"Gabriel" <gabriel_baptist@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1177353216.944035.157830@y80g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...

On Apr 23, 4:31 am, "Andrew W" <removethis_ajwer...@optushome.com.au>
wrote:

God is certainly powerful to wipe our minds from all free will and
force us to obey and lock us in a cage. He doesn't want robots. He
wants people that want to be with him, in spite of having the gift of
free will; the ability to choose to be with Him (or be separate from
Him).

With who? We can't find him.

[Please note, I quote scripture to let you know that what I say comes
from the Bible, not me. Don't just read what I say, see how the Bible
is where it's really said, the Word of God, and read it for yourself.
If you're earnestly curious about it, you should be interested in
reading these ideas for yourself.]

What do you think the "Word of God" refers to?
Do you think it refers to mere words of our language?
Consider the possibility that "Word of God" refers to God's silent voice
inside all living things.

What do you think the "Word of God" refers to?
Do you think it refers to mere words of our language?
Consider the possibility that "Word of God" refers to God's silent voice
inside all living things.

Words in a book can be misunderstood and misrepresented (and have).

According to the scriptures The Word existed at the beginning - when there
were no scriptures.

Look harder. Look at the testimony of creation, your conscience, the
Bible, and other saved Christians.

Rom 1:19-20 "Because that which may be known of God is manifest in
them; for God hath showed it unto them. For the invisible things of
him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood
by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so
that they are without excuse:"

What kind of father forces his children to choose between him and his
worst
enemy and then threatens to kill them when they don't make the right
choice?

We are not His children until accept Him.

So we are all disposable? How can a good God create living, feeling,
needing creatures as expendable and disposable items?
That's monstrous. And you call this story book monster Love?

Do you ever actually use your brain to see if the scriptures are rational at
all or do you just believe everything you read?

In fact, until then we are His enemies.

That's even more ridiculous. Why on earth would God create enemies for
himself?

You Christians are priceless.
It is clear that the scriptures were written by depressed individuals with
no self esteem what so ever.

Only mafia bosses force people into such choices. This is not love.

How much ego does it take to assume that only you and your religion alone
know and understand God perfectly and to assume that just like a
disciplinary human he's a ruler with an
iron fist who uses 'tough love', just because your book says so?

Oh that's right. Your book says that it's "the word of God".
Well then I guess that settles it. How can a man written book lie right?

Romans 6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is
eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Depressive pious poetry. Find something more uplifting to read.

Price? Your God is a shrewd business man too I see. How Jewish.

while we were still wicked sinners, while we were
not yet children of God, while we were yet enemies of God. Perhaps
take a closer look at that instead of complaining

I have already taken a closer look. That's why I'm no longer a Christian.

Why don't you take a closer look. But first take some time to study
spirituality.
Your knowledge on it seems to be lacking tremendously.

and continuing to
want to be separate from God.

"The atheist staring from his attic window is often nearer to God than the
believer caught up in his own false image of God." ~ Martin Buber

Divine creation is far grander than this dark little fantasy you and your
simple minded brethren have bought into.

You really need to do some study on spirituality before you make a total
fool out of yourself.

This will help you.http://www.principalityofcamside.cc/Spiritual/WhoWhatWhy.htm

Did your father do that to you?
Think man!!

If you think our earthly father is any comparison to a heavenly God,
rethink what you think you know about God. Our sense of grace and love
could never even come close.

Then why do *you* place human attributes onto God? It is you Christians who
have compared God to man first.

Romans 5:6-10 "For when we were yet without strength, in due time
Christ died for the ungodly. For scarcely for a righteous man will one
die: yet peradventure for a good man some would even dare to die. But
God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners,
Christ died for us. Much more then, being now justified by his blood,
we shall be saved from wrath through him. For if, when we were
enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more,
being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life."

People would barely die for someone they know and love. They'd never
die for someone who was yet wicked and evil, and Jesus Christ did just
that!! Praise the Lord! As it says, we are enemies with God until we
get saved. His wrath abides on us.

John 3:36 "He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he
that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God
abideth on him."

God commits suicide to save us from his own wrath? I mean really.

You have completely misunderstood the scriptures.

Christ did not come here for the purpose that modern Christians believe.
This will set you straight.http://www.acim.org/

How can you be sure you're going to Heaven? Tired of the Hell already
here in a sin-filled earth? Here's God's plan of salvation:

[1] We must admit that we are sinners
Romans 3:10 "There is none righteous, no not one."
Romans 3:23 "For all have sinned and come short of the glory of God."
[2] We must believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God and bore the
punishment for our sins on the cross and rose from the dead.
Romans 10:9-10 "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord
Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from
the dead, thou shalt be saved."
Romans 6:23 "For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is
eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord."
[3] We must call on the Lord to save us.
Romans 10:13 "For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall
be saved."
John 1:12 "But as many as received him, to them gave he power to
become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name."

Nothing can oppose God's will.
Nothing can go outside of God's plan.
Therefore God must have planned for the Devil to destroy most of his
children.
The Devil is God's creation and employee.

God was most likely aware that some Angels would turn away from Him.
Satan was one of them. Hell is a place he created for them, and for
the rest of us that choose to follow the Devil and not Him.

"Choose me or my enemy" Is this all you think God is about?

How petty. You should be ashamed of yourself for reducing God to nothing
more
than a petty squabble master and divider.
How can love and jealousy come from the same source?
How can love and revenge come from the same source?

You haven't thought about any of this have you?

Like most Christians you just read and believe.

When are you going to educate yourself on the principles of spirituality?

Praise the Lord!

You Christians would praise anything that claimed to be all powerful.
You Christians worship power. That's ego.

No, we worship only God.

What is God to you? Power primarily. Power to crush your hated enemies,
which is practically everyone.

We love our brothers and sisters in Christ,
as is one of the commandments. We worship the one that clearly shows
he loves us, and his abundant mercy, and the mercy of Jesus Christ.
You continue to reject and act superior to an almighty God who created
you. What was that about ego again?

I don't consider myself superior to God, only to the Bible god character
which you worship.
Your god behaves like an angry teenager most of the time. He boasts about
love but then does the opposite and uses violence and threats to solve
problems. As we can see it hasn't worked very well yet. I wonder why.

Please think again about what I've pointed out here that God tells us
in the Bible.

How do you know what parts of the Bible is God telling us things and what
parts are just the written beliefs of men?
You do know that the Bible contains religious beliefs and traditions I hope.

We don't bring it up to make people feel bad, but to
help other people to be saved as well.

Saved from what? God's anger? What is he so angry about?
Doesn't he understand that we are in the process of evolving mentally and
spiritually?

The Bible charges us with going
out to spread the word:

Mark 16:15 "And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and
preach the gospel to every creature."

Although you did come to our newsgroup, rather than one that would
match what you're claiming: your hate for God.

I only dislike false gods.

--
Andrew W.

Jesus said that we must search everywhere for the truth, that we must
leave
no stone unturned.
How naive and foolish is the man who thinks he can get all the answers to
life from one convenient book. ~me

Romans 1:21-22 "Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him
not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their
imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing
themselves to be wise, they became fools," ~the Bible

Praise the Lord!

I think you just enjoy praising worshipping. It makes you feel more secure.

--
Andrew W.

Jesus said that we must search everywhere for the truth, that we must leave
no stone unturned.
How naive and foolish is the man who thinks he can get all the answers to
life from one convenient book. ~me

What we are told God and Jesus said, they did not say.http://www.divinelove.org/volume1/Mission.htm
TABLE OF CONTENTS. Must read!http://www.divinelove.org/revnt/Rev-TOC-title.htm

The true Creator wants us to be happy and abundant.http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Science_of_Getting_Rich
Audio version.http://website.lineone.net/~cornerstone/richaudio.htm

Think you know what ego is? Think again. The Bible is full of it!http://www.acim.org/

Religion Exposed!http://members.optusnet.com.au/~ajwerner

What do you think the "Word of God" refers to?
Do you think it refers to mere words of our language?
Consider the possibility that "Word of God" refers to God's silent voice
inside all living things.

Words in a book can be misunderstood and misrepresented (and have).

According to the scriptures The Word existed at the beginning - when there
were no scriptures.

Look harder. Look at the testimony of creation, your conscience, the
Bible, and other saved Christians.

Rom 1:19-20 "Because that which may be known of God is manifest in
them; for God hath showed it unto them. For the invisible things of
him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood
by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so
that they are without excuse:"

What kind of father forces his children to choose between him and his
worst
enemy and then threatens to kill them when they don't make the right
choice?

We are not His children until accept Him.

So we are all disposable? How can a good God create living, feeling,
needing creatures as expendable and disposable items?
That's monstrous. And you call this story book monster Love?

Do you ever actually use your brain to see if the scriptures are rational at
all or do you just believe everything you read?

In fact, until then we are His enemies.

That's even more ridiculous. Why on earth would God create enemies for
himself?

You Christians are priceless.
It is clear that the scriptures were written by depressed individuals with
no self esteem what so ever.

Only mafia bosses force people into such choices. This is not love.

How much ego does it take to assume that only you and your religion alone
know and understand God perfectly and to assume that just like a
disciplinary human he's a ruler with an
iron fist who uses 'tough love', just because your book says so?

Oh that's right. Your book says that it's "the word of God".
Well then I guess that settles it. How can a man written book lie right?

Romans 6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is
eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Depressive pious poetry. Find something more uplifting to read.

Price? Your God is a shrewd business man too I see. How Jewish.

while we were still wicked sinners, while we were
not yet children of God, while we were yet enemies of God. Perhaps
take a closer look at that instead of complaining

I have already taken a closer look. That's why I'm no longer a Christian.

Why don't you take a closer look. But first take some time to study
spirituality.
Your knowledge on it seems to be lacking tremendously.

and continuing to
want to be separate from God.

"The atheist staring from his attic window is often nearer to God than the
believer caught up in his own false image of God." ~ Martin Buber

Divine creation is far grander than this dark little fantasy you and your
simple minded brethren have bought into.

You really need to do some study on spirituality before you make a total
fool out of yourself.

This will help you.http://www.principalityofcamside.cc/Spiritual/WhoWhatWhy.htm

Did your father do that to you?
Think man!!

If you think our earthly father is any comparison to a heavenly God,
rethink what you think you know about God. Our sense of grace and love
could never even come close.

Then why do *you* place human attributes onto God? It is you Christians who
have compared God to man first.

Romans 5:6-10 "For when we were yet without strength, in due time
Christ died for the ungodly. For scarcely for a righteous man will one
die: yet peradventure for a good man some would even dare to die. But
God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners,
Christ died for us. Much more then, being now justified by his blood,
we shall be saved from wrath through him. For if, when we were
enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more,
being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life."

People would barely die for someone they know and love. They'd never
die for someone who was yet wicked and evil, and Jesus Christ did just
that!! Praise the Lord! As it says, we are enemies with God until we
get saved. His wrath abides on us.

John 3:36 "He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he
that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God
abideth on him."

God commits suicide to save us from his own wrath? I mean really.

You have completely misunderstood the scriptures.

Christ did not come here for the purpose that modern Christians believe.
This will set you straight.http://www.acim.org/

How can you be sure you're going to Heaven? Tired of the Hell already
here in a sin-filled earth? Here's God's plan of salvation:

[1] We must admit that we are sinners
Romans 3:10 "There is none righteous, no not one."
Romans 3:23 "For all have sinned and come short of the glory of God."
[2] We must believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God and bore the
punishment for our sins on the cross and rose from the dead.
Romans 10:9-10 "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord
Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from
the dead, thou shalt be saved."
Romans 6:23 "For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is
eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord."
[3] We must call on the Lord to save us.
Romans 10:13 "For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall
be saved."
John 1:12 "But as many as received him, to them gave he power to
become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name."

Nothing can oppose God's will.
Nothing can go outside of God's plan.
Therefore God must have planned for the Devil to destroy most of his
children.
The Devil is God's creation and employee.

God was most likely aware that some Angels would turn away from Him.
Satan was one of them. Hell is a place he created for them, and for
the rest of us that choose to follow the Devil and not Him.

"Choose me or my enemy" Is this all you think God is about?

How petty. You should be ashamed of yourself for reducing God to nothing
more
than a petty squabble master and divider.
How can love and jealousy come from the same source?
How can love and revenge come from the same source?

You haven't thought about any of this have you?

Like most Christians you just read and believe.

When are you going to educate yourself on the principles of spirituality?

Praise the Lord!

You Christians would praise anything that claimed to be all powerful.
You Christians worship power. That's ego.

No, we worship only God.

What is God to you? Power primarily. Power to crush your hated enemies,
which is practically everyone.

We love our brothers and sisters in Christ,
as is one of the commandments. We worship the one that clearly shows
he loves us, and his abundant mercy, and the mercy of Jesus Christ.
You continue to reject and act superior to an almighty God who created
you. What was that about ego again?

I don't consider myself superior to God, only to the Bible god character
which you worship.
Your god behaves like an angry teenager most of the time. He boasts about
love but then does the opposite and uses violence and threats to solve
problems. As we can see it hasn't worked very well yet. I wonder why.

Please think again about what I've pointed out here that God tells us
in the Bible.

How do you know what parts of the Bible is God telling us things and what
parts are just the written beliefs of men?
You do know that the Bible contains religious beliefs and traditions I hope.

We don't bring it up to make people feel bad, but to
help other people to be saved as well.

Saved from what? God's anger? What is he so angry about?
Doesn't he understand that we are in the process of evolving mentally and
spiritually?

The Bible charges us with going
out to spread the word:

Mark 16:15 "And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and
preach the gospel to every creature."

Although you did come to our newsgroup, rather than one that would
match what you're claiming: your hate for God.

I only dislike false gods.

--
Andrew W.

Jesus said that we must search everywhere for the truth, that we must
leave
no stone unturned.
How naive and foolish is the man who thinks he can get all the answers to
life from one convenient book. ~me

Romans 1:21-22 "Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him
not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their
imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing
themselves to be wise, they became fools," ~the Bible

Praise the Lord!

I think you just enjoy praising worshipping. It makes you feel more secure.

--
Andrew W.

Jesus said that we must search everywhere for the truth, that we must leave
no stone unturned.
How naive and foolish is the man who thinks he can get all the answers to
life from one convenient book. ~me

What we are told God and Jesus said, they did not say.http://www.divinelove.org/volume1/Mission.htm
TABLE OF CONTENTS. Must read!http://www.divinelove.org/revnt/Rev-TOC-title.htm

The true Creator wants us to be happy and abundant.http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Science_of_Getting_Rich
Audio version.http://website.lineone.net/~cornerstone/richaudio.htm

Think you know what ego is? Think again. The Bible is full of it!http://www.acim.org/

Religion Exposed!http://members.optusnet.com.au/~ajwerner