If God, Why Evil?

Christian: My point is not the degree of evil, but the source of
evil. The source of evil is our free choice.

If God were
to do away with evil, then he would have to do away
with free choice. And if he did away with our free choice, we would no
longer have the ability to love or do good. This would
no longer be a moral world.
Atheist: But not all evil is due to free choice. Why do babies
die? Why do natural disasters occur?
Christian: The Bible traces it all back to the fall of man. No
one is really innocent because we all sinned in Adam (Rom.
5:12) and as a consequence deserve death (Rom.
6:23). Natural disasters and premature deaths are a direct result of
the curse on creation because of the fall of humankind
(Genesis 3; Romans 8). This fallen world will not be
righted until Christ returns (Revelation 21-22). So no one is
guaranteed a trouble-free life, or a full life of seventy years.

If God, Why Evil?

Atheist: If there really is an all-good, all-powerful, theistic
God, then why does he allow evil?
Christian: How do you know what evil is unless you know what good
is? And how do you know what good is unless there is an
objective standard of good beyond
yourself?
Atheist: Don't try to avoid the question.
Christian: I'm not trying to avoid the question. I'm simply
showing you that your complaint presupposes that God exists.
In fact, the existence of evil doesn't disprove God.
It may prove that there is a devil, but it doesn't prove that there's
no God.
Atheist: Interesting move, but I'm not convinced.
Christian: You may not be convinced, but your complaint still
presupposes God.
Atheist: For the sake of argument, suppose I grant you that God
exists. Will you then answer the question?
Christian: Sure. It's good to see you're making progress.
Atheist: Remember, it's just for the sake of argument. So why
doesn't your so-called "all-powerful" God stop evil?
Christian: Do you really want him to?
Atheist: Of course!
Christian: Suppose he starts with you?
Atheist: Be serious.
Christian: No, really. We always talk about God stopping evil,
but we forget that if he did, he would have to stop us too.
We all do evil.
Atheist: Oh, come on! We're not talking about the minor sins of
you and me-but we're talking about real evil, like what
Hitler did!
Christian: My point is not the degree of evil, but the source of
evil. The source of evil is our free choice. If God were
to do away with evil, then he would have to do away
with free choice. And if he did away with our free choice, we would no
longer have the ability to love or do good. This would
no longer be a moral world.
Atheist: But not all evil is due to free choice. Why do babies
die? Why do natural disasters occur?
Christian: The Bible traces it all back to the fall of man. No
one is really innocent because we all sinned in Adam (Rom.
5:12) and as a consequence deserve death (Rom.
6:23). Natural disasters and premature deaths are a direct result of
the curse on creation because of the fall of humankind
(Genesis 3; Romans 8). This fallen world will not be
righted until Christ returns (Revelation 21-22). So no one is
guaranteed a trouble-free life, or a full life of seventy years.
Atheist: Oh, isn't that convenient-dust off the Bible and tell us
that God will make it right in the end! I'm not
interested in the future. I want pain and suffering to end now!
Why won't God end it?
Christian: He will end it, but just not on your timetable. Just
because God hasn't ended evil yet doesn't mean that he
never will end it.
Atheist: But why doesn't Christ return right now to end all this
pain? The sum of human pain is enormous!
Christian: First, no one is experiencing the "sum of human pain."
If it's 80 degrees in Manhattan, 85 degrees in Brooklyn,
and 80 degrees in Queens, does any New
Yorker experience a heat of 245 degrees?
Atheist: No.
Christian: That's right. Each person experiences his own pain.
Atheist: But that still doesn't tell me why God doesn't end it
all now. Why is he waiting?
Christian: If God wanted to end evil now, he could. But have you
thought that maybe God has other goals that he would like
to accomplish while evil exists?
Atheist: Like what?
Christian: For starters, he would like to have more people choose
heaven before he closes the curtain on this world. Paul
seems to indicate that Jesus will come back after
"the full number" of people become believers (Rom. 11:25).
Atheist: Well, while God is waiting for the "full number" of
people to be saved, other people are hurting!
Christian: Yes, they are. And that means Christians have a job to
do. We have the privilege of helping those who are
hurting. We are ambassadors for Christ here on
earth.
Atheist: That's nice, but if I were suffering I'd rather have God
help me than you!
Christian: If God prevented pain every time we got into trouble,
then we would become the most reckless, self-centered
creatures in the universe. And we would never
learn from suffering.
Atheist: Learn from suffering! What are you talking about?
Christian: Ah, you've just hit on another reason why God doesn't
end evil right now. Can you name me one enduring lesson
that you ever learned from pleasure?
Atheist: Give me a minute.
Christian: I could give you an hour; I doubt that you would come
up with much. If you think about it, you'll find that
virtually every valuable lesson you've ever learned
resulted from some hardship in your life. In most cases, bad fortune
teaches while good fortune deceives. In fact, you not only
learn lessons from suffering, but it's practically
the only way you can develop virtues.
Atheist: What do you mean?
Christian: You can't develop courage unless there is danger. You
can't develop perseverance unless you have obstacles in
your way. You won't learn how to be a servant
unless there's someone to serve. And compassion would never be
summoned if there were never anyone in pain or in need. It's the
old adage: "no pain, no gain."
Atheist: But I wouldn't need all those virtues if God would just
quarantine evil right now!
Christian: But since God has reasons for not quarantining evil
right now, you need to develop virtues for this life and
the life hereafter. This earth is an uncomfortable home,
but it's a great gymnasium for the hereafter.
Atheist: You Christians always punt to the hereafter. You're so
heavenly minded that you're no earthly good!
Christian: We may be heavenly minded, but we know that what we do
on earth matters in eternity. Virtues that a believer
develops through suffering will enhance his
capacity to enjoy eternity. Paul says that "our light and momentary
troubles are achieving for us an eternal glory that far
outweighs them all" (2 Cor. 4:17; cf. Rom. 8:18).
Atheist: How is hardship here going to help me feel better in a
place where there's not going to be any pain anyway?
Christian: You like football, don't you?
Atheist: I've watched a few games.
Christian: How does every player on the Super Bowl-winning team
feel after the game?
Atheist: Great, of course!
Christian: Does the captain of the winning team-who also won the
MVP trophy-enjoy the victory more than the third-string
quarterback who didn't play a down all
year?
Atheist: I suppose so.
Christian: Of course he does. While the third-string quarterback
is happy to be on the winning team, the victory is much
sweeter for the captain who won the MVP trophy
because he contributed to the win and persevered through the entire
year to get there. By persisting through all the hardships
and pains of playing, he actually enhanced his
capacity to enjoy the victory. And it's made even sweeter by the MVP
trophy.
Atheist: What does football have to do with heaven?
Christian: Heaven will be like the winning locker room (but
without the smell!). We'll all be happy to be there, but some
will have a greater ability to enjoy it and have more
rewards than others. After all, God's justice demands that there will
be degrees of rewards in heaven just like there will be
degrees of punishment in hell.
Atheist: So you're saying life is like a Super Bowl?
Christian: To a certain extent, yes. Like a Super Bowl, life has
rules, a referee, and rewards. But in life there are no
spectators-everyone is in the game-and we already
know who will win. Christ will win, and anyone, regardless of ability,
can be a winner simply by joining the team. While
everyone on the team will enjoy the victory parade,
some will appreciate it even more because of the hardships they
experienced during the game and the rewards they receive for
playing it well. In other words, the feeling of
victory is greater the more intense the battle is.
Atheist: So you're saying that evil has a purpose that has
implications in eternity.
Christian: Yes.
Atheist: Why do you insist on putting everything in light of
eternity?
Christian: Because we're all going to be dead a lot longer than
we're going to be alive! Furthermore, the Bible teaches us
to look to the eternal, and life makes sense only
in light of eternity. If there is no eternity, then there is no
ultimate purpose for anything, pleasures or pains.
Atheist: Suppose there is no eternity. Suppose we live, we die,
and that's it.
Christian: It's possible, but I don't have enough faith to
believe it.
Atheist: Why not?
Christian: Haven't you read this book?
Atheist: No, I jumped right to this appendix.
Christian: That's just like you, isn't it? You don't want to play
the game; you just want to see the final score.
Atheist: I suppose I suffer from the American disease of instant
gratification.
Christian: That's probably why you're having trouble realizing
the value of suffering and "no pain, no gain!"
Atheist: You're right, reading this book is too painful. It's too
long.
Christian: It could be shorter if we didn't have to address all
those crazy arguments you atheists bring up. Besides, you've
got time to read. Sunday mornings are free for
you.
Atheist: There are a lot less painful things I could do on Sunday
mornings.
Christian: Look, I know this book may be painful to read, but
it's more painful to reject its conclusion. You've got to
read this book from beginning to end if you want to
see the whole argument for Christianity. The case is laid out in
logical order. Each chapter builds on the previous one.
Atheist: Alright, I'll read the book. But in the meantime, let's
get back to the question of evil. If there is an
eternity, then some evils in this world may have an eternal
purpose. But there are certainly some evil acts in this world that
have absolutely no purpose.
Christian: How do you know?
Atheist: It's obvious! What good purpose could there be in, say,
the terrorist attacks on 9/11?
Christian: While I wish it had never happened, there were some
good things that we know about that came out of those
terrible events. For example, we came together as
a country; we helped those in need; and we resolved to fight the evil
of terrorism. We also were shocked into pondering the
ultimate questions about life, and some people
came to Christ as result of it. As C. S. Lewis said, pain is God's
"megaphone to rouse a deaf world."?1? 9/11 certainly woke us
up!
Atheist: Yes, you can find a silver lining in just about
anything, but there's no way your "silver lining" outweighs the
pain and suffering.
Christian: How do you know? Unless you are all-knowing and have
an eternal perspective, how do you know the events of 9/11
will not work together for good in the
end? Perhaps there are many good things that will come out of that
tragedy in the individual lives we will never hear about. In
fact, good results may even come generations
from now unbeknownst to those who will experience them.
Atheist: Come on! That's a cop-out!
Christian: No, it's simply recognizing our limits and
acknowledging the limitless knowledge and unseen purposes of God
(Rom. 11:33-36). We can't see the future on
earth, much less what eternity in heaven will be like. So how can we
say that the ultimate eternal outcome of 9/11 won't work
out for good? We already know some good
things that have resulted from it. Just because we can't think of an
ultimate good reason or purpose for it, that doesn't mean
an infinite God doesn't have one.
Atheist: If God would tell me his reasons, then maybe I could
believe you.
Christian: Job already tried that tactic. After he questioned God
about why he suffered, God baffled Job with questions
about the wonders of creation (Job 38-41). It's as
if God were saying to him, "Job, you can't even understand how I run
the physical world that you can see, so how are you going
to understand the vastly more complex moral
world that you cannot see-a world where the results of billions of
free choices made by human beings every day interact with
one another?" Indeed, it would be impossible
for us to comprehend such complexity. By the way, have you ever seen
the movie It's a Wonderful Life?
Atheist: Do you mean the one with Jimmy Stewart that's shown
every Christm . I mean, winter solstice?
Christian: Yeah, that's the one. Jimmy Stewart plays George
Bailey, a character who is despondent because his business
dealings have gone bad and his life seems to be
falling apart. He is averted from suicide at the last minute by an
angel who shows him what life would have been like for
others if George had never been born. It turns out that
life would have been terrible for many people throughout his hometown.
But George never knew this. He never realized the
amazing impact his life had on others. Hence the
title, It's a Wonderful Life.
Atheist: Bah! Humbug!
Christian: Come on. You get the point, don't you?
Atheist: Yeah, I get the point: we don't know what impact any
person or event might have in the long run, especially since
there are so many interacting choices being
made.
Christian: Yes, and even choices meant for evil can turn out for
good (Gen. 50:20). Perhaps many people now or generations
from now will come to Christ because of the
direct or indirect effects of evil events.
Atheist: But it seems like that's an argument from ignorance.
Christian: No. It's not like we have no information about why bad
things happen. We know that we live in a fallen world,
and we know that good things can come from
bad. So we know it's possible that God can have a good reason for bad
things even if we don't know what those reasons are. And
we know that he can bring good from
bad. So it's not an argument from ignorance, but a reasonable
conclusion from what we do know. And while we don't know the
reason for every specific bad thing that
happens, we know why we don't know: we don't know because of our human
limitations.
Atheist: What do you think of Rabbi Kushner's answer to the
question? You know, he wrote the book When Bad Things Happen
to Good People.
Christian: I think his answer is wrong.
Atheist: Wrong? Why?
Christian: Because his answer is that God isn't powerful enough
to defeat evil on earth. So we need to forgive God for
allowing evil.
Atheist: What's wrong with that?
Christian: Because there's strong evidence that God is infinitely
powerful. Fifty-six times in the Bible God is referred
to as "almighty," and in several other ways he is
described as all-powerful. We also know from scientific evidence that
he created this universe out of nothing (take a look at
chapter 3 of this book). So Rabbi Kushner's
finite god doesn't square with the facts.
Atheist: If God is infinitely powerful as you say, then why does
he allow bad things to happen to good people?
Christian: We've already pointed out that there are good outcomes
for pain and suffering. But we also need to point out
that the question makes an assumption that isn't
true.
Atheist: What's that?
Christian: There are no good people!
Atheist: Oh, come on!
Christian: No, really. Some people are better than others, but no
one is really good. We all have a natural bent toward
selfishness. And we all commit sins routinely.
Atheist: I do more good things than bad.
Christian: By whose standard?
Atheist: By society's standard. I'm a law-abiding citizen. I'm
not a murderer or a thief.
Christian: That's the problem. We consider ourselves good people
only by the standards of bad people. We judge ourselves
against others rather than against an absolute
standard of good. By the way, have you ever stolen anything?
Atheist: Well, yes.
Christian: Have you ever lied about anything?
Atheist: No.
Christian: You're lying.
Atheist: I can't fool you.
Christian: So you're a lying thief, then!
Atheist: That doesn't mean I'm all bad.
Christian: No, but it means you're not all good either. Think
about it: it's much easier to be bad than good; it's much
more natural to you to be selfish rather than generous.
We all have that depraved human nature. As Augustine said, "We're all
born with a propensity to sin and a necessity to die."?2?
That propensity is inborn. That's why young
children naturally grab things and yell, "Mine!" It's also why James
Madison said, "If men were angels, no government would be
necessary."?3?
Atheist: So Kushner makes incorrect assumptions about the nature
of man and the nature of God.
Christian: Exactly. The question is not "Why do bad things happen
to good people?" but "Why do good things happen to bad
people?"
Atheist: If God really is all-powerful as you say, I still don't
understand why he didn't stop 9/11. If you knew it was
going to happen and had the power to stop it,
wouldn't you have stopped it?
Christian: Yes.
Atheist: So you are better than God!
Christian: No, by stopping 9/11, I would be preventing evil. But
God, who has an unlimited, eternal perspective, allows
evil choices knowing that he can redeem them in
the end. We can't redeem such choices, so we try to stop every one.
Atheist: Yes, but by your own Christian doctrine, God doesn't
redeem all evil choices in the end. After all, some people
go to hell!
Christian: Yes, but that's because God can bring eternal good
only to those who will accept it. Some people ignore the
facts or simply choose to play the game in a way
that brings them defeat. Since God cannot force them to freely choose
to play the game the right way, ultimate good only comes
to those who choose it. That's why Paul says,
"And we know that in all things God works for the good of those who
love him, who have been called according to his purpose"
(Rom. 8:28). Notice he doesn't say, "all
things are good." He says all things work together for the good of
those who love him.
Atheist: So how did "all things work together for good" for those
who died in 9/11?
Christian: Those who loved God and accepted the free gift of
salvation are with God in eternity. Those who did not, are
having their free choice of eternal separation
respected as well.
Atheist: And the rest of us?
Christian: Those of us who remain here still have time to make
our decision. And those who already were Christians at the
time may have had their character strengthened
through 9/11.
Atheist: But if God is all-good and all-knowing, why would he
create creatures who he knew would go to hell?
Christian: Good question. There are only five options God had. He
could have: 1) not created at all; 2) created a non-free
world of robots; 3) created a free world where
we would not sin; 4) created a free world where we would sin, but
everyone would accept God's salvation; or 5) created the
world we have now-a world where we would
sin, and some would be saved but the rest would be lost.
Atheist: Yes, and it seems like God picked the worst of those
five options! So God is not all-good!
Christian: Not so fast. The first option can't even be compared
to the other four because something and nothing have
nothing in common. Comparing a real world and a
non-world is not even like comparing apples and oranges, since they
both are fruit. It is like comparing apples and non-apples,
insisting that non-apples taste better. In logic,
this is called a category mistake. It's like asking, "What color is
math?" Math is not a color, so the question is meaningless.
Atheist: If comparing existence to nonexistence is a category
mistake, then Jesus made a category mistake when he said it
would have been better if Judas had never been
born (Matt. 26:24).
Christian: No, Jesus was not talking about the supremacy of
non-being over being. He was simply making a forceful point
about the severity of Judas's sin.
Atheist: Okay, so why didn't God make his second option-a robot
world?
Christian: He could have, but that wouldn't have been a moral
world. It would have been a world with no evil, but with no
moral good either.
Atheist: So why didn't he make worlds three or four? Those worlds
would allow love, and they certainly would be better
worlds than this one.
Christian: Yes, but not everything conceivable is actually
achievable with free creatures. For example, it is conceivable
that I could have been robbing a bank instead of
talking to you. But that is not achievable because I freely chose to
talk to you. Likewise, God can't force free creatures not
to sin. Forced freedom is a contradiction.
Atheist: But this world could be better if there were one less
murder or one less rape. So God failed because he didn't
create the best possible world.
Christian: Hold on. While I will admit that this world is not the
best possible world, it may be the best way to get to
the best possible world.
Atheist: What kind of theistic psychobabble is that?
Christian: God may have permitted evil in order to defeat it. As
I've already said, if evil is not allowed, then the
higher virtues cannot be attained. People who are
redeemed have stronger character than people who have not been tested.
Soul-building requires some pain. The Job of chapter 42
is a deeper and more joyful man than the
Job of chapter 1. So evil in this world actually serves a good purpose
in the end. It creates an eternal world that's the best
possible world.
Atheist: But why would God create people knowing that they would
choose hell?
Christian: Do you have children?
Atheist: Yes. In fact I'm a former child myself!
Christian: Why did you have them, knowing that someday they would
disobey you?
Atheist: My wife asks me that question a lot!
Christian: I know why I did. Because love takes risks. I was
willing to take the risk of loss in order to experience the
joy of love. The same is true of every Super Bowl.
Both teams know that one will lose, yet both are willing to play the
game despite that risk.
Atheist: I must admit that your intellectual answers make some
sense, but evil still bothers me.?4?
Christian: It bothers me too, and it should. We all know that
this world just isn't right, and we all long for heaven.
Perhaps our longing for heaven is another clue that it's
really there (some of the other clues being the evidence we've
presented in this book).
Atheist: Perhaps, but I don't think your intellectual answers
will sustain a person through evil.
Christian: You may be right. But you don't have to withstand evil
with just answers. You can have access to the Divine
Comforter-the Holy Spirit-to help you through
this soul-building life of pain and suffering.
Atheist: I'd rather not suffer at all than to have a comforter.
Christian: Maybe that's why God doesn't put pain and suffering in
our control. If he did, who would choose to go through
it?
Atheist: No one.
Christian: Well, that's not exactly true. One man certainly chose
to suffer. Jesus Christ volunteered to suffer so that
you and I could be reconciled to God. It has been the
only real case of a bad thing happening to a truly good person. So we
can complain to God about pain and suffering, but we have
to admit that he did not exempt himself from
it. As for you and me, sometimes God saves us from evil, but sometimes
he comforts us through evil. In either event, whether we
know his reasons or not, believers can trust
God that all things will work together for good according to his
eternal plan.

1 C. S. Lewis, The Problem of Pain (New York: Macmillan, 1959), 81.
2 Augustine, The City of God, 14.1.
3 James Madison, in The Federalist, Benjamin F. Wright, ed. (Cambridge,
Mass.: Harvard University Press, 1961), 356.
4 For a more complete treatment of the problem of evil see Norman Geisler,
Baker Encyclopedia of Christian Apologetics (Grand
Rapids, Mich.: Baker, 1999). See also Peter
Kreeft, Making Sense Out of Suffering (Ann Arbor, Mich.: Servant, 1986).
Geisler, N. L., & Turek, F. (2004). I don't have enough faith to be an
atheist (389). Wheaton, Ill.: Crossway Books.