Religions > Bible > You won't believe it until you read it but atheists are encouraged to display dishonest tactics in their discourse, discussion, and debates. Here's proof...
| Topic: |
Religions > Bible |
| User: |
"Richard Dawkins" |
| Date: |
04 Jan 2006 11:09:09 PM |
| Object: |
You won't believe it until you read it but atheists are encouraged to display dishonest tactics in their discourse, discussion, and debates. Here's proof... |
How atheists are encouraged to debate
This book is published by Promethus - possibly the leading publisher in
atheistic literature. If you like reading stuff by atheists the chances of
having a prometheus book in your home is 99%!
Anyway, Art of Deception can be found in any major bookstore. It is made by
atheists for atheists and it encourages dishonest discourse, discussion, and
debate. Here are some appalling quotes from the book that speaks for itself:
Never admit defeat... Refuse to be convinced. Even if you feel that he has
a good argument and that your case is weaker, refuse to be convinced of your
opponent's case... There is one thing you should always claim no matter what
the opposition has said, namely, that the opposition has misstated your
case. No matter what the opposition has said, you should make this claim.
(p. 131-132)
Appeal to Ignorance... act as if you are absolutely right. Keep harping
upon the fact that some of the things you said, even if they are trivial,
are right and that the opposition cannot disprove your case. (p.133)
Quoting Out of Context. Like any other charge, this one should be denied
and continually denied. Keep insisting that the words you quoted are exactly
as you said they were, that is, you ignore the charge that you quoted out of
context and pretend that you were charged with misquoting. (p.138)
Inconsistency. If you are accused of being inconsistent, deny it! Deny it!
....there may be times when inconsistency is not a bad thing. After all, is
not a foolish consistency the hobgoblin of little minds? All right, then, I
am inconsistent. So what of it? (p.139)
Red Herring.... what happens if you feel that your defense has not been
strong enough or that there are lingering doubts in the minds of the
audience? At this point you should avoid sticking to the point... draw
attention to a side issue where you feel particularly strong. This will give
the impression that you are still in charge of the course of the discussion.
(p.140)
Ad hominem. Instead of attacking the specific points of an argument, you
attack the man... You tell your audience how someone falls into the trap of
believing such nonsense. (p. 148)
True by definition. You can always save your position by making it true by
definition. (p.151)
This shouldn't come as a surprise. Many atheists have been following these
fallacious tactics forever!
Art of Deception even takes its stab at Christian theism and states that
some believe that God exists just because the Bible says so (p.114). It's no
wonder many atheists use deceptions so eloquently stated in this book,
because even when they know they are wrong, they tell their audience that
they are right! Deception at last!
--http://www.geocities.com/atheismsucks/atheistliketodebate.htm-
--
~There are no true atheists in Christian newsgroups.~
~Science is infallible but those hiding behind it are not~
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| User: "Rob Naylor" |
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| Title: Re: You won't believe it until you read it but atheists are encouraged to display dishonest tactics in their discourse, discussion, and debates. Here's proof... |
05 Jan 2006 03:01:26 AM |
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"Richard Dawkins" <Dawkins@Hell.com> wrote in message
news:RR1vf.47$Va3.2832@news.uswest.net...
How atheists are encouraged to debate
This book is published by Promethus - possibly the leading publisher in
atheistic literature. If you like reading stuff by atheists the chances of
having a prometheus book in your home is 99%!
Anyway, Art of Deception can be found in any major bookstore. It is made
by
atheists for atheists and it encourages dishonest discourse, discussion,
and
debate. Here are some appalling quotes from the book that speaks for
itself:
<SNIP out-of context misquotes and lies>
You're right, I don't believe it. And 5 minutes of searching proves that
I'm correct not to believe it, as your post is a load of bollocks.
You appear to be quoting from Robert Morey's "New Atheism...." book of 1986
here. Which is a laugh, because Morey's "quotes" are in most cases made up,
paraphrases or mis-use of Capaldi's intentions in using examples. In fact
Morey (and you, by your uncritical cut-and-pasting of his inaccurate
comments) are engaging in precisely the sort of tactic Morey pretends
Capaldi is encouraging in his book. To quote John Nelson (
http://www.atheistalliance.org/library/nelson-dishonesty_theism.html ):
" And when Christian writers deliberately falsify records in order to
justify their beliefs, we are witnessing dishonesty of a most egregious
kind.
In my reading of Christian apologetics, I have noticed the last point in
particular more often than I can remember. Consider Robert A. Morey's 1986
book The New Atheism and the Erosion of Freedom. After complaining that
"some atheists deliberately use deception to refute theism" (pg. 87), Morey
cites Nicholas Capaldi's book The Art of Deception as "proof" of atheistic
deception. Morey quotes page 117 of Capaldi's book thusly: "Never admit
defeat... ". The only problem is that Capaldi never says this (or anything
like it) on this or on any other page. Morey has numerous other false quotes
attributed to Capaldi, such as: "Refuse to be convinced. Even if you feel
that he has a good argument and that your case is weaker, refuse to be
convinced of your opponent's case". Nowhere does Capaldi advocate, as Morey
accuses him of doing, that atheists should "use any invalid or deceptive
argument as long as it helps him (to) win his case". Morey concludes this
amazing series of lies and defamation of character by noting that his
examples provide "a small sampling of the 'dirty tricks' methodology that
seems to pervade modern atheism", and that, as a consequence, "my personal
experience has proven this makes rational debate with an atheist very
difficult".
Morey fails to mention that, in his introduction, Capaldi specifically
points out that he is writing the book "from the point of view of one who
wishes to deceive, mislead, or manipulate others" (pg. 12). His reason for
this novel approach is that he thinks it makes his readers more able to
recognize this strategy in others. While one may quarrel with this method,
ignoring it altogether and giving false, out of context quotes, as Morey
does, constitutes dishonesty of a most egregious kind.
However, Morey has an "out". There are no actual quotation marks on these
alleged quotes. Yet, they are separated from the main text and page numbers
are given, thus giving the appearance of being actual quotes. In addition,
the use of ellipses, as in the first quote, gives the definite impression
that the citation is an actual quote rather than a paraphrase. The "dirty
tricks methodology" that Morey attributes to atheists certainly apply to
Robert Morey."
I suggest you check the actual book and page references before simply
repeating Morey's rubbish as if it were fact...but then you creationists
rely for the spreading of your misinformation on the fact that most people
won't actually bother to reference the original sources, don't you? Go look,
I dare you. And then write a public apology to Capaldi. Why won't I hold
my breath for this, I wonder?
Rob
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| User: "Icarus" |
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| Title: Re: You won't believe it until you read it but atheists are encouraged to display dishonest tactics in their discourse, discussion, and debates. Here's proof... |
05 Jan 2006 04:04:32 AM |
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Rob Naylor wrote:
<Hell.com> wrote in message
news:RR1vf.47$Va3.2832@news.uswest.net...
How atheists are encouraged to debate
This book is published by Promethus - possibly the leading publisher
in atheistic literature. If you like reading stuff by atheists the
chances of having a prometheus book in your home is 99%!
Anyway, Art of Deception can be found in any major bookstore. It is
made by atheists for atheists and it encourages dishonest discourse,
discussion, and debate. Here are some appalling quotes from the book
that speaks for itself:
<SNIP out-of context misquotes and lies>
You're right, I don't believe it. And 5 minutes of searching proves
that I'm correct not to believe it, as your post is a load of
bollocks.
<snip>...
Let's be charitable and assume that 'hell.com' posted the original message
as a challenge to see who would be the first person to identify his example
of theist deception. You won, Rob - Well done :-) Looks like 'hell.com'
will have to try harder at being a 'liar for Jesus'...
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| User: "Richard Dawkins" |
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| Title: Re: You won't believe it until you read it but atheists are encouraged to display dishonest tactics in their discourse, discussion, and debates. Here's proof... |
05 Jan 2006 11:22:00 AM |
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"Icarus" <icarus_uk@email.com> wrote in message
news:42499jF1hccu3U1@individual.net...
Rob Naylor wrote:
<Hell.com> wrote in message
news:RR1vf.47$Va3.2832@news.uswest.net...
How atheists are encouraged to debate
This book is published by Promethus - possibly the leading publisher
in atheistic literature. If you like reading stuff by atheists the
chances of having a prometheus book in your home is 99%!
Anyway, Art of Deception can be found in any major bookstore. It is
made by atheists for atheists and it encourages dishonest discourse,
discussion, and debate. Here are some appalling quotes from the book
that speaks for itself:
<SNIP out-of context misquotes and lies>
You're right, I don't believe it. And 5 minutes of searching proves
that I'm correct not to believe it, as your post is a load of
bollocks.
<snip>...
You see folks,they really are huge bullshitters that believe even their own
*****!:-)
Present that "5 minutes of searching," because you see, you are a God-Hating
howler monkey that institutes lies as part of your daily regimen.
In other words you're full of *****.
http://www.geocities.com/atheismsucks/atheistliketodebate.htm
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| User: "Rob Naylor" |
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| Title: Re: You won't believe it until you read it but atheists are encouraged to display dishonest tactics in their discourse, discussion, and debates. Here's proof... |
05 Jan 2006 03:07:02 PM |
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"Richard Dawkins" <Dawkins@Hell.com> wrote in message
news:RAcvf.1107$uo4.498@news.uswest.net...
Present that "5 minutes of searching," because you see, you are a
God-Hating
howler monkey that institutes lies as part of your daily regimen.
In other words you're full of *****.
http://www.geocities.com/atheismsucks/atheistliketodebate.htm
That site has just copied the inaccuracies from Morey's book.
How about you do some original research yourself...get a copy of Capaldi's
book, check the pages referenced and then see whether they're accurate
quotations or paraphrases/ out-of-context misquotes.
*Then* come back and apologise to Capaldi and to everyone else reading this
thread for misleading them.
As I said last post, I won't hold my breath, though. The idea that you'd
actually bother to check whether your co-religionist's comments are accurate
or slanderous before you repeat them is a bit over-optimistic, I know...even
though it's been proved to you on several occasions in the past that you've
posted inaccurate quotes, or even quotes from non-existent people. No, much
easier for you to resprt to personal abuse than to argue reasonably.
Rob
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| User: "Richard Dawkins" |
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| Title: Re: You won't believe it until you read it but atheists are encouraged to display dishonest tactics in their discourse, discussion, and debates. Here's proof... |
05 Jan 2006 11:05:55 PM |
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"Rob Naylor" <rnaylor@itl.wellmunnged.uk.com> wrote in message
news:1136495219.25805.0@eunomia.uk.clara.net...
"Richard Dawkins" <Dawkins@Hell.com> wrote in message
news:RAcvf.1107$uo4.498@news.uswest.net...
Present that "5 minutes of searching," because you see, you are a
God-Hating
howler monkey that institutes lies as part of your daily regimen.
In other words you're full of *****.
http://www.geocities.com/atheismsucks/atheistliketodebate.htm
That site has just copied the inaccuracies from Morey's book.
<snip>
How moron...it's his book.
How can it be inaccurate?
What's inaccurate is your long stretch for credibility by making claims
without proof.
IOW-your'e another moron.
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| User: "Robert Weldon" |
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| Title: Re: You won't believe it until you read it but atheists are encouraged to display dishonest tactics in their discourse, discussion, and debates. Here's proof... |
06 Jan 2006 10:36:16 AM |
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"Richard Dawkins" <Dawkins@Hell.com> wrote in message
news:NUmvf.77$fj5.16193@news.uswest.net...
"Rob Naylor" <rnaylor@itl.wellmunnged.uk.com> wrote in message
news:1136495219.25805.0@eunomia.uk.clara.net...
"Richard Dawkins" <Dawkins@Hell.com> wrote in message
news:RAcvf.1107$uo4.498@news.uswest.net...
Present that "5 minutes of searching," because you see, you are a
God-Hating
howler monkey that institutes lies as part of your daily regimen.
In other words you're full of *****.
http://www.geocities.com/atheismsucks/atheistliketodebate.htm
That site has just copied the inaccuracies from Morey's book.
<snip>
How moron...it's his book.
How can it be inaccurate?
What's inaccurate is your long stretch for credibility by making claims
without proof.
IOW-your'e another moron.
Aaaand yet again, he misses the point. It's just Raytard proving to
everyone that he is still, indeed, a Raytard.
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| User: "Icarus" |
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| Title: Re: You won't believe it until you read it but atheists are encouraged to display dishonest tactics in their discourse, discussion, and debates. Here's proof... |
05 Jan 2006 11:29:14 AM |
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'hell.com' wrote:
<out-of context misquotes and lies>
Snipping the evidence of your dishonesty from one post won't erase it from
the Internet - It's there for good.
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| User: "Richard Dawkins" |
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| Title: Re: You won't believe it until you read it but atheists are encouraged to display dishonest tactics in their discourse, discussion, and debates. Here's proof... |
05 Jan 2006 11:04:09 PM |
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"Icarus" <icarus_uk@email.com> wrote in message
news:4253beF1hf9qiU1@individual.net...
'hell.com' wrote:
<out-of context misquotes and lies>
Snipping the evidence of your dishonesty from one post won't erase it from
the Internet - It's there for good.
Snicker~
My best argument towards the dishonesty of the God-Hating howler monkey.
Ignore the evidence when presented with it and then try to turn the tables
by presenting a Red-Herring.
Do keep the posts coming.
You are my best defense :-)
You stated out of context quotes and lies and I present you with a book that
is there in plain ol' black white and paper published by the largest atheist
publisher on the net.
Yet you present no evidence othe than sayin it is a lie.
I believe that is tactic no.2 that you God-Hating morons use.
And I qoute:
Never admit defeat... Refuse to be convinced. Even if you feel that he has a
good argument and that your case is weaker, refuse to be convinced of your
opponent's case... There is one thing you should always claim no matter what
the opposition has said, namely, that the opposition has misstated your
case. No matter what the opposition has said, you should make this claim.
(p. 131-132)
http://www.geocities.com/atheismsucks/atheistliketodebate.htm
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| User: "Icarus" |
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| Title: Re: You won't believe it until you read it but atheists are encouraged to display dishonest tactics in their discourse, discussion, and debates. Here's proof... |
06 Jan 2006 03:31:18 AM |
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'hell.com' wrote:
<out-of context misquotes and lies>
Snicker~
You've been caught out - it was an unwise post, and you should have
anticipated that you wouldn't get away with it, and you didn't. It was a
foregone conclusion that you were being dishonest, and now everyone can see
it.
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| User: "Denis Loubet" |
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| Title: Re: You won't believe it until you read it but atheists are encouraged to display dishonest tactics in their discourse, discussion, and debates. Here's proof... |
05 Jan 2006 02:03:04 AM |
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"Richard Dawkins" <Dawkins@Hell.com> wrote in message
news:RR1vf.47$Va3.2832@news.uswest.net...
How atheists are encouraged to debate
This book is published by Promethus - possibly the leading publisher in
atheistic literature. If you like reading stuff by atheists the chances of
having a prometheus book in your home is 99%!
Anyway, Art of Deception can be found in any major bookstore. It is made
by atheists for atheists and it encourages dishonest discourse,
discussion, and debate. Here are some appalling quotes from the book that
speaks for itself:
Never admit defeat... Refuse to be convinced. Even if you feel that he
has a good argument and that your case is weaker, refuse to be convinced
of your opponent's case... There is one thing you should always claim no
matter what the opposition has said, namely, that the opposition has
misstated your case. No matter what the opposition has said, you should
make this claim. (p. 131-132)
Wow, you've raised projection to a high art.
--
Denis Loubet
dloubet@io.com
http://www.io.com/~dloubet
http://www.ashenempires.com
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| User: "Opie" |
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| Title: Re: You won't believe it until you read it but atheists are encouraged to display dishonest tactics in their discourse, discussion, and debates. Here's proof... |
05 Jan 2006 08:11:52 AM |
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On Wed, 4 Jan 2006 22:09:09 -0700, "Richard
Dawkins" <Dawkins@Hell.com> wrote:
How atheists are encouraged to debate
This book is published by Promethus - possibly the
leading publisher in
atheistic literature. If you like reading stuff by
atheists the chances of
having a prometheus book in your home is 99%!
<snip>
If you'd cut and paste from the bible, you'd have
an even more bizarre scenario. Try it sometime
instead of attacking imaginary god-haters.
People who want to share their religious
views with you almost never want you to
share your views with them.
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| User: "Richard Dawkins" |
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| Title: Re: You won't believe it until you read it but atheists are encouraged to display dishonest tactics in their discourse, discussion, and debates. Here's proof... |
05 Jan 2006 11:15:44 AM |
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"Opie" <O_Taylor@MayberryRFD.com> wrote in message
news:k6aqr1h7i1o0bl14onq6r6kai6d7ij8ugb@4ax.com...
On Wed, 4 Jan 2006 22:09:09 -0700, "Richard
Dawkins" <Dawkins@Hell.com> wrote:
How atheists are encouraged to debate
This book is published by Promethus - possibly the
leading publisher in
atheistic literature. If you like reading stuff by
atheists the chances of
having a prometheus book in your home is 99%!
<snip>
<snip>
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| User: "Icarus" |
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| Title: Re: You won't believe it until you read it but atheists are encouraged to display dishonest tactics in their discourse, discussion, and debates. Here's proof... |
05 Jan 2006 11:27:11 AM |
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'hell.com' wrote:
How atheists are encouraged to debate
This book is published by Promethus - possibly the
leading publisher in
atheistic literature. If you like reading stuff by
atheists the chances of
having a prometheus book in your home is 99%!
<snip>
<snip>
Snipping the evidence of your dishonesty from one post won't erase it from
the Internet - It's there for good.
.
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| User: "Richard Dawkins" |
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| Title: Re: You won't believe it until you read it but atheists are encouraged to display dishonest tactics in their discourse, discussion, and debates. Here's proof... |
05 Jan 2006 11:29:39 AM |
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"Icarus" <icarus_uk@email.com> wrote in message
news:42537jF1h2jvjU1@individual.net...
'hell.com' wrote:
How atheists are encouraged to debate
This book is published by Promethus - possibly the
leading publisher in
atheistic literature. If you like reading stuff by
atheists the chances of
having a prometheus book in your home is 99%!
<snip>
<snip>
Snipping the evidence of your dishonesty from one post won't erase it from
the Internet - It's there for good.
And disregarding the evidence when slapped in the face with it won't erase
the fact that you're another God Hating moron.
It's written in stone.
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| User: "Icarus" |
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| Title: Re: You won't believe it until you read it but atheists are encouraged to display dishonest tactics in their discourse, discussion, and debates. Here's proof... |
05 Jan 2006 11:33:40 AM |
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'hell.com' wrote:
How atheists are encouraged to debate
This book is published by Promethus - possibly the
leading publisher in
atheistic literature. If you like reading stuff by
atheists the chances of
having a prometheus book in your home is 99%!
<snip>
<snip>
Snipping the evidence of your dishonesty from one post won't erase
it from the Internet - It's there for good.
.
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| User: "Richard Dawkins" |
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| Title: Re: You won't believe it until you read it but atheists are encouraged to display dishonest tactics in their discourse, discussion, and debates. Here's proof... |
05 Jan 2006 10:57:52 PM |
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"Icarus" <icarus_uk@email.com> wrote in message
news:4253jnF1gnp4eU1@individual.net...
'hell.com' wrote:
How atheists are encouraged to debate
This book is published by Promethus - possibly the
leading publisher in
atheistic literature. If you like reading stuff by
atheists the chances of
having a prometheus book in your home is 99%!
<snip>
<snip>
Snipping the evidence of your dishonesty from one post won't erase
it from the Internet - It's there for good.
You being a cretinous little ***** with an answer in alignment with the
evidential post that I presented are my best argument.
Dishonest to the core.
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| User: "Icarus" |
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| Title: Re: You won't believe it until you read it but atheists are encouraged to display dishonest tactics in their discourse, discussion, and debates. Here's proof... |
06 Jan 2006 03:32:08 AM |
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'hell.com' wrote:
How atheists are encouraged to debate
This book is published by Promethus - possibly the
leading publisher in
atheistic literature. If you like reading stuff by
atheists the chances of
having a prometheus book in your home is 99%!
<snip>
<snip>
Snipping the evidence of your dishonesty from one post won't erase
it from the Internet - It's there for good.
.
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| User: "bob young" |
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| Title: Re: You won't believe it until you read it but atheists are encouragedto display dishonest tactics in their discourse, discussion, anddebates. Here's proof... |
06 Jan 2006 12:03:13 AM |
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Icarus wrote:
'hell.com' wrote:
How atheists are encouraged to debate
This book is published by Promethus - possibly the
leading publisher in
atheistic literature. If you like reading stuff by
atheists the chances of
having a prometheus book in your home is 99%!
<snip>
<snip>
Snipping the evidence of your dishonesty from one post won't erase
it from the Internet - It's there for good.
He can't erase his god, as it was never there in the first place.
Sad isn't it?
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| User: "Icarus" |
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| Title: Re: You won't believe it until you read it but atheists are encouraged to display dishonest tactics in their discourse, discussion, and debates. Here's proof... |
06 Jan 2006 03:34:15 AM |
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bob young wrote:
Icarus wrote:
'hell.com' wrote:
How atheists are encouraged to debate
This book is published by Promethus - possibly the
leading publisher in
atheistic literature. If you like reading stuff by
atheists the chances of
having a prometheus book in your home is 99%!
<snip>
<snip>
Snipping the evidence of your dishonesty from one post won't erase
it from the Internet - It's there for good.
He can't erase his god, as it was never there in the first place.
Sad isn't it?
Yes, it's sad to see this 'hell.com' character persist in trying to support
a belief which is so shaky that he has to resort to blatant dishonesty to
try to defend it.
.
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| User: "Richard Dawkins" |
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| Title: Re: You won't believe it until you read it but atheists are encouraged to display dishonest tactics in their discourse, discussion, and debates. Here's proof... |
08 Jan 2006 08:17:50 PM |
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"Icarus" <icarus_uk@email.com> wrote in message
news:426rsrF1d2cf1U1@individual.net...
bob young wrote:
Icarus wrote:
'hell.com' wrote:
How atheists are encouraged to debate
This book is published by Promethus - possibly the
leading publisher in
atheistic literature. If you like reading stuff by
atheists the chances of
having a prometheus book in your home is 99%!
<snip>
<snip>
Snipping the evidence of your dishonesty from one post won't erase
it from the Internet - It's there for good.
He can't erase his god, as it was never there in the first place.
Sad isn't it?
Yes, it's sad to see this 'hell.com' character persist in trying to
support a belief which is so shaky that he has to resort to blatant
dishonesty to try to defend it.
You know whats you little sad howler monkey?
Watching you twist in pain.
Kind of like a train wreck full of clowns.
Fanny and sad.
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| User: "Tom" |
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| Title: Re: You won't believe it until you read it but atheists are encouraged to display dishonest tactics in their discourse, discussion, and debates. Here's proof... |
09 Jan 2006 09:36:59 AM |
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"Richard Dawkins" <Dawkins@Hell.com> wrote in message
news:jJjwf.25$BI3.819@news.uswest.net...
"Icarus" <icarus_uk@email.com> wrote in message
news:426rsrF1d2cf1U1@individual.net...
bob young wrote:
Icarus wrote:
'hell.com' wrote:
How atheists are encouraged to debate
This book is published by Promethus - possibly the
leading publisher in
atheistic literature. If you like reading stuff by
atheists the chances of
having a prometheus book in your home is 99%!
<snip>
<snip>
Snipping the evidence of your dishonesty from one post won't erase
it from the Internet - It's there for good.
He can't erase his god, as it was never there in the first place.
Sad isn't it?
Yes, it's sad to see this 'hell.com' character persist in trying to
support a belief which is so shaky that he has to resort to blatant
dishonesty to try to defend it.
You know whats you little sad howler monkey?
Watching you twist in pain.
Kind of like a train wreck full of clowns.
Fanny and sad.
Yes, it is 'fanny'.
.
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| User: "bob young" |
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| Title: Re: You won't believe it until you read it but atheists are encouragedto display dishonest tactics in their discourse, discussion, anddebates. Here's proof... |
09 Jan 2006 12:08:08 AM |
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Richard Dawkins wrote:
"Icarus" <icarus_uk@email.com> wrote in message
news:426rsrF1d2cf1U1@individual.net...
bob young wrote:
Icarus wrote:
'hell.com' wrote:
How atheists are encouraged to debate
This book is published by Promethus - possibly the
leading publisher in
atheistic literature. If you like reading stuff by
atheists the chances of
having a prometheus book in your home is 99%!
<snip>
<snip>
Snipping the evidence of your dishonesty from one post won't erase
it from the Internet - It's there for good.
He can't erase his god, as it was never there in the first place.
Sad isn't it?
Yes, it's sad to see this 'hell.com' character persist in trying to
support a belief which is so shaky that he has to resort to blatant
dishonesty to try to defend it.
You know whats you little sad howler monkey?
Watching you twist in pain.
Kind of like a train wreck full of clowns.
Fanny and sad.
It is notable that when someone discovers he is losing an arguement he
frequently resorts to name calling.
It demonstrates in a concise way that the argument has been well and
truly lost.
Oh and also that he is a little simple by giving the game away.
Try being honest dickie, it will work better for you - always does.
Bob
Humanist Brit.
hong kong
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| User: "Sanitys little helper" |
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| Title: Re: You won't believe it until you read it but atheists are encouraged to display dishonest tactics in their discourse, discussion, and debates. Here's proof... |
06 Jan 2006 02:49:04 AM |
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On Wed, 4 Jan 2006 22:09:09 -0700, Richard Dawkins wrote:
Never admit defeat... Refuse to be convinced. Even if you feel that he has
a good argument and that your case is weaker, refuse to be convinced of your
opponent's case... There is one thing you should always claim no matter what
the opposition has said, namely, that the opposition has misstated your
case. No matter what the opposition has said, you should make this claim.
(p. 131-132)
Appeal to Ignorance... act as if you are absolutely right. Keep harping
upon the fact that some of the things you said, even if they are trivial,
are right and that the opposition cannot disprove your case. (p.133)
Quoting Out of Context. Like any other charge, this one should be denied
and continually denied. Keep insisting that the words you quoted are exactly
as you said they were, that is, you ignore the charge that you quoted out of
context and pretend that you were charged with misquoting. (p.138)
Inconsistency. If you are accused of being inconsistent, deny it! Deny it!
...there may be times when inconsistency is not a bad thing. After all, is
not a foolish consistency the hobgoblin of little minds? All right, then, I
am inconsistent. So what of it? (p.139)
Red Herring.... what happens if you feel that your defense has not been
strong enough or that there are lingering doubts in the minds of the
audience? At this point you should avoid sticking to the point... draw
attention to a side issue where you feel particularly strong. This will give
the impression that you are still in charge of the course of the discussion.
(p.140)
Ad hominem. Instead of attacking the specific points of an argument, you
attack the man... You tell your audience how someone falls into the trap of
believing such nonsense. (p. 148)
True by definition. You can always save your position by making it true by
definition. (p.151)
This shouldn't come as a surprise. Many theists have been following these
fallacious tactics forever!
Thanks for the confession.
--
Eat, drink and be merry, for tomorrow, we eat, drink and be merry.
D Silverman FLAHN, SMLAHN
AA #2208
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| User: "Mr Baggins" |
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| Title: Re: You won't believe it until you read it but atheists are encouraged to display dishonest tactics in their discourse, discussion, and debates. Here's proof... |
06 Jan 2006 03:46:41 AM |
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On the basis of Dorkys refusal to answer my multiple posted question
and his response to people in this thread - I now think its pretty
obvious he is just trying to wind people up - he cannot be a real xian.
Phrases like you "ridiculous little carnival freak" say it all.
So folks - from now on - do as talk.origins does and...
_____________________
/| /| | |
||__|| | Please do not |
/ O O\__ | feed the |
/ \ | Trolls |
/ \ \|_____________________|
/ _ \ \ ||
/ |\____\ \ ||
/ | | | |\____/ ||
/ \|_|_|/ | _||
/ / \ |____| ||
/ | | | --|
| | | |____ --|
* _ | |_|_|_| | \-/
*-- _--\ _ \ | ||
/ _ \\ | / `
* / \_ /- | | |
* ___ c_c_c_C/ \C_c_c_c____________
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| User: "oldwetdog" |
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| Title: Re: You won't believe it until you read it but atheists are encouragedto display dishonest tactics in their discourse, discussion, and debates.Here's proof... |
04 Jan 2006 11:23:45 PM |
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Richard Dawkins wrote:
How atheists are encouraged to debate
This book is published by Promethus - possibly the leading publisher in
atheistic literature. If you like reading stuff by atheists the chances of
having a prometheus book in your home is 99%!
Anyway, Art of Deception can be found in any major bookstore. It is made by
atheists for atheists and it encourages dishonest discourse, discussion, and
debate. Here are some appalling quotes from the book that speaks for itself:
Never admit defeat... Refuse to be convinced. Even if you feel that he has
a good argument and that your case is weaker, refuse to be convinced of your
opponent's case... There is one thing you should always claim no matter what
the opposition has said, namely, that the opposition has misstated your
case. No matter what the opposition has said, you should make this claim.
(p. 131-132)
Appeal to Ignorance... act as if you are absolutely right. Keep harping
upon the fact that some of the things you said, even if they are trivial,
are right and that the opposition cannot disprove your case. (p.133)
Quoting Out of Context. Like any other charge, this one should be denied
and continually denied. Keep insisting that the words you quoted are exactly
as you said they were, that is, you ignore the charge that you quoted out of
context and pretend that you were charged with misquoting. (p.138)
Inconsistency. If you are accused of being inconsistent, deny it! Deny it!
...there may be times when inconsistency is not a bad thing. After all, is
not a foolish consistency the hobgoblin of little minds? All right, then, I
am inconsistent. So what of it? (p.139)
Red Herring.... what happens if you feel that your defense has not been
strong enough or that there are lingering doubts in the minds of the
audience? At this point you should avoid sticking to the point... draw
attention to a side issue where you feel particularly strong. This will give
the impression that you are still in charge of the course of the discussion.
(p.140)
Ad hominem. Instead of attacking the specific points of an argument, you
attack the man... You tell your audience how someone falls into the trap of
believing such nonsense. (p. 148)
True by definition. You can always save your position by making it true by
definition. (p.151)
This shouldn't come as a surprise. Many atheists have been following these
fallacious tactics forever!
Art of Deception even takes its stab at Christian theism and states that
some believe that God exists just because the Bible says so (p.114). It's no
wonder many atheists use deceptions so eloquently stated in this book,
because even when they know they are wrong, they tell their audience that
they are right! Deception at last!
--http://www.geocities.com/atheismsucks/atheistliketodebate.htm-
looks to me like you've been reading Dave's posts...
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| User: "cactus" |
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| Title: Re: You won't believe it until you read it but atheists are encouragedto display dishonest tactics in their discourse, discussion, and debates.Here's proof... |
05 Jan 2006 02:15:10 AM |
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Richard Dawkins wrote:
How atheists are encouraged to debate
This book is published by Promethus - possibly the leading publisher in
atheistic literature. If you like reading stuff by atheists the chances of
having a prometheus book in your home is 99%!
Anyway, Art of Deception can be found in any major bookstore. It is made by
atheists for atheists and it encourages dishonest discourse, discussion, and
debate. Here are some appalling quotes from the book that speaks for itself:
Never admit defeat... Refuse to be convinced. Even if you feel that he has
a good argument and that your case is weaker, refuse to be convinced of your
opponent's case... There is one thing you should always claim no matter what
the opposition has said, namely, that the opposition has misstated your
case. No matter what the opposition has said, you should make this claim.
(p. 131-132)
This sounds like you.
Appeal to Ignorance... act as if you are absolutely right. Keep harping
upon the fact that some of the things you said, even if they are trivial,
are right and that the opposition cannot disprove your case. (p.133)
This sounds like you.
Quoting Out of Context. Like any other charge, this one should be denied
and continually denied. Keep insisting that the words you quoted are exactly
as you said they were, that is, you ignore the charge that you quoted out of
context and pretend that you were charged with misquoting. (p.138)
This is more like Pastor Dave than you.
Inconsistency. If you are accused of being inconsistent, deny it! Deny it!
...there may be times when inconsistency is not a bad thing. After all, is
not a foolish consistency the hobgoblin of little minds? All right, then, I
am inconsistent. So what of it? (p.139)
You are so persistent and single-minded that I think you are conflicted
about of the things you rail against. You are, after all, the right age
for that.
I'm actually starting to worry about you just a bit.
Red Herring.... what happens if you feel that your defense has not been
strong enough or that there are lingering doubts in the minds of the
audience? At this point you should avoid sticking to the point... draw
attention to a side issue where you feel particularly strong. This will give
the impression that you are still in charge of the course of the discussion.
(p.140)
You substitute ad hominem for this one.
Ad hominem. Instead of attacking the specific points of an argument, you
attack the man... You tell your audience how someone falls into the trap of
believing such nonsense. (p. 148)
This is the most like you of any of them.
True by definition. You can always save your position by making it true by
definition. (p.151)
This shouldn't come as a surprise. Many atheists have been following these
fallacious tactics forever!
Art of Deception even takes its stab at Christian theism and states that
some believe that God exists just because the Bible says so (p.114). It's no
wonder many atheists use deceptions so eloquently stated in this book,
because even when they know they are wrong, they tell their audience that
they are right! Deception at last!
Impressive the way you project your own thoughts and actions onto
others. You lack the maturity to write such a text, but you are
deinitely a case study in its application.
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| User: "Mr Baggins" |
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| Title: Re: You won't believe it until you read it but atheists are encouraged to display dishonest tactics in their discourse, discussion, and debates. Here's proof... |
05 Jan 2006 02:46:31 AM |
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Also Dorky, WHEN are you going to ever respond to my questions about
the Dover trial????????
This is the most recent, most open, most public and best documented
"debate" between evolution vs ID etc.
Who lied, lied, lied and lied again ?
(1) The evil secular "no morals" (as you keep pointing out) brigade
or
(2) Our non-changing, non-gay "morals" are from god brigade???
Also - Who appeared to be evasive and whose house of cards collapsed?
(1) The evil secular "no morals" (as you keep pointing out) brigade -
who support the failing belief in evolution
or
(2) The people who are making "Darwinism crumble" (as you keep pointing
out)
When will you answer? Please lets talk about real events for once.....
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