| Topic: |
Religions > Bible |
| User: |
"Pastor Joey Faust" |
| Date: |
26 Nov 2004 08:18:50 PM |
| Object: |
The Myth about "born gay" |
If people are born "gay," with no ability to refrain from acting upon
sexual desires for the same sex, this would mean that the Bible is not
inspired by God! Under the Old Testament, homosexuals were punished by
God in the same manner, in the same class, as people who had sex with
animals:
Leviticus 18:22 Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it
is abomination.
23 Neither shalt thou lie with any beast to defile thyself therewith:
neither shall any woman stand before a beast to lie down thereto: it is
confusion.
24 Defile not ye yourselves in any of these things: for in all these the
nations are defiled which I cast out before you:
25 And the land is defiled: therefore I do visit the iniquity thereof
upon it, and the land itself vomiteth out her inhabitants.
29 For whosoever shall commit any of these abominations, even the souls
that commit them shall be cut off from among their people.
Yet, we know that the Bible IS inspired by God. If God calls a
particular action a sin, and punishes people for that action, it
therefore follows that such people are culpable. And any argument which
tries to justify homosexuality by saying that "it is in the genes,"
would also justify bestiality, pedophilia, and many other abominations!
As society continues to degenerate (many call it "progress"!), the same
argument will increasingly be made for bestiality and pedophilia: "They
can't help themselves. They were born this way." This argument is
already bein used. We can begin to see the sun setting on the horizon:
"American Psychiatric Association Now Wants To Normalize Pedophilia San
Francis - Confirming LifeSite's previous warning about serious on-going
efforts to legitimize adult-child sex, the American Psychiatric
Association (APA) recently sponsored a symposium in which participants
discussed the removal of pedophilia from the psychiatric manual of
mental disorders. Cybercast news Service reports today that
Psychiatrists at the May 19 conference in San Francisco proposed
removing several long-recognized categories of mental illness -
including pedophilia, exhibitionism, fetishism, transvestism, voyeurism
and sadomasochism - from the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental
Disorders (DSM). 'Normalizing' pedophilia would have enormous
implications, especially since civil laws closely follow the scientific
community on social-moral matters, said Linda Ames Nicolosi, NARTH
publications director. 'If pedophilia is deemed normal by psychiatrists,
then how can it remain illegal?' Nicolosi asked. 'It will be a tough
fight to prove in the courts that it should still be against the law.'
Another logical question is how this development would also affect the
battle against currently growing volumes of child porn?" (June 10, 2003,
LifeSiteNews.com)
When is enough, ENOUGH? When will more Christians awake and say it is
past time to take a stand. The "I was born this way" argument is morally
and rationally flawed! It would justify ANY crime, sin or action.
In fact, if we will use such arguments (blaming everything on DNA), then
it follows that all the people that consider bestiality, pedophilia, and
sodomy (i.e. homosexuality) DISGUSTING should not be ridiculed or
scorned! There is much more evidence that people are NATURALLY BORN with
consciences that HATE the above three sins, than there is evidence that
many are born "gay"! Notice the following words from the Holy Bible:
Romans 1:26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for
even their women did change the NATURAL use into that which is AGAINST
NATURE:
27 And likewise also the men, leaving the NATURAL use of the woman,
burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which
is UNSEEMLY, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error
which was meet.
28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God
gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not
convenient;
31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, WITHOUT NATURAL AFFECTION,
implacable, unmerciful:
32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things
are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them
that do them.
According to God, homosexuality is UNNATURAL. Therefore, it is NORMAL
for people to be DISGUSTED at such sins in their consciences.
In conclusion, those who say that homosexuals are "born this way," and
that therefore they should be allowed to flaunt their lifestyle in the
face of children (without protest), will usually be quick to deny the
same right to those who practice bestiality and pedophilia. Furthermore,
they will deny the same liberty to those who are born with a natural
desire to PROTEST such abominations.
The truth of the matter is that moral culpability is not based on genes
or physical chemistry. Morality often involves RESISTING desires
(lusts). The man who "desires" sex with another man's wife is called by
God to RESIST such desires, and refrain from everything which makes
provision for acting upon them (Proverbs 7:6-8, 19). People who desire
to physically strike people who disagree with them, are called to resist
such desires. Any desire, passion, lust, or feeling which is against
God's moral law (written in man's conscience, and in Scripture) should
be resisted. Any desire for such sins as adultery, bestiality,
pedophilia, or sodomy should be resisted (regardless of why it is
present). "I felt like it," is not a legitimate, moral defense in God's
court of law for any sin. But if it will continue to be used, then we
must simply reply with the same rationalization. If some people are born
to have sexual relations with the same sex, simply because they
"desire" it, then others are also born to find such actions disgusting!
Such disgust in not only in our natural consciences, it is in the
"spiritual genes" of our new birth (John 3:7):
2 Corinthians 5:17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new
creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.
Obedient Christians are moved by a great, compelling affection to warn
homosexuals about God's judgment, and protect the young minds of
children from their sodomite propaganda:
Colossians 3:2 Set your affection on things above, not on things on the
earth.
Ephesians 4:23 And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;
Proverbs 28:4 They that forsake the law praise the wicked: but such as
keep the law contend with them.
Visit my website
www.kingdombaptist.org
.
|
|
| User: "Pastor Dave" |
|
| Title: Re: The Myth about "born gay" |
30 Nov 2004 06:50:45 PM |
|
|
On Tue, 30 Nov 2004 21:47:41 GMT, while scaling the Mt.
Everest, Bill Baker <wbaker@postini.spamcon.org>
pontificated:
On Tue, 30 Nov 2004 16:20:03 +0000, Pastor Dave
<pastordave38@nospam-yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:<ib7pq099f70n9i11s7pl6al8m79ctbhbs5@4ax.com>:
On Tue, 30 Nov 2004 13:04:56 GMT, while scaling the Mt. Everest, Bill
Baker <wbaker@postini.spamcon.org> pontificated:
So tell it to us in simple English. How can the
whole human race come from Adam and Even without some incest going on?
I already did that. There was no such thing as incest at that point
in time.
Of course there was. Just because there was no law against it didn't
mean that there was no such thing.
So then when someone says abortion is murder, why do you argue that
abortion is not murder, because there is no law that says it is murder?
Because by definition murder is the UNLAWFUL killing of a PERSON.
Abortion is not unlawful, and a fetus/embryo/zygote is not a person.
And by definition, incest is unlawful sex between close
family members. Definition #2 would apply here...
1) Sexual relations between persons who are so closely
related that their marriage is illegal or forbidden by
custom.
2) The statutory crime of sexual relations with such a
near relative.
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=incest
Therefore, you still have not answered the question
satisfactorily.
--
Pastor Dave Raymond
"I have more understanding than all my teachers:
for thy testimonies are my meditation." - Psalm 119:99
/
o{}xxxxx[]::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::>
\
"And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of
the Spirit, which is the word of God:" - Ephesians 6:17
.
|
|
|
| User: "Bill Baker" |
|
| Title: Re: The Myth about "born gay" |
30 Nov 2004 07:30:46 PM |
|
|
On Wed, 01 Dec 2004 00:50:45 +0000, Pastor Dave
<pastordave38@nospam-yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:<565qq0pk10tc7tlgabm4fg5d8d9ra63j90@4ax.com>:
On Tue, 30 Nov 2004 21:47:41 GMT, while scaling the Mt. Everest, Bill
Baker <wbaker@postini.spamcon.org> pontificated:
On Tue, 30 Nov 2004 16:20:03 +0000, Pastor Dave
<pastordave38@nospam-yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:<ib7pq099f70n9i11s7pl6al8m79ctbhbs5@4ax.com>:
On Tue, 30 Nov 2004 13:04:56 GMT, while scaling the Mt. Everest, Bill
Baker <wbaker@postini.spamcon.org> pontificated:
So tell it to us in simple English. How can the
whole human race come from Adam and Even without some incest going
on?
I already did that. There was no such thing as incest at that point
in time.
Of course there was. Just because there was no law against it didn't
mean that there was no such thing.
So then when someone says abortion is murder, why do you argue that
abortion is not murder, because there is no law that says it is
murder?
Because by definition murder is the UNLAWFUL killing of a PERSON.
Abortion is not unlawful, and a fetus/embryo/zygote is not a person.
And by definition, incest is unlawful sex between close family members.
Definition #2 would apply here...
1) Sexual relations between persons who are so closely related that
their marriage is illegal or forbidden by custom.
2) The statutory crime of sexual relations with such a near relative.
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=incest
Therefore, you still have not answered the question satisfactorily.
If ANY definition of the word incest existed, then incest existed. QED.
--
Lurlean Lie #6:
I am just posting stuff he claimed himself.
news:7908c278.0310191750.679ca7da@posting.google.com
.
|
|
|
| User: "Pastor Dave" |
|
| Title: Re: The Myth about "born gay" |
01 Dec 2004 08:19:59 AM |
|
|
On Wed, 01 Dec 2004 01:30:46 GMT, while scaling the Mt.
Everest, Bill Baker <wbaker@postini.spamcon.org>
pontificated:
On Wed, 01 Dec 2004 00:50:45 +0000, Pastor Dave
<pastordave38@nospam-yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:<565qq0pk10tc7tlgabm4fg5d8d9ra63j90@4ax.com>:
On Tue, 30 Nov 2004 21:47:41 GMT, while scaling the Mt. Everest, Bill
Baker <wbaker@postini.spamcon.org> pontificated:
On Tue, 30 Nov 2004 16:20:03 +0000, Pastor Dave
<pastordave38@nospam-yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:<ib7pq099f70n9i11s7pl6al8m79ctbhbs5@4ax.com>:
On Tue, 30 Nov 2004 13:04:56 GMT, while scaling the Mt. Everest, Bill
Baker <wbaker@postini.spamcon.org> pontificated:
So tell it to us in simple English. How can the
whole human race come from Adam and Even without some incest going
on?
I already did that. There was no such thing as incest at that point
in time.
Of course there was. Just because there was no law against it didn't
mean that there was no such thing.
So then when someone says abortion is murder, why do you argue that
abortion is not murder, because there is no law that says it is
murder?
Because by definition murder is the UNLAWFUL killing of a PERSON.
Abortion is not unlawful, and a fetus/embryo/zygote is not a person.
And by definition, incest is unlawful sex between close family members.
Definition #2 would apply here...
1) Sexual relations between persons who are so closely related that
their marriage is illegal or forbidden by custom.
2) The statutory crime of sexual relations with such a near relative.
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=incest
Therefore, you still have not answered the question satisfactorily.
If ANY definition of the word incest existed, then incest existed. QED.
Both speak of the law, so again, you still have not
answered the question satisfactorily.
--
Pastor Dave Raymond
"I have more understanding than all my teachers:
for thy testimonies are my meditation." - Psalm 119:99
/
o{}xxxxx[]::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::>
\
"And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of
the Spirit, which is the word of God:" - Ephesians 6:17
.
|
|
|
| User: "Bill Baker" |
|
| Title: Re: The Myth about "born gay" |
01 Dec 2004 10:56:37 AM |
|
|
On Wed, 01 Dec 2004 14:19:59 +0000, Pastor Dave
<pastordave38@nospam-yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:<mnkrq0h75qcvr6o57oudtc1utp4ti3sout@4ax.com>:
On Wed, 01 Dec 2004 01:30:46 GMT, while scaling the Mt. Everest, Bill
Baker <wbaker@postini.spamcon.org> pontificated:
On Wed, 01 Dec 2004 00:50:45 +0000, Pastor Dave
<pastordave38@nospam-yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:<565qq0pk10tc7tlgabm4fg5d8d9ra63j90@4ax.com>:
On Tue, 30 Nov 2004 21:47:41 GMT, while scaling the Mt. Everest, Bill
Baker <wbaker@postini.spamcon.org> pontificated:
On Tue, 30 Nov 2004 16:20:03 +0000, Pastor Dave
<pastordave38@nospam-yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:<ib7pq099f70n9i11s7pl6al8m79ctbhbs5@4ax.com>:
On Tue, 30 Nov 2004 13:04:56 GMT, while scaling the Mt. Everest,
Bill Baker <wbaker@postini.spamcon.org> pontificated:
So tell it to us in simple English. How can the
whole human race come from Adam and Even without some incest going
on?
I already did that. There was no such thing as incest at that
point in time.
Of course there was. Just because there was no law against it
didn't mean that there was no such thing.
So then when someone says abortion is murder, why do you argue that
abortion is not murder, because there is no law that says it is
murder?
Because by definition murder is the UNLAWFUL killing of a PERSON.
Abortion is not unlawful, and a fetus/embryo/zygote is not a person.
And by definition, incest is unlawful sex between close family
members. Definition #2 would apply here...
1) Sexual relations between persons who are so closely related that
their marriage is illegal or forbidden by custom.
2) The statutory crime of sexual relations with such a near relative.
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=incest
Therefore, you still have not answered the question satisfactorily.
If ANY definition of the word incest existed, then incest existed. QED.
Both speak of the law, so again, you still have not answered the
question satisfactorily.
It says "illegal OR forbidden by custom." But let's just say for a second
that you're right. Why did God punish Cain for killing Abel when God
hadn't yet given any laws forbidding it? After all, Cain couldn't have
committed murder since there were no laws against it.
--
Lurlean Lie #6:
I am just posting stuff he claimed himself.
news:7908c278.0310191750.679ca7da@posting.google.com
.
|
|
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| User: "David Perkins" |
|
| Title: Re: The Myth about "born gay" |
01 Dec 2004 02:31:50 PM |
|
|
Why did God punish Cain for killing Abel when God
hadn't yet given any laws forbidding it? After all, Cain couldn't have
committed murder since there were no laws against it.
I want to take a stab at this. First, though, remember, if you look for
rationality in God, particularly in Genesis, you're gonna get a very big
headache. I'm not being light headed or silly. It's just not going to be
logical or rational. It's religion. It's supposed to be a mystery for
goodness sakes. If you figure it out using logic and science, it wouldn't
be much of a religion, now would it? You know, it's a trick question to be
a Christian. For a smart, educated, thinking person to believe a baby was
born to a virgin, and he was God in the flesh or that he died a public
execution style death witnessed by many and still came back to life 3 days
later and rose into Heaven after that and his body has never been
found...that takes a real suspension of logic to believe that. It's not
easy to be a Christian! So, why do I do it? Well, you'll just have to go
to church and find out for yourself!
Now, to answer your question. God never said Cain "murdered" Abel. In Gen
4.8 it says he "slew" him. In 4:10 God ASKS "What hast thou done?" AND
this was AA (after the apple...which revealed sin to humans) and even AE
(after Eden.) And where did all of these people come from afterwards?
Like I say, God mysteriously provides. There actually was no law until
Moses. There was a covenant with Noah. But God certainly did punish Cain.
In fact, Cain says it is too much for him 4:13.
Love
David
.
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| User: "Andrealphus" |
|
| Title: Re: The Myth about "born gay" |
01 Dec 2004 04:18:33 PM |
|
|
David Perkins <perkins1b@charter.net> wrote:
Why did God punish Cain for killing Abel when God
hadn't yet given any laws forbidding it? After all, Cain couldn't
have committed murder since there were no laws against it.
I want to take a stab at this. First, though, remember, if you look
for rationality in God, particularly in Genesis, you're gonna get a
very big headache. I'm not being light headed or silly. It's just
not going to be logical or rational. It's religion. It's supposed
to be a mystery for goodness sakes.
Religion is supposed to be a mystery? I suppose the mystery is why religion
is supposed to be a mystery? ANSWER: It helps consolodate and maintain
power in the hands of the priesthood if the masses are not privey to the
"Mystery" of it all.
If you figure it out using logic
and science, it wouldn't be much of a religion, now would it?
It't not much of a religion anyway....
You
know, it's a trick question to be a Christian. For a smart,
educated, thinking person to believe a baby was born to a virgin, and
he was God in the flesh or that he died a public execution style
death witnessed by many and still came back to life 3 days later and
rose into Heaven after that and his body has never been found...that
takes a real suspension of logic to believe that. It's not easy to
be a Christian! So, why do I do it? Well, you'll just have to go to
church and find out for yourself!
Been there, done that, got the t-shirt.
Now, to answer your question. God never said Cain "murdered" Abel.
In Gen
4.8 it says he "slew" him.
Well, I'm sure the distinction there is a real comfort the Abel.
In 4:10 God ASKS "What hast thou done?"
AND this was AA (after the apple...which revealed sin to humans) and
even AE (after Eden.) And where did all of these people come from
afterwards? Like I say, God mysteriously provides. There actually
was no law until Moses. There was a covenant with Noah. But God
certainly did punish Cain. In fact, Cain says it is too much for him
4:13.
Love
David
Yep, a suspension of logic, common sense, and sanity when you get right down
to it.
--
Why is it that the people that complain the most about Jewish Lawyers
are the very same people that want to force you to follow laws set down
by Jewish Lawyers 3,500 years ago?
Jim Doemer 2004.
.
|
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| User: "David Perkins" |
|
| Title: Re: The Myth about "born gay" |
01 Dec 2004 08:54:15 PM |
|
|
Sorry you feel that way. Have a good afterlife!
Love
David
"Andrealphus" <OHNOLETSGO@NARNIA.WHOCARES> wrote in message
news:Zqrrd.5185$u81.1228@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net...
David Perkins <perkins1b@charter.net> wrote:
Why did God punish Cain for killing Abel when God
hadn't yet given any laws forbidding it? After all, Cain couldn't
have committed murder since there were no laws against it.
I want to take a stab at this. First, though, remember, if you look
for rationality in God, particularly in Genesis, you're gonna get a
very big headache. I'm not being light headed or silly. It's just
not going to be logical or rational. It's religion. It's supposed
to be a mystery for goodness sakes.
Religion is supposed to be a mystery? I suppose the mystery is why
religion
is supposed to be a mystery? ANSWER: It helps consolodate and maintain
power in the hands of the priesthood if the masses are not privey to the
"Mystery" of it all.
If you figure it out using logic
and science, it wouldn't be much of a religion, now would it?
It't not much of a religion anyway....
You
know, it's a trick question to be a Christian. For a smart,
educated, thinking person to believe a baby was born to a virgin, and
he was God in the flesh or that he died a public execution style
death witnessed by many and still came back to life 3 days later and
rose into Heaven after that and his body has never been found...that
takes a real suspension of logic to believe that. It's not easy to
be a Christian! So, why do I do it? Well, you'll just have to go to
church and find out for yourself!
Been there, done that, got the t-shirt.
Now, to answer your question. God never said Cain "murdered" Abel.
In Gen
4.8 it says he "slew" him.
Well, I'm sure the distinction there is a real comfort the Abel.
In 4:10 God ASKS "What hast thou done?"
AND this was AA (after the apple...which revealed sin to humans) and
even AE (after Eden.) And where did all of these people come from
afterwards? Like I say, God mysteriously provides. There actually
was no law until Moses. There was a covenant with Noah. But God
certainly did punish Cain. In fact, Cain says it is too much for him
4:13.
Love
David
Yep, a suspension of logic, common sense, and sanity when you get right
down
to it.
--
Why is it that the people that complain the most about Jewish Lawyers
are the very same people that want to force you to follow laws set down
by Jewish Lawyers 3,500 years ago?
Jim Doemer 2004.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Andrealphus" |
|
| Title: Re: The Myth about "born gay" |
01 Dec 2004 09:08:07 PM |
|
|
I hope you can bear the disappointment.
David Perkins <perkins1b@charter.net> wrote:
Sorry you feel that way. Have a good afterlife!
Love
David
"Andrealphus" <OHNOLETSGO@NARNIA.WHOCARES> wrote in message
news:Zqrrd.5185$u81.1228@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net...
David Perkins <perkins1b@charter.net> wrote:
Why did God punish Cain for killing Abel when God
hadn't yet given any laws forbidding it? After all, Cain couldn't
have committed murder since there were no laws against it.
I want to take a stab at this. First, though, remember, if you look
for rationality in God, particularly in Genesis, you're gonna get a
very big headache. I'm not being light headed or silly. It's just
not going to be logical or rational. It's religion. It's supposed
to be a mystery for goodness sakes.
Religion is supposed to be a mystery? I suppose the mystery is why
religion is supposed to be a mystery? ANSWER: It helps consolodate
and maintain power in the hands of the priesthood if the masses are
not privey to the "Mystery" of it all.
If you figure it out using logic
and science, it wouldn't be much of a religion, now would it?
It't not much of a religion anyway....
You
know, it's a trick question to be a Christian. For a smart,
educated, thinking person to believe a baby was born to a virgin,
and he was God in the flesh or that he died a public execution style
death witnessed by many and still came back to life 3 days later and
rose into Heaven after that and his body has never been found...that
takes a real suspension of logic to believe that. It's not easy to
be a Christian! So, why do I do it? Well, you'll just have to go
to church and find out for yourself!
Been there, done that, got the t-shirt.
Now, to answer your question. God never said Cain "murdered" Abel.
In Gen
4.8 it says he "slew" him.
Well, I'm sure the distinction there is a real comfort the Abel.
In 4:10 God ASKS "What hast thou done?"
AND this was AA (after the apple...which revealed sin to humans) and
even AE (after Eden.) And where did all of these people come from
afterwards? Like I say, God mysteriously provides. There actually
was no law until Moses. There was a covenant with Noah. But God
certainly did punish Cain. In fact, Cain says it is too much for him
4:13.
Love
David
Yep, a suspension of logic, common sense, and sanity when you get
right down to it.
--
Why is it that the people that complain the most about Jewish Lawyers
are the very same people that want to force you to follow laws set
down by Jewish Lawyers 3,500 years ago?
Jim Doemer 2004.
--
Why is it that the people that complain the most about Jewish Lawyers
are the very same people that want to force you to follow laws set down
by Jewish Lawyers 3,500 years ago?
Jim Doemer 2004.
.
|
|
|
| User: "David Perkins" |
|
| Title: Re: The Myth about "born gay" |
01 Dec 2004 09:21:21 PM |
|
|
"Andrealphus" <OHNOLETSGO@NARNIA.WHOCARES> wrote in message
news:rGvrd.9874$NU3.7818@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
I hope you can bear the disappointment.
Just leaves more room at the breakfast table in Heaven.
David Perkins <perkins1b@charter.net> wrote:
Sorry you feel that way. Have a good afterlife!
Love
David
"Andrealphus" <OHNOLETSGO@NARNIA.WHOCARES> wrote in message
news:Zqrrd.5185$u81.1228@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net...
David Perkins <perkins1b@charter.net> wrote:
Why did God punish Cain for killing Abel when God
hadn't yet given any laws forbidding it? After all, Cain couldn't
have committed murder since there were no laws against it.
I want to take a stab at this. First, though, remember, if you look
for rationality in God, particularly in Genesis, you're gonna get a
very big headache. I'm not being light headed or silly. It's just
not going to be logical or rational. It's religion. It's supposed
to be a mystery for goodness sakes.
Religion is supposed to be a mystery? I suppose the mystery is why
religion is supposed to be a mystery? ANSWER: It helps consolodate
and maintain power in the hands of the priesthood if the masses are
not privey to the "Mystery" of it all.
If you figure it out using logic
and science, it wouldn't be much of a religion, now would it?
It't not much of a religion anyway....
You
know, it's a trick question to be a Christian. For a smart,
educated, thinking person to believe a baby was born to a virgin,
and he was God in the flesh or that he died a public execution style
death witnessed by many and still came back to life 3 days later and
rose into Heaven after that and his body has never been found...that
takes a real suspension of logic to believe that. It's not easy to
be a Christian! So, why do I do it? Well, you'll just have to go
to church and find out for yourself!
Been there, done that, got the t-shirt.
Now, to answer your question. God never said Cain "murdered" Abel.
In Gen
4.8 it says he "slew" him.
Well, I'm sure the distinction there is a real comfort the Abel.
In 4:10 God ASKS "What hast thou done?"
AND this was AA (after the apple...which revealed sin to humans) and
even AE (after Eden.) And where did all of these people come from
afterwards? Like I say, God mysteriously provides. There actually
was no law until Moses. There was a covenant with Noah. But God
certainly did punish Cain. In fact, Cain says it is too much for him
4:13.
Love
David
Yep, a suspension of logic, common sense, and sanity when you get
right down to it.
--
Why is it that the people that complain the most about Jewish Lawyers
are the very same people that want to force you to follow laws set
down by Jewish Lawyers 3,500 years ago?
Jim Doemer 2004.
--
Why is it that the people that complain the most about Jewish Lawyers
are the very same people that want to force you to follow laws set down
by Jewish Lawyers 3,500 years ago?
Jim Doemer 2004.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Andrealphus" |
|
| Title: Re: The Myth about "born gay" |
01 Dec 2004 09:29:17 PM |
|
|
David Perkins <perkins1b@charter.net> wrote:
"Andrealphus" <OHNOLETSGO@NARNIA.WHOCARES> wrote in message
news:rGvrd.9874$NU3.7818@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
I hope you can bear the disappointment.
Just leaves more room at the breakfast table in Heaven.
Assuming such a place exists. Of course, one would wonder why a
disembodied soul would still have the human weakness of needing to eat a
meal, or why time would still be broken up in morning, noon, and night to
require morning meal. I don't suppose you have the answers to these
questions either, do you?
--
Why is it that the people that complain the most about Jewish Lawyers
are the very same people that want to force you to follow laws set down
by Jewish Lawyers 3,500 years ago?
Jim Doemer 2004.
.
|
|
|
| User: "David Perkins" |
|
| Title: Re: The Myth about "born gay" |
01 Dec 2004 09:47:59 PM |
|
|
"Andrealphus" <OHNOLETSGO@NARNIA.WHOCARES> wrote in message
news:h_vrd.9887$NU3.4152@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
David Perkins <perkins1b@charter.net> wrote:
"Andrealphus" <OHNOLETSGO@NARNIA.WHOCARES> wrote in message
news:rGvrd.9874$NU3.7818@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
I hope you can bear the disappointment.
Just leaves more room at the breakfast table in Heaven.
Assuming such a place exists. Of course, one would wonder why a
disembodied soul would still have the human weakness of needing to eat a
meal, or why time would still be broken up in morning, noon, and night to
require morning meal. I don't suppose you have the answers to these
questions either, do you?
Oh, this is easy to answer. I intend to take this body with me to Heaven
since God has been good to me and gave me such a gorgeous one. And I've
always been told that breakfast is the most important meal of the day so I'm
looking forward to Wheaties in Heaven. The milk "up there" ought to be
pure, pure, pure. Now, I'm also going to take my Timex watch since it has
no earthly value for anyone else. And, too, since I've been promised
eternity, how can I know it's eternity unless I have a watch to see? See?
--
Why is it that the people that complain the most about Jewish Lawyers
are the very same people that want to force you to follow laws set down
by Jewish Lawyers 3,500 years ago?
Jim Doemer 2004.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Glenn \Christian Mystic" |
|
| Title: Re: The Myth about "born gay" |
05 Aug 2005 09:33:31 PM |
|
|
"David Perkins" <perkins1b@charter.net> wrote in message
news:Hlwrd.408$3D3.173@fe06.lga...
"Andrealphus" <OHNOLETSGO@NARNIA.WHOCARES> wrote in message
news:h_vrd.9887$NU3.4152@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
David Perkins <perkins1b@charter.net> wrote:
"Andrealphus" <OHNOLETSGO@NARNIA.WHOCARES> wrote in message
news:rGvrd.9874$NU3.7818@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
I hope you can bear the disappointment.
Just leaves more room at the breakfast table in Heaven.
Assuming such a place exists. Of course, one would wonder why a
disembodied soul would still have the human weakness of needing to eat a
meal, or why time would still be broken up in morning, noon, and night to
require morning meal. I don't suppose you have the answers to these
questions either, do you?
Oh, this is easy to answer. I intend to take this body with me to Heaven
since God has been good to me and gave me such a gorgeous one. And I've
always been told that breakfast is the most important meal of the day so
I'm
looking forward to Wheaties in Heaven. The milk "up there" ought to be
pure, pure, pure. Now, I'm also going to take my Timex watch since it has
no earthly value for anyone else. And, too, since I've been promised
eternity, how can I know it's eternity unless I have a watch to see? See?
LOL
Jesus does talk about a feast in heaven, I know my wife is enjoying hers,
she just died, on the 30th of July, 2005. She had been, for the last three
years on a VERY restricted diet due to suffering kidney failure, she is now
enjoying those foods long denied her, more than this she is eating of the
Tree of Life, and drinking of the Living Water, in this I have peace of mind
:-). BTW she prefered rice, and milkfish for breakfast, being Filipina...
--
Why is it that the people that complain the most about Jewish Lawyers
are the very same people that want to force you to follow laws set down
by Jewish Lawyers 3,500 years ago?
Jim Doemer 2004.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Jenn" |
|
| Title: Re: The Myth about "born gay" |
06 Aug 2005 02:40:30 AM |
|
|
In article <11f87p66jf33b9f@corp.supernews.com>,
"Glenn \(Christian Mystic\)" <christianmystic@ev1.net> wrote:
Jesus does talk about a feast in heaven, I know my wife is enjoying hers,
she just died, on the 30th of July, 2005. She had been, for the last three
years on a VERY restricted diet due to suffering kidney failure, she is now
enjoying those foods long denied her, more than this she is eating of the
Tree of Life, and drinking of the Living Water, in this I have peace of mind
:-). BTW she prefered rice, and milkfish for breakfast, being Filipina...
I'm very sorry for your loss. Take care.
.
|
|
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|
|
| User: "Andrealphus" |
|
| Title: Re: The Myth about "born gay" |
02 Dec 2004 04:45:15 AM |
|
|
David Perkins <perkins1b@charter.net> wrote:
"Andrealphus" <OHNOLETSGO@NARNIA.WHOCARES> wrote in message
news:h_vrd.9887$NU3.4152@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
David Perkins <perkins1b@charter.net> wrote:
"Andrealphus" <OHNOLETSGO@NARNIA.WHOCARES> wrote in message
news:rGvrd.9874$NU3.7818@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
I hope you can bear the disappointment.
Just leaves more room at the breakfast table in Heaven.
Assuming such a place exists. Of course, one would wonder why a
disembodied soul would still have the human weakness of needing to
eat a meal, or why time would still be broken up in morning, noon,
and night to require morning meal. I don't suppose you have the
answers to these questions either, do you?
Oh, this is easy to answer. I intend to take this body with me to
Heaven since God has been good to me and gave me such a gorgeous one.
And I've always been told that breakfast is the most important meal
of the day so I'm looking forward to Wheaties in Heaven. The milk
"up there" ought to be pure, pure, pure. Now, I'm also going to take
my Timex watch since it has no earthly value for anyone else. And,
too, since I've been promised eternity, how can I know it's eternity
unless I have a watch to see? See?
Just as I thought... You're a nut case.
--
Why is it that the people that complain the most about Jewish Lawyers
are the very same people that want to force you to follow laws set down
by Jewish Lawyers 3,500 years ago?
Jim Doemer 2004.
.
|
|
|
| User: "David Perkins" |
|
| Title: Re: The Myth about "born gay" |
02 Dec 2004 09:15:46 AM |
|
|
Bow out, Andrea. You don't belong in a discussion. What you want is a
name-calling, shouting match. As I said to you -and this will be the last
thing I say to you- have a nice afterlife.
Love
David
"Andrealphus" <OHNOLETSGO@NARNIA.WHOCARES> wrote in message
news:%mCrd.10096$NU3.6136@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
David Perkins <perkins1b@charter.net> wrote:
"Andrealphus" <OHNOLETSGO@NARNIA.WHOCARES> wrote in message
news:h_vrd.9887$NU3.4152@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
David Perkins <perkins1b@charter.net> wrote:
"Andrealphus" <OHNOLETSGO@NARNIA.WHOCARES> wrote in message
news:rGvrd.9874$NU3.7818@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
I hope you can bear the disappointment.
Just leaves more room at the breakfast table in Heaven.
Assuming such a place exists. Of course, one would wonder why a
disembodied soul would still have the human weakness of needing to
eat a meal, or why time would still be broken up in morning, noon,
and night to require morning meal. I don't suppose you have the
answers to these questions either, do you?
Oh, this is easy to answer. I intend to take this body with me to
Heaven since God has been good to me and gave me such a gorgeous one.
And I've always been told that breakfast is the most important meal
of the day so I'm looking forward to Wheaties in Heaven. The milk
"up there" ought to be pure, pure, pure. Now, I'm also going to take
my Timex watch since it has no earthly value for anyone else. And,
too, since I've been promised eternity, how can I know it's eternity
unless I have a watch to see? See?
Just as I thought... You're a nut case.
--
Why is it that the people that complain the most about Jewish Lawyers
are the very same people that want to force you to follow laws set down
by Jewish Lawyers 3,500 years ago?
Jim Doemer 2004.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Andrealphus" |
|
| Title: Re: The Myth about "born gay" |
02 Dec 2004 11:14:14 AM |
|
|
David Perkins <perkins1b@charter.net> wrote:
Bow out, Andrea. You don't belong in a discussion. What you want is
a name-calling, shouting match. As I said to you -and this will be
the last thing I say to you- have a nice afterlife.
Love
David
Well Davina, mine was a simple statement of fact, not a shouting match.
You're a nutcase. You will be highly disappointed in your afterlife.
--
Why is it that the people that complain the most about Jewish Lawyers
are the very same people that want to force you to follow laws set down
by Jewish Lawyers 3,500 years ago?
Jim Doemer 2004.
.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| User: "Bill Baker" |
|
| Title: Re: The Myth about "born gay" |
01 Dec 2004 07:35:12 PM |
|
|
On Wed, 01 Dec 2004 14:31:50 -0600, "David Perkins"
<perkins1b@charter.net> wrote in message news:<AYprd.339$Au.134@fe06.lga>:
Why did God punish Cain for killing Abel when God
hadn't yet given any laws forbidding it? After all, Cain couldn't have
committed murder since there were no laws against it.
I want to take a stab at this.
Pun intended?
First, though, remember, if you look for rationality in God,
particularly in Genesis, you're gonna get a very big headache. I'm not
being light headed or silly. It's just not going to be logical or
rational. It's religion. It's supposed to be a mystery for goodness
sakes. If you figure it out using logic and science, it wouldn't be
much of a religion, now would it? You know, it's a trick question to be
a Christian. For a smart, educated, thinking person to believe a baby
was born to a virgin, and he was God in the flesh or that he died a
public execution style death witnessed by many and still came back to
life 3 days later and rose into Heaven after that and his body has never
been found...that takes a real suspension of logic to believe that.
It's not easy to be a Christian! So, why do I do it? Well, you'll just
have to go to church and find out for yourself!
Yeah, I know. I'm a former Christian, myself. I believed that silly *****
for 30 years.
Now, to answer your question. God never said Cain "murdered" Abel. In
Gen 4.8 it says he "slew" him. In 4:10 God ASKS "What hast thou done?"
AND this was AA (after the apple...which revealed sin to humans) and
even AE (after Eden.) And where did all of these people come from
afterwards? Like I say, God mysteriously provides. There actually was
no law until Moses. There was a covenant with Noah. But God certainly
did punish Cain. In fact, Cain says it is too much for him 4:13. Love
David
Which still leaves the question, why did God punish Cain? It wasn't
murder, and there was no law against "slaying" either.
--
Funny Sister Lurlean quote #90:
"Ain't you never BLED out the butt hole"
.
|
|
|
| User: "David Perkins" |
|
| Title: Re: The Myth about "born gay" |
01 Dec 2004 09:18:09 PM |
|
|
"Bill Baker" <wbaker@postini.spamcon.org> wrote in message
news:pan.2004.12.02.01.37.31.983355@postini.spamcon.org...
On Wed, 01 Dec 2004 14:31:50 -0600, "David Perkins"
<perkins1b@charter.net> wrote in message news:<AYprd.339$Au.134@fe06.lga>:
Why did God punish Cain for killing Abel when God
hadn't yet given any laws forbidding it? After all, Cain couldn't have
committed murder since there were no laws against it.
I want to take a stab at this.
Pun intended?
Darn, found out! They say the worse the pun the better. That's my best.
First, though, remember, if you look for rationality in God,
particularly in Genesis, you're gonna get a very big headache. I'm not
being light headed or silly. It's just not going to be logical or
rational. It's religion. It's supposed to be a mystery for goodness
sakes. If you figure it out using logic and science, it wouldn't be
much of a religion, now would it? You know, it's a trick question to be
a Christian. For a smart, educated, thinking person to believe a baby
was born to a virgin, and he was God in the flesh or that he died a
public execution style death witnessed by many and still came back to
life 3 days later and rose into Heaven after that and his body has never
been found...that takes a real suspension of logic to believe that.
It's not easy to be a Christian! So, why do I do it? Well, you'll just
have to go to church and find out for yourself!
Yeah, I know. I'm a former Christian, myself. I believed that silly *****
for 30 years.
I am sorry you have become disillusioned. Care to say why or what happened?
Now, to answer your question. God never said Cain "murdered" Abel. In
Gen 4.8 it says he "slew" him. In 4:10 God ASKS "What hast thou done?"
AND this was AA (after the apple...which revealed sin to humans) and
even AE (after Eden.) And where did all of these people come from
afterwards? Like I say, God mysteriously provides. There actually was
no law until Moses. There was a covenant with Noah. But God certainly
did punish Cain. In fact, Cain says it is too much for him 4:13. Love
David
Which still leaves the question, why did God punish Cain? It wasn't
murder, and there was no law against "slaying" either.
I don't know the answer. Perhaps some biblical scholar does. But not me.
But, I'll beat this one till it's dead. Maybe, when Adam and Eve ate the
apple and had the same knowledge as God, maybe they, and by extension Cain,
"knew" it was wrong to kill. Alan Dershowitz (sp?) wrote a book about how
he could get Cain off claiming self-defense. Others have said they were
rasslin' (like Jacob with God) and it was an accident. God did tell Cain
something about how God could hear his brother's blood crying from the
grave. So you would think God knows and wouldn't punish some innocent
person. However, looking for justice in the Bible is like trying to find
sugar in a lemon. (I think sucrose??? is in a lemon, too, but not much of
it.) It's all about obediance to God not justice from God. Just thinking
out loud but maybe one of the reasons for Jesus is not that God wanted us to
become more God-like through his son made flesh but so that God could
understand human beings more. Hope someone with a better answer volunteers.
--
Funny Sister Lurlean quote #90:
"Ain't you never BLED out the butt hole"
Yeah, had hemorrhoids once!
.
|
|
|
| User: "Andrealphus" |
|
| Title: Re: The Myth about "born gay" |
01 Dec 2004 09:25:15 PM |
|
|
David Perkins <perkins1b@charter.net> wrote:
"Bill Baker" <wbaker@postini.spamcon.org> wrote in message
news:pan.2004.12.02.01.37.31.983355@postini.spamcon.org...
On Wed, 01 Dec 2004 14:31:50 -0600, "David Perkins"
<perkins1b@charter.net> wrote in message
news:<AYprd.339$Au.134@fe06.lga>:
Why did God punish Cain for killing Abel when God
hadn't yet given any laws forbidding it? After all, Cain couldn't
have committed murder since there were no laws against it.
I want to take a stab at this.
Pun intended?
Darn, found out! They say the worse the pun the better. That's my
best.
First, though, remember, if you look for rationality in God,
particularly in Genesis, you're gonna get a very big headache. I'm
not being light headed or silly. It's just not going to be logical
or rational. It's religion. It's supposed to be a mystery for
goodness sakes. If you figure it out using logic and science, it
wouldn't be much of a religion, now would it? You know, it's a
trick question to be a Christian. For a smart, educated, thinking
person to believe a baby was born to a virgin, and he was God in
the flesh or that he died a public execution style death witnessed
by many and still came back to life 3 days later and rose into
Heaven after that and his body has never been found...that takes a
real suspension of logic to believe that. It's not easy to be a
Christian! So, why do I do it? Well, you'll just have to go to
church and find out for yourself!
Yeah, I know. I'm a former Christian, myself. I believed that
silly ***** for 30 years.
I am sorry you have become disillusioned. Care to say why or what
happened?
He woke up.
--
Why is it that the people that complain the most about Jewish Lawyers
are the very same people that want to force you to follow laws set down
by Jewish Lawyers 3,500 years ago?
Jim Doemer 2004.
.
|
|
|
| User: "David Perkins" |
|
| Title: Re: The Myth about "born gay" |
01 Dec 2004 09:39:51 PM |
|
|
"Andrealphus" <OHNOLETSGO@NARNIA.WHOCARES> wrote in message
news:vWvrd.9883$NU3.2740@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
David Perkins <perkins1b@charter.net> wrote:
"Bill Baker" <wbaker@postini.spamcon.org> wrote in message
news:pan.2004.12.02.01.37.31.983355@postini.spamcon.org...
On Wed, 01 Dec 2004 14:31:50 -0600, "David Perkins"
<perkins1b@charter.net> wrote in message
news:<AYprd.339$Au.134@fe06.lga>:
Why did God punish Cain for killing Abel when God
hadn't yet given any laws forbidding it? After all, Cain couldn't
have committed murder since there were no laws against it.
I want to take a stab at this.
Pun intended?
Darn, found out! They say the worse the pun the better. That's my
best.
First, though, remember, if you look for rationality in God,
particularly in Genesis, you're gonna get a very big headache. I'm
not being light headed or silly. It's just not going to be logical
or rational. It's religion. It's supposed to be a mystery for
goodness sakes. If you figure it out using logic and science, it
wouldn't be much of a religion, now would it? You know, it's a
trick question to be a Christian. For a smart, educated, thinking
person to believe a baby was born to a virgin, and he was God in
the flesh or that he died a public execution style death witnessed
by many and still came back to life 3 days later and rose into
Heaven after that and his body has never been found...that takes a
real suspension of logic to believe that. It's not easy to be a
Christian! So, why do I do it? Well, you'll just have to go to
church and find out for yourself!
Yeah, I know. I'm a former Christian, myself. I believed that
silly ***** for 30 years.
I am sorry you have become disillusioned. Care to say why or what
happened?
He woke up.
That's a good one. Now, all we have to do is wake up the preacher and we
can all go home.
--
Why is it that the people that complain the most about Jewish Lawyers
are the very same people that want to force you to follow laws set down
by Jewish Lawyers 3,500 years ago?
If you're talking about the laws laid down in Exodus and Leviticus those
were written by humans but dictated by God (my belief.) Do not count me
among the people trying to "force" you to follow laws set down. As long as
you are an American and we have the Constitution, those are the laws that
must be followed by all citizens. In fact, I don't even complain about
lawyers much less Jewish lawyers. I think lawyers do a great job, by and
large, and protect us from excessive government and business.
Love
David
ps. yes, I guess I am disappointed you feel such anger towards Christianity
but I don't need you nor anyone else to believe as I do to validate my
beliefs. I can't image what happened to ***** you off so. I hope somehow,
without sounding condescending, that you find real peace.
Jim Doemer 2004.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Andrealphus" |
|
| Title: Re: The Myth about "born gay" |
02 Dec 2004 04:46:00 AM |
|
|
David Perkins <perkins1b@charter.net> wrote:
"Andrealphus" <OHNOLETSGO@NARNIA.WHOCARES> wrote in message
news:vWvrd.9883$NU3.2740@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
David Perkins <perkins1b@charter.net> wrote:
"Bill Baker" <wbaker@postini.spamcon.org> wrote in message
news:pan.2004.12.02.01.37.31.983355@postini.spamcon.org...
On Wed, 01 Dec 2004 14:31:50 -0600, "David Perkins"
<perkins1b@charter.net> wrote in message
news:<AYprd.339$Au.134@fe06.lga>:
Why did God punish Cain for killing Abel when God
hadn't yet given any laws forbidding it? After all, Cain
couldn't have committed murder since there were no laws against
it.
I want to take a stab at this.
Pun intended?
Darn, found out! They say the worse the pun the better. That's my
best.
First, though, remember, if you look for rationality in God,
particularly in Genesis, you're gonna get a very big headache.
I'm not being light headed or silly. It's just not going to be
logical or rational. It's religion. It's supposed to be a
mystery for goodness sakes. If you figure it out using logic and
science, it wouldn't be much of a religion, now would it? You
know, it's a trick question to be a Christian. For a smart,
educated, thinking person to believe a baby was born to a virgin,
and he was God in the flesh or that he died a public execution
style death witnessed by many and still came back to life 3 days
later and rose into Heaven after that and his body has never been
found...that takes a real suspension of logic to believe that.
It's not easy to be a Christian! So, why do I do it? Well,
you'll just have to go to church and find out for yourself!
Yeah, I know. I'm a former Christian, myself. I believed that
silly ***** for 30 years.
I am sorry you have become disillusioned. Care to say why or what
happened?
He woke up.
That's a good one. Now, all we have to do is wake up the preacher
and we can all go home.
--
Why is it that the people that complain the most about Jewish Lawyers
are the very same people that want to force you to follow laws set
down by Jewish Lawyers 3,500 years ago?
If you're talking about the laws laid down in Exodus and Leviticus
those were written by humans but dictated by God
Prove it.
--
Why is it that the people that complain the most about Jewish Lawyers
are the very same people that want to force you to follow laws set down
by Jewish Lawyers 3,500 years ago?
Jim Doemer 2004.
.
|
|
|
|
|
|
| User: "Bill Baker" |
|
| Title: Re: The Myth about "born gay" |
01 Dec 2004 10:11:12 PM |
|
|
On Wed, 01 Dec 2004 21:18:09 -0600, "David Perkins"
<perkins1b@charter.net> wrote in message
news:<JVvrd.395$ao3.322@fe06.lga>:
"Bill Baker" <wbaker@postini.spamcon.org> wrote in message
news:pan.2004.12.02.01.37.31.983355@postini.spamcon.org...
On Wed, 01 Dec 2004 14:31:50 -0600, "David Perkins"
<perkins1b@charter.net> wrote in message news:<AYprd.339$Au.134@fe06.lga>:
Why did God punish Cain for killing Abel when God
hadn't yet given any laws forbidding it? After all, Cain couldn't have
committed murder since there were no laws against it.
I want to take a stab at this.
Pun intended?
Darn, found out! They say the worse the pun the better. That's my best.
Good one, though. :-)
First, though, remember, if you look for rationality in God,
particularly in Genesis, you're gonna get a very big headache. I'm not
being light headed or silly. It's just not going to be logical or
rational. It's religion. It's supposed to be a mystery for goodness
sakes. If you figure it out using logic and science, it wouldn't be
much of a religion, now would it? You know, it's a trick question to be
a Christian. For a smart, educated, thinking person to believe a baby
was born to a virgin, and he was God in the flesh or that he died a
public execution style death witnessed by many and still came back to
life 3 days later and rose into Heaven after that and his body has never
been found...that takes a real suspension of logic to believe that.
It's not easy to be a Christian! So, why do I do it? Well, you'll just
have to go to church and find out for yourself!
Yeah, I know. I'm a former Christian, myself. I believed that silly *****
for 30 years.
I am sorry you have become disillusioned. Care to say why or what happened?
More like I became de-illusioned. I realized that none of it made sense.
Now, to answer your question. God never said Cain "murdered" Abel. In
Gen 4.8 it says he "slew" him. In 4:10 God ASKS "What hast thou done?"
AND this was AA (after the apple...which revealed sin to humans) and
even AE (after Eden.) And where did all of these people come from
afterwards? Like I say, God mysteriously provides. There actually was
no law until Moses. There was a covenant with Noah. But God certainly
did punish Cain. In fact, Cain says it is too much for him 4:13. Love
David
Which still leaves the question, why did God punish Cain? It wasn't
murder, and there was no law against "slaying" either.
I don't know the answer. Perhaps some biblical scholar does. But not me.
But, I'll beat this one till it's dead. Maybe, when Adam and Eve ate the
apple and had the same knowledge as God, maybe they, and by extension Cain,
"knew" it was wrong to kill. Alan Dershowitz (sp?) wrote a book about how
he could get Cain off claiming self-defense. Others have said they were
rasslin' (like Jacob with God) and it was an accident. God did tell Cain
something about how God could hear his brother's blood crying from the
grave. So you would think God knows and wouldn't punish some innocent
person. However, looking for justice in the Bible is like trying to find
sugar in a lemon. (I think sucrose??? is in a lemon, too, but not much of
it.) It's all about obediance to God not justice from God. Just thinking
out loud but maybe one of the reasons for Jesus is not that God wanted us to
become more God-like through his son made flesh but so that God could
understand human beings more. Hope someone with a better answer volunteers.
OK, you don't have to keep thinking up answers anymore. :-)
--
Funny Sister Lurlean quote #90:
"Ain't you never BLED out the butt hole"
Yeah, had hemorrhoids once!
Sister Lurlean (now known as Reverend Mother Tucker) is an interesting
character here in alt.politics.homosexuality.
--
Funny Sister Lurlean quote #56:
"I know that most of them Mexicans got smegma on account of I can smell it for
myself."
.
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| User: "David Perkins" |
|
| Title: Re: The Myth about "born gay" |
02 Dec 2004 04:57:19 PM |
|
|
"Bill Baker" <wbaker@postini.spamcon.org> wrote in message
news:pan.2004.12.02.04.13.33.36734@postini.spamcon.org...
On Wed, 01 Dec 2004 21:18:09 -0600, "David Perkins"
<perkins1b@charter.net> wrote in message
news:<JVvrd.395$ao3.322@fe06.lga>:
"Bill Baker" <wbaker@postini.spamcon.org> wrote in message
news:pan.2004.12.02.01.37.31.983355@postini.spamcon.org...
On Wed, 01 Dec 2004 14:31:50 -0600, "David Perkins"
<perkins1b@charter.net> wrote in message
news:<AYprd.339$Au.134@fe06.lga>:
Why did God punish Cain for killing Abel when God
hadn't yet given any laws forbidding it? After all, Cain couldn't
have
committed murder since there were no laws against it.
I want to take a stab at this.
Pun intended?
Darn, found out! They say the worse the pun the better. That's my
best.
Good one, though. :-)
First, though, remember, if you look for rationality in God,
particularly in Genesis, you're gonna get a very big headache. I'm
not
being light headed or silly. It's just not going to be logical or
rational. It's religion. It's supposed to be a mystery for goodness
sakes. If you figure it out using logic and science, it wouldn't be
much of a religion, now would it? You know, it's a trick question to
be
a Christian. For a smart, educated, thinking person to believe a
baby
was born to a virgin, and he was God in the flesh or that he died a
public execution style death witnessed by many and still came back to
life 3 days later and rose into Heaven after that and his body has
never
been found...that takes a real suspension of logic to believe that.
It's not easy to be a Christian! So, why do I do it? Well, you'll
just
have to go to church and find out for yourself!
Yeah, I know. I'm a former Christian, myself. I believed that silly
*****
for 30 years.
I am sorry you have become disillusioned. Care to say why or what
happened?
More like I became de-illusioned. I realized that none of it made sense.
I get the difference. I guess we're all fools if it turns out to be
nonsense. We'll just go to sleep and never know the difference. But, on
the other hand, take away the promise of salvation (life after death) and
living the Christian life is about like living a good Zen Buddhism life, if
done somewhat correctly. I said it wasn't easy being a Christian, for me at
least. I wish you would rejoin us hypocrites and fools again. Who knows,
maybe something good will come of it.
Now, to answer your question. God never said Cain "murdered" Abel.
In
Gen 4.8 it says he "slew" him. In 4:10 God ASKS "What hast thou
done?"
AND this was AA (after the apple...which revealed sin to humans) and
even AE (after Eden.) And where did all of these people come from
afterwards? Like I say, God mysteriously provides. There actually
was
no law until Moses. There was a covenant with Noah. But God
certainly
did punish Cain. In fact, Cain says it is too much for him 4:13. Love
David
Which still leaves the question, why did God punish Cain? It wasn't
murder, and there was no law against "slaying" either.
I don't know the answer. Perhaps some biblical scholar does. But not
me.
But, I'll beat this one till it's dead. Maybe, when Adam and Eve ate
the
apple and had the same knowledge as God, maybe they, and by extension
Cain,
"knew" it was wrong to kill. Alan Dershowitz (sp?) wrote a book about
how
he could get Cain off claiming self-defense. Others have said they were
rasslin' (like Jacob with God) and it was an accident. God did tell
Cain
something about how God could hear his brother's blood crying from the
grave. So you would think God knows and wouldn't punish some innocent
person. However, looking for justice in the Bible is like trying to
find
sugar in a lemon. (I think sucrose??? is in a lemon, too, but not much
of
it.) It's all about obediance to God not justice from God. Just
thinking
out loud but maybe one of the reasons for Jesus is not that God wanted
us to
become more God-like through his son made flesh but so that God could
understand human beings more. Hope someone with a better answer
volunteers.
OK, you don't have to keep thinking up answers anymore. :-)
Whew! I thought I was going to have to actually think! You know, in all
seriousness, it's too bad you can't just joke around about a serious subject
every once in a while without some yayhoo pouncing like Andrea or whatever
his or her name is . Oh no, I've gone and punned again. At long last, do I
have no shame?
--
Funny Sister Lurlean quote #90:
"Ain't you never BLED out the butt hole"
Yeah, had hemorrhoids once!
Sister Lurlean (now known as Reverend Mother Tucker) is an interesting
character here in alt.politics.homosexuality.
Oh. I thought Lurlean was a character in "Greater Tuna." I guess we both
are right.
--
Funny Sister Lurlean quote #56:
"I know that most of them Mexicans got smegma on account of I can smell it
for
myself."
Take care, brother Bill.
Love
David
.
|
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| User: "Bill Baker" |
|
| Title: Re: The Myth about "born gay" |
02 Dec 2004 07:18:46 PM |
|
|
On Thu, 02 Dec 2004 16:57:19 -0600, "David Perkins"
<perkins1b@charter.net> wrote in message news:<iaNrd.5$iG3.3@fe06.lga>:
"Bill Baker" <wbaker@postini.spamcon.org> wrote in message
news:pan.2004.12.02.04.13.33.36734@postini.spamcon.org...
On Wed, 01 Dec 2004 21:18:09 -0600, "David Perkins"
<perkins1b@charter.net> wrote in message
news:<JVvrd.395$ao3.322@fe06.lga>:
"Bill Baker" <wbaker@postini.spamcon.org> wrote in message
news:pan.2004.12.02.01.37.31.983355@postini.spamcon.org...
On Wed, 01 Dec 2004 14:31:50 -0600, "David Perkins"
<perkins1b@charter.net> wrote in message
news:<AYprd.339$Au.134@fe06.lga>:
Why did God punish Cain for killing Abel when God
hadn't yet given any laws forbidding it? After all, Cain couldn't
have
committed murder since there were no laws against it.
I want to take a stab at this.
Pun intended?
Darn, found out! They say the worse the pun the better. That's my
best.
Good one, though. :-)
First, though, remember, if you look for rationality in God,
particularly in Genesis, you're gonna get a very big headache. I'm
not
being light headed or silly. It's just not going to be logical or
rational. It's religion. It's supposed to be a mystery for goodness
sakes. If you figure it out using logic and science, it wouldn't be
much of a religion, now would it? You know, it's a trick question to
be
a Christian. For a smart, educated, thinking person to believe a
baby
was born to a virgin, and he was God in the flesh or that he died a
public execution style death witnessed by many and still came back to
life 3 days later and rose into Heaven after that and his body has
never
been found...that takes a real suspension of logic to believe that.
It's not easy to be a Christian! So, why do I do it? Well, you'll
just
have to go to church and find out for yourself!
Yeah, I know. I'm a former Christian, myself. I believed that silly
*****
for 30 years.
I am sorry you have become disillusioned. Care to say why or what
happened?
More like I became de-illusioned. I realized that none of it made sense.
I get the difference. I guess we're all fools if it turns out to be
nonsense. We'll just go to sleep and never know the difference. But, on
the other hand, take away the promise of salvation (life after death) and
living the Christian life is about like living a good Zen Buddhism life, if
done somewhat correctly. I said it wasn't easy being a Christian, for me at
least. I wish you would rejoin us hypocrites and fools again. Who knows,
maybe something good will come of it.
Nah, I'm good. :-)
Now, to answer your question. God never said Cain "murdered" Abel.
In
Gen 4.8 it says he "slew" him. In 4:10 God ASKS "What hast thou
done?"
AND this was AA (after the apple...which revealed sin to humans) and
even AE (after Eden.) And where did all of these people come from
afterwards? Like I say, God mysteriously provides. There actually
was
no law until Moses. There was a covenant with Noah. But God
certainly
did punish Cain. In fact, Cain says it is too much for him 4:13. Love
David
Which still leaves the question, why did God punish Cain? It wasn't
murder, and there was no law against "slaying" either.
I don't know the answer. Perhaps some biblical scholar does. But not
me.
But, I'll beat this one till it's dead. Maybe, when Adam and Eve ate
the
apple and had the same knowledge as God, maybe they, and by extension
Cain,
"knew" it was wrong to kill. Alan Dershowitz (sp?) wrote a book about
how
he could get Cain off claiming self-defense. Others have said they were
rasslin' (like Jacob with God) and it was an accident. God did tell
Cain
something about how God could hear his brother's blood crying from the
grave. So you would think God knows and wouldn't punish some innocent
person. However, looking for justice in the Bible is like trying to
find
sugar in a lemon. (I think sucrose??? is in a lemon, too, but not much
of
it.) It's all about obediance to God not justice from God. Just
thinking
out loud but maybe one of the reasons for Jesus is not that God wanted
us to
become more God-like through his son made flesh but so that God could
understand human beings more. Hope someone with a better answer
volunteers.
OK, you don't have to keep thinking up answers anymore. :-)
Whew! I thought I was going to have to actually think! You know, in all
seriousness, it's too bad you can't just joke around about a serious subject
every once in a while without some yayhoo pouncing like Andrea or whatever
his or her name is . Oh no, I've gone and punned again. At long last, do I
have no shame?
Pun away. It's all one big party in here. :-)
--
Funny Sister Lurlean quote #90:
"Ain't you never BLED out the butt hole"
Yeah, had hemorrhoids once!
Sister Lurlean (now known as Reverend Mother Tucker) is an interesting
character here in alt.politics.homosexuality.
Oh. I thought Lurlean was a character in "Greater Tuna." I guess we both
are right.
She's a "character" all right.
--
Funny Sister Lurlean quote #56:
"I know that most of them Mexicans got smegma on account of I can smell it
for
myself."
Take care, brother Bill.
Love
David
--
Funny Sister Lurlean quote #12:
"The important thing to know is whether the different candidates is
circumcised." --Lurlean makes her final decision as she approaches the ballot
box.
.
|
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| User: "Bard Kesnit" |
|
| Title: Re: The Myth about "born gay" |
02 Dec 2004 05:50:38 PM |
|
|
On Thu, 2 Dec 2004 16:57:19 -0600, "David Perkins"
<perkins1b@charter.net> wrote:
"Bill Baker" <wbaker@postini.spamcon.org> wrote in message
news:pan.2004.12.02.04.13.33.36734@postini.spamcon.org...
On Wed, 01 Dec 2004 21:18:09 -0600, "David Perkins"
<perkins1b@charter.net> wrote in message
news:<JVvrd.395$ao3.322@fe06.lga>:
Yeah, I know. I'm a former Christian, myself. I believed that silly
*****
for 30 years.
I am sorry you have become disillusioned. Care to say why or what
happened?
More like I became de-illusioned. I realized that none of it made sense.
I get the difference. I guess we're all fools if it turns out to be
nonsense. We'll just go to sleep and never know the difference.
I keep saying that we'll all die and meet "The Great Pumpkin."
<g>
But, on the other hand, take away the promise of salvation (life after death) and
living the Christian life is about like living a good Zen Buddhism life,
That may be the point. People have to have a reason to justify
their good behavrior. Are most of us naturally "good," or do we
"behave" because someone told us what to do? (I know there is no
answer to that question. At least, not a short one.)
OK, you don't have to keep thinking up answers anymore. :-)
Whew! I thought I was going to have to actually think! You know, in all
seriousness, it's too bad you can't just joke around about a serious subject
every once in a while without some yayhoo pouncing like Andrea or whatever
his or her name is .
It is a breath of fresh air to find someone who can discuss
religion without flying off the handle.
Bard Kesnit
.
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| User: "Andrealphus" |
|
| Title: Re: The Myth about "born gay" |
02 Dec 2004 04:48:22 AM |
|
|
Bill Baker <wbaker@postini.spamcon.org> wrote:
On Wed, 01 Dec 2004 21:18:09 -0600, "David Perkins"
<perkins1b@charter.net> wrote in message
news:<JVvrd.395$ao3.322@fe06.lga>:
"Bill Baker" <wbaker@postini.spamcon.org> wrote in message
news:pan.2004.12.02.01.37.31.983355@postini.spamcon.org...
On Wed, 01 Dec 2004 14:31:50 -0600, "David Perkins"
<perkins1b@charter.net> wrote in message
news:<AYprd.339$Au.134@fe06.lga>:
Why did God punish Cain for killing Abel when God
hadn't yet given any laws forbidding it? After all, Cain
couldn't have committed murder since there were no laws against
it.
I want to take a stab at this.
Pun intended?
Darn, found out! They say the worse the pun the better. That's my
best.
Good one, though. :-)
First, though, remember, if you look for rationality in God,
particularly in Genesis, you're gonna get a very big headache.
I'm not being light headed or silly. It's just not going to be
logical or rational. It's religion. It's supposed to be a
mystery for goodness sakes. If you figure it out using logic and
science, it wouldn't be much of a religion, now would it? You
know, it's a trick question to be a Christian. For a smart,
educated, thinking person to believe a baby was born to a virgin,
and he was God in the flesh or that he died a public execution
style death witnessed by many and still came back to life 3 days
later and rose into Heaven after that and his body has never been
found...that takes a real suspension of logic to believe that.
It's not easy to be a Christian! So, why do I do it? Well,
you'll just have to go to church and find out for yourself!
Yeah, I know. I'm a former Christian, myself. I believed that
silly ***** for 30 years.
I am sorry you have become disillusioned. Care to say why or what
happened?
More like I became de-illusioned. I realized that none of it made
sense.
Now, to answer your question. God never said Cain "murdered"
Abel. In Gen 4.8 it says he "slew" him. In 4:10 God ASKS "What
hast thou done?" AND this was AA (after the apple...which revealed
sin to humans) and even AE (after Eden.) And where did all of
these people come from afterwards? Like I say, God mysteriously
provides. There actually was no law until Moses. There was a
covenant with Noah. But God certainly did punish Cain. In fact,
Cain says it is too much for him 4:13. Love David
Which still leaves the question, why did God punish Cain? It wasn't
murder, and there was no law against "slaying" either.
I don't know the answer. Perhaps some biblical scholar does. But
not me. But, I'll beat this one till it's dead. Maybe, when Adam
and Eve ate the apple and had the same knowledge as God, maybe they,
and by extension Cain, "knew" it was wrong to kill. Alan Dershowitz
(sp?) wrote a book about how he could get Cain off claiming
self-defense. Others have said they were rasslin' (like Jacob with
God) and it was an accident. God did tell Cain something about how
God could hear his brother's blood crying from the grave. So you
would think God knows and wouldn't punish some innocent person.
However, looking for justice in the Bible is like trying to find
sugar in a lemon. (I think sucrose??? is in a lemon, too, but not
much of it.) It's all about obediance to God not justice from God.
Just thinking out loud but maybe one of the reasons for Jesus is not
that God wanted us to become more God-like through his son made
flesh but so that God could understand human beings more. Hope
someone with a better answer volunteers.
OK, you don't have to keep thinking up answers anymore. :-)
Isn't it amazing just how few tools their god left them to answer even the
simplest of questions?
--
Why is it that the people that complain the most about Jewish Lawyers
are the very same people that want to force you to follow laws set down
by Jewish Lawyers 3,500 years ago?
Jim Doemer 2004.
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