| Topic: |
Sociology > Depression |
| User: |
"Indigo Moon Man" |
| Date: |
18 Jul 2003 03:43:29 PM |
| Object: |
France fighting back against freedom fries? |
France bans the term 'e-mail'
http://tinyurl.com/hcl3
.
|
|
| User: "alvintchase" |
|
| Title: Re: France fighting back against freedom fries? |
21 Jul 2003 10:33:28 AM |
|
|
"Indigo Moon Man" <indigomoonman250@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:<bf9m76$cv5vh$1@ID-70710.news.uni-berlin.de>...
France bans the term 'e-mail'
http://tinyurl.com/hcl3
It's certainly no more stupid then congress changing "french
fries" to "Freedom Fries".Congress acting like 5 years old is nothing
To be proud of,in my opinion./
.
|
|
|
| User: "Indigo Moon Man" |
|
| Title: Re: France fighting back against freedom fries? |
21 Jul 2003 10:40:05 AM |
|
|
On Monday 21 July 2003 09:33, alvintchase wrote:
It's certainly no more stupid then congress changing "french
fries" to "Freedom Fries".Congress acting like 5 years old is nothing
To be proud of,in my opinion./
I agree.
--
Subtract 250 to email me.
Online Bible Study Tools:
http://www.apostolic-churches.net/bible/
.
|
|
|
|
|
| User: "Alan Harding" |
|
| Title: Re: France fighting back against freedom fries? |
18 Jul 2003 04:37:34 PM |
|
|
In article <3f184b98$1_7@news.buzzardnews.com>, Joe User
<rot@inhell.org> writes
Chateau - building
Not just any building, a castle. The USA's too young to have them, let
alone ban them.
adeui - buh bi, won't be missed
With God. Interesting that you should want to ban this.
and
frommage - it's rotten cheese, forget the word, ban the product.
Not necessarily rotten, or even soft cheese. Frommage Frais doesn't have
an English alternative that I can think of. Reduce your options if you
want, though.
--
Alan@harding.demon.co.uk = Alan Harding =
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The opinions given above may be mine. They might also
just be what I feel like saying right now, okay?
.
|
|
|
| User: "IOStorm" |
|
| Title: Re: France fighting back against freedom fries? |
18 Jul 2003 07:21:18 PM |
|
|
On Fri, 18 Jul 2003 22:37:34 +0100, Alan Harding
<Alan@harding.demon.co.uk> wrote:
Not necessarily rotten, or even soft cheese. Frommage Frais doesn't have
an English alternative that I can think of. Reduce your options if you
want, though.
Reduced options? English is the language that offers the most options
on the planet. The sheer number os words in the English language was
no accident. It was the result of an Aristotelian drive towards
dissecting and defining things to an ever deeper level.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Thomas Dehn" |
|
| Title: Re: France fighting back against freedom fries? |
19 Jul 2003 02:17:59 AM |
|
|
x-no-archive: yes
"IOStorm" <noemail@noemail.net> wrote:
On Fri, 18 Jul 2003 22:37:34 +0100, Alan Harding
<Alan@harding.demon.co.uk> wrote:
Not necessarily rotten, or even soft cheese. Frommage Frais doesn't have
an English alternative that I can think of. Reduce your options if you
want, though.
Reduced options? English is the language that
offers the most options on the planet.
Certainly not. For starters, english has a very simple
grammar which makes the language much easier to
learn than, say, French, German, Polish, or Finnish.
The sheer number os words in the English language was
no accident.
The sheer number of words in the English language
simply is a result of
- English being a mix of German and Roman languages, thus
inheriting words from both sources; there frequently are
two words in English for the same item.
- English being the main language of large countries thousands
of miles away from eachother. Truck/lorry, flashlight/torch
et. al. add thousands of words to the english language, even though
in each of the UK, Australia, and the US only one of these
words will be in common use.
- English having a very simple grammar, thus creating a need
to express with different words what is expressed with
different grammatical constructions in other languages.
- English which its strong tendency towards short
words does not allow for creating new nouns by
putting together existing nouns, at least not to the
extent some other languages such as German do.
An example would be "cellphone" from "cell" and "phone".
There are no constructions in English such as
"Donaudampfschifffahrtskapitaen" from "Donau",
"Dampf", "Schiff", "Fahrt", and "Kapitaen".
Thomas
.
|
|
|
| User: "Whiskers" |
|
| Title: Re: France fighting back against freedom fries? |
19 Jul 2003 03:14:20 PM |
|
|
In alt.support.depression on Saturday 19 Jul 2003 8:17 am, Thomas Dehn
<thomas-usenet@arcor.de> wrote:
snip
There are no constructions in English such as
"Donaudampfschifffahrtskapitaen" from "Donau",
"Dampf", "Schiff", "Fahrt", and "Kapitaen".
"Danube steam navigation captain" (says babelfish - I suspect 'steam-ship'
would be a more suitable term than 'steam navigation' - which implies
digging a canal, in English).
Is there a different word for "Rheine diesel-ship captain (female)"?
English seems to keep that degree of precision for when it's really needed;
mostly, we'd say 'sailor' or 'river-boat Captain' for that.
English tends to construct 'noun phrases' rather than big compound words -
and the real difference is mostly in the way they are written down. "The
vice captain elect of the Veteren English Ladies' bias bowling team" is a
noun-phrase in English, and could be treated as a single word, as in "I
would like to thank the vice president elect of the Veteren English Ladies'
bias bowling team for her gracious letter accepting the proposed
reconstruction of the number two bowling rink at the rear of the public
conveniences in the High Street, work to begin on the third monday after St
Crispian's day next, weather permitting".
(Three noun phrases, and a few other bits). As we don't insist on a noun
phrase being welded into a single word with it's own entry in the lexicon,
we are free to make them up as we go along :))
Now, who would care to open the debate on the merits of splitting
inconvenient infinitives? Or using conjunctions to start sentences with
;)) <EG>
--
-- ^^^^^^^^^^ Interested in Citroens?
-- Whiskers <http://www.aacit.net>
-- ~~~~~~~~~~ <news:alt.autos.citroen>
.
|
|
|
| User: "Alan Harding" |
|
| Title: Re: France fighting back against freedom fries? |
20 Jul 2003 01:28:45 AM |
|
|
In article <vdlou-nqe.ln1@ID-107770.user.dfncis.de>, Whiskers
<catwheezel@operamail.com> writes
In alt.support.depression on Saturday 19 Jul 2003 8:17 am, Thomas Dehn
<thomas-usenet@arcor.de> wrote:
snip
There are no constructions in English such as
"Donaudampfschifffahrtskapitaen" from "Donau",
"Dampf", "Schiff", "Fahrt", and "Kapitaen".
"Danube steam navigation captain" (says babelfish - I suspect 'steam-ship'
would be a more suitable term than 'steam navigation' - which implies
digging a canal, in English).
Is there a different word for "Rheine diesel-ship captain (female)"?
English seems to keep that degree of precision for when it's really needed;
mostly, we'd say 'sailor' or 'river-boat Captain' for that.
English tends to construct 'noun phrases' rather than big compound words -
and the real difference is mostly in the way they are written down. "The
vice captain elect of the Veteren English Ladies' bias bowling team" is a
noun-phrase in English, and could be treated as a single word, as in "I
would like to thank the vice president elect of the Veteren English Ladies'
bias bowling team for her gracious letter accepting the proposed
reconstruction of the number two bowling rink at the rear of the public
conveniences in the High Street, work to begin on the third monday after St
Crispian's day next, weather permitting".
(Three noun phrases, and a few other bits). As we don't insist on a noun
phrase being welded into a single word with it's own entry in the lexicon,
we are free to make them up as we go along :))
Now, who would care to open the debate on the merits of splitting
inconvenient infinitives? Or using conjunctions to start sentences with
;)) <EG>
To boldly spilt infinitives whenever it is natural, or sounds better:
That's my rule. Sometimes not splitting is so affected that no sensible
person would do it. As long as the words work, and swapping the order
can change the meaning, do whichever sounds best, literally.
Can anyone read without trying to use the little voice inside for the
words? It's what makes the James' I Bible a much better read than the
modern ones - they have it on accuracy, but the KJB was designed to be
read aloud. I'm prepared to say that there are split infinitives galore
in it, too. It was only in the seventeenth century that the literary
blinkers came on, wasn't it, with the rise of Latinism, as I read the
story. You can't split a (single word) Latin infinitive, so you mustn't
split an English one.
Even Fowler has conceded them (1996) but says it was a nineteenth
century prohibition.
--
Alan@harding.demon.co.uk = Alan Harding =
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The opinions given above may be mine. They might also
just be what I feel like saying right now, okay?
.
|
|
|
| User: "Whiskers" |
|
| Title: Re: France fighting back against freedom fries? |
20 Jul 2003 01:21:29 PM |
|
|
In alt.support.depression on Sunday 20 Jul 2003 7:28 am, Alan Harding
<Alan@harding.demon.co.uk> wrote:
snip
To boldly spilt infinitives whenever it is natural, or sounds better:
That's my rule. Sometimes not splitting is so affected that no sensible
person would do it. As long as the words work, and swapping the order
can change the meaning, do whichever sounds best, literally.
Can anyone read without trying to use the little voice inside for the
words? It's what makes the James' I Bible a much better read than the
modern ones - they have it on accuracy, but the KJB was designed to be
read aloud. I'm prepared to say that there are split infinitives galore
in it, too. It was only in the seventeenth century that the literary
blinkers came on, wasn't it, with the rise of Latinism, as I read the
story. You can't split a (single word) Latin infinitive, so you mustn't
split an English one.
Even Fowler has conceded them (1996) but says it was a nineteenth
century prohibition.
I blithely break all the 'rules of grammar' without any compunction.
Wasn't it Churchill whp said "This is a restriction up with which I shall
not put"?
--
-- ^^^^^^^^^^ Interested in Citroens?
-- Whiskers <http://www.aacit.net>
-- ~~~~~~~~~~ <news:alt.autos.citroen>
.
|
|
|
|
|
|
| User: "Thomas Dehn" |
|
| Title: Re: France fighting back against freedom fries? |
25 Jul 2003 12:52:33 PM |
|
|
x-no-archive: yes
"IOStorm" <noemail@noemail.net> wrote:
On Sat, 19 Jul 2003 09:17:59 +0200, "Thomas Dehn"
<thomas-usenet@arcor.de> wrote:
"IOStorm" <noemail@noemail.net> wrote:
English is the language that
offers the most options on the planet.
Certainly not. For starters, english has a very simple
grammar which makes the language much easier to
learn than, say, French, German, Polish, or Finnish.
That flies in the face of the belief of most people who learn English.
Are you talking about native language English speakers,
rather than about foreigners? Easy to find your own language
difficult if you never had to learn any other. ;-)
The general consensus was always that English is extremely confusing
and difficult to learn.
Ask some people who learned several foreign languages,
not English as their only foreign language.
There are a few languages which are easier to learn than
English, but most are much more difficult.
French, Polish, German, and Russian certainly all are way
more difficult to learn than English. All of these languages
require the continuous simultanreus use dozens of grammatical
concepts which do not exist in English any more
(you can see some of them in ancient English texts).
There are only very few difficulties in English, and
among these the spelling is the only difficulty which
a foreigner really needs to learn. (However, French, Polish, and
Russian spelling are even harder than English spelling)
Just two examples about the grammar difficulties of foreign languages:
In English, almost all verbs are not conjugated anymore
expect for the "s" in the 3rd person singular, present tense:
I run, you run, he/she/it runs, we/they/you run
In German, this would be
Ich laufe, du läufst, er/sie/es läuft, wir laufen, ihr lauft, sie laufen.
Notice the irregular use of the Umlaut for 2nd and 3rd person
singular, but not for 2nd person plural. Roughly 50% of all
German verbs are irregular! And the past tense is conjugated, too:
ich lief, du liefst, er/sie/es liefen, wir/ihr/sie liefen.
(again, the past tense is irregular. If you go in detail through
the similar German verbs laufen, saufen, kaufen, raufen, and taufen
and all their forms, you'll notice that each on them is irregular
in its own fashion. In the end, to learn German, you need
to add a large hard disk to your brain to store all the irregularities)
In French, conjugation of verbs is worse than in German.
In Polish, in addition to the complex conjugations of the
verbs you must pick the correct verb among about a dozen
of possibly very similar verbs, each describing a different "aspect" of
the same activity, and sometimes the only difference will
be that between sz,ch,cz,szcz and a dozen other similar sounds
in Slawic languages neither you nor me can create correctly.
To top that, in Russian you will have to use kyrillic letters.
Similar to verbs, adjectives and nouns also are hardly ever declinated
in English. Nominative, dative, and accusative usually
will be the same, you just have to respect
the order of direct and indirect objects.
In German and French, adjectives and nouns are declinated through
three grammatical genders and four grammatical cases,
Polish and Russian offer three additional grammatical cases.
(Finnish has a whopping 16).
Thomas
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "" |
|
| Title: Re: France fighting back against freedom fries? |
19 Jul 2003 07:14:10 AM |
|
|
x-no-archive: yes
On Sat, 19 Jul 2003 09:17:59 +0200, "Thomas Dehn"
<thomas-usenet@arcor.de> wrote:
<(((*> - English which its strong tendency towards short
<(((*> words does not allow for creating new nouns by
<(((*> putting together existing nouns, at least not to the
<(((*> extent some other languages such as German do.
<(((*> An example would be "cellphone" from "cell" and "phone".
<(((*> There are no constructions in English such as
<(((*> "Donaudampfschifffahrtskapitaen" from "Donau",
<(((*> "Dampf", "Schiff", "Fahrt", and "Kapitaen".
Well, thank god for that! ;-)
Tara J. Ballance
Montreal, Canada
.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| User: "Alan Harding" |
|
| Title: Re: France fighting back against freedom fries? |
18 Jul 2003 05:39:17 PM |
|
|
In article <bf9qlq$r4a$1@peabody.colorado.edu>, Franz Bestuchev
<fbestuchev@n05p4m.userealsugar.com> writes
The french have always been nutty about their language. There's even an
official govt. dept to regulate it.
Ultimately though, it's futile. Just another French bureacracy... ;)
There's an Italian version too, I believe, and Russian. Makes you wonder
at all these countries trying to preserve their languages from
encroaching English, doesn't it?
--
Alan@harding.demon.co.uk = Alan Harding =
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The opinions given above may be mine. They might also
just be what I feel like saying right now, okay?
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "Criswell The Psychic Weatherman" |
|
| Title: Re: France fighting back against freedom fries? |
18 Jul 2003 04:51:44 PM |
|
|
Indigo Moon Man wrote:
France bans the term 'e-mail'
http://tinyurl.com/hcl3
Did you notice at the bottom was a link to "E-Mail story"?
Shouldn't it have said, "Courriel Story"?
--
"A belief is not merely an idea the mind possesses;
it is an idea that possesses the mind." Robert Bolton
Criswell The Psychic Weatherman
ssenate@mindless.com
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "IOStorm" |
|
| Title: Re: France fighting back against freedom fries? |
18 Jul 2003 07:15:03 PM |
|
|
On Fri, 18 Jul 2003 14:43:29 -0600, "Indigo Moon Man"
<indigomoonman250@yahoo.com> wrote:
France bans the term 'e-mail'
IT's nothing new. The Frogs have a long-standing policy of working to
prevent foreign terms from entering their language.
I recall hearing once what great linguistic pains the Frogs went to
create a Frog version of the term "Splash-Down" in the era of the
Apollo space program.
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "wombn" |
|
| Title: Re: France fighting back against freedom fries? |
18 Jul 2003 11:57:07 PM |
|
|
On Fri, 18 Jul 2003 14:43:29 -0600, "Indigo Moon Man"
<indigomoonman250@yahoo.com> wrote:
France bans the term 'e-mail'
http://tinyurl.com/hcl3
they've done this kind of thing for *years*.
"One world government", yeah right...
--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If laughter is the best medicine,
then kittens should be covered by our health insurance. :-)
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "Whiskers" |
|
| Title: Re: France fighting back against freedom fries? |
19 Jul 2003 03:19:36 PM |
|
|
X-No-Archive: Yes
In alt.support.depression on Friday 18 Jul 2003 9:54 pm, Thomas Dehn
<thomas-usenet@arcor.de> wrote:
The French try to replace all foreign language
words with french-sounding words. They have always been
doing this, there is no connection to freedom fries.
Which are and always have been 'pommes frites' in French; only Americans
call them 'French fries' (or 'freedom fries'). In English, they are
'chips' (except for the victims of Ronald McDonyank who are fired if they
dare speak English while serving out their durance vile).
--
-- ^^^^^^^^^^ Interested in Citroens?
-- Whiskers <http://www.aacit.net>
-- ~~~~~~~~~~ <news:alt.autos.citroen>
.
|
|
|
|
|
Related Articles |
|
|
