Religions > Bible > Re: The Top 10 Reasons Why I Don't Celebrate Christmas
| Topic: |
Religions > Bible |
| User: |
"Pastor Dave" |
| Date: |
05 Dec 2007 06:29:35 PM |
| Object: |
Re: The Top 10 Reasons Why I Don't Celebrate Christmas |
On Mon, 3 Dec 2007 14:47:13 -0800 (PST),
paganisminchristianity <paganisminchristianity@yahoo.com>
said the following:
The Top 10 Reasons Why I Don't Celebrate Christmas
1. CHRISTMAS IS DRIVEN BY COMMERCIALISM
Amen!
2. CHRISTMAS IS NOWHERE MENTIONED IN THE BIBLE
Amen!
3. JESUS WASN'T BORN ON OR NEAR DECEMBER 25TH
Amen!
4. THE CHRISTMAS HOLIDAY IS LARGELY A RECYCLED
PAGAN CELEBRATION.
Amen! And I have a chapter that I wrote in my book,
which I would be happy to send to you free of charge,
if you want it and give me your email address.
5. GOD CONDEMNS USING PAGAN CUSTOMS TO
WORHSIP HIM.
A-M-E-N !!! Now if only "Christians" would stop
excusing their own paganism and get with God
on this issue!!!
6. CHRISTMAS IS WORSHIPPING GOD IN VAIN.
Since Christmas is a jumble of ancient pagan customs
invented by men, and a holiday found nowhere in the
Bible, does God honor or accept such worship?
Jesus provides the answer in His stern rebuke of the
religious teachers of His day, men who had
substituted human traditions and teachings for God's
divine truths and commands: "Well did Isaiah prophesy
of you hypocrites . . . 'in vain they worship Me, teaching
as doctrines the commandments of men.' . . . All too
well you reject the commandment of God, that you
may keep your tradition" (Mark 7:6-9).
Amen! See Matthew 15, please! :)
7.YOU CAN'T PUT CHRIST BACK IN SOMETHING HE
WAS NEVER IN.
Amen!
8. THE BIBLE NOWHERE TELLS US TO OBSERVE A
HOLIDAY CELBRATING JESUS CHRIST'S BIRTH--BUT IT
CLEARLY DOES TELL US TO COMMEMORATE HIS DEATH.
Amen!
9. CHRISTMAS OBSCURES GOD'S PLAN FOR MANKIND
Yes it does! Amen!
10. I'D RATHER CELEBRATE THE HOLY DAYS
JESUS CHRIST AND THE APOSTLES OBSERVED.
Unnecessary, since they were only until the Mosaic Age
had ended, but no harm in it either. :)
Great post!!! :)
--
"Wasn't there a time when the brightest minds in
the world believed that the world was flat? And
up until like what, 50 years ago, you all thought
the atom was the smallest thing, until you split
it open and this like, whole mess of crap came out.
Now, are you telling me that you are so unbelievably
arrogant that you can't admit that there's a teeny
tiny possibility that you could be wrong about this?"
- Phoebe from Friends, regarding evolution
.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: The Top 10 Reasons Why I Don't Celebrate Christmas |
06 Dec 2007 08:10:40 AM |
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I've given you my top 10 reasons for not celebrating Christmas. What do you suppose God thinks of your reasons for continuing to observe it?
If we entertain the notion of god thinking... the answer to your
rhetorical question is that it doesn't matter what god thinks because
(1) any god so insecure and egocentric as to care what measly humans
do with a pine tree and some lights once a year (compared to an
eternity) is ridiculous, (2) the thoughts of a personal god are
imaginary and if god didn't want x-mas celebrated then god could
always write "don't celebrate x-mas" in the sky in brazen gold and
lastly (3) any god that is so cruel and immoral as to force people to
eat their kids is not worthy of consideration, much less abiding by
any purported prohibition against families handing gifts to each
other.
Leviticus 26:22 "I will also send wild beasts among you, which shall
rob you of your children, and destroy your cattle, and make you few in
number; and your high ways shall be desolate."
Lev. 26: 28, 29: "Then I will walk contrary unto you also in fury; and
I, even I, will chastise you seven times for your sins. And ye shall
eat the flesh of your sons, and the flesh of your daughters shall ye
eat."
Deuteronomy 28:53 "Then you shall eat the offspring of your own body,
the flesh of your sons and of your daughters whom the LORD your God
has given you.."
Merry x-mas...
.
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| User: "Ylog" |
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| Title: Re: The Top 10 Reasons Why I Don't Celebrate Christmas |
10 Dec 2007 04:49:23 PM |
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Christmas is a great victory of Christ over paganism. Ask any person in the
world what Christmas is. They are not going to say that its comercialism or
the name of th pagan god or anything else. They are going to say the Birth
of Jesus Christ. Victory to Jesus!!!
AMEN!!!!
"Pastor Dave" <ananias917_@_gmail.com> wrote in message
news:2jgel35545tg1jaa67huq9p2r4su7fuffr@4ax.com...
On Mon, 3 Dec 2007 14:47:13 -0800 (PST),
paganisminchristianity <paganisminchristianity@yahoo.com>
said the following:
The Top 10 Reasons Why I Don't Celebrate Christmas
1. CHRISTMAS IS DRIVEN BY COMMERCIALISM
Amen!
2. CHRISTMAS IS NOWHERE MENTIONED IN THE BIBLE
Amen!
3. JESUS WASN'T BORN ON OR NEAR DECEMBER 25TH
Amen!
4. THE CHRISTMAS HOLIDAY IS LARGELY A RECYCLED
PAGAN CELEBRATION.
Amen! And I have a chapter that I wrote in my book,
which I would be happy to send to you free of charge,
if you want it and give me your email address.
5. GOD CONDEMNS USING PAGAN CUSTOMS TO
WORHSIP HIM.
A-M-E-N !!! Now if only "Christians" would stop
excusing their own paganism and get with God
on this issue!!!
6. CHRISTMAS IS WORSHIPPING GOD IN VAIN.
Since Christmas is a jumble of ancient pagan customs
invented by men, and a holiday found nowhere in the
Bible, does God honor or accept such worship?
Jesus provides the answer in His stern rebuke of the
religious teachers of His day, men who had
substituted human traditions and teachings for God's
divine truths and commands: "Well did Isaiah prophesy
of you hypocrites . . . 'in vain they worship Me, teaching
as doctrines the commandments of men.' . . . All too
well you reject the commandment of God, that you
may keep your tradition" (Mark 7:6-9).
Amen! See Matthew 15, please! :)
7.YOU CAN'T PUT CHRIST BACK IN SOMETHING HE
WAS NEVER IN.
Amen!
8. THE BIBLE NOWHERE TELLS US TO OBSERVE A
HOLIDAY CELBRATING JESUS CHRIST'S BIRTH--BUT IT
CLEARLY DOES TELL US TO COMMEMORATE HIS DEATH.
Amen!
9. CHRISTMAS OBSCURES GOD'S PLAN FOR MANKIND
Yes it does! Amen!
10. I'D RATHER CELEBRATE THE HOLY DAYS
JESUS CHRIST AND THE APOSTLES OBSERVED.
Unnecessary, since they were only until the Mosaic Age
had ended, but no harm in it either. :)
Great post!!! :)
--
"Wasn't there a time when the brightest minds in
the world believed that the world was flat? And
up until like what, 50 years ago, you all thought
the atom was the smallest thing, until you split
it open and this like, whole mess of crap came out.
Now, are you telling me that you are so unbelievably
arrogant that you can't admit that there's a teeny
tiny possibility that you could be wrong about this?"
- Phoebe from Friends, regarding evolution
.
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| User: "Emma" |
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| Title: Re: The Top 10 Reasons Why I Don't Celebrate Christmas |
11 Dec 2007 05:42:24 AM |
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In article <13lrgjqc57dkb53@corp.supernews.com>, Ylog says...
Christmas is a great victory of Christ over paganism.
Ask any person in the
world what Christmas is. They are not going to
say that its comercialism or
the name of th pagan god or anything else.
They are going to say the Birth
of Jesus Christ. Victory to Jesus!!!
I don't know where you live, but I think in
a lot of the UK at least, the first thing many
children say about Christmas is that it's
the time when Father Christmas brings them
toys. They generally mention Jesus' birthday
as an afterthought. But that's probably
because children are self-centred.
Anyway, I love Christmas, and I do agree that
it's never considered a pagan holiday.
--
*~*~Emma~*~*
http://www.christmas-time.com/ct-faith.htm
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: The Top 10 Reasons Why I Don't Celebrate Christmas |
11 Dec 2007 11:09:58 PM |
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On Dec 11, 5:42 am, Emma <e...@newsguy.com> wrote:
In article <13lrgjqc57dk...@corp.supernews.com>, Ylog says...
Christmas is a great victory of Christ over paganism.
Ask any person in the
world what Christmas is. They are not going to
say that its comercialism or
the name of th pagan god or anything else.
They are going to say the Birth
of Jesus Christ. Victory to Jesus!!!
I don't know where you live, but I think in
a lot of the UK at least, the first thing many
children say about Christmas is that it's
the time when Father Christmas brings them
toys. They generally mention Jesus' birthday
as an afterthought. But that's probably
because children are self-centred.
Anyway, I love Christmas, and I do agree that
it's never considered a pagan holiday.
--
*~*~Emma~*~*http://www.christmas-time.com/ct-faith.htm
I don't understand why you believe a particular time is better to
celebrate Jesus. I don't think taking communion and reading scripture
on Christmas Eve is a form of pagan worship. Why try to ruin the
Christmas spirit like the rest of the world; rather, use it as an
excuse for worshipping your creator and sustainer. Also, this holiday
has been corrupted by humans not God.
.
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| User: "Emma" |
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| Title: Re: The Top 10 Reasons Why I Don't Celebrate Christmas |
12 Dec 2007 07:16:00 AM |
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In article <0c54f8b8-ff27-4cd5-8d19-1d83dead065e@b40g2000prf.googlegroups.com>,
christian.kauffman@musowls.org says...
On Dec 11, 5:42 am, Emma <e...@newsguy.com> wrote:
In article <13lrgjqc57dk...@corp.supernews.com>, Ylog says...
Christmas is a great victory of Christ over paganism.
Ask any person in the
world what Christmas is. They are not going to
say that its comercialism or
the name of th pagan god or anything else.
They are going to say the Birth
of Jesus Christ. Victory to Jesus!!!
I don't know where you live, but I think in
a lot of the UK at least, the first thing many
children say about Christmas is that it's
the time when Father Christmas brings them
toys. They generally mention Jesus' birthday
as an afterthought. But that's probably
because children are self-centred.
Anyway, I love Christmas, and I do agree that
it's never considered a pagan holiday.
I don't understand why you believe a particular
time is better to celebrate Jesus. I don't think
taking communion and reading scripture
on Christmas Eve is a form of pagan worship.
Why try to ruin the
Christmas spirit like the rest of the world; rather,
use it as an excuse for worshipping your creator and
sustainer. Also, this holiday
has been corrupted by humans not God.
I'm not what you're saying. I celebrate Christmas.
I love Christmas.
I think the accusations of paganism are a throwback
from the Puritans. Miserable lot. They didn't
know how to enjoy themselves. They banned everything.
--
*~*~Emma~*~*
http://www.christmas-time.com/ct-faith.htm
.
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| User: "Pastor Dave" |
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| Title: Re: The Top 10 Reasons Why I Don't Celebrate Christmas |
11 Dec 2007 05:31:03 AM |
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On Mon, 10 Dec 2007 16:49:23 -0600, "Ylog"
<jkmichael@peoplepc.com> said the following:
Christmas is a great victory of Christ over paganism.
No, it's Christians using pagan rituals.
Ask any person in the world what Christmas is.
And if they're either pagan, or an atheist,
or even agnostic, they will tell you that
they are laughing at you every year,
because they know what it really is
and they laugh at the ignorance of
Christians regarding this!
Why would you want to promote the idea
of alienating them from Christ, on the day
you wrongly claim is about Christ?
--
The Last Days were in the first century:
Speaking to His disciples that were standing
in front of Him, Jesus said...
Luke 21:20-22
20) And when YE shall see JERUSALEM compassed
with armies, then know that the desolation
THEREOF IS NIGH.
21) Then let them which are IN JUDEA flee to
the mountains; and let them which are in the
midst of it depart out; and let not them that
are in the countries enter thereinto.
22) For THESE be the days of vengeance, that
ALL THINGS WHICH ARE WRITTEN, MAY BE FULFILLED.
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| User: "null" |
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| Title: Re: Re: The Top 10 Reasons Why I Don't Celebrate Christmas |
10 Dec 2007 08:02:11 AM |
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On Wed, 05 Dec 2007 19:29:35 -0500, Pastor Dave
<ananias917_@_gmail.com> wrote:
9. CHRISTMAS OBSCURES GOD'S PLAN FOR MANKIND
Yes it does! Amen!
There is one important detail that you are forgetting though!
Maybe your expertise in religion is obscuring this for you....
Or maybe you have just never thought about it....
The Christmas season may be the ONLY time that someone ever even
HEARS the name of Jesus the Messiah or even thinks about Him at all.
It may be the ONLY time they see ANYTHING about the good news
of Messiah.
So you see, the Macy's parade and all the hoopla, might be of great
eternal value for those who have eyes to see it and ears to her.
.
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| User: "Pastor Dave" |
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| Title: Re: The Top 10 Reasons Why I Don't Celebrate Christmas |
11 Dec 2007 04:13:32 AM |
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On Mon, 10 Dec 2007 09:02:11 -0500, null <null@void.com>
said the following:
On Wed, 05 Dec 2007 19:29:35 -0500, Pastor Dave
<ananias917_@_gmail.com> wrote:
9. CHRISTMAS OBSCURES GOD'S PLAN FOR MANKIND
Yes it does! Amen!
There is one important detail that you are forgetting though!
Maybe your expertise in religion is obscuring this for you....
Or maybe you have just never thought about it....
The Christmas season may be the ONLY time that someone ever even
HEARS the name of Jesus the Messiah or even thinks about Him at all.
That isn't true. C'mon, dude! :)
No offense, but what you are doing here, is scrambling
for an excuse to celebrate it.
The fact is, that it is the time that atheists laugh at us,
because they know what it's really about. Now is that
our mission? To push atheists farther away from God,
with our lack of integrity when celebrating it? Or did
you "forget that one thing"? :)
--
The Last Days were in the first century:
Hebrews 1:1-2
1) God who at sundry times and in divers manners
spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
2) Hath *IN THESE LAST DAYS* spoken unto us by
His Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things,
by whom also he made the worlds;
.
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| User: "duke" |
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| Title: Re: The Top 10 Reasons Why I Don't Celebrate Christmas |
06 Dec 2007 05:07:41 PM |
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On Wed, 05 Dec 2007 19:29:35 -0500, Pastor Dave <ananias917_@_gmail.com> wrote:
The Top 10 Reasons Why I Don't Celebrate Christmas
1. CHRISTMAS IS DRIVEN BY COMMERCIALISM
Amen!
Not for Roman Catholics.
2. CHRISTMAS IS NOWHERE MENTIONED IN THE BIBLE
Amen!
And why should the bible mention celebrating the Lord's birthday?
3. JESUS WASN'T BORN ON OR NEAR DECEMBER 25TH
Amen!
Actually, he may have been. The winter solstice is the first day of the
lengthening of the daylight hours for crop growth. 12/25, or thereabouts, was
chosen to celebrate his birthday because he is the new light bringing us out the
darkness of sin.
4. THE CHRISTMAS HOLIDAY IS LARGELY A RECYCLED
PAGAN CELEBRATION.
Amen! And I have a chapter that I wrote in my book,
which I would be happy to send to you free of charge,
if you want it and give me your email address.
But learned others know better.
5. GOD CONDEMNS USING PAGAN CUSTOMS TO
WORHSIP HIM.
A-M-E-N !!!
You protest_ants may use pagan customs, but we Roman Christians take that day,
but not customs, which is pagan and turn it to the good of the Lord.
6. CHRISTMAS IS WORSHIPPING GOD IN VAIN.
Amen! See Matthew 15, please! :)
Ok, I saw, now what?
7.YOU CAN'T PUT CHRIST BACK IN SOMETHING HE
WAS NEVER IN.
Amen!
His tomb?
8. THE BIBLE NOWHERE TELLS US TO OBSERVE A
HOLIDAY CELBRATING JESUS CHRIST'S BIRTH--BUT IT
CLEARLY DOES TELL US TO COMMEMORATE HIS DEATH.
Amen!
Where does he tell us that?
9. CHRISTMAS OBSCURES GOD'S PLAN FOR MANKIND
Yes it does! Amen!
Where does it do that?
10. I'D RATHER CELEBRATE THE HOLY DAYS
JESUS CHRIST AND THE APOSTLES OBSERVED.
Unnecessary, since they were only until the Mosaic Age
had ended, but no harm in it either. :)
But they were ONLY the Jewish holidays.
Great post!!! :)
So now we know what you are - Jewish.
duke, American-American
*****
"The Mass is the most perfect form of Prayer."
Pope Paul VI
*****
.
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| User: "null" |
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| Title: Re: Re: The Top 10 Reasons Why I Don't Celebrate Christmas |
10 Dec 2007 08:03:38 AM |
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On Thu, 06 Dec 2007 17:07:41 -0600, duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> wrote:
7.YOU CAN'T PUT CHRIST BACK IN SOMETHING HE
WAS NEVER IN.
Amen!
His tomb?
Just curious. Where does it say that they took Him out and put
Him back in?
Not being a smart arse.... I really want to know!
.
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| User: "duke" |
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| Title: Re: The Top 10 Reasons Why I Don't Celebrate Christmas |
10 Dec 2007 11:24:12 AM |
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On Mon, 10 Dec 2007 09:03:38 -0500, null <null@void.com> wrote:
On Thu, 06 Dec 2007 17:07:41 -0600, duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> wrote:
7.YOU CAN'T PUT CHRIST BACK IN SOMETHING HE
WAS NEVER IN.
Amen!
His tomb?
Just curious. Where does it say that they took Him out and put
Him back in?
Not being a smart arse.... I really want to know!
Jesus was raised from the dead by the power of God. He then walked the earth
for the next 40 days with 500+ of his disciples before ascending to the Father
in heaven.
duke, American-American
*****
"The Mass is the most perfect form of Prayer."
Pope Paul VI
*****
.
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| User: "Bill M" |
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| Title: Re: The Top 10 Reasons Why I Don't Celebrate Christmas |
07 Dec 2007 02:28:48 PM |
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Your imagination can create any mental myth you wish!
"duke" <duckgumbo32@cox.net> wrote in message
news:i50hl3ti89cfevf1p3qd53tqsi4o56knos@4ax.com...
On Wed, 05 Dec 2007 19:29:35 -0500, Pastor Dave <ananias917_@_gmail.com>
wrote:
The Top 10 Reasons Why I Don't Celebrate Christmas
1. CHRISTMAS IS DRIVEN BY COMMERCIALISM
Amen!
Not for Roman Catholics.
2. CHRISTMAS IS NOWHERE MENTIONED IN THE BIBLE
Amen!
And why should the bible mention celebrating the Lord's birthday?
3. JESUS WASN'T BORN ON OR NEAR DECEMBER 25TH
Amen!
Actually, he may have been. The winter solstice is the first day of the
lengthening of the daylight hours for crop growth. 12/25, or thereabouts,
was
chosen to celebrate his birthday because he is the new light bringing us
out the
darkness of sin.
4. THE CHRISTMAS HOLIDAY IS LARGELY A RECYCLED
PAGAN CELEBRATION.
Amen! And I have a chapter that I wrote in my book,
which I would be happy to send to you free of charge,
if you want it and give me your email address.
But learned others know better.
5. GOD CONDEMNS USING PAGAN CUSTOMS TO
WORHSIP HIM.
A-M-E-N !!!
You protest_ants may use pagan customs, but we Roman Christians take that
day,
but not customs, which is pagan and turn it to the good of the Lord.
6. CHRISTMAS IS WORSHIPPING GOD IN VAIN.
Amen! See Matthew 15, please! :)
Ok, I saw, now what?
7.YOU CAN'T PUT CHRIST BACK IN SOMETHING HE
WAS NEVER IN.
Amen!
His tomb?
8. THE BIBLE NOWHERE TELLS US TO OBSERVE A
HOLIDAY CELBRATING JESUS CHRIST'S BIRTH--BUT IT
CLEARLY DOES TELL US TO COMMEMORATE HIS DEATH.
Amen!
Where does he tell us that?
9. CHRISTMAS OBSCURES GOD'S PLAN FOR MANKIND
Yes it does! Amen!
Where does it do that?
10. I'D RATHER CELEBRATE THE HOLY DAYS
JESUS CHRIST AND THE APOSTLES OBSERVED.
Unnecessary, since they were only until the Mosaic Age
had ended, but no harm in it either. :)
But they were ONLY the Jewish holidays.
Great post!!! :)
So now we know what you are - Jewish.
duke, American-American
*****
"The Mass is the most perfect form of Prayer."
Pope Paul VI
*****
.
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| User: "duke" |
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| Title: Re: The Top 10 Reasons Why I Don't Celebrate Christmas |
10 Dec 2007 11:22:00 AM |
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On Fri, 7 Dec 2007 20:28:48 -0000, "Bill M" <wmech@bellsouth.net> wrote:
Your imagination can create any mental myth you wish!
Your's does just that.
"duke" <duckgumbo32@cox.net> wrote in message
news:i50hl3ti89cfevf1p3qd53tqsi4o56knos@4ax.com...
On Wed, 05 Dec 2007 19:29:35 -0500, Pastor Dave <ananias917_@_gmail.com>
wrote:
The Top 10 Reasons Why I Don't Celebrate Christmas
1. CHRISTMAS IS DRIVEN BY COMMERCIALISM
Amen!
Not for Roman Catholics.
2. CHRISTMAS IS NOWHERE MENTIONED IN THE BIBLE
Amen!
And why should the bible mention celebrating the Lord's birthday?
3. JESUS WASN'T BORN ON OR NEAR DECEMBER 25TH
Amen!
Actually, he may have been. The winter solstice is the first day of the
lengthening of the daylight hours for crop growth. 12/25, or thereabouts,
was
chosen to celebrate his birthday because he is the new light bringing us
out the
darkness of sin.
4. THE CHRISTMAS HOLIDAY IS LARGELY A RECYCLED
PAGAN CELEBRATION.
Amen! And I have a chapter that I wrote in my book,
which I would be happy to send to you free of charge,
if you want it and give me your email address.
But learned others know better.
5. GOD CONDEMNS USING PAGAN CUSTOMS TO
WORHSIP HIM.
A-M-E-N !!!
You protest_ants may use pagan customs, but we Roman Christians take that
day,
but not customs, which is pagan and turn it to the good of the Lord.
6. CHRISTMAS IS WORSHIPPING GOD IN VAIN.
Amen! See Matthew 15, please! :)
Ok, I saw, now what?
7.YOU CAN'T PUT CHRIST BACK IN SOMETHING HE
WAS NEVER IN.
Amen!
His tomb?
8. THE BIBLE NOWHERE TELLS US TO OBSERVE A
HOLIDAY CELBRATING JESUS CHRIST'S BIRTH--BUT IT
CLEARLY DOES TELL US TO COMMEMORATE HIS DEATH.
Amen!
Where does he tell us that?
9. CHRISTMAS OBSCURES GOD'S PLAN FOR MANKIND
Yes it does! Amen!
Where does it do that?
10. I'D RATHER CELEBRATE THE HOLY DAYS
JESUS CHRIST AND THE APOSTLES OBSERVED.
Unnecessary, since they were only until the Mosaic Age
had ended, but no harm in it either. :)
But they were ONLY the Jewish holidays.
Great post!!! :)
So now we know what you are - Jewish.
duke, American-American
*****
"The Mass is the most perfect form of Prayer."
Pope Paul VI
*****
duke, American-American
*****
"The Mass is the most perfect form of Prayer."
Pope Paul VI
*****
.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: The Top 10 Reasons Why I Don't Celebrate Christmas |
06 Dec 2007 05:31:09 PM |
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haha
"The Mass is the most perfect form of Prayer."
Pope Paul VI
*****
"What is my state of mind? Am I Hamlet? Or Don Quixote?"
Pope Paul VI
.
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| User: "duke" |
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| Title: Re: The Top 10 Reasons Why I Don't Celebrate Christmas |
07 Dec 2007 01:13:18 PM |
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On Thu, 6 Dec 2007 15:31:09 -0800 (PST), "natezenmaster@gmail.com"
<natezenmaster@gmail.com> wrote:
haha
"The Mass is the most perfect form of Prayer."
Pope Paul VI
*****
"What is my state of mind? Am I Hamlet? Or Don Quixote?"
Pope Paul VI
Are you as screwed up as pd?
duke, American-American
*****
"The Mass is the most perfect form of Prayer."
Pope Paul VI
*****
.
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