| Topic: |
Sociology > Depression |
| User: |
"" |
| Date: |
21 Jun 2005 04:56:58 PM |
| Object: |
people are so complex... |
It's interesting isn't it? I tend to overcomplicate things and
people.. sometimes it seems that maybe in some ways,people aren't as
complex as I think... but then I also think,in certain moods, that it's
all much more complex then even I think... it's hard to know...
certainly I've always been seen by some people as a really,really
complex person... which is how I like it,ultimatly,I think... I've
never really liked being thought of as a saint or a goody goody. But
then I've never liked insults either,or to be thought of in any number
of negative ways... I like the idea of being a 3 dimensional,complex
person... maybe it's partly in the nature of having severe
depression,hat you are naturally hard on yourself... that's something I
want to work on... We are all human, we all make mistakes... We all
have our strengths and weaknessess and struggles...I often see ASD as a
kind of journal or diary, a place to work out very deep issues... The
indepth book on the enneagram really helped me understand myself
better. I realized from that book that I'm an average to unhealthy
"4",that I tend to romantasize depresion,mental illnes,negative
thoughts and feelings... It's good to be introspective,to be honest
with yourself... but maybe it's not such a good idea to romantasize
dark thoughts and feelings,and ambivalence as much as I do...I just
always have the feeling that I'm,-and maybe everyone?-is just sharing
parts of ourselves...I felt that strongly at times in my
life,paticularly in 9th grade. I felt that I was just "borrowing" from
parts of myself. not that I was being phony,I don't think...but that I
just had to borrow from images,memories,feelings that I could
remember..I don't know...when you think about it,what good does it do
to romantasize dark thoughts,dark feelings,dark images? is it
necessary? Is it even more real then all the positive stuff,the positve
memories and images and events that happen in life? I don't know...I
guess I have to find someway to struggle against my natural
tendencies,temperament,history,habits and patterns...It's
funny,also,how when you focus on all the negaitive stuff,you really do
ignore and forget all the positve stuff....what good does it do to be
so hard on your self? Maybe the trick is to just be loving towards
myself as my therapist always tells me...
-"Alvintchase"
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| User: "Bev Thornton" |
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| Title: Re: people are so complex... |
21 Jun 2005 05:42:13 PM |
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On 2005-06-21, wrote:
I just always have the feeling that I'm,-and maybe everyone?-is just
sharing parts of ourselves...
Nothing more is possible. Only parts at a time can be visible, let alone
detected with accuracy.
when you think about it,what good does it do to romantasize dark
thoughts,dark feelings,dark images? is it necessary?
No good at all, it does harm.
Although it can entertain, the dark ideals remain.
Is it even more real then all the positive stuff,the positve
memories and images and events that happen in life?
No. Nor are they, really.
Romanticising that stuff does no good at all, either. The idealisation
necessary is guaranteed to produce dissatisfaction and disillusionment
when confronted with the actual reality of anything since actual entities
present as hosts of both positive and negative attributes, qualities and
effects. Events are the same, there are so-called 'positive' and
'negative' or 'beneficial' and 'harmful' or 'good' and 'bad' attributes in
or to any event. Romanticisation is exactly the process of ignoring
aspects of the whole in favour of a lop-sided, one sided, ideal.
When the essential problem is that only one side can be presented,
displayed or observed at a time (without use of a mirror, which is simply
a further complication), to do anything that limits awareness to just that
one side, or worse, to an idealisation of just that one side, say, the
positive side, is to surely miss the whole.
I don't know...I guess I have to find someway to struggle against my
natural tendencies,temperament,history,habits and patterns...
Does it have to be struggle?
What about trying to let go of them? There is not much struggle to letting
go. It's the opposite. Sometimes though, the trick is that what to let go
of and what you are struggling with that causes the hanging on to habit,
pattern, histroy and so on, are two different things (or more).
It's funny,also,how when you focus on all the negaitive stuff,you really
do ignore and forget all the positve stuff...
And vice versa. Just look at the writings from participants of this
newsgroup where they pine on about longing for past abusers to come back
into their lives. Not literally funny, but off the mark.
what good does it do to be so hard on your self? Maybe the trick is to
just be loving towards myself as my therapist always tells me...
Being hard on yourself can be useful when it is warranted and in
perspective.
--
<bevthornton@despammed.com> Support: <http://www.noborder.org/>
If it is harmful, avoid doing it.
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| User: "xmp" |
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| Title: Re: people are so complex... |
21 Jun 2005 07:14:59 PM |
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"Bev Thornton" <Reply-To@Not.Invalid> wrote in message
news:slrndbh5uq.6si.Reply-To@this.domain.invalid...
Romanticising that stuff does no good at all, either. The idealisation
necessary is guaranteed to produce dissatisfaction and disillusionment
when confronted with the actual reality of anything since actual entities
present as hosts of both positive and negative attributes, qualities and
effects. Events are the same, there are so-called 'positive' and
'negative' or 'beneficial' and 'harmful' or 'good' and 'bad' attributes in
or to any event. Romanticisation is exactly the process of ignoring
aspects of the whole in favour of a lop-sided, one sided, ideal.
it's all ***** in the end. words. nothing more. no actualities, no
reality, no nothing can be expressed in words without some hegemony.
everything is a cup of coffee and some converse.
m.
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| User: "Bev Thornton" |
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| Title: Re: people are so complex... |
21 Jun 2005 07:26:27 PM |
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On 2005-06-22, xmp wrote:
everything is a cup of coffee and some converse.
Here's to fine coffees and rewarding conversation.
--
<bevthornton@despammed.com> Support: <http://www.ifrc.org/>
Among those who are avaricious let us live without greed.
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| User: "xmp" |
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| Title: Re: people are so complex... |
21 Jun 2005 07:18:06 PM |
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"Bev Thornton" <Reply-To@Not.Invalid> wrote in message
news:slrndbh5uq.6si.Reply-To@this.domain.invalid...
Romanticising that stuff does no good at all, either. The idealisation
necessary is guaranteed to produce dissatisfaction and disillusionment
when confronted with the actual reality of anything since actual entities
present as hosts of both positive and negative attributes, qualities and
effects. Events are the same, there are so-called 'positive' and
'negative' or 'beneficial' and 'harmful' or 'good' and 'bad' attributes in
or to any event. Romanticisation is exactly the process of ignoring
aspects of the whole in favour of a lop-sided, one sided, ideal.
why does delusional thought usually go towards the negative rather than the
positive? very few people think they are the next Van Gogh or Einstein, yet
many are depressed, or think that the government is after them.
why aren't more delusions about happy go-lucky harmless stuff?
because there are evil spirits in the world. these spirits attach to
people. very rarely do you run into a happy unattached spirit.
Sagan asked why are schizos so depressed. well because there is a God. but
Sagan never believed in that. only the Drake equation.
seems to me the world is filled with aliterate technicians (Comp USA at
least).
m.
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| User: "bunny" |
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| Title: Re: people are so complex... |
22 Jun 2005 07:09:28 PM |
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"xmp" <xmp@example.net> wrote
why does delusional thought usually go towards the negative rather than
the
positive? very few people think they are the next Van Gogh or Einstein,
yet
many are depressed, or think that the government is after them.
why aren't more delusions about happy go-lucky harmless stuff?
My paranoid schizophrenic aunt thought she was a rich and famous author of
joke books. Her books had names like Humorous Chuckles. She was my
favourite aunt.
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| User: "Bev Thornton" |
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| Title: Re: people are so complex... |
21 Jun 2005 07:51:54 PM |
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On 2005-06-22, xmp wrote:
why does delusional thought usually go towards the negative rather than the
positive? very few people think they are the next Van Gogh or Einstein, yet
many are depressed, or think that the government is after them.
Maybe because there are other discomforts coincident with the delusional
thought and it is more difficult to construct a delusion of grandeur than
one of the many other types.
why aren't more delusions about happy go-lucky harmless stuff?
That stuff isn't considered delusional, popularly.
because there are evil spirits in the world. these spirits attach to
people. very rarely do you run into a happy unattached spirit.
What do you mean by 'spirits'?
--
<bevthornton@despammed.com> Support: <http://www.theirc.org/>
Always have a heart of great compassion towards all beings.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: people are so complex... |
22 Jun 2005 10:18:29 AM |
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xmp wrote:
"Bev Thornton" <Reply-To@Not.Invalid> wrote in message
news:slrndbh5uq.6si.Reply-To@this.domain.invalid...
Romanticising that stuff does no good at all, either. The idealisation
necessary is guaranteed to produce dissatisfaction and disillusionment
when confronted with the actual reality of anything since actual entities
present as hosts of both positive and negative attributes, qualities and
effects. Events are the same, there are so-called 'positive' and
'negative' or 'beneficial' and 'harmful' or 'good' and 'bad' attributes in
or to any event. Romanticisation is exactly the process of ignoring
aspects of the whole in favour of a lop-sided, one sided, ideal.
why does delusional thought usually go towards the negative rather than the
positive? very few people think they are the next Van Gogh or Einstein, yet
many are depressed, or think that the government is after them.
Well,with me,it does go both ways... I have always been called
"unique" and "special"...I read in this book that often when people are
called those things,they feel that since they are "special",they
shouldn't have the same obligations and responsabilities as
"regular","normal' people...logically,of course that's very silly....
but on an emotional level,I really,strongly related to that... but it
does go bo ways...my self esteem has always been very low,and my
insecurity very high-so maybe they are really just 2 sides to the same
coin....What I'm working on now is having high self esteem-knowing that
I AM special,but not more or less special then anyone else...
-"Alvintchase"
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| User: "CyberDroog" |
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| Title: Re: people are so complex... |
22 Jun 2005 11:07:35 AM |
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On 22 Jun 2005 08:18:29 -0700, wrote:
Well,with me,it does go both ways... I have always been called
"unique" and "special"...I read in this book that often when people are
called those things,they feel that since they are "special",they
shouldn't have the same obligations and responsabilities as
"regular","normal' people...logically,of course that's very silly....
but on an emotional level,I really,strongly related to that... but it
does go bo ways...my self esteem has always been very low,and my
insecurity very high-so maybe they are really just 2 sides to the same
coin....What I'm working on now is having high self esteem-knowing that
I AM special,but not more or less special then anyone else...
If no one is more special than others, wouldn't that mean that no one is
special? As the saying goes, you are unique... just like everyone else.
--
PREHISTORIC, adj. Belonging to an early period and a museum. Antedating
the art and practice of perpetuating falsehood.
- Ambrose Bierce
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