the Jewish
religious leaders who plotted to kill Jesus, and this was because he went against the
the
teachings of the Talmud. Once again, I think your the ADL in disquise.
The ADL propaganda is wearing thin on me. Its beginning to make me wonder if the
Jews
are
still following the Talmud and things haven't really changed that much with them
after
all....... Are we still the Goy's in the Talmud? Anyone who has studied Jewish
literature knows that the Talmud is a vial and wicked teaching.
You have a rather strange definition of "anybody." You left out any
scholars or people who actually studied the Talmud.
Ah, so your true colors are showing through. Your of Jewish persuation. Fiqures you
would
defend the Talmud, then my assumption is correct, and so is Edersheims, not much has
changed in the Jewish world of religion.
It allows the rape of any
gentile from 3 years old and up, it allows for the murder of Goy's as long as the
Jewish
religion can't be put on trial. It teaches that when there is a majority of Jews
over
the
other religions that it is THEIR DUTY to overcome the Goy's and suppress them, even
murder
them.
Anybody who studied the Talmud or studied Judaism is well aware that
your statements are lies. I could give you references that describe
the history of these lies, but I'm assuming that asking you to read an
entire book would be beyond your capability.
The readers will determine who is lying. Not one single thing you presented was truth,
every point was proven to be false. Go ahead, proclaim your knowledge, but next time
present some facts that can't be contradicted with historic facts. I lost count as to
the
number of errors and distortions you have made. You couldn't even get the dates of the
Gospels correct! Then you say I don't read? :-) I really am honestly smiling right now,
its kind of funny how you came here all proud and arrogant and NOT A SINGLE THING YOU
SAID
was correct! :-)
But for others who are
interested, I'd recommend "The Popes Against the Jews: The Vatican's
Role in the Rise of Modern Anti-Semitism" by David I. Kertzer. It
details the origins of these lies and uses the Vatican's own archives
as sources. Others reading this might want to get it from their
library or go to Amazon.com to read the reviews (not counting the ones
from people who obviously didn't read it, of course.) This book was
well accepted by Jews and Christians alike as a scholarly work.
Now, if the Jews want to start this Anti-Semite stuff they should be prepared to
defend
what they have historically believed and teach today. I have written the ADL and of
course, they don't respond. I told them that I believe their intent is to stir the
pot
so
their support in the Jewish community will increase.
As I said before, they made their case clear and you supported it by
proving them right. Jews have no problem defending what they believe
and what they teach today. They don't have to defend the teaching of
your lies, because they are your lies and not the teachings of the
Jews. They never were.
Oh really. Well now lets see, I will try next week to start in on the Talmud. It would
be
good for the Christians and others to see exactly what you say it doesnt say. I love a
challenge. I bet this is going to be good after reading your mistakes listed above.
Anybody who read the Bible knows about the part that says, "Thou shalt
not kill." The other things you mentioned are also clearly prohibited
in the Bible.
Its evident you never read the bible, you were wrong on every issue you made above. Even
the dates :-)
Only a fool will say that the Jews
didn't demand Christ crucifixion, and only a fool can put today's Jews on trial for
what
happened 2000 years ago.
Only a fool thinks he can win an argument by mere name calling. You
didn't provide irrefutable evidence that the gospels are accurate,
OH HERE IT COMES!!! You come here as an expert, and misstated EVERY POINT above, saying
the gospels say this and that, but in reality YOU DON"T EVEN BELIVE IN THEM!!! What a
hypocrite and liar you are. You stated EVERYBODY KNOWS that the three gospels were
written
hundreds of years after the crucifixtion. You are stating this as a fact. Then you say
that you can't rely upon the gospels! You have proven your a deciever and your only
reason
coming here is because my post has hit a nerve in your Jewish pride.
and
the fact that they are full of contradictions leads one to believe
that alternative arguments have merit.
Blah blah blah.......... a Jew who never read the New Testament saying there are
contradictions. And earlier he says I havent read anything. Your really exposing
yourself
to be the son of Satan, for he is the father of lies.
While they provide a generally
good history of Christianity and the teachings of Jesus, they were
written by men and are not perfect.
BTW, you fellow Christians who say that it was 'my sins who put
them there," are not looking at the total picture here. We are to condemn sin AND
any
religion that promotes it. Jesus said if you (they) are not for Him then you (they)
are
ENEMIES of his. Not my words but Christ's. These people committed MURDER and they
are
judged for it just like we are to be judged for our sins. I'm sick of a few Jews who
deny
their race/religion had anything to do with Christ's death and then want us to feel
pain
for their trials and tribulations.
Jews don't blame you for their pain because you are Christian. Jews
blame you for their pain because you are a dangerous racist who
spreads lies about Judaism and does not have a clue what Judaism is
all about.
Funny, I read Jewish authors, went to a Jewish school, studied Jewish customes, worship
a
Jew named Jesus which you say is a liar. Yep, Jesus said he was the Son of God, you say
he
isn't. You must be an anti-semite because you hate Jesus.
Also, I believe I know more about Judaism than you do. It is evident you know nothing
about history, just read your errors above.
You also don't have much of a clue what Christianity is
all about or why most Jews have a great deal of respect for many
modern Christian denominations and vice versa.
Yep, typical Jewish whining, if you say one thing about a Jew your an anti-Semite and
you
don't know about the customs or religion and your not a good Christian.. Lets all have a
pity party for this guy, he's so in need of acceptance, everybody who says anything
against their religion or their historical murder of the Christ and we become the great
persecutors of the Jews. I really feel sorry for you. You think I'm an anti-Semite?
Fine,
go for it, believe what you want. When we stand before the Lord PLEASE ask him to point
me
out in the crowd and ask him to tell you the truth about me, ask him if it isn't true
that
I'm an anti-Semite. Ask him how many times I prayed for the Jews and my Jewish friends
and
how many times I prayed for Israel. Lets make a pact right now, when we both stand
before
all mighty G*d ( I'll respect your limitations to say or type the word) but as I was
saying, when we both stand before the Lord, PLEASE ask him before he judges us if I hate
Jews, Ok? Then, after that it will be revealed if you loved or hated Jesus. He said
that
if you don't love him you are his enemy. Man, the heat is on now...... go ahead, believe
the stuff you think is right, but in the end every knee shall bow and every tongue shall
confess that Jesus Chris is Lord.
Amen
Later.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Wai Doan Hsu" |
|
| Title: Re: Germany and the residents of the killing towns |
01 Mar 2004 12:27:34 PM |
|
|
"Geoman" <Geomaan@yho.com> wrote in message news:<4PCdnUNyQagmYKDdRVn-uA@adelphia.com>...
Hm, Wai Doan Hsu, I've done some research and it seems that you are some kind of Newsgroup
cop.
Interesting that you reply to me was canned copy in EXACT words on other replies on MANY
newsgroups.
If you think that's the case, then post a link. Anybody here can take
any quote from my posts and search USENET, and will not find any posts
that I made that contain an EXACT copy of what I posted. You made
that up. I may have posted on this topic before, but so did you.
If the only way you can "refute" what I say is by quoting the bible,
when my original post discussed the inconsistencies between biblical
accounts, you have done nothing to further your arguments. I had
already agreed that what you said conflicted with other things, so
posting it adds nothing to your argument.
However, your vehement insistence on injecting racist diatribes into
your posts again proves me right.
On the other hand, if you research any of the points I have made, you
will find reliable and generally accepted sources that verify them.
You gave no source for many of your assertions. I gave a source to
prove many of them wrong. You would not refute my arguments, but
instead chose to ignore many of them completely. I can do the same
thing and say that yours are so ridiculous that it's not worth wasting
my time on them. But in my case, anybody who wishes to check on his
or her own will find that I am right and you are wrong. They can
start with the claim that you made in this post.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Geoman" |
|
| Title: Re: Germany and the residents of the killing towns |
01 Mar 2004 01:11:02 PM |
|
|
http://groups.google.com/groups?q=waidoan%40hotmail.com&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&start=0&sa=N
Compare them, there are MANY places where you said the exact same wording, especially on
the Kosher Tax.
Also, I'm not reading your posts because I have proven you to be a liar already. You said
the Gospels were written HUNDREDS Of years after Jesus died, which I proved is a lie. Why
should I read anything from a liar.
Get your facts straight before coming on the big boards because when you don't you will be
exposed again like you are not.
Also, quit your whining and get some professional help. Your constant posting on the
newsgroups that everyone is Antis shows that you have no self esteem and everyone is out
to get you.
How sad that your history and religious beliefs have to be defended so strongly by you.
This shows a real flaw in your beliefs and shows that you really are a weak person.
Grow up Wai, then come back.
Now, I'm moving on since your first post was proven to be lies, just like your leaders
were that condemned Jesus. You certainly are a carbon copy of them! You distort truth so
well you should be Pharisee.
"Wai Doan Hsu" <waidoan@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:d31826ae.0403011027.7c72c014@posting.google.com...
"Geoman" <Geomaan@yho.com> wrote in message
news:<4PCdnUNyQagmYKDdRVn-uA@adelphia.com>...
Hm, Wai Doan Hsu, I've done some research and it seems that you are some kind of
Newsgroup
cop.
Interesting that you reply to me was canned copy in EXACT words on other replies on
MANY
newsgroups.
If you think that's the case, then post a link. Anybody here can take
any quote from my posts and search USENET, and will not find any posts
that I made that contain an EXACT copy of what I posted. You made
that up. I may have posted on this topic before, but so did you.
If the only way you can "refute" what I say is by quoting the bible,
when my original post discussed the inconsistencies between biblical
accounts, you have done nothing to further your arguments. I had
already agreed that what you said conflicted with other things, so
posting it adds nothing to your argument.
However, your vehement insistence on injecting racist diatribes into
your posts again proves me right.
On the other hand, if you research any of the points I have made, you
will find reliable and generally accepted sources that verify them.
You gave no source for many of your assertions. I gave a source to
prove many of them wrong. You would not refute my arguments, but
instead chose to ignore many of them completely. I can do the same
thing and say that yours are so ridiculous that it's not worth wasting
my time on them. But in my case, anybody who wishes to check on his
or her own will find that I am right and you are wrong. They can
start with the claim that you made in this post.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Wai Doan Hsu" |
|
| Title: Re: Germany and the residents of the killing towns |
02 Mar 2004 08:05:57 PM |
|
|
"Geoman" <Geomaan@yh1o.com> wrote in message news:<evidndhbUr0kF97dRVn-tw@adelphia.com>...
http://groups.google.com/groups?q=waidoan%40hotmail.com&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&start=0&sa=N
Compare them, there are MANY places where you said the exact same wording, especially on
the Kosher Tax.
If you had read those posts, you would know that there's no such thing
as a kosher tax. There were a flurry of posts about it in a short
period of time and I addressed them. I gave sources. Anybody who
looks at posts I made on that subject will find that for the most
part, they were tailored individually to the post in question and did
not have the same wording.
I encourage any reader to click on the link you gave, so that he or
she can see a variety of subjects relating to many different religions
and races and subjects completly unrelated to any of those topics. You
picked a handful of posts from seven months ago that serve well to
show how poorly founded those racist anti-Semetic posts were.
However, if having the same wording in multiple places disproves
something, that would make the New Testament, which is the most widely
published book, the least trusted writing in the history of mankind BY
YOUR LOGIC. However, I suspect most readers would reject your logic on
that one.
Also, I'm not reading your posts because I have proven you to be a liar already.
No you haven't. I asked for sources and you gave none.
You said
the Gospels were written HUNDREDS Of years after Jesus died, which I proved is a lie.
How did you prove that? Even the most conservative estimates place the
authorship between 70 and 140 years after the death of Jesus, and
others place them later. If you can prove that I made an intentionally
false statement to deceive anybody, go ahead and prove it.
Why
should I read anything from a liar.
Was that supposed to be a question? If it is, then why should I read
anything from you? You gave no support for your arguments, but by
repeatingly showing that you are a racist, you are proving my point
over and over again.
Get your facts straight before coming on the big boards because when you don't you will be
exposed again like you are not.
Since that cannot possibly be construed as a decodable English
sentence so I won't even try to figure out what you were trying to
say. Apparently, you didn't try to figure it out either.
Also, quit your whining and get some professional help. Your constant posting on the
newsgroups that everyone is Antis shows that you have no self esteem and everyone is out
to get you.
I'm trying to show that everyone is Antis? I never even heard of the
person. Every post you mentioned was a response to a post such as
yours that was full of attacks based on lies. I asked you for your
sources. I provided sources that disprove what you posted. Your only
defense is, "Maybe he's a Jew so I'll attack him on that." You didn't
point out any of my posts in Asian groups or Buddhist forums because
you know that it would contradict what you are saying. If you can
discern something from where I posted, you would have to assume that I
am a Vietnamese, Korean, Russian, Malaysian Christian who is also
Jewish.
How sad that your history and religious beliefs have to be defended so strongly by you.
This shows a real flaw in your beliefs and shows that you really are a weak person.
It's not a flaw to defend any position. It's a flaw to have a
position that cannot be defended. It's easy to defend Christianity.
It's easy to defend Judaism. It's hard to defend you because your
positions are inconsistent with either, or with almost any other
religion.
Grow up Wai, then come back.
Now, I'm moving on since your first post was proven to be lies, just like your leaders
were that condemned Jesus. You certainly are a carbon copy of them! You distort truth so
well you should be Pharisee.
Again, you did not prove my statements to be lies. You don't have a
clue who my leaders are. Your statements go against established
theological views of the Church.
"Wai Doan Hsu" <waidoan@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:d31826ae.0403011027.7c72c014@posting.google.com...
"Geoman" <Geomaan@yho.com> wrote in message
news:<4PCdnUNyQagmYKDdRVn-uA@adelphia.com>...
Hm, Wai Doan Hsu, I've done some research and it seems that you are some kind of
Newsgroup
cop.
Interesting that you reply to me was canned copy in EXACT words on other replies on
MANY
newsgroups.
If you think that's the case, then post a link. Anybody here can take
any quote from my posts and search USENET, and will not find any posts
that I made that contain an EXACT copy of what I posted. You made
that up. I may have posted on this topic before, but so did you.
If the only way you can "refute" what I say is by quoting the bible,
when my original post discussed the inconsistencies between biblical
accounts, you have done nothing to further your arguments. I had
already agreed that what you said conflicted with other things, so
posting it adds nothing to your argument.
However, your vehement insistence on injecting racist diatribes into
your posts again proves me right.
On the other hand, if you research any of the points I have made, you
will find reliable and generally accepted sources that verify them.
You gave no source for many of your assertions. I gave a source to
prove many of them wrong. You would not refute my arguments, but
instead chose to ignore many of them completely. I can do the same
thing and say that yours are so ridiculous that it's not worth wasting
my time on them. But in my case, anybody who wishes to check on his
or her own will find that I am right and you are wrong. They can
start with the claim that you made in this post.
.
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| User: "Sergio" |
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| Title: Re: Germany and the residents of the killing towns |
25 Feb 2004 05:45:02 AM |
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So let me get this straight.
Because 2000 years ago a few politicians committed a political murder, and
those politicians happened to be jewish (as their victim, btw), you want all
people of that religion today to say : "We did this".
I have a few questions.
First of all, how does this work? In spite of the words of Mr J himself, who
said that people should not be held responsible for the actions of their
parents, how does an entire people become contaminated with one murder?
Why stop at one murder? Does that mean that you and I are responsible for
each and every single murder that happened in Europe and America, ever?
Should we hold you responsible for the death of most of the Indians,
perhaps? Slavery, as well? Witchburnings, perhaps? How about wars, crusades?
My point is: Exactly how far do you want to extend historical guild? And why
should it cover only Jews?
Another thing that bugs me: How can you compare one murder with the attempt
to wipe out all millions of people of one religion? I hope you are not
suggesting that these things are on the same scale?
And lastly: What do you expect? Do you want the Jews to apologize? For what?
Yes, Jews killed Jesus. It's easy, not the same as 'the Jews killed Jesus'.
You can point at no single person alive today and say that he or she was
even remotely involved in those events at all. That person would have to be
over 2000 years old, and that's not possible.
So no person alive today was remotely involved in those events - that means,
in English, that they had nothing to do with it, and that means that noone
can be held accountable for it.
What is it you want? You want them to say "we killed Jesus"? Well, maybe I
should be the one to tell you, but no-one alive today killed Jesus. If you
dispute this, I strongly suggest you find that someone and drag him to
court. Why don't you do that? What do you want?
So I think your point misses me completely. The comparison between the
murder on one man and the murder of an entire people are not the same thing
at all, guild does not ride from parent to child; if it does it's applicable
to all of us, and what do you want?
Gm
"Geoman" <> wrote in message news:RsGdnZYK-bK69aHdRVn-gw@adelphia.com...
After the Germans laid down their weapons, the citizens who lived in the
towns where the
killing camps were doing their atrocities were lined up and forced to walk
through those
camps to see first hand what they ignored to talk about while the murders
were going on.
The entire town was lined up and commanded to view what they ignored for
so many years.
The Germans in those towns were denying that the murders and inhuman
treatment was going
on. And here is the key, some did not believe the stories, some were
fearful to take a
stand against it and there were some who supported the murders.
No one can blame todays citizens for what took place then in the 1940's,
that was a
different generation, But we must learn from it and not ignore the facts,
the Germans
killed many Jews AND CHRISTIANS who stood up to Hitler's rule.
NOW, this is important, when in Washington DC, the holocaust museum
stresses that idea
that if they don't emphasis this historical fact that it could happen over
again. SO, WITH
THEIR OWN LOGIC I submit the following.
Today, The Passion is opened around the world. Many Jews are saying, "THIS
DIDN'T HAPPEN!
WE DIDN'T DO THAT!" No one is saying that today's generation of Jews
murdered Christ, but
it is INSULTING to me for them to deny the fact that they DID murder
Christ! Why is it
that the Jews are so adamant to say that the terrible things Hitler did is
important to
review but the murder of Christ is less important? They are guilty of the
very things
that they claim the Germans are guilty of!
I BELIEVE that the Anti-defamation League is just making a fuss in hopes
of being
portrayed by the Jewish community as a necessary organization that is
fighting for the
Jews. But in reality, they make me upset with their childish acts, trying
there best to
talk about how the Jews didn't force the hand of Pilot. The ADL thinks if
they say it
enough maybe someone will believe it! Instead, its making me insensitive
to their causes
and I just see it as a way for them to get free publicity.
The ADL propaganda is wearing thin on me. Its beginning to make me wonder
if the Jews are
still following the Talmud and things haven't really changed that much
with them after
all....... Are we still the Goy's in the Talmud? Anyone who has studied
Jewish
literature knows that the Talmud is a vial and wicked teaching. It allows
the rape of any
gentile from 3 years old and up, it allows for the murder of Goy's as long
as the Jewish
religion can't be put on trial. It teaches that when there is a majority
of Jews over the
other religions that it is THEIR DUTY to overcome the Goy's and suppress
them, even murder
them.
Now, if the Jews want to start this Anti-Semite stuff they should be
prepared to defend
what they have historically believed and teach today. I have written the
ADL and of
course, they don't respond. I told them that I believe their intent is to
stir the pot so
their support in the Jewish community will increase. Only a fool will say
that the Jews
didn't demand Christ crucifixion, and only a fool can put today's Jews on
trial for what
happened 2000 years ago. BTW, you fellow Christians who say that it was
'my sins who put
them there," are not looking at the total picture here. We are to condemn
sin AND any
religion that promotes it. Jesus said if you (they) are not for Him then
you (they) are
ENEMIES of his. Not my words but Christ's. These people committed MURDER
and they are
judged for it just like we are to be judged for our sins. I'm sick of a
few Jews who deny
their race/religion had anything to do with Christ's death and then want
us to feel pain
for their trials and tribulations.
Rich
.
|
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| User: "Geoman" |
|
| Title: Re: Germany and the residents of the killing towns |
25 Feb 2004 07:46:57 AM |
|
|
Keep to the subject matter. Just about everything you wrote is a deflection from the
subject. Your just like a politician, and please learn to read before you reply to
something, Reply's are within your erroneous post.
"Sergio" <mgerben@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:2V%_b.353$nP5.330@amsnews02.chello.com...
So let me get this straight.
Because 2000 years ago a few politicians committed a political murder, and
those politicians happened to be jewish (as their victim, btw), you want all
people of that religion today to say : "We did this".
They were not polititians. Read your Bible, they were High Priests, the religious leaders.
And yes they should reply that they did do what history records. Did you happen to read
the part where I mentioned MetroGoldwynMeyer admitted it in their Movie in the 1950's
called King Of Kings? Of course you didn't or you would once again have your answer. Read
the entire posts before you reply. If you did, I suggest you take a comprehension class.
I have a few questions.
First of all, how does this work? In spite of the words of Mr J himself, who
said that people should not be held responsible for the actions of their
parents, how does an entire people become contaminated with one murder?
WRONG, the entire race is subject to the actions of their parents. Ever hear of Adam and
Eve ! Secondly, His name is Jesus Christ, not Mr. J. Your disrespect reveals your
complete misinformation concerning scriptures and history.
Why stop at one murder? Does that mean that you and I are responsible for
each and every single murder that happened in Europe and America, ever?
CAN YOU READ?? Let me copy and paste what I origianlly posted and you can try to read it
again.
""" No one can blame todays citizens for what took place then in the 1940's,"" Now, once
again, read a post before you reply.
Should we hold you responsible for the death of most of the Indians,
perhaps? Slavery, as well? Witchburnings, perhaps? How about wars, crusades?
My point is: Exactly how far do you want to extend historical guild? And why
should it cover only Jews?
Answered above, "No one can blame todays citizens for what took place then in the
1940's,"
But not once would I say our ancestory didn't do it. Man, you are something,.Your entire
reply is worthless.
Another thing that bugs me: How can you compare one murder with the attempt
to wipe out all millions of people of one religion? I hope you are not
suggesting that these things are on the same scale?
Yes I am. The difference between you and me is I regard life as being precious, and so
does God. There is NO 11th commandment that says "Thou shalt not kill millions" This is
sad, we have a poster here that thinks murder isn't bad unless it involves millions.
Anytime an anocent is put to death then one is guilty. It doesn't take millions before God
condemns you to hell, only one thought of it. Jesus said, If you hate your brother
(singular) your going to hell.
And lastly: What do you expect? Do you want the Jews to apologize? For what?
Ah, I expect the Jews to not deny the facts any more than the Germans should admit that
their country did kill CHRISTIANS and Jews. Notice I stressed the Christians because I'm
sure that you were not aware of this since you can't even read a text correctly.
Yes, Jews killed Jesus. It's easy, not the same as 'the Jews killed Jesus'.
You can point at no single person alive today and say that he or she was
even remotely involved in those events at all. That person would have to be
over 2000 years old, and that's not possible.
So no person alive today was remotely involved in those events - that means,
in English, that they had nothing to do with it, and that means that noone
can be held accountable for it.
What is it you want? You want them to say "we killed Jesus"? Well, maybe I
should be the one to tell you, but no-one alive today killed Jesus. If you
dispute this, I strongly suggest you find that someone and drag him to
court. Why don't you do that? What do you want?
So I think your point misses me completely. The comparison between the
murder on one man and the murder of an entire people are not the same thing
at all, guild does not ride from parent to child; if it does it's applicable
to all of us, and what do you want?
"As one man sins pass on to the third and fourth generation" Seems the scriptures in
Romans don't agree with you. Unfortunatly, this poster has never read the first chapter of
Romans. I have a suggestion, do a search on Google for Total Depravity and then come back
and discuss the issue more. But before you do, read Romans 1, 2 and 9.
Gm
"Geoman" <> wrote in message news:RsGdnZYK-bK69aHdRVn-gw@adelphia.com...
After the Germans laid down their weapons, the citizens who lived in the
towns where the
killing camps were doing their atrocities were lined up and forced to walk
through those
camps to see first hand what they ignored to talk about while the murders
were going on.
The entire town was lined up and commanded to view what they ignored for
so many years.
The Germans in those towns were denying that the murders and inhuman
treatment was going
on. And here is the key, some did not believe the stories, some were
fearful to take a
stand against it and there were some who supported the murders.
No one can blame todays citizens for what took place then in the 1940's,
that was a
different generation, But we must learn from it and not ignore the facts,
the Germans
killed many Jews AND CHRISTIANS who stood up to Hitler's rule.
NOW, this is important, when in Washington DC, the holocaust museum
stresses that idea
that if they don't emphasis this historical fact that it could happen over
again. SO, WITH
THEIR OWN LOGIC I submit the following.
Today, The Passion is opened around the world. Many Jews are saying, "THIS
DIDN'T HAPPEN!
WE DIDN'T DO THAT!" No one is saying that today's generation of Jews
murdered Christ, but
it is INSULTING to me for them to deny the fact that they DID murder
Christ! Why is it
that the Jews are so adamant to say that the terrible things Hitler did is
important to
review but the murder of Christ is less important? They are guilty of the
very things
that they claim the Germans are guilty of!
I BELIEVE that the Anti-defamation League is just making a fuss in hopes
of being
portrayed by the Jewish community as a necessary organization that is
fighting for the
Jews. But in reality, they make me upset with their childish acts, trying
there best to
talk about how the Jews didn't force the hand of Pilot. The ADL thinks if
they say it
enough maybe someone will believe it! Instead, its making me insensitive
to their causes
and I just see it as a way for them to get free publicity.
The ADL propaganda is wearing thin on me. Its beginning to make me wonder
if the Jews are
still following the Talmud and things haven't really changed that much
with them after
all....... Are we still the Goy's in the Talmud? Anyone who has studied
Jewish
literature knows that the Talmud is a vial and wicked teaching. It allows
the rape of any
gentile from 3 years old and up, it allows for the murder of Goy's as long
as the Jewish
religion can't be put on trial. It teaches that when there is a majority
of Jews over the
other religions that it is THEIR DUTY to overcome the Goy's and suppress
them, even murder
them.
Now, if the Jews want to start this Anti-Semite stuff they should be
prepared to defend
what they have historically believed and teach today. I have written the
ADL and of
course, they don't respond. I told them that I believe their intent is to
stir the pot so
their support in the Jewish community will increase. Only a fool will say
that the Jews
didn't demand Christ crucifixion, and only a fool can put today's Jews on
trial for what
happened 2000 years ago. BTW, you fellow Christians who say that it was
'my sins who put
them there," are not looking at the total picture here. We are to condemn
sin AND any
religion that promotes it. Jesus said if you (they) are not for Him then
you (they) are
ENEMIES of his. Not my words but Christ's. These people committed MURDER
and they are
judged for it just like we are to be judged for our sins. I'm sick of a
few Jews who deny
their race/religion had anything to do with Christ's death and then want
us to feel pain
for their trials and tribulations.
Rich
.
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