Religions > Bible > H.E. EICKLEBERRY - DID PAUL SAY 1,000 YEAR REIGN ON EARTH?
| Topic: |
Religions > Bible |
| User: |
"Pastor Dave" |
| Date: |
23 May 2005 09:34:02 PM |
| Object: |
H.E. EICKLEBERRY - DID PAUL SAY 1,000 YEAR REIGN ON EARTH? |
Hi,
You claimed that Paul stated that there would be a
1,000 year reign of Christ on Earth. You quoted a
passage from Paul, implying that he agreed with it.
You completely ignored and snipped my rebuttal.
Why did you do that? I would appreciate a response.
1Co 15:24-25 Then cometh the end, when [Jesus]
shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even
the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and
all authority and power. For he must reign, till he hath
put all enemies under his feet.
Paul says Jesus must reign for a time. I'll accept
a thousand years as a "time."
And that was done. Jesus put all enemies under His
feet. His "reign" was not a temporary one. That would
contradict this quote from Luke...
Luke 1:31-33
31) And, behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and
bring forth a son, and shalt call his name JESUS.
32) He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of
the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the
throne of his father David:
33) And he shall reign over the house of Jacob FOREVER;
and of his kingdom there shall be NO END.
Once again, you have quoted a passage out of context.
Let's read it and see what it actually says, in
context...
1 Corinthians 15:24-28
24) Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered
up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall
have put down all rule and all authority and power.
25) For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies
under his feet.
26) The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.
27) For he hath put all things under his feet. But when
he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest
that he is excepted, which did put all things under
him.
28) And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then
shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put
all things under him, that God may be all in all.
Note that the subject is clarified in v28. Jesus
reigns equal to the Father in this matter, until all
enemies have been put under His feet. Then
what happens? He is placed under the Father,
so that "God may be all in all".
You failed to note the point that Paul made here. He
is not discussing the length of Jesus' reign, but
rather, the length of Jesus' reign without being made
subject to the Father, from the time of His ascension,
until all enemies have been put under His feet.
The fact is, that you did indeed take the quote out of
context. The passage has nothing to do with Christ
coming to Earth for 1,000 years, to reign here and Paul
does not say that. And what Paul addressed, is not a
reign on Earth by Christ, but a reign of Christ as
coequal with God the Father IN HEAVEN, until all
enemies had been conquered. Paul never says, "and this
happens after Christ comes to Earth to sit on a throne
here". Thus, you took the Scripture out of context and
misused it to suit your own invented doctrine.
This was future to Paul, when he wrote this, but this
did happen, when Jesus returned in the 1st century,
to the generation He promised He would return to
(Matthew 16:24-28; 24:34). His victory is complete and
death has been conquered ("the last enemy is death")
and He is now subject to the Father. That does not
mean he doesn't reign. It means that He reigns with
the Father and is over the church and is our "one
mediator between man and God". This is why Christians
can pray to Jesus, for help, since He is our mediator
with God.
--
Pastor Dave
Silence in the Face of Doctrinal Criticism is Suicide
http://www.ecclesia.org/truth/solution.html
http://tinyurl.com/ce97m
.
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| User: "H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." |
|
| Title: Re: H.E. EICKLEBERRY - DID PAUL SAY 1,000 YEAR REIGN ON EARTH? |
23 May 2005 09:49:45 PM |
|
|
"Pastor Dave" <news-group-mail@nospam-tampa-bay.rr.com> wrote in message
news:844591h93in9l4oj0pr9fej7bfil3pqa04@4ax.com...
Hi,
You claimed that Paul stated that there would be a
1,000 year reign of Christ on Earth. You quoted a
passage from Paul, implying that he agreed with it.
You completely ignored and snipped my rebuttal.
Why did you do that? I would appreciate a response.
Here's your response: When did the Jews come up out of Babylon and rebuild
the temple?
Jer 29:10 For thus saith the LORD, That AFTER seventy years be accomplished
at Babylon I will visit you, and perform my good word toward you, in causing
you to RETURN to this place.
Ike
.
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|
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| User: "Pastor Dave" |
|
| Title: Re: H.E. EICKLEBERRY - DID PAUL SAY 1,000 YEAR REIGN ON EARTH? |
24 May 2005 08:53:04 AM |
|
|
On Mon, 23 May 2005 21:49:45 -0500, "H.E. Eickleberry,
Jr." <Xeickleberrybooks@comcast.net> spake thusly:
"Pastor Dave" <news-group-mail@nospam-tampa-bay.rr.com> wrote in message
news:844591h93in9l4oj0pr9fej7bfil3pqa04@4ax.com...
Hi,
You claimed that Paul stated that there would be a
1,000 year reign of Christ on Earth. You quoted a
passage from Paul, implying that he agreed with it.
You completely ignored and snipped my rebuttal.
Why did you do that? I would appreciate a response.
Here's your response: When did the Jews come up out of Babylon and rebuild
the temple?
Jer 29:10 For thus saith the LORD, That AFTER seventy years be accomplished
at Babylon I will visit you, and perform my good word toward you, in causing
you to RETURN to this place.
As usual, you snip everything I said and post this.
--
Pastor Dave
Silence in the Face of Doctrinal Criticism is Suicide
http://www.ecclesia.org/truth/solution.html
http://tinyurl.com/ce97m
.
|
|
|
| User: "H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." |
|
| Title: Re: H.E. EICKLEBERRY - DID PAUL SAY 1,000 YEAR REIGN ON EARTH? |
24 May 2005 09:18:33 AM |
|
|
"Pastor Dave" <news-group-mail@nospam-tampa-bay.rr.com> wrote in message
news:c5c691l36sj44cbk86m6mvlhjc1psg7s7v@4ax.com...
Hey, Dave, when did the Jews come up out of Babylon and rebuild the temple?
Jer 29:10 For thus saith the LORD, That AFTER seventy years be accomplished
at Babylon I will visit you, and perform my good word toward you, in causing
you to RETURN to this place.
Ike
.
|
|
|
|
|
| User: "Pastor Dave" |
|
| Title: Re: H.E. EICKLEBERRY - DID PAUL SAY 1,000 YEAR REIGN ON EARTH? |
24 May 2005 09:02:21 AM |
|
|
On Mon, 23 May 2005 21:49:45 -0500, "H.E. Eickleberry,
Jr." <Xeickleberrybooks@comcast.net> spake thusly:
"Pastor Dave" <news-group-mail@nospam-tampa-bay.rr.com> wrote in message
news:844591h93in9l4oj0pr9fej7bfil3pqa04@4ax.com...
Hi,
You claimed that Paul stated that there would be a
1,000 year reign of Christ on Earth. You quoted a
passage from Paul, implying that he agreed with it.
You completely ignored and snipped my rebuttal.
Why did you do that? I would appreciate a response.
Here's your response: When did the Jews come up out of Babylon and rebuild
the temple?
Jer 29:10 For thus saith the LORD, That AFTER seventy years be accomplished
at Babylon I will visit you, and perform my good word toward you, in causing
you to RETURN to this place.
This is not a response to what I said. here it is
again...
You claimed that Paul stated that there would be a
1,000 year reign of Christ on Earth. You quoted a
passage from Paul, implying that he agreed with it.
You completely ignored and snipped my rebuttal.
Why did you do that? I would appreciate a response.
1Co 15:24-25 Then cometh the end, when [Jesus]
shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even
the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and
all authority and power. For he must reign, till he hath
put all enemies under his feet.
Paul says Jesus must reign for a time. I'll accept
a thousand years as a "time."
And that was done. Jesus put all enemies under His
feet. His "reign" was not a temporary one. That would
contradict this quote from Luke...
Luke 1:31-33
31) And, behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and
bring forth a son, and shalt call his name JESUS.
32) He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of
the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the
throne of his father David:
33) And he shall reign over the house of Jacob FOREVER;
and of his kingdom there shall be NO END.
Once again, you have quoted a passage out of context.
Let's read it and see what it actually says, in
context...
1 Corinthians 15:24-28
24) Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered
up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall
have put down all rule and all authority and power.
25) For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies
under his feet.
26) The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.
27) For he hath put all things under his feet. But when
he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest
that he is excepted, which did put all things under
him.
28) And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then
shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put
all things under him, that God may be all in all.
Note that the subject is clarified in v28. Jesus
reigns equal to the Father in this matter, until all
enemies have been put under His feet. Then
what happens? He is placed under the Father,
so that "God may be all in all".
You failed to note the point that Paul made here. He
is not discussing the length of Jesus' reign, but
rather, the length of Jesus' reign without being made
subject to the Father, from the time of His ascension,
until all enemies have been put under His feet.
The fact is, that you did indeed take the quote out of
context. The passage has nothing to do with Christ
coming to Earth for 1,000 years, to reign here and Paul
does not say that. And what Paul addressed, is not a
reign on Earth by Christ, but a reign of Christ as
coequal with God the Father IN HEAVEN, until all
enemies had been conquered. Paul never says, "and this
happens after Christ comes to Earth to sit on a throne
here". Thus, you took the Scripture out of context and
misused it to suit your own invented doctrine.
This was future to Paul, when he wrote this, but this
did happen, when Jesus returned in the 1st century,
to the generation He promised He would return to
(Matthew 16:24-28; 24:34). His victory is complete and
death has been conquered ("the last enemy is death")
and He is now subject to the Father. That does not
mean he doesn't reign. It means that He reigns with
the Father and is over the church and is our "one
mediator between man and God". This is why Christians
can pray to Jesus, for help, since He is our mediator
with God.
--
Pastor Dave
Silence in the Face of Doctrinal Criticism is Suicide
http://www.ecclesia.org/truth/solution.html
http://tinyurl.com/ce97m
.
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