| Topic: |
Religions > Bible |
| User: |
"John Rohrer" |
| Date: |
23 Jan 2004 12:03:53 AM |
| Object: |
Re: No evidence of God yet... |
Douglas wrote:
I am an agnostic. Now that that's out of the way, I do not believe that
the God portrayed in Christian mythology or any other religion is real or
even close. Prayer and worship is just a waste of time because no God is
listening.
Well, there's the power of expectations, hope, self-fulfilling prophecies,
mind-body medicine...what did I leave out...
I thought God was all powerful and perfect. Well this place
(Earth) is a disaster. I am not impressed with his work if that is the
case. I tried to talk to God, but he won't answer me back. He must not
like me.
Well, the bible says He gave us free will, right? As far as your "no reply", it
may be that you're not listening in the right way or in the right frame of mind.
Hey, it's plausible anyway.
All I have to say to a theist is prove it. They will freeze
up...naturally because even they know their beliefs are totally irrational.
They will often come back with "Prove he doesn't exist". The burden of
proof lies in the theist lap. They should convince me he is real, not scare
me into believing he is real with the "threat" of Hell after death. I
believe when you die, you die. No heaven or hell. Just nothing. It will
feel the way you felt before you were born.
I don't know how you can say to such a certain degree. It seems congruent with
common sense and observation, but common sense and observation may not be
equipped to give us any thorough understanding of mortality. Many perspectives
can be taken, and they all make sense to those who take them. For instance,
who's to say that there's nothing to the idea of reincarnation? Who's to say
we're not just the eyes of the universe winking open and shut as we watch
ourselves through the ages? Is the concept of personal identity inherently
misleading? If our identities are functions of our brief, local experience of
the universe, what are the implications? Alternately, if there is a more basic,
essential identity, would that not live in each locus of experience manifested
throughout the universe? ...food for thought anyway.
I can accept that. Theist
can't. So they decided to make up a nice place for good people and a bad
place for bad people. Sounds like this was made up a long time ago to keep
people in line and give them hope that "when I die, I will go to heaven."
Without religion, people would see no reason to live here. Anarchy would
happen.
Perhaps "civilized" culture (where the food is under lock and key) breeds
heirarchy and injustice and suppresses true tribal democracy. If you've toiled
under oppression your whole life while a privileged few commit atrocities with
impunity (as the system enables), divine justice is an understandably welcome
concept. "Keeping the masses in line" sounds to me like an attempt to save a
society whose social bonds were dissolved by and insidious atmosphere of control
and personal entitlement (the dangerous combination which seems to me to be at
the heart of the agricultural revolution which spawned the need for
"salvationist" religions. You see, indigenous cultures (still being extinguished
by civilization's zealous expansion) ascribe to "animistic" religions focused on
the interdependent harmony of life, rather than a way to cope with our current
disequilibruim. If you contest that the alternative is anarchy, I submit the
opinion that heirarchical governmental systems create the suffering which
"salvationist" religions medicate.
Heaven, sounds nice...lets go there and prove it once and for all...oh,
thats right. How convienient. We can't go there alive and there is no
scientific reason to believe in its existence anyway. Heaven is not real.
Period.
Well, who's to say unequivocally that it's not? Or maybe it's all a matter of
perspective. It seems real enough as a metaphor for creating a utopian society.
But then, utopianism seems inherently divisive, as it rejects compromise in
favor of the One Right Way which seems to cause so many conflicts.
God, sounds like an interesting person...I would like to meet him
now...oh, thats right. How convienient. He doesn't talk back and science
has yet to find his radio frequency. Either God doesn't care about us or he
doesn't exist.
Begging for opinions please.
Maybe we *are God in the sense that we're indistinguishably connected to every
perticle in the known universe. Maybe we're trying to playing God all over this
planet. Or maybe, just *maybe, there *is a real God out there who entrusted us
with this fine planet... which will cease to be when Christ returns to send the
non-Christian 2/3 of the planet straight to hell or purgatory along with all of
the Christian sects who happened to be wrong (oops) any any within the *right
faith who weren't quite able to follow all of the rules. Oh yeah, I forgot to
include any sentient beings inhabiting any of the other trillion planets
throughout the universe.Gee, hell sounds like the place to be to meet new
people.
Crossing my fingers,
John
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| User: "bob young" |
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| Title: Re: No evidence of God yet... |
01 Feb 2004 08:50:07 PM |
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duke wrote:
On 1 Feb 2004 03:43:07 -0600, bob young <alaspectrum@netvigator.com> wrote:
Here we go: Are you one of those persons that professes the mythical fable that
there is no almighty God.
Your evidence, please, and I look forward to your answers...
......this has been done to death has it not?
Nope. I haven't seen any of your work except a useless repeat of a long list
names.
I will repeat in case yuo missed the thousamnd of previous answers to this stupid
question; it is your responsibility to prove that you have a god, not mine to prove
otherwise.
No, it's not my responsibility. I have given you my evidence for the existance
of God, you have given me nothing for the non existance of God..
.....sooooo pleased that you are happy with your 'proofs' !
bob
hong Kong
"I refuse to prove that I exist" says God, "for proof denies
faith, and without faith, I am nothing."
.
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| User: "duke" |
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| Title: Re: No evidence of God yet... |
03 Feb 2004 05:00:35 AM |
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On 1 Feb 2004 20:50:07 -0600, bob young <alaspectrum@netvigator.com> wrote:
duke wrote:
On 1 Feb 2004 03:43:07 -0600, bob young <alaspectrum@netvigator.com> wrote:
Here we go: Are you one of those persons that professes the mythical fable that
there is no almighty God.
Your evidence, please, and I look forward to your answers...
......this has been done to death has it not?
Nope. I haven't seen any of your work except a useless repeat of a long list
names.
I will repeat in case yuo missed the thousamnd of previous answers to this stupid
question; it is your responsibility to prove that you have a god, not mine to prove
otherwise.
No, it's not my responsibility. I have given you my evidence for the existance
of God, you have given me nothing for the non existance of God..
....sooooo pleased that you are happy with your 'proofs' !
Especially me.
bob
hong Kong
"I refuse to prove that I exist" says God, "for proof denies
faith, and without faith, I am nothing."
It's your funeral. Enjoy it if you can.
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| User: "William Barwell" |
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| Title: Re: No evidence of God yet... |
01 Feb 2004 05:40:19 PM |
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bob young wrote:
duke wrote:
On 30 Jan 2004 05:01:10 -0600, bob young <alaspectrum@netvigator.com>
wrote:
Just typical - unable to give sensible answers to the questions so -
'lets resort to insults'
Hopeless
Yes, you atheists are truly and unquestionably hopeless. I have yet to
see an
atheist offer so much as one excuse for the non-existance of God. So I
play this little game with you.
Here we go: Are you one of those persons that professes the mythical
fable that there is no almighty God.
Your evidence, please, and I look forward to your answers...
......this has been done to death has it not?
I will repeat in case you missed the thousand of previous answers to this
stupid question; it is your responsibility to prove that you have a god,
not mine to prove
otherwise. After all, if you have a god it should be extremely easy to
prove - right?
Can god do the impossible, create a square circle, a 4 sided triangle?
That is, does god create teh Universe's laws, rules and logic, or is that
outside of god's creation and control?
I ran this by Duke and he punted. He couildn't handle it so he pretended
not to get it and he denied the undeniable consequences of the premises,
which either way you answer, debunk god.
God is either at best, the total creator and sustaining cause of all evil
and thus is evil incarnate, or is subject to the Universe's laws and rules
and thus cannot be the creator of all as claimed, or the most powerful
thing imaginable, omnipotent or anything else as claimed.
Duke, Eric, Georgeanne, all have failed to handle this argument.
In fact, nobody has bothered with it at all, even my fellow Atheists do not
comment on this.
There is more, I haven't even really presented the whole argument
yet, which is still being developed.
So much for natural religion.
And archaeology has debunked the bible as history and so the god
theologically attached to that fake history is dead too.
The Greek philosopher's god and the bible god are both dead as doornails.
What happens when I pop this stuff on them is, they turn away, and ignore
it, and later, make the same challenges, ignoring the fact they were
given proof and ignored it.
The god they claim is debunkable, and they run from that and pretend it
was not so debunked.
--
"Socialist!" A name thrown at a moderate by a
reactionary who has run out of relevant argumemnts
Cheerful Charlie
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| User: "duke" |
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| Title: Re: No evidence of God yet... |
03 Feb 2004 05:09:50 AM |
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On Sun, 01 Feb 2004 17:40:19 -0600, William Barwell
<wbarwell@mungged.mylinuxisp.com> wrote:
Can god do the impossible, create a square circle, a 4 sided triangle?
Really sad. Why would he "create" something with a new name already allocated
to something else?
That is, does god create teh Universe's laws, rules and logic, or is that
outside of god's creation and control?
All creation is of God.
I ran this by Duke and he punted.
sorry, but I quarterback-sneaked for a 100 yard touchdown.
He couildn't handle it so he pretended
not to get it and he denied the undeniable consequences of the premises,
which either way you answer, debunk god.
You scratched your crystal ball, but not mine.
God is either at best, the total creator and sustaining cause of all evil
and thus is evil incarnate, or is subject to the Universe's laws and rules
and thus cannot be the creator of all as claimed, or the most powerful
thing imaginable, omnipotent or anything else as claimed.
Because he mayhave to desire to create somthing that he created already by
another name? Don't be so stupid.
Duke, Eric, Georgeanne, all have failed to handle this argument.
In fact, nobody has bothered with it at all, even my fellow Atheists do not
comment on this.
I think the answers have gone: swoosh, right part your right ear.
There is more, I haven't even really presented the whole argument
yet, which is still being developed.
Better start again. You triangle/circle is full of holes.
So much for natural religion.
Natural religion.
And archaeology has debunked the bible as history and so the god
theologically attached to that fake history is dead too.
nope. but it would be interesting to see your works. They should be good for a
laugh.
The Greek philosopher's god and the bible god are both dead as doornails.
You sure like to makes these boasts about your own inferiority.
What happens when I pop this stuff on them is, they turn away, and ignore
it, and later, make the same challenges, ignoring the fact they were
given proof and ignored it.
The god they claim is debunkable, and they run from that and pretend it
was not so debunked.
What stuff? You fell flat on your duff on the circle/triangle stuff.
.
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| User: "John Ings" |
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| Title: Re: No evidence of God yet... |
24 Jan 2004 07:26:19 PM |
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On Sat, 24 Jan 2004 17:40:48 -0600, duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> wrote:
Diseases and genetic defects are man caused?
The Bible says they are caused by demons!
Of course you don't understand.
But I DO understand! You believe in an ancient Mesopotamian folktale.
Which one is that?
Genesis.
Mankind was kicked out of the garden for trying
to play God. Diseses and genetic defects are our doing for being such rotten
gods.
There have been diseases and birth defects in existence for hundreds
of millions of years, long before there was anything remotely
resembling a man.
I knew you didn't understand.
Understand what? You're pretending there is some esoteric truth that
only the devout can understand? Foo! I can understand anything you can
explain and PROVE, but I won't accept your mystic claims on faith.
And men had diseases and birth defects hundreds of
thousands of years before some Hebrew priests got around to concocting
that Genesis *****.
So where do y ou profess the heavens and the earth and all in it came from?
Check any decent text on cosmology. I know exactly where the earth,
the sun and other planets and all the stars you can see came from, and
it's not where Genesis claims. Where the entire universe came from I
don't know, but then neither do you.
In fact they are quite natural phenomena, and not caused by either
supernatural spooks or by man.
We make pretty bad gods,
Indeed we do!
Hence disease and genetic defects.
No, hence silly superstitions about gods.
Why silly and superstition? What is your evidence?
He who asserts the affermative has the onus of supplying the evidence.
It's not up to me to supply evidence to refute every fantasy the
devout make up. I can't prove your God doesn't exist, but I also can't
prove the old Greek gods don't exist, or the old Roman gods, or any of
the other mryad gods man has invented for himself don't exist.
So if I must prove the God of the Bible doesn't exist or else believe
in him, you must prove Zeus and Demeter and Mythra don't exist or
believe in them.
which we
tried to do just before God kicked us out of the garden.
There was no Garden, and no Adam and Eve who were kicked out either.
Easy to say - impossible to support. Let's see your evidence.
Who asserts the theory must suppy the support. Where's YOUR evidence?
Sorry - you just said there is no Garden and no A&E. So lets see what you got.
YOU asserted, YOU prove. I know that there were human beings like us
in Africa 130,000 years ago, and that doesn't match the Genesis story
very well.
The God that is supposed to have done so is as much a bad myth as any
other man has invented for himself.
How do YOU know?
Because the book that tells us about this God is full of fraud and
lies and I know that disease has afflicted all living things for as
long as living things have existed.
Ok so what's fraudulent about it. Put your mouth where your foot is right now.
The Bible wasn't written when it was supposed to have been, or by
whom it claims to have been. It tells of a cosmology that is
ludicrous, a creation order that is erroneous, a Deluge that never
happened, and global miracles that somehow no one noticed. It tells of
an exodus that left no trace, and a conquest of the cities of the
plain that didn't happen either. It is full of spurious prophecy by
20/20 hindsight and begins its second testament by telling of a census
that never happened and a journey to Bethlehem that wouldn't have been
necessary if it had happened. But it's most fundamental fraud is its
pretense that it is the Word of God when in fact it is the lies of
men.
## Religion explains to ignorance the nature of the unknowable
Still nothing but mouthing off by you, and bad mouthing off at that.
And not an iota of proof from you, bad or otherwise.
## As long as there are fools and rascals, there will be religions.
Voltaire
.
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| User: "duke" |
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| Title: Re: No evidence of God yet... |
25 Jan 2004 08:25:28 AM |
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On Sat, 24 Jan 2004 17:26:19 -0800, John Ings <nodamned@spam.org> wrote:
But I DO understand! You believe in an ancient Mesopotamian folktale.
Which one is that?
Genesis.
No, no, no - why is it a folktale?
Understand what? You're pretending there is some esoteric truth that
only the devout can understand? Foo! I can understand anything you can
explain and PROVE, but I won't accept your mystic claims on faith.
It's your funeral. Enjoy it if you can.
And men had diseases and birth defects hundreds of
thousands of years before some Hebrew priests got around to concocting
that Genesis *****.
So where do y ou profess the heavens and the earth and all in it came from?
Check any decent text on cosmology. I know exactly where the earth,
the sun and other planets and all the stars you can see came from, and
it's not where Genesis claims. Where the entire universe came from I
don't know, but then neither do you.
Sure I do. God almighty made the heavens and the universe, and all that is in
it. My evidence and statements are as valid as anything you can offer as an
alternative.
But rather than me put words in your mouth, why do you try to explain the
beginning of all things. I'll start with:
*****
Evidence of God - duke32, circa 2002AD
1. The belief that a supreme being is the creator of the universe is
based on a profession by those that believe that is equal to, but no
less than, any profession that our universe exists for any other
alternative reason that can be imagined.
One could hypothesize an astronomical event such as a prior universe
that collapsed on itself and has now exploded outward to form our new
present universe. If this did happen, it would have happened again
and again for the same reason as the latest occurrence, thereby
suggesting that the universe always was, is, and always will be. Yet
another equal suggestion is that the universe was birthed out of
another universe, or another dimension.
The human mind cannot cope with the idea that all things lack a
beginning, and clearly neither matter nor energy on their own, the
basic building blocks of the universe, could either exist in and of
itself, or in and of its own intelligence.
The profession by believers is that our universe is a creation of
almighty God who is truly acknowledged as "always was, is, and always
will be". No alternative is available.
*****
Why silly and superstition? What is your evidence?
He who asserts the affermative has the onus of supplying the evidence.
Nice game, but no cigar. Can you back up your words or not?
It's not up to me to supply evidence to refute every fantasy the
devout make up. I can't prove your God doesn't exist, but I also can't
prove the old Greek gods don't exist, or the old Roman gods, or any of
the other mryad gods man has invented for himself don't exist.
I'm quite satisfied and happy with my desire and hope for an eternity of love
and peace of mind with God almighty.
All I see in you is that you are one of those few that profess the mythical
fable that there is no Almighty God.
So if I must prove the God of the Bible doesn't exist or else believe
in him, you must prove Zeus and Demeter and Mythra don't exist or
believe in them.
Zeus, demeter and mythra never existed. In fact the current world's expert
on mithra says mithra was just a sun's ray.
Sorry - you just said there is no Garden and no A&E. So lets see what you got.
YOU asserted, YOU prove. I know that there were human beings like us
in Africa 130,000 years ago, and that doesn't match the Genesis story
very well.
YOU asserted, YOU prove.
Ok so what's fraudulent about it. Put your mouth where your foot is right now.
The Bible wasn't written when it was supposed to have been, or by
whom it claims to have been. It tells of a cosmology that is
ludicrous, a creation order that is erroneous, a Deluge that never
happened, and global miracles that somehow no one noticed.
So why is the cosmology ludicrous and the creation in error (big bang says
otherwise), what proof do you have the flood never happened?
What global miracles are you referring to?
It tells of
an exodus that left no trace, and a conquest of the cities of the
plain that didn't happen either.
Of course there is trace of a wandering people. Ahhhhhhh, I suspect you are
movie dreaming of a tight band of people wandering for 40 years, rather than a
people quickly scattered throughout the desert.
Shame, shame on you for no forethought at all.
It is full of spurious prophecy by
20/20 hindsight and begins its second testament by telling of a census
that never happened and a journey to Bethlehem that wouldn't have been
necessary if it had happened.
Necessary? How do you know what Joseph was thinking?
But it's most fundamental fraud is its
pretense that it is the Word of God when in fact it is the lies of
men.
Prove it the lies of men.
Touche.
(what a totally unknowing person)
.
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| User: "ZenIsWhen" |
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| Title: Re: No evidence of God yet... |
25 Jan 2004 09:59:39 AM |
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"duke" <duckgumbo32@cox.net> wrote in message
news:mcj710hecac1thurcp4s6i2rtmek99qtba@4ax.com...
On Sat, 24 Jan 2004 17:26:19 -0800, John Ings <nodamned@spam.org> wrote:
But I DO understand! You believe in an ancient Mesopotamian folktale.
Which one is that?
Genesis.
No, no, no - why is it a folktale?
Understand what? You're pretending there is some esoteric truth that
only the devout can understand? Foo! I can understand anything you can
explain and PROVE, but I won't accept your mystic claims on faith.
It's your funeral. Enjoy it if you can.
And men had diseases and birth defects hundreds of
thousands of years before some Hebrew priests got around to concocting
that Genesis *****.
So where do y ou profess the heavens and the earth and all in it came
from?
Check any decent text on cosmology. I know exactly where the earth,
the sun and other planets and all the stars you can see came from, and
it's not where Genesis claims. Where the entire universe came from I
don't know, but then neither do you.
Sure I do. God almighty made the heavens and the universe, and all that
is in
it. My evidence and statements are as valid as anything you can offer as
an
alternative.
Yea ..........right ............. in your dreams...........
But rather than me put words in your mouth, why do you try to explain the
beginning of all things. I'll start with:
That someone can, or cannot, explain anything has NOTING TO DO with your
proving god.
*****
Evidence of God - duke32, circa 2002AD
1. The belief that a supreme being is the creator of the universe is
based on a profession by those that believe that is equal to, but no
less than, any profession that our universe exists for any other
alternative reason that can be imagined.
One could hypothesize an astronomical event such as a prior universe
that collapsed on itself and has now exploded outward to form our new
present universe. If this did happen, it would have happened again
and again for the same reason as the latest occurrence, thereby
suggesting that the universe always was, is, and always will be. Yet
another equal suggestion is that the universe was birthed out of
another universe, or another dimension.
The human mind cannot cope with the idea that all things lack a
beginning, and clearly neither matter nor energy on their own, the
basic building blocks of the universe, could either exist in and of
itself, or in and of its own intelligence.
The profession by believers is that our universe is a creation of
almighty God who is truly acknowledged as "always was, is, and always
will be". No alternative is available.
Whether there is an alternatoiv or not - claiming so is merely delusional
fraud.
The argument, itself, is based on nothing but ignorance .. "I don't know how
the hell it happened " so there MUST be a god!
That is neither scientific or evidence - merely a continuation of the same
ignorance based religous fantasies.
*****
Why silly and superstition? What is your evidence?
He who asserts the affermative has the onus of supplying the evidence.
Nice game, but no cigar. Can you back up your words or not?
Let's see if you can...........
It's not up to me to supply evidence to refute every fantasy the
devout make up. I can't prove your God doesn't exist, but I also can't
prove the old Greek gods don't exist, or the old Roman gods, or any of
the other mryad gods man has invented for himself don't exist.
I'm quite satisfied and happy with my desire and hope for an eternity of
love
and peace of mind with God almighty.
Whether you're happy with that, or believing Peter Pan exists, is totally
meaningless and irrelient.
All I see in you is that you are one of those few that profess the
mythical
fable that there is no Almighty God.
And you bellow about a god that exists - without one shred of valid
evidence.
So if I must prove the God of the Bible doesn't exist or else believe
in him, you must prove Zeus and Demeter and Mythra don't exist or
believe in them.
Zeus, demeter and mythra never existed. In fact the current world's
expert
on mithra says mithra was just a sun's ray.
Bwahahhaaaaaaaaaaaaa.............you'll listen to this unknown - but ignore
ALL the valid scientific work,and scientists, that haven;t found any
evidence to support your good .. ytyour Adam and Eve .. your garden .. your
fairy tale "fall" ... and anything else out of YOUR bible that is related.
Sorry - you just said there is no Garden and no A&E. So lets see what
you got.
YOU asserted, YOU prove. I know that there were human beings like us
in Africa 130,000 years ago, and that doesn't match the Genesis story
very well.
YOU asserted, YOU prove.
Naaaaa. Naaaaaaaaa. ..... you said it first !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Ok so what's fraudulent about it. Put your mouth where your foot is
right now.
The Bible wasn't written when it was supposed to have been, or by
whom it claims to have been. It tells of a cosmology that is
ludicrous, a creation order that is erroneous, a Deluge that never
happened, and global miracles that somehow no one noticed.
So why is the cosmology ludicrous and the creation in error (big bang says
otherwise), what proof do you have the flood never happened?
Evidence that there were people on the earth for the whole time who,
appaently, never noticed that they were drowned and extinguished.
What global miracles are you referring to?
It tells of
an exodus that left no trace, and a conquest of the cities of the
plain that didn't happen either.
Of course there is trace of a wandering people. Ahhhhhhh, I suspect you
are
movie dreaming of a tight band of people wandering for 40 years, rather
than a
people quickly scattered throughout the desert.
How about evidence that they, en-masse - crossed the Red Sea together ... or
anything else they did BEFORE they wandered?
Shame, shame on you for no forethought at all.
Shame on you for being so ignorant!
.
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| User: "duke" |
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| Title: Re: No evidence of God yet... |
25 Jan 2004 03:56:36 PM |
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On Sun, 25 Jan 2004 10:59:39 -0500, "ZenIsWhen" <ZenIsWhen@anywhere.com> wrote:
No, no, no - why is it a folktale?
No answer, I observe.
It's your funeral. Enjoy it if you can.
No response, I note.
Sure I do. God almighty made the heavens and the universe, and all that
is in
it. My evidence and statements are as valid as anything you can offer as
an
alternative.
Yea ..........right ............. in your dreams...........
Shocked into submission, I see.
But rather than me put words in your mouth, why do you try to explain the
beginning of all things. I'll start with:
That someone can, or cannot, explain anything has NOTING TO DO with your
proving god.
I can't, and you can't prove otherwise.
*****
Evidence of God - duke32, circa 2002AD
1. The belief that a supreme being is the creator of the universe is
based on a profession by those that believe that is equal to, but no
less than, any profession that our universe exists for any other
alternative reason that can be imagined.
One could hypothesize an astronomical event such as a prior universe
that collapsed on itself and has now exploded outward to form our new
present universe. If this did happen, it would have happened again
and again for the same reason as the latest occurrence, thereby
suggesting that the universe always was, is, and always will be. Yet
another equal suggestion is that the universe was birthed out of
another universe, or another dimension.
The human mind cannot cope with the idea that all things lack a
beginning, and clearly neither matter nor energy on their own, the
basic building blocks of the universe, could either exist in and of
itself, or in and of its own intelligence.
The profession by believers is that our universe is a creation of
almighty God who is truly acknowledged as "always was, is, and always
will be". No alternative is available.
Whether there is an alternatoiv or not - claiming so is merely delusional
fraud.
Hahahahahaha. Delusional fraud - you sure are.
The argument, itself, is based on nothing but ignorance .. "I don't know how
the hell it happened " so there MUST be a god!
Actually I offered two alternatives, for a total of 3 options.
You are a delusional fraud, being unable to offer even 1 option.
That is neither scientific or evidence - merely a continuation of the same
ignorance based religous fantasies.
Sure, little dumbo.
Let's see if you can...........
Are you so shocked that you are speechless. Answer - yes, you bet.
It's not up to me to supply evidence to refute every fantasy the
devout make up. I can't prove your God doesn't exist, but I also can't
prove the old Greek gods don't exist, or the old Roman gods, or any of
the other mryad gods man has invented for himself don't exist.
I'm quite satisfied and happy with my desire and hope for an eternity of
love and peace of mind with God almighty.
Whether you're happy with that, or believing Peter Pan exists, is totally
meaningless and irrelient.
Well, watch this. Me: win (hopefully)/no win. You the atheist: lose/no win.
"No win" comes into play if there is no Almighty God.
Do you care to continue to play the game?
All I see in you is that you are one of those few that profess the
mythical
fable that there is no Almighty God.
And you bellow about a god that exists - without one shred of valid
evidence.
Which puts my position no worst than yours.
So if I must prove the God of the Bible doesn't exist or else believe
in him, you must prove Zeus and Demeter and Mythra don't exist or
believe in them.
Zeus, demeter and mythra never existed. In fact the current world's
expert
on mithra says mithra was just a sun's ray.
Bwahahhaaaaaaaaaaaaa.............you'll listen to this unknown - but ignore
ALL the valid scientific work,and scientists, that haven;t found any
evidence to support your good
Like who. And what did they discover. And what do they have to offer you
dumbo's that there is no God.
You have nothing, dummy, nothing to substantiate your position. End of joke.
. ytyour Adam and Eve .. your garden .. your
fairy tale "fall" ... and anything else out of YOUR bible that is related.
But "why", dumbo. Do you have any little ole reason to say why? Of course you
don't. Today you are simply the world's biggest idiot dummy.
Sorry - you just said there is no Garden and no A&E. So lets see what
you got.
YOU asserted, YOU prove. I know that there were human beings like us
in Africa 130,000 years ago, and that doesn't match the Genesis story
very well.
YOU asserted, YOU prove.
Naaaaa. Naaaaaaaaa. ..... you said it first !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Sorry, but it's your funeral. Enjoy it if you can.
So why is the cosmology ludicrous and the creation in error (big bang says
otherwise), what proof do you have the flood never happened?
Evidence that there were people on the earth for the whole time who,
appaently, never noticed that they were drowned and extinguished.
Are you suggesting they walked and talked after they drowned?
Come on, dumbo, not even you believe that.
What global miracles are you referring to?
Oh, no answer I see.
How about evidence that they, en-masse - crossed the Red Sea together ... or
anything else they did BEFORE they wandered?
Who said they crossed em-masse? You're been watching too many movies lately.
Shame, shame on you for no forethought at all.
Shame on you for being so ignorant!
Why am I the one? You, dumbo, are the stiffled one.
.
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| User: "John Ings" |
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| Title: Re: No evidence of God yet... |
25 Jan 2004 04:36:11 PM |
|
|
On Sun, 25 Jan 2004 15:56:36 -0600, duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> wrote:
Well, watch this. Me: win (hopefully)/no win. You the atheist: lose/no win.
"No win" comes into play if there is no Almighty God.
Pascal's Wager? Blather! Just believing in God on the basis of a
cynical bet is good enough for a win? C'mon now, that won't do!
You have to believe deeply and sincerely and in just the right God in
just the right way don't you? And what makes you so sure yours is the
right way?
Maybe you need to believe as the Jews do. Or perhaps the Mormons have
it right, or the Muslims. Maybe the pope's crowd have it right, but
then it could be the Jehova's Witlesses...
So really it's You: no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/
no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/
no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/
no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/
no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/
no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/
no win/ (faint hope)win.
## Causes of atheism; division in religions.
.
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| User: "duke" |
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| Title: Re: No evidence of God yet... |
26 Jan 2004 05:54:50 PM |
|
|
On Sun, 25 Jan 2004 14:36:11 -0800, John Ings <nodamned@spam.org> wrote:
On Sun, 25 Jan 2004 15:56:36 -0600, duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> wrote:
Well, watch this. Me: win (hopefully)/no win. You the atheist: lose/no win.
"No win" comes into play if there is no Almighty God.
Pascal's Wager? Blather! Just believing in God on the basis of a
cynical bet is good enough for a win? C'mon now, that won't do!
You have to believe deeply and sincerely and in just the right God in
just the right way don't you? And what makes you so sure yours is the
right way?
Oh, I see you are basically unfamiliar with the PW. The PW itself is of
questionable value, but the premise is rock solid.
Maybe you need to believe as the Jews do. Or perhaps the Mormons have
it right, or the Muslims. Maybe the pope's crowd have it right, but
then it could be the Jehova's Witlesses...
Thanks, but I'll stick with the winner - Christianity.
So really it's You: no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/
no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/
no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/
no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/
no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/
no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/
no win/ (faint hope)win.
I win.
.
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| User: "John Ings" |
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| Title: Re: No evidence of God yet... |
26 Jan 2004 07:15:06 PM |
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|
On Mon, 26 Jan 2004 17:54:50 -0600, duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> wrote:
Pascal's Wager? Blather! Just believing in God on the basis of a
cynical bet is good enough for a win? C'mon now, that won't do!
You have to believe deeply and sincerely and in just the right God in
just the right way don't you? And what makes you so sure yours is the
right way?
Oh, I see you are basically unfamiliar with the PW. The PW itself is of
questionable value, but the premise is rock solid.
The premise is ludicrous. It assumes:
1. That there is a God
2. That said God is cognizant of humanity
3. That being cognizant, God gives a ***** about all of us let alone
you
Maybe you need to believe as the Jews do. Or perhaps the Mormons have
it right, or the Muslims. Maybe the pope's crowd have it right, but
then it could be the Jehova's Witlesses...
Thanks, but I'll stick with the winner - Christianity.
Which flavour?
So really it's You: no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/
no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/
no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/
no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/
no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/
no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/no win/
no win/ (faint hope)win.
I win.
No, you just hope you will, but the odds are not in your favour.
## Man has the True Religion---several of them!
Mark Twain
.
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| User: "duke" |
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| Title: Re: No evidence of God yet... |
01 Feb 2004 06:51:05 AM |
|
|
On Mon, 26 Jan 2004 17:15:06 -0800, John Ings <nodamned@spam.org> wrote:
Oh, I see you are basically unfamiliar with the PW. The PW itself is of
questionable value, but the premise is rock solid.
The premise is ludicrous. It assumes:
1. That there is a God
2. That said God is cognizant of humanity
3. That being cognizant, God gives a ***** about all of us let alone
you
Wow - look at your errors.
You don't know what the premise is. then:
1. God almighty exists.
2. God created humanity.
3. We are his children, he is our Father.
Maybe you need to believe as the Jews do. Or perhaps the Mormons have
it right, or the Muslims. Maybe the pope's crowd have it right, but
then it could be the Jehova's Witlesses...
Thanks, but I'll stick with the winner - Christianity.
Which flavour?
There is only one.
I win.
No, you just hope you will, but the odds are not in your favour.
Why not? With the existance of almighty God a fact, my odds are fantastic.
Yours may not be, though.
.
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| User: "John Ings" |
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| Title: Re: No evidence of God yet... |
01 Feb 2004 07:27:28 AM |
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On Sun, 01 Feb 2004 06:51:05 -0600, duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> wrote:
Oh, I see you are basically unfamiliar with the PW. The PW itself is of
questionable value, but the premise is rock solid.
The premise is ludicrous. It assumes:
1. That there is a God
2. That said God is cognizant of humanity
3. That being cognizant, God gives a ***** about all of us let alone
you
Wow - look at your errors.
You don't know what the premise is.
I certainly do. The premise is a dichotomy, a coice between believing
in God and not believing. That's NOT the choice. The real choice is a
multiplicity, believe in this god or that god or one of hundreds of
visions of god or believe in no god.
then:
1. God almighty exists.
Not demonstarted or demonstrable.
2. God created humanity.
Not demonstarted or demonstrable.
And if true, he probably did not do so deliberately.
3. We are his children, he is our Father.
Or so you fantasize
Maybe you need to believe as the Jews do. Or perhaps the Mormons have
it right, or the Muslims. Maybe the pope's crowd have it right, but
then it could be the Jehova's Witlesses...
Thanks, but I'll stick with the winner - Christianity.
Which flavour?
There is only one.
Yours of course. All the rest are false Christianity.
But then maybe yours is too...
I win.
No, you just hope you will, but the odds are not in your favour.
Why not?
Because there are so many, many choices and there's no practical way
to discern if the prize is even there to be won, let alone how to win
it.
With the existance of almighty God a fact, my odds are fantastic.
As we have seen, no, your odds are very long indeed.
Yours may not be, though.
You forget, I don't want your prize...
## Never undertake vast schemes with half-vast methods.
.
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| User: "duke" |
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| Title: Re: No evidence of God yet... |
01 Feb 2004 03:13:10 PM |
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On Sun, 01 Feb 2004 05:27:28 -0800, John Ings <nodamned@spam.org> wrote:
You don't know what the premise is.
I certainly do. The premise is a dichotomy, a coice between believing
in God and not believing.
Congratulations, I think maybe you do have a clue.
That's NOT the choice. The real choice is a
multiplicity, believe in this god or that god or one of hundreds of
visions of god or believe in no god.
Nope, that has nothing to do with it. There is only one God almighty.
Multiplicity is out of the question.
then:
1. God almighty exists.
Not demonstarted or demonstrable.
It is therefore an error to say he doesn't.
2. God created humanity.
Not demonstarted or demonstrable.
And if true, he probably did not do so deliberately.
We are his creation.
3. We are his children, he is our Father.
Or so you fantasize
You have nothing to offer to the contrary.
Maybe you need to believe as the Jews do. Or perhaps the Mormons have
it right, or the Muslims. Maybe the pope's crowd have it right, but
then it could be the Jehova's Witlesses...
Thanks, but I'll stick with the winner - Christianity.
Which flavour?
There is only one.
Yours of course. All the rest are false Christianity.
But then maybe yours is too...
No, you clearly don't understand. There is only one Christianity - various
pluses and minuses of worship are demonstrated, but there is only one
Christianity..
Why not?
Because there are so many, many choices and there's no practical way
to discern if the prize is even there to be won, let alone how to win
it.
Nope, only one Christianity.
With the existance of almighty God a fact, my odds are fantastic.
As we have seen, no, your odds are very long indeed.
Just becaue you choose to say no. Don't be so stupid.
Yours may not be, though.
You forget, I don't want your prize...
It's your funeral, and whether you want to or not, you too will stand before God
to answer to your rejection of him.
## Never undertake vast schemes with half-vast methods.
Your's is one of the most suicidal.
.
|
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| User: "John Ings" |
|
| Title: Re: No evidence of God yet... |
01 Feb 2004 04:47:48 PM |
|
|
On Sun, 01 Feb 2004 15:13:10 -0600, duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> wrote:
That's NOT the choice. The real choice is a
multiplicity, believe in this god or that god or one of hundreds of
visions of god or believe in no god.
Nope, that has nothing to do with it. There is only one God almighty.
But many visions of him.
Multiplicity is out of the question.
Not demonstrated or demonstrable.
1. God almighty exists.
Not demonstarted or demonstrable.
It is therefore an error to say he doesn't.
True. Also to say he does.
The fact is not only that no one knows, but that no one ever CAN know.
2. God created humanity.
Not demonstarted or demonstrable.
And if true, he probably did not do so deliberately.
We are his creation.
Possibly indirectly. If there is a Universal Creator who caused the
laws of physics to be what they are, then the sponaneous evolution of
life wherever conditions are favorable is probably an imperative.
3. We are his children, he is our Father.
Or so you fantasize
You have nothing to offer to the contrary.
I have the evidence of cosmology, paleontology, archeology,
cell-biology and history to indicate that man is an accidental
construct and that there is no evidence whatsoever that the
intervention of any supernatural being has ever been involved in his
appearance on earth or his development.
Maybe you need to believe as the Jews do. Or perhaps the Mormons have
it right, or the Muslims. Maybe the pope's crowd have it right, but
then it could be the Jehova's Witlesses...
Thanks, but I'll stick with the winner - Christianity.
Which flavour?
There is only one.
Yours of course. All the rest are false Christianity.
But then maybe yours is too...
No, you clearly don't understand. There is only one Christianity - various
pluses and minuses of worship are demonstrated, but there is only one
Christianity..
Really? Strange is it not then, that your fellow Christians don't
agree? Even a superficial perusal of posts in this newsgroup will show
you that,
I win.
No, you just hope you will, but the odds are not in your favour.
Why not?
Because there are so many, many choices and there's no practical way
to discern if the prize is even there to be won, let alone how to win
it.
Nope, only one Christianity.
In your mind. But not in other Christians. Can a Jew get to Heaven?
A Muslim? A Mormon? A Hindu?
With the existance of almighty God a fact, my odds are fantastic.
As we have seen, no, your odds are very long indeed.
Just becaue you choose to say no. Don't be so stupid.
Just saying yes on the basis of a cynical bet,
"I've got nothing to lose" is sufficient?
Yours may not be, though.
You forget, I don't want your prize...
It's your funeral, and whether you want to or not, you too will stand before God
to answer to your rejection of him.
If God matches your envisionment of him as a hide-and-seek deity who
demands I bet my immortal soul on believing the right preacher.
## Equal toleration of all religions is atheism. Pope LEO XIII
.
|
|
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| User: "duke" |
|
| Title: Re: No evidence of God yet... |
02 Feb 2004 05:25:25 PM |
|
|
On Sun, 01 Feb 2004 14:47:48 -0800, John Ings <nodamned@spam.org> wrote:
Nope, that has nothing to do with it. There is only one God almighty.
But many visions of him.
Well, some people see a long white beard, some see a flowing robe. What are you
referring to when you say "vision"?
1. God almighty exists.
Not demonstarted or demonstrable.
Nor is his non-existance.
It is therefore an error to say he doesn't.
True. Also to say he does.
The fact is not only that no one knows, but that no one ever CAN know.
That's why it's called "faith in God".
We are his creation.
Possibly indirectly. If there is a Universal Creator who caused the
laws of physics to be what they are, then the sponaneous evolution of
life wherever conditions are favorable is probably an imperative.
Personally, I believe he had me directly in mind. Care you provide a case
otherwise?
3. We are his children, he is our Father.
Or so you fantasize
You have nothing to offer to the contrary.
I have the evidence of cosmology, paleontology, archeology,
cell-biology and history to indicate that man is an accidental
construct and that there is no evidence whatsoever that the
intervention of any supernatural being has ever been involved in his
appearance on earth or his development.
Nope, you have things to point to. I can point to a banana just as easy. The
truth is you just say "no" to God's existance. You clearly have nothing else to
turn to.
No, you clearly don't understand. There is only one Christianity - various
pluses and minuses of worship are demonstrated, but there is only one
Christianity..
Really? Strange is it not then, that your fellow Christians don't
agree? Even a superficial perusal of posts in this newsgroup will show
you that,
You're listening to atheists, not Christians..
Various understandings of Christianity exist, but there is only one
Christianity. Baptists and Catholics have virtual 50% differing "views", but
one Christ, one God, one Christianity. Even the bible presents different action
stories in the bible, but one message from God.
In your mind. But not in other Christians. Can a Jew get to Heaven?
A Muslim? A Mormon? A Hindu?
There is only one way. Christ. It's his decision basis the life of the
individual regardless of his religous faith practiced.
With the existance of almighty God a fact, my odds are fantastic.
As we have seen, no, your odds are very long indeed.
Just becaue you choose to say no. Don't be so stupid.
Just saying yes on the basis of a cynical bet,
"I've got nothing to lose" is sufficient?
Say what ever you wish. Christ is the only way.
Yours may not be, though.
You forget, I don't want your prize...
It's your funeral, and whether you want to or not, you too will stand before God
to answer to your rejection of him.
If God matches your envisionment of him as a hide-and-seek deity who
demands I bet my immortal soul on believing the right preacher.
God broadcast a new commandment 2000 years ago. It applies to atheists as well
as Christians.
You can say "yes" to it, or "no" to it. And you will stand in judgement
regardless of your answer.
.
|
|
|
| User: "John Ings" |
|
| Title: Re: No evidence of God yet... |
02 Feb 2004 06:31:55 PM |
|
|
On Mon, 02 Feb 2004 17:25:25 -0600, duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> wrote:
Nope, that has nothing to do with it. There is only one God almighty.
But many visions of him.
Well, some people see a long white beard, some see a flowing robe. What are you
referring to when you say "vision"?
A deity who rewards and punishes the objects of his creation like
farmer relating to a mule with carrot and stick. A supernatural entity
who is pleased by praise and flattery like some conceited tribal
chief. A monster who condones slavery and underwrites the power of
greedy priests. A 'loving' God who proposes to condemn me to eternal
life, which in either heaven or hell would be excruciating torment.
A creator crazy enough to subscribe to the inane hocus-pocus of
Atonement, sacrificing an aspect of himself to himself to atone for
the sins of generations unborn.
That kind of envisionment. I'm not talking about physical appearance.
1. God almighty exists.
Not demonstarted or demonstrable.
Nor is his non-existance.
Agreed. Same goes for Zeus and Mithra.
It is therefore an error to say he doesn't.
True. Also to say he does.
The fact is not only that no one knows, but that no one ever CAN know.
That's why it's called "faith in God".
And also called superstition.
We are his creation.
Possibly indirectly. If there is a Universal Creator who caused the
laws of physics to be what they are, then the sponaneous evolution of
life wherever conditions are favorable is probably an imperative.
Personally, I believe he had me directly in mind. Care you provide a case
otherwise?
Easily. If you are a deliberate creation, God is a sloppy workman.
3. We are his children, he is our Father.
Or so you fantasize
You have nothing to offer to the contrary.
I have the evidence of cosmology, paleontology, archeology,
cell-biology and history to indicate that man is an accidental
construct and that there is no evidence whatsoever that the
intervention of any supernatural being has ever been involved in his
appearance on earth or his development.
Nope, you have things to point to.
Pertinent and persuasive facts.
I can point to a banana just as easy.
But without meaning.
The truth is you just say "no" to God's existance.
As I have now told you repeatedly, no I don't.
You clearly have nothing else to turn to.
You are clearly either scientifically illiterate, or what is termed
'invincibly ignorant'.
No, you clearly don't understand. There is only one Christianity - various
pluses and minuses of worship are demonstrated, but there is only one
Christianity..
Really? Strange is it not then, that your fellow Christians don't
agree? Even a superficial perusal of posts in this newsgroup will show
you that,
You're listening to atheists, not Christians.
Yeah, but they think they're Christians, just like you. In fact I
recognize your attitude as the hallmark of the Christian; an eagerness
to declare his fellow Christian 'not a True Christian', or worse an
atheist.
Various understandings of Christianity exist, but there is only one
Christianity. Baptists and Catholics have virtual 50% differing "views", but
one Christ, one God, one Christianity.
One Christianity divided. Sectarian as it always has been right from
its inception.
Even the bible presents different action
stories in the bible, but one message from God.
Sheepdip.
In your mind. But not in other Christians. Can a Jew get to Heaven?
A Muslim? A Mormon? A Hindu?
There is only one way. Christ.
And there you have it. Your message of intolerance and hatred to the
world. Call it love all you want, but the bottom line is always the
same... the other guys gods are false and yours is true, and he says
the same, and let the jihad begin!
It's his decision basis the life of the
individual regardless of his religous faith practiced.
That's your vision of God. If it's true then God is an evil monster.
But I think any being capable of creating the universe I see around me
is smarter than that. You envision God as a Bronze Age sheepherder
did, brutal and vindictive. How primitive.
With the existance of almighty God a fact, my odds are fantastic.
As we have seen, no, your odds are very long indeed.
Just becaue you choose to say no. Don't be so stupid.
Just saying yes on the basis of a cynical bet,
"I've got nothing to lose" is sufficient?
Say what ever you wish. Christ is the only way.
As a bet? No real love of Our Saviour required? Just making a bet
because there's everything to gain and nothing to loose?
whether you want to or not, you too will stand before God
to answer to your rejection of him.
If God matches your envisionment of him as a hide-and-seek deity who
demands I bet my immortal soul on believing the right preacher.
God broadcast a new commandment 2000 years ago.
Did he? You envision a God who is really that stupid? An omnipotent
creator who somehow just can't make himself heard, who can't
communicate to his creations except through the scribblings of
wild-eyed prophets and sly preists? Hundreds of millions of people in
the world even then, and he addresses only the fanatical theologians
of one nondescript little tribe in Mesopotamia?
It applies to atheists as well as Christians.
God isn't that bloody ignorant duke. If he exists he's just gotta be a
LOT smarter than that! If he was interested in us hearing what he
wants, there would be no doubts on anyone's part. And greedy, power
hungry prelates would be out of business. So would Bible thumping
evangelicals.
You can say "yes" to it, or "no" to it. And you will stand in judgement
regardless of your answer.
If you can't lure them in with honeyed promises, scare them in with
threats of hellfire eh?
## The whole religious complexion of the modern world
## is due to the absence from Jerusalem of a lunatic asylum
Havlock Ellis
.
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| User: "duke" |
|
| Title: Re: No evidence of God yet... |
03 Feb 2004 05:34:09 PM |
|
|
On Mon, 02 Feb 2004 16:31:55 -0800, John Ings <nodamned@spam.org> wrote:
On Mon, 02 Feb 2004 17:25:25 -0600, duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> wrote:
Nope, that has nothing to do with it. There is only one God almighty.
But many visions of him.
Well, some people see a long white beard, some see a flowing robe. What are you
referring to when you say "vision"?
A deity who rewards and punishes the objects of his creation like
farmer relating to a mule with carrot and stick.
Well, there you do. God does no such thing. Eventually you'll realize this is
where you fail.
A supernatural entity
who is pleased by praise and flattery like some conceited tribal
chief.
Doesn't do that either.
A monster who condones slavery and underwrites the power of
greedy priests.
Definitely doesn't do that.
A 'loving' God who proposes to condemn me to eternal
life, which in either heaven or hell would be excruciating torment.
Well, I plan on going one way, and am loving the approach. You are scared to
death going the other way, but won't do anything to avoid it.
It's your funeral, enjoy it if you can.
A creator crazy enough to subscribe to the inane hocus-pocus of
Atonement, sacrificing an aspect of himself to himself to atone for
the sins of generations unborn.
Nope, that doesn't apply either.
That kind of envisionment. I'm not talking about physical appearance.
Well, you got God all wrong, that's for sure.
That's why it's called "faith in God".
And also called superstition.
Why?
Personally, I believe he had me directly in mind. Care you provide a case
otherwise?
Easily. If you are a deliberate creation, God is a sloppy workman.
Maybe in your case, but not mine.
Pertinent and persuasive facts.
Nope, ignorance.
I can point to a banana just as easy.
But without meaning.
Just what you do.
The truth is you just say "no" to God's existance.
As I have now told you repeatedly, no I don't.
Gosh, you got a long way to go to deny that one.
You clearly have nothing else to turn to.
You are clearly either scientifically illiterate, or what is termed
'invincibly ignorant'.
I know more than you do, and especially the truth.
Even the bible presents different action
stories in the bible, but one message from God.
Sheepdip.
You didn't know that. I shows all over you.
In your mind. But not in other Christians. Can a Jew get to Heaven?
A Muslim? A Mormon? A Hindu?
There is only one way. Christ.
And there you have it. Your message of intolerance and hatred to the
world.
More demonstrated ignorance on your part. You'll note I didn't say "one had to
be a Christian".
No, no you didn't.
God is so much love that being a Christian has nothing to do with getting to
heaven. Of course, we have a gigantic leg up on others, becasue we understand
that the way is to love one another as God loves us. That's not a strong trait
of other faiths, just Christianity.
You blew it.
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| User: "John Ings" |
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| Title: Re: No evidence of God yet... |
04 Feb 2004 05:06:53 AM |
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On Tue, 03 Feb 2004 17:34:09 -0600, duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> wrote:
Nope, that has nothing to do with it. There is only one God almighty.
But many visions of him.
Well, some people see a long white beard, some see a flowing robe. What are you
referring to when you say "vision"?
A deity who rewards and punishes the objects of his creation like
farmer relating to a mule with carrot and stick.
Well, there you do. God does no such thing. Eventually you'll realize this is
where you fail.
The God of the Bible does EXACTLY that!
Heaven is the carrot, and Hell the stick.
A supernatural entity
who is pleased by praise and flattery like some conceited tribal
chief.
Doesn't do that either.
Then why all the praise and flattery? The Bible is fairly stuffed with
it, and your Christian churces echo with fawning hymns and servile
supplication.
A monster who condones slavery and underwrites the power of
greedy priests.
Definitely doesn't do that.
Leviticus 25:44 As for the male and female slaves whom you may have,
it is from the nations around you that you may acquire male and female
slaves. 45 You may also acquire them from among the aliens residing
with you, and from their families that are with you, who have been
born in your land; and they may be your property. 46You may keep them
as a possession for your children after you, for them to inherit as
property. These you may treat as slaves,
1 Timothy 6:1-2 "Those who are slaves must
consider their masters worthy of all respect, so that no one will
speak evil of the name of God and of our teaching. Slaves belonging to
Christian masters must not despise them, for they are their brothers."
A 'loving' God who proposes to condemn me to eternal
life, which in either heaven or hell would be excruciating torment.
Well, I plan on going one way, and am loving the approach. You are scared to
death going the other way, but won't do anything to avoid it.
Read what I said again and quit reformulating my motivations to suit
yourself!
It's your funeral, enjoy it if you can.
That's the best you can do to recommend your God to me, isn't it duke?
Threaten me with hellfire. Your God with the stick.
A creator crazy enough to subscribe to the inane hocus-pocus of
Atonement, sacrificing an aspect of himself to himself to atone for
the sins of generations unborn.
Nope, that doesn't apply either.
Then you have invented your own deity and don't believe in the Jesus
of the New Testament.
That kind of envisionment. I'm not talking about physical appearance.
Well, you got God all wrong, that's for sure.
Or you have. And from your answers above, I'm confident it's you.
That's why it's called "faith in God".
And also called superstition.
Why?
superstition, n
1 a : a belief or practice resulting from ignorance, fear of the
unknown, trust in magic or chance, or a false conception of causation
b : an irrational abject attitude of mind toward the supernatural,
nature, or God resulting from superstition
2 : a notion maintained despite evidence to the contrary
Personally, I believe he had me directly in mind. Care you provide a case
otherwise?
Easily. If you are a deliberate creation, God is a sloppy workman.
Maybe in your case, but not mine.
Your anatomy is the same as mine.
Pertinent and persuasive facts.
Nope, ignorance.
So you contend but can't demonstrate.
I can point to a banana just as easy.
But without meaning.
Just what you do.
Let the bystander judge...
The truth is you just say "no" to God's existance.
As I have now told you repeatedly, no I don't.
Gosh, you got a long way to go to deny that one.
That I deny your vision of a malignant deity doesn't mean I have the
timerity to deny that God may exist.
You clearly have nothing else to turn to.
You are clearly either scientifically illiterate, or what is termed
'invincibly ignorant'.
I know more than you do, and especially the truth.
You just don't deign to show it.
Nah! You're just posing and posturing. Pretending you have an insight
into mysteries us spiritually blind folk just can't understand. But
it's either delusion or bluff.
Even the bible presents different action
stories in the bible, but one message from God.
Sheepdip.
You didn't know that. I shows all over you.
And you can't prove it because it ain't so.
In your mind. But not in other Christians. Can a Jew get to Heaven?
A Muslim? A Mormon? A Hindu?
There is only one way. Christ.
And there you have it. Your message of intolerance and hatred to the
world.
More demonstrated ignorance on your part. You'll note I didn't say "one had to
be a Christian".
No, no you didn't.
Yeah, I've met that "free pass into heaven" baloney before.
The man who leads a good life in a foreign land and who has never
heard of Jesus will get to Heaven anyway.
God is so much love that being a Christian has nothing to do with getting to
heaven. Of course, we have a gigantic leg up on others, becasue we understand
that the way is to love one another as God loves us. That's not a strong trait
of other faiths, just Christianity.
You blew it.
In your opinion. But don't try and tell me your 53% believe that!
## Equal toleration of all religions is atheism. Pope LEO XIII
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