Religions > Bible > PROOF -- Christians Know The Bible is False -- They just pretendit's not.
| Topic: |
Religions > Bible |
| User: |
"AcesLucky" |
| Date: |
29 Nov 2006 09:26:43 AM |
| Object: |
PROOF -- Christians Know The Bible is False -- They just pretendit's not. |
Christians...
You calling god a liar? Take a look.
Mark 11:24:
Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer,
believe that you have received it, and it will be yours.
Mat 21:21
If you believe, you will receive whatever you ask for in prayer.
So you see, his will has already been expressed in advance.
If you believe it, it will be done. And keep in mind that
this is Jesus talking in each of these! His will has already
been stated. So these ARE according to his will.
[Borrowed from: http://www.godisimaginary.com/i1.htm]
What would happen if we get down on our knees and pray to
God in this way:
Dear God, almighty, all-powerful, all-loving creator of the
universe, we pray to you to cure every case of cancer on
this planet tonight. We pray in faith, knowing you will
bless us as you describe in Matthew 7:7, Matthew 17:20,
Matthew 21:21, Mark 11:24, John 14:12-14, Matthew 18:19 and
James 5:15-16. In Jesus' name we pray, Amen.
We pray sincerely, knowing that when God answers this
completely heartfelt, unselfish, non-materialistic prayer,
it will glorify God and help millions of people in
remarkable ways.
Will anything happen? Begin your lies here ____, or...
Let's find out! If you're Christian and believes in
prayer, or whoever you are, these words are unselfish and
delivered to god, and according to the bible should work
like a charm...if the bible's true and these are true
scripture.
[ By the way, these 'proofs' below are supposedly the actual
words of Jesus; from god himself in the flesh, as stated in
the Bible! ]
Jesus says in many different places that he and God will
answer your prayers.
=====
In Matthew 7:7 Jesus says:
Ask, and it will be given you;
In Matthew 17:20 Jesus says:
For truly, I say to you, if you have faith as a grain of
mustard seed, you will say to this mountain, 'Move from here
to there,' and it will move; and nothing will be impossible
to you.
In Matthew 21:21:
I tell you the truth, if you have faith and do not doubt,
not only can you do what was done to the fig tree, but also
you can say to this mountain, 'Go, throw yourself into the
sea,' and it will be done. If you believe, you will receive
whatever you ask for in prayer.
The message is reiterated Mark 11:24:
Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer,
believe that you have received it, and it will be yours.
In John chapter 14, verses 12 through 14, Jesus tells all of
us just how easy prayer can be:
"I tell you the truth, anyone who has faith in me will do
what I have been doing. He will do even greater things than
these, because I am going to the Father. And I will do
whatever you ask in my name, so that the Son may bring glory
to the Father. You may ask me for anything in my name, and I
will do it." [ref]
Look at how direct this statement is: "You may ask me for
anything in my name, and I will do it." This is the "Son of
God" speaking.
We see the same thing over and over again...
In Matthew 18:19 Jesus says:
Again I say to you, if two of you agree on earth about
anything they ask, it will be done for them by my Father in
heaven. For where two or three are gathered in my name,
there am I in the midst of them.
In James 5:15-16 the Bible says:
And the prayer offered in faith will make the sick person
well; the Lord will raise him up. If he has sinned, he will
be forgiven. Therefore confess your sins to each other and
pray for each other so that you may be healed. The prayer of
a righteous man is powerful and effective.
In Mark 9:23:
All things are possible to him who believes.
In Luke 1:37:
For with God nothing will be impossible.
========
Nothing could be simpler or clearer than Jesus' promises
about prayer in the Bible. Yet, when we pray to eliminate
cancer, nothing happens.
And keep in mind that this is Jesus talking here. These are
not the words of human beings. These are not the words of
"inspired" human beings. These are supposedly the words of
God himself, incarnated in a human body. Jesus is supposed
to be a perfect, sinless being. And yet, it is obvious that
Jesus is lying [or the bible is! ]. What Jesus says is
clearly incorrect.
--- source: http://www.godisimaginary.com/i1.htm ---
*See the video! Click the link below!*
http://www.godisimaginary.com/video.htm
---
So!
A.) Does the Bible lie?
B.) Does Jesus lie?
C.) Do YOU lie? or..(if you're a Christian)...
D.) ALL OF THE ABOVE
.
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| User: "Grestang" |
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| Title: Re: PROOF -- Christians Know The Bible is False -- They just pretend it's not. |
29 Nov 2006 01:40:41 PM |
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"AcesLucky" <aceslucky@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:WEhbh.897$XU2.104@newsfe12.phx...
Christians...
You calling god a liar? Take a look.
Mark 11:24:
Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you
have received it, and it will be yours.
<snip>
Maybe we should take a look at Jesus' own prayer in the Garden of
Gethsemane. He prayed to the Father, but He also stated that it should be
done according to the Father's will, and not his. Similarly with your
cancer argument. Now, if this is where you go into a spleel about God being
cold and heartless because He chooses not to make cancer and suffering
disappear, don't even waste your time. Suffering is a part of the human
condition. It would also be foolish to think that God does not use
suffering to further His own will....a will which often brings benefit to
those who suffer and those who love them.
.
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| User: "Mary Walker" |
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| Title: Re: PROOF -- Christians Know The Bible is False -- They just pretend it's not. |
29 Nov 2006 05:38:38 PM |
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"Grestang" <grestang77@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:Zmlbh.13$Ye5.4@tornado.ohiordc.rr.com...
"AcesLucky" <aceslucky@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:WEhbh.897$XU2.104@newsfe12.phx...
Christians...
You calling god a liar? Take a look.
Mark 11:24:
Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you
have received it, and it will be yours.
<snip>
Maybe we should take a look at Jesus' own prayer in the Garden of
Gethsemane. He prayed to the Father, but He also stated that it should be
done according to the Father's will, and not his. Similarly with your
cancer argument. Now, if this is where you go into a spleel about God
being cold and heartless because He chooses not to make cancer and
suffering disappear, don't even waste your time. Suffering is a part of
the human condition. It would also be foolish to think that God does not
use suffering to further His own will....a will which often brings benefit
to those who suffer and those who love them.
Ah, so we have clarified that God is a complete waste of space then. At
least we agree on something :-)
.
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| User: "SheBlewHimDidYouBlowHim" |
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| Title: Re: PROOF -- Christians Know The Bible is False -- They just pretend it's not. |
29 Nov 2006 05:58:50 PM |
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Maybe we should take a look at Jesus' own prayer in the Garden of
Gethsemane. He prayed to the Father, but He also stated that it should be
done according to the Father's will, and not his. Similarly with your
cancer argument. Now, if this is where you go into a spleel about God
being cold and heartless because He chooses not to make cancer and
suffering disappear, don't even waste your time. Suffering is a part of
the human condition.
and the COLD-HEARTED ***** christian god certainly does love to watch
people suffer,
he especially loves to watch children being raped murdered while he sits on
his FAT, LAZY *****
laughing his ***** off
It would also be foolish to think that God does not use suffering to
further His own will....a will which often brings benefit to those who
suffer and those who love them.
MAKING PEOPLE SUFFER - PART OF GOD'S DIVINE PLAN
CHILDREN BEING RAPED AND MURDERED - PART OF GOD'S DIVINE PLAN
.
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| User: "Grestang" |
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| Title: Re: PROOF -- Christians Know The Bible is False -- They just pretend it's not. |
29 Nov 2006 10:16:55 PM |
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"SheBlewHimDidYouBlowHim" <killgod@killgod.com> wrote in message
news:_8pbh.4973$tM1.4134@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
Maybe we should take a look at Jesus' own prayer in the Garden of
Gethsemane. He prayed to the Father, but He also stated that it should
be done according to the Father's will, and not his. Similarly with your
cancer argument. Now, if this is where you go into a spleel about God
being cold and heartless because He chooses not to make cancer and
suffering disappear, don't even waste your time. Suffering is a part of
the human condition.
he especially loves to watch children being raped murdered while he sits
on
Where to start, where to start...
Whether you want to believe this or not, someday we are all judged for our
actions. I have no place to judge you, as I am also a sinner. But, I have
to ask why you would want to heap condemnation on yourself. The fact that
you are in this newsgroup may be telling you something about yourself. If
you, or anyone else would like to have a more civil conversation through
email, feel free. Sometimes people feel the need to act out when they are
in front of a group.
The issue of human suffering has been a hotbed issue for non-believers for
the longest time. In the Book of Job, Job's friends, people who ought to
know better, got it wrong. Even a young man who came to set Job's friends
only got it half right. Why do bad things happen? Sometimes we find out in
this life...sometimes we don't.
It would also be foolish to think that God does not use suffering to
further His own will....a will which often brings benefit to those who
suffer and those who love them.
MAKING PEOPLE SUFFER - PART OF GOD'S DIVINE PLAN
CHILDREN BEING RAPED AND MURDERED - PART OF GOD'S DIVINE PLAN
God is sovereign.
.
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| User: "SheBlewHimDidYouBlowHim" |
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| Title: Re: PROOF -- Christians Know The Bible is False -- They just pretend it's not. |
30 Nov 2006 06:28:24 PM |
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. Why do bad things happen?
answer: because the christian god is a COLD-HEARTED *****, that's why !
Question: What would jesus do?
Answer: He'd sit on his FAT, LAZY *****, laughing his ***** off and doing
nothing to
help the child, while she is being raped and murdered.
Oh wait, I know the usual christian nutcase reply. Jesus is there "with the
child", "suffering with the child", while she is being raped. Is Jesus there
getting fucked up the ***** or murdered TOO?
Actually, as Mary Walker suggested, Jesus is there with the child allright,
jacking off while he watches the child being raped.
Now, while I do understand that the all-powerful, all-loving, COLD-HEARTED
***** christian god is busy doing VERY IMPORTANT things such as making
water stains in the image of the virgin mary, and putting jesus's likeness
on slices of bread, however the question remains:
Why doesn't the COLD-HEARTED ***** christian god (aka jesus jerk) prevent
a child from being raped and murdered?
Now, one last question, (this is for anyone with any sense of decency,
granted, it might leave christians out)
IF YOU knew that a child was being raped and murdered in the house next
door, would you call the police or rush over yourself to try and stop it
from happening, or would "you do as jesus does", you'd just go over to the
house, and watch the show so you could claim you were there "suffering with
the child". ? (TRY TELLING THAT ONE TO THE AUTHORITIES AND SEE
WHERE IT GETS YOU)
.
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| User: "AcesLucky" |
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| Title: Re: PROOF -- Christians Know The Bible is False -- They just pretendit's not. |
29 Nov 2006 05:13:34 PM |
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Grestang wrote:
"AcesLucky" <aceslucky@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:WEhbh.897$XU2.104@newsfe12.phx...
Christians...
You calling god a liar? Take a look.
Mark 11:24:
Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you
have received it, and it will be yours.
<snip>
Maybe we should take a look at Jesus' own prayer in the Garden of
Gethsemane. He prayed to the Father, but He also stated that it should be
done according to the Father's will, and not his.
That's the equivalent of not praying at all.
Dear god, do "X", but only if you were going to do "X" anyway.
Similarly with your
cancer argument. Now, if this is where you go into a spleel about God being
Dear god; cure all cancer, but only if you were going to
kill all cancer anyway.
Dear god; why do you need my prayer if you're not going to
do anything you weren't already going to do anyway?
I don't know, Grestang. Sounds like you're making an awfully
weak argument (excuse for it not working).
Jesus is very clear. Ask in my name and it shall be granted.
Why all the excuses? Is there anyone who can claim to be
Christian and be HONEST about these things?
Why do you need to make excuses for it not working?
What would happen if you were straight honest about it?
(Then you'd have to be honest about everything else! And the
house of cards comes falling, doesn't it?)
cold and heartless because He chooses not to make cancer and suffering
disappear, don't even waste your time. Suffering is a part of the human
condition. It would also be foolish to think that God does not use
suffering to further His own will....a will which often brings benefit to
those who suffer and those who love them.
.
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| User: "Grestang" |
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| Title: Re: PROOF -- Christians Know The Bible is False -- They just pretend it's not. |
29 Nov 2006 10:36:11 PM |
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"AcesLucky" <aceslucky@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:Buobh.4$lP5.3@newsfe07.phx...
Grestang wrote:
"AcesLucky" <aceslucky@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:WEhbh.897$XU2.104@newsfe12.phx...
Christians...
You calling god a liar? Take a look.
Mark 11:24:
Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you
have received it, and it will be yours.
<snip>
Maybe we should take a look at Jesus' own prayer in the Garden of
Gethsemane. He prayed to the Father, but He also stated that it should
be done according to the Father's will, and not his.
That's the equivalent of not praying at all.
Dear god, do "X", but only if you were going to do "X" anyway.
God would do "X" anyway regardless of whether we asked Him to do it only if
He were already going to do it. Its an issue of understanding and
submission. Jesus asked the Father to take away what was the come, but He
recognized the importance of Him mission and wanted to make it clear that He
was willing to care out what He was to do. Sort of like saying "If there's
any other way to do this, please do it that way...but I'm more than willing
to do it if this is your will."
Similarly with your
cancer argument. Now, if this is where you go into a spleel about God
being
Dear god; cure all cancer, but only if you were going to kill all cancer
anyway.
Dear god; why do you need my prayer if you're not going to do anything you
weren't already going to do anyway?
I don't know, Grestang. Sounds like you're making an awfully weak argument
(excuse for it not working).
I understand what you're saying. What Jesus said is that if you ask
something for God's glory, it will be given to you. Yes, its all about
glory. Despite what "The Purpose Driven Life" says, and what the "name it,
claim it" crowd says, the Gospel is all about God's grace and His love for
the elect. The Gospel has never been about making people happy or rich.
Jesus is very clear. Ask in my name and it shall be granted. Why all the
excuses? Is there anyone who can claim to be Christian and be HONEST about
these things?
Why do you need to make excuses for it not working?
What would happen if you were straight honest about it? (Then you'd have
to be honest about everything else! And the house of cards comes falling,
doesn't it?)
In John 14:14, Jesus makes a similar statement: "You may ask me for anything
in my name, and I will do it." This again seems to be saying that if you
pray for the moon to turn into cheese Jesus is bound by His word to make it
happen! But, what is the context of this statement? People have taken
Bible verses out of context throughout history to justify all kinds of
ludicrous behavior. The verse prior says "And I will do whatever you ask in
my name, so that the Son may bring glory to the Father." This is why I say
its all about God's glory. Let's say someone did ask God to take away
cancer, and He did. That's great, but most everyone is still going to die
anyway at some point. There will still be pain, and there will still be
suffering in this life. That is the result of the human condition.
I've answered these things in an honest way, and this what they mean! Look,
let's imagine that you and some friends are going to create a religion.
You're going to make a book containing some of your philosophy in it, and
include some stories about things that never happened. I'll go out on a
limb and say that's probably what you think about the Bible. If you were
going to create a false religion, why would you include one of the teachings
to be that if any of your followers ask/wish/imagine something to happen
that it will happen? That's crazy! As soon as your followers didn't get
the BMW's and mansions they wished for they'd consider you a con man, and
leave you. If the writers of the Bible were concocting a story, they'd be
at least as insightful as I am (not saying a whole lot), and wouldn't put
something in there which can very obviously disprove them.
.
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| User: "AcesLucky" |
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| Title: Re: PROOF -- Christians Know The Bible is False -- They just pretendit's not. |
30 Nov 2006 01:07:59 AM |
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Grestang wrote:
"AcesLucky" <aceslucky@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:Buobh.4$lP5.3@newsfe07.phx...
Grestang wrote:
"AcesLucky" <aceslucky@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:WEhbh.897$XU2.104@newsfe12.phx...
Christians...
You calling god a liar? Take a look.
Mark 11:24:
Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you
have received it, and it will be yours.
<snip>
Maybe we should take a look at Jesus' own prayer in the Garden of
Gethsemane. He prayed to the Father, but He also stated that it should
be done according to the Father's will, and not his.
That's the equivalent of not praying at all.
Dear god, do "X", but only if you were going to do "X" anyway.
God would do "X" anyway regardless of whether we asked Him to do it only if
He were already going to do it. Its an issue of understanding and
submission. Jesus asked the Father to take away what was the come, but He
recognized the importance of Him mission and wanted to make it clear that He
was willing to care out what He was to do. Sort of like saying "If there's
any other way to do this, please do it that way...but I'm more than willing
to do it if this is your will."
Similarly with your
cancer argument. Now, if this is where you go into a spleel about God
being
Dear god; cure all cancer, but only if you were going to kill all cancer
anyway.
Dear god; why do you need my prayer if you're not going to do anything you
weren't already going to do anyway?
I don't know, Grestang. Sounds like you're making an awfully weak argument
(excuse for it not working).
I understand what you're saying. What Jesus said is that if you ask
something for God's glory, it will be given to you. Yes, its all about
glory. Despite what "The Purpose Driven Life" says, and what the "name it,
claim it" crowd says, the Gospel is all about God's grace and His love for
the elect. The Gospel has never been about making people happy or rich.
Jesus is very clear. Ask in my name and it shall be granted. Why all the
excuses? Is there anyone who can claim to be Christian and be HONEST about
these things?
Why do you need to make excuses for it not working?
What would happen if you were straight honest about it? (Then you'd have
to be honest about everything else! And the house of cards comes falling,
doesn't it?)
In John 14:14, Jesus makes a similar statement: "You may ask me for anything
in my name, and I will do it." This again seems to be saying that if you
pray for the moon to turn into cheese Jesus is bound by His word to make it
happen! But, what is the context of this statement?
I object!!!!
That's been the Christian excuse for ages. Whenever your
bible is proved stupid, factually wrong, or just plain too
ignorant, you always resort to context.
YOU TELL ME, what context was Jesus talking about when he
made those statements over and over.
What is the context that YOU understand? I'm not asking that
the moon be turned to cheese. I'm asking to cure a disease!
Something he supposedly was doing ANYWAY! So how could it
be out of context?
Explain.
People have taken
Bible verses out of context throughout history to justify all kinds of
ludicrous behavior. The verse prior says "And I will do whatever you ask in
my name, so that the Son may bring glory to the Father." This is why I say
its all about God's glory.
That was directly accounted for in the prayer. Go back up
top and read it!
Let's say someone did ask God to take away
cancer, and He did. That's great, but most everyone is still going to die
anyway at some point. There will still be pain, and there will still be
suffering in this life. That is the result of the human condition.
I've answered these things in an honest way, and this what they mean! Look,
let's imagine that you and some friends are going to create a religion.
You're going to make a book containing some of your philosophy in it, and
include some stories about things that never happened. I'll go out on a
limb and say that's probably what you think about the Bible. If you were
going to create a false religion, why would you include one of the teachings
to be that if any of your followers ask/wish/imagine something to happen
that it will happen? That's crazy! As soon as your followers didn't get
the BMW's and mansions they wished for they'd consider you a con man, and
leave you. If the writers of the Bible were concocting a story, they'd be
at least as insightful as I am (not saying a whole lot), and wouldn't put
something in there which can very obviously disprove them.
And yet they did. They were believers in superstition. They
had little science, so the masses were very gullible, ready
to believe just about anything. (Besides, not believing was
punishable by death!)
Fact: people are gullible and can be easily fooled. REASON
shines light, and exposes the false. Use your head and TEST
if the assertions are really true.
You don't need to take anyone's word. Just test it; but be
honest about it, and report your honest findings.
.
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| User: "Wild Bill" |
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| Title: Re: PROOF -- Christians Know The Bible is False -- They just pretend it's not. |
01 Dec 2006 04:14:56 PM |
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"AcesLucky" <aceslucky@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:krvbh.6273$dC7.3206@newsfe07.phx...
Grestang wrote:
"AcesLucky" <aceslucky@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:Buobh.4$lP5.3@newsfe07.phx...
Grestang wrote:
"AcesLucky" <aceslucky@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:WEhbh.897$XU2.104@newsfe12.phx...
Christians...
You calling god a liar? Take a look.
Mark 11:24:
Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you
have received it, and it will be yours.
<snip>
Maybe we should take a look at Jesus' own prayer in the Garden of
Gethsemane. He prayed to the Father, but He also stated that it should
be done according to the Father's will, and not his.
That's the equivalent of not praying at all.
Dear god, do "X", but only if you were going to do "X" anyway.
God would do "X" anyway regardless of whether we asked Him to do it only
if He were already going to do it. Its an issue of understanding and
submission. Jesus asked the Father to take away what was the come, but
He recognized the importance of Him mission and wanted to make it clear
that He was willing to care out what He was to do. Sort of like saying
"If there's any other way to do this, please do it that way...but I'm
more than willing to do it if this is your will."
Similarly with your
cancer argument. Now, if this is where you go into a spleel about God
being
Dear god; cure all cancer, but only if you were going to kill all cancer
anyway.
Dear god; why do you need my prayer if you're not going to do anything
you weren't already going to do anyway?
I don't know, Grestang. Sounds like you're making an awfully weak
argument (excuse for it not working).
I understand what you're saying. What Jesus said is that if you ask
something for God's glory, it will be given to you. Yes, its all about
glory. Despite what "The Purpose Driven Life" says, and what the "name
it, claim it" crowd says, the Gospel is all about God's grace and His
love for the elect. The Gospel has never been about making people happy
or rich.
Jesus is very clear. Ask in my name and it shall be granted. Why all the
excuses? Is there anyone who can claim to be Christian and be HONEST
about these things?
Why do you need to make excuses for it not working?
What would happen if you were straight honest about it? (Then you'd have
to be honest about everything else! And the house of cards comes
falling, doesn't it?)
In John 14:14, Jesus makes a similar statement: "You may ask me for
anything in my name, and I will do it." This again seems to be saying
that if you pray for the moon to turn into cheese Jesus is bound by His
word to make it happen! But, what is the context of this statement?
I object!!!!
That's been the Christian excuse for ages. Whenever your bible is proved
stupid, factually wrong, or just plain too ignorant, you always resort to
context.
YOU TELL ME, what context was Jesus talking about when he made those
statements over and over.
What is the context that YOU understand? I'm not asking that the moon be
turned to cheese. I'm asking to cure a disease! Something he supposedly
was doing ANYWAY! So how could it be out of context?
Explain.
People have taken
Bible verses out of context throughout history to justify all kinds of
ludicrous behavior. The verse prior says "And I will do whatever you ask
in my name, so that the Son may bring glory to the Father." This is why
I say its all about God's glory.
That was directly accounted for in the prayer. Go back up top and read it!
Let's say someone did ask God to take away
cancer, and He did. That's great, but most everyone is still going to
die anyway at some point. There will still be pain, and there will still
be suffering in this life. That is the result of the human condition.
I've answered these things in an honest way, and this what they mean!
Look, let's imagine that you and some friends are going to create a
religion. You're going to make a book containing some of your philosophy
in it, and include some stories about things that never happened. I'll
go out on a limb and say that's probably what you think about the Bible.
If you were going to create a false religion, why would you include one
of the teachings to be that if any of your followers ask/wish/imagine
something to happen that it will happen? That's crazy! As soon as your
followers didn't get the BMW's and mansions they wished for they'd
consider you a con man, and leave you. If the writers of the Bible were
concocting a story, they'd be at least as insightful as I am (not saying
a whole lot), and wouldn't put something in there which can very
obviously disprove them.
And yet they did. They were believers in superstition. They had little
science, so the masses were very gullible, ready to believe just about
anything. (Besides, not believing was punishable by death!)
Fact: people are gullible and can be easily fooled. REASON shines light,
and exposes the false. Use your head and TEST if the assertions are really
true.
You don't need to take anyone's word. Just test it; but be honest about
it, and report your honest findings.
One of the problems of believers is that they believe that Jesus did in fact
say everything he is quoted in the N.T. However, the 200 scholars/fellows of
the Jesus Seminar determined that less than 20% of the words attributed to
Jesus were actually spoken by him. Apparently the myth-makers put most of
the N.T. words into his mouth. I'd give the historical Jesus credit for
being smart enough not to make the stupid statements being discussed on this
thread.
Shalom,
Bill
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| User: "gatekeeper" |
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| Title: Re: PROOF -- Christians Know The Bible is False -- They just pretend it's not. |
01 Dec 2006 08:33:50 PM |
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Wild Bill wrote:
"AcesLucky" <aceslucky@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:krvbh.6273$dC7.3206@newsfe07.phx...
Grestang wrote:
"AcesLucky" <aceslucky@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:Buobh.4$lP5.3@newsfe07.phx...
Grestang wrote:
"AcesLucky" <aceslucky@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:WEhbh.897$XU2.104@newsfe12.phx...
Christians...
You calling god a liar? Take a look.
Mark 11:24:
Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you
have received it, and it will be yours.
<snip>
Maybe we should take a look at Jesus' own prayer in the Garden of
Gethsemane. He prayed to the Father, but He also stated that it should
be done according to the Father's will, and not his.
That's the equivalent of not praying at all.
Dear god, do "X", but only if you were going to do "X" anyway.
God would do "X" anyway regardless of whether we asked Him to do it only
if He were already going to do it. Its an issue of understanding and
submission. Jesus asked the Father to take away what was the come, but
He recognized the importance of Him mission and wanted to make it clear
that He was willing to care out what He was to do. Sort of like saying
"If there's any other way to do this, please do it that way...but I'm
more than willing to do it if this is your will."
Similarly with your
cancer argument. Now, if this is where you go into a spleel about God
being
Dear god; cure all cancer, but only if you were going to kill all cancer
anyway.
Dear god; why do you need my prayer if you're not going to do anything
you weren't already going to do anyway?
I don't know, Grestang. Sounds like you're making an awfully weak
argument (excuse for it not working).
I understand what you're saying. What Jesus said is that if you ask
something for God's glory, it will be given to you. Yes, its all about
glory. Despite what "The Purpose Driven Life" says, and what the "name
it, claim it" crowd says, the Gospel is all about God's grace and His
love for the elect. The Gospel has never been about making people happy
or rich.
Jesus is very clear. Ask in my name and it shall be granted. Why all the
excuses? Is there anyone who can claim to be Christian and be HONEST
about these things?
Why do you need to make excuses for it not working?
What would happen if you were straight honest about it? (Then you'd have
to be honest about everything else! And the house of cards comes
falling, doesn't it?)
In John 14:14, Jesus makes a similar statement: "You may ask me for
anything in my name, and I will do it." This again seems to be saying
that if you pray for the moon to turn into cheese Jesus is bound by His
word to make it happen! But, what is the context of this statement?
I object!!!!
That's been the Christian excuse for ages. Whenever your bible is proved
stupid, factually wrong, or just plain too ignorant, you always resort to
context.
YOU TELL ME, what context was Jesus talking about when he made those
statements over and over.
What is the context that YOU understand? I'm not asking that the moon be
turned to cheese. I'm asking to cure a disease! Something he supposedly
was doing ANYWAY! So how could it be out of context?
Explain.
People have taken
Bible verses out of context throughout history to justify all kinds of
ludicrous behavior. The verse prior says "And I will do whatever you ask
in my name, so that the Son may bring glory to the Father." This is why
I say its all about God's glory.
That was directly accounted for in the prayer. Go back up top and read it!
Let's say someone did ask God to take away
cancer, and He did. That's great, but most everyone is still going to
die anyway at some point. There will still be pain, and there will still
be suffering in this life. That is the result of the human condition.
I've answered these things in an honest way, and this what they mean!
Look, let's imagine that you and some friends are going to create a
religion. You're going to make a book containing some of your philosophy
in it, and include some stories about things that never happened. I'll
go out on a limb and say that's probably what you think about the Bible.
If you were going to create a false religion, why would you include one
of the teachings to be that if any of your followers ask/wish/imagine
something to happen that it will happen? That's crazy! As soon as your
followers didn't get the BMW's and mansions they wished for they'd
consider you a con man, and leave you. If the writers of the Bible were
concocting a story, they'd be at least as insightful as I am (not saying
a whole lot), and wouldn't put something in there which can very
obviously disprove them.
And yet they did. They were believers in superstition. They had little
science, so the masses were very gullible, ready to believe just about
anything. (Besides, not believing was punishable by death!)
Fact: people are gullible and can be easily fooled. REASON shines light,
and exposes the false. Use your head and TEST if the assertions are really
true.
You don't need to take anyone's word. Just test it; but be honest about
it, and report your honest findings.
One of the problems of believers is that they believe that Jesus did in fact
say everything he is quoted in the N.T. However, the 200 scholars/fellows of
the Jesus Seminar determined that less than 20% of the words attributed to
Jesus were actually spoken by him. Apparently the myth-makers put most of
the N.T. words into his mouth. I'd give the historical Jesus credit for
being smart enough not to make the stupid statements being discussed on this
thread.
Shalom,
Bill
Thank you for confessing that your statements on the thread are stupid!
The Eastgate is open, the King is in Residence! Whosoever will, may
come in!
Gatekeeper
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| User: "Gary Eickmeier" |
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| Title: Re: PROOF -- Christians Know The Bible is False -- They just pretendit's not. |
02 Dec 2006 11:59:06 AM |
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Wild Bill wrote:
One of the problems of believers is that they believe that Jesus did in fact
say everything he is quoted in the N.T. However, the 200 scholars/fellows of
the Jesus Seminar determined that less than 20% of the words attributed to
Jesus were actually spoken by him. Apparently the myth-makers put most of
the N.T. words into his mouth. I'd give the historical Jesus credit for
being smart enough not to make the stupid statements being discussed on this
thread.
Good point - but then, it is more likely than not that the entire bible
was written by sincere but delusional men trying to control a
population. If there was a historical Jesus, he certainly was not the
"son" of God, a concept so bizarre as to border on deceitful.
Gary Eickmeier
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| User: "gatekeeper" |
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| Title: Re: PROOF -- Christians Know The Bible is False -- They just pretend it's not. |
02 Dec 2006 01:40:03 PM |
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Gary Eickmeier wrote:
Wild Bill wrote:
One of the problems of believers is that they believe that Jesus did in fact
say everything he is quoted in the N.T. However, the 200 scholars/fellows of
the Jesus Seminar determined that less than 20% of the words attributed to
Jesus were actually spoken by him. Apparently the myth-makers put most of
the N.T. words into his mouth. I'd give the historical Jesus credit for
being smart enough not to make the stupid statements being discussed on this
thread.
Good point - but then, it is more likely than not that the entire bible
was written by sincere but delusional men trying to control a
population. If there was a historical Jesus, he certainly was not the
"son" of God, a concept so bizarre as to border on deceitful.
Gary Eickmeier
And your basis of saying this is what? Wishful thinking?
The Eastgate is open, the King is in Residence! Whosoever will, may
come in!
Gatekeeper
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| User: "AcesLucky" |
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| Title: Re: PROOF -- Christians Know The Bible is False -- They just pretendit's not. |
02 Dec 2006 02:58:28 PM |
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gatekeeper wrote:
Gary Eickmeier wrote:
Wild Bill wrote:
One of the problems of believers is that they believe that Jesus did in fact
say everything he is quoted in the N.T. However, the 200 scholars/fellows of
the Jesus Seminar determined that less than 20% of the words attributed to
Jesus were actually spoken by him. Apparently the myth-makers put most of
the N.T. words into his mouth. I'd give the historical Jesus credit for
being smart enough not to make the stupid statements being discussed on this
thread.
Good point - but then, it is more likely than not that the entire bible
was written by sincere but delusional men trying to control a
population. If there was a historical Jesus, he certainly was not the
"son" of God, a concept so bizarre as to border on deceitful.
Gary Eickmeier
And your basis of saying this is what? Wishful thinking?
In Matthew 18:19 Jesus says:
"Again I say to you, if two of you agree on earth about
anything they ask, it will be done for them by my Father in
heaven. For where two or three are gathered in my name,
there am I in the midst of them."
That's as strong a basis as you can get. What do you think
we've been talking about?
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| User: "gatekeeper" |
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| Title: Re: PROOF -- Christians Know The Bible is False -- They just pretend it's not. |
02 Dec 2006 03:49:13 PM |
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AcesLucky wrote:
gatekeeper wrote:
Gary Eickmeier wrote:
Wild Bill wrote:
One of the problems of believers is that they believe that Jesus did in fact
say everything he is quoted in the N.T. However, the 200 scholars/fellows of
the Jesus Seminar determined that less than 20% of the words attributed to
Jesus were actually spoken by him. Apparently the myth-makers put most of
the N.T. words into his mouth. I'd give the historical Jesus credit for
being smart enough not to make the stupid statements being discussed on this
thread.
Good point - but then, it is more likely than not that the entire bible
was written by sincere but delusional men trying to control a
population. If there was a historical Jesus, he certainly was not the
"son" of God, a concept so bizarre as to border on deceitful.
Gary Eickmeier
And your basis of saying this is what? Wishful thinking?
In Matthew 18:19 Jesus says:
"Again I say to you, if two of you agree on earth about
anything they ask, it will be done for them by my Father in
heaven. For where two or three are gathered in my name,
there am I in the midst of them."
That's as strong a basis as you can get. What do you think
we've been talking about?
Gary said that "Jesus is not the Son of God," and I totally understand
that this is what you have been talking about from the very beginning
of this thread!
Your use and application of Matt 18:19 to yourself, as to two of you
being in agreement on this, is almost laughable. Jesus was speaking
about when two believers get together and agree, then it will be done
for them by His Father! He is not talking about when two unbelievers
agree about anything, that any good will come out of it at all!
That your basis, and Gary's basis for saying that Jesus is not the son
of God, is nothing more than the wishful thinking of a couple raunchy
unbelievers! You have no creditablity that I can find for what you
say, it is still nothing more than ignorance and foolishness!
The Eastgate is open, the King is in Residence! Whosoever will, may
come in!
Gatekeeper
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| User: "Gary Eickmeier" |
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| Title: Re: PROOF -- Christians Know The Bible is False -- They just pretendit's not. |
02 Dec 2006 06:42:59 PM |
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gatekeeper wrote:
Gary said that "Jesus is not the Son of God," and I totally understand
that this is what you have been talking about from the very beginning
of this thread!
Your use and application of Matt 18:19 to yourself, as to two of you
being in agreement on this, is almost laughable. Jesus was speaking
about when two believers get together and agree, then it will be done
for them by His Father! He is not talking about when two unbelievers
agree about anything, that any good will come out of it at all!
That your basis, and Gary's basis for saying that Jesus is not the son
of God, is nothing more than the wishful thinking of a couple raunchy
unbelievers! You have no creditablity that I can find for what you
say, it is still nothing more than ignorance and foolishness!
Gatey, lift your head up into the air for a moment. Shake it off. Think.
Why would GOD need to impregnate a woman to have a "son" who would then
grow up to be killed as a human by the humans that he was "saving" from
their sins? Can you explain this "atonement" theology? Can you imagine
GOD tramping around on the Earth among us? It reeks so much of Greek and
Roman and other pagan mythology that I suspect it strongly. Besides
which, the burden of proof would be on the believers, not on the
unbelievers to prove that it did not happen. It is far more unlikely
than likely.
Gary Eickmeier
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| User: "gatekeeper" |
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| Title: Re: PROOF -- Christians Know The Bible is False -- They just pretend it's not. |
03 Dec 2006 01:39:18 AM |
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Gary Eickmeier wrote:
gatekeeper wrote:
Gary said that "Jesus is not the Son of God," and I totally understand
that this is what you have been talking about from the very beginning
of this thread!
Your use and application of Matt 18:19 to yourself, as to two of you
being in agreement on this, is almost laughable. Jesus was speaking
about when two believers get together and agree, then it will be done
for them by His Father! He is not talking about when two unbelievers
agree about anything, that any good will come out of it at all!
That your basis, and Gary's basis for saying that Jesus is not the son
of God, is nothing more than the wishful thinking of a couple raunchy
unbelievers! You have no creditablity that I can find for what you
say, it is still nothing more than ignorance and foolishness!
Gatey, lift your head up into the air for a moment. Shake it off. Think.
Why would GOD need to impregnate a woman to have a "son" who would then
grow up to be killed as a human by the humans that he was "saving" from
their sins? Can you explain this "atonement" theology? Can you imagine
GOD tramping around on the Earth among us? It reeks so much of Greek and
Roman and other pagan mythology that I suspect it strongly. Besides
which, the burden of proof would be on the believers, not on the
unbelievers to prove that it did not happen. It is far more unlikely
than likely.
Gary Eickmeier
With all your education, God's ways are still way beyond your
understanding? I am not at all surprised because the things of God are
spiritually discerned! I thank you for your total admission that you
do not know anything about what God the Father thinks about, and why
his Love for the world, would cause Him to send His only begotten Son,
Jesus, to be born of a virgin, walk in the mud and dust of this Earth,
among us, to die, to be buried, and to be raised from the dead on the
third Day! This is indeed the greatest miracle that has ever occurred!
So do not be ashamed that you do no understand these things, for some
of the greatest minds that ever lived have not understood it either!
On the other hand, know that even small children can and do believe
this amazing account of God's Love! Also the poor and the weak and the
unlearned! For the Scriptures say it is harder for a rich man to enter
the Kingdom of God, than for a camel to enter the eye of the needle!
So with all your understanding, and education, you are very rich!
If you would understand these things, then you must humble yourself
under the Hand of God, and He will lift you up! He will by the Holy
Spirit teach you all the mysteries of God and Godliness! You must
become as a little child!
The Eastgate is open, the King is in Residence! Whosoever will, may
come in!
Gatekeeper
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| User: "SheBlewHimDidYouBlowHim" |
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| Title: Re: PROOF -- Christians Know The Bible is False -- They just pretend it's not. |
03 Dec 2006 02:55:16 PM |
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God the Father thinks about, and why
his Love for the world, would cause Him to send His only begotten Son,
Jesus, to be born of a virgin, walk in the mud and dust of this Earth,
among us, to die, to be buried, and to be raised from the dead on the
third Day! This is indeed the greatest miracle that has ever occurred!
religion is the GREATEST SCAM that's ever been inflicted on humanity
so, supposedly this COLD-HEARTED ***** "loving, caring" (and for eric,
NON-JEHOVAH) christian sky buddy god sent his only son down to earth for the
sole purpose of being killed to forgive sin that he created in the first
place.
However,. this ***** son of his didn't stay dead, I guess, so much for
"giving his only son", huh?
..
After three days, this ***** son of god's "ROSE FROM THE DEAD" to sit at
the right hand of his father.
Mark 14:62 (New International Version)
62"I am," said Jesus. "And you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right
hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven." .....first off,
you shouldn't be jacking off and "coming" on the clouds of heaven.
Hey christian god jackass, here's a hint for you, you dumbass fucking moron,
if you're going to give your only son, then that doesn't mean that he's
allowed to just show back up at your front door like nothing ever happened.
If you're going to send him down for the sole purpose of being killed to
forgive sin which you created in the first fucking place, then your *****
son should STAY DEAD.
Hey, ***** CHRISTIAN SKY BUDDY, Why the hell does your ***** son get
to come back and be by your side, when you specifically MURDERED my father,
my uncle, my grandparents, and won't let any of them come back and sit by my
right hand, you know like your ***** son is sitting by your right hand?
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| User: "Father Haskell" |
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| Title: Re: PROOF -- Christians Know The Bible is False -- They just pretend it's not. |
03 Dec 2006 06:11:32 PM |
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gatekeeper wrote:
With all your education, God's ways are still way beyond your
understanding?
What education does it require to know a scam when you
smell one?
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| User: "Gary Eickmeier" |
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| Title: Re: PROOF -- Christians Know The Bible is False -- They just pretendit's not. |
03 Dec 2006 10:44:47 PM |
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gatekeeper wrote:
With all your education, God's ways are still way beyond your
understanding? I am not at all surprised because the things of God are
spiritually discerned! I thank you for your total admission that you
do not know anything about what God the Father thinks about, and why
his Love for the world, would cause Him to send His only begotten Son,
Jesus, to be born of a virgin, walk in the mud and dust of this Earth,
among us, to die, to be buried, and to be raised from the dead on the
third Day! This is indeed the greatest miracle that has ever occurred!
Let's take this one at a time.
Beyond my understanding? What have you seen that is beyond your
understanding? I haven't seen anything yet. I've heard a lot of stories,
but that's about it.
Nor do you know anything God the father is thinking.
Only begotten son? Why would one man be any more the "son" of God than
anyone else? Wasn't Adam the first son of God? He made Adam with his own
hands. Made Eve with a rib. These were not the son and daughter of God?
His love for the world? Do you realize what we are being "saved" from?
It is a God who has condemned every living person to hell for eternity.
The greatest miracle? Did you see it? Do you have any idea if it even
happened? Why? How? Why would you believe a story that you know nothing
about?
Shake it off again - just for a moment. Do you believe in the Easter
Bunny? Why not? Do you think that if the bible story really happened, it
wouldn't have been recorded by every historian who was awake at the
time? Would it not be the most sensational event that ever happened on
this planet? So why was it just promoted by a religious group? Why is it
not found in any texts from the time? Why wouldn't we have a bust, or a
picture, or a manuscript, fingerprint, lock of hair, anything to prove
that he was here?
Gary Eickmeier
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| User: "AcesLucky" |
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| Title: Re: PROOF -- Christians Know The Bible is False -- They just pretendit's not. |
04 Dec 2006 10:04:32 AM |
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Gary Eickmeier wrote:
gatekeeper wrote:
With all your education, God's ways are still way beyond your
understanding? I am not at all surprised because the things of God are
spiritually discerned! I thank you for your total admission that you
do not know anything about what God the Father thinks about, and why
his Love for the world, would cause Him to send His only begotten Son,
Jesus, to be born of a virgin, walk in the mud and dust of this Earth,
among us, to die, to be buried, and to be raised from the dead on the
third Day! This is indeed the greatest miracle that has ever occurred!
Let's take this one at a time.
Beyond my understanding? What have you seen that is beyond your
understanding? I haven't seen anything yet. I've heard a lot of stories,
but that's about it.
Nor do you know anything God the father is thinking.
Only begotten son? Why would one man be any more the "son" of God than
anyone else? Wasn't Adam the first son of God? He made Adam with his own
hands. Made Eve with a rib. These were not the son and daughter of God?
His love for the world? Do you realize what we are being "saved" from?
It is a God who has condemned every living person to hell for eternity.
The greatest miracle? Did you see it? Do you have any idea if it even
happened? Why? How? Why would you believe a story that you know nothing
about?
Shake it off again - just for a moment. Do you believe in the Easter
Bunny? Why not? Do you think that if the bible story really happened, it
wouldn't have been recorded by every historian who was awake at the
time? Would it not be the most sensational event that ever happened on
this planet? So why was it just promoted by a religious group? Why is it
not found in any texts from the time? Why wouldn't we have a bust, or a
picture, or a manuscript, fingerprint, lock of hair, anything to prove
that he was here?
Gary Eickmeier
gatekeeper's answer to this has to frustrate you. It's like
trying to reason with a 7 year old who doesn't want to give
up on the tooth fairy. He's heard other children attest to
quarters under their pillow in exchange for a tooth, and no
amount of reason can eliminate those stories.
The truly evil thing about faith is that it rewards
credulity. It makes gullibility a virtue. It makes honest
investigation a crime of character and enforces the
ignorance of superstition.
gatekeeper is a perfect example of it.
.
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| User: "gatekeeper" |
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| Title: Re: PROOF -- Christians Know The Bible is False -- They just pretend it's not. |
04 Dec 2006 06:57:40 PM |
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AcesLucky wrote:
Gary Eickmeier wrote:
gatekeeper wrote:
With all your education, God's ways are still way beyond your
understanding? I am not at all surprised because the things of God are
spiritually discerned! I thank you for your total admission that you
do not know anything about what God the Father thinks about, and why
his Love for the world, would cause Him to send His only begotten Son,
Jesus, to be born of a virgin, walk in the mud and dust of this Earth,
among us, to die, to be buried, and to be raised from the dead on the
third Day! This is indeed the greatest miracle that has ever occurred!
Let's take this one at a time.
Beyond my understanding? What have you seen that is beyond your
understanding? I haven't seen anything yet. I've heard a lot of stories,
but that's about it.
Nor do you know anything God the father is thinking.
Only begotten son? Why would one man be any more the "son" of God than
anyone else? Wasn't Adam the first son of God? He made Adam with his own
hands. Made Eve with a rib. These were not the son and daughter of God?
His love for the world? Do you realize what we are being "saved" from?
It is a God who has condemned every living person to hell for eternity.
The greatest miracle? Did you see it? Do you have any idea if it even
happened? Why? How? Why would you believe a story that you know nothing
about?
Shake it off again - just for a moment. Do you believe in the Easter
Bunny? Why not? Do you think that if the bible story really happened, it
wouldn't have been recorded by every historian who was awake at the
time? Would it not be the most sensational event that ever happened on
this planet? So why was it just promoted by a religious group? Why is it
not found in any texts from the time? Why wouldn't we have a bust, or a
picture, or a manuscript, fingerprint, lock of hair, anything to prove
that he was here?
Gary Eickmeier
gatekeeper's answer to this has to frustrate you. It's like
trying to reason with a 7 year old who doesn't want to give
up on the tooth fairy. He's heard other children attest to
quarters under their pillow in exchange for a tooth, and no
amount of reason can eliminate those stories.
The truly evil thing about faith is that it rewards
credulity. It makes gullibility a virtue. It makes honest
investigation a crime of character and enforces the
ignorance of superstition.
gatekeeper is a perfect example of it.
Thank You! I consider this a compliment that my faith should shine so
bright, that you call it perfect! However I must be quick to point out
that my faith is in the Faithfulness of God, who has proved Himself
Faithful through the various events of the almost 40 years that I have
been learning to walk in the Way! I have not always been such a
shining example of faith that it would warrant your compliment! During
those times though is the time that I found Him holding me all the more
secure in His hands of Love!
I thank Him for the revelation of His Love that He has made known to
me, and that I should have the opportunity to share it with you all! I
would pray that you also would have a clear vision of Him, even as He
revealed Himself to me, and said "Go and Fear not, for I am with you
always, where ever you go!" I did not have anyone else tell me that I
would see Him, but in His great Love, He showed Himself to me! That
image is burned into my spirit, and then He filled me with His Spirit
by which I have seen Him work many miracles of Love!
The Word is very important to me, and at all times affirms the things
that I have seen and heard, I could never turn my back on any of these
things as you suggest! All your suggestion only show your complete
misunderstanding of God and His Love! That you compare Him to the
tooth fairy, only exposes your own ignorance and foolishness! Now if
you were involved in honest investigation, then you would not be nearly
so willing to make disparaging comments that are not the sign of
intelligent and educated, and open-minded individual, but instead
someone that is dishonest and biased!
The Eastgate is open, the King is in Residence! Whosoever will, may
come in!
Gatekeeper
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| User: "Gary Eickmeier" |
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| Title: Re: PROOF -- Christians Know The Bible is False -- They just pretendit's not. |
04 Dec 2006 08:42:37 PM |
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gatekeeper wrote:
Thank You! I consider this a compliment that my faith should shine so
bright, that you call it perfect! However I must be quick to point out
that my faith is in the Faithfulness of God, who has proved Himself
Faithful through the various events of the almost 40 years that I have
been learning to walk in the Way!
In the immortal words of Ronald Reagan, "There you go again." Christians
are always walking somewhere.
I have not always been such a
shining example of faith that it would warrant your compliment! During
those times though is the time that I found Him holding me all the more
secure in His hands of Love!
Did you ever have an imaginary playmate when you were a kid? Was he the
only one who really understood you?
I thank Him for the revelation of His Love that He has made known to
me, and that I should have the opportunity to share it with you all!
May I ask exactly how this revelation took place? A holographic image? A
voice from a burning bush? Voices in your head?
I
would pray that you also would have a clear vision of Him, even as He
revealed Himself to me, and said "Go and Fear not, for I am with you
always, where ever you go!" I did not have anyone else tell me that I
would see Him, but in His great Love, He showed Himself to me!
When? How? Did you have your camera with you? Come on, Gatey - spill!
That
image is burned into my spirit, and then He filled me with His Spirit
by which I have seen Him work many miracles of Love!
The Word is very important to me, and at all times affirms the things
that I have seen and heard, I could never turn my back on any of these
things as you suggest! All your suggestion only show your complete
misunderstanding of God and His Love! That you compare Him to the
tooth fairy, only exposes your own ignorance and foolishness! Now if
you were involved in honest investigation, then you would not be nearly
so willing to make disparaging comments that are not the sign of
intelligent and educated, and open-minded individual, but instead
someone that is dishonest and biased!
Oops - now wait a minute. I think you crossed the line there, Gatey. I
can go along with your statements of faith and your warm toasty
feelings, but to say that questioning all this is dishonest, whereas
believing all of it hook, line, and sinker is honest, I must object. If
you were honest with yourself, you would realize that you haven't seen
any evidence of any of your faithy statements. You got every scrap of it
from an ancient book. My proof of that is that you and all of your
Christian faithy cohorts never say anything new, just keep quoting the
bible and retelling the stories. I would not call that a "revelation" of
any sort. No Lord has shown you *****; a minister or a parent has shown
you a book.
That's it.
Gary Eickmeier
The Eastgate is open, the King is in Residence! Whosoever will, may
come in!
Gatekeeper
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| User: "Gary Eickmeier" |
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| Title: Re: PROOF -- Christians Know The Bible is False -- They just pretendit's not. |
04 Dec 2006 08:13:44 PM |
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AcesLucky wrote:
gatekeeper's answer to this has to frustrate you. It's like trying to
reason with a 7 year old who doesn't want to give up on the tooth fairy.
He's heard other children attest to quarters under their pillow in
exchange for a tooth, and no amount of reason can eliminate those stories.
The truly evil thing about faith is that it rewards credulity. It makes
gullibility a virtue. It makes honest investigation a crime of character
and enforces the ignorance of superstition.
gatekeeper is a perfect example of it.
Amen.
He is not looking for any truth; he has already found it. The Holy
Babble is the word of almighty Gawd, and any questioning of it is a lack
of FAITH.
How are you going to beat that logic?
Gary Eickmeier
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| User: "gatekeeper" |
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| Title: Re: PROOF -- Christians Know The Bible is False -- They just pretend it's not. |
04 Dec 2006 08:45:33 PM |
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Gary Eickmeier wrote:
AcesLucky wrote:
gatekeeper's answer to this has to frustrate you. It's like trying to
reason with a 7 year old who doesn't want to give up on the tooth fairy.
He's heard other children attest to quarters under their pillow in
exchange for a tooth, and no amount of reason can eliminate those stories.
The truly evil thing about faith is that it rewards credulity. It makes
gullibility a virtue. It makes honest investigation a crime of character
and enforces the ignorance of superstition.
gatekeeper is a perfect example of it.
Amen.
He is not looking for any truth; he has already found it. The Holy
Babble is the word of almighty Gawd, and any questioning of it is a lack
of FAITH.
How are you going to beat that logic?
Gary Eickmeier
Once I experienced the Grace of His presence, you are correct, there
is no way that I would substitute anything that you have to offer! You
have been rude, crude, ignorant and foolish! What do you have that
could possibly compare! Even your logic is a sad substitute for His
Love, so I will stick with my faith, and be content! Contentment with
Godliness is great Gain, and I am very rich!
The Eastgate is open, the King is in Residence! Whosoever will, may
come in!
Gatekeeper
.
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| User: "Wild Bill" |
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| Title: Re: PROOF -- Christians Know The Bible is False -- They just pretend it's not. |
04 Dec 2006 09:11:22 PM |
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|
"gatekeeper" <gatekeeper.eastgate@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1165286733.236437.298310@l12g2000cwl.googlegroups.com...
Gary Eickmeier wrote:
AcesLucky wrote:
gatekeeper's answer to this has to frustrate you. It's like trying to
reason with a 7 year old who doesn't want to give up on the tooth
fairy.
He's heard other children attest to quarters under their pillow in
exchange for a tooth, and no amount of reason can eliminate those
stories.
The truly evil thing about faith is that it rewards credulity. It makes
gullibility a virtue. It makes honest investigation a crime of
character
and enforces the ignorance of superstition.
gatekeeper is a perfect example of it.
Amen.
He is not looking for any truth; he has already found it. The Holy
Babble is the word of almighty Gawd, and any questioning of it is a lack
of FAITH.
How are you going to beat that logic?
Gary Eickmeier
Once I experienced the Grace of His presence, you are correct, there
is no way that I would substitute anything that you have to offer! You
have been rude, crude, ignorant and foolish! What do you have that
could possibly compare! Even your logic is a sad substitute for His
Love, so I will stick with my faith, and be content! Contentment with
Godliness is great Gain, and I am very rich!
Pious, preachy ***** noted. Say Gatey, let's back up a bit to that fellow
you said grew eyeballs and gained his sight via yours and presumably other
Christians' prayers. Surely you have documentation of such a miraculous
occurrence. You know, the television, radio and press would have been all
over that. So please show us some examples of the media feeding frenzy that
day. Betcha all we get from you is more preachy *****, and if that's the
case, you won't be surprised when we call you a liar...will you?
Shalom,
Bill
The Eastgate is open, the King is in Residence! Whosoever will, may
come in!
Gatekeeper
.
|
|
|
| User: "gatekeeper" |
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| Title: Re: PROOF -- Christians Know The Bible is False -- They just pretend it's not. |
05 Dec 2006 02:17:42 AM |
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|
Wild Bill wrote:
"gatekeeper" <gatekeeper.eastgate@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1165286733.236437.298310@l12g2000cwl.googlegroups.com...
Gary Eickmeier wrote:
AcesLucky wrote:
gatekeeper's answer to this has to frustrate you. It's like trying to
reason with a 7 year old who doesn't want to give up on the tooth
fairy.
He's heard other children attest to quarters under their pillow in
exchange for a tooth, and no amount of reason can eliminate those
stories.
The truly evil thing about faith is that it rewards credulity. It makes
gullibility a virtue. It makes honest investigation a crime of
character
and enforces the ignorance of superstition.
gatekeeper is a perfect example of it.
Amen.
He is not looking for any truth; he has already found it. The Holy
Babble is the word of almighty Gawd, and any questioning of it is a lack
of FAITH.
How are you going to beat that logic?
Gary Eickmeier
Once I experienced the Grace of His presence, you are correct, there
is no way that I would substitute anything that you have to offer! You
have been rude, crude, ignorant and foolish! What do you have that
could possibly compare! Even your logic is a sad substitute for His
Love, so I will stick with my faith, and be content! Contentment with
Godliness is great Gain, and I am very rich!
Pious, preachy ***** noted. Say Gatey, let's back up a bit to that fellow
you said grew eyeballs and gained his sight via yours and presumably other
Christians' prayers. Surely you have documentation of such a miraculous
occurrence. You know, the television, radio and press would have been all
over that. So please show us some examples of the media feeding frenzy that
day. Betcha all we get from you is more preachy *****, and if that's the
case, you won't be surprised when we call you a liar...will you?
Shalom,
Bill
The Eastgate is open, the King is in Residence! Whosoever will, may
come in!
Gatekeeper
Jesus offered the nay-Sayers no proof, and I offer you no proof! It
was not done for you or the media, it was done for a blind man that God
had mercy on! I will pray that He will have mercy on you, that your
blind eyes will be opened as well, before it is too Late!
That you think that I am a liar, does not mean anything to me, for I
know what I have seen, and who I believe in! I know that my Redeemer
Lives, and that He shall be Glorified on the Day of Judgement, when all
men will see Him! That includes you, you shall see Him, and the
Scriptures says that you will gnash your teeth in fear! So you can be
cocky now, but the day will come when you will not be so cocky! In
that day, you will be cast into the fiery pit!
You now say shalom, but you do not know peace, for you do not know Him!
I pray that you will come to know Him, and repent of your sin, that
your sins will be forgiven! Then you shall know the peace of God that
passes understanding!
The Eastgate is open, the King is in Residence! Whosoever will, may
come in!
Gatekeeper
.
|
|
|
| User: "Wild Bill" |
|
| Title: Re: PROOF -- Christians Know The Bible is False -- They just pretend it's not. |
05 Dec 2006 07:58:40 AM |
|
|
"gatekeeper" <gatekeeper.eastgate@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1165306662.147239.242550@f1g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Wild Bill wrote:
"gatekeeper" <gatekeeper.eastgate@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1165286733.236437.298310@l12g2000cwl.googlegroups.com...
Gary Eickmeier wrote:
AcesLucky wrote:
gatekeeper's answer to this has to frustrate you. It's like trying
to
reason with a 7 year old who doesn't want to give up on the tooth
fairy.
He's heard other children attest to quarters under their pillow in
exchange for a tooth, and no amount of reason can eliminate those
stories.
The truly evil thing about faith is that it rewards credulity. It
makes
gullibility a virtue. It makes honest investigation a crime of
character
and enforces the ignorance of superstition.
gatekeeper is a perfect example of it.
Amen.
He is not looking for any truth; he has already found it. The Holy
Babble is the word of almighty Gawd, and any questioning of it is a
lack
of FAITH.
How are you going to beat that logic?
Gary Eickmeier
Once I experienced the Grace of His presence, you are correct, there
is no way that I would substitute anything that you have to offer! You
have been rude, crude, ignorant and foolish! What do you have that
could possibly compare! Even your logic is a sad substitute for His
Love, so I will stick with my faith, and be content! Contentment with
Godliness is great Gain, and I am very rich!
Pious, preachy ***** noted. Say Gatey, let's back up a bit to that
fellow
you said grew eyeballs and gained his sight via yours and presumably
other
Christians' prayers. Surely you have documentation of such a miraculous
occurrence. You know, the television, radio and press would have been all
over that. So please show us some examples of the media feeding frenzy
that
day. Betcha all we get from you is more preachy *****, and if that's
the
case, you won't be surprised when we call you a liar...will you?
Shalom,
Bill
The Eastgate is open, the King is in Residence! Whosoever will, may
come in!
Gatekeeper
Jesus offered the nay-Sayers no proof, and I offer you no proof! It
was not done for you or the media, it was done for a blind man that God
had mercy on! I will pray that He will have mercy on you, that your
blind eyes will be opened as well, before it is too Late!
That you think that I am a liar, does not mean anything to me, for I
know what I have seen, and who I believe in! I know that my Redeemer
Lives, and that He shall be Glorified on the Day of Judgement, when all
men will see Him! That includes you, you shall see Him, and the
Scriptures says that you will gnash your teeth in fear! So you can be
cocky now, but the day will come when you will not be so cocky! In
that day, you will be cast into the fiery pit!
You now say shalom, but you do not know peace, for you do not know Him!
I pray that you will come to know Him, and repent of your sin, that
your sins will be forgiven! Then you shall know the peace of God that
passes understanding!
Yep, just as I predicted; no documentation or evidence presented about
Gatekeeper's blind man who miraculously grew new eyeballs. Does anyone
besides me detect a strong stench of mendacity in Gatey's claim? As far as
I'm concerned, he now has a new name...Liekeeper!
Shalom,
Bill
The Eastgate is open, the King is in Residence! Whosoever will, may
come in!
Gatekeeper
.
|
|
|
| User: "gatekeeper" |
|
| Title: Re: PROOF -- Christians Know The Bible is False -- They just pretend it's not. |
05 Dec 2006 08:58:27 AM |
|
|
Wild Bill wrote:
"gatekeeper" <gatekeeper.eastgate@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1165306662.147239.242550@f1g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Wild Bill wrote:
"gatekeeper" <gatekeeper.eastgate@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1165286733.236437.298310@l12g2000cwl.googlegroups.com...
Gary Eickmeier wrote:
AcesLucky wrote:
gatekeeper's answer to this has to frustrate you. It's like trying
to
reason with a 7 year old who doesn't want to give up on the tooth
fairy.
He's heard other children attest to quarters under their pillow in
exchange for a tooth, and no amount of reason can eliminate those
stories.
The truly evil thing about faith is that it rewards credulity. It
makes
gullibility a virtue. It makes honest investigation a crime of
character
and enforces the ignorance of superstition.
gatekeeper is a perfect example of it.
Amen.
He is not looking for any truth; he has already found it. The Holy
Babble is the word of almighty Gawd, and any questioning of it is a
lack
of FAITH.
How are you going to beat that logic?
Gary Eickmeier
Once I experienced the Grace of His presence, you are correct, there
is no way that I would substitute anything that you have to offer! You
have been rude, crude, ignorant and foolish! What do you have that
could possibly compare! Even your logic is a sad substitute for His
Love, so I will stick with my faith, and be content! Contentment with
Godliness is great Gain, and I am very rich!
Pious, preachy ***** noted. Say Gatey, let's back up a bit to that
fellow
you said grew eyeballs and gained his sight via yours and presumably
other
Christians' prayers. Surely you have documentation of such a miraculous
occurrence. You know, the television, radio and press would have been all
over that. So please show us some examples of the media feeding frenzy
that
day. Betcha all we get from you is more preachy *****, and if that's
the
case, you won't be surprised when we call you a liar...will you?
Shalom,
Bill
The Eastgate is open, the King is in Residence! Whosoever will, may
come in!
Gatekeeper
Jesus offered the nay-Sayers no proof, and I offer you no proof! It
was not done for you or the media, it was done for a blind man that God
had mercy on! I will pray that He will have mercy on you, that your
blind eyes will be opened as well, before it is too Late!
That you think that I am a liar, does not mean anything to me, for I
know what I have seen, and who I believe in! I know that my Redeemer
Lives, and that He shall be Glorified on the Day of Judgement, when all
men will see Him! That includes you, you shall see Him, and the
Scriptures says that you will gnash your teeth in fear! So you can be
cocky now, but the day will come when you will not be so cocky! In
that day, you will be cast into the fiery pit!
You now say shalom, but you do not know peace, for you do not know Him!
I pray that you will come to know Him, and repent of your sin, that
your sins will be forgiven! Then you shall know the peace of God that
passes understanding!
Yep, just as I predicted; no documentation or evidence presented about
Gatekeeper's blind man who miraculously grew new eyeballs. Does anyone
besides me detect a strong stench of mendacity in Gatey's claim? As far as
I'm concerned, he now has a new name...Liekeeper!
Shalom,
Bill
The Eastgate is open, the King is in Residence! Whosoever will, may
come in!
Gatekeeper
And so they also accused Jesus with false accusation! | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
