On 2005-07-03, Rosena wrote:

I am reading this text about affective piety in the Fourteenth century,
mainly women saints, and their incredible erotic experience of Christ
in the context of visions and self-imposed suffering to mimic His
suffering on the Cross. They lick his wounds, feel Him enter their
bodies like a lover, marry him with his foreskin as a wedding ring and
so forth (there was a foreskin cult - this is one part of Christ's
flesh that is said to be left on earth).

Visions? or hallucinations? What's the difference?

There is a song by Madonna called Like a Prayer that had a video that
got people upset - it is wonderful - piety turned to erotic pleasure
which, in turn, is transfigured into piety. An intersection with the
most worldly part of us with the divine igniting a spark of
transcendence.

Are you sure you're not thinking about 'Like a Virgin'? That's not piety
portrayed in the video, it's self-pleasure.

DOES ANYONE know what I am talking about - does anyone come close to
seeing the face of God when they make love so intensely that the lines
are blurred between consent and ravishment, pain and pleasure, fucking
and lovemaking, etc etc.??

Is bliss the "face of God"?

This stuff is something. These women were grand. I wonder if any
sisters today come close to their saintliness and experience such vivid
erotic in their chasity??

Yes, but you won't find them in books nor much in academic circles.
They're contemplatives and most are either cloistered or in retreat.

Rosaries and practices like The Prayer of the Heart aren't for nothing.
You could see for yourself by doing a hundred thousand or so.

since the original post is a day or 2 old, you probably won't see this and
what I have to say doesn't really matter anyways, but from my point of

this sounds extremely odd. Of course I'm naive in many respects and not
very educated in historical, religious matters as you are. Would be
interesting for my brother who has his doctorate degress in history and
american studies with strong emphasis on religion due to our upbringing,
what he would have to say about all of this. But this all seems very,

odd to me, almost sacreligious......from my point of view and very

For me, and I'm only speaking for me, religion and sexuality aren't a good
mix.

since the original post is a day or 2 old, you probably won't see this and
what I have to say doesn't really matter anyways, but from my point of view,
this sounds extremely odd. Of course I'm naive in many respects and not
very educated in historical, religious matters as you are. Would be
interesting for my brother who has his doctorate degress in history and
american studies with strong emphasis on religion due to our upbringing,
what he would have to say about all of this. But this all seems very, very
odd to me, almost sacreligious......from my point of view and very tainted.
For me, and I'm only speaking for me, religion and sexuality aren't a good
mix.
"Rosena" <filpriros@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1120368359.870473.306240@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...

I am reading this text about affective piety in the Fourteenth century,
mainly women saints, and their incredible erotic experience of Christ
in the context of visions and self-imposed suffering to mimic His
suffering on the Cross. They lick his wounds, feel Him enter their
bodies like a lover, marry him with his foreskin as a wedding ring and
so forth (there was a foreskin cult - this is one part of Christ's
flesh that is said to be left on earth).

There is a song by Madonna called Like a Prayer that had a video that
got people upset - it is wonderful - piety turned to erotic pleasure
which, in turn, is transfigured into piety. An intersection with the
most worldly part of us with the divine igniting a spark of
transcendence.

DOES ANYONE know what I am talking about - does anyone come close to
seeing the face of God when they make love so intensely that the lines
are blurred between consent and ravishment, pain and pleasure, fucking
and lovemaking, etc etc.??

This stuff is something. These women were grand. I wonder if any
sisters today come close to their saintliness and experience such vivid
erotic in their chasity??

Rosena

since the original post is a day or 2 old, you probably won't see this and
what I have to say doesn't really matter anyways, but from my point of
view, this sounds extremely odd. Of course I'm naive in many respects and
not very educated in historical, religious matters as you are. Would be
interesting for my brother who has his doctorate degress in history and
american studies with strong emphasis on religion due to our upbringing,
what he would have to say about all of this. But this all seems very,
very odd to me, almost sacreligious......from my point of view and very
tainted. For me, and I'm only speaking for me, religion and sexuality
aren't a good mix.
"Rosena" <filpriros@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1120368359.870473.306240@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...

I am reading this text about affective piety in the Fourteenth century,
mainly women saints, and their incredible erotic experience of Christ
in the context of visions and self-imposed suffering to mimic His
suffering on the Cross. They lick his wounds, feel Him enter their
bodies like a lover, marry him with his foreskin as a wedding ring and
so forth (there was a foreskin cult - this is one part of Christ's
flesh that is said to be left on earth).

There is a song by Madonna called Like a Prayer that had a video that
got people upset - it is wonderful - piety turned to erotic pleasure
which, in turn, is transfigured into piety. An intersection with the
most worldly part of us with the divine igniting a spark of
transcendence.

DOES ANYONE know what I am talking about - does anyone come close to
seeing the face of God when they make love so intensely that the lines
are blurred between consent and ravishment, pain and pleasure, fucking
and lovemaking, etc etc.??

This stuff is something. These women were grand. I wonder if any
sisters today come close to their saintliness and experience such vivid
erotic in their chasity??

Rosena