| Topic: |
Sociology > Education |
| User: |
"Dominic Torrazzi" |
| Date: |
13 Apr 2006 05:43:24 PM |
| Object: |
You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
If you need any evidence that the theocrats don't understand science,
statistics, or logic - have a read.
You bet your life
Posted: April 13, 2006
1:00 a.m. Eastern
© 2006 WorldNetDaily.com
When Judas Iscariot agreed to deliver Jesus to the chief priests on Maundy
Thursday some 2,000 years ago, he was betting that Jesus was not who He
claimed to be - the son of God. Judas' payoff was 30 pieces of silver.
However, that betrayal cost Judas his life. History has shown this wager was
against impossible odds.
Today, many are going against the odds and making that same wager.
Just what are the odds that Jesus was God's son?
Although, we will not know with absolute certainty until we die and are
confronted by our Maker, overwhelming statistical probability is considered
proof by the scientific community. For example, DNA evidence is often the
proof needed to get a crime conviction, even though the probability of a
match may be 1 in a quintillion (1 with 18 zeros after it) or one in 10 to
the 29th power if using a full profile.
Consider the proof in the Bible that Jesus was who He said He was.
The Hebrew Scriptures pointed the way to the promised Messiah and went into
great detail about His birth, life and death through prophecy. These
prophecies were made many years before Jesus' birth and the Dead Sea Scrolls
confirm that they remained unchanged.
Oxford scholar Alfred Edersheim compiled a list of 456 identifying
characteristics of the Messiah from these prophecies that were fulfilled by
Jesus.
Dr. Peter Stoner, professor emeritus of science at Westmont College,
calculated the probability of one man fulfilling just the major prophecies
with the help of 12 different classes of 600 college students. Then, he took
more conservative figures to the Committee of the American Scientific
Affiliation and had them verified using the data supplied in the Bible.
Stoner looked at these eight prophecies:
Born in Bethlehem (Micah 5:2).
A messenger was sent to prepare the way (Malachi 3:1).
Made a triumphant entry into Jerusalem as a king riding on a lowly donkey
(Zechariah 9:9).
Betrayed by a friend that resulted in wounds in the hands (Zechariah 13:6).
Price of betrayal was 30 pieces of silver (Zechariah 11:12).
The blood money was used to buy a potter's field (Zechariah 11:13).
Offered no defense at his trial (Isaiah 53:7).
His hands and feet were pierced (Psalm 22:16).
The estimate of one man fulfilling all eight of these prophecies was a
staggering 10 to the 17th power, a number with 17 zeroes after it.
In another calculation, he used 48 prophecies and came up with a probability
of 10 to the 157th power, an impossible figure to achieve without Divine
intervention.
Exactly what do these numbers mean?
Stoner gave us this example. Ten to the 17th power would be the number of
silver dollars needed to cover the entire state of Texas, two feet deep.
To help us visualize 10 to the 157th power, Stoner chose one of the smallest
known objects, the electron. An electron is so small that it would take 2.5
x 1,000,000,000,000,000 of them laid side by side to make a line, single
file, one inch long.
Space, according to some estimates, extends in all directions to a distance
of 6 million light-years. Dr. Stoner asked us to imagine a solid ball of
electrons the size of space. Now fit that space-size ball of electrons, into
a ball of electrons 10 to the 157th power. How big of a dent would our
space-size ball make? It would make a hole so small that it would not be
noticeable.
Remember, that number 10 to the 157th power represents the probability of
one man fulfilling just 48 of these prophesies and there were 456 that Dr.
Stoner and his mathematicians could have used.
Let us go back to the odds that one man could have fulfilled just those
first eight prophecies. Imagine that one of the silver dollars covering the
state of Texas, two feet thick, was marked in red fingernail polish. You are
given the task of walking throughout Texas, reaching down and selecting the
right one on the first try. Suppose your very life was on the line. Could
you do it?
Would you bet your life on that?
Of course you would not, but that is, in effect, what you are doing when
you, like Judas, decide to reject the tremendous amount of evidence that
Jesus Christ was the son of God and the only way to the Father.
Christ willingly laid down His life to pay the price for our sins in order
to give us the gift of eternal life. It is a free gift - yours to accept or
reject.
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| User: "rbwinn" |
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| Title: Re: You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
17 Apr 2006 08:19:20 AM |
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Curt wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
One of the things the Xtian dogma committees finally agreed on, and
enforce on pain of excommunication or death, eventually.
This doctrine did not come from any committee. It came from Jesus
Christ.
At least, that's what the committee says.
Jesus Christ was the one who said that no one would come to the Father
except by him. If you want to tell him that he is a committee when he
returns to judge the earth, that would be up to you.
Robert B. Winn
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| User: "Curt" |
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| Title: Re: You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
24 Apr 2006 12:09:42 AM |
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"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145279960.312146.284470@t31g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Curt wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
One of the things the Xtian dogma committees finally agreed on, and
enforce on pain of excommunication or death, eventually.
This doctrine did not come from any committee. It came from Jesus
Christ.
At least, that's what the committee says.
Jesus Christ was the one who said that no one would come to the Father
except by him. If you want to tell him that he is a committee when he
returns to judge the earth, that would be up to you.
No one that wrote the Gospels heard him say it though.
The committee decided, later, what he must have said.
Curt
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| User: "rbwinn" |
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| Title: Re: You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
24 Apr 2006 08:44:42 AM |
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Curt wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145279960.312146.284470@t31g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Curt wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
One of the things the Xtian dogma committees finally agreed on, and
enforce on pain of excommunication or death, eventually.
This doctrine did not come from any committee. It came from Jesus
Christ.
At least, that's what the committee says.
Jesus Christ was the one who said that no one would come to the Father
except by him. If you want to tell him that he is a committee when he
returns to judge the earth, that would be up to you.
No one that wrote the Gospels heard him say it though.
The committee decided, later, what he must have said.
So you are saying that you have a committee that decides what the
committee decided later?
Robert B. Winn
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| User: "Curt" |
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| Title: Re: You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
25 Apr 2006 01:32:17 PM |
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"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145886282.653027.183260@g10g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Curt wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145279960.312146.284470@t31g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Curt wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
One of the things the Xtian dogma committees finally agreed on,
and
enforce on pain of excommunication or death, eventually.
This doctrine did not come from any committee. It came from Jesus
Christ.
At least, that's what the committee says.
Jesus Christ was the one who said that no one would come to the Father
except by him. If you want to tell him that he is a committee when he
returns to judge the earth, that would be up to you.
No one that wrote the Gospels heard him say it though.
The committee decided, later, what he must have said.
So you are saying that you have a committee that decides what the
committee decided later?
I think what I'm saying is clear, at least to most of the kids in the class.
If you're having a hard time understanding it, that's a you thing, not a me
thing.
Curt
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| User: "Dominic Torrazzi" |
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| Title: Re: You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
17 Apr 2006 10:33:38 AM |
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"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145279960.312146.284470@t31g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Curt wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
One of the things the Xtian dogma committees finally agreed on, and
enforce on pain of excommunication or death, eventually.
This doctrine did not come from any committee. It came from Jesus
Christ.
At least, that's what the committee says.
Jesus Christ was the one who said that no one would come to the Father
except by him. If you want to tell him that he is a committee when he
returns to judge the earth, that would be up to you.
Robert B. Winn
No one knows what Jesus said. The authors of the bible lived more than a
century later and never met him, if he existed at all.
.
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| User: "rbwinn" |
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| Title: Re: You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
20 Apr 2006 01:16:48 AM |
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Dominic Torrazzi wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145279960.312146.284470@t31g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Curt wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
One of the things the Xtian dogma committees finally agreed on, and
enforce on pain of excommunication or death, eventually.
This doctrine did not come from any committee. It came from Jesus
Christ.
At least, that's what the committee says.
Jesus Christ was the one who said that no one would come to the Father
except by him. If you want to tell him that he is a committee when he
returns to judge the earth, that would be up to you.
Robert B. Winn
No one knows what Jesus said. The authors of the bible lived more than a
century later and never met him, if he existed at all.
Sorry, you are wrong about that. People who lived back in the time of
Christ were not controlled by edicts from you today. They were free to
do what they wanted to do.
Robert B. Winn
.
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| User: "Dominic Torrazzi" |
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| Title: Re: You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
20 Apr 2006 12:06:20 PM |
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"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145513808.477476.273590@j33g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Dominic Torrazzi wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145279960.312146.284470@t31g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Curt wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
One of the things the Xtian dogma committees finally agreed on,
and
enforce on pain of excommunication or death, eventually.
This doctrine did not come from any committee. It came from Jesus
Christ.
At least, that's what the committee says.
Jesus Christ was the one who said that no one would come to the Father
except by him. If you want to tell him that he is a committee when he
returns to judge the earth, that would be up to you.
Robert B. Winn
No one knows what Jesus said. The authors of the bible lived more than a
century later and never met him, if he existed at all.
Sorry, you are wrong about that.
Please feel free to prove that the apostles authored the books of the bible.
I believe what we are seeing here from you is what is called a conscious
disconnect because actual fact is butting up against your unprovable belief.
People who lived back in the time of
Christ were not controlled by edicts from you today.
What has that got to do with anything, other than it is a dodge so you can
avoid the question.
They were free to
do what they wanted to do.
Which has nothing to do with the fact that the authors of the bible were not
the actual apostles and never knew Jesus.
.
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| User: "rbwinn" |
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| Title: Re: You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
20 Apr 2006 11:50:04 PM |
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Dominic Torrazzi wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145513808.477476.273590@j33g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Dominic Torrazzi wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145279960.312146.284470@t31g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Curt wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
One of the things the Xtian dogma committees finally agreed on,
and
enforce on pain of excommunication or death, eventually.
This doctrine did not come from any committee. It came from Jesus
Christ.
At least, that's what the committee says.
Jesus Christ was the one who said that no one would come to the Father
except by him. If you want to tell him that he is a committee when he
returns to judge the earth, that would be up to you.
Robert B. Winn
No one knows what Jesus said. The authors of the bible lived more than a
century later and never met him, if he existed at all.
Sorry, you are wrong about that.
Please feel free to prove that the apostles authored the books of the bible.
I believe what we are seeing here from you is what is called a conscious
disconnect because actual fact is butting up against your unprovable belief.
People who lived back in the time of
Christ were not controlled by edicts from you today.
What has that got to do with anything, other than it is a dodge so you can
avoid the question.
They were free to
do what they wanted to do.
Which has nothing to do with the fact that the authors of the bible were not
the actual apostles and never knew Jesus.
The people who never knew Jesus were the university professors who came
up with these crackpot ideas of who wrote the books of the New
Testament. Written history shows that these books existed not long
after the crucifixion. The people who had them said, This one was
written by Matthew, this one was written by John, this one was written
by Peter, this one was written by Paul, as is also written in most of
the books of the New Testament themselves. So how is it that
pin-headed educators of today are supposed to know more about who wrote
them than the people who had them?
Robert B. Winn
.
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| User: "grandwazoo" |
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| Title: Re: You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
21 Apr 2006 01:50:16 AM |
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rbwinn wrote:
Dominic Torrazzi wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145513808.477476.273590@j33g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Dominic Torrazzi wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145279960.312146.284470@t31g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Curt wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
One of the things the Xtian dogma committees finally agreed on,
and
enforce on pain of excommunication or death, eventually.
This doctrine did not come from any committee. It came from Jesus
Christ.
At least, that's what the committee says.
Jesus Christ was the one who said that no one would come to the Father
except by him. If you want to tell him that he is a committee when he
returns to judge the earth, that would be up to you.
Robert B. Winn
No one knows what Jesus said. The authors of the bible lived more than a
century later and never met him, if he existed at all.
Sorry, you are wrong about that.
Please feel free to prove that the apostles authored the books of the bible.
I believe what we are seeing here from you is what is called a conscious
disconnect because actual fact is butting up against your unprovable belief.
People who lived back in the time of
Christ were not controlled by edicts from you today.
What has that got to do with anything, other than it is a dodge so you can
avoid the question.
They were free to
do what they wanted to do.
Which has nothing to do with the fact that the authors of the bible were not
the actual apostles and never knew Jesus.
The people who never knew Jesus were the university professors who came
up with these crackpot ideas of who wrote the books of the New
Testament. Written history shows that these books existed not long
after the crucifixion. The people who had them said, This one was
written by Matthew, this one was written by John, this one was written
by Peter, this one was written by Paul, as is also written in most of
the books of the New Testament themselves. So how is it that
pin-headed educators of today are supposed to know more about who wrote
them than the people who had them?
Robert B. Winn
I think you just knocked down your strawman, then appealed to their
authority for historic research. Take another look at the gospels you
mention. The titles are added for the purpose of chapter identification
in the NT. The gospels tell you whose gospel is being told, not that the
gospel of Mark was written by Mark, Matthew, Luke and John. The later
chapters of Paul's Acts, letters, Timothy, James and John's apocalypse
claim authorship. Peter 2 is doubtful.
.
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| User: "rbwinn" |
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| Title: Re: You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
21 Apr 2006 11:48:06 AM |
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grandwazoo wrote:
rbwinn wrote:
Dominic Torrazzi wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145513808.477476.273590@j33g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Dominic Torrazzi wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145279960.312146.284470@t31g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Curt wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
One of the things the Xtian dogma committees finally agreed on,
and
enforce on pain of excommunication or death, eventually.
This doctrine did not come from any committee. It came from Jesus
Christ.
At least, that's what the committee says.
Jesus Christ was the one who said that no one would come to the Father
except by him. If you want to tell him that he is a committee when he
returns to judge the earth, that would be up to you.
Robert B. Winn
No one knows what Jesus said. The authors of the bible lived more than a
century later and never met him, if he existed at all.
Sorry, you are wrong about that.
Please feel free to prove that the apostles authored the books of the bible.
I believe what we are seeing here from you is what is called a conscious
disconnect because actual fact is butting up against your unprovable belief.
People who lived back in the time of
Christ were not controlled by edicts from you today.
What has that got to do with anything, other than it is a dodge so you can
avoid the question.
They were free to
do what they wanted to do.
Which has nothing to do with the fact that the authors of the bible were not
the actual apostles and never knew Jesus.
The people who never knew Jesus were the university professors who came
up with these crackpot ideas of who wrote the books of the New
Testament. Written history shows that these books existed not long
after the crucifixion. The people who had them said, This one was
written by Matthew, this one was written by John, this one was written
by Peter, this one was written by Paul, as is also written in most of
the books of the New Testament themselves. So how is it that
pin-headed educators of today are supposed to know more about who wrote
them than the people who had them?
Robert B. Winn
I think you just knocked down your strawman, then appealed to their
authority for historic research. Take another look at the gospels you
mention. The titles are added for the purpose of chapter identification
in the NT. The gospels tell you whose gospel is being told, not that the
gospel of Mark was written by Mark, Matthew, Luke and John. The later
chapters of Paul's Acts, letters, Timothy, James and John's apocalypse
claim authorship. Peter 2 is doubtful.
2 Peter is the least doubtful book of the Bible because of what it
says. Not only does he identify himself as Simon Peter, but he
expounds doctrine that was offensive to any church leaders who were
drifting into apostasy.
The Apostle Paul also identifies himself in all of his epistles. James
identifies himself in his epistle. John identifies himself as the
writer of Revelations, but does not identify himself by name in his
three epistles. Jude names himself and says he is the brother of James
in his epistle. Paul did not identify himself in Hebrews, but he was
the author. That leaves the gospels and the book of Acts. Luke
addresses his gospel and the book of Acts to Theophilus, but does not
name himself by name. John identifies himself as the author of his
gospel by saying he is the disciple whom Jesus loved, which is the way
he refers to himself throughout. Matthew and Mark do not identify
themselves by name.
So now you seem to think that all Christianity is going to go into
severe doubt because you refer to some university professors of today
who speculate about authorship. It is not going to happen.
Rober B. Winn
.
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| User: "grandwazoo" |
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| Title: Re: You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
22 Apr 2006 03:17:05 AM |
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rbwinn wrote:
grandwazoo wrote:
rbwinn wrote:
Dominic Torrazzi wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145513808.477476.273590@j33g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Dominic Torrazzi wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145279960.312146.284470@t31g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Curt wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
One of the things the Xtian dogma committees finally agreed on,
and
enforce on pain of excommunication or death, eventually.
This doctrine did not come from any committee. It came from Jesus
Christ.
At least, that's what the committee says.
Jesus Christ was the one who said that no one would come to the Father
except by him. If you want to tell him that he is a committee when he
returns to judge the earth, that would be up to you.
Robert B. Winn
No one knows what Jesus said. The authors of the bible lived more than a
century later and never met him, if he existed at all.
Sorry, you are wrong about that.
Please feel free to prove that the apostles authored the books of the bible.
I believe what we are seeing here from you is what is called a conscious
disconnect because actual fact is butting up against your unprovable belief.
People who lived back in the time of
Christ were not controlled by edicts from you today.
What has that got to do with anything, other than it is a dodge so you can
avoid the question.
They were free to
do what they wanted to do.
Which has nothing to do with the fact that the authors of the bible were not
the actual apostles and never knew Jesus.
The people who never knew Jesus were the university professors who came
up with these crackpot ideas of who wrote the books of the New
Testament. Written history shows that these books existed not long
after the crucifixion. The people who had them said, This one was
written by Matthew, this one was written by John, this one was written
by Peter, this one was written by Paul, as is also written in most of
the books of the New Testament themselves. So how is it that
pin-headed educators of today are supposed to know more about who wrote
them than the people who had them?
Robert B. Winn
I think you just knocked down your strawman, then appealed to their
authority for historic research. Take another look at the gospels you
mention. The titles are added for the purpose of chapter identification
in the NT. The gospels tell you whose gospel is being told, not that the
gospel of Mark was written by Mark, Matthew, Luke and John. The later
chapters of Paul's Acts, letters, Timothy, James and John's apocalypse
claim authorship. Peter 2 is doubtful.
2 Peter is the least doubtful book of the Bible because of what it
says. Not only does he identify himself as Simon Peter, but he
expounds doctrine that was offensive to any church leaders who were
drifting into apostasy.
The Apostle Paul also identifies himself in all of his epistles. James
identifies himself in his epistle. John identifies himself as the
writer of Revelations, but does not identify himself by name in his
three epistles. Jude names himself and says he is the brother of James
in his epistle. Paul did not identify himself in Hebrews, but he was
the author. That leaves the gospels and the book of Acts. Luke
addresses his gospel and the book of Acts to Theophilus, but does not
name himself by name. John identifies himself as the author of his
gospel by saying he is the disciple whom Jesus loved, which is the way
he refers to himself throughout. Matthew and Mark do not identify
themselves by name.
So now you seem to think that all Christianity is going to go into
severe doubt because you refer to some university professors of today
who speculate about authorship. It is not going to happen.
Rober B. Winn
"all Christianity", no, only those who look objectively. It is not for
everyone and most cannot emotionally handle the information, until after
age 35 or so. The one thing that can be understood is that the literal
translations are problematic, and such as the NRSV are conformed to meet
dogma while hiding the problems revealed by more accurate translations.
That leaves the more general teaching of ethics and disbelief of the
miraculous.
But, first answer a question, please. Does the Old Testament (Covenant)
bind Christians?
.
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| User: "Curt" |
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| Title: Re: You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
26 Apr 2006 11:34:21 AM |
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"grandwazoo" <grand@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:1145698475.664180@news.commspeed.net...
"all Christianity", no, only those who look objectively. It is not for
everyone and most cannot emotionally handle the information, until after
age 35 or so. The one thing that can be understood is that the literal
translations are problematic, and such as the NRSV are conformed to meet
dogma while hiding the problems revealed by more accurate translations.
That leaves the more general teaching of ethics and disbelief of the
miraculous.
Oh, I dunno about that. Kids learn physics in high school. No reason they
couldn't learn theology too.
But, first answer a question, please. Does the Old Testament (Covenant)
bind Christians?
"The Law Is Dead."
Curt
.
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| User: "rbwinn" |
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| Title: Re: You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
23 Apr 2006 09:42:46 AM |
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grandwazoo wrote:
rbwinn wrote:
grandwazoo wrote:
rbwinn wrote:
Dominic Torrazzi wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145513808.477476.273590@j33g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Dominic Torrazzi wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145279960.312146.284470@t31g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Curt wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
One of the things the Xtian dogma committees finally agreed on,
and
enforce on pain of excommunication or death, eventually.
This doctrine did not come from any committee. It came from Jesus
Christ.
At least, that's what the committee says.
Jesus Christ was the one who said that no one would come to the Father
except by him. If you want to tell him that he is a committee when he
returns to judge the earth, that would be up to you.
Robert B. Winn
No one knows what Jesus said. The authors of the bible lived more than a
century later and never met him, if he existed at all.
Sorry, you are wrong about that.
Please feel free to prove that the apostles authored the books of the bible.
I believe what we are seeing here from you is what is called a conscious
disconnect because actual fact is butting up against your unprovable belief.
People who lived back in the time of
Christ were not controlled by edicts from you today.
What has that got to do with anything, other than it is a dodge so you can
avoid the question.
They were free to
do what they wanted to do.
Which has nothing to do with the fact that the authors of the bible were not
the actual apostles and never knew Jesus.
The people who never knew Jesus were the university professors who came
up with these crackpot ideas of who wrote the books of the New
Testament. Written history shows that these books existed not long
after the crucifixion. The people who had them said, This one was
written by Matthew, this one was written by John, this one was written
by Peter, this one was written by Paul, as is also written in most of
the books of the New Testament themselves. So how is it that
pin-headed educators of today are supposed to know more about who wrote
them than the people who had them?
Robert B. Winn
I think you just knocked down your strawman, then appealed to their
authority for historic research. Take another look at the gospels you
mention. The titles are added for the purpose of chapter identification
in the NT. The gospels tell you whose gospel is being told, not that the
gospel of Mark was written by Mark, Matthew, Luke and John. The later
chapters of Paul's Acts, letters, Timothy, James and John's apocalypse
claim authorship. Peter 2 is doubtful.
2 Peter is the least doubtful book of the Bible because of what it
says. Not only does he identify himself as Simon Peter, but he
expounds doctrine that was offensive to any church leaders who were
drifting into apostasy.
The Apostle Paul also identifies himself in all of his epistles. James
identifies himself in his epistle. John identifies himself as the
writer of Revelations, but does not identify himself by name in his
three epistles. Jude names himself and says he is the brother of James
in his epistle. Paul did not identify himself in Hebrews, but he was
the author. That leaves the gospels and the book of Acts. Luke
addresses his gospel and the book of Acts to Theophilus, but does not
name himself by name. John identifies himself as the author of his
gospel by saying he is the disciple whom Jesus loved, which is the way
he refers to himself throughout. Matthew and Mark do not identify
themselves by name.
So now you seem to think that all Christianity is going to go into
severe doubt because you refer to some university professors of today
who speculate about authorship. It is not going to happen.
Rober B. Winn
"all Christianity", no, only those who look objectively. It is not for
everyone and most cannot emotionally handle the information, until after
age 35 or so. The one thing that can be understood is that the literal
translations are problematic, and such as the NRSV are conformed to meet
dogma while hiding the problems revealed by more accurate translations.
That leaves the more general teaching of ethics and disbelief of the
miraculous.
But, first answer a question, please. Does the Old Testament (Covenant)
bind Christians?
A covenant is an agreement between two parties, in this case between
believers in Christ and God. In the Old Testament, God made a covenant
with Adam, with Noah, with Abraham, etc., that if they and their
posterity would obey Him, then He would give them certain blessings.
They broke the covenant at Mt. Sinai when they worshipped the golden
calf. God renewed the covenant through the Law of Moses, which was a
schoolmaster to bring them to the law of Christ. Once the Atonement of
Christ was accomplished, it was called the New and Everlasting Covenant
because it will be in effect eternally. The Law of Christ fulfills all
previous laws and contains all previous covenants. The Law of Christ
only has two commandments, Love the Lord thy God, and love thy neighbor
as thyself. Anything promised in any Old Testament covenant can be
obtained by obedience to the Law of Christ.
Robert B. Winn
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| User: "rbwinn" |
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| Title: Re: You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
01 May 2006 12:33:08 PM |
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grandwazoo wrote:
rbwinn wrote:
grandwazoo wrote:
rbwinn wrote:
Dominic Torrazzi wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145513808.477476.273590@j33g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Dominic Torrazzi wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145279960.312146.284470@t31g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Curt wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
One of the things the Xtian dogma committees finally agreed on,
and
enforce on pain of excommunication or death, eventually.
This doctrine did not come from any committee. It came from Jesus
Christ.
At least, that's what the committee says.
Jesus Christ was the one who said that no one would come to the Father
except by him. If you want to tell him that he is a committee when he
returns to judge the earth, that would be up to you.
Robert B. Winn
No one knows what Jesus said. The authors of the bible lived more than a
century later and never met him, if he existed at all.
Sorry, you are wrong about that.
Please feel free to prove that the apostles authored the books of the bible.
I believe what we are seeing here from you is what is called a conscious
disconnect because actual fact is butting up against your unprovable belief.
People who lived back in the time of
Christ were not controlled by edicts from you today.
What has that got to do with anything, other than it is a dodge so you can
avoid the question.
They were free to
do what they wanted to do.
Which has nothing to do with the fact that the authors of the bible were not
the actual apostles and never knew Jesus.
The people who never knew Jesus were the university professors who came
up with these crackpot ideas of who wrote the books of the New
Testament. Written history shows that these books existed not long
after the crucifixion. The people who had them said, This one was
written by Matthew, this one was written by John, this one was written
by Peter, this one was written by Paul, as is also written in most of
the books of the New Testament themselves. So how is it that
pin-headed educators of today are supposed to know more about who wrote
them than the people who had them?
Robert B. Winn
I think you just knocked down your strawman, then appealed to their
authority for historic research. Take another look at the gospels you
mention. The titles are added for the purpose of chapter identification
in the NT. The gospels tell you whose gospel is being told, not that the
gospel of Mark was written by Mark, Matthew, Luke and John. The later
chapters of Paul's Acts, letters, Timothy, James and John's apocalypse
claim authorship. Peter 2 is doubtful.
2 Peter is the least doubtful book of the Bible because of what it
says. Not only does he identify himself as Simon Peter, but he
expounds doctrine that was offensive to any church leaders who were
drifting into apostasy.
The Apostle Paul also identifies himself in all of his epistles. James
identifies himself in his epistle. John identifies himself as the
writer of Revelations, but does not identify himself by name in his
three epistles. Jude names himself and says he is the brother of James
in his epistle. Paul did not identify himself in Hebrews, but he was
the author. That leaves the gospels and the book of Acts. Luke
addresses his gospel and the book of Acts to Theophilus, but does not
name himself by name. John identifies himself as the author of his
gospel by saying he is the disciple whom Jesus loved, which is the way
he refers to himself throughout. Matthew and Mark do not identify
themselves by name.
So now you seem to think that all Christianity is going to go into
severe doubt because you refer to some university professors of today
who speculate about authorship. It is not going to happen.
Rober B. Winn
"all Christianity", no, only those who look objectively. It is not for
everyone and most cannot emotionally handle the information, until after
age 35 or so. The one thing that can be understood is that the literal
translations are problematic, and such as the NRSV are conformed to meet
dogma while hiding the problems revealed by more accurate translations.
That leaves the more general teaching of ethics and disbelief of the
miraculous.
But, first answer a question, please. Does the Old Testament (Covenant)
bind Christians?
All covenants made in the Old Testament are still available to people
on earth today through the New and Everlasting Covenant of the
Atonement of Christ. A covenant is an agreement between two parties,
in this case between God and men.
Robert B. Winn
.
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| User: "gatt" |
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| Title: Re: You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
20 Apr 2006 12:45:46 PM |
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"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145513808.477476.273590@j33g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Sorry, you are wrong about that. People who lived back in the time of
Christ were not controlled by edicts from you today. They were free to
do what they wanted to do.
HAA HAHAHA. HAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHA!!! PEOPLE WHO LIVED IN THE RULE OF THE
ROMAN EMPIRE WERE FREE TO DO WHAT THEY WANTED TO DO.
HAA HAHAHAHA. Like practice religion? APPARENTLY PEOPLE -WANTED- TO
BE CRUCIFIED BY THE ROMANS AND SHREDDED ALIVE FOR THEIR ENTERTAINMENT.
They should built monuments to that great guardian of freedom, Tiberius
Caesar!
-c
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| User: "rbwinn" |
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| Title: Re: You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
17 Apr 2006 01:04:50 PM |
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Dominic Torrazzi wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145279960.312146.284470@t31g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Curt wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
One of the things the Xtian dogma committees finally agreed on, and
enforce on pain of excommunication or death, eventually.
This doctrine did not come from any committee. It came from Jesus
Christ.
At least, that's what the committee says.
Jesus Christ was the one who said that no one would come to the Father
except by him. If you want to tell him that he is a committee when he
returns to judge the earth, that would be up to you.
Robert B. Winn
No one knows what Jesus said. The authors of the bible lived more than a
century later and never met him, if he existed at all.
The Apostle Peter lived at the same time Jesus did. 2 Peter 1:16 For
we have not followed cunningly devised fables when we made known unto
you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were
eyewitnesses.
Robert B. Winn
.
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| User: "Curt" |
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| Title: Re: You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
26 Apr 2006 11:27:07 AM |
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"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145297090.676229.81500@j33g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Dominic Torrazzi wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145279960.312146.284470@t31g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Curt wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
One of the things the Xtian dogma committees finally agreed on,
and
enforce on pain of excommunication or death, eventually.
This doctrine did not come from any committee. It came from Jesus
Christ.
At least, that's what the committee says.
Jesus Christ was the one who said that no one would come to the Father
except by him. If you want to tell him that he is a committee when he
returns to judge the earth, that would be up to you.
Robert B. Winn
No one knows what Jesus said. The authors of the bible lived more than a
century later and never met him, if he existed at all.
The Apostle Peter lived at the same time Jesus did. 2 Peter 1:16 For
we have not followed cunningly devised fables when we made known unto
you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were
eyewitnesses.
Maybe, and maybe not. But you notice there's no Gospel of Peter.
Curt
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
27 Apr 2006 07:39:03 PM |
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Curt wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145297090.676229.81500@j33g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Dominic Torrazzi wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145279960.312146.284470@t31g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Curt wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
One of the things the Xtian dogma committees finally agreed on,
and
enforce on pain of excommunication or death, eventually.
This doctrine did not come from any committee. It came from Jesus
Christ.
At least, that's what the committee says.
Jesus Christ was the one who said that no one would come to the Father
except by him. If you want to tell him that he is a committee when he
returns to judge the earth, that would be up to you.
Robert B. Winn
No one knows what Jesus said. The authors of the bible lived more than a
century later and never met him, if he existed at all.
The Apostle Peter lived at the same time Jesus did. 2 Peter 1:16 For
we have not followed cunningly devised fables when we made known unto
you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were
eyewitnesses.
Maybe, and maybe not. But you notice there's no Gospel of Peter.
There are two epistles of Peter. That was not all he wrote, but that
is all we have of his writings in the Bible.
Robert B. Winn
.
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| User: "Dominic Torrazzi" |
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| Title: Re: You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
17 Apr 2006 02:26:47 PM |
|
|
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145297090.676229.81500@j33g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Dominic Torrazzi wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145279960.312146.284470@t31g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Curt wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
One of the things the Xtian dogma committees finally agreed on,
and
enforce on pain of excommunication or death, eventually.
This doctrine did not come from any committee. It came from Jesus
Christ.
At least, that's what the committee says.
Jesus Christ was the one who said that no one would come to the Father
except by him. If you want to tell him that he is a committee when he
returns to judge the earth, that would be up to you.
Robert B. Winn
No one knows what Jesus said. The authors of the bible lived more than a
century later and never met him, if he existed at all.
The Apostle Peter lived at the same time Jesus did. 2 Peter 1:16 For
we have not followed cunningly devised fables when we made known unto
you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were
eyewitnesses.
Modern scholars are skeptical that the apostle Simon Peter actually wrote it
because of the style of the Greek it was written in. It also lacks any
personal detail suggesting contact with the historical Jesus of Nazareth.
All of Peter's references to the Old Testament come from the Septuagint (a
Greek translation created at Alexandria for the use of those Jews who could
not easily read the Hebrew and Aramaic) an unlikely source for historical
Peter the apostle. The historical Simon Peter in Galilee would not have
heard Scripture in this form.
.
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| User: "rbwinn" |
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| Title: Re: You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
18 Apr 2006 08:55:36 AM |
|
|
Dominic Torrazzi wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145297090.676229.81500@j33g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Dominic Torrazzi wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145279960.312146.284470@t31g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Curt wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
One of the things the Xtian dogma committees finally agreed on,
and
enforce on pain of excommunication or death, eventually.
This doctrine did not come from any committee. It came from Jesus
Christ.
At least, that's what the committee says.
Jesus Christ was the one who said that no one would come to the Father
except by him. If you want to tell him that he is a committee when he
returns to judge the earth, that would be up to you.
Robert B. Winn
No one knows what Jesus said. The authors of the bible lived more than a
century later and never met him, if he existed at all.
The Apostle Peter lived at the same time Jesus did. 2 Peter 1:16 For
we have not followed cunningly devised fables when we made known unto
you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were
eyewitnesses.
Modern scholars are skeptical that the apostle Simon Peter actually wrote it
because of the style of the Greek it was written in. It also lacks any
personal detail suggesting contact with the historical Jesus of Nazareth.
All of Peter's references to the Old Testament come from the Septuagint (a
Greek translation created at Alexandria for the use of those Jews who could
not easily read the Hebrew and Aramaic) an unlikely source for historical
Peter the apostle. The historical Simon Peter in Galilee would not have
heard Scripture in this form.
Well, aren't you cute? The only thing that matters is whether or not
Peter wrote it, which he did.
Robert B. Winn
.
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| User: "gatt" |
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| Title: Re: You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
18 Apr 2006 12:01:05 PM |
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"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145368536.386070.47060@z34g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
Modern scholars are skeptical that the apostle Simon Peter actually wrote
it
because of the style of the Greek it was written in. It also lacks any
personal detail suggesting contact with the historical Jesus of Nazareth.
All of Peter's references to the Old Testament come from the Septuagint
(a
Greek translation created at Alexandria for the use of those Jews who
could
not easily read the Hebrew and Aramaic) an unlikely source for historical
Peter the apostle. The historical Simon Peter in Galilee would not have
heard Scripture in this form.
Well, aren't you cute? The only thing that matters is whether or not
Peter wrote it, which he did.
Once again, you have one source to back your claims and dismiss discussion
with opinion. This is the typical born-again Christian pattern.
-c
.
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| User: "Larry in America" |
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| Title: Re: You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
18 Apr 2006 12:21:06 PM |
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Waiving the right to remain silent, "gatt"
<LiveFromTheClocktower@gfy.com> said:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145368536.386070.47060@z34g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
Modern scholars are skeptical that the apostle Simon Peter actually
wrote it because of the style of the Greek it was written in. It
also lacks any personal detail suggesting contact with the
historical Jesus of Nazareth. All of Peter's references to the Old
Testament come from the Septuagint (a Greek translation created at
Alexandria for the use of those Jews who could not easily read the
Hebrew and Aramaic) an unlikely source for historical Peter the
apostle. The historical Simon Peter in Galilee would not have heard
Scripture in this form.
Well, aren't you cute? The only thing that matters is whether or
not Peter wrote it, which he did.
Once again, you have one source to back your claims and dismiss
discussion with opinion. This is the typical born-again Christian
pattern.
It's the typical mindless moron's pattern. Xtian imbeciles just happen to
fit it as well...
--
Larry J. - Remove spamtrap in ALLCAPS to e-mail
"I've come here to enjoy nature. Don't talk to me
about the environment!" - 'Denny Crane'
.
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| User: "rbwinn" |
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| Title: Re: You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
19 Apr 2006 01:17:18 AM |
|
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gatt wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145368536.386070.47060@z34g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
Modern scholars are skeptical that the apostle Simon Peter actually wrote
it
because of the style of the Greek it was written in. It also lacks any
personal detail suggesting contact with the historical Jesus of Nazareth.
All of Peter's references to the Old Testament come from the Septuagint
(a
Greek translation created at Alexandria for the use of those Jews who
could
not easily read the Hebrew and Aramaic) an unlikely source for historical
Peter the apostle. The historical Simon Peter in Galilee would not have
heard Scripture in this form.
Well, aren't you cute? The only thing that matters is whether or not
Peter wrote it, which he did.
Once again, you have one source to back your claims and dismiss discussion
with opinion. This is the typical born-again Christian pattern.
So what you are saying is that all you have to do to prove something
wrong is to get some homosexuals or other easily influenced people to
say what you want said. Then you have more than one source.
Robert B. Winn
.
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| User: "rbwinn" |
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| Title: Re: You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
18 Apr 2006 07:29:35 PM |
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gatt wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145368536.386070.47060@z34g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
Modern scholars are skeptical that the apostle Simon Peter actually wrote
it
because of the style of the Greek it was written in. It also lacks any
personal detail suggesting contact with the historical Jesus of Nazareth.
All of Peter's references to the Old Testament come from the Septuagint
(a
Greek translation created at Alexandria for the use of those Jews who
could
not easily read the Hebrew and Aramaic) an unlikely source for historical
Peter the apostle. The historical Simon Peter in Galilee would not have
heard Scripture in this form.
Well, aren't you cute? The only thing that matters is whether or not
Peter wrote it, which he did.
Once again, you have one source to back your claims and dismiss discussion
with opinion. This is the typical born-again Christian pattern.
Well, if you want to say that some crackpot theories from university
professors of today are more reliable than what Peter wrote, then go
right ahead. That does not change what took place 2000 years ago when
Peter wrote his two epistles. No one else who ever lived wrote or
spoke the same way Peter did.
Robert B. Winn
.
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| User: "Dominic Torrazzi" |
|
| Title: Re: You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
19 Apr 2006 12:35:46 PM |
|
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"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145406575.280840.9520@i40g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
gatt wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145368536.386070.47060@z34g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
Modern scholars are skeptical that the apostle Simon Peter actually
wrote
it
because of the style of the Greek it was written in. It also lacks any
personal detail suggesting contact with the historical Jesus of
Nazareth.
All of Peter's references to the Old Testament come from the
Septuagint
(a
Greek translation created at Alexandria for the use of those Jews who
could
not easily read the Hebrew and Aramaic) an unlikely source for
historical
Peter the apostle. The historical Simon Peter in Galilee would not
have
heard Scripture in this form.
Well, aren't you cute? The only thing that matters is whether or not
Peter wrote it, which he did.
Once again, you have one source to back your claims and dismiss
discussion
with opinion. This is the typical born-again Christian pattern.
Well, if you want to say that some crackpot theories from university
professors of today are more reliable than what Peter wrote, then go
right ahead. That does not change what took place 2000 years ago when
Peter wrote his two epistles. No one else who ever lived wrote or
spoke the same way Peter did.
Peter never wrote them, and that has been verified.
.
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| User: "rbwinn" |
|
| Title: Re: You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
19 Apr 2006 07:11:40 PM |
|
|
Dominic Torrazzi wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145406575.280840.9520@i40g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
gatt wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145368536.386070.47060@z34g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
Modern scholars are skeptical that the apostle Simon Peter actually
wrote
it
because of the style of the Greek it was written in. It also lacks any
personal detail suggesting contact with the historical Jesus of
Nazareth.
All of Peter's references to the Old Testament come from the
Septuagint
(a
Greek translation created at Alexandria for the use of those Jews who
could
not easily read the Hebrew and Aramaic) an unlikely source for
historical
Peter the apostle. The historical Simon Peter in Galilee would not
have
heard Scripture in this form.
Well, aren't you cute? The only thing that matters is whether or not
Peter wrote it, which he did.
Once again, you have one source to back your claims and dismiss
discussion
with opinion. This is the typical born-again Christian pattern.
Well, if you want to say that some crackpot theories from university
professors of today are more reliable than what Peter wrote, then go
right ahead. That does not change what took place 2000 years ago when
Peter wrote his two epistles. No one else who ever lived wrote or
spoke the same way Peter did.
Peter never wrote them, and that has been verified.
Well, possibly the best one to discuss your idea with would be the
Apostle Peter after the resurrection.
Robert B. Winn
.
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| User: "Dominic Torrazzi" |
|
| Title: Re: You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
20 Apr 2006 12:09:24 PM |
|
|
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145491900.513274.192220@g10g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Dominic Torrazzi wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145406575.280840.9520@i40g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
gatt wrote:
"rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1145368536.386070.47060@z34g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
Modern scholars are skeptical that the apostle Simon Peter actually
wrote
it
because of the style of the Greek it was written in. It also lacks
any
personal detail suggesting contact with the historical Jesus of
Nazareth.
All of Peter's references to the Old Testament come from the
Septuagint
(a
Greek translation created at Alexandria for the use of those Jews
who
could
not easily read the Hebrew and Aramaic) an unlikely source for
historical
Peter the apostle. The historical Simon Peter in Galilee would not
have
heard Scripture in this form.
Well, aren't you cute? The only thing that matters is whether or
not
Peter wrote it, which he did.
Once again, you have one source to back your claims and dismiss
discussion
with opinion. This is the typical born-again Christian pattern.
Well, if you want to say that some crackpot theories from university
professors of today are more reliable than what Peter wrote, then go
right ahead. That does not change what took place 2000 years ago when
Peter wrote his two epistles. No one else who ever lived wrote or
spoke the same way Peter did.
Peter never wrote them, and that has been verified.
Well, possibly the best one to discuss your idea with would be the
Apostle Peter after the resurrection.
Your complete inability to prove your point has been reached, hasn't it?
But I'll keep playing until we reach the your full on crisis of faith.
.
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| User: "Don Homuth" |
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| Title: Re: You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
19 Apr 2006 07:19:37 PM |
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|
On 19 Apr 2006 17:11:40 -0700, "rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote:
Dominic Torrazzi wrote:
Peter never wrote them, and that has been verified.
Well, possibly the best one to discuss your idea with would be the
Apostle Peter after the resurrection.
OhferXrist'seffing Sakes, RBW -- can't you just defend the idiot-stick
things You say on Your own behalf, without trying to defer it to The
Dead?
Sheesh! You are a Special Case of cowardice, even for Fundies!
If you can manage to channel St Pete, though, do send him on in.
Strangely, thus far, SP has been as unwilling to become involved on
Your side as has Xrist his own Divine Self.
That leaves You alone to be the stand-in.
But you're a coward, and duck your responsibility here.
But, you are Very close to exhausting pretty much everything you have
to discuss without further repetition, and that will -- in the fulness
of time -- mean you have become Boring and Not Entertaining.
At which point, the appropriate take will simply be to ignore your
idiocies redux, and have a good chuckle in the process.
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| User: "Lobby Dosser" |
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| Title: Re: You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
19 Apr 2006 10:29:43 PM |
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Don Homuth <dhomuth1@comcast.net> wrote:
On 19 Apr 2006 17:11:40 -0700, "rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote:
Dominic Torrazzi wrote:
Peter never wrote them, and that has been verified.
Well, possibly the best one to discuss your idea with would be the
Apostle Peter after the resurrection.
OhferXrist'seffing Sakes, RBW -- can't you just defend the idiot-stick
things You say on Your own behalf, without trying to defer it to The
Dead?
Sheesh! You are a Special Case of cowardice, even for Fundies!
If you can manage to channel St Pete, though, do send him on in.
Strangely, thus far, SP has been as unwilling to become involved on
Your side as has Xrist his own Divine Self.
That leaves You alone to be the stand-in.
But you're a coward, and duck your responsibility here.
He has responsibilities here? How interesting.
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| User: "rbwinn" |
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| Title: Re: You Have Got To Read This Wingnut Column |
20 Apr 2006 01:37:04 AM |
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Lobby Dosser wrote:
Don Homuth <dhomuth1@comcast.net> wrote:
On 19 Apr 2006 17:11:40 -0700, "rbwinn" <rbwinn3@juno.com> wrote:
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