Religions > Bible > Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim
| Topic: |
Religions > Bible |
| User: |
"Elroy Willis" |
| Date: |
18 Feb 2004 06:23:09 AM |
| Object: |
Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
Christopher A. Lee <calee@optonline.net> wrote in alt.atheism
Elroy Willis <elo@airmail.net> wrote:
Pastor Dave <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in alt.atheism
The fact is, we draw the line somewhere and for a Christian, aiding
a murder is where we must draw the line.
The woman was raped for Christ's sake!
Where the heck does the moron get "murder" from?
Preventing a blob of cells from implanting itself into the uteran
wall is considered murder by the cell-worshippers out there. That
little blob of cells is a potential human being, even though it
doesn't have a brain or heart or lungs or any other organs that
most people consider necessary to be human.
I guess that's the bottom line in this whole thing, isn't it?
Some people, like the pharmacists who got fired believe that, and
many, or maybe even most people disagree with them.
Nevermind that the woman was raped, or that naturally, not
all fertilized eggs manage to implant themselves and become
viable fetuses.
By supporting the denial of a "morning after" pill for rape victims,
people like Pastor Dave are ignoring all the horrors of being raped
in the first place. They seem to have no compassion at all for the
women involved. It's pitiful, really, in my opinion.
The potential baby which might have come about because of the
rape which God didn't feel necessary to stop, might grow up to
think of itself as a "gift from God," or might even become President
some day, championing the benefits of rape. Or it might follow in its
own father's footsteps, if it happens to be a male child, raping more
women in the future. If it's a female child, then the little girl can
thank her daddy for raping her mother. Yeah boy!
--
Elroy Willis
EAP Chief Editor and Newshound
http://web2.airmail.net/~elo/news
.
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| User: "Christopher A. Lee" |
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| Title: Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
18 Feb 2004 06:46:40 AM |
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On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 12:23:09 GMT, Elroy Willis <elo@airmail.net>
wrote:
Christopher A. Lee <calee@optonline.net> wrote in alt.atheism
Elroy Willis <elo@airmail.net> wrote:
Pastor Dave <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in alt.atheism
The fact is, we draw the line somewhere and for a Christian, aiding
a murder is where we must draw the line.
The woman was raped for Christ's sake!
Where the heck does the moron get "murder" from?
Preventing a blob of cells from implanting itself into the uteran
wall is considered murder by the cell-worshippers out there. That
little blob of cells is a potential human being, even though it
doesn't have a brain or heart or lungs or any other organs that
most people consider necessary to be human.
But these morons are hardly going to change people's minds by taking
an extreme polarised opposite stance and EEG accusing others of murder
- when it manifestly isn't.
When I still lived in the Bay Area I saw an Operation Rescue picket of
a clinic. There was so much hatred there you could feel it - from the
picketers who were screaming at the patients who were just going about
their business. Of course abortion was only one of the services
provided. Contraception and general gynaecology patients were all
murderers to be prevented from entering - and to have their hearts and
minds won over by vicious slander. Yeah, right.
Do you remember the episode of Law and Order where the judge was
sympathetic to a clinic bomber/murderer whose defence was that one
killing stopped thousands of murders and was therefore justified?
Where eventually a frustrated McCoy (the DA) trapped the judge by
calling on the bailiff to arrest a witness who admitted she had an
abortion before becoming anti-abortion. The judge snapped "but that's
not murder" and McCoy thanked him?
I guess that's the bottom line in this whole thing, isn't it?
Some people, like the pharmacists who got fired believe that, and
many, or maybe even most people disagree with them.
Nevermind that the woman was raped, or that naturally, not
all fertilized eggs manage to implant themselves and become
viable fetuses.
I know. It's pathetic.
Remember Jeff Warrender siding with Mother Theresa's refusal to give
the victims of organised rape by the Pakistani army in what is now
Bangladesh, what they needed, that led to deaths from both suicide and
botched abortion? And how he equated this with forgetting
contraception while drunk?
By supporting the denial of a "morning after" pill for rape victims,
people like Pastor Dave are ignoring all the horrors of being raped
in the first place. They seem to have no compassion at all for the
women involved. It's pitiful, really, in my opinion.
It's worse than that.
It's their "absolute inflexible morals" at work in a situation that
demonstrates exactly why ethics are situational. They are totally
unable to understand good or bad in terms of their effect on others.
What if it had been Oldridge's daughter? Or the pharmacist's?
The potential baby which might have come about because of the
rape which God didn't feel necessary to stop, might grow up to
think of itself as a "gift from God," or might even become President
some day, championing the benefits of rape. Or it might follow in its
own father's footsteps, if it happens to be a male child, raping more
women in the future. If it's a female child, then the little girl can
thank her daddy for raping her mother. Yeah boy!
Potential. That's the operative word. At this stage it's like the
difference between an acorn and an oak tree.
.
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| User: "Doc Smartass" |
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| Title: Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
18 Feb 2004 06:24:27 PM |
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Christopher A. Lee <calee@optonline.net> wrote in
news:dgm6305u7h8js2grm752800r7rngmj6fdl@4ax.com:
On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 12:23:09 GMT, Elroy Willis <elo@airmail.net>
wrote:
Christopher A. Lee <calee@optonline.net> wrote in alt.atheism
Elroy Willis <elo@airmail.net> wrote:
Pastor Dave <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in alt.atheism
The fact is, we draw the line somewhere and for a Christian, aiding
a murder is where we must draw the line.
The woman was raped for Christ's sake!
Where the heck does the moron get "murder" from?
Preventing a blob of cells from implanting itself into the uteran
wall is considered murder by the cell-worshippers out there. That
little blob of cells is a potential human being, even though it
doesn't have a brain or heart or lungs or any other organs that
most people consider necessary to be human.
But these morons are hardly going to change people's minds by taking
an extreme polarised opposite stance and EEG accusing others of murder
- when it manifestly isn't.
When I still lived in the Bay Area I saw an Operation Rescue picket of
a clinic. There was so much hatred there you could feel it - from the
picketers who were screaming at the patients who were just going about
their business. Of course abortion was only one of the services
provided. Contraception and general gynaecology patients were all
murderers to be prevented from entering - and to have their hearts and
minds won over by vicious slander. Yeah, right.
I used to be an escort for women coming to the two clinics here in
Pensacola.
I talked briefly to the first doctor to be shot; he was killed less than a
week later by Michael Griffin. The fundies had a field day. Some of them
showed up at the clinics and amused themselves by pointing fingers-as-guns
at us.
A year later, one of our own was killed: Jim Barrett was bringing Dr.
Britton to work from the airport. Jim was a great guy, retired Marines, and
a good escort. He and the doc were killed by Paul Hill. The fundies had a
field day with this, too.
For all their yapping about "godly love"...
--
Dr. Smartass
BAAWA Knight of Heckling -- a.a. #1939
"You should realize Usenet is a strange reality where you see people
beating up a patch of grass where nine years ago there used to be a
horse. " 01 July 2003, talk.origins
.
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| User: "Christopher A. Lee" |
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| Title: Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
18 Feb 2004 06:45:50 PM |
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On Thu, 19 Feb 2004 00:24:27 GMT, Doc Smartass
<gekiskivviesdo@astroboyskivviesmail.com> wrote:
I used to be an escort for women coming to the two clinics here in
Pensacola.
I talked briefly to the first doctor to be shot; he was killed less than a
week later by Michael Griffin. The fundies had a field day. Some of them
showed up at the clinics and amused themselves by pointing fingers-as-guns
at us.
I remeber Rush Limbaugh asking if it was so predictable, who was going
to be next - with a self satisfied smirk and attempting to be
menacing.
A year later, one of our own was killed: Jim Barrett was bringing Dr.
Britton to work from the airport. Jim was a great guy, retired Marines, and
a good escort. He and the doc were killed by Paul Hill. The fundies had a
field day with this, too.
For all their yapping about "godly love"...
.
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| User: "Elroy Willis" |
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| Title: Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
18 Feb 2004 08:35:17 AM |
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Christopher A. Lee <calee@optonline.net> wrote in alt.atheism
Elroy Willis <elo@airmail.net> wrote:
Christopher A. Lee <calee@optonline.net> wrote in alt.atheism
Elroy Willis <elo@airmail.net> wrote:
Pastor Dave <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in alt.atheism
The fact is, we draw the line somewhere and for a Christian, aiding
a murder is where we must draw the line.
The woman was raped for Christ's sake!
Where the heck does the moron get "murder" from?
Preventing a blob of cells from implanting itself into the uteran
wall is considered murder by the cell-worshippers out there. That
little blob of cells is a potential human being, even though it
doesn't have a brain or heart or lungs or any other organs that
most people consider necessary to be human.
But these morons are hardly going to change people's minds by taking
an extreme polarised opposite stance and EEG accusing others of murder
- when it manifestly isn't.
They're just voicing their right to freedom of speech and thought,
which is what makes this country better than some others, in my
opinion. I don't happen to agree with them, and I think their
opinions will be over-ruled by other people like myself.
When I still lived in the Bay Area I saw an Operation Rescue picket of
a clinic. There was so much hatred there you could feel it - from the
picketers who were screaming at the patients who were just going about
their business. Of course abortion was only one of the services
provided. Contraception and general gynaecology patients were all
murderers to be prevented from entering - and to have their hearts and
minds won over by vicious slander. Yeah, right.
After doing a little Googling around, I found one account of the
above story which says that there were actually some picketers at the
above site.
From:
http://www.kltv.com/Global/story.asp?S=1628793
"Nearly 40 people started protesting the drug store once word of the
incident spread."
Good for them.
Do you remember the episode of Law and Order where the judge was
sympathetic to a clinic bomber/murderer whose defence was that one
killing stopped thousands of murders and was therefore justified?
I don't watch Law and Order.
Where eventually a frustrated McCoy (the DA) trapped the judge by
calling on the bailiff to arrest a witness who admitted she had an
abortion before becoming anti-abortion. The judge snapped "but that's
not murder" and McCoy thanked him?
Can I drag in a Star Trek episode with McCoy in it who faced a similar
scenario, since I don't watch Law and Order?
I guess that's the bottom line in this whole thing, isn't it?
Some people, like the pharmacists who got fired believe that, and
many, or maybe even most people disagree with them.
Nevermind that the woman was raped, or that naturally, not
all fertilized eggs manage to implant themselves and become
viable fetuses.
I know. It's pathetic.
Remember Jeff Warrender siding with Mother Theresa's refusal to give
the victims of organised rape by the Pakistani army in what is now
Bangladesh, what they needed, that led to deaths from both suicide and
botched abortion? And how he equated this with forgetting
contraception while drunk?
Is it fair to drag drunkenness into this story? Was the rapist drunk,
in this case?
By supporting the denial of a "morning after" pill for rape victims,
people like Pastor Dave are ignoring all the horrors of being raped
in the first place. They seem to have no compassion at all for the
women involved. It's pitiful, really, in my opinion.
It's worse than that.
It's their "absolute inflexible morals" at work in a situation that
demonstrates exactly why ethics are situational. They are totally
unable to understand good or bad in terms of their effect on others.
I guess that's a major problem, and I agree with you.
What if it had been Oldridge's daughter? Or the pharmacist's?
Oldridge?
The potential baby which might have come about because of the
rape which God didn't feel necessary to stop, might grow up to
think of itself as a "gift from God," or might even become President
some day, championing the benefits of rape. Or it might follow in its
own father's footsteps, if it happens to be a male child, raping more
women in the future. If it's a female child, then the little girl can
thank her daddy for raping her mother. Yeah boy!
Potential. That's the operative word. At this stage it's like the
difference between an acorn and an oak tree.
I agree completely. Maybe some of the "a blob of cells without
a brain is a human," people might like to make some comments.
--
Elroy Willis
EAP Chief Editor and Newshound
http://web2.airmail.net/~elo/news
.
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| User: "Christopher A. Lee" |
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| Title: Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
18 Feb 2004 04:34:20 PM |
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On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 14:35:17 GMT, Elroy Willis <elo@airmail.net>
wrote:
What if it had been Oldridge's daughter? Or the pharmacist's?
Oldridge?
"Pastor" Dave's surname.
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| User: "Pastor Dave" |
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| Title: Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
18 Feb 2004 04:52:34 PM |
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On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 22:34:20 GMT, Christopher A. Lee
<calee@optonline.net> spake thusly:
On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 14:35:17 GMT, Elroy Willis <elo@airmail.net>
wrote:
What if it had been Oldridge's daughter? Or the pharmacist's?
Oldridge?
"Pastor" Dave's surname.
Now I'm supposedly Dave Oldridge? Atheists love to
lie.
--
Pastor Dave Raymond
"As for me, I have not hastened from being a pastor
to follow thee: neither have I desired the woeful day;
thou knowest: that which came out of my lips was right
before thee." - Jeremiah 17:16
www.icr.org
-----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
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| User: "Bill, The Avender" |
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| Title: Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
19 Feb 2004 03:47:56 PM |
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In alt.atheism on Wed, 18 Feb 2004 17:52:34 -0500, Pastor Dave
<nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote:
On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 22:34:20 GMT, Christopher A. Lee
<calee@optonline.net> spake thusly:
On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 14:35:17 GMT, Elroy Willis <elo@airmail.net>
wrote:
What if it had been Oldridge's daughter? Or the pharmacist's?
Oldridge?
"Pastor" Dave's surname.
Now I'm supposedly Dave Oldridge? Atheists love to
lie.
And Christians love to see malice and lies where there are only honest
mistakes. How very "loving" of you to automatically assume the worst
at every possible turn just because someone doesn't share your
religious views. Speaks scathing oodles about your version of
"integrity".
.
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| User: "Elroy Willis" |
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| Title: Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
20 Feb 2004 08:04:32 AM |
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Bill, The Avender wrote in alt.atheism
Pastor Dave <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote:
Christopher A. Lee <calee@optonline.net> spake thusly:
Elroy Willis <elo@airmail.net> wrote:
What if it had been Oldridge's daughter? Or the pharmacist's?
Oldridge?
"Pastor" Dave's surname.
Now I'm supposedly Dave Oldridge? Atheists love to
lie.
And Christians love to see malice and lies where there are only
honest mistakes.
No kidding. It was a simple mistake, and Chris even admitted to
making it.
--
Elroy Willis
EAP Chief Editor and Newshound
http://web2.airmail.net/~elo/news
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| User: "Elroy Willis" |
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| Title: Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
18 Feb 2004 05:48:03 PM |
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Pastor Dave <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in alt.atheism
Christopher A. Lee <calee@optonline.net> spake thusly:
Elroy Willis <elo@airmail.net> wrote:
What if it had been Oldridge's daughter? Or the pharmacist's?
Oldridge?
"Pastor" Dave's surname.
Now I'm supposedly Dave Oldridge? Atheists love to
lie.
I think Dave Oldridge might take offense at being called you.
He's an evilution believer, you know. :-)
--
Elroy Willis
EAP Chief Editor and Newshound
http://web2.airmail.net/~elo/news
.
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| User: "Christopher A. Lee" |
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| Title: Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
18 Feb 2004 06:07:07 PM |
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On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 23:48:03 GMT, Elroy Willis <elo@airmail.net>
wrote:
Pastor Dave <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in alt.atheism
Christopher A. Lee <calee@optonline.net> spake thusly:
Elroy Willis <elo@airmail.net> wrote:
What if it had been Oldridge's daughter? Or the pharmacist's?
Oldridge?
"Pastor" Dave's surname.
Now I'm supposedly Dave Oldridge? Atheists love to
lie.
I think Dave Oldridge might take offense at being called you.
He's an evilution believer, you know. :-)
You're right - I confused the two Daves - I meant Dave Raymond.
How would he feel if it had been his daughter who had been raped?
[My apologies to Dave Oldridge]
.
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| User: "Elroy Willis" |
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| Title: Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
18 Feb 2004 07:37:13 PM |
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Christopher A. Lee <calee@optonline.net> wrote in alt.atheism
Elroy Willis <elo@airmail.net> wrote:
Pastor Dave <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in alt.atheism
Christopher A. Lee <calee@optonline.net> spake thusly:
Elroy Willis <elo@airmail.net> wrote:
What if it had been Oldridge's daughter? Or the pharmacist's?
Oldridge?
"Pastor" Dave's surname.
Now I'm supposedly Dave Oldridge? Atheists love to
lie.
I think Dave Oldridge might take offense at being called you.
He's an evilution believer, you know. :-)
You're right - I confused the two Daves - I meant Dave Raymond.
How would he feel if it had been his daughter who had been raped?
[My apologies to Dave Oldridge]
I would hope the both of them would be horrified by the thought
of one of their daughters being raped, but I could be wrong.
Pastor Dave seems to be saying that he'd be against his
daughter taking the "day after pill" to prevent or abort a pregnancy
caused by the rape of his own daughter, if he has one, or can
imagine to have one, for the sake of argument.
--
Elroy Willis
EAP Chief Editor and Newshound
http://web2.airmail.net/~elo/news
.
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| User: "Pastor Dave" |
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| Title: Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
18 Feb 2004 06:29:31 PM |
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On Thu, 19 Feb 2004 00:07:07 GMT, Christopher A. Lee
<calee@optonline.net> spake thusly:
On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 23:48:03 GMT, Elroy Willis <elo@airmail.net>
wrote:
Pastor Dave <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in alt.atheism
Christopher A. Lee <calee@optonline.net> spake thusly:
Elroy Willis <elo@airmail.net> wrote:
What if it had been Oldridge's daughter? Or the pharmacist's?
Oldridge?
"Pastor" Dave's surname.
Now I'm supposedly Dave Oldridge? Atheists love to
lie.
I think Dave Oldridge might take offense at being called you.
He's an evilution believer, you know. :-)
You're right - I confused the two Daves - I meant Dave Raymond.
How would he feel if it had been his daughter who had been raped?
Very simple. I would want the criminal punished and
love my daughter and the child.
--
Pastor Dave Raymond
"As for me, I have not hastened from being a pastor
to follow thee: neither have I desired the woeful day;
thou knowest: that which came out of my lips was right
before thee." - Jeremiah 17:16
http://home.clear.net.nz/pages/bryanp/Evolution/Gre.Sci..htm
-----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
-----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =-----
.
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| User: "MrD Pstychologist \retired" |
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| Title: Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
18 Feb 2004 07:36:25 PM |
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"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:6q0830pku79ljbd68jhq1sudv1g71iagp6@4ax.com...
On Thu, 19 Feb 2004 00:07:07 GMT, Christopher A. Lee
<calee@optonline.net> spake thusly:
On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 23:48:03 GMT, Elroy Willis <elo@airmail.net>
wrote:
Pastor Dave <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in alt.atheism
Christopher A. Lee <calee@optonline.net> spake thusly:
Elroy Willis <elo@airmail.net> wrote:
What if it had been Oldridge's daughter? Or the pharmacist's?
Oldridge?
"Pastor" Dave's surname.
Now I'm supposedly Dave Oldridge? Atheists love to
lie.
I think Dave Oldridge might take offense at being called you.
He's an evilution believer, you know. :-)
You're right - I confused the two Daves - I meant Dave Raymond.
How would he feel if it had been his daughter who had been raped?
Very simple. I would want the criminal punished and
love my daughter and the child.
But what about your new son-in-law?
Deuteronomy 22
28 If a man find a damsel that is a virgin, which is not betrothed, and
lay hold on her, and lie with her, and they be found;
29 Then the man that lay with her shall give unto the damsel's father
fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife; because he hath humbled
her, he may not put her away all his days.
His punishment, under biblical law, would be to become part of your family
for 'all of his days'. Wow, a life sentance.
Oh well, at least you pick up some silver while you sell your daughter to
her attacker.
MrD
--
Pastor Dave Raymond
"As for me, I have not hastened from being a pastor
to follow thee: neither have I desired the woeful day;
thou knowest: that which came out of my lips was right
before thee." - Jeremiah 17:16
http://home.clear.net.nz/pages/bryanp/Evolution/Gre.Sci..htm
-----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
-----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =-----
.
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| User: "William Klee" |
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| Title: Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
18 Feb 2004 11:08:19 PM |
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In article <c113r3$ga5$1@news.netins.net>, retired\ <askme@netins.net>
wrote:
"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:6q0830pku79ljbd68jhq1sudv1g71iagp6@4ax.com...
On Thu, 19 Feb 2004 00:07:07 GMT, Christopher A. Lee
<calee@optonline.net> spake thusly:
On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 23:48:03 GMT, Elroy Willis <elo@airmail.net>
wrote:
Pastor Dave <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in alt.atheism
Christopher A. Lee <calee@optonline.net> spake thusly:
Elroy Willis <elo@airmail.net> wrote:
What if it had been Oldridge's daughter? Or the pharmacist's?
Oldridge?
"Pastor" Dave's surname.
Now I'm supposedly Dave Oldridge? Atheists love to
lie.
I think Dave Oldridge might take offense at being called you.
He's an evilution believer, you know. :-)
You're right - I confused the two Daves - I meant Dave Raymond.
How would he feel if it had been his daughter who had been raped?
Very simple. I would want the criminal punished and
love my daughter and the child.
But what about your new son-in-law?
Deuteronomy 22
28 If a man find a damsel that is a virgin, which is not betrothed, and
lay hold on her, and lie with her, and they be found;
29 Then the man that lay with her shall give unto the damsel's father
fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife; because he hath humbled
her, he may not put her away all his days.
His punishment, under biblical law, would be to become part of your family
for 'all of his days'. Wow, a life sentance.
Oh well, at least you pick up some silver while you sell your daughter to
her attacker.
I priced it a few years ago when some raving fucktard was insisting
that it's impossible to rape your wife, because when she said "I do"
she was giving you perpetual consent. Anyway, the bible says 20 ounces
of silver, which at the time was about $95. Guess that's all a woman's
whole life is worth to a christian.
--
....and in elder days there were wars in the Heavens between the Ibemmeraphim
and the Angels of the Apple of Knowledge...
.
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| User: "Pastor Dave" |
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| Title: Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
24 Feb 2004 06:40:30 AM |
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On Thu, 19 Feb 2004 05:08:19 GMT, William Klee
<fnord2k@yahoo.com> spake thusly:
it's impossible to rape your wife,
Agreed. It is possible however, to assault her.
Oh, don't mind the word twisting. I'm just giving you
an example of what you guys do with the Bible, when you
quote it.
--
± Pastor Dave Raymond ±
"As for me, I have not hastened from being a pastor
to follow thee: neither have I desired the woeful day;
thou knowest: that which came out of my lips was right
before thee." - Jeremiah 17:16
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| User: "Elroy Willis" |
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| Title: Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
24 Feb 2004 08:31:17 AM |
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Pastor Dave <nospam*-*pastordave38@yahoo.com> wrote in alt.atheism
William Klee spake thusly:
it's impossible to rape your wife,
Agreed. It is possible however, to assault her.
Oh, don't mind the word twisting. I'm just giving you
an example of what you guys do with the Bible, when you
quote it.
What are the legal differences between an assault and rape
charge, according to your current understanding?
--
Elroy Willis
EAP Chief Editor and Newshound
http://web2.airmail.net/~elo/news
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| User: "Pastor Dave" |
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| Title: Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
21 Feb 2004 08:35:11 AM |
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On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 19:36:25 -0600, "MrD Pstychologist
\(retired\)" <askme@netins.net> spake thusly:
"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:6q0830pku79ljbd68jhq1sudv1g71iagp6@4ax.com...
On Thu, 19 Feb 2004 00:07:07 GMT, Christopher A. Lee
<calee@optonline.net> spake thusly:
On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 23:48:03 GMT, Elroy Willis <elo@airmail.net>
wrote:
Pastor Dave <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in alt.atheism
Christopher A. Lee <calee@optonline.net> spake thusly:
Elroy Willis <elo@airmail.net> wrote:
What if it had been Oldridge's daughter? Or the pharmacist's?
Oldridge?
"Pastor" Dave's surname.
Now I'm supposedly Dave Oldridge? Atheists love to
lie.
I think Dave Oldridge might take offense at being called you.
He's an evilution believer, you know. :-)
You're right - I confused the two Daves - I meant Dave Raymond.
How would he feel if it had been his daughter who had been raped?
Very simple. I would want the criminal punished and
love my daughter and the child.
But what about your new son-in-law?
Deuteronomy 22
28 If a man find a damsel that is a virgin, which is not betrothed, and
lay hold on her, and lie with her, and they be found;
29 Then the man that lay with her shall give unto the damsel's father
fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife; because he hath humbled
her, he may not put her away all his days.
His punishment, under biblical law, would be to become part of your family
for 'all of his days'. Wow, a life sentance.
Oh well, at least you pick up some silver while you sell your daughter to
her attacker.
It's called a dowry and the money is not for the sale
of the daughter. It is to compensate the family for
the loss of wages that will occur, should the daughter
leave the home. Everyone worked and produced for the
family, in those days. Just as many immigrant families
who come here to live. Everyone works, except those of
school age and if they are old enough, even they will
take part time jobs and help out. It was the same way
then and even today, in that type of family, dowries
are still given on many occasions. We could learn a
lot from them.
As for marrying the rapist, it is the same today in the
same type of family that I stated above. If a man
wishes to humble a woman, he should be prepared to
marry her. Note that this is not discussing serial
rapists, since that would be promoting polygamy, which
the God does not. This is discussing one act, in one
instance, by one individual and it also does not speak
of beating her half to death, nor of stabbing her,
etc.. Learn the difference. But we both know you
won't bother. Your goal is to ridicule and insult.
--
Pastor Dave Raymond
"As for me, I have not hastened from being a pastor
to follow thee: neither have I desired the woeful day;
thou knowest: that which came out of my lips was right
before thee." - Jeremiah 17:16
http://www.delusionresistance.org/creation/christ_scientific_creation.html
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| User: "MrD Pstychologist \retired" |
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| Title: Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
21 Feb 2004 03:44:53 PM |
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"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:tsqe3011bemuat1pj2nn5jucnhlj245lqm@4ax.com...
On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 19:36:25 -0600, "MrD Pstychologist
\(retired\)" <askme@netins.net> spake thusly:
"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:6q0830pku79ljbd68jhq1sudv1g71iagp6@4ax.com...
On Thu, 19 Feb 2004 00:07:07 GMT, Christopher A. Lee
<calee@optonline.net> spake thusly:
On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 23:48:03 GMT, Elroy Willis <elo@airmail.net>
wrote:
Pastor Dave <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in alt.atheism
Christopher A. Lee <calee@optonline.net> spake thusly:
Elroy Willis <elo@airmail.net> wrote:
What if it had been Oldridge's daughter? Or the pharmacist's?
Oldridge?
"Pastor" Dave's surname.
Now I'm supposedly Dave Oldridge? Atheists love to
lie.
I think Dave Oldridge might take offense at being called you.
He's an evilution believer, you know. :-)
You're right - I confused the two Daves - I meant Dave Raymond.
How would he feel if it had been his daughter who had been raped?
Very simple. I would want the criminal punished and
love my daughter and the child.
But what about your new son-in-law?
Deuteronomy 22
28 If a man find a damsel that is a virgin, which is not betrothed, and
lay hold on her, and lie with her, and they be found;
29 Then the man that lay with her shall give unto the damsel's father
fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife; because he hath
humbled
her, he may not put her away all his days.
His punishment, under biblical law, would be to become part of your
family
for 'all of his days'. Wow, a life sentance.
Oh well, at least you pick up some silver while you sell your daughter to
her attacker.
It's called a dowry and the money is not for the sale
of the daughter. It is to compensate the family for
the loss of wages that will occur, should the daughter
leave the home.
This is incorrect. A dowry is paid to the husband/husband's family.
This payment from the Biblical book of Deuteronomy is a payment for
lessoning the value of the property of the father. It has nothing to do
with how much work the daughter could have done.
Everyone worked and produced for the
family, in those days. Just as many immigrant families
who come here to live. Everyone works, except those of
school age and if they are old enough, even they will
take part time jobs and help out. It was the same way
then and even today, in that type of family, dowries
are still given on many occasions. We could learn a
lot from them.
This has nothing to do with the discussion of rape/abortion.
I imagine that your father was willing to pay hansomly to get someone who
would pick up the slack for the lack of work you were providing, but that
isn't really a part of the discussion about your imagined daughter being
forcibly raped and you waiting at the door for the attacker to come and pay
you 50 shekels because he's ruined your property, and by luck you can force
him to take her off your hands based on an old biblical law.
The thought of you only worrying about the loss of work from your daughter
staggers my mind. I hope you don't have any children in reality.
As for marrying the rapist, it is the same today in the
same type of family that I stated above.
I don't believe you. Prove it.
If a man
wishes to humble a woman, he should be prepared to
marry her.
Should she be forced to marry him, though?
Note that this is not discussing serial
rapists, since that would be promoting polygamy, which
the God does not.
The God? You lie again. The same god of the book of Deuteronomy was the
same god that allowed polygamy all through the old testament.
How many wives did King David have? Solomon? These kings reigned after the
time of the Deuteronomy laws. Your answer is false.
This is discussing one act, in one
instance, by one individual and it also does not speak
of beating her half to death, nor of stabbing her,
etc.. Learn the difference.
Perhaps you should learn the difference. You are stating that rape that
doesn't involve physical harm is a normal, condoned part of life. It isn't,
nor should it be. Also, the biblical verse doesn't state anything about the
level of violence that occurs upon the daughter, she is to be sold to her
attacker because she's damaged goods to the father.
Your attempt to condone these actions is sickening.
But we both know you
won't bother. Your goal is to ridicule and insult.
I* won't bother?! I understand the difference. It is you that has some
education to attend to. My goal does happen to be to ridicule and insult
you, but that is because you deserve it and the world should see it. It
doesn't make my position incorrect simply because I happen to ridicule and
insult you as I point out your stupidity and lack of decency.
You make me sick.
MrD
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| User: "Liz" |
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| Title: Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
21 Feb 2004 08:56:16 AM |
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On Sat, 21 Feb 2004 09:35:11 -0500, Pastor Dave
<nospam-draymond@minister.com> in news message
<tsqe3011bemuat1pj2nn5jucnhlj245lqm@4ax.com> wrote:
On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 19:36:25 -0600, "MrD Pstychologist
\(retired\)" <askme@netins.net> spake thusly:
"Pastor Dave" <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote in message
news:6q0830pku79ljbd68jhq1sudv1g71iagp6@4ax.com...
On Thu, 19 Feb 2004 00:07:07 GMT, Christopher A. Lee
<calee@optonline.net> spake thusly:
[-----]
How would he feel if it had been his daughter who had been raped?
Very simple. I would want the criminal punished and
love my daughter and the child.
But what about your new son-in-law?
Deuteronomy 22
28 If a man find a damsel that is a virgin, which is not betrothed, and
lay hold on her, and lie with her, and they be found;
29 Then the man that lay with her shall give unto the damsel's father
fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife; because he hath humbled
her, he may not put her away all his days.
His punishment, under biblical law, would be to become part of your family
for 'all of his days'. Wow, a life sentance.
Oh well, at least you pick up some silver while you sell your daughter to
her attacker.
It's called a dowry and the money is not for the sale
of the daughter.
Just to set the record straight, a dowery is the money or property
brought by the woman to her husband at the time of marriage.
according to www.ask.com
In many cultures, it was customary to offer cash or land, along with a
daughter, in marriage. This was, in effect, the daughters share of her
inheritance, as a daughter married out of her family, becoming a
member of her new husbands family. The dowry was also given on
condition that the woman be well taken care of. Should there be any
problem, as in a divorce, the woman's family could insist that the
dowry be returned.
It is to compensate the family for
the loss of wages that will occur, should the daughter
leave the home. Everyone worked and produced for the
family, in those days. Just as many immigrant families
who come here to live. Everyone works, except those of
school age and if they are old enough, even they will
take part time jobs and help out. It was the same way
then and even today, in that type of family, dowries
are still given on many occasions. We could learn a
lot from them.
Such as what exactly a dowery was?
As for marrying the rapist, it is the same today in the
same type of family that I stated above. If a man
wishes to humble a woman, he should be prepared to
marry her. Note that this is not discussing serial
rapists, since that would be promoting polygamy, which
the God does not. This is discussing one act, in one
instance, by one individual and it also does not speak
of beating her half to death, nor of stabbing her,
etc.. Learn the difference. But we both know you
won't bother. Your goal is to ridicule and insult.
What if the woman does not want to marry her rapist? In your world
view, would you allow your daughter to be humbled and remain a single
mother?
Liz #658 BAAWA
We have just enough religion to make us hate, but not
enough to make us love one another, - Johnathan Swift
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| User: "Pastor Dave" |
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| Title: Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
22 Feb 2004 09:57:35 AM |
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On Sat, 21 Feb 2004 14:56:16 GMT, Liz
<ehuth1@donotspam.com> spake thusly:
It's called a dowry and the money is not for the sale
of the daughter.
Just to set the record straight, a dowery is the money or property
brought by the woman to her husband at the time of marriage.
according to www.ask.com
In many cultures, it was customary to offer cash or land, along with a
daughter, in marriage. This was, in effect, the daughters share of her
inheritance, as a daughter married out of her family, becoming a
member of her new husbands family. The dowry was also given on
condition that the woman be well taken care of. Should there be any
problem, as in a divorce, the woman's family could insist that the
dowry be returned.
That is not correct as it pertains to Biblical times
and the people discussed.
As for marrying the rapist, it is the same today in the
same type of family that I stated above. If a man
wishes to humble a woman, he should be prepared to
marry her. Note that this is not discussing serial
rapists, since that would be promoting polygamy, which
the God does not. This is discussing one act, in one
instance, by one individual and it also does not speak
of beating her half to death, nor of stabbing her,
etc.. Learn the difference. But we both know you
won't bother. Your goal is to ridicule and insult.
What if the woman does not want to marry her rapist? In your world
view, would you allow your daughter to be humbled and remain a single
mother?
It was not up to her, nor should it be. For example, I
do not steal. Now if that's for no other reason than
God says I should not steal, that reason is good
enough.
--
Pastor Dave Raymond
"As for me, I have not hastened from being a pastor
to follow thee: neither have I desired the woeful day;
thou knowest: that which came out of my lips was right
before thee." - Jeremiah 17:16
"The real mark of someone who wants to know the Truth
is not that they expect others to prove it to them,
but that they seek after it themselves." - Chayil
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| User: "Liz" |
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| Title: Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
22 Feb 2004 11:19:58 AM |
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On Sun, 22 Feb 2004 10:57:35 -0500, Pastor Dave
<nospam-draymond@minister.com> in news message
<f8kh30l0n667blepn3depd60e3nr24qfor@4ax.com> wrote:
On Sat, 21 Feb 2004 14:56:16 GMT, Liz
<ehuth1@donotspam.com> spake thusly:
It's called a dowry and the money is not for the sale
of the daughter.
Just to set the record straight, a dowery is the money or property
brought by the woman to her husband at the time of marriage.
according to www.ask.com
In many cultures, it was customary to offer cash or land, along with a
daughter, in marriage. This was, in effect, the daughters share of her
inheritance, as a daughter married out of her family, becoming a
member of her new husbands family. The dowry was also given on
condition that the woman be well taken care of. Should there be any
problem, as in a divorce, the woman's family could insist that the
dowry be returned.
That is not correct as it pertains to Biblical times
and the people discussed.
But we were discussing your hypothetical daughter, and the application
of Biblical principals to modern times. You seem to believe that a
father can accept a bride price from a rapist, and that would make the
marriage of your daughter to a rapist justifiable.
As for marrying the rapist, it is the same today in the
same type of family that I stated above. If a man
wishes to humble a woman, he should be prepared to
marry her. Note that this is not discussing serial
rapists, since that would be promoting polygamy, which
the God does not. This is discussing one act, in one
instance, by one individual and it also does not speak
of beating her half to death, nor of stabbing her,
etc.. Learn the difference. But we both know you
won't bother. Your goal is to ridicule and insult.
What if the woman does not want to marry her rapist? In your world
view, would you allow your daughter to be humbled and remain a single
mother?
It was not up to her, nor should it be.
<boggle> Let's go over the scenario again.
Your daughter is raped, and according to you she has no option except
to marry her rapist. In fact, you state that she has no choice in the
matter at all.
For example, I
do not steal. Now if that's for no other reason than
God says I should not steal, that reason is good
enough.
If you choose to steel, you are culpable. However, your daughter's
act of being raped was not voluntary, obviously, or it would not be
rape. Yet, you say that a grown woman has no choice except to marry
the rapist because that is God®s instructions as if it were her
punishment for being a victim. You don't seem to have any problem
with your daughter being consigned to hell on Earth because you think
that it is God®'s will that she *must* marry a man who has violently
violated her person, and whom she has every right to detest and have
put in prison.
You are an evil man without compassion or any semblance of conscience.
Liz #658 BAAWA
I could not believe that anyone who had read this book
would be so foolish as to proclaim that the Bible in every
literal word was the divinely inspired, inerrant word of
God? Have these people simply not read the text? Are they
hopelessly uninformed? Is there a different Bible? Are
they blinded by a combination of ego needs and naivete?
-- Bishop John Shelby Spong!
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| User: "Pastor Dave" |
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| Title: Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
22 Feb 2004 11:28:15 AM |
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On Sun, 22 Feb 2004 17:19:58 GMT, Liz
<ehuth1@donotspam.com> spake thusly:
On Sun, 22 Feb 2004 10:57:35 -0500, Pastor Dave
<nospam-draymond@minister.com> in news message
<f8kh30l0n667blepn3depd60e3nr24qfor@4ax.com> wrote:
On Sat, 21 Feb 2004 14:56:16 GMT, Liz
<ehuth1@donotspam.com> spake thusly:
It's called a dowry and the money is not for the sale
of the daughter.
Just to set the record straight, a dowery is the money or property
brought by the woman to her husband at the time of marriage.
according to www.ask.com
In many cultures, it was customary to offer cash or land, along with a
daughter, in marriage. This was, in effect, the daughters share of her
inheritance, as a daughter married out of her family, becoming a
member of her new husbands family. The dowry was also given on
condition that the woman be well taken care of. Should there be any
problem, as in a divorce, the woman's family could insist that the
dowry be returned.
That is not correct as it pertains to Biblical times
and the people discussed.
But we were discussing your hypothetical daughter, and the application
of Biblical principals to modern times. You seem to believe that a
father can accept a bride price from a rapist, and that would make the
marriage of your daughter to a rapist justifiable.
One cannot apply Biblical principles to modern times,
by changing what the Bible says. That is what you
attempted to do.
--
Pastor Dave Raymond
"As for me, I have not hastened from being a pastor
to follow thee: neither have I desired the woeful day;
thou knowest: that which came out of my lips was right
before thee." - Jeremiah 17:16
"I am not permitted to let my love be so merciful
as to tolerate and endure false doctrine. When
faith and doctrine are concerned and endangered,
neither love nor patience are in order... For
a defective life does not destroy Christendom,
but exercises it. However, defective doctrine
and false faith ruin everything. Therefore, when
these are concerned, neither toleration nor mercy
are in order, but only anger, dispute and
destruction - to be sure, only with the Word
of God as our weapon." - Martin Luther
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| User: "Liz" |
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| Title: Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
22 Feb 2004 03:01:09 PM |
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On Sun, 22 Feb 2004 12:28:15 -0500, Pastor Dave
<nospam-draymond@minister.com> in news message
<9jph30t3pnqqfloqtocmh7iud4rpcdngbr@4ax.com> wrote:
On Sun, 22 Feb 2004 17:19:58 GMT, Liz
<ehuth1@donotspam.com> spake thusly:
On Sun, 22 Feb 2004 10:57:35 -0500, Pastor Dave
<nospam-draymond@minister.com> in news message
<f8kh30l0n667blepn3depd60e3nr24qfor@4ax.com> wrote:
On Sat, 21 Feb 2004 14:56:16 GMT, Liz
<ehuth1@donotspam.com> spake thusly:
It's called a dowry and the money is not for the sale
of the daughter.
Just to set the record straight, a dowery is the money or property
brought by the woman to her husband at the time of marriage.
according to www.ask.com
In many cultures, it was customary to offer cash or land, along with a
daughter, in marriage. This was, in effect, the daughters share of her
inheritance, as a daughter married out of her family, becoming a
member of her new husbands family. The dowry was also given on
condition that the woman be well taken care of. Should there be any
problem, as in a divorce, the woman's family could insist that the
dowry be returned.
That is not correct as it pertains to Biblical times
and the people discussed.
But we were discussing your hypothetical daughter, and the application
of Biblical principals to modern times. You seem to believe that a
father can accept a bride price from a rapist, and that would make the
marriage of your daughter to a rapist justifiable.
One cannot apply Biblical principles to modern times,
by changing what the Bible says. That is what you
attempted to do.
No, that was not what I was attempting to do. I haven't changed one
word of what the Bible says.
Exodus 22 (NIV)
16 "If a man seduces a virgin who is not pledged to be married and
sleeps with her, he must pay the bride-price, and she shall be his
wife.
http://www.biblegateway.com/cgi-bin/bible?passage=EXOD+22:16&language=english&version=NIV&showfn=on&showxref=on
In modern parlance, a dowry refers to the money given by a father to
his daughter to take to the marriage, and a bride price refers to the
money paid by the prospective husband to the father of the bride for
the right to marry her, and, as I've shown above, the words "bride
price" have even been used in the NIV to mean just that. My usage of
the term bride-price seems to be quite Biblical. Nevertheless no
matter what term are used for this exchange of money, we are
discussing the compensation that is paid to the father by a rapist so
that the rapist may marry the raped woman, which according to Exodus
22, is also Biblical.
However, I see that you have not repudiated my above statement: "You
seem to believe that a father can accept a bride price from a rapist,
and that would make the marriage of your daughter to a rapist
justifiable." I take it that you agree with that statement since it
is the Biblically correct action no matter what the wishes of the
raped woman might be. As you said in the portion of the post you
snipped, "It was not up to her, nor should it be."
Liz #658 BAAWA
I could not believe that anyone who had read this book
would be so foolish as to proclaim that the Bible in every
literal word was the divinely inspired, inerrant word of
God? Have these people simply not read the text? Are they
hopelessly uninformed? Is there a different Bible? Are
they blinded by a combination of ego needs and naivete?
-- Bishop John Shelby Spong!
.
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| User: "Pastor Dave" |
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| Title: Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
22 Feb 2004 03:17:20 PM |
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On Sun, 22 Feb 2004 21:01:09 GMT, Liz
<ehuth1@donotspam.com> spake thusly:
On Sun, 22 Feb 2004 12:28:15 -0500, Pastor Dave
<nospam-draymond@minister.com> in news message
<9jph30t3pnqqfloqtocmh7iud4rpcdngbr@4ax.com> wrote:
On Sun, 22 Feb 2004 17:19:58 GMT, Liz
<ehuth1@donotspam.com> spake thusly:
On Sun, 22 Feb 2004 10:57:35 -0500, Pastor Dave
<nospam-draymond@minister.com> in news message
<f8kh30l0n667blepn3depd60e3nr24qfor@4ax.com> wrote:
On Sat, 21 Feb 2004 14:56:16 GMT, Liz
<ehuth1@donotspam.com> spake thusly:
It's called a dowry and the money is not for the sale
of the daughter.
Just to set the record straight, a dowery is the money or property
brought by the woman to her husband at the time of marriage.
according to www.ask.com
In many cultures, it was customary to offer cash or land, along with a
daughter, in marriage. This was, in effect, the daughters share of her
inheritance, as a daughter married out of her family, becoming a
member of her new husbands family. The dowry was also given on
condition that the woman be well taken care of. Should there be any
problem, as in a divorce, the woman's family could insist that the
dowry be returned.
That is not correct as it pertains to Biblical times
and the people discussed.
But we were discussing your hypothetical daughter, and the application
of Biblical principals to modern times. You seem to believe that a
father can accept a bride price from a rapist, and that would make the
marriage of your daughter to a rapist justifiable.
One cannot apply Biblical principles to modern times,
by changing what the Bible says. That is what you
attempted to do.
No, that was not what I was attempting to do. I haven't changed one
word of what the Bible says.
Exodus 22 (NIV)
16 "If a man seduces a virgin who is not pledged to be married and
sleeps with her, he must pay the bride-price, and she shall be his
wife.
You claimed that a dowry was when the bride's family
paid the groom. That was wrong, as far as Biblical
times are concerned.
--
Pastor Dave Raymond
"As for me, I have not hastened from being a pastor
to follow thee: neither have I desired the woeful day;
thou knowest: that which came out of my lips was right
before thee." - Jeremiah 17:16
"When we descend to details we can prove that no one
species has changed (i.e., we cannot prove that a
single species has changed): nor can we prove that
the supposed changes are beneficial, which is the
groundwork of the theory. Nor can we explain why
some species have changed and others have not.
The latter case seems to me hardly more difficult
to understand precisely and in detail than the former
case of supposed change" - Darwin, 1863.
-----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
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| User: "Robibnikoff" |
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| Title: Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
23 Feb 2004 12:27:19 PM |
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In article <t17i30p1vs6kp5uoqmhspmeqldh1eb9nuh@4ax.com>, Pastor Dave says...
snip
You claimed that a dowry was when the bride's family
paid the groom.
That's what it is - though perhaps it more goes to the groom's family, but I
think that depends on the culture.
That was wrong, as far as Biblical
times are concerned.
Oh well, who cares about that.
Robyn
Resident Witchypoo & EAC Spellcaster
#1557
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| User: "L. Raymond" |
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| Title: Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
22 Feb 2004 10:18:24 AM |
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Pastor Dave <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote:
Liz <ehuth1@donotspam.com> wrote:
Pastor Dave <nospam-draymond@minister.com> wrote:
As for marrying the rapist, it is the same today in the
same type of family that I stated above. If a man
wishes to humble a woman, he should be prepared to
marry her. Note that this is not discussing serial
rapists, since that would be promoting polygamy, which
the God does not. This is discussing one act, in one
instance, by one individual and it also does not speak
of beating her half to death, nor of stabbing her,
etc.. Learn the difference. But we both know you
won't bother. Your goal is to ridicule and insult.
The phrase you want is not "humble a woman". She is violated by
rape, not humbled.
What if the woman does not want to marry her rapist? In your world
view, would you allow your daughter to be humbled and remain a single
mother?
It was not up to her, nor should it be. For example, I
do not steal. Now if that's for no other reason than
God says I should not steal, that reason is good
enough.
You seem to be saying that if your daughter is raped and does not
wish to marry the man who did it, she must wed him anyway because she
has no choice in the matter. Is that your view?
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| User: "Robibnikoff" |
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| Title: Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
23 Feb 2004 01:00:05 PM |
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In article <4038d59a.1126332@news.mylinuxisp.com>, L. Raymond says...
snip
You seem to be saying that if your daughter is raped and does not
wish to marry the man who did it, she must wed him anyway because she
has no choice in the matter. Is that your view?
Wow, sure glad my parents don't feel this way. I'm sure it would have made my
life so wonderful to have been forced to marry my rapist a month past my 15th
birthday.
Robyn
Resident Witchypoo & EAC Spellcaster
#1557
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| User: "Elroy Willis" |
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| Title: Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
24 Feb 2004 06:27:44 AM |
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Robibnikoff <nospam@newsranger.com> wrote in alt.atheism
L. Raymond says...
You seem to be saying that if your daughter is raped and does not
wish to marry the man who did it, she must wed him anyway because she
has no choice in the matter. Is that your view?
Wow, sure glad my parents don't feel this way. I'm sure it would have
made my life so wonderful to have been forced to marry my rapist a
month past my 15th birthday.
My sister was raped by my stepfather when she was 32 years old one
night. She already had a family and two kids, and it destroyed their
whole family, and she ended up committing suicide, possibly because
of it, and some other horrible things that happened to her after that.
People like Pastor Dave who think that women should marry their
rapists make me sick to my stomach. My sister would have had to
marry my stepfather, and I don't want to think about the implications
of that.
--
Elroy Willis
EAP Chief Editor and Newshound
http://web2.airmail.net/~elo/news
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| User: "Pastor Dave" |
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| Title: Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
24 Feb 2004 07:58:39 AM |
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On Tue, 24 Feb 2004 12:27:44 GMT, Elroy Willis
<elo@airmail.net> spake thusly:
Robibnikoff <nospam@newsranger.com> wrote in alt.atheism
L. Raymond says...
You seem to be saying that if your daughter is raped and does not
wish to marry the man who did it, she must wed him anyway because she
has no choice in the matter. Is that your view?
Wow, sure glad my parents don't feel this way. I'm sure it would have
made my life so wonderful to have been forced to marry my rapist a
month past my 15th birthday.
My sister was raped by my stepfather when she was 32 years old one
night. She already had a family and two kids, and it destroyed their
whole family, and she ended up committing suicide, possibly because
of it, and some other horrible things that happened to her after that.
People like Pastor Dave who think that women should marry their
rapists make me sick to my stomach. My sister would have had to
marry my stepfather, and I don't want to think about the implications
of that.
No one said to marry family.
--
± Pastor Dave Raymond ±
"As for me, I have not hastened from being a pastor
to follow thee: neither have I desired the woeful day;
thou knowest: that which came out of my lips was right
before thee." - Jeremiah 17:16
http://www.delusionresistance.org/creation/christ_scientific_creation.html
-----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
-----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =-----
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| User: "Elroy Willis" |
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| Title: Re: Eckerd Pharmacist Fired For Refusing To Dispense Day After Pill To a Rape Victim |
24 Feb 2004 08:15:39 AM |
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Pastor Dave <nospam*-*pastordave38@yahoo.com> wrote in alt.atheism
Elroy Willis <elo@airmail.net> spake thusly:
Robibnikoff <nospam@newsranger.com> wrote in alt.atheism
L. Raymond says...
You seem to be saying that if your daughter is raped and does not
wish to marry the man who did it, she must wed him anyway because
she has no choice in the matter. Is that your view?
Wow, sure glad my parents don't feel this way. I'm sure it would have
made my life so wonderful to have been forced to marry my rapist a
month past my 15th birthday.
My sister was raped by my stepfather when she was 32 years old one
night. She already had a family and two kids, and it destroyed their
whole family, and she ended up committing suicide, possibly because
of it, and some other horrible things that happened to her after that.
People like Pastor Dave who think that women should marry their
rapists make me sick to my stomach. My sister would have had to
marry my stepfather, and I don't want to think about the implications
of that.
No one said to marry family.
What do you expect should happen in such cases? A woman having
to raise her own stepfather's child and calling it a "blessing of god"
instead of a "***** child?"
Good grief, surely you can't be so insensitive, can you?
--
Elroy Willis
EAP Chief Editor and Newshound
http://web2.airmail.net/~elo/news
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