Trinity Not Mentioned In Bible

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Topic:	Religions > Bible
User:	"Norwood Holden"
Date:	06 Nov 2004 10:19:47 AM
Object:	Trinity Not Mentioned In Bible

The truth is that the Trinity isn't even mentioned in God's word, the
Holy Bible. A check of any concordance will prove this fact. Not only
is it not mentioned, but the doctrine is neither found in the New
Testament, nor the Old Testament.
http://www.auburn.edu/~allenkc/trinity.html
.

User: "Norwood Holden"
Title: Re: Trinity Not Mentioned In Bible	07 Nov 2004 03:44:49 AM

(Mrs. James Q. Stallion) wrote

The word Trinity does not appear in the Bible, but the concept
certainly does.
Out of the blue you just suddenly felt the need to discuss this
Biblical point. You have my permission to misquote the Bible until you
feel some sort of satisfaction, with no further correction from me....no
one here takes your word for anything any way. Suzan

Listed below are over a hundred individual Bible verses which prove
conclusively that Jesus Christ was not God, but God's Son.
Matthew 3:16-17; 8:29; 11:27; 12:18; 14:33; 16:16-17; 17:5; 27:54
Mark 5:7; 15:39
Luke 1:32; 1:35; 8:28; 9:35; 10:22
John 1:13; 1:18; 1:34; 1:49; 3:16; 5:19-23; 5:37; 6:40; 6:69; 8:18;
8:42; 10:15; 10:36; 11:4; 12:49-50; 14:13; 14:23; 14:28; 16:17;
17:1-16; 20:17; 20:31
Acts 2:22-24; 3:13; 3:26; 9:20
Romans 1:4; 5:10; 8:29
1 Corinthians 11:3; 15:28
2 Corinthians 1:19
Galatians 4:4
Philippians 2:9
Colossians 1:13
1 Thessalonians 1:10
1 Timothy 2:5
Hebrews 1:2; 2:9; 4:14; 5:7-8
1 Peter 1:3
2 Peter 1:17
1 John 1:3; 2:22; 3:23; 4:10; 4:14-15; 5:11-12
2 John 1:9
Revelation 2:18
.

User: "Holden"
Title: Fuzzy yes ; Fundy no	07 Nov 2004 04:17:19 AM

Norwood Holden wrote:

SuzanPeachFuzz@webtv.net (Mrs. James Q. Stallion) wrote

Here are 60 Bible texts which prove conclusively that Jesus was NOT
GOD, but RATHER the SON of God. [If in fact He WAS God, (as
trinitarians would want us to believe), He could not have really died;
and the act of paying the Ransom would merely have been a hoax!]
Matthew 3:16-17; 8:29; 11:27; 12:18; 14:33; 16:16; 17:5; 27:54
Mark 5:7; 15:39
Luke 1:32; 8:28; 9:35; 10:22
John 1:18; 1:34; 1:49; 3:16; 5:19-23; 6:40; 6:69; 8:42; 10:15; 11:4;
12:49-50; 14:13; 14:23; 14:28; 16:17; 17:1-26
Acts 2:22-24; 3:13; 3:26; 9:20
Romans 1:4; 5:10; 8:13; 8:29-32
1 Corinthians 11:3; 15:28
2 Corinthians 1:19
Galatians 4:4
Colossians 1:13
1 Thessalonians 1:10
Hebrews 1:2; 4:14; 5:8; 7:3; 11:17
2 Peter 1:17
1 John 1:3; 1:22; 3:23; 4:10; 4:14-15; 5:6; 5:11-12
2 John 1:9
Revelation 2:8
Since these texts exist in God's Word, the Gospel story has been told
over and over again. However, it could NOT be told if Jesus had really
been God and the ransom had not actually ben paid! GOD CAN"T DIE!
.

User: "icono"
Title: Re: Fuzzy yes ; Fundy no	07 Nov 2004 08:27:58 PM

"Norwood Holden" <postmaster@norwoodholden.force9.co.uk> wrote in message
news:418df62f$0$33622$ed2619ec@ptn-nntp-reader02.plus.net...

Norwood Holden wrote:

SuzanPeachFuzz@webtv.net (Mrs. James Q. Stallion) wrote

The word Trinity does not appear in the Bible, but the concept
certainly does.
Out of the blue you just suddenly felt the need to discuss this
Biblical point. You have my permission to misquote the Bible until you
feel some sort of satisfaction, with no further correction from
me....no
one here takes your word for anything any way. Suzan

Listed below are over a hundred individual Bible verses which prove
conclusively that Jesus Christ was not God, but God's Son.

Matthew 3:16-17; 8:29; 11:27; 12:18; 14:33; 16:16-17; 17:5; 27:54
Mark 5:7; 15:39
Luke 1:32; 1:35; 8:28; 9:35; 10:22
John 1:13; 1:18; 1:34; 1:49; 3:16; 5:19-23; 5:37; 6:40; 6:69; 8:18;
8:42; 10:15; 10:36; 11:4; 12:49-50; 14:13; 14:23; 14:28; 16:17;
17:1-16; 20:17; 20:31
Acts 2:22-24; 3:13; 3:26; 9:20
Romans 1:4; 5:10; 8:29
1 Corinthians 11:3; 15:28
2 Corinthians 1:19
Galatians 4:4
Philippians 2:9
Colossians 1:13
1 Thessalonians 1:10
1 Timothy 2:5
Hebrews 1:2; 2:9; 4:14; 5:7-8
1 Peter 1:3
2 Peter 1:17
1 John 1:3; 2:22; 3:23; 4:10; 4:14-15; 5:11-12
2 John 1:9
Revelation 2:18

Here are 60 Bible texts which prove conclusively that Jesus was NOT
GOD, but RATHER the SON of God. [If in fact He WAS God, (as
trinitarians would want us to believe), He could not have really died;
and the act of paying the Ransom would merely have been a hoax!]

Matthew 3:16-17; 8:29; 11:27; 12:18; 14:33; 16:16; 17:5; 27:54
Mark 5:7; 15:39
Luke 1:32; 8:28; 9:35; 10:22
John 1:18; 1:34; 1:49; 3:16; 5:19-23; 6:40; 6:69; 8:42; 10:15; 11:4;
12:49-50; 14:13; 14:23; 14:28; 16:17; 17:1-26
Acts 2:22-24; 3:13; 3:26; 9:20
Romans 1:4; 5:10; 8:13; 8:29-32
1 Corinthians 11:3; 15:28
2 Corinthians 1:19
Galatians 4:4
Colossians 1:13
1 Thessalonians 1:10
Hebrews 1:2; 4:14; 5:8; 7:3; 11:17
2 Peter 1:17
1 John 1:3; 1:22; 3:23; 4:10; 4:14-15; 5:6; 5:11-12
2 John 1:9
Revelation 2:8

Since these texts exist in God's Word, the Gospel story has been told
over and over again. However, it could NOT be told if Jesus had really
been God and the ransom had not actually ben paid! GOD CAN"T DIE!

"Jesus" was a man.
Now think REAL hard about the concept.
O.K. God can't die.
Man cannot bring himself from the dead.
Man cannot control demons.
.

User: "Holden"
Title: Re: Fuzzy yes ; Fundy no	07 Nov 2004 06:42:53 AM

David Simpson wrote:

On 07 Nov 2004 10:17:19 GMT,
postmaster@norwoodholden.force9.co.uk(Norwood Holden) typed furiously:

Norwood Holden wrote:

SuzanPeachFuzz@webtv.net (Mrs. James Q. Stallion) wrote

Listed below are over a hundred individual Bible verses which prove
conclusively that Jesus Christ was not God, but God's Son.

Here are 60 Bible texts which prove conclusively that Jesus was NOT
GOD, but RATHER the SON of God. [If in fact He WAS God, (as
trinitarians would want us to believe), He could not have really died;
and the act of paying the Ransom would merely have been a hoax!]

Matthew 3:16-17; 8:29; 11:27; 12:18; 14:33; 16:16; 17:5; 27:54
Mark 5:7; 15:39
Luke 1:32; 8:28; 9:35; 10:22
John 1:18; 1:34; 1:49; 3:16; 5:19-23; 6:40; 6:69; 8:42; 10:15; 11:4;
12:49-50; 14:13; 14:23; 14:28; 16:17; 17:1-26
Acts 2:22-24; 3:13; 3:26; 9:20
Romans 1:4; 5:10; 8:13; 8:29-32
1 Corinthians 11:3; 15:28
2 Corinthians 1:19
Galatians 4:4
Colossians 1:13
1 Thessalonians 1:10
Hebrews 1:2; 4:14; 5:8; 7:3; 11:17
2 Peter 1:17
1 John 1:3; 1:22; 3:23; 4:10; 4:14-15; 5:6; 5:11-12
2 John 1:9
Revelation 2:8

Since these texts exist in God's Word, the Gospel story has been told
over and over again. However, it could NOT be told if Jesus had really
been God and the ransom had not actually ben paid! GOD CAN"T DIE!

For once, wonder of wonders, I actually find myself agreeing with
Norwood. See, Norwood, you can post sense occasionally. I just wish
you would do it all the time. It is still a religious topic and, as
such, is off-topic for alt.freemasonry. I have deleted all those cross
posts you put in.

It is not off-topic. Think David. Isn't it your change of religous belief
that prevent you rejoining masonry? Further, if you think a little deeper,
you will find I am always right. Seriously.
.

User: "duke"
Title: Re: Fuzzy yes ; Fundy no	07 Nov 2004 08:47:57 AM

On 07 Nov 2004 10:17:19 GMT, postmaster@norwoodholden.force9.co.uk(Norwood Holden) wrote:

Since these texts exist in God's Word, the Gospel story has been told
over and over again. However, it could NOT be told if Jesus had really
been God and the ransom had not actually ben paid! GOD CAN"T DIE!

God became man, fully man, to die on the cross for the redemption of our sin and to
restore salvation of souls.
The man Jesus died on the cross and was buried in the tomb, the divine Jesus walked out of
the tomb.
duke
*****
Matthew 22
14"For many are invited, but few are chosen."
*****
.

User: "Norwood Holden"
Title: Re: Fuzzy yes ; Fundy no	10 Nov 2004 09:22:29 AM

duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> wrote in message news:<g9dso0ltiu91k0o2imvcjjs8lpum0q2s6u@4ax.com>...

On 07 Nov 2004 10:17:19 GMT, postmaster@norwoodholden.force9.co.uk(Norwood Holden) wrote:

God became man, fully man, to die on the cross for the redemption of our sin and to
restore salvation of souls.

The man Jesus died on the cross and was buried in the tomb, the divine Jesus walked out of
the tomb.

Stake. Not a cross.
.

User: "Teresita"
Title: Re: Fuzzy yes ; Fundy no	10 Nov 2004 11:39:30 PM

On 10 Nov 2004 07:22:29 -0800,

(Norwood
Holden) wrote:

The man Jesus died on the cross and was buried in the tomb, the divine Jesus walked out of
the tomb.

Stake. Not a cross.

Phil.3:[18] For many walk, of whom I have told you often, and now tell
you even weeping, that they are the enemies of the cross of Christ
--
Teresita aka Ruby Redinger
http://web.newsguy.com/rubyred
.

User: "_cloud"
Title: Re: Trinity Not Mentioned In Bible	07 Nov 2004 09:15:17 PM

(Norwood Holden) wrote in message news:<9e48f660.0411060819.329e1f6d@posting.google.com>...

It appears you need to do some reading.
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/15047a.htm#II
I. THE DOGMA OF THE TRINITY
The Trinity is the term employed to signify the central doctrine of
the Christian religion -- the truth that in the unity of the Godhead
there are Three Persons, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit,
these Three Persons being truly distinct one from another. Thus, in
the words of the Athanasian Creed: "the Father is God, the Son is God,
and the Holy Spirit is God, and yet there are not three Gods but one
God." In this Trinity of Persons the Son is begotten of the Father by
an eternal generation, and the Holy Spirit proceeds by an eternal
procession from the Father and the Son. Yet, notwithstanding this
difference as to origin, the Persons are co-eternal and co-equal: all
alike are uncreated and omnipotent. This, the Church teaches, is the
revelation regarding God's nature which Jesus Christ, the Son of God,
came upon earth to deliver to the world: and which she proposes to man
as the foundation of her whole dogmatic system.
In Scripture there is as yet no single term by which the Three Divine
Persons are denoted together. The word trias (of which the Latin
trinitas is a translation) is first found in Theophilus of Antioch
about A.D. 180. He speaks of "the Trinity of God [the Father], His
Word and His Wisdom ("Ad. Autol.", II, 15). The term may, of course,
have been in use before his time. Afterwards it appears in its Latin
form of trinitas in Tertullian ("De pud." c. xxi). In the next century
the word is in general use. It is found in many passages of Origen
("In Ps. xvii", 15). The first creed in which it appears is that of
Origen's pupil, Gregory Thaumaturgus. In his Ekthesis tes pisteos
composed between 260 and 270, he writes:
There is therefore nothing created, nothing subject to another in the
Trinity: nor is there anything that has been added as though it once
had not existed, but had entered afterwards: therefore the Father has
never been without the Son, nor the Son without the Spirit: and this
same Trinity is immutable and unalterable forever (P. G., X, 986).
It is manifest that a dogma so mysterious presupposes a Divine
revelation. When the fact of revelation, understood in its full sense
as the speech of God to man, is no longer admitted, the rejection of
the doctrine follows as a necessary consequence. For this reason it
has no place in the Liberal Protestantism of today. The writers of
this school contend that the doctrine of the Trinity, as professed by
the Church, is not contained in the New Testament, but that it was
first formulated in the second century and received final approbation
in the fourth, as the result of the Arian and Macedonian
controversies. In view of this assertion it is necessary to consider
in some detail the evidence afforded by Holy Scripture. Attempts have
been made recently to apply the more extreme theories of comparative
religion to the doctrine ot the Trinity, and to account for it by an
imaginary law of nature compelling men to group the objects of their
worship in threes. It seems needless to give more than a reference to
these extravagant views, which serious thinkers of every school reject
as destitute of foundation.
II. PROOF OF DOCTRINE FROM SCRIPTURE
A. New Testament
The evidence from the Gospels culminates in the baptismal commission
of Matthew 28:20. It is manifest from the narratives of the
Evangelists that Christ only made the great truth known to the Twelve
step by step. First He taught them to recognize in Himself the Eternal
Son of God. When His ministry was drawing to a close, He promised that
the Father would send another Divine Person, the Holy Spirit, in His
place. Finally after His resurrection, He revealed the doctrine in
explicit terms, bidding them "go and teach all nations, baptizing them
in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost"
(Matthew 28:18). The force of this passage is decisive. That "the
Father" and "the Son" are distinct Persons follows from the terms
themselves, which are mutually exclusive. The mention of the Holy
Spirit in the same series, the names being connected one with the
other by the conjunctions "and . . . and" is evidence that we have
here a Third Person co-ordinate with the Father and the Son, and
excludes altogether the supposition that the Apostles understood the
Holy Spirit not as a distinct Person, but as God viewed in His action
on creatures.
The phrase "in the name" (eis to onoma) affirms alike the Godhead of
the Persons and their unity of nature. Among the Jews and in the
Apostolic Church the Divine name was representative of God. He who had
a right to use it was invested with vast authority: for he wielded the
supernatural powers of Him whose name he employed. It is incredible
that the phrase "in the name" should be here employed, were not all
the Persons mentioned equally Divine. Moreover, the use of the
singular, "name," and not the plural, shows that these Three Persons
are that One Omnipotent God in whom the Apostles believed. Indeed the
unity of God is so fundamental a tenet alike of the Hebrew and of the
Christian religion, and is affirmed in such countless passages of the
Old and New Testaments, that any explanation inconsistent with this
doctrine would be altogether inadmissible.
The supernatural appearance at the baptism of Christ is often cited as
an explicit revelation of Trinitarian doctrine, given at the very
commencement of the Ministry. This, it seems to us, is a mistake. The
Evangelists, it is true, see in it a manifestation of the Three Divine
Persons. Yet, apart from Christ's subsequent teaching, the dogmatic
meaning of the scene would hardly have been understood. Moreover, the
Gospel narratives appear to signify that none but Christ and the
Baptist were privileged to see the Mystic Dove, and hear the words
attesting the Divine sonship of the Messias.
Besides these passages there are many others in the Gospels which
refer to one or other of the Three Persons in particular and clearly
express the separate personality and Divinity of each. In regard to
the First Person it will not be necessary to give special citations:
those which declare that Jesus Christ is God the Son, affirm thereby
also the separate personality of the Father. The Divinity of Christ is
amply attested not merely by St. John, but by the Synoptists. As this
point is treated elsewhere (see JESUS CHRIST), it will be sufficient
here to enumerate a few of the more important messages from the
Synoptists, in which Christ bears witness to His Divine Nature.
* He declares that He will come to be the judge of all men (Matthew
25:31). In Jewish theology the judgment of the world was a
distinctively Divine, and not a Messianic, prerogative.
* In the parable of the wicked husbandmen, He describes Himself as the
son of the householder, while the Prophets, one and all, are
represented as the servants (Matthew 21:33 sqq.).
* He is the Lord of Angels, who execute His command (Matthew 24:31).
* He approves the confession of Peter when he recognizes Him, not as
Messias -- a step long since taken by all the Apostles -- but
explicitly as the Son of God: and He declares the knowledge due to a
special revelation from the Father (Matthew 16:16-17).
* Finally, before Caiphas He not merely declares Himself to be the
Messias, but in reply to a second and distinct question affirms His
claim to be the Son of God. He is instantly declared by the high
priest to be guilty of blasphemy, an offense which could not have been
attached to the claim to be simply the Messias (Luke 22:66-71).
St. John's testimony is yet more explicit than that of the Synoptists.
He expressly asserts that the very purpose of his Gospel is to
establish the Divinity of Jesus Christ (John 20:31). In the prologue
he identifies Him with the Word, the only-begotten of the Father, Who
from all eternity exists with God, Who is God (John 1:1-18). The
immanence of the Son in the Father and of the Father in the Son is
declared in Christ's words to St. Philip: "Do you not believe, that I
am in the Father, and the Father in Me?" (14:10), and in other
passages no less explicit (14:7; 16:15; 17:21). The oneness of Their
power and Their action is affirmed: "Whatever he [the Father] does,
the Son also does in like manner" (5:19, cf. 10:38); and to the Son no
less than to the Father belongs the Divine attribute of conferring
life on whom He will (5:21). In 10:29, Christ expressly teaches His
unity of essence with the Father: "That which my Father hath given me,
is greater than all . . . I and the Father are one." The words, "That
which my Father hath given me," can, having regard to the context,
have no other meaning than the Divine Name, possessed in its fullness
by the Son as by the Father.
Rationalist critics lay great stress upon the text: "The Father is
greater than I" (14:28). They argue that this suffices to establish
that the author of the Gospel held subordinationist views, and they
expound in this sense certain texts in which the Son declares His
dependence on the Father (5:19; 8:28). In point of fact the doctrine
of the Incarnation involves that, in regard of His Human Nature, the
Son should be less than the Father. No argument against Catholic
doctrine can, therefore, be drawn from this text. So too, the passages
referring to the dependence of the Son upon the Father do but express
what is essential to Trinitarian dogma, namely, that the Father is the
supreme source from Whom the Divine Nature and perfections flow to the
Son. (On the essential difference between St. John's doctrine as to
the Person of Christ and the Logos doctrine of the Alexandrine Philo,
to which many Rationalists have attempted to trace it, see LOGOS.)
In regard to the Third Person of the Blessed Trinity, the passages
which can be cited from the Synoptists as attesting His distinct
personality are few. The words of Gabriel (Luke 1:35), having regard
to the use of the term, "the Spirit," in the Old Testament, to signify
God as operative in His creatures, can hardly be said to contain a
definite revelation of the doctrine. For the same reason it is dubious
whether Christ's warning to the Pharisees as regards blasphemy against
the Holy Spirit (Matthew 12:31) can be brought forward as proof. But
in Luke 12:12, "The Holy Ghost shall teach you in the same hour what
you must say" (Matthew 10:20, and Luke 24:49), His personality is
clearly implied. These passages, taken in connection with Matthew
28:19, postulate the existence of such teaching as we find in the
discourses in the Cenacle reported by St. John (14-16). We have in
these chapters the necessary preparation for the baptismal commission.
In them the Apostles are instructed not only as the personality of the
Spirit, but as to His office towards the Church. His work is to teach
whatsoever He shall hear (16:13) to bring back their minds the
teaching of Christ (14:26), to convince the world of sin (16:8). It is
evident that, were the Spirit not a Person, Christ could not have
spoken of His presence with the Apostles as comparable to His own
presence with them (14:16). Again, were He not a Divine Person it
could not have been expedient for the Apostles that Christ should
leave them, and the Paraclete take His place (16:7). Moreover,
notwithstanding the neuter form of the word (pneuma), the pronoun used
in His regard is the masculine ekeinos. The distinction of the Holy
Spirit from the Father and from the Son is involved in the express
statements that He proceeds from the Father and is sent by the Son
(15:26; cf. 14:16, 26). Nevertheless, He is one with Them: His
presence with the Disciples is at the same time the presence of the
Son (14:17, 18), while the presence of the Son is the presence of the
Father (14:23).
In the remaining New Testament writings numerous passages attest how
clear and definite was the belief of the Apostolic Church in the three
Divine Persons. In certain texts the coordination of Father, Son, and
Spirit leaves no possible doubt as to the meaning of the writer. Thus
in II Corinthians 13:13, St. Paul writes: "The grace of our Lord Jesus
Christ, and the charity of God, and the communication of the Holy
Ghost be with you all." Here the construction shows that the Apostle
is speaking of three distinct Persons. Moreover, since the names God
and Holy Ghost are alike Divine names, it follows that Jesus Christ is
also regarded as a Divine Person. So also, in I Corinthians 12:4-11:
"There are diversities of graces, but the same Spirit; and there are
diversities of ministries, but the same Lord: and there are
diversities of operations, but the same God, who worketh all [of them]
in all [persons]." (Cf. also Ephesians 4:4-6; I Peter 1:2-3.)
But apart from passages such as these, where there is express mention
of the Three Persons, the teaching of the New Testament regarding
Christ and the Holy Spirit is free from all ambiguity. In regard to
Christ, the Apostles employ modes of speech which, to men brought up
in the Hebrew faith, necessarily signified belief in His Divinity.
Such, for instance, is the use of the Doxology in reference to Him.
The Doxology, "To Him be glory for ever and ever" (cf. I Chronicles
16:38; 29:11; Psalm 103:31; 28:2), is an expression of praise offered
to God alone. In the New Testament we find it addressed not alone to
God the Father, but to Jesus Christ (II Timothy 4:18; II Peter 3:18;
Revelations 1:6; Hebrews 13:20-21), and to God the Father and Christ
in conjunction (Revelations 5:13, 7:10). Not less convincing is the
use of the title Lord (Kyrios). This term represents the Hebrew
Adonai, just as God (Theos) represents Elohim. The two are equally
Divine names (cf. I Corinthians 8:4). In the Apostolic writings Theos
may almost be said to be treated as a proper name of God the Father,
and Kyrios of the Son (see, for example, I Corinthians 12:5-6); in
only a few passages do we find Kyrios used of the Father (I
Corinthians 3:5; 7:17) or Theos of Christ. The Apostles from time to
time apply to Christ passages of the Old Testament in which Kyrios is
used, for example, I Corinthians 10:9 (Numbers 21:7), Hebrews 1:10-12
(Psalm 101:26-28); and they use such expressions as "the fear of the
Lord" (Acts 9:31; II Corinthians 5:11; Ephesians 5:21), "call upon the
name of the Lord," indifferently of God the Father and of Christ (Acts
2:21; 9:14; Romans 10:13). The profession that "Jesus is the Lord"
(Kyrion Iesoun, Romans 10:9; Kyrios Iesous, I Corinthians 12:3) is the
acknowledgment of Jesus as Jahweh. The texts in which St. Paul affirms
that in Christ dwells the plenitude of the Godhead (Colossians 2:9),
that before His Incarnation He possessed the essential nature of God
(Philemon 2:6), that He "is over all things, God blessed for ever"
(Romans 9:5) tell us nothing that is not implied in many other
passages of his Epistles.
The doctrine as to the Holy Spirit is equally clear. That His distinct
personality was fully recognized is shown by many passages. Thus He
reveals His commands to the Church's ministers: "As they were
ministering to the Lord and fasting, the Holy Ghost said to them:
Separate me Saul and Barnabas . . ." (Acts 13:2). He directs the
missionary journey of the Apostles: "They attempted to go into
Bithynia, and the Spirit of Jesus suffered them not" (Acts 16:7; cf.
Acts 5:3; 15:28; Romans 15:30). Divine attributes are affirmed of Him.
* He possesses omniscience and reveals to the Church mysteries known
only to God (I Corinthians 2:10);
* it is He who distributes charismata (I Cor., 12:11);
* He is the giver of supernatural life (II Cor., 3:8);
* He dwells in the Church and in the souls of individual men, as in
His temple (Romans 8:9-11; I Corinthians 3:16, 6:19).
* The work of justification and sanctification is attributed to Him (I
Cor., 6:11; Rom., 15:16), just as in other passages the same
operations are attributed to Christ (I Cor., 1:2; Gal., 2:17).
To sum up: the various elements of the Trinitarian doctrine are all
expressly taught in the New Testament. The Divinity of the Three
Persons is asserted or implied in passages too numerous to count. The
unity of essence is not merely postulated by the strict monotheism of
men nurtured in the religion of Israel, to whom "subordinate deities"
would have been unthinkable; but it is, as we have seen, involved in
the baptismal commission of Matthew 28:19, and, in regard to the
Father and the Son, expressly asserted in John 10:38. That the Persons
are co-eternal and coequal is a mere corollary from this. In regard to
the Divine processions, the doctrine of the first procession is
contained in the very terms Father and Son: the procession of the Holy
Spirit from the Father and Son is taught in the discourse of the Lord
reported by St. John (14-17) (see HOLY GHOST).
.

User: "Dave Lister"
Title: Re: Trinity Not Mentioned In Bible	08 Nov 2004 10:28:00 PM

(_cloud) wrote in
news:eebdba34.0411071915.4ab26f81@posting.google.com:

The Trinity is the term employed to signify the central doctrine of
the Christian religion -- the truth that in the unity of the Godhead
there are Three Persons, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit,
these Three Persons being truly distinct one from another. Thus, in
the words of the Athanasian Creed: "the Father is God, the Son is God,
and the Holy Spirit is God, and yet there are not three Gods but one
God." In this Trinity of Persons the Son is begotten of the Father by
an eternal generation, and the Holy Spirit proceeds by an eternal
procession from the Father and the Son. Yet, notwithstanding this
difference as to origin, the Persons are co-eternal and co-equal: all
alike are uncreated and omnipotent. This, the Church teaches, is the
revelation regarding God's nature which Jesus Christ, the Son of God,
came upon earth to deliver to the world: and which she proposes to man
as the foundation of her whole dogmatic system.

So you have three gods, which sit on a council you call the "godhead".
--
Bush is not my President.
.

User: "icono"
Title: Re: Trinity Not Mentioned In Bible	06 Nov 2004 07:56:54 PM

Grandmother isn't either. So there is no such thing as Grandmother.
.

User: "::: vera :::"
Title: Re: Trinity Not Mentioned In Bible	06 Nov 2004 04:03:18 PM

In news:9e48f660.0411060819.329e1f6d@posting.google.com,
Norwood Holden <norwood_holden@hotmail.com> wrote:

Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the
Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost (Matthew 28:19 KJV)
<>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <><
Love and Peace,
::: vera :::
--
::: http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de :::
::: http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de/Israel.htm :::
.

User: "duke"
Title: Re: Trinity Not Mentioned In Bible	07 Nov 2004 08:56:49 AM

On Sat, 6 Nov 2004 23:03:18 +0100, "::: vera :::" <verasix@acc-growing-deeper.de> wrote:

Norwood Holden <norwood_holden@hotmail.com> wrote:

Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the
Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost (Matthew 28:19 KJV)

<>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <><

Love and Peace,

::: vera :::

Yes.
duke
*****
Matthew 22
14"For many are invited, but few are chosen."
*****
.

User: "Holden"
Title: Re: Trinity Not Mentioned In Bible	07 Nov 2004 09:16:44 AM

duke wrote:

On Sat, 6 Nov 2004 23:03:18 +0100, "::: vera :::"

<verasix@acc-growing-deeper.de> wrote:

Norwood Holden <norwood_holden@hotmail.com> wrote:

Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the
Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost (Matthew 28:19 KJV)

<>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <><

Love and Peace,

::: vera :::

During the days when Christ's apostles lived, the Gospel was taught with
accuracy, but after their death, it did not take very long for the truth
to become eroded with falsehoods.
This erosion of Biblical truth grew like a cancer -- slow, but sure.
Little by little, inacuracy crept in as the Gospel message of Jesus Christ
became more and more popular.
In an effort to increase the church membership, many Pagans were brought
in and with the Pagans came Pagan ideas. Rituals began to replace serious
Bible study and differences in opinion soon became the basis for growth of
various creeds and sects. Ober the span of many years, man-made rites
became time honored tradition.
Christian leaders then became powerful forces in the church as well as in
politics; religious beliefs, many times, were dictated by the state. These
facts, however, are not surpirsing considering the Biblical warning:
"First of all you must understand this, that no prophecy ever came by the
impulse of man, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God."
"But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will be
false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies,
even denying the Master who bought them.... And many will follow their
licentiousness, and because of them the way of truth will be reviled. And
in their greed they will exploit you with false words...." (2 Peter
1:20-21; 2:1-3)
.

User: "duke"
Title: Re: Trinity Not Mentioned In Bible	08 Nov 2004 06:10:11 AM

On 07 Nov 2004 15:16:44 GMT, postmaster@norwoodholden.force9.co.uk(Norwood Holden) wrote:

During the days when Christ's apostles lived, the Gospel was taught with
accuracy, but after their death, it did not take very long for the truth
to become eroded with falsehoods.

Falsehoods?. How about solidification?

This erosion of Biblical truth grew like a cancer -- slow, but sure.
Little by little, inacuracy crept in as the Gospel message of Jesus Christ
became more and more popular.

How so?

In an effort to increase the church membership, many Pagans were brought
in and with the Pagans came Pagan ideas. Rituals began to replace serious
Bible study and differences in opinion soon became the basis for growth of
various creeds and sects. Ober the span of many years, man-made rites
became time honored tradition.

Serious bible study? There was no Bible at the time except for the Jewish writings. Like
the OT, it was put together in bits and pieces.
Maybe that 's why the Protest_ants took 7 books out of the bible. They didn't like what
was being said. Which is really drawn out the way the Protest_ants worship the OT, and
then go to bed and say "thank you Jesus".
duke
*****
Matthew 22
14"For many are invited, but few are chosen."
*****
.

User: "::: vera :::"
Title: Re: Trinity Not Mentioned In Bible	06 Nov 2004 04:24:03 PM

In news:9e48f660.0411060819.329e1f6d@posting.google.com,
Norwood Holden <norwood_holden@hotmail.com> wrote:

There is some more proof:
Mark 2:5-12
Why does this man speak that way? He is blaspheming; who can forgive
sins but God alone?
John 1:1
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word
was God. He was in the beginning with God.
John 5:18
For this cause therefore the Jews were seeking all the more to kill
Him, because He not only was breaking the Sabbath, but also was calling God
His own Father, making Himself equal with God.
John 8:58
"Your father Abraham rejoiced to see My day, and he saw it and was
glad." The Jews therefore said to Him, "You are not yet fifty years old, and
have You seen Abraham?" Jesus said to them, "Truly, truly, I say to you,
before Abraham was born, I am." Therefore they picked up stones to throw at
Him; but Jesus hid Himself, and went out of the temple.
John 10:33
"I and the Father are one." The Jews took up stones again to stone
Him. . Has it not been written in your Law, 'I said, you are gods'?"
John 19:7
The Jews answered him, "We have a law, and by that law He ought to die
because He made Himself out to be the Son of God."
Romans 14:11
For it is written, "As I live, says the Lord, every knee shall bow to
Me, And every tongue shall give praise to God."
2 Corinthians 13:14
The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the
fellowship of the Holy Spirit, be with you all.
Philippians 2:9-11
"Therefore also God highly exalted Him, and bestowed on Him the name
which is above every name, that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow,
of those who are in heaven, and on earth, and under the earth, and that
every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God
the Father."
1 Peter 1:2
Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through
sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of
Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.
Love and Peace,
::: vera :::
--
::: http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de :::
::: http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de/Israel.htm :::
.

User: "bob young"
Title: Re: Trinity Not Mentioned In Bible	06 Nov 2004 07:53:21 PM

Norwood Holden wrote:

The truth is that the Trinity isn't even mentioned in God's word, the
Holy Bible.

As far as I know no god ever spoke any words to anyone that are not, at
the very least, secondhand. The 'words' so called, in the bible, are
stories written by men and nothing more.
Why would a god that supposedly created mankind and every other thing,
rely on an old book, full of contradictions, to be 'his word'. Quite
rediculous if one thinks about it.
A god who achieved such great creations would stand before mankind for
all to see. The reason he doesn't do this is :
1) He is very very shy [!] or
2) All the stories about this god are made up things by superstitious
man
take your pick

A check of any concordance will prove this fact. Not only
is it not mentioned, but the doctrine is neither found in the New
Testament, nor the Old Testament.

http://www.auburn.edu/~allenkc/trinity.html

User: "Keith Johnson"
Title: Re: Trinity Not Mentioned In Bible	07 Nov 2004 11:08:04 AM

Norwood Holden wrote:

Christ was glorified in the exact image of the Father!
In Zechariah 14;:3,4 IT SAYS THE LORD will come! Not a little god!
http://www.irr.org/English-JW/jwfacten.html
We do not intend to ridicule or belittle individual Jehovah's
Witnesses; they are generally sincere, dedicated people. In one sense
they are more like lost sheep than ravenous wolves, for they have been
deceived by an organization with a history of false prophecies and false
doctrines. Jehovah's Witnesses truly believe that if they leave the
Watchtower Society they will be destroyed at Armageddon. They need our
love and compassion. Our desire for them, as for everyone else, is that
they come to a true knowledge of what the Bible teaches, and the
understanding that salvation is God's gift to us. Only by entering into
a personal relationship with Jesus Christ will any of us be guaranteed
forgiveness and eternal life.
� Joel B. Groat
All copyright material posted for research purposes only!
.

User: ""
Title: Re: Trinity Not Mentioned In Bible	06 Nov 2004 09:01:06 PM

On 6 Nov 2004 08:19:47 -0800,

(Norwood
Holden) done went and wrote as Gospel Truth in these here little old
Usenet News'FROUPS:

While the actual word may not be,its existence IS mentioned in the
fact that our Lord tells us to baptize IN THE NAME OF the Father, and
of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost.
Therefore, the trinity IS biblical.
-------------------------------------------------------
JESUS IS THE ROCK
God doesn't call the qualified; He qualifies the called
-------------------------------------------------------
.

User: "Mike Painter"
Title: Re: Trinity Not Mentioned In Bible	07 Nov 2004 02:56:48 AM

wrote:

On 6 Nov 2004 08:19:47 -0800,

(Norwood
Holden) done went and wrote as Gospel Truth in these here little old
Usenet News'FROUPS:

Sounds like a Bush supporter who want the Legeslative, judicial , and
executive branch to be one.
What part of "and" don't you people understand?
.

User: ""
Title: Re: Trinity Not Mentioned In Bible	07 Nov 2004 12:23:03 PM

On Sun, 07 Nov 2004 08:56:48 GMT, "Mike Painter"
<mddotpainter@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

Sounds like a Bush supporter

I do not support bush. Never have.
.

User: "Holden"
Title: Roman Catholic Church, and its doctrine of a Triune deity	07 Nov 2004 09:37:53 AM

The New Catholic Encyclopedia, 1967, vol. 14, p. 299, acknowledges: "The
formulation �one G-d in three Persons� was not solidly established,
certainly not fully assimilated into Christian life and its profession of
faith, prior to the end of the 4th century....Among the Apostolic Fathers,
there had been nothing even remotely approaching such a mentality or
perspective."
The issue came to a flash point at the general church Council of Nicaea in
325 C.E., called by Constantine. Two church leaders in Alexandria�Arius
and Athanasius�had been in open dispute over whether the Father and Son
were equal.
Eusebius, the father of ecclesiastical history, early in the conference
offered a compromise resolution that described the relationship of the
Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Supporters of Athanasius realized that the
compromise would destroy the doctrine of the Trinity, and was essentially
a vote for Arius, who maintained that the Father was superior in some
ways. Emperor Constantine stepped in, rejecting the compromise of
Eusebius. But the Trinity idea did not become doctrine until the year 379
when Roman Emperor Theodosius established Christianity as the state
religion. Hence, the Roman Catholic Church, and its doctrine of a Triune
deity, was born.
romath@romath.net wrote:

On 6 Nov 2004 08:19:47 -0800,

(Norwood
Holden) done went and wrote as Gospel Truth in these here little old
Usenet News'FROUPS:

User: ""
Title: Re: Roman Catholic Church, and its doctrine of a Triune deity	07 Nov 2004 12:22:57 PM

On 07 Nov 2004 15:37:53 GMT,
postmaster@norwoodholden.force9.co.uk(Norwood Holden) wrote:
LARGE snippage of romaist rhetoric

Emperor Constantine stepped in, rejecting the compromise of
Eusebius. But the Trinity idea did not become doctrine until the year

379

when Roman Emperor Theodosius established Christianity as the state
religion. Hence, the Roman Catholic Church, and its doctrine of a

Triune

deity, was born.

OTC, the BIBLE dictated the TRINITY, not the romanist cult.
The romanists had nothing to do with the TRUE doctrine of the Holy
Trinity.
.

User: "The Apostle"
Title: Re: Roman Catholic Church, and its doctrine of a Triune deity	07 Nov 2004 02:20:45 PM

<me@you.net> wrote in message >

OTC, the BIBLE dictated the TRINITY, not the romanist cult.
The romanists had nothing to do with the TRUE doctrine of the Holy
Trinity.

Why don't you show us the book, chapter and verse.
That the three were all the same.
Don't quote things like Matthew 28: 19, where it says The Father, AND the
son, AND the holy ghost.
Show us something that tells us they were all the same.
Or you can shut up!!
.

User: "icono"
Title: Re: Roman Catholic Church, and its doctrine of a Triune deity	07 Nov 2004 08:24:40 PM

"The Apostle" <nobler@accesswave.ca> wrote in message
news:xsvjd.122685$9b.108577@edtnps84...

<me@you.net> wrote in message >

OTC, the BIBLE dictated the TRINITY, not the romanist cult.
The romanists had nothing to do with the TRUE doctrine of the Holy
Trinity.

Why don't you show us the book, chapter and verse.

Right after you show "a" book, chapter, and verse proving there is a
grandmother.
.

User: "Streamer"
Title: Re: Roman Catholic Church, and its doctrine of a Triune deity	07 Nov 2004 11:42:15 PM

"The Apostle" <nobler@accesswave.ca> wrote in message
news:xsvjd.122685$9b.108577@edtnps84...

<me@you.net> wrote in message >

OTC, the BIBLE dictated the TRINITY, not the romanist cult.
The romanists had nothing to do with the TRUE doctrine of the Holy
Trinity.

Why don't you show us the book, chapter and verse.

That the three were all the same.

Don't quote things like Matthew 28: 19, where it says The Father, AND the
son, AND the holy ghost.

Show us something that tells us they were all the same.

Or you can shut up!!

Who told you that "TRINITY " means "the same" ?
Now answer this:
Do you believe that only God created man ? And only in His own image ?
.

User: "mclark"
Title: Re: Roman Catholic Church, and its doctrine of a Triune deity	13 Nov 2004 01:02:16 PM

Streamer <jcjuno@optonline.net> wrote:

"The Apostle" <nobler@accesswave.ca> wrote in message
news:xsvjd.122685$9b.108577@edtnps84...

<me@you.net> wrote in message >

OTC, the BIBLE dictated the TRINITY, not the romanist cult.
The romanists had nothing to do with the TRUE doctrine of the Holy
Trinity.

Why don't you show us the book, chapter and verse.

That the three were all the same.

Don't quote things like Matthew 28: 19, where it says The Father, AND the
son, AND the holy ghost.

Show us something that tells us they were all the same.

Or you can shut up!!

Who told you that "TRINITY " means "the same" ?

Now answer this:
Do you believe that only God created man ? And only in His own image ?

Ancient writer (historian ?) Tertullian probably coined the word
Trinity.
"For example, he coined the word Trinity, a word that does not appear
anywhere in the Bible, to help us to understand the New Testament
teaching about what God is like."
Try:
http://www.tertullian.org
I would certainly classify Trinity issues under Romans 14 with an
emphasis on Romans 14:4.
Return to God, believing in his Son Jesus in faith, and have eternal
life.
M. Clark
.

User: ""
Title: Re: Roman Catholic Church, and its doctrine of a Triune deity	07 Nov 2004 09:15:58 PM

On Sun, 07 Nov 2004 20:20:45 GMT, "The Apostle" <nobler@accesswave.ca>
done went and wrote as Gospel Truth in these here little old Usenet
News'FROUPS:

<me@you.net> wrote in message >

OTC, the BIBLE dictated the TRINITY, not the romanist cult.
The romanists had nothing to do with the TRUE doctrine of the Holy
Trinity.

Why don't you show us the book, chapter and verse.

I already HAVE.

That the three were all the same.

Don't quote things like Matthew 28: 19, where it says The Father, AND the
son, AND the holy ghost.

I included those verses, much to your chagrin, and you will not tell
me how to post or what I'm permitted to post, either.

Show us something that tells us they were all the same.

been there- did that already.

Or you can shut up!!

I will not shut up.
If I have something to say, I will say it. If you object, then feel
free to killfile me, sonny.
-------------------------------------------------------
JESUS IS THE ROCK
God doesn't call the qualified; He qualifies the called
-------------------------------------------------------
.

User: "Teresita"
Title: Re: Roman Catholic Church, and its doctrine of a Triune deity	07 Nov 2004 07:02:39 PM

On Sun, 07 Nov 2004 20:20:45 GMT, "The Apostle" <nobler@accesswave.ca>
wrote:

<me@you.net> wrote in message >

OTC, the BIBLE dictated the TRINITY, not the romanist cult.
The romanists had nothing to do with the TRUE doctrine of the Holy
Trinity.

Why don't you show us the book, chapter and verse.

That the three were all the same.

Don't quote things like Matthew 28: 19, where it says The Father, AND the
son, AND the holy ghost.

Show us something that tells us they were all the same.

Or you can shut up!!

Duh. It says in the Name singular (not names plural) of the Father
and the Son and the Holy Ghost.
--
Teresita aka Ruby Redinger
http://web.newsguy.com/rubyred
.

User: "Jerric"
Title: Re: Roman Catholic Church, and its doctrine of a Triune deity	08 Nov 2004 12:26:02 AM

"Teresita" <teresita@dataway.com> wrote in message
news:7chto0da3f5rrurp61ctnu8idtcndcq7tm@4ax.com...

On Sun, 07 Nov 2004 20:20:45 GMT, "The Apostle" <nobler@accesswave.ca>
wrote:

<me@you.net> wrote in message >

OTC, the BIBLE dictated the TRINITY, not the romanist cult.
The romanists had nothing to do with the TRUE doctrine of the Holy
Trinity.

Why don't you show us the book, chapter and verse.

That the three were all the same.

Don't quote things like Matthew 28: 19, where it says The Father, AND the
son, AND the holy ghost.

Show us something that tells us they were all the same.

Or you can shut up!!

In Genesis 1:26-27 it says "Then God (original hebrew
text says 'Elohim' which is plural) said: 'let US make man in OUR image,
after OUR likeness. So Elohim created man in His own image in the image of
Elohim he created him" wo who's this us if one corelates this with the
exerpt in Johns gospel about Jesus being with God during creation and the
fact the original text refers to God in the plural
and
Acts 2:17,21 "And it shall come to pass in the last days, says God, that I
will pour out of My Spirit on all flesh; and it shall come to pass that
whoever calls on the name of the Lord shall be saved"
John 14:17-18 "but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you,
I will not leave you orphans, I will come to you" (refer this back to acts
where it says God will pour out his spirit and yet in this passage Jesus
says the same thing perhaps because they are one in the same and certainly
because of when Jesus says in the next passage)
John 10:29-30 "My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all; and
no one is able to snatch theim out of my father's hand. I and my father are
one"
John 14:20 "at that day you will know that I am in my father, and you in me,
and I in you...and I will love him and manifest myself to him" so if we
have the Holy spirit within us that guides us as most Christians believe,
how could Jesus be in us and God at the same time is it three separate
beings residing within us or the Holy spirit who is God
John 12:45 "and he who sees me sees Him who sent me" how could that be if
Jesus was not the same as Him who sent Him
2 corintians 5:19 "That is, that God was in Christ reconciling the world to
Himself" God came down in the person of Jesus Christ to reconcile us to Him
Romans 8:9 "But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit; if indeed the
spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of
Christ, he is not his" again do we have multiple spirits living within
us?????
Hebrews 1:3 "Jesus, who being the brightness of His (God) glory and the
express image of His person, and upholding all things by the word of His
power"
John 1:1-5 "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and
the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things were made
<-----perhaps the biggest one if Jesus was with God and was God then......
through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made. In Him was
life, and the life was the light of man. And the light shines in the
darkness and the darkness did not comprehend it."
.

User: "mclark"
Title: Re: Roman Catholic Church, and its doctrine of a Triune deity	13 Nov 2004 01:02:14 PM

Jerric <jerric@nb.sympatico.ca> wrote:

"Teresita" <teresita@dataway.com> wrote in message
news:7chto0da3f5rrurp61ctnu8idtcndcq7tm@4ax.com...

On Sun, 07 Nov 2004 20:20:45 GMT, "The Apostle" <nobler@accesswave.ca>
wrote:

<me@you.net> wrote in message >

OTC, the BIBLE dictated the TRINITY, not the romanist cult.
The romanists had nothing to do with the TRUE doctrine of the Holy
Trinity.

Why don't you show us the book, chapter and verse.

That the three were all the same.

Don't quote things like Matthew 28: 19, where it says The Father, AND the
son, AND the holy ghost.

Show us something that tells us they were all the same.

Or you can shut up!!

In Genesis 1:26-27 it says "Then God (original hebrew
text says 'Elohim' which is plural) said: 'let US make man in OUR image,
after OUR likeness. So Elohim created man in His own image in the image of
Elohim he created him" wo who's this us if one corelates this with the
exerpt in Johns gospel about Jesus being with God during creation and the
fact the original text refers to God in the plural

and

Acts 2:17,21 "And it shall come to pass in the last days, says God, that I
will pour out of My Spirit on all flesh; and it shall come to pass that
whoever calls on the name of the Lord shall be saved"

John 14:17-18 "but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you,
I will not leave you orphans, I will come to you" (refer this back to acts
where it says God will pour out his spirit and yet in this passage Jesus
says the same thing perhaps because they are one in the same and certainly
because of when Jesus says in the next passage)

John 10:29-30 "My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all; and
no one is able to snatch theim out of my father's hand. I and my father are
one"

John 14:20 "at that day you will know that I am in my father, and you in me,
and I in you...and I will love him and manifest myself to him" so if we
have the Holy spirit within us that guides us as most Christians believe,
how could Jesus be in us and God at the same time is it three separate
beings residing within us or the Holy spirit who is God

John 12:45 "and he who sees me sees Him who sent me" how could that be if
Jesus was not the same as Him who sent Him

2 corintians 5:19 "That is, that God was in Christ reconciling the world to
Himself" God came down in the person of Jesus Christ to reconcile us to Him

Romans 8:9 "But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit; if indeed the
spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of
Christ, he is not his" again do we have multiple spirits living within
us?????

Hebrews 1:3 "Jesus, who being the brightness of His (God) glory and the
express image of His person, and upholding all things by the word of His
power"

John 1:1-5 "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and
the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things were made
<-----perhaps the biggest one if Jesus was with God and was God then......
through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made. In Him was
life, and the life was the light of man. And the light shines in the
darkness and the darkness did not comprehend it."

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