Jesus Was Jewish!

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Topic:	Religions > Bible
User:	"Ahn Fyuh Wi Dizayah"
Date:	22 Dec 2003 09:41:17 AM
Object:	Jesus Was Jewish!

Christians sometimes seem to forget that JESUS WAS JEWISH. Not only was he a
Jew but he was a very good and concerned Jew who wished to reform the
hypocrites that were dominating Jewish life in his day.
Jesus worked extra hard at attempting to bring his people back to the
ethical traditions that were the foundations of the Jewish faith. The men in
power were not happy with his reform efforts, which threatened their power
and thus were largely responsible for the Crucifixion.
While Jesus was living, his followers lived by his example and thus might be
called reformed Jews, who after his death became the first Christians. Many
of these early Christians were dedicated to following the example of Jesus
but over time they too fell into actions and activities that Jesus would not
have approved of.
By the seventh century after Jesus' birth, Muhammad was, like Jesus had
been, quite disgusted with Jewish hypocrisy and in addition, Christian
hypocrisy, and began a new reform movement that resulted in the rise of
Islam.
Today, some Muslims, in defiance of the peaceful teachings of Muhammad, have
become hypocrites who promote war and terrorism, just as hypocritical
Christians promote war and terrorism, and just as hypocritical Jews promote
war and terrorism.
Yes, JESUS WAS JEWISH, who wished to bring his faith back to its moral,
ethical and fundamental roots and it seems that history would confirm that
Muhammad was a product of both Jewish and Christian spiritual traditions who
wished only to bring those faiths back to their moral, and ethical roots.
http://www.jesuswasjewish.org/
--
Pro-War religious fanatics in government:
Wolfowitz, Perle, Feith, Rumsfeld, Ashcroft, Lieberman, Ridge, Cheney and
Bush
.

User: "Mark Fox"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	22 Dec 2003 11:36:14 PM

"Ahn Fyuh Wi Dizayah" <ahn-fyuh-wi-dizayah@thegreatslashtubitch.org> wrote in message news:<xgEFb.76820$HH.45201@fe1.texas.rr.com>...

Christians sometimes seem to forget that JESUS WAS JEWISH. Not only was he a
Jew but he was a very good and concerned Jew who wished to reform the
hypocrites that were dominating Jewish life in his day.

Jesus worked extra hard at attempting to bring his people back to the
ethical traditions that were the foundations of the Jewish faith. The men in
power were not happy with his reform efforts, which threatened their power
and thus were largely responsible for the Crucifixion.

While Jesus was living, his followers lived by his example and thus might be
called reformed Jews, who after his death became the first Christians. Many
of these early Christians were dedicated to following the example of Jesus
but over time they too fell into actions and activities that Jesus would not
have approved of.

By the seventh century after Jesus' birth, Muhammad was, like Jesus had
been, quite disgusted with Jewish hypocrisy and in addition, Christian
hypocrisy, and began a new reform movement that resulted in the rise of
Islam.

Today, some Muslims, in defiance of the peaceful teachings of Muhammad, have
become hypocrites who promote war and terrorism, just as hypocritical
Christians promote war and terrorism, and just as hypocritical Jews promote
war and terrorism.

Yes, JESUS WAS JEWISH, who wished to bring his faith back to its moral,
ethical and fundamental roots and it seems that history would confirm that
Muhammad was a product of both Jewish and Christian spiritual traditions who
wished only to bring those faiths back to their moral, and ethical roots.

Yes, and I agree with George Bush. Muslims, Jews and Christians all
worship the same God. I believe the first step in honoring Muhammad,
Jesus and Moses is to root out the hypocritical leaders of today who
try to claim otherwise.
.

User: "Caiaphas"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	23 Dec 2003 07:50:29 AM

"Mark Fox" <mark_fox_@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:a258afb5.0312222136.583842b6@posting.google.com...

"Ahn Fyuh Wi Dizayah" <ahn-fyuh-wi-dizayah@thegreatslashtubitch.org> wrote in

message news:<xgEFb.76820$HH.45201@fe1.texas.rr.com>...

Christians sometimes seem to forget that JESUS WAS JEWISH. Not only was he a
Jew but he was a very good and concerned Jew who wished to reform the
hypocrites that were dominating Jewish life in his day.

Jesus worked extra hard at attempting to bring his people back to the
ethical traditions that were the foundations of the Jewish faith. The men in
power were not happy with his reform efforts, which threatened their power
and thus were largely responsible for the Crucifixion.

While Jesus was living, his followers lived by his example and thus might be
called reformed Jews, who after his death became the first Christians. Many
of these early Christians were dedicated to following the example of Jesus
but over time they too fell into actions and activities that Jesus would not
have approved of.

By the seventh century after Jesus' birth, Muhammad was, like Jesus had
been, quite disgusted with Jewish hypocrisy and in addition, Christian
hypocrisy, and began a new reform movement that resulted in the rise of
Islam.

Today, some Muslims, in defiance of the peaceful teachings of Muhammad, have
become hypocrites who promote war and terrorism, just as hypocritical
Christians promote war and terrorism, and just as hypocritical Jews promote
war and terrorism.

Yes, JESUS WAS JEWISH, who wished to bring his faith back to its moral,
ethical and fundamental roots and it seems that history would confirm that
Muhammad was a product of both Jewish and Christian spiritual traditions who
wished only to bring those faiths back to their moral, and ethical roots.

Yes, I too believe that Muslims, Christians,and Jews worship the same God. God
is revealed in each religion the same way as an advocate of peace and brotherly
love. But, man hijaacks religion to build earthly kingdoms and in the act of
building earthly kingdoms go against Gods Will and commit evil. This is quite
evident in the quest for modern-day Israel by both Jews, Zionists, and
Fundamentalist Christians, the Islamic reaction to this buildout of Israel,
Christian inquistions of the past, and oppression of other faiths by all of
Judaism, Christianity, and Islam. I think all these religious wars and violence
are results of mans attempts to build man-made kingdoms.
.

User: "Robert B. Winn"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	23 Dec 2003 06:46:19 PM

"Caiaphas" <Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:<2LXFb.368$kg.14258@eagle.america.net>...

"Mark Fox" <mark_fox_@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:a258afb5.0312222136.583842b6@posting.google.com...

"Ahn Fyuh Wi Dizayah" <ahn-fyuh-wi-dizayah@thegreatslashtubitch.org> wrote in

message news:<xgEFb.76820$HH.45201@fe1.texas.rr.com>...

Christians sometimes seem to forget that JESUS WAS JEWISH. Not only was he a
Jew but he was a very good and concerned Jew who wished to reform the
hypocrites that were dominating Jewish life in his day.

Jesus worked extra hard at attempting to bring his people back to the
ethical traditions that were the foundations of the Jewish faith. The men in
power were not happy with his reform efforts, which threatened their power
and thus were largely responsible for the Crucifixion.

While Jesus was living, his followers lived by his example and thus might be
called reformed Jews, who after his death became the first Christians. Many
of these early Christians were dedicated to following the example of Jesus
but over time they too fell into actions and activities that Jesus would not
have approved of.

By the seventh century after Jesus' birth, Muhammad was, like Jesus had
been, quite disgusted with Jewish hypocrisy and in addition, Christian
hypocrisy, and began a new reform movement that resulted in the rise of
Islam.

Today, some Muslims, in defiance of the peaceful teachings of Muhammad, have
become hypocrites who promote war and terrorism, just as hypocritical
Christians promote war and terrorism, and just as hypocritical Jews promote
war and terrorism.

Yes, JESUS WAS JEWISH, who wished to bring his faith back to its moral,
ethical and fundamental roots and it seems that history would confirm that
Muhammad was a product of both Jewish and Christian spiritual traditions who
wished only to bring those faiths back to their moral, and ethical roots.

Isaiah 1:11 To what purpose is the multitude of your sacrifices unto
me? saith the Lord: I am full of the burnt offerings of rams, and the
fat of fed beases, and I delight not in the blood of bullocks, or of
lambs, or of he goats.
Robert B. Winn
.

User: "Polybius"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	23 Dec 2003 04:35:23 PM

Caiaphas wrote: I think all these religious wars and violence

are results of mans attempts to build man-made kingdoms.

The jews killed Christ, for among other reasons, he wasn't the earthly
messiah they wanted. As far as Christ being a jew, the jews sure didn't
consider him the jew messiah, then or now...otherwise they would not
have had Christ killed, or killed Christ which ever you prefer...
As far as the moslems go, they do share some orthodox Christian beliefs,
like the Virgin birth, and the idea of Christ's return before the end of
time, but, to them Christ still is a lesser prophet than Mohammed and
not their god either.
So Christ was not a jew, and not a moslem, and, both jews and moslems
worship false gods of their own creation.
.

User: "Mark Fox"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	26 Dec 2003 11:41:05 PM

Polybius <Polybius@Mail2World.com> wrote

Caiaphas wrote: I think all these religious wars and violence

are results of mans attempts to build man-made kingdoms.

The jews killed Christ, for among other reasons, he wasn't the earthly
messiah they wanted.

don't ya just HATE it when you open that present on Christmas morning
and its not the God you wanted. Maybe we can take it back to the
store and get a refund. How about a satisfaction guarantee?

So Christ was not a Jew, and not a moslem, and, both jews and moslems
worship false gods of their own creation.

False god? Hmmm....
What makes God a false god?
Is it when we read an "unapproved" book about God?
Is it when we try to write one?
Is it when someone claims to be a prophet after 1972? (No wait that
was when the last decent song was written.)
Is it when we don't go to church on sunday? No wait... saturday. No
its sunday.
Is it when a minister takes money for his work?
Is it when we don't give enough money to the minister? Tithing means
ten percent before taxes you know!
Is it when a Christian hates his brother or lusts after his neighbor's
wife?
Is it when a priest has sex with a young boy?
Is it when a TV evangelist blames the 9/11 attack on Gay people?
Is it when we dare say God's name out loud? ... Oops, I mean G-d. Or
was it ya-way or emanual? I AM not sure.
Is it when another TV evangelist sells condos that don't exist?
Is it when a religious leader says you will go to heaven and have sex
with 77 virgins if you just murder the innocent civilians on this here
list?
Is it when a guy named Joe thinks that Jesus visited the Native
Americans during his walk on earth and then Joe wrote an extra book to
tell the story and then his followers moved to Utah?
Is it when a scientist scoffs at the idea of being created from the
dust but yet promotes the idea that we were created from primordial
slime instead?
Is it when a Jew says that six million people were killed by Hitler
when there actually were 12 million killed, not all of them Jews?
Perhaps it was when we declared that light was a wave, no its a
particle, no a wave, no.....
Or when we said that gravity was a force, no wait, its a curvature of
space, no its a force, no ........
Was it when the Pope arrested Galileo for suggesting that the Earth
went around the sun. Certainly an insult to the only REAL GOD! Not
any of those FALSE GODS!! We understand the significant extent of
Galileo's outrageous blasphemy even today. Will the REAL GOD ever
forgive us our transgression?
Or did I create a false god when I failed to use the words "ONLY IN"
when referring to Christ's death, crucifixion and resurrection as my
dear friend in Canada keeps insisting in this very newsgroup?
Maybe it was when we decided that Carbs were good and fat was bad for
you. No wait, now its fat and not Carbohydrates, no wait its Polly
unsaturated fats, no wait its trans fatty acids, No wait its free
radicals, no wait........
All I know for sure is that Human beings are the most arrogant force
in the universe. And it seems reasonable for God to get fed up with
us to the point where he might say "ok you arrogant SOB's, You think
you know it all. Fine. Take the wheel of this ship called reality
for a while and lets see how you do. And as God leaves the room and
you hear the door slam shut behind him you hear God mutter to himself
"little pissant ignorant assholes!"
.

User: "Robert B. Winn"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	23 Dec 2003 09:19:43 PM

Polybius <Polybius@Mail2World.com> wrote in message news:<Kq3Gb.27589$By5.21728@news.randori.com>...

Caiaphas wrote: I think all these religious wars and violence

are results of mans attempts to build man-made kingdoms.

The jews killed Christ, for among other reasons, he wasn't the earthly
messiah they wanted. As far as Christ being a jew, the jews sure didn't
consider him the jew messiah, then or now...otherwise they would not
have had Christ killed, or killed Christ which ever you prefer...

As far as the moslems go, they do share some orthodox Christian beliefs,
like the Virgin birth, and the idea of Christ's return before the end of
time, but, to them Christ still is a lesser prophet than Mohammed and
not their god either.

So Christ was not a jew, and not a moslem, and, both jews and moslems
worship false gods of their own creation.

The Jews worship Jehovah, and Jesus Christ said he was Jehovah, so
they crucified the God they worship. The Moslems are descendants of
Ishmael, the oldest son of Abraham and worship Allah, who they say is
the God of Abraham. Since they worship the God of Abraham, they
worship the correct God, but they have some strange ways of doing it,
such as crashing airplanes into tall buildings. The God of Abraham
never told anyone to crash an airplane into a tall building.
Robert B. Winn
.

User: "Caiaphas"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	24 Dec 2003 08:36:12 AM

"Robert B. Winn" <rbwinn47@mybluelight.com> wrote in message
news:7943568.0312231919.19e8a88a@posting.google.com...

Polybius <Polybius@Mail2World.com> wrote in message

news:<Kq3Gb.27589$By5.21728@news.randori.com>...

Caiaphas wrote: I think all these religious wars and violence

are results of mans attempts to build man-made kingdoms.

The jews killed Christ, for among other reasons, he wasn't the earthly
messiah they wanted. As far as Christ being a jew, the jews sure didn't
consider him the jew messiah, then or now...otherwise they would not
have had Christ killed, or killed Christ which ever you prefer...

As far as the moslems go, they do share some orthodox Christian beliefs,
like the Virgin birth, and the idea of Christ's return before the end of
time, but, to them Christ still is a lesser prophet than Mohammed and
not their god either.

So Christ was not a jew, and not a moslem, and, both jews and moslems
worship false gods of their own creation.

Robert, I doubt that "airplanes and tall buildings" are in the Qur'an. The
reason that this happened is mans desire to build earthly kingdoms in lieu of
obeying Gods Commandments.
Similarly, creating the modern-day state of Israel is not in the Old Testment,
nor in the Torah. The reason that this happened is mans desire to build earthly
kingdoms in lieu of obeying Gods Commandments.
I think you are on to the root problem when question whether either Jews or
Muslims are true ambassadors of their faith.
.

User: "Me"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	24 Dec 2003 07:35:53 AM

In article <7943568.0312231919.19e8a88a@posting.google.com>,

(Robert B. Winn) wrote:

Wrong. The Romans crucified Jesus, not the Jews.
.

User: "Pastor Dave"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	24 Dec 2003 07:53:50 AM

On Wed, 24 Dec 2003 08:35:53 -0500, Me
<srhi@comcast.net> spake thusly:

In article <7943568.0312231919.19e8a88a@posting.google.com>,
rbwinn47@mybluelight.com (Robert B. Winn) wrote:

Wrong. The Romans crucified Jesus, not the Jews.

Pontius Pilate wanted to set Him free. When he saw
that couldn't prevail over the tumult that the Jews
were creating, he washed his hands of it. The Jews
also stated that they had no king, but Caesar, thereby
rejecting their true King and they said, "His blood be
upon us and our children.", thereby accepting blame for
the crucifixion (Matthew 27 & John 19). This is as
Jesus said it would be, that the generation then
living, would receive judgment for the blood of the
prophets and Him (Matthew 23). The Romans had a part
in it. They did the actual nailing. But the Jews are
not innocent by any means and judgment came upon them,
in 70 A.D...
--
Pastor Dave Raymond
"As for me, I have not hastened from being a pastor
to follow thee: neither have I desired the woeful day;
thou knowest: that which came out of my lips was right
before thee." - Jeremiah 17:16
When Christianity becomes religion,
it leaves the heart hungry.
.

User: "Caiaphas"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	24 Dec 2003 08:42:58 AM

"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:f46juvc8nbaubokrlvku79mgt6t5g51h3q@4ax.com...

On Wed, 24 Dec 2003 08:35:53 -0500, Me
<srhi@comcast.net> spake thusly:

In article <7943568.0312231919.19e8a88a@posting.google.com>,
rbwinn47@mybluelight.com (Robert B. Winn) wrote:

Wrong. The Romans crucified Jesus, not the Jews.

I agree that the ancient "Jews are not innocent by any means and judgment came
upon them, in 70 A.D".
Even though Scripture states "His blood be upon us and our children", I really
don't think that this blame extends to the Jewish people living today. I think
that if a Christian feels that we "drive a nail into His hand everytime we sin",
the practice of Judaism with the idea that Jesus was not the Christ similarily
"drives a nail into His hand".
In any case, there is no denying that some Jewish people at the time of Christ
were involved in His crucifixion.
.

User: "Pastor Dave"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	24 Dec 2003 08:50:03 AM

On Wed, 24 Dec 2003 09:42:58 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:f46juvc8nbaubokrlvku79mgt6t5g51h3q@4ax.com...

On Wed, 24 Dec 2003 08:35:53 -0500, Me
<srhi@comcast.net> spake thusly:

In article <7943568.0312231919.19e8a88a@posting.google.com>,
rbwinn47@mybluelight.com (Robert B. Winn) wrote:

Wrong. The Romans crucified Jesus, not the Jews.

Neither do I. It applied to that generation. These
Jews had children, between the time of that statement
and 70 A.D., which means that it did indeed come upon
them and their children, as they asked for and in the
time of that generation, as Jesus said it would.
However, let us understand, that they still reject
their King.
--
Pastor Dave Raymond
"As for me, I have not hastened from being a pastor
to follow thee: neither have I desired the woeful day;
thou knowest: that which came out of my lips was right
before thee." - Jeremiah 17:16
The fact is, if you can't believe the beginning,
you can't believe the end and shouldn't claim to.
To disbelieve the beginning, is to doubt many things
that Jesus said. After all, He made it clear that
He believed it. If you believe in the Trinity, how
can you believe that God wouldn't know how it all
started? If you can't believe the beginning, then
get off the pulpit.
.

User: "Caiaphas"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	24 Dec 2003 09:04:45 AM

"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:to9juv8n76e2echiq5219l1h585inpo1p7@4ax.com...

On Wed, 24 Dec 2003 09:42:58 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:f46juvc8nbaubokrlvku79mgt6t5g51h3q@4ax.com...

On Wed, 24 Dec 2003 08:35:53 -0500, Me
<srhi@comcast.net> spake thusly:

In article <7943568.0312231919.19e8a88a@posting.google.com>,
rbwinn47@mybluelight.com (Robert B. Winn) wrote:

Wrong. The Romans crucified Jesus, not the Jews.

I agree that the ancient "Jews are not innocent by any means and judgment

came

upon them, in 70 A.D".
Even though Scripture states "His blood be upon us and our children", I

really

don't think that this blame extends to the Jewish people living today.

We Christians believe that Jesus is God and the ancient Jews crucified Jesus aka
God.
I don't have a problem with Jewish people, but I don't agree with their religion
Judaism if practiced without Christ, and I don't believe that the modern-day
state of Israel is nothing more than a glorification of Jewish History and
Culture.
.

User: "Pastor Dave"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	24 Dec 2003 09:22:49 AM

On Wed, 24 Dec 2003 10:04:45 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

and I don't believe that the modern-day
state of Israel is nothing more than a glorification of Jewish History and
Culture.

You'll have to explain that statement to me.
--
Pastor Dave Raymond
"As for me, I have not hastened from being a pastor
to follow thee: neither have I desired the woeful day;
thou knowest: that which came out of my lips was right
before thee." - Jeremiah 17:16
Evolution is a theory universally accepted
not because it can be proven by logically
coherent evidence to be true, but because
the only alternative, special creation, is
clearly incredible. - D.M.S. Watson,
Adaptation, Nature 124:233, 1929
.

User: "Caiaphas"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	24 Dec 2003 11:51:51 AM

"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:lobjuv4ttj3euprcakb4cqcil74rdj5or3@4ax.com...

On Wed, 24 Dec 2003 10:04:45 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

and I don't believe that the modern-day
state of Israel is nothing more than a glorification of Jewish History and
Culture.

You'll have to explain that statement to me.

Simply that modern-day Israel is not a Biblical phenomenon, that Israel has done
evil against the Palestinian people by hiding behind ancient Biblical covenants.
.

User: "Pastor Dave"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	24 Dec 2003 12:52:30 PM

On Wed, 24 Dec 2003 12:51:51 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:lobjuv4ttj3euprcakb4cqcil74rdj5or3@4ax.com...

On Wed, 24 Dec 2003 10:04:45 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

and I don't believe that the modern-day
state of Israel is nothing more than a glorification of Jewish History and
Culture.

You'll have to explain that statement to me.

Simply that modern-day Israel is not a Biblical phenomenon, that Israel has done
evil against the Palestinian people by hiding behind ancient Biblical covenants.

While modern Israel may not be fulfilling a Biblical
prophecy, that does not mean that they are doing evil
against the Palestinian people.
Before Israel came back their home land, Gaza was not a
Palestine state, nor was the West Bank, so where does
this "love of the land" come from, all of the sudden,
after Israel is back together again?
And let us not forget, Israel offered many peace
treaties, which Palestine rejected. They have been
caught by their own words, stating that they want the
annihilation of Israel. It isn't a matter of the land,
it is a matter of desiring that the Jews of Israel be
exterminated. That is a fact.
--
Pastor Dave Raymond
"As for me, I have not hastened from being a pastor
to follow thee: neither have I desired the woeful day;
thou knowest: that which came out of my lips was right
before thee." - Jeremiah 17:16
When Christianity becomes religion,
it leaves the heart hungry.
.

User: "Caiaphas"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	24 Dec 2003 09:45:41 PM

"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:dtnjuvci3oteco83o5k3v2rshl2bsjohtp@4ax.com...

On Wed, 24 Dec 2003 12:51:51 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:lobjuv4ttj3euprcakb4cqcil74rdj5or3@4ax.com...

On Wed, 24 Dec 2003 10:04:45 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

and I don't believe that the modern-day
state of Israel is nothing more than a glorification of Jewish History and
Culture.

You'll have to explain that statement to me.

Simply that modern-day Israel is not a Biblical phenomenon, that Israel has

done

evil against the Palestinian people by hiding behind ancient Biblical

covenants.

No matter what one perceives what has already transpired, we have got to realize
that there are millions of Jews and Palestinians on the same land as that of
ancient Israel. The current-day Palestinians have the right to live on the land
they occupy and that is just, fair, right, and godly. To say that these peoples
have to be removed from this land simply to build an earthly kingdom that
glorifies Jewish Culture is not Gods Will. We must recognize that Palestinians
are every bit Gods Children as Jews or Christians, and Jews and Christians must
not treat them unjustly. There are two peoples here and their welfare and just
treatment should take priority to any desire to build an earthly kingdom that
replicates some ancient kingdom of 3,000 years ago.
.

User: "Pastor Dave"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	26 Dec 2003 06:25:30 PM

On Wed, 24 Dec 2003 22:45:41 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:dtnjuvci3oteco83o5k3v2rshl2bsjohtp@4ax.com...

On Wed, 24 Dec 2003 12:51:51 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:lobjuv4ttj3euprcakb4cqcil74rdj5or3@4ax.com...

On Wed, 24 Dec 2003 10:04:45 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

and I don't believe that the modern-day
state of Israel is nothing more than a glorification of Jewish History and
Culture.

You'll have to explain that statement to me.

Simply that modern-day Israel is not a Biblical phenomenon, that Israel has

done

evil against the Palestinian people by hiding behind ancient Biblical

covenants.

Why?
--
Pastor Dave Raymond
"As for me, I have not hastened from being a pastor
to follow thee: neither have I desired the woeful day;
thou knowest: that which came out of my lips was right
before thee." - Jeremiah 17:16
I know God won't give me anything I can't handle.
I just wish He didn't trust me so much.
.

User: "Caiaphas"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	26 Dec 2003 07:55:12 PM

"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:7bkpuvcptfjkspnhcmtmgjmjc2dj5f2bug@4ax.com...

On Wed, 24 Dec 2003 22:45:41 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:dtnjuvci3oteco83o5k3v2rshl2bsjohtp@4ax.com...

On Wed, 24 Dec 2003 12:51:51 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:lobjuv4ttj3euprcakb4cqcil74rdj5or3@4ax.com...

On Wed, 24 Dec 2003 10:04:45 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

and I don't believe that the modern-day
state of Israel is nothing more than a glorification of Jewish History

and

Culture.

You'll have to explain that statement to me.

Simply that modern-day Israel is not a Biblical phenomenon, that Israel

has

done

evil against the Palestinian people by hiding behind ancient Biblical

covenants.

No matter what one perceives what has already transpired, we have got to

realize

that there are millions of Jews and Palestinians on the same land as that of
ancient Israel. The current-day Palestinians have the right to live on the

land

they occupy and that is just, fair, right, and godly.

Why?

Why not?
.

User: "Pastor Dave"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	27 Dec 2003 05:02:42 AM

On Fri, 26 Dec 2003 20:55:12 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:7bkpuvcptfjkspnhcmtmgjmjc2dj5f2bug@4ax.com...

On Wed, 24 Dec 2003 22:45:41 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:dtnjuvci3oteco83o5k3v2rshl2bsjohtp@4ax.com...

On Wed, 24 Dec 2003 12:51:51 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:lobjuv4ttj3euprcakb4cqcil74rdj5or3@4ax.com...

On Wed, 24 Dec 2003 10:04:45 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

and I don't believe that the modern-day
state of Israel is nothing more than a glorification of Jewish History

and

Culture.

You'll have to explain that statement to me.

Simply that modern-day Israel is not a Biblical phenomenon, that Israel

has

done

evil against the Palestinian people by hiding behind ancient Biblical

covenants.

No matter what one perceives what has already transpired, we have got to

realize

that there are millions of Jews and Palestinians on the same land as that of
ancient Israel. The current-day Palestinians have the right to live on the

land

they occupy and that is just, fair, right, and godly.

Why?

Why not?

I've already explained that. The Palestinians had no
claim to that land. Gaza was not a Palestine state and
neither was the West Bank. This supposed great love of
that land by them, only manifests itself after Israel
comes back together as a nation. The Palestine want
the Jews exterminated. They don't want peace. No
matter how many generous offers of land have been made,
palestine has been bagged stating that they want Israel
exterminated. So what is "Godly" about tolerating
Palestine? Should America tolerate Canada, if they
declare their mission to be to start taking part of our
country, simply because they bought some land and also
to exterminate us? Offering a peace treaty would even
be going too far, yet Israel did it many times and
every time, it was Palestine who rejected it.
--
Pastor Dave Raymond
"As for me, I have not hastened from being a pastor
to follow thee: neither have I desired the woeful day;
thou knowest: that which came out of my lips was right
before thee." - Jeremiah 17:16
http://www.geocities.com/dpatrickwood/evolution2.html
.

User: "Caiaphas"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	27 Dec 2003 10:11:28 AM

"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:tdpquvg9rq5blldgfbuojirl2f396qlo51@4ax.com...

On Fri, 26 Dec 2003 20:55:12 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:7bkpuvcptfjkspnhcmtmgjmjc2dj5f2bug@4ax.com...

On Wed, 24 Dec 2003 22:45:41 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:dtnjuvci3oteco83o5k3v2rshl2bsjohtp@4ax.com...

On Wed, 24 Dec 2003 12:51:51 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:lobjuv4ttj3euprcakb4cqcil74rdj5or3@4ax.com...

On Wed, 24 Dec 2003 10:04:45 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

and I don't believe that the modern-day
state of Israel is nothing more than a glorification of Jewish

History

and

Culture.

You'll have to explain that statement to me.

Simply that modern-day Israel is not a Biblical phenomenon, that Israel

has

done

evil against the Palestinian people by hiding behind ancient Biblical

covenants.

No matter what one perceives what has already transpired, we have got to

realize

that there are millions of Jews and Palestinians on the same land as that

ancient Israel. The current-day Palestinians have the right to live on

the

land

they occupy and that is just, fair, right, and godly.

Why?

Why not?

So what is your solution for the Palestniians?
Could your solution also be used to deal with the Iraqis and the Afgans?
.

User: "Pastor Dave"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	27 Dec 2003 06:52:50 PM

On Sat, 27 Dec 2003 11:11:28 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

Why not?

So what is your solution for the Palestniians?
Could your solution also be used to deal with the Iraqis and the Afgans?

There is no solution. When faced with an enemy
occupying your country, who won't live in peace and
accept land as their own, there is only one way to
handle it and that's by giving them what they want. A
war. The Palestinians will lose. Israel can fly more
sorties each day than the U.S..
--
Pastor Dave Raymond
"As for me, I have not hastened from being a pastor
to follow thee: neither have I desired the woeful day;
thou knowest: that which came out of my lips was right
before thee." - Jeremiah 17:16
http://www.unlimitedglory.org/evcha3.htm
.

User: "Caiaphas"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	27 Dec 2003 08:26:21 PM

"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:u4asuvsqhfo4i8ko74bsvivslrt8r55c3g@4ax.com...

On Sat, 27 Dec 2003 11:11:28 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

Why not?

So what is your solution for the Palestniians?
Could your solution also be used to deal with the Iraqis and the Afgans?

Are you a real pastor? What faith?
.

User: "Pastor Dave"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	28 Dec 2003 06:39:18 AM

On Sat, 27 Dec 2003 21:26:21 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:u4asuvsqhfo4i8ko74bsvivslrt8r55c3g@4ax.com...

On Sat, 27 Dec 2003 11:11:28 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

Why not?

So what is your solution for the Palestniians?
Could your solution also be used to deal with the Iraqis and the Afgans?

Are you a real pastor? What faith?

Yes. No denomination. Just because I'm a pastor, that
does not mean that I don't recognize the way a
situation is. People are dying now. It's already a
war. Instead of letting it go on for years and years,
get it over with. Pull the band-aid off in one shot,
ya know what I mean?
--
Pastor Dave Raymond
"As for me, I have not hastened from being a pastor
to follow thee: neither have I desired the woeful day;
thou knowest: that which came out of my lips was right
before thee." - Jeremiah 17:16
"There are only two possibilities as to how life
arose. One is spontaneous generation arising to
evolution; the other is a supernatural creative
act of God. There is no third possibility.
Spontaneous generation, that life arose from
non-living matter was scientifically disproved
120 years ago by Louis Pasteur and others. That
leaves us with the only possible conclusion that
life arose as a supernatural creative act of God.
I will not accept that philosophically because I
do not want to believe in God. Therefore, I choose
to believe in that which I know is scientifically
impossible; spontaneous generation arising to
evolution." - (Wald, George, "Innovation and
Biology," Scientific American, Vol. 199,
Sept. 1958, p. 100)
.

User: "Caiaphas"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	28 Dec 2003 07:14:43 AM

"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:ukjtuv4ba4gkdkf6rd9f3lq6k9al3qqkus@4ax.com...

On Sat, 27 Dec 2003 21:26:21 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:u4asuvsqhfo4i8ko74bsvivslrt8r55c3g@4ax.com...

On Sat, 27 Dec 2003 11:11:28 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

Why not?

So what is your solution for the Palestniians?
Could your solution also be used to deal with the Iraqis and the Afgans?

Are you a real pastor? What faith?

No, I don't get it. What do you mean by "pull the band-aid off in one shot" ??
.

User: "Pastor Dave"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	28 Dec 2003 08:26:36 AM

On Sun, 28 Dec 2003 08:14:43 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:ukjtuv4ba4gkdkf6rd9f3lq6k9al3qqkus@4ax.com...

On Sat, 27 Dec 2003 21:26:21 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:u4asuvsqhfo4i8ko74bsvivslrt8r55c3g@4ax.com...

On Sat, 27 Dec 2003 11:11:28 -0500, "Caiaphas"
<Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> spake thusly:

Why not?

So what is your solution for the Palestniians?
Could your solution also be used to deal with the Iraqis and the Afgans?

Are you a real pastor? What faith?

No, I don't get it. What do you mean by "pull the band-aid off in one shot" ??

Ever had a band-aid put on your arm, for example, when
you were a kid? When ya go to take it off, it tends to
grab your hair and it can hurt to take it off. Now you
can take it off slowly and keep hurting yourself for a
while, or you can just rip it off and get it over with.
--
Pastor Dave Raymond
"As for me, I have not hastened from being a pastor
to follow thee: neither have I desired the woeful day;
thou knowest: that which came out of my lips was right
before thee." - Jeremiah 17:16
Evolution is a theory universally accepted
not because it can be proven by logically
coherent evidence to be true, but because
the only alternative, special creation, is
clearly incredible. - D.M.S. Watson,
Adaptation, Nature 124:233, 1929
.

User: "Polybius"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	23 Dec 2003 09:46:01 PM

Robert B. Winn wrote:

Polybius <Polybius@Mail2World.com> wrote in message news:<Kq3Gb.27589$By5.21728@news.randori.com>...

Caiaphas wrote: I think all these religious wars and violence

are results of mans attempts to build man-made kingdoms.

The jews killed Christ, for among other reasons, he wasn't the earthly
messiah they wanted. As far as Christ being a jew, the jews sure didn't
consider him the jew messiah, then or now...otherwise they would not
have had Christ killed, or killed Christ which ever you prefer...

As far as the moslems go, they do share some orthodox Christian beliefs,
like the Virgin birth, and the idea of Christ's return before the end of
time, but, to them Christ still is a lesser prophet than Mohammed and
not their god either.

So Christ was not a jew, and not a moslem, and, both jews and moslems
worship false gods of their own creation.

The Jews worship Jehovah, and Jesus Christ said he was Jehovah, so
they crucified the God they worship.

That's another way to look at it...
The Moslems are descendants of

Ishmael, the oldest son of Abraham and worship Allah, who they say is
the God of Abraham. Since they worship the God of Abraham, they
worship the correct God, but they have some strange ways of doing it,
such as crashing airplanes into tall buildings. The God of Abraham
never told anyone to crash an airplane into a tall building.

The jews and the moslems both claim Abraham...and we are in the middle
of their holy war...it's not our nightmare...it is their nightmare...
.

User: "Robert B. Winn"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	24 Dec 2003 08:36:28 AM

Polybius <Polybius@Mail2World.com> wrote in message news:<YZ7Gb.28214$By5.19778@news.randori.com>...

Robert B. Winn wrote:

Polybius <Polybius@Mail2World.com> wrote in message news:<Kq3Gb.27589$By5.21728@news.randori.com>...

Caiaphas wrote: I think all these religious wars and violence

are results of mans attempts to build man-made kingdoms.

The jews killed Christ, for among other reasons, he wasn't the earthly
messiah they wanted. As far as Christ being a jew, the jews sure didn't
consider him the jew messiah, then or now...otherwise they would not
have had Christ killed, or killed Christ which ever you prefer...

As far as the moslems go, they do share some orthodox Christian beliefs,
like the Virgin birth, and the idea of Christ's return before the end of
time, but, to them Christ still is a lesser prophet than Mohammed and
not their god either.

So Christ was not a jew, and not a moslem, and, both jews and moslems
worship false gods of their own creation.

The Jews worship Jehovah, and Jesus Christ said he was Jehovah, so
they crucified the God they worship.

That's another way to look at it...
The Moslems are descendants of

The jews and the moslems both claim Abraham...and we are in the middle
of their holy war...it's not our nightmare...it is their nightmare...

Well, it is our nightmare now also, since we chose to try to control
their governments by covert CIA operations. Why do you think the
Moslems were so upset they started crashing airplanes into New York
City skyscrapers?
Robert B. Winn
.

User: "Caiaphas"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	24 Dec 2003 09:07:01 AM

"Robert B. Winn" <rbwinn47@mybluelight.com> wrote in message
news:7943568.0312240636.1ea59c45@posting.google.com...

Polybius <Polybius@Mail2World.com> wrote in message

news:<YZ7Gb.28214$By5.19778@news.randori.com>...

Robert B. Winn wrote:

Polybius <Polybius@Mail2World.com> wrote in message

news:<Kq3Gb.27589$By5.21728@news.randori.com>...

Caiaphas wrote: I think all these religious wars and violence

are results of mans attempts to build man-made kingdoms.

The jews killed Christ, for among other reasons, he wasn't the earthly
messiah they wanted. As far as Christ being a jew, the jews sure didn't
consider him the jew messiah, then or now...otherwise they would not
have had Christ killed, or killed Christ which ever you prefer...

As far as the moslems go, they do share some orthodox Christian beliefs,
like the Virgin birth, and the idea of Christ's return before the end of
time, but, to them Christ still is a lesser prophet than Mohammed and
not their god either.

So Christ was not a jew, and not a moslem, and, both jews and moslems
worship false gods of their own creation.

The Jews worship Jehovah, and Jesus Christ said he was Jehovah, so
they crucified the God they worship.

That's another way to look at it...
The Moslems are descendants of

The jews and the moslems both claim Abraham...and we are in the middle
of their holy war...it's not our nightmare...it is their nightmare...

What if say modern-day Israel had birthed itself peacefully and not caused a lot
of Arab anger and rage - do you think that the World Trade Center would still be
standing today?
.

User: "Robert B. Winn"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	24 Dec 2003 01:49:24 PM

"Caiaphas" <Nyquist314159@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:<QYhGb.439$kg.17367@eagle.america.net>...

"Robert B. Winn" <rbwinn47@mybluelight.com> wrote in message
news:7943568.0312240636.1ea59c45@posting.google.com...

Polybius <Polybius@Mail2World.com> wrote in message

news:<YZ7Gb.28214$By5.19778@news.randori.com>...

Robert B. Winn wrote:

Polybius <Polybius@Mail2World.com> wrote in message

news:<Kq3Gb.27589$By5.21728@news.randori.com>...

Caiaphas wrote: I think all these religious wars and violence

are results of mans attempts to build man-made kingdoms.

The jews killed Christ, for among other reasons, he wasn't the earthly
messiah they wanted. As far as Christ being a jew, the jews sure didn't
consider him the jew messiah, then or now...otherwise they would not
have had Christ killed, or killed Christ which ever you prefer...

As far as the moslems go, they do share some orthodox Christian beliefs,
like the Virgin birth, and the idea of Christ's return before the end of
time, but, to them Christ still is a lesser prophet than Mohammed and
not their god either.

So Christ was not a jew, and not a moslem, and, both jews and moslems
worship false gods of their own creation.

The Jews worship Jehovah, and Jesus Christ said he was Jehovah, so
they crucified the God they worship.

That's another way to look at it...
The Moslems are descendants of

The jews and the moslems both claim Abraham...and we are in the middle
of their holy war...it's not our nightmare...it is their nightmare...

What if say modern-day Israel had birthed itself peacefully and not caused a lot
of Arab anger and rage - do you think that the World Trade Center would still be
standing today?

I used to look at those two buildings, and it did not look to me like
they were going to stand very long in any case.
Robert B. Winn
.

User: "HP Opus"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	23 Dec 2003 07:39:14 PM

(Mark Fox) wrote in message news:<a258afb5.0312222136.583842b6@posting.google.com>...

I agree with George Bush. Muslims, Jews and Christians all worship the
same God.

MARK FOX: Don't you find it a little petty and shallow to announce
that Jesus is the only way to salvation? (1)
MARK FOX: the God you describe is not worth worshiping. (2)
MARK FOX: I agree with George Bush. Muslims, Jews and Christians all
worship the same God. (3)
S O U R C E
(1) Mark Fox (

). Subject: Re: Jesus broke down the
walls of hatred between Jew and Samartian -- would He try to break
down the wall of hatred we have for Arabs and Arab Culture?
Newsgroups: alt.religion.christian.methodist, alt.bible,
soc.culture.palestine. Date: 2003-12-03. Message-ID:
<a258afb5.0312031844.19e4dfdc@posting.google.com>.
(2) Mark Fox (

). Subject: Re: Jesus broke down the
walls of hatred between Jew and Samartian -- would He try to break
down the wall of hatred we have for Arabs and Arab Culture?
Newsgroups: alt.religion.christian.methodist, alt.bible,
soc.culture.palestine. Date: 2003-12-07. Message-ID:
<a258afb5.0312072010.71389e3e@posting.google.com>.
(3) Mark Fox (

). Subject: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!
Newsgroups: alt.bible, alt.politics.immigration, alt.abortion. Date:
2003-12-22. Message-ID:
<a258afb5.0312222136.583842b6@posting.google.com>
One with you (if) in Christ,
HP Opus
http://fellow-servants-of-christ.0catch.com
.

User: "Mark Fox"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	22 Dec 2003 11:36:18 PM

"Ahn Fyuh Wi Dizayah" <ahn-fyuh-wi-dizayah@thegreatslashtubitch.org> wrote in message news:<xgEFb.76820$HH.45201@fe1.texas.rr.com>...

Christians sometimes seem to forget that JESUS WAS JEWISH. Not only was he a
Jew but he was a very good and concerned Jew who wished to reform the
hypocrites that were dominating Jewish life in his day.

Jesus worked extra hard at attempting to bring his people back to the
ethical traditions that were the foundations of the Jewish faith. The men in
power were not happy with his reform efforts, which threatened their power
and thus were largely responsible for the Crucifixion.

While Jesus was living, his followers lived by his example and thus might be
called reformed Jews, who after his death became the first Christians. Many
of these early Christians were dedicated to following the example of Jesus
but over time they too fell into actions and activities that Jesus would not
have approved of.

By the seventh century after Jesus' birth, Muhammad was, like Jesus had
been, quite disgusted with Jewish hypocrisy and in addition, Christian
hypocrisy, and began a new reform movement that resulted in the rise of
Islam.

Today, some Muslims, in defiance of the peaceful teachings of Muhammad, have
become hypocrites who promote war and terrorism, just as hypocritical
Christians promote war and terrorism, and just as hypocritical Jews promote
war and terrorism.

Yes, JESUS WAS JEWISH, who wished to bring his faith back to its moral,
ethical and fundamental roots and it seems that history would confirm that
Muhammad was a product of both Jewish and Christian spiritual traditions who
wished only to bring those faiths back to their moral, and ethical roots.

User: "zbihniew"
Title: Re: Jesus Was Jewish!	24 Dec 2003 04:27:24 AM

By the seventh century after Jesus' birth, Muhammad was, like Jesus had
been, quite disgusted with Jewish hypocrisy and in addition, Christian
hypocrisy, and began a new reform movement that resulted in the rise of
Islam.

Muhammad was disgusted not with Christianity nor with Judaism but with
contemporary beliefs of Arabs who, though believed to be descendants of
Ismael, praised hundreds of gods. He created (or was revelated with) a
religion containing elements of J. and C. which he respected. In fact he
got out of getting on well with them because they didn't want to accept
him as a prophet.

Today, some Muslims, in defiance of the peaceful teachings of Muhammad, have
become hypocrites who promote war and terrorism, just as hypocritical
Christians promote war and terrorism, and just as hypocritical Jews promote
war and terrorism.

Teachings of Muhammad not in the least are as peaceful as one could
imagine not having read the Quran. It is a hard religion suitable for
hard desert people. It does not ban war or revenge. What is more,
Muhammad himself led some wars in Arabia.
--
zbihniew
ICQ# 340170009
email: zbihniew[at]op[dot]pl
"There is a goal, but no way; what we call a way is hesitation."
(Franz Kafka)
.