| Topic: |
Sociology > Education |
| User: |
"Alberto Moreira" |
| Date: |
20 Aug 2003 07:24:08 AM |
| Object: |
Re: Judge Refuses to Remove Ten Commandments Display |
Said :
I prefer the man who was the most directly involved with the entire
process, the Constitution, the BORs. That would be the 4th President
You want to talk about him?
I'd rather talk about the theorists who generated the document and the
political thought behind hit: Madison, Hamilton, Jay. Starting,
obviously, with a deep and dissecting analysis of the Federalist
Papers.
Alberto.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Judge Refuses to Remove Ten Commandments Display |
20 Aug 2003 12:58:27 PM |
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(Alberto Moreira) wrote:
:|Said :
:|
:|
:|>I prefer the man who was the most directly involved with the entire
:|>process, the Constitution, the BORs. That would be the 4th President
:|>
:|>You want to talk about him?
:|
:|I'd rather talk about the theorists who generated the document and the
:|political thought behind hit: Madison,
Bingo, Madison was the 4th President.
:|Hamilton, Jay. Starting,
:|obviously, with a deep and dissecting analysis of the Federalist
:|Papers.
(1) The Fed Papers were propaganda designed to counter the anti-fed
papers/writings and seel the people of NY on ratification of the
Constitution,
(2) Ultimately, you would not like what Madison or Hamilton had to say and
thought. Hamilton was very strong nationalist, (read in favor of a very
strong central government) central government and broad interpretation of
the Constitution
Madison varied from time to time from a strong nationalist to less than and
back again.
it was Madison that felt the PEOPLE nd the STATES were a far bigger threat
than the general government.
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| User: "Alberto Moreira" |
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| Title: Re: Judge Refuses to Remove Ten Commandments Display |
20 Aug 2003 07:21:04 PM |
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Said :
(1) The Fed Papers were propaganda designed to counter the anti-fed
papers/writings and seel the people of NY on ratification of the
Constitution,
Hello, Carol ? Are u there ? This is the hidden target I talked
about. It's a rather old difference of opinion, a capital one, that
surfaces every now and then when JAlison and myself interact. That's
one of the reasons I phrased my answer as I did, I was expecting the
reaction to surface.
Alison-san, your reaction is so predictable it's pathetic. The Fed
Papers were targeted as propaganda, yes, but they happen to contain a
very extensive and rather detailed explanation of the rationales
behind much of the Constitution, drawing from historical sources and
from the pragmatic realities of the international politics of those
times.
(2) Ultimately, you would not like what Madison or Hamilton had to say and
gubhtug. Unzvygba jnf irel fgebat angvbanyvfg, (ernq va snibe bs n irel
strong central government) central government and broad interpretation of
the Constitution
Both Madison and Hamilton said enough in the Federalist Papers, which
are, well, papers, written in a style and with an emphasis intended to
carry more weight than letters or personal communications. Also, they
were written BEFORE the fact, therefore, they're immune from the
political and judicial pressures that built after the fact. So,
propaganda or not, I know no better source of wisdom about the ins and
outs of the American Constitution.
Madison varied from time to time from a strong nationalist to less than and
back again.
it was Madison that felt the PEOPLE nd the STATES were a far bigger threat
than the general government.
I really don't care about their personal opinions, indeed, that kind
of thing changes with times. I do care about the politics behind the
document - how many times, Alison-dude, I told you that I care about
politics and not that much about legalese ? - and that's marvellously
expounded in the FPs, in different directions: Madison the theorist,
Hamilton the pragmatist, Jay the foreign relations expert. I'm also
very fond of John Adams, there's no revolution without a firebrand to
light peoples' fuses.
Alberto.
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| User: "Cary Kittrell" |
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| Title: Re: Judge Refuses to Remove Ten Commandments Display |
20 Aug 2003 07:22:45 PM |
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In article <3f4e0e3c.7259348@news.mv.net> (Alberto Moreira) writes:
<
<Said :
<
{...}
<
<>(2) Ultimately, you would not like what Madison or Hamilton had to say and
<>gubhtug. Unzvygba jnf irel fgebat angvbanyvfg, (ernq va snibe bs n irel
<>strong central government) central government and broad interpretation of
<>the Constitution
<
So, is this rot13'ing of sections of the post part of that mysterious
longstanding tradition between the two of you that you alluded
to in replying to Carol?
-- cary
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| User: "Alberto Moreira" |
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| Title: Re: Judge Refuses to Remove Ten Commandments Display |
20 Aug 2003 08:02:17 PM |
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Said (Cary Kittrell) :
In article <3f4e0e3c.7259348@news.mv.net> (Alberto Moreira) writes:
<
<Said :
<
{...}
<
<>(2) Ultimately, you would not like what Madison or Hamilton had to say and
<>gubhtug. Unzvygba jnf irel fgebat angvbanyvfg, (ernq va snibe bs n irel
<>strong central government) central government and broad interpretation of
<>the Constitution
<
So, is this rot13'ing of sections of the post part of that mysterious
longstanding tradition between the two of you that you alluded
to in replying to Carol?
LOL ! I got that too, it brought me fond memories of the Internet of
bygone years.
Alberto.
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| User: "SemiScholar" |
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| Title: Re: Judge Refuses to Remove Ten Commandments Display |
20 Aug 2003 12:18:56 PM |
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On Wed, 20 Aug 2003 12:24:08 GMT, (Alberto
Moreira) wrote:
Said :
I prefer the man who was the most directly involved with the entire
process, the Constitution, the BORs. That would be the 4th President
You want to talk about him?
I'd rather talk about the theorists who generated the document and the
political thought behind hit: Madison, Hamilton, Jay. Starting,
obviously, with a deep and dissecting analysis of the Federalist
Papers.
You'd rather talk about Madison rather than the 4th president of the
US?
Hmmm....
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| User: "Carol Lee Smith" |
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| Title: Re: Judge Refuses to Remove Ten Commandments Display |
20 Aug 2003 03:17:50 PM |
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On Wed, 20 Aug 2003, SemiScholar wrote:
You'd rather talk about Madison rather than the 4th president of the
US?
You read about Moore the individual giving the holy rock to Moore the AL
Supreme Court Justice, right?
Well, perhaps Madison was just as schizoid.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Judge Refuses to Remove Ten Commandments Display |
20 Aug 2003 02:09:20 PM |
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SemiScholar <noemail@spambegone.com> wrote:
:|On Wed, 20 Aug 2003 12:24:08 GMT, (Alberto
:|Moreira) wrote:
:|
:|>Said :
:|>
:|>
:|>>I prefer the man who was the most directly involved with the entire
:|>>process, the Constitution, the BORs. That would be the 4th President
:|>>
:|>>You want to talk about him?
:|>
:|>I'd rather talk about the theorists who generated the document and the
:|>political thought behind hit: Madison, Hamilton, Jay. Starting,
:|>obviously, with a deep and dissecting analysis of the Federalist
:|>Papers.
:|>
:|
:|
:|You'd rather talk about Madison rather than the 4th president of the
:|US?
:|
:|
:|Hmmm....
Alberto has laspes like that:
danger and comments, major blunder, other evidence of not knowing
constitution, etc
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=pkvnbvk2709e91d2sp6ijq4mj2pe5b0g0g%404ax.com&oe=UTF-8&output=gplain
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| User: "Joni Rathbun" |
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| Title: Re: Judge Refuses to Remove Ten Commandments Display |
20 Aug 2003 07:55:47 AM |
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On Wed, 20 Aug 2003, Alberto Moreira wrote:
Said :
I prefer the man who was the most directly involved with the entire
process, the Constitution, the BORs. That would be the 4th President
You want to talk about him?
I'd rather talk about the theorists who generated the document and the
political thought behind hit: Madison,
4th president
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| User: "Carol Lee Smith" |
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| Title: Re: Judge Refuses to Remove Ten Commandments Display |
20 Aug 2003 08:53:46 AM |
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On Wed, 20 Aug 2003, Joni Rathbun wrote:
On Wed, 20 Aug 2003, Alberto Moreira wrote:
Said :
I prefer the man who was the most directly involved with the entire
process, the Constitution, the BORs. That would be the 4th President
You want to talk about him?
I'd rather talk about the theorists who generated the document and the
political thought behind hit: Madison,
4th president
OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOH Albert!!
B U S T E D !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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| User: "Alberto Moreira" |
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| Title: Re: Judge Refuses to Remove Ten Commandments Display |
20 Aug 2003 07:06:14 PM |
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Said Carol Lee Smith <human@csd.uwm.edu> :
OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOH Albert!!
B U S T E D !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Carol, I phrased my answer for a reason, aiming to hit at a target
that I'm almost sure you don't know exists. I've been interacting with
JAlison for years now, there's much unsaid material that is attached
to a lot of our interaction, and some of it floats underneath,
invisible, like the bottom of an iceberg. So, I don't blame you for
getting the context, well, quite wrong.
Alberto.
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| User: "Alberto Moreira" |
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| Title: Re: Judge Refuses to Remove Ten Commandments Display |
20 Aug 2003 07:00:39 PM |
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Said Joni Rathbun <jrathbun@orednet.org> :
4th president
And a rather bad one, mind you. Theory and practise often part ways !
Alberto.
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